Gay Therapy

>>8664908
but anon, hrt is treatment for the mental illness

>>8664908
lmao don't you know what mental illness even is kid like what are you dumb or just a /pol/ack spamming his "everything I don't like is mental illness :(" propaganda because you're triggered? You should probably look up the definition of mental illness you greasy weirdo.

Like
ew

>>8664934
So you're just a self-hating tranny.

>>8664934
So was homosexuality you stupid faggot, just because someone in a position of authority says something doesn't automatically make it true, go look up the actual definition, go look up the fucking requirements to be a mental illness. It's not just anything that effects how people think and it's not just any disease that effects the brain.

>>8664948
START FAPPING
STOP GETTING CANCER
NOFAP IS A LIE

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>>8664901
That title is so misleading. I thought there was a tape that makes other people gay.

>>8664948
being happy is a benefit anon

>>8664951
>anything that requires medication is a mental illness
Good to know you and your ass cancer are mentally ill. Stupid underage robots my fucking god.

>>8664908
How about this actual case, anon?
The former student is suing the school for showing him a conversion therapy video, and after he was forced to watch this video he was treated for depression and expelled from the school for reporting suicidal thoughts.
Not exactly your model patient.

>>8664908
HRT actually produces positive results, conversion therapy doesn't. Consensual conversion therapy for adults is defensible under the notion that an adult has a right to throw their life away if they want to, but that doesn't mean it's actually good for anything.

>>8665124

I'm currently looking for some kind of conversion therapy near me and in my budget because I am pretty uncomfortable with being gay, I've never been suicidal or depressed, just want to try to be straight if possible

What's so wrong with that? Yes it's bad that he was forced and I feel bad that someone who is happy with their sexuality was treated this way but please don't close the door on all of us

>>8666036
There are basically no good reasons to try to become straight unless you've constantly rejected being gay this whole time. Do you REALLY think ANY non-degenerate woman would be remotely okay living with someone that was once attracted to men ? Because changing one's innate orientation is philosophically and aesthetically obscene. The only genuinely good reason I can think of someone becoming straight is if he's alone on earth with a single woman and the species is on the brink of exctinction AND he had been rejecting his own feelings this whole time...which is still a pretty weird situation. There is something wrong with all other reasons. Trying to become straight for wrong reasons = legitimizing homophobia. These people will say : "See ? Even these faggots themselves certainly don't want to be gay, that means we're fully right in hating gayness."
What are the reasons why you dislike being gay ? Is it because of anal sex ? That has nothing to do with being gay. Is it because of degenerates ? You can disavow them. Is it because of tfw no bf ? Have faith. Is it because of something else ? Please tell.

>>8667438

>Do you REALLY think ANY non-degenerate woman would be remotely okay living with someone that was once attracted to men ?

If I obtained a gf after some form of successful therapy, why would I tell her? That could destroy any trust she has in me, not to mention I've never done anything with a man

>Because changing one's innate orientation is philosophically and aesthetically obscene

Why?

>legitimizing homophobia

No-one knows irl that I'm gay and I plan to stay closeted until I have sorted myself out

> "See ? Even these faggots themselves certainly don't want to be gay, that means we're fully right in hating gayness."

People will always badmouth us, nothing will be good enough. I thought this was what being proud of yourself was all about?

>What are the reasons why you dislike being gay? Is it because of anal sex ?

No, I don't like it myself but it's nothing to do with being gay like you say, and I can't stop other people from enjoying what they do

>degenerates

No, they have no effect on my life and seem happy, as long as they don't create airborne AIDS it's cool

>Is it because of tfw no bf ?

This is not a bad thing for me lmao, I don't need more temptation

I've never really been comfortable with being gay or finding other men attractive, I'm happy to admit to myself that I'm gay and have never found women attractive. The thought of being with a man makes my skin crawl sometimes, other times I want it so badly. I grew up in a gay friendly, 'liberal' household so I would probably be accepted if I came out but the idea of acting on my impulses fills me with dread


tl;dr I don't like being gay because I am not comfortable with it, being straight seems easier plus you can have a natural family

>>8669622
It would be tremendously less work to just go to normal therapy to confront and work through why you're uncomfortable with being gay than trying to become straight, with a lot less self-hate and feelings of desperation.

>>8669622
>seems easier
There's your problem. It's not.

>>8669685

That's my second plan, I'm not finding any conversion therapy that I'm happy with near me so far but I'm still looking

>with a lot less self-hate and feelings of desperation.

I don't hate myself nor am I 'desparate' to be straight, it would be better imo. I wouldn't know how to find a therapist who would be able to work with me rather than just say 'come out u dum dum gay is ok', I feel conversion therapy is more tailored for people like me

>>8669703

How so? The dating pool is much larger, it's easier to meet people casually rather than in specific places/websites, apps etc. and you're much more likely to find someone who shares your interests. Plus the fact that you don't have to worry about homophobia and you can have a natural family, no IVF or surrogacy

I need to point out that I don't hate gays or myself, I feel very happy for those who are happy with themselves but please don't close the door for people like me

>>8669731
>you don't have to worry about homophobia
I hate to tell you, but even straight people can be victims of it. When groups of homophobic people search the streets for someone to beat off, they just look for someone who looks gay enough for them. They don't search your history. If people detect some measure of gay vibes in you, they won't spare you just because you have a gf (that you weren't being honest with btw since you hid your former feelings to her thinking she doesn't need to know...well what if she does ?)

>>8669775

Let's face it, it's way more likely to happen if you are walking down the street holding hands with your bf. I'm lucky enough that I can handle myself, but I'm more worried about the legal protections/recognition of gay relationships, job security etc. People get attacked on the streets for being the wrong race, having nice clothes, no reason at all etc.

>gf questions

I wouldn't get a gf if my feelings weren't genuine, I'm trying to pass as straight to please my family or anything. Would you enter a relationship with a bf you weren't in love with?

>what if she does ?

I'm sorry, do you mean what if she finds out? or what if she needs to know that I had therapy? I'm confused

>>8669622
Suggestion. Keep your girlfriend if it makes you happy.

Explore your homosexual feelings to the limit of what you feel comfortable with.

My philosophy is that urges are innately virtuous. They only feel bad when you have failed to give them a proper home. So if you feel about about having feelings for men it doesn't mean you should suppress it but that you should try to find a way to express that feels rewarding.

>>8669821
What if she does need to know about your former feelings ?

>>8669829

I don't have a gf and never have, I wouldn't even try because my feelings wouldn't be genuine

>My philosophy is that urges are innately virtuous. They only feel bad when you have failed to give them a proper home. So if you feel about about having feelings for men it doesn't mean you should suppress it but that you should try to find a way to express that feels rewarding.

I have no idea where to begin with this, I'm not happy with the feelings I have right now, why would I bow down to them? I don't know what would feel 'rewarding' anyway

>>8669839

I don't know why she would, but assuming that the therapy worked I wouldn't mention my past life, that would just makes things harder. If she knew but wanted me to admit it for some reason then that doesn't sound like a good relationship anyway

>>8669854
What psychology tells us is that you cannot remove your feelings. At best you can repress them and they will be expressed in subconcious ways. You'll feel like shit because you are waging a war against yourself.

