hons

>>8468530
Hons should keep repressing.

Almost all hons are AGP.

Transition and show the world that trans people can be beautiful, happy, and live fulfilling lives as well. Better than leaving it to old age, becoming a hon, and joining the problem you're trying to resolve. It'll just fix itself with time.

>>8468538
>transitioning as a hon
Honestly, if you've made it that far, you can go the rest of the way. Just gotta hold on.

Transition is not scientifically proven by multiple citations that are not conflicting to even help transgender people.

Repression has the same suicide rate.

improve your position in society, start your own group for advocacy such as youth trans society (under 30), reach out to people directly via door to door or social media. the media is never gonna want to stop showing more weird lookingg people cause it gets views

>>8468543

Are you that egg in this thread >>8468143 who sperged out about scientific studies?

>>8468543
fuck off /pol/freak


also OP its a generational thing, most gen z'rs primarily personally have met young transitioners. just wait for those rascals to start havingg a voice

>>8468548
I'm not an "egg".
And I am anonymous.

>>8468551
I'm not from /pol/. That place is awful.

I'm simply saying, it is never worth it to transition when it is experimental treatments / palliative care essentially, when there is no known cure that actually has proven benefits.

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>>8468561

Oh man it IS you.

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>>8468530
>issue of hons
>they get the most media attention
>everyone assumes we're all disugsting old men in dresses like them

Be glad that hons exist. Think about it: When people meet a young transgirl, who isn't gone completely insane and acts appropriate, people are surprised positively!

Hons are a gift! A gift for the foes of Mordor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFQEIZEsWj4

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>>8468543
He made it real far.

>>8468569
But she gave up too early, and became a hon, big mistake. But I can sympathise with those that have to transition. It shoulid generally only be considered in cases of transition or suicide, where there is no other choice.

>>8468565
Who is this person? Is this a new caraposter?

>>8468587

Just read the other thread linked to see some pretty kekworthy denial. AGP posters can say some really crazy shit when they're repressed.

Sorta sad desu.

>>8468599
I'm not denying anything. I'm simply stating facts, nothing more. Believe what you will!

>>8468599
I see, anon.
Seems like a logical repressor to me.

Gotta do what you gotta do to keep on survivin'

>>8468599
Link the specific posts you're talking about.

>>8468607
the facts are transition demonstrably lowers suicidality

we dont have blind trials because theyre impossible given the subject but theres piles of secondary evidence

>>8468543
>Transition is not proven to help transgender people
False.

>>8468622

But I dont wanna miss one and have you or AGP-kun sperg out and claim I'm a soviet. It's only 100-something posts anyway. People can just read it desu. You're all here on /lgbt/ all day anyway.

>>8468636
>>8468633

[citations needed]

Trans people have the same suicide rate transitioning or not.

Secondary evidence isn't evidence. BS.

>>8468639
>hurr every post i don't like is denial but i don't have to prove it or even say what i'm talking about durr

>>8468686
This. Butthurt hons BTFO.

Still waiting for a real argument that isn't insults, or "You're an egg." or "Take your damn hormones".

>>8468642
secondary evidence, as in not
placebo randomized trials.. when presented in massive quantities, when placebo randomized trials are impossible, are recognized as totally valid due to extremely high likelihood. you are defending a position that is very very difficult to defend, to pretend it is the most valid position is dishonest which is why i peg you as a /pol/scum but i guess being a dumb repressor fits too

>>8468711
>massive quantities
[citation needed]
Oh and it's not difficult to defend, speaking of /pol/ isn't your so called secondary evidence very.. political? Just people saying they feel better when in the long run the suicide rates are the same, lol.

There is not a massive quantity of secondary evidence. Prove it.

I'm actually AGP myself, I'm not from /pol/ - Posted on there once, got told to gas myself and left, /lgbt/ is the only place who understands, ignoring the butthurt transitioning hons that hear the truth.

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Let's toss Milo Stewart into Mount Doom.

>>8468699

But you got them in the other thread even though we said it wouldnt matter because you'd always find some 'exclusionary reason' to not believe anything else.

We're already going down the path of that other thread. It has barely 20 posters but 100+ posts of unduly nitpicking studies and AGP-kun sperging out. You just dont change your mind. It's fine to be trans and not wanna transition but dont spread misinformation about transgender statistics and go hysterically defensive about real evidence when people post studies and interviews of the study authors.

>>8468736
Not an argument. "exclusionary reason" is not an argument. It's a way of dismissing fair debate.

I'm not spreading misinformation, I'm simply speaking my mind, nothing more. Feel free to disagree, anon.

Also, you don't need to call me "AGP-kun". You hons are cherrypicking studies yourselves, so don't give me that argument.

I'm not transgender, as far as I believe. There is not enough evidence to support the current hypothesis, and I await a cure, and that's that.

I'm not going "defensive" - I am simply stating facts.

>>8468732
Shoe0nhead is kissing her ass and calling her real trans.

>>8468568
I would have to agree with you. This has helped me out a couple of times.

>>8468728
http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/full/10.1089/trgh.2015.0008
theres scores of studies and meta analysis like this, your position is simply hard to defend when we have this and also strong evidence that discrimination affects suicide

>>8468878
Social effects are not easily measured, and are essentially anecdotal evidence. Even in a perfect world, trans suicide rates would be just as high, unless you can prove otherwise of course!

Low quality evidence suggests that hormone therapy may lead to improvements in psychological functioning.

>low quality evidence
That isn't a good citation, anon.

I think even the shitshow of blanchard has more evidence.

>>8468906

#notmyevidence

>>8468642
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2265.2009.03625.x/abstract
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24344788
https://mayoclinic.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/hormonal-therapy-and-sex-reassignment-a-systematic-review-and-met
http://www.researchgate.net/publication/23553588_Long-term_Assessment_of_the_Physical_Mental_and_Sexual_Health_among_Transsexual_Women
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/25690443

Transitioning correlates with an improvement in mental health and a reduction in dysphoria. Deteriorated mental health and gender dysphoria correlate with suicide. By transitivity, assuming that gender dysphoria and deteriorated mental health contribute to people being suicidal, improving mental health and reducing gender dysphoria reduces suicide risk.

>>8468906
>I think even the shitshow of blanchard has more evidence.
Other way around. They use a very strict standard. Since it is hard to directly show social effects most evidence in social science is low quality. Blanchard's isn't even that.

ok hoe the fuck is hrt a mental cure
if adderall is a mental cure then ok w.e

hrt gives me adderall lvl energy w.o amphetamine cardio feels

ur never guna convince me my lazy ass is mentally ill.

Teach the public to be accepting of hons, and you will face less bullshit in your life. If hons are treated okay by society, you will fall well within the bounds of 'normal'. You will fit in, and be accepted as feminine.

Teach the public to condemn hons, and society will condemn you as well. For plenty of people, there is no difference between a hon and a girl who passes. They don't understand our intricacies, they just hear 'was born a man'. Be very careful when throwing your own kind under the bus.

Respect and cherish hons. They are women at the frontiers of transphobia. I think that's fucking brave.

