Q

>>8721327
>Do you even believe in internalized homophobia?
Yes, when a guy goes out of his way to hate all gay people even the ones there's no reason to, which includes him supporting gay bashing, anti-gay laws (i.e. literal criminalization) and supporting muslims.

Sure some obnoxious flamboyant flamers will hate when you state the obvious, that they are annoying and stain the image of gay men to the public's eye, but that doesn't mean you have internalized homophobia.

If you want to see what internalized homophobia really is like, look at all the cases of gay men that died because their partner felt guilty after sex.

>>8721337
Thanks for your answer. I'm trying to be open minded to this and I want to be a more accepting guy. I just don't know where the line is drawn and whether it's a hoax to make gays feel like all degenerate behavior should be worshipped no matter what.

>>8721347
I don't really understand this. So if you criticize another gay you have internalized homophobia?

>>8721349
Always use your your head to discern what is right and wrong, people will always try to manipulate you into doing their bidding, carefully examining the arguments and the situation is always the best bet.

>>8721359
I agree. I'm not one to call anyone out or gossip, I'll just think it. I just don't want to feel guilty for thinking it when I shouldn't.

>>8721365
I didn't realize being obnoxious and annoying was exclusive to gay men...

>>8721376
What point were you trying to make with that mangled abomination of a "sentence"?

>>8721368
Well you should be always free to think as well, thought restriction is one of the worse forms of self-censorship. And it's okay to talk and debate about it, sometime it's only when you touch touchy subjects that you can see people's true color, not of course on what they say specifically, but how they say it and why. it helps you learn who to trust and who to not.

>>8721376
For me, it's the stereotypical mannerisms of gays that tick me off sometimes, and those same mannerisms are not always imitated by straight people. I'm all for equal scorn.

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>>8721327
Trans, bisexual, asexual, queer =

Identities that reflect an attitude of internalized homophobia.

Linguistic closets are still closets.

>>8721391
Do you care to expand on this?

>>8721402
These are identities created for those attracted to the same sex to deny or minimize said attraction.

They are linguistic closets. Places to hide in fear of shame. Nobody using these words to self-describe will ever admit to being gay for the same sex.

Perhaps "lesbian" as a "trans woman", but relative to natal sex these individuals are largely at least partially attracted to the same sex, but choose to deny it, to the detriment of the rest of the same sex community.

We gays are like the first person to exit off the bus of the freedom rallies held against segregation. We face the brunt of criticism for our open embrace of same sex attracted identities, while others claim to have never been on the bus at all.

I know you will decry this as pol trolling but I believe with all my heart that those who are same sex attracted have a responsibility to be open with that.

There is no reason you cannot be celibate or crossdress and still identify as gay so that we can all stand in the light of solidarity.

>>8721413
If you think we take lifelong medication, buy tens of thousands of dollars of surgeries, thousands of dollars of new clothing and cosmetics, burn our skin off for months, and completely rewrite some of our socialization (for many) because we're scared to say a word, knowing the whole time that we are considered a thousand times worse than any gay person, then you're a literal retard. There is no other explanation.

>>8721413
>these individuals are largely at least partially attracted to the same sex, but choose to deny it, to the detriment of the rest of the same sex community
I never thought of it that way. It's an interesting point.

>>8721413
Not him but you sound completely delusional, you have nothing to back this up and you warp identity politics in the middle of that mess of a post you made for no fucking reason.

An argument that similarly to mtfs gay men have feminized brains but in a different way, an argument can be made that asexuals are just people with hormone imbalances or brain damage, but what you claim, without argument is absolutely stupid.

>>8721437
I don't care what you think

>>8721424
Yes I do. It is THAT important to you to try to date straight men (does not apply to opposite sex attracted trans, I get that) and try to simulate opposite sex dating roles.

Even if the straight guy is actually just gay and in the closet, natal gay trans will often look for "passable" straight men who not appear visibly gay because they want to appear "normal" in public. This is a regressive mode.

I don't see natal gay trans dating visibly feminine men. The whole point is they can date someone who can remain technically straight despite having sex with another natal male, while the other natal male can claim to not be same sex attracted despite being in a natal same sex relationship and unable to bear live young as a natal woman could.