So you're stuck being attracted to men for your whole life that is never going to change. Even if you think you've changed it all you did was hide your feelings from yourself. One of 3 things will happen if you do this. First your subconscious might kick the shit out of you and make you feel guilted and self-loathing until you crawl into a grave and die. Second you might take all that negative energy and express it on someone or something else. You might even intentionally start sabotaging things that are prescious to you as a form of self-punishemnt. Third option, which is what I personally went through, you starve your feelings of what they want and they die. You kind of walk around as an impassionate zombie and sometimes you wonder if you would bother eating if it weren't for the stomach pains.

Find something that satisifies your homosexual urges in even the smallest way. Branch out from there. Figure out why you feel guilt and address the issue. If you can't do that yourself you need a therapist.

>>8664901

I dont disagree with the desire to become straight. I just disagree with the upside down mindset that quacks use to pursue it.

You cant remove an attraction. But with some help, you can gain a new one. And then its just a matter of prioritizing what sort of life you want.

Trying to remove homosexual desire is really nothing short of mental abuse. But if an attraction to females is fostered, one could disregard their homosexual interest over time with successful interaction with females.

This isn't to say one "should" do anything. I am just saying that the idea that you can be made 'straight' by trying to remove a primal reflex is idiotic, and thats where gay conversion seems so fucked up.

Just like you cant make a straight guy gay with a few beers and a down-low proposal. But you can expand his interest, What he does as routine thereafter remains his matter of choice.

I enjoyed sex with a chick just fine, I just have no interest in the lifestyle. I often wonder how many centuries have to pass before we really re-evaluate a profession that claims to be the gatekeepers of sanity.

>>8664901
The only gay therapy is having a decent Dad. Literally no one would be a fag or tranny if they have a proper father figure

>>8669954
Keep telling yourself that. Pathetic lifeform.

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>>8669997

That seems unfair. I dont know he is or isnt correct, but he is just making an assumption of shared values. Maybe he means gay by identity, not behavior.

Most of the homosex that happens is between homosexuals. But most men who have had homosex dont actually live as gays. I think thats pretty much global through history.

Even the Hellenist Greeks who had a working institutional dynamic for homosex would not have tolerated what we call gay identity today.

>>8669997
You just go thread to thread with your autistic insults. Do you want to end up in a cringe thread?

>>8669873

I'm not going to lie, option 3 sounds like me at the moment, that did hit home

I've heard a lot about how 'u can't change ur gayness sweetie :-) just b urself XDDD' in my research into this and a lot f it does seem to come from religious hacks but honestly I'll try anything once

>Figure out why you feel guilt and address the issue.

I will take your advice on this one as your first paragraph seems very accurate and well informed, if I can't find anyone who'll make me straight there's no point being a lonely wreck the rest of your life

>>8669954

My parents divorced when I was 8 bc my dad's schizophrenia was getting unmanageable, maybe there is some truth to this? Do gays come from non-nuclear families at a higher rate than straight people?

>>8670026
i don't care about ancient greek degenerates.
I don't care about homophobes' opinion, that would be far too forgiving.

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>>8670035

Glad to be of help.

Once you find something USEFUL to do with your feelings everything starts falling into place, you don't need a reason why for any of it. Like my boyfriend, he's useful to me. He's good in a lot areas I'm weak in and ultimatly I think would be a good father to my children. It's very much pic related.

The way I am right now, I wouldn't know what to do if I were straight. All my homo feelings I've found ways to weaponize them. If you have feelings that you cannot weaponize it is not because they are bad but because you have not found a use for them. Denying them isn't going to do anything, because feelings are the 'why' of life.

If you want to do my route. Here's my advice. Get less rational, more impulsive, enjoy violence and carnal instincts. I don't mean in any particular or grand way. I mean in the most significant things: day dreams, what movies you watch. The purpose of that is it exercises your subconscious's ability to be passionate. To put as a metaphor. Imagine your instincts as your girlfriend, essentially you've turned your back on her and broken up with her. You need to make it up to her and embrace her.

>>8670196
>a good father
>any character from berserk

>>8670196

That's deep man, I've got a few questions but I'm busy rn so I'll do a proper response in a bit. Thanks for the advice so far

>>8669873
>First your subconscious might kick the shit out of you and make you feel guilted and self-loathing until you crawl into a grave and die. Second you might take all that negative energy and express it on someone or something else. You might even intentionally start sabotaging things that are prescious to you as a form of self-punishemnt. Third option, which is what I personally went through, you starve your feelings of what they want and they die. You kind of walk around as an impassionate zombie and sometimes you wonder if you would bother eating if it weren't for the stomach pains.
currently doing all of these things tbdesu

literally have no life at all, not figuring out any direction, anything to do

>>8670322
Yeah. I was there. I dropped out of college because I didn't see a point in doing anything at all.

Rationally speaking there's no reason to prefer one thing over another. Things like direction or an entirely emotional direction. Passions are quite literally the the means or justification itself. So if you've divorced yourself from her of course you're going to be nihilistic. Being at war with your own gay instincts might be the source of you breaking up or it might an effect. Either way this is something she fixes, not you, your job is to just give her the proper respect and domain she deserves.

>>8670196
>>8670238
It's me again

>USEFUL to do with your feelings

I'm assuming you mean find a bf who's into you, to prove that your feelings and love is valid, rather than being alone and thinking about love in abstract terms, or as something bad? Or do you mean fill your time with hobbies/other things?

>All my homo feelings I've found ways to weaponize them

How do you 'weaponize' a feeling? Do I have to anger-fuck a guy?

> Get less rational

So do small things implusivly as a way to let yourself 'go' a little, then leading up to bigger things? I'm not autistic or scared of intimacy but I can see how that would work for someone who was

>>8670322

This anon is spookily correct isn't he

>>8669954

straight people have divorced parents /absent dads too sweaty :-)

>>8670672

I'll confine my answers largely to feelings related to homo stuff. Feelings as a broad category is a huge subject. My influences are Nietzsche and Jung if you care, with Jung it's mostly the concept of the Shadow and the Anima.

>I'm assuming you mean find a bf who's into you, to prove that your feelings and love is valid, rather than being alone and thinking about love in abstract terms, or as something bad? Or do you mean fill your time with hobbies/other things?

There's a lot you can do with a boyfriend. That's not the defining thing about being gay, it's just the most obvious consequence. If you're gay your brain is wired differently all sorts of nuisances in neurology, estrogen, testosterone. Which translates into all sorts of different emotional patterns like being quicker to empathize.

Getting validated by having a boyfriend is one way. You essentially become useful to someone else which gives your life meaning. On the other hand if you validate yourself than you're the person seeking out a guy that is useful to your own ends.

>How do you 'weaponize' a feeling? Do I have to anger-fuck a guy?

Feelings push you, if they are well developed one's it's a voice of command you must obey. That's how you get out your nihilistic rut. Griffoth at the eclipse is kind of the pen-ultimate example of excellence here.

I'll give an example and it relates to something common to us homos. A pretty common thing for anyone with self loathing is the desire to see yourself hurt or punished. Weaponizing that is turning it into something useful. Go work out, get your body sore, there's all the pain you want.

>So do small things implusivly as a way to let yourself 'go' a little, then leading up to bigger things?
That's part of it.