>>8469116
This is the moral thing to do
but
as someone who would be a hon if they transitioned and hates themselves I can't not also hate hons

>>8469130
Agreed. Stay repressing, brother.
Don't join them and become a sister hon.

>>8469137
There is no nobility to what I'm doing. Only cowardice.

>>8469130
>>8469352
I'm sorry for the girl in you, Anon. I care about you.

Stay safe.

>>8469363

Or at the very least, I care about her. I care about the repressed girls, women and mothers in every one of you.

>>8469376
>repressed mothers
Rreeeeee, anon.. son't bring that up.

>>8469376
>repressed AGPs not on that list
Blanchardphobes

>>8470699
AGPs are repressed girls.

>>8470711
AGPs are men awaiting a cure for their cross-gender feelings.

>>8468543
Then you should repress, hon. Only femboys are allowed to transition. That will solve the problem. No more hons like you.

>trans women are only legitimate if lots of men want to fuck them
So, I'm just a bi guy who doesn't have much of a horse in this race, but what the actual shit?

>>8471463
Point is that these scary looking hons with their nauseating plastic surgery, crotch bulges, and giant intimidating hulk bodies are the face of transgender women. You wanna know why grown ass hairy men are always cast as transwomen in movies, even when actual PASSING transwomen audition for the roles? Because that's what people think we all look like, and will continue to think as long as these atrocious hons keep trying to spill their life stories all over the news. It does not feel good to be associated with terrifying crossdressers that are almost guaranteed to be creepy transbians. No one would give a shit if they kept to themselves and let the passing trannies (whether attractive OR ugly) have a little limelight.

>>8471517
That's fair. Though I doubt most of the people who don't pass as well appreciate the fact that some much more vocal people are basically treating their own being trans as some kind of side show either.

It's not someone's fault they look a certain way.

>>8470820
I'm not "Repressing". While it does have the same suicide rate as transition, a method that makes me feel better is being self-aware that I'm AGP, but not transitioning, ever.

I'm not a hon, because I'm not really a girl. Wanting to be a girl does not = being a girl.

>>8469025
I like how these discussions always completely end when someone posts actual links.

Makes me wonder if it's because they have no argument or just not intereted enough to read through them.

>>8471563
I've read his "very low quality evidence" posts, anon. Very low quality evidence = NOT AN ARGUMENT.

>>8471594
And did you read the other 4?

>>8471598
Different anon, but why should she? When he resorts to spamming links it's because he's lost the argument. If he hadn't, he'd only be posting ones that are actual quality.

>>8471607
...what?

>someone asks for citations
>posts citations
>heh... you lost the argument kiddo...
Why am I even replying

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>>8471607
>assumes the person against transitioning is a "she"
>assumes the person posting sources that transitioning is good is a "he"
???

>>8471598
"very low evidence"
"low evidence"
"likely"

That is not hard evidence, anon.
I read all 5.

>>8471607
I'm not a she, anon - but I appreciate the pronoun usage. I'm waiting for a cure, I'm a guy. :)

>>8471614
I'm assuming it's a subtle troll, with the "she".

>>8471630
I'm not really against transitioning, anon. I just believe that it should be only done in cases of life or death, when there is absolutely no other choice for the person in question.

It's palliative care, not a cure or even a good treatment. But I have nothing against those who transition, or transition as a whole.

We just need more studies, more evidence and most of all work on a cure for those that do not require transition.

>>8471636
It's still more than nothing. I don't see any convincing (or any at all, personally) study that determines that transition is definitely bad. And I'm talking about social transition, not about SRS-focused studies, since I'm myself very neutral in that matter.

There are multiple stating that it's likely that it's a positive treatment, and there are more I'm sure if I get to look for them, even if they are "low quality".
I can understand being against it if there was a convincing one stating otherwise but I find your conclusion super unreasonable.

>>8471678
There is no study that determines transition is bad, however the studies for transition being good are also heavily lacking.

In this case, there is a lack of evidence for both sides, meaning that logically we should support those that need to transition as palliative, experimental treatment cases, and for the others, work on treatments and research for alternatives.

As transition DOES NOT make every AGP, Trans, and so on happy.

Did I ever claim to be "against transitioning?"

I'm only against people telling ME that I "must be trans" and "must transition", and in addition to that telling others the same.

>>8471630
>unable to reply to the content of the post
>better attack the pronouns!
>while conspicuously ignoring everybody else who assumes pronouns

>>8471695
Sorry, I'd rather believe numerous studies reaching the same conclusion even if they are not 100% conclusive than consider a theory that has absolutely nothing to base itself on.

>I'm only against people telling ME that I "must be trans"
I don't really understand this, weren't you saying you were waiting for a cure? So it was for someone else or something?

>>8471723
>Sorry, I'd rather believe
And that's what it is at the end of the day. What you'd prefer to think.

>>8471723
I have said I'm "waiting for a cure" for AGP/Dysphoria. I've never said that I'm transgender, it's quite possible but there is no evidence or way of objectively testing that.

I have a mental illness that is awaiting a cure and proper, scientifically backed treatment that is effective and proven to work.

When I speak of "AGP" I do not mean the Blanchard drivel version, I use it as a label to identify the feelings of my dysphoria in a way that makes sense to me.
>>8471730
The studies are not conclusive, so either way it's a belief. I have a belief that I am not trans, but simply mentally ill and awaiting a cure.

Others believe all AGP/Trans/Whatever label people need to stuff hormones down their throats, and there is absolutely no other options for us.

>>8471742
Well, take this the way you want, but you sound extremely in denial to me.

Either way, what do you mean by
>I have a belief that I am not trans, but simply mentally ill and awaiting a cure.
What do you think your illness is? I'm genuinely curious.

>>8471778
This is what I am always told, and this is the real problem. There is no room for others to have their opinion, and discuss alternate viewpoints. It is simply "You're a girl take your damn hormones."

By "not trans", what I mean by this is I believe there is something causing me to feel the way I do about gender, that is not adequately described by being "transgender".

This is why I use the term "AGP", as while Blanchardism is a cancer, it describes how I feel far better than being Transgender.

>>8471778
She thinks her desires to be female are a form of OCD.
Read the thread.

>>8471804
>feel the way I do about gender
Can you describe it?

>>8471817
I never claimed this. I am actually unsure why I feel the way I do, which is why I strongly feel more research, and alternative viewpoints are required.

But I do know what I don't feel like, and that is being transgender. I'm not in denial, I have explored my feelings for many, many years.

Even in the depths of dysphoria, I feel the same way as I do now about all this.

I simply await more research, more evidence, a proper diagnosis and a proper cure.

>>8471825
It's very difficult to explain, in all honesty.

It's simply a feeling, I can't really describe it in any detail.

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>>8468530
Get rid of all transbians, the niggers of the lgbt community. They transition not out of inclination but a desire to get more chicks by dressing up and feminizing their penis, so they don't put in any effort and want society to accept them as female even when they're a drooping crone in a trash bag.

>>8471850
I don't think anyone wants to be trans. Especially transbians - for the record I'm bi, not really a transbian I'm happy with guys too, but just saying.

