Trans men vs women

Transwomen threaten a cis man's perception of masculinity.
Why would you ever willingly make yourself a "lesser" being is the general attitude.
The issue is a very personal one. They judge themselves based on how other people act, if someone "throws away" their masculine features they take it as a personal insult.

>>8760088

It's because transwomen are so damned loud, annoying and aggressive. Transmen never tried to stop prostate cancer being a men's issue.

>>8760110
>loud, annoying and aggressive
Sounds like every man in my life.

>>8760097
This, plus they threaten straight men sexuality. They don't want to be attracted to a male born person.

>>8760117

They literally threaten lesbians a lot more. Straight men would fight back.

>>8760134
That's not what they mean by threaten and you know it.
>is liking traps gay
>am I gay
>I'm not gay wtf
>trans panic

>>8760134
Yeah, well, you'll find that 90% of straight trannies agree with you and are sick of "trans"bians, so fuck off and leave us alone.

We just want our neovags and asspussies slammed with cock, I don't want anything to do with hon rapist straight men trying to rape lesbian women

>>8760134
How do they threaten lesbians? Like calling their sexuality into question or like literally physically threatening? Thats fucked if its the latter but could you give me an example?

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>>8760152

Trouble is only 1 in 5 MtFs are straight. It's the majority giving the minority a bad name.

>>8760153

You're kidding me right?

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>>8760097
>Why would you ever willingly make yourself a "lesser" being is the general attitude.

Men are clearly the lesser, that's why FtM are ignored. "They'll see their mistake"

MtF attract hate because it looks like we're taking the "easy way out" Men are supposed to "face their problems head on" this looks like running away to them.

Also an FtM is still percieved a woman during transition, so no one cares, they're not expected of as much. Once they're men, they're respected as bretheren. Not much risk involved in comparison

Did you ever hear any news about coptic christians in egypt? Yeah, me neither, because theyre all small minority.

>>8760162
I really wasnt joking.. I dont spend that much time online and I dont know any transbians irl but if theyre all like your pic related thats disgusting and shameful. Also weird and aggressive and it sounds like they think thats okay

>>8760088

Because the transphobes that come to this board are repressed trannies. FtMs are not even on the radar because they are not achieving the repressor's ignored dream.

Nobody cares about men in general. As long as enough of them show up to work and keep the systems and services running, nobody cares. Women are different, more valuable. A society lives and dies by its women, and will always focus on them.
Man tries to become woman:
>"Are our women and girls going to be safe around him?!"
>"I don't get to put on a prop crown and ptetend I'm the queen of England, why should you get to play pretend, faggot?"
>"Pretending he's something he's not, how self-indulgent. Spoiled men are just too vain these days."
>"He is just trying to live on easy mode and escape the responsibility of being a man. You're not special, faggot. You don't get to do that."
>"Why would I wanna cum in some dude's surgically inverted scrotum? I would never have a relationship with or marry some faggot that I can't start a family with."
Woman tries to become man:
>"Kinda sad. Why would you do that to yourself? Oh well, whatever."
>"Eh, she'll get over it eventually."
>"Jake is actually a woman? Who the fuck is Jake?"
>"So do you have a job yet"
>"That's nice dear."
>"Tomboys are cute! :D"
>"So he still has a vagina and can get pregnant? Well, maybe I'm 'gay' after all, heh"
>"Why?"

>>8760168
This actually. It's a mans world. And men love and bow down to women.

>>8760193
This.

>>8760369
This brings me to my next question

So whats the best way to kill myself?

Where does everyone get this notion that life is somehow easier as a woman? Still gotta pay my bills still need to work a shitty job. Now I pay for extra shit that men dont: make up hair products cis women have tampons etc... Women as friends are generally more catty and will backstab you. Not to mention being weaker and more emotional.

If youre a guy you just get up put a shirt on and youre ready for the day. You can walk around with a idgaf attitude and people respect you. Finding a decent paying job is,easier. Youre prone to have learned more skills growing up

Girls only have it slightly easier if theyre hot. And even then its no cakewalk.