Your admitting you are not really on good terms with your homosexual feelings. All feeling are connected, you can't really just isolate your homo feelings. It's a package deal.

>>8671191

>influences

These are pretty interesting, I like Jung in particular,

>validation

I'm not sure what this would mean for future relationship dynamics, I don't really like the idea of 'using' someone. What's the healthiest mindset to avoid that?

>weaponising feelings

this makes sense to me now, thanks. I should mention that I initially took up exercise as part of a plan I made to reduce my libido (also had a low meat diet, tried meditation) but I can see how it would be healthier to tey it in a different way

>Your admitting you are not really on good terms with your homosexual feelings. All feeling are connected, you can't really just isolate your homo feelings. It's a package deal.

I'm not a nihilist, it's just one specific part of me that I don't like. Obviously my relationships/love life are stunted or non-existent but I feel like I'm pretty healthy in most other areas, and I'm working on this anyway

>All feeling are connected

How so? If you repress in one area of your life it will affect you in other areas? I can't really see this

>>8671336

>Jung
As far as big thinkers go he's the one most enjoyed by homos. There's a lot more homosexual Jungian psychologists than any other school. The second largest institute for his study is in San Fransisco for fuck's sake.

>I don't really like the idea of 'using' someone. What's the healthiest mindset to avoid that?

Max Stirner
"I do not want to recognize or respect in you any thing, neither the proprietor nor the ragamuffin, nor even the man, but to use you. In salt I find that it makes food palatable to me, therefore I dissolve it; in the fish I recognize an aliment, therefore I eat it; in you I discover the gift of making my life agreeable, therefore I choose you as a companion"

alternatively the movie Rocky https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcqos-b3jDo

Love is when two people are useful to each other. I think Plato said something to this exact affect but I don't remember which dialogue it was.

>How so? If you repress in one area of your life it will affect you in other areas? I can't really see this

Take homosexuality. It relates to: how you feel about yourself, about each gender, about companionship, hell it's even going to relate to how you feel about seeing hetro people in your movies or anime.

One part of your mind being malnourished is going to weaken everything that connects to it, which in turn has a less effect of weakening everything connected to those systems.

>reduce my libido
Is being horny killing you or something? Libdo affects your general motivation. What I'm saying is don't take your emotions and try to shrink them, that shrinks you in turn. If you find a use for your emotions (weaponizing them) than what you want is to grow your emotional state because it will grow you in return.

>>8664901
test

>>8671430
>As far as big thinkers go he's the one most enjoyed by homos.
>implying more than 1% of homos care about what psychologists have to say

>>8671586
The average person does not care to read psychology, no matter your orientation.

What I am saying is if you look at the people that do read psychology and practice it there is ridiculous amount of gays in the Jungian school.

>>8671607
And they're making us look utterly ridiculous since Jung was clearly homophobic.

>>8671430
>Jung
>A man full of bullshit who based his bullshit off another man's bullshit
>"big thinker"

More like yuge thinker.

>>8671614
I've read everything the man ever said about homosexuals (it's not much) I wouldn't classify any of it as homophobic, it was critical, mostly saying how development is impared by it. The most obvious thing is he didn't beleive anyone was born gay but that their psyche becomes gay in response to certain stimulai. This isn't to say he beleived it was an aligment, he did think it was reversible (something all psychology now rejects, including modern Jungianism) but thought it could potentially cause more harm than good. His analysis of them is still very useful though.

>>8671636
>very useful
For what ? (not even bothering with contradicting the former points)

>>8671430

I know nothing about psychology but have read a bit on Jung as a person, apart from the Freud obsession he seems intriguing

>Stirner

Like all anarchists, the man is naive and a meme, the Rocky scene makes more sense.

>how you feel about yourself, about each gender, about companionship, hell it's even going to relate to how you feel about seeing hetro people in your movies or anime.

I sort of see where you are coming from, I mean I'm not happy with myself for one and the gender thing is obvious, the last part makes sense but it's always confused me why some gays sperg out about media representation, I don't demand that all movie characters have green eyes bc I do to, you're a minority, get used to it

>your anime

How dare you? Anime is for losers, weebs and autists

>Is being horny killing you or something?

No, it was the strategy I used for a few years before I decided to try and go straight, the logic being that if I wasn't comfortable being gay then I should try and crush the impulses. It worked a bit but over time, especially as I was a teenager, they came back stronger than before. I've kept the diet and exercise for physical health but the meditation did nothing for me

> don't try to shrink your emotions

I'm trying to grow straight ones if that makes sense?

>>8671669
A very solid psychological profile of homosexuality. Everything he thought was a cause of homosexuality can easily be re-interpreted as an effect.

>>8671738
>I'm trying to grow straight ones if that makes sense?

You can learn to think in the culture of straight people, however you cannot become straight. At best you can try to oppress those emotions and I've already told you where that leads you and it's utter futility.

>they came back stronger than before
If you fuck with parts of your mind it hits back. The good news is that it means you are still alive. The bad news is you are spiteful and stupid to the point where I can't teach you anything.

>Like all anarchists, the man is naive and a meme
You're in a state of absolute misery and self-loathing. You admit to attempting to destroy your own bodies chemical balance just because you can't handle your sex drive. That's your position. Think long and hard about how lowly that is.

I am in a better position and I used to be in your shoes which is why you are asking me what I think. Stirner is even healthier than me, even smarter, he was one of my teachers which got me out of that. In other words by dismissing him you have effectively dismissed every damn thing I told you as 'naive'. I legitimately feel like telling you that you deserve your self-loathing and more so but I'll hold that off to see how you respond.

>>8672041
How is that useful ? Who needs that ?

>>8672062
Anyone interested in self-knowledge or trying to develop a way to live better as a homosexual.

>>8672077
Look, gay people trying to gain self-knowledge from straight people has got to be the most pathetic thing ever. That's just real.

>>8672085
And it usually results in harm for the gay people I might add, since straight people have no way of understanding our essence and will make mistakes trying to understand us. They will try to make us fit into their moulds.

>>8672041

>you cannot become straight

I'll try, I hear it a lot and have already mentioned how most of the 'therapists' seem to be religious hacks but I'll try anything once, if all else fails I'll just grow up and move on

>you are spiteful and stupid to the point where I can't teach you anything

Sorry about that, I've enjoyed talking to you and feel your analyses have been pretty accurate so far, especially the three options post from earlier. I've been thinking like this for about 5 years so I'm doubtful I'll turn around in a day, that said I'm not trying that strategy anymore because it didn't work. I like the advice you've given so far and would like to hear more, but I won't just yes sir to everything someone posts on the 4chan gay board

>That's your position. Think long and hard about how lowly that is.

I don't understand what this has to do with Stirner, or what the problem is. I can get the hatred towards closet cases who clamp down on LGBT rights while hiring male prostitutes on the side, but I'm just one guy with a few issues.

>In other words by dismissing him you have effectively dismissed every damn thing I told you as 'naive'.

I don't like his anarchist tendencies, I'm from the near bottom of the social classes and anarchism isn't going to be harmonious tribes of kumbiyah hippes but scum doing whatever they want. Yes, Stirner is not anarchist totally, but I believe there is a deficiency in his thought where everyone is assumed to be functioning at a level of rationality - something you could argue I'm not with regards to my sexuality, but I can type, spell and think, people are all mad in their own ways. Bit off topic but I should probably have not been so dismissive.