>>8468530
>the media hates trans people
>its trans people's fault!!

>>8471834
Alright I can't say I understand your point of view, but out of sincere concern I want to tell you that waiting for "more research, more evidence, a proper diagnosis and a proper cure" is simply not a good choice because of the simple fact that chances are that it will be too late for you by the time we get to that point.

For the majority of people transitioning has been positive, I understand that your concern is that it may not be positive for you at all, but ultimately there's still a better chance of it being beneficial and actually getting a cure anytime soon.

You do you, this is just what I believe you should do. Just try not to regret whatever you end up choosing.

>>8471882
>and actually getting a cure anytime soon.
I meant
"THAN actually getting a cure anytime soon."

>>8471882
I'm well aware of this. I would not be choosing this option if I felt differently, and that transition would even slightly improve my quality of life in the long run. But for me, personally it would do nothing.

Transition, as a whole is palliative care, and as long as you're aware of that, there's nothing wrong with transitioning if you think it may make you feel better, and you think you that you're going to end up transition or suicide in the long run.

Regardless of what I choose, life is all about the ride. I'm not going to regret my choice even if I end up being a "hon" and finding out I'm actually trans later on - Infact, it'd be a blessing. I'd know what to do with my life.

For someone that has no choice, and feels it may help them, even though there is no proven benefits, transition is the logical choice.

But when there is a choice, then you seek alternatives, even if they don't exist yet.

Transition, personally would not make me happy, it would only decrease my quality of life.

>>8471886
freudian slip

A G P
G
P

>>8471563
[Citation needed] has come to be used as a debate tactic based on the idea that people can't back what they're saying off the cuff. The problem is that, on the long term, it just causes the community you're trolling to create a whole library of citations they can pull on demand.

>>8471594
>>8471636
You do not understand what "very low quality evidence" means. Most psych evidence, including any suicide statistics, is low quality because it is not hard evidence showing direct causation. For example you could not find "high quality" evidence for the relation between being trans and suicide.

>>8471607
They literally asked for a citation dimwit.

>>8471695
>As transition DOES NOT make every AGP, Trans, and so on happy.
Where's your evidence for that? :^) Make sure it shows causation, now! Can't be satisfied with low quality evidence here.

>>8472447
Detransitioners exist. Enough said. You don't need a citation for blatant common sense.

>>8472447
>not hard evidence
Meaning the trans narrative is total bullshit.
Opinion discarded.

All you want is more hons to join your Trans* cult.

You want me to say I'm a girl when I'm not, I just have feelings about gender.

I'm not going to take estrogen, because I'm a man.

Blanchard was right.

>>8472447
[citation needed] on [Citation needed] has come to be used as a debate tactic

>>8472470
>Blanchard was right.
[citation needed]

>>8472454
>Detransitioners exist. Enough said.
Where's your hard, high quality evidence that they didn't detransition because of bigotry? :^)

>You don't need a citation for blatant common sense
Oh, NOW you don't need a citation for blatant common sense, such as transitioning making transsexuals happier?

>>8472463
>Meaning the trans narrative is total bullshit.
Nah, there is hard evidence for transsexuality as intersexuality. There is no hard evidence for any of the social stuff. If that makes the social narrative total bullshit.. well, then, it also makes the anti-trans narrative total bullshit and we're left with zero info.

>>8472470
m8 you're the one who has been posting here for, what, a week or two now? You're inviting these debates. You're getting the proper, true answers. If you don't want to hear the truth stop initiating these debates and live your little life in an echo chamber of your choice.

>>8472470
Addendum:
>Blanchard was right.
Okay, so you accept that as a dysphopric adult you can't be treated in any way sans transitioning. Great. :^)

>>8472486
I don't need to cite shit. You all essentially admit Blanchard is right and concede the debate when you say you can't prove blanchard is wrong.

Because he's right, dummy.

>>8472496
Social issues generally don't cover the scope of science, more politics. So there is no [citation needed]. It is an open debate and currently not known why detransitioners detransition, just like we don't know why transgender people transition.

Where's your evidence that "trans" people don't transition due to societal factors like gender roles? [citation needed]

>>8472496

It's not common sense that transitioning makes transsexuals happier in the LONG TERM. In the short term, it is widely known that it makes transsexuals happier, but it does not increase their long term happiness as far as is known.

>we're left with zero info.

That's exactly what I'm trying to say. We have zero information. I use AGP as a purely descriptive label, not as a blandchardist. More research is needed. Both theories are "wrong" until proved otherwise.

I'm not anti-trans. I'm anti-bullshit.

>>8472500
"Can't be treated in any other way" THAT IS CURRENTLY KNOWN.

>>8472496
hard evidence for transsexuality as intersexuality
[citation needed]

And one BSTc study doesn't fucking count.

>>8472514
>"Can't be treated in any other way" THAT IS CURRENTLY KNOWN.
by the time they find a cure or confirm that transitioning is the best option, you will be dead lol and why even keep debating in this place if you are trying to repress, you are just making it harder for yourself

>>8472508
>You all essentially admit Blanchard is right and concede the debate when you say you can't prove blanchard is wrong.
Fucking lol.
You essentially admit Islam is right and concede the debate when you say you can't prove Islam is wrong.

For real though the fact that gynephilic transsexuals have feminized brains pre-hormones kinda dunks on the whole no feminine essence claim so..

>It is an open debate and currently not known why detransitioners detransition, just like we don't know why transgender people transition.
And the reasons they state of course mean nothing :^)

>>8472514
>It's not common sense that transitioning makes transsexuals happier in the LONG TERM. In the short term, it is widely known that it makes transsexuals happier, but it does not increase their long term happiness as far as is known.
Why is this position not "common sense" while the opposite position is?

>That's exactly what I'm trying to say. We have zero information. I use AGP as a purely descriptive label, not as a blandchardist. More research is needed. Both theories are "wrong" until proved otherwise.
We're only left with zero evidence on the social plane. As far as the cause of transsexuality we're pretty confident in the whole neurological angle.

>>8472528
Okay, how about several pages filled with dozens of studies? I'll lead with a single one for good measure.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4699258/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_transsexuality#Genetics
http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2005to2009/2006-atypical-gender-development.html
http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2015to2019/2016-transsexualism.html

>>8472540
I'm not repressing. I'm not trans, you see. I'm AGP. I don't need to repress.

>>8472548
I didn't speak of religion, anon. Religion is a belief system. Blanchardism is science.

Lack of evidence in regards to long-term happiness, and transgender suicide rates long-term are just as bad as repressors.

These studies do not show the cause of transgenderism, and it could be as a result of other factors, rather than the "feminized brains". These may simply be harmless brain differences.

>>8472854
>I didn't speak of religion, anon. Religion is a belief system. Blanchardism is science.
Blanchardianism is as much of a religion as Islam because it is as unfalsifiable as Islam.

>Lack of evidence in regards to long-term happiness
If you don't accept the evidence for transsexuals being happier you have no reason to accept the idea that they might not be since it is of the same quality (minus the evidence).

