Have you ever seen transphobia from a trans person?

>>7918207
that is not transphobia friend

>>7918207
More than from cis people but your image is not an example of it.

>>7918214
>>7918221
How are bathroom bills NOT transphobia?

>>7918239
A trans person might feel more comfortable in the public bathroom of the opposite sex, but the other people in that public bathroom will be made uncomfortable by the trans person.

Whose discomfort is more important? The majority, of course.

>>7918239
do you know who danielle muscato is?

>>7918239
non-passers/hons don't belong in any bathroom.

You must remember that being trans is not a free out of jail card, where people can be as disgusting as they want and society lets them get away with it. This also applies for every other person that is just disgusting to look at. People these days in modern libertarianism are acting like everything that triggers them somehow shouldn't be allowed, but they never consider what other people think. Also being gross is not being progressive. It is being a nuisance for society. And if you don't like societies rules go live in the woods, retard.

>>7918248
Do you know what her legal gender is?

>>7918251
Somehow I don't think you believed that when society was even more transphobic and your choice was be a man or go live in the woods.

>>7918242
the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few seems to be diametrically opposed to the goals of self proclaimed social justice advocates

>>7918251
You can be a non-passer living in the city, just don't expect people to actually care about you. Because you are an outcast and should realise that once in a while.

>>7918251
Hons have the right to go out in public without the risk of pissing themselves or whatever. Just like other fat or ugly people, I don't want to look at them, but we don't ban people from society based on that.

To pre-empt the "dangerous men in bathrooms" argument: if anybody sees Danielle Muscato going into the ladies' room, they'll be watching him like a hawk. If nobody sees him, he could sneak in no matter what the bathroom rules are.

>>7918257
Byrnt

Hey, um, guys, just a quick reminder:

The biggest issues come with changing rooms, not bathrooms.

>>7918263
No one is talking about banning trans people from society. All we're saying is not to allow non-passing trans people entering the bathroom of the opposite sex and making everyone else uncomfortable, just for the sake of the trans person's comfort. The needs of the many outweight the needs of the few, or the one.

>>7918263
>misgenders
>doesn't deadname
Transphobic people are so arbitrary in their transphobia.

>>7918272
>transphobia
>about that person
>that person is trans
try again tumblr

>>7918274
What makes your definition of trutrans any less arbitrary than any other transphobe's?

>>7918278
not even trutrans
you can't just say you're trans and then boom, you are. You also can't claim to have cancer and suddenly you do. Trans is a mental condition and most of todays trannies do not fit the criteria. This person doesn't.

>>7918269
>All we're saying is not to allow non-passing trans people entering the bathroom of the opposite sex
Actually >>7918242 pointed out that other people's comfort means no trans people, whether or not they pass.

>>7918287
Both posts were me. I guess my first post was poorly worded. The hypothetical trans person in the first post does not represent all trans people and I meant for it to be clear they do not pass (hence everyone else getting uncomfortable)

If a trans person passes, no one notices them and it is a non issue. The problem is non-passers making all the other people in the public bathroom uncomfortable and feeling entitled to doing so.

>>7918283
You're not calling trutrans, you're just saying if they don't have a certain mental condition they aren't trans? That's exactly what trutrans is.

>you can't just say you're trans and then boom, you are.
That's the TERF position. You just switched woman for trans.

>>7918272
> Taking me up to task on respecting somebody's pronouns when I clearly disrespect their entire gender identification
To be fair I didn't look that hard beyond "IDs as trans, presents totally as a cis man"

>>7918278
Everyone draws a line somewhere. Unless you're fine with stuff like "trans-age", "transracial," or "transspecies", the right to self-identification is not absolute.

>>7918269
The person earlier said hons shouldn't use any bathroom. IMO they should use the bathroom that is less uncomfortable for everyone involved, whichever one that is

>>7918298
that is literally how every sane person defnies trans. Having that medical condition. What else is trans then? A fkn lifestyle, a favourite color? Fkn people discrediting real trans people makes me sick. The good thing is you guys won't achieve anything in life and your petty SJW movement promises no fruit. Things are gonna stay how they are and that is good that way.