> I legitimately feel like telling you that you deserve your self-loathing and more so

Thanks. I don't hate myself but see being straight as less 'compromised' homosexuality for me and my wishes, pretty Stirner right?

>but I'll hold that off to see how you respond.

Thanks

>>8672102

Ignore the repeated thanks, I can't type apparently

>>8672092


>>8672102
The point is when you are in a lowly position, what is the fastest way and often the only way to get up is to find someone stronger than you and copy them. So being spiteful to people above you high people is a fucking death-sentence. It's easy to see with simple things like money (if you're poor and you can become less poor by learning doing things wealthy people do) but with psychology it's harder (if you're psychologically sick you need to copy the habits of the healthy, and Stirner was very healthy!)

Stirner is not an anarchist in the traditional sense of the word. He doesn' fit neatly into any common ism. I can't really articulate his important lessons because they are very abstract.

The biggest thing is that groups do not actually exist, only individuals. So there is no such thing as straight or gay 'people' or 'culture'. There are only individual people and individual concepts. You can take whatever ideas you want from either category and you are not 'betraying your team' because the 'team' doesn't exist. In short you are not obligated to do anything because you are 'gay' or forbidden from doing any 'straight things'. Biological restrictions of course still apply, if you like men sexually that's built in and can't be changed, only denied, which hurts like a truck.

>>8672092
The idea that gay people are so different that they can never be understood by straights, even a genius straight guy like Jung is nonsense. We arn't fucking ETs.

>>8672092
>no way of understanding our essence

If by essence you mean rampant narcissism, yes they do in fact understand that very well indeed. You are neither unique nor special.

>>8672285
>The idea that gay people are so different that they can never be understood by straights, even a genius straight guy like Jung is nonsense. We arn't fucking ETs.

Yes we f****** are. Not literally (although at times I am full of doubts), but we are. How would you explain otherwise that after so many millenias we are still widely and wildly misunderstood ? Face it, we are utterly alien.
Barely any straight people would even dream of our existence if they had no knowledge of us.

>>8672311
Sure we are the narcissists when we're the ones being routinely vilified, mocked, killed, beaten, denied, even raped. Sure.

>>8672324
>Sure we are the narcissists when we're the ones being routinely vilified, mocked, killed, beaten, denied, even raped. Sure.

Sure, you are perfection itself, you are obviously not narcissistic, it's everybody else's fault. It doesn't matter how tolerant the society is, you are always the victim.

>>8672339
this is what we call gaslighting

it's where people who have no degree or interest in psychology (and probably believe it's all a big jewish hoax lmao x-D) pretend they have the authority to convince others about their own sanity on a peruvian alpaca shearing estate because their shitty political cause tells them everyone who disagrees with their personal fees fees is crazy

>>8672339
You sound like someone who views himself as more understanding than he actually is.

>>8672350
Excuse me, who is gaslighting according to you ?
>>8672324
or>>8672339
?

>>8672285

>someone stronger than you and copy them

Who then? Stirner? You? Which individual can claim to be above me? I've read a bit about Stirner in the past and try not to write him off but it's hard not to just see him as a nihilist anarchism who read too much Hegel

>no such thing as straight or gay 'people' or 'culture'

I don't care about 'my team', they've been telling me that I should just give in to my impulses and trying to make therapy as hard to access as possible for years now. I don't want to change my orientation because of some imagined stereotype, maybe as a genuine reactions against my gay impulses? I don't know

> if you like men sexually that's built in and can't be changed

This again. I'll see what I can do with time.

>>8672317
We aren't that alien, literally straight people by another name. The only difference is our sexual dynamics, e.g. a straight man and a gay man will typically want to have sex more often and with a greater number of partners than a woman of any orientation.

>>8672350
I really hope I'm not wasting my time talking to the ((())) crew, this thread has been pretty good so far, posters here seem reasoned, rational and willing to explain themselves

>>8672369
>space between end of sentence and question mark

ESL students should be banned from 4chan because they can't understand what the fuck you're typing half the time and go into reading comprehension errors like this one.

Figure it out yourself, sweetcheeks.

>>8672350
>no degree or interest in psychology

Not my case. If you can handle some uncomfortable ideas, you can always return to a hug box.

>>>/tumblr/.

>>8672373
I think you wouldn't talk to me like that if you were before me, filthy coward and sorry excuse of a human being.

>>8672382
>you just can't handle being e-diagnosed by some loser online!!

are you serious lmfao the leaps in logic ppl on this board go through ahahahahhahhahahhahah

keep telling yourself your pocket Wikipedia degree allows you to diagnose axis II disorders at whim faggot

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>>8672387
2011 memes? lmfao

>>8672389
>>8672400

Shame, this got really bad really fast

Never change, 4chan

>>8672372
>literally straight people by another name.
You know, the more you talk, the more you sound deluded. Avoid talking too much in public.

>>8672400
How's that a meme, exactly ? Oh wait, I don't care.

>>8672404
go back to your hole bpdfag

>>8672409
>I d-don't care!

>still replied anyway

ESL students can't understand 4chan. They're all terrible at it. Should just restrict it to anglo IPs only.

>>8669622
Are you that self hating gay from last time?

>>8672405

How are gay people different besides their attractions? I read your points earlier about them being better at empathy but I'd like to know more about that

Nice to know some internet stranger thinks I'm dumb although I mostly agree with him

>>8672410

Borderline personality disorder, I assume? Not sure that label fits me beyond depressive tendencies, but your sweet internet slapfights and dank memes cheer me up

>>8672416

Oh no, slightly non-standard punctuation? The world has ended

>>8672426

Last time? I've been making consistent posts ITT only but it wouldn't surprise me if someone was here before me, should have put a trip on maybe

>>8672437
We had a self-hating gay who was obsessed with anal sex, AIDS and posted from /pol/. Your posting style is very similar.

>>8664901
This is a non issue. Guy gets fired. Student gets paid. End of story. Conversion therapy should be performed on consenting adults on their own terms.

>>8672443

Not him sorry, I don't care about anal, anyone with risky behaviours can get AIDS and don't visit /pol/.

>>8672449

>Conversion therapy should be performed on consenting adults on their own terms.

Agreed, now only to find some within reasonable distance of me, and not run by monks or whatever

>>8672437
>I read your points earlier about them being better at empathy
I think you may be mistaking me for someone else, I don't remember talking about that.
A better question would be: where and when are we not different ? From the way we move to the ideas we express, pretty much everything about us is different, no matter how subtly so.

>>8672460

>From the way we move to the ideas we express, pretty much everything about us is different, no matter how subtly so.

I think a lot of this relies on stereotypes generated by straights, before gay liberation only the most obvious gays, who were unable to effectively hide their attractions were really known about, if you could hide you did

I think gay men are male first and gay (in an identity sense) second, certainly I've never felt anything other than male and no-one has ever taken me aside and said 'I know you're not like me, gay boy' or words to that effect.

I think 'straight-acting' gays are ridiculed for repressing or hiding the fact that they actually want to be total queens or whatever, but I was into cars and sport before puberty, before I even knew what sex or sexuality was. I don't think I would cultivate an interest in make-up or interior design if I came out, I'm just me and my orientation is part of that. It does not define me.