>and transgender suicide rates long-term are just as bad as repressors
False.
>>8469025

>These studies do not show the cause of transgenderism, and it could be as a result of other factors, rather than the "feminized brains". These may simply be harmless brain differences.
Okay, so all of the people who say they feel they're trans just happen to have feminized brains by coincidence. Gotcha.

Brian sex has been extensively studies, even in non-trans subjects. Normal men and women don't have brains of this sort.

>>8468530
The people who bitch about hons are probably delusional hons themselves tbqh senpai.
The timeline for trutrans© people is:
>start hrt
>pass
>go stealth
>never associate with anything trans EVER!!!
>enjoy your happy trutrans© life

Everyone who is openly trans is also a hon because nobody would choose to be openly trans if they had the option to just go stealth.

>>8472867
Agree with you, except with the last one:
>"Everyone who is openly trans is also a hon because nobody would choose to be openly trans if they had the option to just go stealth."
You have to leave all your family and friends in order to go real stealth. That's a thing most people do not want to do.

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>>8472854
>Blanchardism is science.

>>8472879
I just cut people out of my life to be safe.
Everyone who knows my past is a danger to my stealth.
All the good intentions and support in the world aren't worth shit when those people can fuck up my entire life by talking too much while being drunk for example.
It's fine if you want to keep your friends and family but at least acknowledge them for being a potential danger to you.

>>8472887
Is this thing shooped?

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>>8472867

>>8472887
>>8472889
As in, is the one on the right shooped?

>>8472889
>>8472892
nope, its reel

>>8472888
I've been stealth for a long time and I don't plan to be openly trans, but stealth can get burdensome. It's caused me to keep people at a distance and made me reluctant to have close friends and relationships because I don't want anyone to find out about me. I'm still trying to figure out what to do but over time stealth can be lonely.

>>8473060
id love to go stealth but fucking adams apple (5'2 tho so people probably wont see as easily) and the fact that i cant change my name to a girl name because dumb shit laws (id have to go official for that and they can just deny me treatments for any bllshit reason)

>>8472888
Anon you're responding to reporting in.

I keep the people, who know my past, and "new people" at distance. My family and old friends know about me, but they never meet the new people I've met. Probably I'm lucky because they live far apart.

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>>8471862
>I don't think anyone wants to be trans
>is trans

I don't think that's how an exchange works, babe.

>>8468535
I'm a hon, I guess. I'm over 30, crossdress occasionally, consider myself trans but never had the courage to transition. It's too late for me now. I pass ok but more than a glance and you'll notice.

I don't go out and dress, I only do it on my own in private. I'm not AGP, but I look like it and don't want to just be viewed as a freak so I keep it in the closet.

>>8468535
But not all AGPs are hons. Many are cute passing trans girls.

>>8474698
Please, show me one such example.

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Wew reddit

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This "hon" stuff sounds like a bunch of retard shit for jackasses who like to be smug and seeing as I've only ever seen hon used on 4chan it probably is

>>8468642
I know of like nine mtfs that transitioned and none of them are dead yet.
All of them had multiple suicide attempts and a few had suicide pacts setup prior to transition. I'm in a pact with one of them where we are not allowed to die unless the other does it first.

>>8475238
>I've only ever seen hon used on 4chan

http://honfest.net/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HonFest
http://www.visitmaryland.org/event/honfest

>>8475238
Gb2 /susans/ darlin'~ :3

>>8474945

IDK, makes a pretty cute slampig. I'd fuck it if it acted like a whore and wore a pretty pair of undies

>>8475904
Your standards are pretty low then, let's face it.

>>8475937

at least i'm not lying to god or anyone on the internet

I am a late transition hon. It isn't easy at all. The shit I hear is sometimes very cruel. I sometimes think I made a mistake. That I can't make it. I often think of suicide.

I just couldn't repress anymore. I figure I will do this until I just kill myself.

I do feel so much happier at times tho so I am glad I found the courage to do this.

>>8468642
>Trans people have the same suicide rate transitioning or not
[citations needed]

>>8471648
>I just believe that it should be only done in cases of life or death
The trans suicide rate without treatment speaks for itself, it is a case of life or death.
You can't have it both ways with the suicide rate showing how mentally ill trannies are yet it not being a big enough issue to use the most effective treatment.

>We just need more studies, more evidence
I agree 100% however in the meantime people still suffer and need help from the most effective treatment which is transition.
Furthermore, I doubt any amount of evidence would be enough for people like you who just want to make excuses to delay treatment in the hope that some alternative that you would prefer will magically materialise despite no indication of its existence.

>>8471742
>When I speak of "AGP" I do not mean the Blanchard drivel version
That is the only version in medicine and science.
There is literally no research to support any version of agp as some stand-alone concept separate from blanchard's research.

You are making up a condition out of pure opinion and personal anecdote with no research or evidence and labelling it with a term from largely discredited research. That is not science or medicine and if anything harms any chance of an actual medical concept coming out of your claims.

>>8476521
>There is literally no research to support any version of agp as some stand-alone concept separate from blanchard's research.

May be not
>spoiler: fuckloads of peer reviewed science on AGP exists

but there's about 4$billion worth of pron vidya made every year to support it you disingenuous fucking faggot so ignore that reality

I feel like people obsessed with hons are either /pol/yps and other right wing people trying to coat trolling in a thin "but I care for you!" paint, or just really shallow people

>>8476521
There is a chance of a cure, anon. The most effective treatment is NOT transition for some people. It is an experimental, palliative care treatment.

I'm well aware there is no research to support a version of AGP as a standalone concept, I use this as a label to describe how I feel - however bad evidence namely in favor of the "traditional narrative'" is just as valid as no evidence at all. I believe there is an explanation for this that goes beyond the two theories.

I do not ever claim that my condition is scientific, I have said again and again more research is needed on non-traditional narrative science in order to find a cure.

The traditional narrative is just as made up as Blanchard's theories are, and the evidence heavily lacks support and is heavily biased by social belief, with no objective, hard evidence proving the absolute cause of dysphoria.

There is many "low evidence" brain studies, but they heavily lack in pre-transition studies, proper proof it is simply not a natural brain variation that is not related to gender dysphoria (More studies are needed on non-trans people's brains as well, we almost have no clue what these regions DO in the brain!), and so on.

I know that a cure is out there, we simply need to discover it, and stop shoving the narrative of "You're just a girl in a man's body" down everyone's throats.

>>8476546
Much peer review exists on AGP, but there is a lack of AGP not connected to Blanchard's theories.
[citation needed]

>>8476546
I would also like much more research on the whole video game self identification thing.

As men playing female characters may be a possible cause to the brain structural changes, we have very little understanding of how the brain itself works, and this may be reversible through some method of brain training if the case.

While this would not affect all AGP/Trans/Dysphoric people, I believe there is many types or forms of being transgender, and this should be looked into beyond simply "AGP or HSTS".

>>8472508
>I don't need to cite shit, muh feels are all teh evidense I need, only you need to cite shit so I can ignore it
This shitposting is getting lower quality over time.