>>7918297
So ugly or disfigured people don't get to use any bathrooms even if they are cis?

>>7918307
False equivalence. Being visibly gross-looking in a public bathroom is not the same as visibly being the wrong sex in a public bathroom.

>>7918301
>that is literally how every sane person defnies trans.
You just said "most of todays trannies do not fit the criteria" so obviously that's not true.

>The good thing is you guys won't achieve anything in life and your petty SJW movement promises no fruit.
I feel like I'm fucking talking to /pol/ and asking for basic respect for trans people.

>>7918307
I meant people that actually go out of their way to be as annoying to bare as possible. Like pride goers wearing a dick suit. I wouldn't want those people in my restroom, no matter how "progressive" shoving dicks in peoples faces is. And not to say
>think of the children

>>7918299
>To be fair I didn't look that hard beyond "IDs as trans, presents totally as a cis man"
Since when is calling yourself "Danielle" presenting as a cis man?

>Everyone draws a line somewhere.
So arbitrary transphobia >>7918272

>>7918313
They are self-acclaimed trannies. They are like femboys right? Now they're like thinking they are trendy and cool, but in a few years regret will sink in. It's like being emo was back in the day. Or how smoking cigs as a child was in once. This fad will end. Don't worry. Trans meme is only big now, but in a few years from now when it's not cool to be trans anymore you guys won't be a nuisance anymore.

>>7918311
Can you explain the difference?

Even so of course a cis woman who appears trans won't be allowed in under your rules.

>>7918321
You have real issues with your transphobia that need to be worked through, not projected onto others.

>>7918328
transphobia implies I'm afraid of trans people friend.
Keep throwing around buzzwords. On the internet it works really well, but like I said, in actual reality it doesn't get you anywhere

>>7918333
>redefining trans so that you aren't transphobic
For real?

>>7918325
>Can you explain the difference?
One condition is relevant to the rules of sex-segregated restrooms and one is not... are you being deliberately obtuse?

>a cis woman who appears trans won't be allowed in under your rules
No, not at all. Like I said being ugly is not the same as being the wrong sex in a public bathroom. No matter how mannish the cis woman looks, she is going where is supposed to go according to the rules of sex-segregated restrooms, she is not bending the rules to accomodate herself. It is not the same as a nonpassing trans woman feeling entitled to break the rules make the cis women uncomfortable.

>>7918343
>redifining trans
that is what you are trying. Good thing doctors are not dumb enough to buy this shit.
But I guess this is not my issue, since I don't live in NA, where you guys gained disgusting traction, but Trump is gonna beat it out of you eventually

>>7918344
>the rules apply where I want them to and nowhere else because those are the rules
Circular logic.

>trans women have to look cis but cis women don't
So it's nothing to do with comfort at all and just another case of arbitrary transphobia.

>>7918351
What do you say to the people who accuse you of redefining gender but good thing they aren't dumb enough to fall for your shit?

Your position is very hypocritical.

>>7918360
I say they have every right to make that claim, since I'm not a SJW asshole that think everybody is supposed to think like me or accept me, because reality is not my personal hugbox
also you are the one redefining gender, not me. I am gendernormative

>>7918356
It's really not circular logic. The rules never had anything to do with people being ugly, only whether they are male or female. Physical beauty never had anything to do with it. I didn't invent the rules.

>>7918356
If you expect to be an exception to the rule, you should be able to pass unnoticed.

>>7918371
>The rules never had anything to do with people being ugly, only whether they are male or female.
Your entire argument has been about passing/making people uncomfortable, but now you're back at your original "just a typo" position of allowing only cis people.

>>7918378
Just because you've repeatedly put words iny mouth and misconstrued the substance of my argument doesn't mean anything you infer from my words is what I actually imply.