>>8672460
>>8672479

It was in this post >>8671191, I apologise if you didn't write it but it seems consistent with your message, I thought I'd mainly been talking to one other anon for the past few hours ITT

>>8672479
>no matter how subtly so

>>8672491
I don't care much for Jung or Nietzsche. And I don't like the manga Berserk.

>>8672372
>Which individual can claim to be above me

Generally the one's that lead more content lives, less self-loathing, less whining. Mostly because you want to be content, not-self-loathing, and not whiny.

You copy the people above you entirly for selfish reasons, because you want the same greatness they have. So it doesn't shame you, it elevates you.

>This again. I'll see what I can do with time.
Like i said my advice is to take the feelings you already have more them useful (weaponize them). HOW you do that is really up to you. I did it by reading Stirner, Jung, Nietzsche. If you can do it by say gardening than more power to ya.

In general I've found personally, and read from these people, that going to war on your emotions is like punching yourself in the face. It hurts for awhile, than you go numb, than you feel like shit. Because your emotions are a part of you.

>>8672437

>I read your points earlier about them being better at empathy but I'd like to know more about that

That was me.

The empathy is a big thing. It kind of makes to harder for us to be cruel or accept the nessiaty of cruelity. It also makes it easier for us to learn from others. Another major effect is it makes us better as teachers (Jung discussed this when talking about Pedo-Greeks)

Another thing (also Jung) is our development as children had us more focused on our mother than our father, often the mother is an overpowering force. I know from my own childhood that was my father was abscent via work and my mother was always there. So I got very close to her.

We also kind of never grew up (more Jung). We essentially seek out other boys as a way to keep the fire of childhood lit, either by being a child with them or them being a child in our place, sometimes both at the same time. If you have any doubts about this go to /cm/ and look at all the puerile boys or /hm/ and all the daddy stuff. Hell just consider that Link is our favorite fictional character and that in his most respected game, he is literally a child with the body of an adult.

>>8672655
You're utterly retarded. Pedo"philia" is cruelty itself.

>>8672610

>You copy the people above you entirly for selfish reasons, because you want the same greatness they have. So it doesn't shame you, it elevates you.

Now I see, thought you were getting a bit haughty on me because I didn't like Stirner, fair enough

I'm thinking about how to weaponize my feelings, I don't have a lot of free time at the moment but I'm sure I can up with something

>that going to war on your emotions is like punching yourself in the face.

This was my rationale behind seeking conversion therapy in the first place, trying to crsh my emotions hadn't worked so moulding them in a different direction seemed the next best step

>>8672655

>Jungian analyses of childhood

I've heard of this before, I mentioned it here >>8670035 but I can believe that the upbringing of a child might affect their sexuality in adulthood, not that we'll ever see any scientific research on this as it's too sensitive of an issue

>/cm/, /hm/ and Link

This stuff puts me off, all the borderline paedo stuff in /cm/ particularly, /hm/ is just damage in a different way. To me, gays seem to have a preponderance to this kind of dynamic more than straight people, although that could just be because I spend much more time on gay material, I dunno

>>8664901

there's no story herre, student got a fat payout and is still gay

fuck the ny post

>>8674131
>I'm thinking about how to weaponize my feelings

Like all good things it takes time. If you want accelerate it read Nietzsche, Jung. Their entire thinking is in that direction. Stirner is not as importaint.

>To me, gays seem to have a preponderance to this kind of dynamic more than straight people

As someone that enjoys both types of porn, I can confirm, gay porn is much more childish. Jung thought the maturity of homosexuals was on average much lower, in terms of emotional maturity they are stuck in teenage years. They never became Men (or Women if they are lesbians). That isn't to say you can't weaponize that type of feeling, child-like thinking is very magical and unchained by social and moral norms "innocent".

>>8676171

>read Nietzsche, Jung

Thanks for the recommendation, I will seek them out when I have some free time

> gay porn is much more childish

I don't watch much porn at all, and it's not exactly a great depiction of what I would call a 'healthy' model for gay relationships, but yes it does seem more obsessed with pushing boundaries and being more extreme than the last set of movies, in a very childish show of one-upmanship

> child-like thinking is very magical and unchained by social and moral norms "innocent".

I don't believe in the inherent wisdom of children, or that all gays are this way, but it does seem to be a sizeable amount of gays I've encountered. How would you describe this emotional stunting as affecting the lives of gays?

>>8676171
>>8676225

Don't leave me this way psychology anon

>>8676225

>How would you describe this emotional stunting as affecting the lives of gays?

You naturally cut yourself off from being a man, it's a voluntary act because you don't want to let go of being a man. This goes hand in hand with being overwhelmed by the mother. Feeling alien to the father ultimately means you don't want to become a man, in other words become your father.

This in turn leads you to desire a partner who is also in a peter-pan state and you sort of keep each other from growing up so you can keep the fire of childhood burning. Alternatively maybe you want a 'daddy' that can be a man in your place.

Another affect is that you kind of get shunted for spiritual development. By spiritual I do not mean rosaries and after-life. In a sense because you are an emotionally stunted child the complex emotions of being an adult are unobtainable and unrecognizable. Deeper senses of having connection to the big things in life etc.

The good news is these states are not limited to homosexuals. We're in a masculinity crisis, society is over-run with man-children, and we're in late stage nihilism. It just hits us harder than the straights. The bad news is that it means it is even harder to find someone to idolize and learn from. Art is good for that. Guts and Griffith.

>>8676623
What?

>>8677024

>it's a voluntary act because you don't want to let go of being a man
>ultimately means you don't want to become a man

Sorry you've lost me here, gays recoil from being a man but don't want to let go of being a man? Did you mean being a child

>This in turn leads you to desire a partner who is also in a peter-pan state and you sort of keep each other from growing up so you can keep the fire of childhood burning. Alternatively maybe you want a 'daddy' that can be a man in your place.

This is eerily correct for what I've seen of the gay 'scene', very few seem to diverge from stereotypes/categories and often lead similar lifestyles. Granted, my experience is all second hand, and it might be harder for minorities to express a spread of personalities and lifestyles

>spiritual development
This fits me very well in my opinion. Whether that comes from my upbringing, familial attitudes, individual depressive tendencies or what you are suggesting is probably easy to find out

>last paragraph

Nihilism truly is pervasive throughout the western world, I'd argue that the gay community has benefited from it as morre and more people don't care about us, where once we were abominations to be thrown in a bog or whatever. In one sense I'm glad for that, but I hate it on a wider cultural and national scale.

>>8679824
>Did you mean being a child
Yes, sorry.

>Whether that comes from my upbringing, familial attitudes, individual depressive tendencies or what you are suggesting is probably easy to find out

Your attitude is wrong. Upbringing and family is not very important, it's worth considering but not dwelling on. Nietzsche had no father and Jung's parents were peasants yet they were two of most spiritually develops humans ever.
"When one has not had a good father, one must create one"~Nietzsche his 'father' were Greek mythical heroes. Jung's 'father' were Gnostic mystics.