>>8760088
Two reasons:

- Male homosexuality is a lot more stigmatized, so men are more afraid of being gay than women, the definition of male homosexuality is a sensitive topic, and by proxy the definition of what a woman is becomes a sensitive topic as well. "A woman with a dick" is way too controversial.
Lesbian sex was historically not even considered sex, and is still not considered sex in most part of the world, but rather a special kind of female friendship. So a man who has a vagina? At worst it's disappointing, but it's not the threat transwomen are.

- Transmen pass way, way more easily. Most transmen pass no matter what they do after six or seven months on T. Transwomen rarely pass even after years on T, unless they put some real effort in it.
Transmen being virtually invisible, they are much less controversial. In my experience, most people don't even know they exist, or if they do, don't know they can look like anything other than tomboys.
(As a transguy, people almost always react to me coming out with "oh so you want to become a woman?" and when I correct them, "so you're like a transsexual but the other way around?" because they have no idea how much taking T changes a person's looks.)

It's misandry. All cultures obsess over women as sacred while viewing as men as expendable. A male trying to be female is the worst crime that exists.

>>8760399
>where does everyone get this notion that life is somehow easier as a woman?
Just off the top of my head
>less likely to die on the job
>men more likely to buy/do things for you
>massively favored in divorce and custody cases
>more socially acceptable to cry or show emotion
>not expected to be successful
>longer live expectancy
>makeup increases female attractiveness dramatically whereas men don't have a similar option
>given priority in emergency situations

>>8760399
>If youre a guy you just get up put a shirt on and youre ready for the day. You can walk around with a idgaf attitude and people respect you. Finding a decent paying job is,easier.

I know plenty of cisgirls who fit this description. Finding a job is about equal,

differences include:
women can take more time off without worrying about being fired, unless their boss is a girl.
Women still have less duties on the job, no matter the placement.
Looked down upon if a man criticizes a woman if a woman is present. And can be sent to HR or fired if she complains
If woman criticizes anyone, no one says anything, and bosses wont intervene.

Just a few things I've noticed in my many jobs.

Sidenote: seems receptionists/secretaries are the only ones swho don't complain and play along with banter. No idea why.

I view transmen as delusional freaks who are wrecking their beautiful bodies. I'm ok with criticism of transmen becoming more mainstream. Especially pregnant men fuck those clowns. If your willing to do that you should get a one on one session with Pence.

However, the man in me respects their bravery. They're willing to trade being a normie girl for being a shit tier man.

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>>8760168
>Once they're men, they're respected as bretheren

>>8760190
No, very few of us are like what was shown.

The vast majority of us are just trans women who are attracted to women, and both understand and accept that a great deal of lesbians simply are not attracted to someone with a penis, or who previously had a penis.

Lesbians who are angry at trans women and see them as straight men trying to invade lesbian spaces like to hold up whatever examples of shitty transbians they can find to say that all trans lesbians are like that.

Anecdotally, I've noticed that a lot of these people also dislike bisexuals, because they think bisexuals are just gonna leave on them to be with a man.

>>8760369
The questions you wrote for ftms still make me feel incredibly horrible too, especially the first, and the second and third to last ones.
Sure being a mtf people may judge or put more visibility on but ftms are percieved just as much as "only women" as mtfs are men, and you just proved that.

>>8760847
I feel like mtfs get hostile reactions, whereas ftms get reactions that can be summed up as "sure, uh huh, you're a dude. I'll play along if it makes you happy" which is just as shitty in different ways

It's like we're not even worth these people's time to get upset about. They treat us like children wanting to be an astronaut president

>>8760847
>still make me feel incredibly horrible too
There are more important things in some people's lives than their feels.

>>8760887
>which is just as shitty in different ways
>which is just as shitty
Are you serious?

>>8760887
Ambivalence is not as bad as hostility

>>8760937
muh female victimhood

>>8760975
AFAB* victimhood :^)

>>8760887
"That's weird but ok" != "fuck you, delusional perverted faggot"
Female privilege in action

>>8760887
Mtf is still seen as a male so they are prone to violence whereas FtM spectrum people dont because their brain says "you cant hit girls"

>>8760088
It's misogyny.

Femininity should be shamed, masculinity celebrated.