Ugly cis women in the lady's room are not breaking the rules of segregated public restrooms. Trans women in the lady's room are, but it doesn't matter if they pass, because no one knows it.

The rules exist to prevent people from being made uncomfortable. Non-passing trans women believing they have a right to break the rules for their own comfort have an inflated sense of self importance. Their comfy is not more important than everyone else's.

No matter how ugly or disfigured you are, other people being made uncomfortable by your appearance is not your responsibility if you are following the rules.

Transphobia?
No.
Honphobia?
All the time.

>>7918207
Yep, I bullied trannies when I was closeted out of pure jealously.

>ITT: americans discussing stupid american problems
just abolish gendered bathrooms, how hard can it be

>>7920213
It's weird how trans people like the ones ITT are often the ones defending them.

>>7918207
Yes, the ones who voted for Trump.

>>7920187
/mtfg/ in a nutshell

>>7920245
>voting for Donald "gay marriage should stay" "trans women get to use female bathrooms" Trump is transphobic
>voting for Hillary "funded by people who stone trannies" Clinton isn't

>>7920396
The government is not the president though, and Clinton, being funded and supported by liberals, would have been better for you than Trump, funded and supported by ""cconservatives""".

>>7920396
Didn't Trump retracted that bathroom statement?

>>7920427
How exactly are the 'liberals' better for me than the GOP?

If your answer includes the phrase 'LGBT rights', that's a cop out.

HI

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oh wait i forgot to post the photo
fuck

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>>7918253
>HER
>HER
>HER
Kek, I wonder if he's only claiming to be trans because he's too lazy to cut his gross fucking nails.

>>792007
since when are trans people homophobic?

Bathroom laws are great because only passable trans and cis people can use the bathroom.

Seriously fuck hons and butch lesbians.

>>7918207
Holy shit have you searched who this "Danielle Muscato" person is? I, too, would not want "her" in the women's bathrooms.

I'm also a trans girl and have pretty left-leaning opinions, but at some point the politically correct goes way too far. A full grown bearded bald man cannot just declare himself "a woman" just like that.

>>7923155
What makes someone trutrans in your opinion?

>>7918272
A person cannot change their gender. A person can change their name.

>>7926982
TruTrans is just a shitty 4chan meme. There is no clear cut definition of transgender.

The thing is there is at least a certain minimum of things to do to be "considered transgender", but this person is not even close to that. I can't even be sure that this isn't a shitty hoax. You literally have a bald man with a beard, without even somewhat feminine or androgynous clothes, claiming he is a "woman".

>>7918207
>>7921001
OP, it's not transphobia if the person they're talking about isn't trans.

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>>7922821
>only passable trans and cis people can use the bathroom.
>Seriously fuck hons and butch lesbians.

yeah, make 'em shit in the woods!
that'll teach 'em!

>>7927073
You knew what I meant. In your opinion what does someone have to do to be "considered transgender" as you put it?

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Im made uncomfortable by people of the SAME sex in the bathroom with me. Why dont we just upgrade to single stall unisex bathrooms and put an end to it?

>>7927102
This. It's downright bizarre how many trans people defend segregation, like in this thread, even though it harms them so much.

>>7927102
Why don't all you disgusting public-shitters do the deed before you leave home, like a normal person?

>>7918207
Have you seen hon threads?

>>7927182
people do take pisses as well you know

>>7927102
>Im made uncomfortable by people of the SAME sex in the bathroom with me
Too bad for you, because for 99.99% of the population, it's the opposite.

>Why dont we just upgrade to single stall unisex bathrooms and put an end to it?
It's not like these haven't been invented... some places have em, some dont. Theyre expensive.

>>7927096
Like I said, there is no clear cut, every individual is different, transgender or not. Also I don't care about defining who is transgender or not. It's just that in that special case, it's very obvious. Actually I think he is either trolling or completely insane mentally. Maybe both.