As for depression, I'm not sure why but it's important in spiritual development (maybe it has to do with hardness toughening you up or because it forces you to be introspective). Nietzche and Jung both were ridiculously depressed before they wrote their best stuff basically it forces you into a type of do-or-die where you either become ridiculously strong to fight your inner demons or it's an eternity of hell with no escape. Think the mark of sacrifice from Berserk.


>I'd argue that the gay community has benefited from [nihilism] as morre and more people don't care about us
That's another example of what I mentioned above. Once you have no values at all you either wallow in misery forever or start crafting them yourself. It's not a situation where everyone will win. The strong will become armored and the weak will be eaten alive by monsters and nothing can be done to save them.

>>8679958

>Upbringing and family is not very important, it's worth considering but not dwelling on

I've heard of the Nietzsche quote before, many famous thinkers, scientists and philosophers who had no fathers throughout history made their own idols - Byron kept a bust of Napoleon on his school desk as inspiration, for example - Jung and Nietzsche obviously did the same, but I can't believe that there is no family input. If all individuals make themselves, could the family not have some influence on the child before it has chance to think for itself?

> depression is important in spiritual development

I agree with you, I'd rather not have it but it can make you consider some very uncomfortable truth about yourself, particularly your place in the world and your attitudes/relationships with others and yourself. I don't think it's a question of beating or losing to depression but rather that it can (maybe not always) be a conduit to new ways of perceiving things. Or maybe people who think too deeply are more prone to depression and negativity?

>Think the mark of sacrifice from Berserk

I don't know what this is and had to look it up. Please could you explain what the link is here, I think you mean what you mean but I don't want to assume

>(nihilism is) not a situation where everyone will win

On a wider, societal level, certainly, especially when it's dressed up as 'post-modernity', but that's a different topic. I'm not sure if someone who creates their own values can truly be a nihilist, but rather that nihilism (maybe like depression) can be a seed from which something greater, or at least different can grow. I feel I can apply to this areas in my own life.

>weak will be eaten alive by monsters and nothing can be done to save them.

Just out of curiosity, are these monsters of their own creation or are they created by the strong as a way of creating a better world for themselves? It seems like the former to me but I'd be interested to know your take on it

>>8680040
>could the family not have some influence on the child before it has chance to think for itself?

If you need to analyze how your parents affected by all means do that. But nothing can beat the authenticity or individuality out of you. All they can do is teach you to hide your own desires and feelings, not just from society but from yourself. All your secret desires and feelings just got moved to your unconscious; you hide yourself from yourself. That's why spiritual growth is so explosive, you unpack everything you locked away.

>be a conduit to new ways of perceiving things. Or maybe people who think too deeply are more prone to depression and negativity?

Depression isn't related nessiairly to how deeply you think. Tumblr-fags are always depressed. Some people are genetically programmed to be depressed more easily, and will lean towards that type of thininking no matter how wise or foolish they are.

Depression can be a way to dig up a lot of skeletons you shoved in your closet, more things you hid from yourself. That's how it acts a conduit.

>Berserk
I just name dropped Berserk because I figure a lot of people reading will know what I mean. When you're miserable it's do or die, either you get ridiculously strong to pull yourself up or you get eaten alive.

>Just out of curiosity, are these monsters of their own creation or are they created by the strong as a way of creating a better world for themselves?
Strong people do step on other people's toes. Blaming things on yourself is better though. If it's something you created it means you are responsible for your own misery and thus your own salvation. If you blame it on others than you're helpless and waiting for someone else to pick you up.

>>8680175

>If you need to analyze how your parents affected by all means do that

I don't know, I was just wondering as you know more about this than me. The more I age the more I seem to become a near-identical replica of my father, personality and thought-wise. Could be either genetic or upbringing I suppose, it just makes me wonder

>Depression isn't related nessiairly to how deeply you think. Tumblr-fags are always depressed.

I wouldn't say that I'm particularly intelligent or a deep thinker, or that Tumblr people are either (I think that the majority claim depression for pity points or a cool factor, and they are certainly not clever for being sad about wasting their lives moaning on the internet) but rather that it seems more common in historical figures.

>That's how it acts as a conduit
Yes, I agree. It's important to note that it it's no guarantee but I think that for the right individual, they can find that depression may lead to greater discoveries about themselves or even the world around them.

>When you're miserable it's do or die
Understood, sorry I'm not a big gamer.

>If it's something you created it means you are responsible for your own misery and thus your own salvation

Only if you can see the way out. I wouldn't know whether to classify myself as weak or strong by your own definition, going back to the therapy point I am trying to solve a problem that causes me misery but am doing so in a way that could mean you consider me weak, particularly if you factor in my apparent self-loathing

>>8680299
>The more I age the more I seem to become a near-identical replica of my father, personality and thought-wise

I'm not in a position to tell you if that is good are bad. That's for you to decide. I'm just saying with a strong enough sense of self-ownership and enough devotion to your subconscious you can remove anything your parents or societies taught you.

>whether to classify myself as weak or strong by your own definition
In referring to how people respond to depression and nihilism? Weak people are people that have reached a state where they think the only way they will be helped is from an outside force. By and large this doesn't happen. Other people will get strength,from the inner world, subconscious. It's all irrational and passionate strength. That's why I talked about training yourself to act impulsive, it's not something you can do without her. And I'm talking about that part of the subconscious in feminine pronouns and titles to be cute.

That's actually how I think (look up the Anima) and it's productive for me to an absurd degree. I don't know how relevant that would be for anyone else.

There's a 3rd option, it's really just a copying mechancism for weak people. That's just distracting yourself from your state until you fall into your grave. Entertainment is good for that, especially the addicting kind.

The biggest deciding factor in all of this is your response to pain. Whether you can make yourself not run from it but affirm it. Berserk is a good analogy here too, Guts enjoys his suffering.

>>8681749

>I'm not in a position to tell you if that is good are bad.

I didn't mean it like that, I meant that there mus be some influence from the parents - genetic or maybe from me emulating a largely absent father or something, I don't know.

> strong enough sense of self-ownership and enough devotion to your subconscious you can remove anything your parents or societies taught you.

Agreed, devotion to your subconscious being reached through training yourself to be more impulsive and weaponizing feelings. What part of the subconscious is 'she' all of the irrational subconscious (feelings) or just repressed things?

>look up the Anima

Will do, it's a Jungian concept right? I'll see if it's relevant to me, how does it help you in your life?

>3rd option

That's not really for me, I can't just let something that bothers me lie, I am too stubborn

>Whether you can make yourself not run from it but affirm it

This is to build spiritual strength yes? Hardship making you stronger than just finding something to stop the pain or hiding from it

>>8684030
>Anima
I'm not going to put much effort into describing the concept. Jung's thinking is systematic so starting with the specifics, especially a very unorthodox specific like the anima is hard. It's conduit for spiritual epiphanies and the feeling of being completely possessed by high emotions (including the negative one's like being a bitch). Also important for conceptualizing femininity. She's more directly involved in gay people's psyche while in straight people she plays an indirect role, mostly in regards to the latter.

I'll elborate on how she is useful to me personally. Basically the concept of masculinity is only something that you can visualize and thus obtain if you have a clear understanding of it's opposite. You wouldn't be able to comprehend the concept of being cold without a clear concept of being hot. Most straight people get an idea of what femininity is from taking women as their 'other'. If you don't do this (and most gay guys can't because women are never on their mind) you get swamped in androgyny.