>>8760988
AFAB* privilege in action :^)

>>8761013
That's what anon said.
>not understanding biological sex in current year

>>8760997
>AMABs get worse treatment than AFABs
>"It's misogyny."

>>8760088
Misandry obviously. Males are inherently seen as dangerous and perverted while females as non-threatening and virtuous. While in reality females are the corrupt ones.

Trans women are just more disgusting.

Trans men just look like little boys. Except with vaginas. They're a joke. they don't threaten people.

Trans women are often violent which doesnt help

>>8760997
Except most of the shit comes from "feminists" who think of us as men.

>>8761148

I wonder why

>>8761073
>all amabs are men and all afabs are women

>>8760997
Trans women aren't feminine, that's the entire point. Literally nobody is shaming femininity, the entire structure of human society has females on top and worships them like goddesses. If anything, trans women are seen as peasants who think they're lords just because they're wearing fancy shoes, an unforgivable offense.

>>8761163
>hate of trans women is misogyny because they're women
>hate of trans men is misogyny because they're AFAB
Why are feminists retards?

>>8760937
>>8760899

Hostility is easier to turn to compassion. People see hostility, and they can go "hey, here's something solid- a mindset I can disagree with despite not being an involved party".

Ambivalence doesn't get that same reaction- it gets "they're not being outright aggressive, so why does it matter their opinion?" and people don't change as much.

>>8761946
It's easier to stop people hating you than to stop them not hating you but not loving you either?

THAT is your reason for why FTMs have it worse?

>>8761975
when did I say ftms have it worse?

>>8762012
Correct, MTFs do.

>>8762049
>>8762012
>>8761975
This is like when Bipolar IIs and Bipolar Is bicker about who has it worse.

Nobody cares. Quit the fucking pity competition, it's asinine.

>>8762050
I'm not saying someone has it worse though, it's a misrepresentation of what I said

Trans people are mentally ill and it's embarrassing we have to share the name lgbt with them

>>8762431
Gays are just trans lite, both are disruptive to the gender binary / social order and both are non-reproductive, so it's the same level of mental illness. Oh I forego having a healthy reproductive relationship with someone of the opposite sex, date men, lay on my back and accept a man fucking my anus like a pussy, then marry that man and cook dinner for him every night, BUT I don't wear a dress while I do it so I'm totally not gender non-conformant and mentally ill guys.

>>8760088
>itt a bunch of hons explain why it's SO HORRIBLE to be a mtf compared to ftm and have a bunch of bullshit answers like misogyny and or muh patriarchy
>the real answer is that male cross dressers frequently used to be associated with sex criminals like rapists and pedos and awhile female cross dressers have really no con except maybe being a carpet muncher if you look super butch

>>8760088
1. There aren't as many FTMs
2. FTM transitions work out very well, and people are by and large more concerned with whether or not a person is ugly than helping them with gender dysphoria.

>>8760088
No because you arent a man you will actually always be a women nonone can change that you may change your look but your mind is the same and you still have xx

>>8760152
>d-d-do I fit in now? Will you accept me as one of the good degenerates if I just shit talk and throw the "others" under the bus more? Pls love me I'm not like the others!

>>8760522
>Looked down upon if a man criticizes a woman if a woman is present. And can be sent to HR or fired if she complains
>If woman criticizes anyone, no one says anything, and bosses wont intervene.
FtM and can confirm. Literally got fired at my last job for complaining about the women not pulling their weight. The reason? I made them "uncomfortable." I created a hostile working environment for them to not-work in, you see.

I aim to never work in a majority-female field or job ever again.

>>8760721
>delusional
Literally not what the word means, I have to pick on that.
>beautiful
Most trans people are average-looking pre-transition; that's what "average" means. I've also known guys who were ugly as sin beforehand and one guy who won beauty pageants. Describing all trans men as "wrecking beautiful bodies" sounds like some weird fantasy you made up in your head and not a reflection of reality.

But you are right about those fuckers who get pregnant. I hate them so fucking much.

>>8761073
>>8761197
>people still trying to map cis gender relations onto trans people 1:1 in the first place
ffs, did it occur to people that all of these answers are partially right, part of the time?