>>8721413
This is your brain on collectivism

>>8721434
My point is these people are going to lie about their attraction and distort it linguistically so short of hooking them up to a device to measure arousal in response to same sex and opposite sex imagery, you will never know if these people are primarily same sex attracted, and that is how you want it, it is a linguistic closet.

https://www.scholars.northwestern.edu/en/publications/sexual-arousal-patterns-of-bisexual-men

There has long been controversy about whether bisexual men are substantially sexually aroused by both sexes. We investigated genital and self-reported sexual arousal to male and female sexual stimuli in 30 heterosexual, 33 bisexual, and 38 homosexual men. In general, bisexual men did not have strong genital arousal to both male and female sexual stimuli. Rather, most bisexual men appeared homosexual with respect to genital arousal, although some appeared heterosexual. In contrast, their subjective sexual arousal did conform to a bisexual pattern. Male bisexuality appears primarily to represent a style of interpreting or reporting sexual arousal rather than a distinct pattern of genital sexual arousal.

>>8721327

None, and internalized homophobia doesn't exist. Homophobia is a defense mechanism ingrained in humans to avoid disease spreading.


Look at the rate of aids and homosexuals, there's a reason why many feel a literal sense of disgust at the sight of homosexual.

>>8721448
To me homophobia is more of a self defense by men who feel very slight same sex attraction against somehow "giving in" to that attraction that they feel others have done in a moment of moral laziness.

I know this christian pedo spammer, he oscillates between boards on this shithole accusing everyone of being a straight pedo all day.

>>8721450
>dog shit
You trolls always resort to this ridiculous name calling instead of logically debating and articulating your point. I'm for equal scorn of straight and gay men if they do some annoying shit.
>inb4 you're a diseased dog shit

>>8721446
>My point is these people are going to lie about their attraction and distort it linguistically so short of hooking them up to a device to measure arousal in response to same sex and opposite sex imagery, you will never know if these people are primarily same sex attracted, and that is how you want it, it is a linguistic closet.
Mtf "lesbians" and those agp fucks completely contradict what you just said. And asexuals have been proven to many times have hormone, normally testosterone, imbalance.

>bisexual men lie
Yeah but that's another different problem, they don't go as far as mutilating themselves to feel better.

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>>8721453
>Homophobia is when you choose to be evil worthless dog shit, plain and simple.


Hahahaha, just die of aids already.

>>8721451
So you feel like internalized homophobia only counts for ssa and not individuals who accept that they are gay?

>>8721448
>aids
Here comes the old thing again, first off aids has a higher chance of spreading through anal sex, regardless of sex of the receiver. Secondly, it affects mostly black males and females, much like on africa. Thirdly if you look at the rate of stds in women you'll find how they are on the same tier as male sluts.

>>8721464
Maybe the anon is talking about people who aren't fucked up mentally/hormonal and just smack a random ass label to their sexual identity?

>>8721464
I said that I am excluding excluding non same-sex attracted trans people from this analysis.

There is zero data that breaks down trans attraction in a binary fashion between natal same sex attracted and opposite attracted, and this data is all self reported, so short of a representative sample being tested on penile arousal, we will never know the true breakdown of what percentage of trans individuals experience same sex attraction.

Hormone imbalance does not preclude same sex attraction.

>>8721468
No, you are right. Individuals who are openly gay can have internalized homophobia, but saying you are not gay when you have same sex attraction is externalizing homophobia that you have internally.

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>>8721473
Not sure if the rates between men and women are the same.

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>>8721480
I do suspect a disproportionate share of homophobia originates from those who are attracted to prepubescent children. Obviously, we will never know if this is true either.

>>8721482
If you break this down by race, the rates are declining for White MSM and rising for Latino and Black MSM.

>>8721474
Oh that happens but he made a terrible construction of his argument, there IS a case to be made about the fact that sexuality and studies regarding that largely rely on self reported questions which is unacceptable in all respectable fields of science.

Mind you this is why there has been such a boon on the non-hetero community recently with younger people in britain reaching an absurdly high rate of glb individuals.

>>8721475
>penile arousal
Scratch that, you have to use brain monitoring and eye monitoring during a test where subjects are exposed to pornographic imagery of different orientations.

Still now you made your case clear.

>hormone imbalance
It does cause cessation of sexual interest, such as the ones asexuals report.

>>8721476
Then how do I differentiate between my opinion and whether I'm internalizing homophobia? And how do I stop internalizing it?

>>8721482

>/pol/ is actually right when they call homos degenerate


Shit...

>>8721483
Get some help because you aren't any here

>>8721487
Can brain monitoring detect arousal though? I am not aware of the science on this.

I think even with low sexual interest asexual primarily applies to those who are natal same sex attracted. You still know if you are gay even if you don't have a libido.

>>8721489
Be as honest as you can with yourself. Then be honest with others.