The spirtual stuff is heavy. It's not something I can talk about without sounding schizoid, that's how Jungian thought is if you go deep enough. I talk to her directly sometimes.

>Hardship making you stronger than just finding something to stop the pain or hiding from it
Exactly.

>>8685545

>Jung's thinking is systematic so starting with the specifics

I found that out when reading about the anima as a concept, I ended up clicking around other concepts as I had to understand them first, I'll give it a proper read on my break tomorrow

> She's more directly involved in gay people's psyche

This is because gay men are psychologically effeminate right? In that they didn't associate with a father male figure?

> It's not something I can talk about without sounding schizoid

It's healthy enough, bear in mind you're talking to someone who hates a huge part of himself, it's not that weird here

> that's how Jungian thought is if you go deep enough.

I see.

>I talk to her directly sometimes.

As in self-reflection or for advice? Have you trained yourself into total honesty or did it evolve gradually?

>>8685677
>This is because gay men are psychologically effeminate right?
Correct. You're going to conceptualize femininity in some way. Straight guys tend to conceptualize it as a type of other, while gay guys end up with it not quite as an other but not fully their identity either. Hense the huge attraction to androgyny.

>As in self-reflection or for advice? Have you trained yourself into total honesty or did it evolve gradually?

It's all gradual although advances are like thunderbolts. Anything that comes from the unconscious is explosive, because you never see the development, only the results. General advice
*In terms of 'meditation' anyway you feel you can give up control and just let information flow. Something easy would just be sitting and watching your thoughts trying not to control them and seeing where they lead. A harder thing would be giving up control of your hands and letting them write or type what they want. Even harder is to than take back a small bit of control and write a response.
*Dreams are good. You naturally lose control their and end up in their world. They have the highest potential. Speaking of which practice good sleeping sleep hygiene (that's her number 1 complaint to me).
*Movies (especially the unrealistic ones), music, religious expressions I think it gives your unconscious energy.

>>8685936

>Hense the huge attraction to androgyny.

How does this present itself? In our attractions or more subconsciously? I understand the masculine/feminine elements but this is a little new to me

>It's all gradual although advances are like thunderbolts. Anything that comes from the unconscious is explosive, because you never see the development, only the results.

Yes, self-revelation is a strange thing, seems to come from nowhere but arrives very quickly fully formed, I think that what you talk about is how to get in touch with it before it reaches this stage, to see the processes that are going on underneath

>advice

I find it hard to really let myself go like you describe, I'm going to read up in the Anima properly and start with the movies/music and then try the writing thing, could this work as a way to ease myself into this way of thinking? I don't remember dreams and I lost religion when prayer wouldn't make me straight so I'll have to use the other methods, dedication is the key here I think. Correct me if I'm wrong

>>8685545
What's the distinction between HSTS and A*P in Jungian theory?

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>>8686144
I don't even know what those terms mean. They are tranny words right? Now let me preface by saying what I am discussing is the older theory of Anima relationship. With one exception. Jung beleives all these psychological traits of homosexuals are CAUSING homosexuality. I am treating these as EFFECTS..

There are other orientation theories that are less "hetronormative". I've read the basics of them and think they are either meaningless psycho-babble or do not make sense in the broader scope of psychology.

As for the tranny stuff. The stuff I said here >>8685936 about how people conceptualize femininity. Trannies take that image of femininity and fully identify with it. They want to be the ideal femininity. You take your anima as your identity. It's like being possessed.

>>8686099
>androgyny
Just look at gay men and the types of images we post on any gay boards.

>I think that what you talk about is how to get in touch with it before it reaches this stage
Basically. Spirtual development is mostly about gathering up all the parts of your mind, finding a use for them and making them into one whole thing. Sort of like assembling a human being out of various organs.

>I find it hard to really let myself go like you describe
Start with just watching your thoughts while trying to have zero input. "Active Imagination". Just do that for a few days or weeks or whatever. Eventually you will learn what it giving up control feels like. You can't do something like writing until you know both that and what it feels like to get a 'request' for control.

As for dreams, the more you put effort into remembering, writing them down, or trying to analyze them the more you have them. Also sleep hygiene. There's tons of medical advice on how to sleep better which makes you dream better.

>>8686312

>types of images we post on any gay boards (creepy cat/man/furry thing)

Like that pic? Personally I'm not really attracted to that kind of stuff, but some guys' preference for feminine guys/twinks/to be a girl makes sense in this context. I'd never really thought of it

> Spiritual development is mostly about gathering up all the parts of your mind

If you are in touch with everything you do, then you are the most complete person possible right? This would align with what I've found in my research into the anima today, in that the key to understanding it seems to be knowing how to recognise it and isolate it from reality, as it's subconscious it can be easy to miss. Is this right?

>sleep hygiene

I'll try this as my sleep patterns are pretty disordered anyway, I keep odd hours and use coffee/alcohol to keep me awake or tire me out. Not good

>"Active Imagination"

I'm researching this as well and will try different techniques, any personal tips that work for you before I start?

>>8689731


>If you are in touch with everything you do, then you are the most complete person possible right?
Correct. You get much stronger, you also get a lot more challenges because you can't hide your skeletons in your closet as easily and there's more 'you' to manage and develop.

>Active Imagination
The ideal situation to do it would be one where you there is no outside stimuli. You arn't hungry or thirsty. There's no noises and you are in place that is familiar or very plain. Basically you have a fininite amount of psyche energy, the more it is spent on considering outside stimuli, the more you take, the less your subconscious gets. Same reason why dreams are so intense.

>research into the anima today, in that the key to understanding it seems to be knowing how to recognise it and isolate it from reality,
Basically. It's very really encountered directly outside of dreams (and even that's pretty rare). That's really something you can't will. Sometimes she possesses you sometimes she gets projected onto other women, real or fictional, these are the most common things. In general she works in the background, unseen. I think less so in gay people, the possession thing is very routine with us. If you're a tranny the possession thing is x10.

>>8690008
>you also get a lot more challenges because you can't hide your skeletons in your closet as easily and there's more 'you' to manage and develop.

And from there I guess you will get ever stronger, allowing you to face more of yourself. Training your mind up over time with the goal of complete self-understand and self-acceptance

>The ideal situation to do it would be one where you there is no outside stimuli.

So a dark, quiet room say, then I lay down and just let my mind go. I feel that I need to accept that I might think of weird stuff, or it is worth trying to think about men and relationships as a starter and then let my mind wander? Is that too controlling?

>posession/projection

Please explain this to me, I think I understand but want to make sure

Alright, didn't want to do this but whatever. I was in conversion therapy for little less than three years. Shoot.

>>8690835

What were the circumstances that led you to being there?
How did you choose which course you attended?
Were you there full time or part time?
Who was it run buy?
How much did it cost?
What techniques/practises did they use on you?
Most importantly, how did it affect you? Did your feelings change? How do you feel about your time there?

Appreciate there might be a lot of questions but it would be very helpful if you could answer them, thank you.

