WH now falsely claiming transgender people are mentally ill

>>8643583
Isn't that correct though? Being trans is a medical condition, gender dysphoria and neurological opposite-sex characteristics are the symptoms, the treatment is gender transition.

>>8643592
Just because something is a medical condition that effects people's brains doesn't automatically make it a mental illness, that's a very american/underage way of thinking about it.
May as well call victims of brain cancer crazy people.

>>8643603
what characterizes mental illness, in your opinion?

>>8643603
>a medical condition that effects people's brains
No, you have it backwards. The neurological opposite-sex characters ARE the medical condition. They are what causes the gender dysphoria. They are what causes the person to be transgender. It is absolutely about the brain.

>>8643642
>neurological opposite-sex characteristics*

>>8643583
>Daily Signal
lol

>>8643583
>wahh, don't take trans out of the DSM!
>wahh, don't call trans a mental disorder!

>>8643603
The real question is why you're in so much fucking denial as to the fact that it is a mental illness. I get gay and being attracted to someone of the opposite gender, but trans is a whole other issue. You want to wear dresses, to look like how you think women should look. You think you are X when you are Y. Why are you so fucking insistent on saying it's not a mental fucking problem when it is obvious to everyone else? What pride do you want to gain by fooling yourself into thinking it's normal? It's a mental condition whether you like it or not, because plain and simple you want to be something that you will never be.

This is what I don't or ever will understand. You think looking like a woman makes you a woman. And this insanity drives people to meteoric lengths. Have you seen the disgusting reality of SRS? Do you think it's normal to have to be shoving something up a fucking wound trying to heal itself for the rest of your life?

God I feel as frustrated as if I was trying to convince a dumb Islamist that Allah doesn't exist, while he shouts "ALLAHU AKBAR" mindlessly.

>>8643671
>you want to be something that you will never be
The neurological opposite-sex characteristics mean they kind of are what they identify as, or at least their brain is.

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>>8643583
>Walt Heyer
LOL
This AGP nigga once again.

>>8643583
If transgenders aren't mentally ill, then they wouldn't need hormones and surgery so they wouldn't kill themselves. Looking like a woman also doesn't cure gender dysphoria, it just elevates the symptom because they'll never be a real woman.

>>8643676
Claim that when you've MRI'd us.

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>>8643725
Haven't there been a ton of studies finding that trannies always have neurological opposite-sex characteristics? And that fags' brains have the same pattern, just to a lesser extent?

>>8643671
>This is what I don't or ever will understand.
Because you haven't yet figured out that words are not intrinsic in meaning, and as such trying to be definitional when the definition has changed is pointless.

"how you think a woman should look". There is no way a woman 'should' look - such a thing isn't even possible. But that concept - that 'woman' is a wholly fabricated concept - is not yet something you've understood. And so long as you fail in this basic task, you are correct -- you'll never understand.

IOW...YOU ARE the Islamist, and you're shouting 'man! man! man! man! woman!' mindlessly.

PS -- no one thinks dressing like a woman makes them a woman. they are already women internally, where it matters, and the 'outfit' is what society demands of women. IOW...the 'man in a dress' phenomenon is wholly a result of your own insistence on 'what women wear'. Heh.

>>8643676
I want to take your statement for granted but it is simply, logically, too unreal. How would you distinguish trans that are actually trans and people who just have some weird gay fetish? Would you scan every brain? From the people who are "bold (stupid)" enough to go with SRS?

I'm pretty sure if we scanned all the male brains there would be some that lean more towards a "female" brain, and vice versa. Furthermore, if there are such things as "male" and "female" brains, why are we pretending there are more than two real genders? This whole thing is a fuck soup and it is confusing and stupid and people need to snap the fuck out of this fucking trend.

>>8643583
Next they're gonna say people in wheelchairs are physically disabled!

>>8643743
>I'm pretty sure
Why guess? You can go read up on this stuff yourself. There's a lot of related reading material online. Use google.

>This whole thing is a fuck soup and it is confusing
I know it is Anon, but there is strong evidence for the theory of trannies being "neurological intersex". Seriously, look it up hombre.

>>8643748
As a matter of fact, I have an acquaintance who is wheelchair bound who is not, in fact, physically disabled but has suffered near-vegetative brain damage. Her body, however, is perfectly fine.

>>8643735
Have there?

>always
[citation needed]

>>8643741
You misinterpret me. I wholly agree that there is no way a woman "should" look, my point was that why don't you tell that to trans people, because they have a very clear definition of what woman """should""" look like. They say they identify as a woman, and so they dress like what they think a woman should look like. Dresses, heels, you find it in the girl's aisle and it's what they decide to wear to tell the world they *are* women.

So it would seem like they are the ones with that primitive idea.

Wait, so, most of the gay community believes transgenders to be mentally ill?

>>8643761
Does the brain damage prevent her from being ABLE to walk? Is that why she's in a wheelchair? Because that's called a physical DISABILITY.

>>8643762
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=transgender+brain

>>8643774
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=define+cite

Come back when it's sunk in.