>>8472548
>Why is this position not "common sense" while the opposite position is?
Because muh feel>>>>> your statistics

>>8476595
Because there is a lack of evidence towards supporting long-term benefits of transition. There is much lacking research.
>>8476584
That's a blanchardposting troll mimicking me because he thinks it's funny. Ignore them.

>>8476546
>spoiler: fuckloads of peer reviewed science on AGP exists
And it's as a completely separate idea from blanchar'ds work and with research and evidence to back it up?
Well then present it!
The trannies keep posting research and evidence for trannies having intersex brains and transition being the most effective treatment which anons keep making excuses to ignore yet I don't see ONE single source for the other side.

>>8476546
>who needs actual science, porn exists and I say it proves my wild claims!
You're shitposting or a moron but either way anyone can see you have no scientific credibility.

>>8476584
>>8476595

Because a trope so common in retail porn that it has its own vertical is not enough evidence


Trap/tranny/shemale are literally in the top ten of porn of all time, what exactly are you trying to say?

>>8476616
I agree with this. I, myself think a third side is the correct option, an unknown cause - and simply use AGP as a label to identify my dysphoria in a way that does not agree with the traditional narrative, while describing the views I have on the topic.

There is [citation needed] on the blanchardposting trolls.

>>8476630
There is actual cases of porn changing people's sexualities, so I could see it possibly causing AGP, or some form of transgender dysphoria. However, there's zero evidence of that, which is why more research is needed, and blanchardposting is mostly drivel.

I've tried nofap for over a year, and am still trying it. However, I still feel the way I do about gender. I await a cure.

>>8476370
>I am a late transition hon. It isn't easy at all.
It's unfortunate that you waited so long. What you should do is put the effort into your appearance and try to look as normal as possible, not like a stereotype. Having started late means you have to work harder, but maybe if you find the right look and have a decent sounding voice it won't be so bad.

>>8476616
I don't know if you are retarded or just slow, but Blanchard is a strong proponent of transition, in fact a pioneer of drastic treatment options for trans* people, so you might want to do some research before posting

>>8476578
>As men playing female characters may be a possible cause to the brain structural changes,
You've got to be kidding me.

>>8476656
It's unfortunate there is not alternate options beside people pushing transition as the be all and end all treatment for Dysphoria, even if one does not feel trans in the slightest.

>>8476613
>there is a lack of evidence towards supporting long-term benefits of transition
There is evidence, you just choose to ignore it.

>>8476616
>And it's as a completely separate idea from blanchar'ds work and with research and evidence to back it up?
>Well then present it!

>gold exists!
>I doubt it!
>it's easy to find, it's gold, everyone knows what it is!
>I don't want to find it!


jlawOK.jpg

>>8476666
I clearly said "possible cause". While quite unlikely, it is still an avenue that should be researched into.

While this is not true for all trans/AGP/dysphoric people, it's very possible that there is many, many types of dysphoria, some being caused by conditioning, others being caused by (possibly even birth defects, but there is a lack of research) and so on.

We simply do not know enough about the brain to rule ANYTHING out at this stage.

>>8476673
[citation needed] One or two studies based on long-term transitioners do not count. There is much evidence supporting transition helping in the short-term, but very little in the long term.

Check your own citations.

>>8476682
The issue is nobody is willing to look at other sides rather than "Everyone who has dysphoria is simply a girl on the inside and needs to take her hormones". There is not any research into alternate treatments, and this is the big, big problem. Since we don't know much about the brain, the current research should be focused on understanding the underlying causes of dysphoria, including different types of dysphoria.

>>8476697
Why do trans people feel dysphoria differently than others? Some feel more interpersonal dysphoria, others feel anatomical dysphoria exclusively, and so on.

There is absolutely nothing explaining this in any of the citations that you have presented.

>>8476697
Whoops, I meant that to >>8476682
Apologies, anon.

>>8476564
>The most effective treatment is NOT transition for some people
Well for people who aren't sufferers from gender dysphoria, of course, but that's a given because they don't need any such treatment. This is a pointless statement.
>I'm well aware there is no research to support a version of AGP as a standalone concept
>I use this as a label to describe how I feel
But can't you see how using a specific medical term to describe a completely different condition that you are claiming the existence of causes issues?
I mean even assuming your claims are true and there's some other condition in some people you're harming your own efforts of advocating for it by misusing the name of a separate already existing medical concept.
>I do not ever claim that my condition is scientific
Well then what are you talking about, religion, spirituality? And why are you talking about it here on /lgbt/?

>The traditional narrative is just as made up as Blanchard's theories are, and the evidence heavily lacks support and is heavily biased by social belief, with no objective, hard evidence proving the absolute cause of dysphoria.
Now you're just saying that everything you disagree with is "made up" and lacks "support" and "hard evidence" and is "socially biased" but your alternative suggestion literally has no support or evidence and is pure opinion and feeling which are the most heavily socially biased factors. The majority of academic support and literal physical objective evidence supports some sort of neurological intersex disorder in people who suffer from gender dysphoria.
You're making less sense as this goes on and I'm honestly starting to suspect that you're suffering from some sort of mental issues separate from this whole topic.

>>8476631
>Trap/tranny/shemale are literally in the top ten of porn of all time, what exactly are you trying to say?
And what does that prove? What exactly are you trying to claim with the existence of porn as evidence?

You know there are intersex birds that look half-and-half in coloration(sexual appearance) and they're more sexually popular among both sexes than normal birds even though they're actually infertile.

>>8476636
>I, myself think a third side is the correct option, an unknown cause
Why do you think this?
Is it based on any evidence or do you simply want it to be the case?
Furthermore what's the point of such claims if you can't point towards any sort of possible treatment or even avenue of research to look for evidence?

Even beyond that why use the term agp?
Why not create a new name for the new condition you're claiming exists so it can stand on it's own and avoid confusion for the condition that had the name first?

>>8476650
>There is actual cases of porn changing people's sexualities
And you have sources for this? you know
>citation needed
and all that?

Do you have neurological evidence showing brain patterns associated with sexuality changing?
Do you have ANY evidence?

Without absolutely any evidence why is it unreasonable to wonder if they're just trying to escape responsibility for their sexuality because they don't fully accept themselves?

>>8476751
>>>8476631 (You)
>>Trap/tranny/shemale are literally in the top ten of porn of all time, what exactly are you trying to say?
>And what does that prove? What exactly are you trying to claim with the existence of porn as evidence?

is this a joke?

porn is the ultimate humand demand, it is the arbirter of all things sexual, it is the 34th rule of the internet, are you stupid?

if porn of it exists, then the ratio of it to other porn is the measure of how many people want to look at it. This is Assatur's Shakein' It Law

tranny porn is fucking huge. It's universal. It's mainstream, chick with dicks are practically an Oscar category.

point being: NOBODY IS SURPRISED OR OFFENDED we just want to watch dick chicks fuck/get fucked so stop acting like a special snowflake you inconsiderate asshole

>>8476778
The evidence for both sides is severely lacking. Blanchard being from Freudian thought, lacking hard evidence and the traditional narrative/"they are really girls" belief system equally lacking hard evidence.