>>8721486
I totally agree with you on that statistic. I only meant that reply for the last bit you added.

>>8721490
That doesn't break by subgroups though. Neither do they take into consideration the large numbers of closeted bisexual men.

>>8721493
It can, brain monitoring could if detailed enough reveal every thought you have, but that would require them actually inserting probes into your skull.

Sexual arousal is much easier, it's a specific section of the brain that flares up while shutting off the logical portion.

>>8721497
Well do you have any data on this that isn't self reported or gathered in a forensic setting?

>>8721508
What sort of brain monitoring? Link to studies on this?

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>>8721498
Does this help? It's from CDC in 2014.

>>8721497
I've heard so much info that gay men are pedos and anti gays are pedos I don't know what the fucking believe.

>>8721512
Would be more helpful then to break this data down per capita but no, this doesn't show whether those rates are increasing or decreasing. Is this for syphilis or HIV?

>>8721327

'internalized homophobia' is a buzzword used by low IQ fags who can't stand being critiqued by someone they think should be on their side by default

>>8721515
Sorry I should have added more information. "Estimated New HIV Diagnoses Among the Most-Affected Subpopulations, 2014—United States"
"Although HIV diagnoses increased among gay and bisexual men overall from 2005 to 2014—and increased sharply among African American and Hispanic/Latino gay and bisexual men—diagnoses overall have stabilized in more recent years"
https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/group/msm/index.html

>>8721508
I think you greatly overestimate the level of knowledge we currently possess

>>8721512
Date?

>>8721517
See, I want to believe this is true, but I don't want to shut out others opinions before I make up my mind about it. Thanks for your.

>>8721524
2-2014..
https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/pdf/library/reports/surveillance/cdc-hiv-surveillance-report-us.pdf

>>8721528
Makes sense, my point still stands, minor group still manages to over-represent in this. I'd like to see how it fares for the syphilis case though.

>>8721543
Leave if you have nothing to add to this topic

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>>8721539
This info gets conflicted with these though, so I'm left confused.

>>8721543
Why are shitposters always awful with English too?

>>8721552
Fuck off already with your fucking "dog shit" and "disease" bullshit

>>8721521
Still this isn't directly evidence that syphilis infections have decreased in White MSM vs Latino and Black MSM. I believe the data for HIV at least has shown that disparity that new infection rates are declining for White MSM but increasing for Hispanic and Latino MSM.

>>8721539
I mean that a lot of data is gathered only on pedophiles who have been arrested or anecdotally. We don't (to my knowledge) have a ton of great data on pedophilia gathered in a non-self reported way with representative samples.

>>8721550
>16-19

Being sexually active and gay from ages 16-19 is not evidence of pedophilia. That is such weak evidence.

>>8721553
Your syntax and sentence construction are awful. Take a class, please.

>>8721555
>Still this isn't directly evidence that syphilis infections have decreased in White MSM vs Latino and Black MSM. I believe the data for HIV at least has shown that disparity that new infection rates are declining for White MSM but increasing for Hispanic and Latino MSM.
I wasn't trying to contradict you or anything, I just wanted to provide some images that shared evidence on what you were saying. I just didn't know if it was true whether or not women were getting stds at the same rate as gay men who binge sex all weekend

>>8721559
It's technically is though as much as you and I would think that you can consent around those ages. But it also lists "or younger" and that's not a good thing to add.

>>8721563
>No you filthy dog shit diseases.
Is that supposed to be the shut all dialogue down that I disagree with tactic? Weak!

>>8721562
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3349342/HIV-infections-fall-20-decade-NOT-gay-bisexual-men-living-South.html

Here we go. 18% decline in new HIV infections in Whites.

New HIV diagnoses over the past decade also increased 24 per cent among Latino gay and bisexual men - and 22 per cent among black gay and bisexual men.

Black gay and bisexual men between the ages of 13 and 24 saw an 87 per cent increase in new HIV infections since 2005 – but that also stabilized and ‘even declined slightly’ since 2010.

>>8721567
Well then the data was collected poorly if it conflates actual pedophilic attraction with adults having sex.

>>8721578
Exactly. You're pathetic.

>>8721582
P A T H E T I C
A
T
H
E
T
I
C

>>8721327
Internalized homophobia is having an opinion that gay men are obnoxious and annoying, so they stay in the closet because they don't want to be associated with the other gay men. That they're just men who likes other men sexually. When in fact, the obnoxious ones are actually trannies or trannies in the closet.

This is why we need to drop the T.