>>8643767
Not exactly. The opposite-sex neurological characteristics of transgender people's brains essentially make them neurologically intersex people. This is obviously unusual, but not exactly an illness since it has no inherent harmful effect.

>>8643780
Ooh, clever! Unfortunately for you, we're not in your high school debate club, and so I don't need to spoonfeed you.

>>8643763
Wtf I'm mtf and i wear jeans moccasins and the occasional dress. What trans people are you talking about

>>8643790
>It's the internet so my lies don't need to be true
'kay, bye.

>>8643804
>it's a lie because the 4chan post had no formal citation
kay, bye.

>>8643809
>lie and straw man
Guessing you don't have fond memories of debate club.

>>8643820
I was never in debate club, I was too cool.

>>8643822
>I was never in debate club
I couldn't tell.

>>8643794

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVtnsNDXuaY
And literally every MtF I've ever seen. They sure as hell always like to wear make up like they think women do. Lipstick and everything. Very clear idea of what a woman should look like. So are they sexist?

>>8643824
I would emphasize, once again, that 4chan is no place for your formal debate. Also, traditionally, you stop replying after the "kay bye" thing. Please get yourself together.

>>8643834
Backing up your wild claims instead of just lying is hardly formal debate.

>>8643828

using their own rules, yeah, everything about the trans community is so fucking hypocritical. But it's better to just leave them alone than call them out

>>8643828
You're seriously going to rag on someone because she hasn't had the lead-in years of makeup practice a natal girl gets?

Just remember. Trouble borrowed will be paid back with interest compounded on sorrow.

>>8643843
I'm not going to bother linking you directly to any of the many places you coul read up on those studies - because you can find them all yourself if you really care to, it's not complicate bro.

If that means you choose not to believe in the scientific evidence just waiting for your eyes, that's honestly just your problem.

>>8643828
Are you saying the women who put on make up to go on national television are making a mockery of women? Im not going on dr phil in fucking sweatpants ffs

Come on, Get Real.

>>8643855
I don't believe the scientific evidence that doesn't exist.

That this upsets you so much says it all.

it's just confusing how the transgender community has multiple opposed alternative facts going on that are opposed to each other. like gender fluidity vs. people moving towards very traditional and classic gender roles

Just none of it really adds up whatsoever honestly

>>8643828
Are you the mom from this video?

>>8643871
As we're seeing in this thread the transgender community doesn't care about truth very much.

If a transgender woman tricks a straight cis guy , and he murders her, then I blame her for ruining 2 lives.

you're dead, he's probably going to prison forever, all because of your fucked up sadistic behavior.

>>8643865
You're telling me to get real while preaching transgenderism.

>>8643583
Yeah. Straight cis people have been lying and then making those lies into laws for ten thousand years. What's your point?

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>>8643583
Trumps fighting the good fight.

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>draft exception
>disability bux
>the entire media crying out in outrage on my behalf, effectively doubling my chance in any sort of civilian placement

>Boys, does this skirt make my butt look big?

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>>8643583
>falsely

>>8643871
Because you're a moron who's squishing a bunch of feminist sjw bullshit in with trans people and saying it's all trannies.
This is like those retards who post the "there's no such thing as gender, trannies are real, pick on" images. Trannies don't say there's no such thing as gender, they don't say gender is completely fluid and can change at whim, that's what radfems say and they often shit on trannies for supporting traditional gender roles.

>>8643583
>WH now falsely claiming transgender people are mentally ill
[citation needed]

>>8643603

Schizophrenia is a mental illness and affects people's brains to a point where symptoms can be artificially induced by stimulating certain areas of the brain.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/09/060920-shadow-person.html

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>falsely

>>8643871
>confusing people who understand the biological and medical aspects of the disorder with Tumblr tots
Ever letting trenders get a platform was a mistake.

>>8645738
So genocide people with schizophrenia?

Got it, classic /pol/ logic.

>m-muh darwin tells me to!

>>8643676
there are no absolute difference between female and male brains.
its all probabilistic, there are some traits which are more common in men (masculine traits), and some in women (feminine traits).

to claim that there is a female brain or a male brain, and any deviation from that implies you are another gender is pure nonsense.

trannies are at best people who tend to have traits more common in the other sex.

>>8646071

wut?

>>8646810
>there are no absolute difference between female and male brains.
Source? Same the the opposite side, where do claims about male/female brains being different or the same come from to begin with?

>to claim that there is a female brain or a male brain, and any deviation from that implies you are another gender is pure nonsense.
But all other aspects of male/female physiology are sexually dimorphic, why not brains?
Males and females differ in terms of height, fat distribution, bone density, body hair, muscle mass, proportions, skin texture, health risks, illness manifestations, etc. Even non-sexual internal organs differ, eg females have smaller hearts than males.
And sure, there can be outliers like cis women who have man hands and cis men who have girly wrists, but from a top-down view of humankind, male and female bodies are very distinct.

And the same goes for male and female behaviour, across societies and across time. It doesn't always manifest in the same way, and there are some cultures where the dynamic is completely flipped and women hold the power. But to my knowledge there is no and has never been a human society where gender doesn't exist at all, and where there is no difference between the sexes in terms of social roles, expectations, behaviours, strengths, etc.