While there have been many citations towards certain brain markers, they may simply be either a natural brain defect that does not cause dysphoria, or a sign someone has dysphoria, but not the cause of it.

There is no known cause for dysphoria.

In this case, we have many suffering people, using experimental treatments like transition.

It is logical to assume that there is a much better method out there that has not been discovered yet, as we severely lack knowledge of the brain, and neuroscience as a whole is not understood fully.

I can point to many possible treatment methods, including research towards medication that actually fixes the brain's problems, like anti-psychotics, but for trans people, fixing the actual emotions themselves that cause dysphoria, as a possible mixup of neuropeptides, and many other *POSSIBILITIES*.

Obviously, the possibility that the traditional narrative is right is there. But it is very unlikely considering how many other alternatives there are. More research is needed, plain and simple - and going by one narrative when all the others are equally not truly proven is utterly dumb.

The point of such claims is to encourage research towards other, alternative methods, and to provide hope for those in which transition simply is not even a viable treatment, let alone one that is even proven to make people happy long-term.

I want the best for all people, and if transition works for a certain type of person, then that's great - but for others, it simply will never work, even if they are dysphoric and take it at the correct age.

I use the term AGP because I am not one to simply coin a term, I am not a scientist or some form of researcher, I am simply a sufferer of a condition that awaits a cure. AGP describes how I feel.

>>8476663
That's completely irrelevant to that post and not contradicted by anything in it.
>I don't know if you are retarded or just slow
Ironic. Maybe work on your reading comprehension.

>>8476804
>porn is the ultimate human demand

No, survival is the ultimate human demand.
Sexuality is the second-strongest human demand, NOT porn. Porn as a whole is causing an extremely high amount of issues, including people's sexualities changing, people becoming addicted to porn, and so forth.

See the accounts of NoFap, and the active research ongoing in these fields. Unlike a cure for transition, there is active research here.

While nofap has personally not cured my dysphoria, nor would I truly expect it - there is a very high likelihood that a lot of problems are relating to extremely heavy porn use.

Porn is not natural.

>>8476819
Obviously Blanchard wants treatment for AGP/Trans/Dysphoric people. Nobody wants to see people suffer, unless they're from /pol/.

However, Blanchard is simply going off the current narrative just as much as everyone else is.

We need more options, more research, and a true cure.

>>8476835
>a true cure.
if you could take a pill that made your dysphoria disappear would you be content to remain a man?

>>8476845
Absolutely, without a second thought I would swallow that pill.

>>8472548
So you're suggesting that AGPs have some degree of feminization pre HRT? This is messed up because that would mean AGP may be caused by neural feminization.

>>8476856
This person isn't me.

>>8476845
I would, absolutely be content with staying a male if I did not have dysphoria, because I know I am a man.

However this pill would have to be scientifically checked over, many many times, and proven completely safe before I would take it.

>>8476864
These studies are heavily lacking, and are not duplicated enough times to be shown as truly accurate. They are very low quality, and need much, much more research in the long-term transitioner happiness, and the cause of dysphoria.

>>8476865

[citation needed]

The pill already exists. It's called pimozide you hon. Transitioning doesnt need to happen especially when there are so many health risks and theres a 80% successful suicide rate even after HRT.

>>8476818
>as a possible mixup of neuropeptides, and many other *POSSIBILITIES*.
You're totally grasping at straws here. Anything to avoid admitting that we're born trans due to mixups in prenatal hormones, and that HRT and transition is the best treatment for this, especially early transition since that greatly reduces the risk of hondom.

>>8476874
There was only a single study on pimozide, anon. And it was heavily discredited, many many times.

A case size of 1 is barely even a study.

[citation needed] on what you are claiming.

Also, I'm not a hon, or a transitioner of any sort. I will never transition, as I know it would not help me. I am awaiting a true cure, not a bullshit study based on pimozide.

I'm completely aware there is an extremely high suicide rate after HRT, but it's not 80% successful, so I'm pretty sure you're just a troll.

I've literally been arguing with hons about the point of HRT does nothing to help people, and you still make that comment.

Troll elsewhere, please. And quit pretending to be me.

>>8476845
>pill that made your dysphoria disappear
I would not have wanted that pill. I wanted my titty skittles. I had no interest in being a man.

>>8476883
I'm not grasping at straws, anon. I am making a legitimate point that there is a complete and total lack of research for any perspectives apart from "You're a girl, transition."

Transition would not help me, I am absolutely sure of that. Please go troll elsewhere, hon.

Seems it's nothing but me getting trolled and people mimicking and imitating me on this board now.

I'm not transgender, I've said this many times. I self-label as AGP because while Blanchard's theory is utter drivel, equally is the traditional narrative and the "transgender=intersex" theory.

>>8476898
I'm aware most of you would not take a pill if offered a cure. However, this makes sense considering there is most likely many root causes of dysphoria, not just being transgender.

While some people may feel transgender, and feel the need to take HRT, this may be caused by things other than feminization within the brain, and there is also many people who feel differently.

If HRT makes you happy, that's great - but there has been no proven benefits on long-term transition, as the studies are heavily lacking on that front. Short term, however is looking fairly optimistic.

Best of luck to you, anon.

>>8476682
>dragons are real, also my dad works at nintendo!
>what, no they're not, show us any evidence at all, also isn't your dad a janitor
>l-lol everyone knows dragons are r-real, haven't you ever read a fairytale? you just wouldn't believe me even if I showed you my pet dragon and my dad just cleans the library for exercise!
Seriously though, if there was actual neurological evidence to support someone changing sexuality at all let alone just from porn it would make headlines internationally and it would take less time for you to post a citation that you're wasting shitposting.

I would LOVE to find such research because it would be very interesting and redefine our neurological understanding but unfortunately, you're just a shitposting liar.

>>8468569
If the lips were thinner she'd look like an average british woman

>>8476891
>There was only a single study on pimozide, anon.
Not to mention that pimozide is an antipsychotic with severe side effects. It's basically a chemical lobotomy. HRT is much safer than pimozide.

>>8476909
I'm not lying to you, anon. But believe whatever you want.

>>8476916
>HRT is much safer than pimozide.
define "safer"
because fewer people commit suicide on pimozide

>>8476916
I disagree with transition as proper treatment for *most* Trans/AGP/Dysphoric individuals unless it is truly required, but I completely agree with you here. The pimozide study is an absolute joke, and far worse than the traditional narrative.

Thankfully, I'm not forced to consider treatment options that simply do not work for me as a person (As I am not trans), and are not proven to have health improvements long-term.

I can advocate and wait for a cure.

>>8476925
Dysphoria, as a whole has an extremely high suicide rate, transition or no transition. It is meaningless whether someone transitions or not as to their long-term suicide rates.

The real problem is there is absolutely no treatment available that actually works, and there is absolutely no evidence pimozide, or any other known drug can decrease suicide rates.
[citation needed]

>>8476697
>There is not any research into alternate treatments
Becuase there is literally no research or evidence even suggesting at the existence of such treatments.
Many people would love for there to be alternative options but they won't magically appear just by wanting them and you're welcome to suggest where we start research to find them.