>>8761197
the second part is not true tho?

>>8760937
>>8760899
I'd rather be treated hostily towards than have people just not take me seriously at all.
As a mostly closeted 5'7 ftm I hope I'm taken a little more seriously than 4'11 ftms tbqh. I hope that the more male you look, the more people believe you/respect you rather than shit on you and call you a girl. Can anyone confirm this?

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>>8766512
>hostily
https://www.powerthesaurus.org/hostily

>>8760088
>majority of trans people are MtF
>majority of 4chan posters were born male and went through the school system as a male

>>8760433
i always thought the "gets more custody rights" thing was because mothers with custody typically spend twice as much time taking care of/feeding/bathing the children than fathers with custody do.

>>8760097
Too individualist. You have to understand that masculinity is an inherently competitive state of mind. You're supposed to maintain rank by asserting dominance over the males below you, by being more macho than them. The more feminine (i.e. non-masculine) a male appears, the easier, less threatening and more popular a target he becomes. In this way masculinity is a self-perpetuating system.

Unfortunately, somebody who is transitioning from male to female is obviously off the scale when it comes to not being masculine. I mean, they're literally taking female hormones. Hence they end up as a popular target for violence.

>>8766608
mothers tend to be better mothers than fathers.
whoda thunkit?

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>>8760088
if you are trans man you need to understand that men actually don't give a damn bout all this shit.

you have to ask those low standard tranny fuckers to get the answer u want. oh right you are on the 4chan there u go

because to feel better you depended on other people like a faggot rather than being your retarded tranny/gay/whatever self.

whining about how that's not it, to the same circle jerk of people always here and anywhere else you slug around at.

the fact your asking something like this means your very caught up in it and probably have a bunch of shits and fucks to say to anyone against you rather than actually needing help.

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>>8760114
Hmm, really makes you think, doesn't it?

>>8760162
>Trouble is only 1 in 5 MtFs are straight.
Straight as in attracted to men or to women? It's hard to tell on this site which people mean sometimes.
Source?

>>8767236
Not that poster, but she means attracted to men. An MtF is a woman, "straight" would mean attraction to men.

>>8767516
tbqhon not everyone on this site considers a mtf a woman.

>>8767536
Not them but no shit, it's just that we have to agree on terminology if we're going to discuss anything and given the nature of /lgbt/ and its userbase their way of assigning "straight" vs "gay" for MtFs makes sense to adopt, if just for the discussion unless you really, REALLY want to have another fucking useless semantics argument as if trans issues don't devolve into that bullshit enough already.

>>8767536
So be an idiot and stay confused by the most basic terminology then...? Not my problem if your bias keeps you from being unable to grasp how the words are used.

>>8766512
>I'd rather be treated hostily towards than have people just not take me seriously at all.
As an AFAB you're privileged enough to be able to think that could be better.

>>8760088
It's perfectly reflective of how society perceives men and women.
Men as predatory rapists, so MtF are "creeps in dresses".
Women as ascended children, so FtM are "harmless".

>>8760097
>>8760088
Pretty much. It's why no one cares for lesbians.

>>8763024
This straight up doesn't make any sense. It assumes all gay couples have only one working person, the non-working person doesn't work and bottom and cook dinners.

>>8760399
>>8760433
Female "privileges" are just the result of the fact that society was made for straight men by straight men.

As a gay guy, I can see it without bias. Women are like dolls: They get treated with love and care, but in the end they are just dolls in the hands of little kids. That's why now that women no longer to in line with straight dude's desires there is a surface of MRA/Redpilled movements.

>>8760088

Because being a man is harder than being a woman, and more is expected of us.

FtM get pity, and maybe even a little respect. "Hey, it's your funeral, lady. Have fun!"

MtF get resentment. "Look at this pussy trying to escape his manhood."

There's also the added phobia of having an MtF gf, which is low-status signalling as fuck. Loser can't even get a real girl!

I've yet to see an FtM who could live up to a cis woman's astronomical standards for men.

>>8760137

>This is what trans actually believe
Lmao, I am straight male and I do not find trans sexually attractive, not even the ones that pass.
You guys are nothing but a fucking sexual fetish on legs, doomed to have worthless and suicidal lives.