So why is suggesting brain differences total nonsense, when pretty much every other trait shows differences?

Mental illness is a very arbitarily defined social convention but generally it does not make any sense to call transgenderism a mental illness if it does not serve to actually help the people with transgenderism become mentally healthy. It blanket makes them unemployable in many jobs as well.

Treating transgenderism as not a mental illness, but a common cause of many related mental illnesses such as dysphoria and depression, means that somebody is clear of comorbid mental illness can hold down a job in say military IT, and treating it in such a fashion is likely to make transgender people feel like less of freaks and thus have an easier time adjusting to society which is good for everybody.

Homosexuality could be called a mental illness on the exact same grounds transgenderism is because it is associated with depression, suicide, etc. It also, like transgenderism, is associated with a reduced chance of reproducing. It however was agreed a long time ago we should stop calling it that under similar rationale that is being used for transgenderism now.

I see no reason to call transgenderism a mental illness unless your goal is to "cure it" by getting transgender people to not live as the gender they were not born with which seems to make them only more dysfunctional and suicidal and thus does not seem worth it. I side with conservatives a lot these days but they're just acting like dicks on this point purely arguing that transgenderism fits what they think of as mental illness making a purely semantic argument but missing the point entirely. I really don't think they understand why we call people and things mentally ill. It's to help them get better and function in society, not to label people who are different.

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>>8648885
That's basically what all this is. Most assholes that like to label trans people as mentally ill and cherrypick quotes and suicide statistics from studies that they haven't even read thoroughly enough to comprehend just wanna use the "mentally ill" label as both an ad-hominem attack and a platform to stigmatize us and try to remove us from society by any means possible. Whether that's trying to "cure" us through some flavor of repressive conversion therapy or by using the stigma they push as a means to take away our rights and healthcare. They like to pretend they're concerned and that they care, but they're really just hateful people that want us to go away. It'd be dishonest to say that transphobia and sexism have absolutely no bearing on their faux "concern".

Pic related is what's happening in the U.S. right now. I think you might like the article it came from.

https://psmag.com/social-justice/take-gender-identity-disorder-dsm-68308

>>8643583
>implying it's false
There's a reason trannies are a small minority. Now I don't hate trannies nor do I think they're lesser people. But it's fact that it is a mental disorder that is not naturally supposed to happen.

>>8648990
>not naturally supposed to happen
What does that even mean though? It doesn't happen unnaturally.

>>8649006
I mean it's not normal and not supposed to happen thus being a disorder. Not inherently bad for the person affected, but still a disorder

>>8649009
>it's not normal
granted

>not supposed to happen
???

>a disorder
more like an anomaly

>>8649013
I don't know why you're so baffled by me saying it's not supposed to happen. It's just like how you're not supposed to be born without an arm or an organ or some shit. It's still a disorder nonetheless

>>8649018
>you're not supposed to be born without an arm or an organ
Those anomalies are inherently bad for the person though. Being transgender, intersex, gay or otherwise "not normal" seems quite different from an actual handicap like missing a limb or other body part.

>>8648885
>Treating transgenderism as not a mental illness, but a common cause of many related mental illnesses such as dysphoria and depression

But transgenderism (as in, transitioning and living as the opposite sex) isn't a cause of dysphoria, it's the treatment. That makes no sense.

But yes, transgenderism itself isn't the mental illness, dysphoria is.

>>8649021
Hence why I've already said it wasn't inherently bad or a handicap. It's still a fucking disorder holy shit how hard is it to get through your head? It being a disorder isn't inherently bad, it's just that, a disorder. Holy shit I think you have enough concrete around your head to protect us from the toxic radiation that's going on in your mind

>>8643642
Being transgender means having neurological opposite-sex characteristics which cause gender dysphoria.

Transitioning is the treatment for that dysphoria, but a person with neurological opposite-sex characteristics AND gender dysphoria is 100% trans whether they transition or not!

>>8649037
Why are you getting so mad?

>disorder
>a disturbance in physical or mental health or functions; malady or dysfunction
LGBTQIA2+ just does not meet the medical definition of a disorder

it is abnormal but not a malady or dysfunction, just unusual

>>8649018
>>8649037
>It's just like how you're not supposed to be born without an arm or an organ or some shit. It's still a disorder nonetheless
Those things are disorders because they greatly impair one's ability to function, not because they're "not supposed to happen."

Likewise, gender dysphoria is a disorder because it's a source of distress that impairs one's ability to function, and improved functioning is achieved through medical treatment.
Which is also why homosexuality is conversely not a disorder. In a vacuum, it creates no such distress or impairment and requires no intervention to allow the subject to function comfortably.

By your definition, blonde hair might as well be a disorder.

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>>8643583
>falsely claiming

Everybody that has spent more than a few days on /lgbt/ would conclude that trannies are mentally ill. It's not an insult, it's just a sad reality. Bering in denial about it isn't going to make it go away.