Until you actually have any evidence for this alternative disorder or treatment or just anything to say about it besides "it's definitely out there because I say so" it's completely useless to anyone suffering from dysphoria and is no argument for ignooring what treatments DO have some evidence supporting them.

>>8476916
Also, antiphyscotics are not "chemical lobotomy". They are commonly used in anxiety cases in low doses, and are proven to have health benefits.

However in individuals suffering from dysphoria in any form, there is absolutely zero evidence that it could help.

>>8476940
I've suggested many times, the answer is to support alternatives in the first place. There is absolutely zero transgender studies apart from the traditional narrative, and blanchard's utter drivel which piggybacks off the traditional narrative quite heavily.

I am simply saying, that transition is not the answer, and that there should be much greater funding, researchers, and attention as a whole on non-transition alternatives.

Unfortunately, due to the traditional narrative (and Blanchard if you count 4chan) taking over the Trans/AGP/Dysphoria community, there is little to no awareness of the possibility of other ways.

There is heavily, heavily lacking research for long-term happiness with transitioners. I am not arguing that people should not transition. I have nothing against transitioners. What I am against is people shoving the notion of I have a female brain, and that transition is the only option.

Transition DOES NOT HELP EVERYONE! There are many, many trans folk that have absolutely no way to have hope, as there is not even a single researcher working on trying to understand the true reasons people are Trans/AGP/Dysphoric.

The real issue is that there is zero awareness. Until we have researchers working on this, there is no hope for us, and the suicide rates will only grow higher.

>>8476804
>a bunch of opinion bullshit including citing rule 34
Are you retarded?

Again what the fuck are you even trying to claim with porn as "evidence"?
>tranny porn is fucking huge. It's universal. It's mainstream
>point being: NOBODY IS SURPRISED OR OFFENDED we just want to watch dick chicks fuck/get fucked
Where did I disagree with any of this? I even gave an example of similar behaviour in birds!
>so stop acting like a special snowflake you inconsiderate asshole
WTF are you even talking about? Are you confusing me with some other anon?

The initial claim was that you don't to cite evidence for your claim that "blanchard was right" though from how you described it you don't even seem to even understand what blanchard said on the topic. Blanchard advocated for some men taking estrogen as part of hrt as a treatment for gender dysphoria.

>>8476818
I wholehearted agree that there needs to be a LOT more research but that doesn't invalidate what HAS been found especially things as clear-cut as neurological differences prior to transition which contradicts many claims of social causes.

>In this case, we have many suffering people, using experimental treatments like transition
Yes there are people suffering which is precisely why they need the most effective known treatment now rather than waiting until some magical perfect cure that may not exist appears out of nowhere.
You call transition an "experimental treatment" yet it has been used and refined for decades and decades and stood the test of time to prove itself the most effective known treatment and any alternative that you're calling for would be incomparably MORE experimental and unproven. I mean literally, any treatment in all of medicine is an "experimental treatment" if you define it by assuming there logically must be a better method.

There is probably a much better treatment for cancer than modern ones but it would be ridiculous to use your "logic" and do nothing for people suffering now until we find some imaginary perfect cure to please everyone.
Can't you see that's what you're doing here? In fact, I'm pretty sure transition is more statistically effective than many cancer treatments.

>>8476818
>I use the term AGP because I am not one to simply coin a term, I am not a scientist or some form of researcher, I am simply a sufferer of a condition that awaits a cure
But you are already "coining a term" by using the word in a completely new way.
>>AGP describes how I feel
No, it describes a specific medical idea and you're trying to redefine it and coin a new meaning.
Simply calling it "my condition" would be infinitely better than trying to steal a name that already describes a separate condition.

Your explanation doesn't make any sense.

>>8476835
>We need more options, more research, and a true cure.
I have absolutely no objections expect when this is used as an excuse to ignore what research and options are actually available for people suffering today.

>>8476818
>I can point to many possible treatment methods
Point to literally any that have as much evidence for their effectiveness as transition, otherwise, why don't your own objections about not enough evidence apply?

>>8476869
>are not duplicated enough times to be shown as truly accurate
No amount of times would be enough for you because you don't want it to be true.

File: 1475694197470.png (98KB, 375x307px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 375x307px

>>8476874
>>8476891
>multiple studies showing neurological differences
>not enough evidence
>a dubious case study of one person with co-morbid conditions that can be confused for gender dysphoria
>undeniable evidence

>>8476917
But you just can't find the evidence?

>>8476963
>the answer is to support alternatives in the first place
You need to be specific. Vague allusions to alternatives is meaningless.
There just haven't been any suggestions of realistic alternatives in any of the data that has been found on the topic and I challenge you to prove me wrong with evidence that points towards literally any alternative.
Medical treatment works according to what the research shows and what's effective.
>There is absolutely zero transgender studies apart from the traditional narrative
Because there's literally no suggestion of where to even start looking for the kind of stuff you're claiming.
The "traditional narrative" is the standard precisely because it is where all the research over the years has pointed and absolutely no viable alternatives have been found.

You're welcome to go out and do research yourself but you actually need to do it and suggesting some vague conspiracy pushing a narrative as an excuse for your lack of evidence is absolute bullshit.

>>8477108
Did I ever say people should not transition? No. I simply ask others to consider that there may be alternatives out there that are unexplored. When everyone is told to transtion and that it's only option and the traditional narrative is the absolute truth, that's outright lying.

Transition does not work for everyone, and what are these people supposed to do. Oh yeah, that's right, transition even when it won't help them.

I'm done arguing with you bitter hons. You will never understand the fact transition is not the best option for Trans/AGP/Dysphoria.

transition transition transition there is no other option is all I hear. And it's outright wrong. Support those that wish to "repress", those that consider other options, and most of all actually accept the possibility that there is an alternative.

You may all have given up, but I haven't.

What you suggest is equivalent to "There is no chance of a cure, you might as well kill yourself now."

This will be my last post on this board. It seems even the depths of 4chan cannot understand.

>>8477235
sure thing girl

>>8477165

the evidence is the millions of hours of tranny pron that are produced and consumed, this is literally a zero sum argument

>>8477235
>This will be my last post on this board.
I guess we'll find you over at Susan's Place when you finally break down!

>>8477235

This is like the 4th time you've said this lmao. See you on Laura's, honnie.

>>8477235
Hey I support you. Just reading /lgbt/ or /asktg/ makes it obvious how miserable some trannies are. The narratives of AGP detransitioners show that transition does not always work.

I believe that more people should be open to repression. If you need surgery to be happy as a tranny its probably not worth it to transition. At least with just hormones you can go back to being a normal dude(or larping as one) if it doesnt work out.

>>8477321
>>8477310
>>8477244
>>8477242

Typical /tttt/ mentality.