>>8760162
>1 in 5 MtFs are straight.
Thats complete bullshit and you know it.

>>8770567
>I've yet to see an FtM who could live up to a cis woman's astronomical standards for men.
How so?

>>8760190

You don't spend much time online and you're HERE? There's your problem. This is a place for people who hate everything. If you like things, you should not be here.

im transgirl and i dont give a fuck my family accepts me and looking for work they dont give a fuck either i think you people should to stop to see the sick side of society

>>8760162
What about bisexual trannies?

Or does bi erasure apply here as well.

>>8773122
He's telling himself that to make himself feel better, can't throw a stone on tumblr without hitting straight/bi girls who are into FTMs.

>>8773853
Everyone has an opinion and everyone will find a way to voice their opinion. People like you can't handle it, because you've let the screen impact your lives too much. You look at society enabling thus, and tell yourselves it's alright. Because even the President does it. Because meme protestors use it to organize for obvious reasons. You've convinced yourself that this is indeed, srs bsns.

It's sad, where once we used to joke people take literal. It's humorous. A generation of imbecilities frolicking in 4chan's September, letting the hormones in their heads, natural or exogenous, run wild. All telling themselves that this or skeletonchan is the "final end boss" the "villain" all people of righteous good character should fear and fear for their children. Thusly fueling the '4chan is god' mythos that has been endemic. 4chan is now an evil god, an disgusting, vile fetish that never should've existed in the first place. It didn't have to be this way. And though you'll accuse me of hypocrisy, daring to spend time to craft a real response to this otherwise noise-filled hive, or mock me for the following, even you will have to admit that the joke has been taken far too far. It impacts people's lives unduly when it shouldn't.

The screen impacts you only as much as you let it.

>>8769677
Hey, FtM who came out 20 years here. The fuck are you talking about, nigga? No one thinks that the second one is better. "AFAB privilege," is that something you bring up whenever you're butthurt because you think guys have it harder? And you tell us to man up. Fucking hell.

"Hostility" got me a few cracked ribs, "not taken seriously" got me treated like a fucking house cat for years on end. Yeah, I'll take the first one. Thanks.

>>8773979
>No one thinks that the second one is better.
t. deluded by female privilege

>>8773979

An ftm acting like an authority on the male experience. Think about this one, if this is a real, non-trolling opinion, because you're wrong.

>>8760522
>Sidenote: seems receptionists/secretaries are the only ones swho don't complain and play along with banter. No idea why.
Maybe because they have a gendered job?

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>>8760988
>Female privilege

>>8760997
No, it's misandry.

The most basic premise of transphobia is that trans women are "really men", and that trans men are "really women."

Following this premise, the most logical conclusion is that hatred against trans women is motivated by misandry. The mentality is basically
>How DARE this faggot-ass beta male pretend to be a woman?

Women are more valued by society, so obviously "impersonating a woman" is seen as more offensive than "impersonating a man." It's like the equivalent of impersonating a police officer, vs. impersonating the fry guy at Denny's.

Of course, most transphobes know all this intuitively without being able to articulate it, so what you get is just a "fuck you faggot", but the subtext is obviously "Know your place, male. You can NEVER be one of the privileged class."

>>8760114

It's almost like MtF are just men larping

>>8760088
Transphobes dont take transmen seriously. This is a mixed blessing. You want less people giving you problems in life.

>>8760162
>1 in 5 MtFs are straight
And 3 of them are bisexuals, the rest are lesbians?

>>8760162
It's weird how to qualify as "true trans" on /lgbt/ you have to be exclusively attracted to men, when there are studies showing that most cis women aren't exclusively attracted to men.

>>8775543
trutrans(tm) is a meme pushed by /pol/. Why would anyone let /pol/tards judge who is or is not a woman when the majority of them have never made contact with vagina beyond being ejected out of it by their mom, whose basement they use as shitposting headquarter?

>>8760419
>tfw no smart masculine ftm friend who acts like my big brother, completely supports me even though im a nasty mtf and lets me hug him a lot
literally why go on