>>8690894
>What were the circumstances that led you to being there?
I came out to my parents and they freaked out as they always do because they're super neurotic and Catholics. And my mother came across a book by Joseph Nicolosi and called him.
>How did you choose which course you attended?
I'm not sure I understand. What do you mean by course. It was all therapy.
>Were you there full time or part time?
I had a session of 1½hrs every week.
>Who was it run buy?
It was called the Thomas Aquinas clinic and was part of NARTH
>How much did it cost?
Like 200 bucks a session.
>What techniques/practises did they use on you?
Mostly we talked. Sometimes we didn't talk about my sexuality at all. Sometimes we performed EMDR on a memory from the past.
>Most importantly, how did it affect you? Did your feelings change? How do you feel about your time there?
Let me get home to respond to this one as it's a loaded one and I'm at work. I'll get out in one hour.

>>8690968

Take the time you need my friend, thanks for taking the time to answer me.

>I'm not sure I understand. What do you mean by course. It was all therapy.

Lots of places seem to offer varying 'courses' of therapy, I wanted to know how you chose the one you ended up on but it sounds like it was decided for you. Sorry for the confusion.

>>8690655
>Development
The one thing you got wrong is self-acceptance. You naturally accept any part of yourself you've figured out how to weaponize.

>Active imagination
You got the general idea. As for the ugly stuff there will be plenty of that. There seems to be an early step where you are worried it will engulf you completly and you will drown in it. You can always turn if off though, I've never heard of any real danger happening from this.

>posession/projection
An example of anima possession. Think of times when a guy can be huge emotional bitch about the slightest thing, than suddenly go back to being normal just as suddenly. Or Greek playwrights that attributed their art to being possessed by a muse.

As for projection. It's seeing bits of her in images or other people. You focus on them as a proxy.

Both of these are healthy or even critical at certain times. What matters is realizing you are doing this so you can make a judgement call about whether you want to live your life like that.

>>8692571

> You naturally accept any part of yourself you've figured out how to weaponize.

I see, I will make sure that I try to focus upon areas that trouble me, if this isn't too controlling or directive

> it will engulf you completly and you will drown in it.

I tried this last night and utterly failed at it, I'm going to keep going and see what happens. I have a feeling that it might take some time

>anima possession

The active imagination techniques I'm trying should help me able to discern what's going on when this happens, particularly helping with self-understanding

>whether you want to live your life like that.

I'm assuming you mean living in a pure anima-possessed state vs. the 'repressed' conscious state of normality

>>8691005
Man I forgot to respond, hopefully this gets to you

>Most importantly,
>how did it affect you?

It changed my life forever. I realized some of the things that I feel come from my background and that I have more power over them than they have power over me. The therapy surrounded itself on the hypothesis that your family background and shame experiences are the source of homosexual behavior. To think that this is the sole reason of homosexuality is misleading, but to dispense with the notion that nurture is not part of where gays come from is foolish. I have an extremely dysfunctional family, he essentially was the only one that stuck with me when all the craziness of my family affected me.

>Did your feelings change?
I didn't have straight feelings before this. I'd consider myself bi at this point 3 on kinsey's. However it didn't feel like I "became" bi but rather that I sorted my feelings and discovered I actually liked girls more when I distanced myself from my clingy mother. I've always had straight feelings but now they come more naturally as for the gay ones they're still there, but at this point I don't care much for them. I'll masturbate to gay porn once in a while but it won't linger in my mind too long.

>How do you feel about your time there?
Man, this one's a tough one. If you go and search Joseph Nicolosi in the internet. You'll see rampant feminists calling him out and people telling he was a monster. You'll also see that he's dead. He died this March. And he was much more than what the media portrayed him to be. He was the best therapist I've ever had and to be honest a father figure that I always wanted. Unlike what you heard, if I ever had a gay experience instead of telling me I'm a degenerate, he'd only ask "how did you feel?" and then we'd talk from there. Honestly I never heard him say anything remotely homophobic. He hated the political correct crowd but not the gays themselves. When he died a bar in Hollywood celebrated.

>>8695922
You seem to have gotten the basics. I probaly went too far because ultimately there are tons of writing on this stuff (the anima and activation imagination, not the homo stuff). Everything is gradual, this is a life-style, even a religion for me.

>>8669829
This. Straight white male cis scum whatever here. Explored homosexuality and now I jerk off to gay porn occasionally but nothing further than that and it's pretty sweet.

>>8698247
You're degenerate. Never forget that.

But I'm not gay

>>8698458
Didn't say you were.

>>8696994

Thanks for taking the time to answer me, what you've written is very helpful to me, I'll try and outline why below

>I realized some of the things that I feel come from my background

This is what initially made me unhappy with my feelings, like you I come from a less than ideal family situation and feel that it could have affected my attractions and desires

>I've always had straight feelings but now they come more naturally as for the gay ones they're still there, but at this point I don't care much for them

Do you now seek relationships with women, or have a girlfriend? Sorry if this seems invasive, ignore it if you don't want to answer it

>NARTH and Nicolosi

I know a little about Nicolosi, having seen a television programme about him once. He seemed to be exactly the kind of therapist I would be looking for, in that he doesn't say 'find religion' or 'just be yourself :-) come out lol'. He sounds like he was willing to work with clients in a positive way, yet the interviewer teased him about his suit being gay looking and brought in an ex-ex-gay guy to refute his claims, because there's no way you'd be allowed to say therapy might work in the Western media. Unfortunatly there don't seem to be any NARTH or Nicolosi style therapists in my country though, it's all about encouraging gays and telling us that we're perfect.

>When he died a bar in Hollywood celebrated.

;_; This kind of stuff will make me homophobic

>>8697156

> Everything is gradual, this is a life-style, even a religion for me.

I'm keeping at it, again had no success last night, but if you have to take it that seriously I will persist. Thanks for your advice, you didn't go too far at all. I would never have known about most of this if not for your help anon.

>>8699981
>Do you now seek relationships with women, or have a girlfriend? Sorry if this seems invasive, ignore it if you don't want to answer it

I do. I have a fear of women attachment, but I think that has to do with mommy issues, 'cause I certainly have that. I've never had a long term girlfriend but I've had a couple of girls I've liked. Never had straight sex but I've gone to second base and been fully erect. So yeah the question of whether or not I can engage on straight sex is yes.

Now I do have same sex feelings everyday, I simply try to recognize them and not engage with them too much, not ignoring them simply being aware they are there. It's funny for same sex attraction if I get to know the guy I'm attracted to usually my attraction will go down, usually it has to do with the fact that I humanize the person instead of putting them on a sexual pedestal. For women it's the opposite, if I engage with women usually the attraction is low but if I get to know them better in my mind they get sexier and sexier. There was this time at a party where I was bored so I started to talk to this girl, anyway she was super interesting and funny fast forward 1 hour and I started to think "god dammed, when did she get so hot all of the sudden" she went from a 6 to an 8 in a matter of an hour in my mind.

>;_; This kind of stuff will make me homophobic
Yeah man. He was a great guy and to see people toasting on his death makes me want to puke. Watch this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXue5IknI2U
and tell me you don't want to puke yourself on the stupidity of the mother.

>>8699981
btw if you want to speak hit me up at my throaway reddit account (the only thing I can think of that doesn't have my personal information) /u/cacaphonous_rage, send me a dm, maybe. I definitely know what you're feeling.

>>8701827
>>8701973

In order not to fill this thread up any more, I have sent you a dm on le reddit.

Thanks for your time and answers