>>8477216
>I simply ask others to consider that there may be alternatives out there that are unexplored
Sure, but until there's any indication that a specific alternative is viable it's a moot point.
>When everyone is told to transtion and that it's only option
But it literally is the only option that has any evidence for its effectiveness for gender dysphoria. If there IS some alternative there's no evidence that it's known and being suppressed by the "traditional narrative" like you're implying. Even if someone were to discover new data and put forth an alternative hypothesis all your arguments about being experimental and not supported by enough evidence would apply to it even moreso than the prevailing ideas.
>the traditional narrative is the absolute truth
No one having a serious scientific discussion suggests that the current state of knowledge is the complete end-all-be-all that will ever be known but the "traditional narrative" as you label the prevailing ideas is so because it is the sum of the ideas best supported by the available evidence rather than because of some agenda suppressing alternatives like you suggest.
>Transition does not work for everyone
But it's literally the most effective, best-supported treatment known. Cancer treatments do not work for everyone but they're better than doing nothing.
It's not like they're not continuing to do research but fewer resources are devoted to a small population and they're using them to follow the most promising routes of research. You're basically complaining that they haven't found exactly what you want but that's not how it works. If anything the best chance of discovering some new information that leads to a new type of treatment like you want is them learning as much as they can about the related neurology. Even if you assume it ISN'T the cause specifically it's still the only actual detectable physical difference
that we've found in people with dysphoria so obviously that's where research is focused.

>>8477235
>there is no other option is all I hear
>consider other options
>actually accept the possibility that there is an alternative
Suggest one then!
You keep blaming everyone else for not talking about alternatives but you can't point to any single one yourself.
>What you suggest is equivalent to "There is no chance of a cure, you might as well kill yourself now."
No, everyone is literally just suggesting that people with gender dysphoria should try the best and only known treatment for gender dysphoria.

Go ahead and suggest an actual alternative, even just an avenue of research to pursue to find these alternatives you insist on.
Anything else is admitting that there's no option but to continue general research like they're doing anyway and using the best available treatment until better alternatives are found.

>>8477244
Porn is not evidence that anyone changed sexual orientations, your entire premise is faulty.
You need to actually prove that someone is one orientation and then changes into another and for it to have any actual value it needs to be documented with supporting evidence.

>>8477519
herpa derpa doooooooo

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>>8477538

>>8476564
>There is many "low evidence" brain studies
You fucking idiot. The "low evidence" links were not brain study links. For once in your life, read.

>>8476564
Also
>but they heavily lack in pre-transition studies
They fucking aren't. Many of them focus on pre-HRT differences you absolute fucking dimwit READ

>proper proof it is simply not a natural brain variation
We've studied the differences between the sexes for decades. Thousands of cis people have been studied. Such "natural variations" as having gender-intermediate brains were not spotted in them.

>The traditional narrative is just as made up as Blanchard's theories are, and the evidence heavily lacks support and is heavily biased by social belief
How would you fucking know if you've never read it you ADHD-addled idiot?

If this is an elaborate trolling attempt then congrats you got me. 10/10 would rage again.

>>8476864
That's the case regardless of orientation, though androphiles are more feminized than gynephiles.

>>8477674
Which really just follows with the differences between straight and gay people.

>>8477695
Yup.

>>8477672
>>8477658
The anon you're raging at said that he wasn't going to post anymore on this board because of people like you. You simply do not understand the AGP struggle.

So are we just ignoring this shit
>I do not ever claim that my condition is scientific
?

It's not clear that this person is even talking about science and empirical evidence.
Honestly, it seems like they're suffering from some issue like severe autism or some sort of delusions.

>>8477706
You already drove him off this board, by bashing him. You should feel good about yourself.

I was enjoying his conversation and alternate viewpoints.

>>8477703
>>8477709
You're him, aren't you?

>>8477703
>implying I haven't been waging holy war against the neoblanchardian menace for actual years
AGP doesn't give you ADHD

>>8477710
No, I'm not him. I just like reading different views. I'm an AGP blanchardist, myself.

>>8477711
Like he said, you're just a bunch of trolls tbqh.

I'm gonna go check out other threads, I'm from /repgen/ and feel for this guy.

>>8477703
>you just don't understand!
No, most of you people saying this shit clearly don't understand what you're talking about and ignore all contradicting evidence and your own lack of evidence with vague suggestions of some mainstream narrative conspiracy supposedly suppressing the truth.
No one is suppressing the evidence that would support you, it just doesn't exist.

>>8477706
Honestly I think they're just jumping through every mental hoop possible in order to avoid admitting they mite b trans

>>8477719
He's not trans. He clearly said that he knows that he is not trans. He's AGP, and he wants to do something about it. I wish him luck.

>>8477712
Blanchard's theories suggest that agps should be treated with transition just as much as hsts. the different groups were about the supposed causes, not the recommended treatment.

>>8477716
>Someone asks for citations
>Offer them citations
>Call them out on not reading the citations they asked for
>Ask them to cite their sources
>They don't
>your trolls desu ne

>>8477721
Blanchard said that agp are trans.
There is no theory of agp separate from blanchard's work.
Therefore you either have no idea what you're talking about or are purposefully trying to mislead people.

>>8477727
this citation meme is honestly retarded.

>>8477725
>>8477729

I'm well aware. I'm for transitioning myself, but choose not to due to repressing. Call me an egg, hon exc but it's my choice.

But I appreciate his views on alternatives, including the possibility of a cure regardless.

>>8477729
Not them.
Disclaimer: Fuck Blanchard. I think he's wrong but I know a great deal about him because I've read most of his shit to argue with people.

Blanchard said AGP *can lead* to the development of a cross-sex identity, which leads to dysphoria. This is distinct from AGP innately making one trans. Someone can be AGP without being trans, which is why he supports transitioning in severe cases in adults but supports "curing" children and teens via conversion therapy (though he won't call it that).

>>8477743
If conversion therapy worked, I would honestly sign up without a second thought. But that's because I'm a blanchardist.

>>8477737
If you're so aware then why do you keep saying false bullshit like that agps aren't trans?
Frankly, it seems like you're lying to cover your shitposting.

>>8477733
Honestly most of the time it's just a bullshit tactic based on the idea that people can't back up what they know with citations off the cuff, but sometimes it's a good way to show that people ARE just making shit up and pretending that science is on their side.

>>8477751
Science is on Blanchard's side.
blanchard's got $WAG, check out the AGP deniers thread.

>>8477753
The AGP denier thread is full of people showing Blanchard is wrong lol. It's honestly funny.

>>8477753
>check out the AGP deniers thread
Ok...
>So what if I like dick? That doesn't make me gay
Wew, some quality $cience $wag you have there!

>>8468530
You could start by removing /mtfg/ from the board. They'll probably migrate to other threads so you could ban all trans topics. There are only a handful non hon trannies here anyway.

>>8477428
sure thing girl

>>8477737
>I'm for transitioning myself, but choose not to due to repressing
How long can you keep this up? Becoming a 40, 50, 60+ year old transitioner isn't doing yourself or anyone else any favors.

>>8477812
>implying this isn't the tranny board
If anything the others would be banned since they don't post enough to sustain their own board.

>>8477924
He is not a girl. He is a proud non-transitioner.

>>8478223
Forever, as I'm not transgender and neither is cureanon. There are many of us out there.

>>8482831
ok girl

>>8482847
Bitter hons trolling as usual. Don't worry, we'll never transition.