>>7918207
Have you ever seen heterophobia from a hetero person?

>>7927073
>I can't even be sure that this isn't a shitty hoax
fucking this
it has to be some false flag shit

>>7927270
You said there is a "certain minimum". But you can't express what that is either, right?

>I don't care about defining who is transgender or not. It's just that in that special case
You can't "not care except". That's caring.

>Actually I think he is either trolling or completely insane mentally. Maybe both.
You realize the irony in saying that about her when precisely the same was said about us by almost all of society not very long ago, and is still said about us today by very many people?

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>>7927255
My point was anyone is made uncomfortable by other people being around them when they're trying too poop or pee, you dense stupid fuck.

>>7927307
She works for a leftist sjw charity...

>>7927314
Well that's just not true, you warty bloodbelching cunt. Most people are comfortable doing their business in the public restroom assigned to their sex. We can't all be princesses.

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>>7927558
Then get over the ugly nonpasser in the stall over, princess. She's just trying to pee.

Also
>You warty bloodbelching cunt
I wish.

>>7927581
>get over the ugly nonpasser in the stall over
I'm sorry, but it has to be the other way around. The majority do not give up their comfort to accomodate the tiny minority's comfort. The needs of the many outweight the needs of the few, or the one.

>I wish.
I thought you'd like that.

Yea man it was pretty gay though

>>7927310
The fuck is your problem? Do you have nothing to do apart trolling anons on the internet?

Here are the minimum things I consider should be done for transition:
-Getting rid of your beard
-Letting you hair grow
-Dressing appropriately for your age and situation
-Working on voice
-Hormones

So not only this person has a full beard and won't get rid of it, he is still trimming it. Also he has a bald head and dresses in traditional male business clothes. Literally the only thing he did was "self-declaring" himself transgender and changing his name. That's why I think he is a troll.

>>7918207
My ex.

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>>7927628
The Majority are uncomfortable having to poop next to strangers, we've been over this, your opinions are not the basis for legality. People have a right to use the bathroom, they dont have a right to be comfortable there.

If they did, dirty bathrooms would be illegal.

>>7918207
>Have you ever seen homophobia from a homosexual person?

Yes, many sexual minorities suffer from internalized self-hate.
It can be overcome.

>>7927672
The bathrooms are segregated by sex for the comfort of those using them. As I said before the majority are quite alright doing their business in their sex's assigned restroom knowing only the same sex is present. It makes everyone feel uncomfortable or even threatened when the opposite sex enters, even if they are trans. It's fine if you pass, no one notices and thus no one cares. But if the tranny doesn't pass then they are making everyone else uncomfortable. Instead the tranny should be in the restroom they are uncomfortable using, as trannies are so few it is only logical for the short straw to be theirs when one side must be made to feel uncomfortable.

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>>7927723
Except you're wrong, most people would always choose to poop alone and only deal with it in public cause they have too and are accustomed to it. Trannies are so few you should get over it because a nonpasser making your uncomfortable doesn't give you a right to kick them out of the bathroom.

Heres another scenario that I always wonder about with gender bathroom law, mothers bringing their small male children into the bathroom with them, do you want them to make toddlers use the mens room alone?

Also what about at music festivals and concerts where the ladies room always has an hourlong line, should girls be banned from the mens room?

We have gendered bathrooms to label that, "This one had urinals." or "This one doesn't have urinals" That's it. There is nothing sacred about bathrooms, and we all have unisex bathrooms at home.

>>7927770
>only deal with it in public cause they have too and are accustomed to it
Most people are really truly seriously comfortable with it.

>you should get over it
>making your uncomfortable doesn't give you a right to kick them out of the bathroom
Against, the tiny minority does not get to use the bathroom they are more comfortable with at the expense of the majority's comfort. Trannies will have to get over it and go in the other toilet. It might make them uncomfortable to go in there, but again:

>the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.

>toddlers
dont be ridiculous please, everyone understands that a parents need to look after children is more important than comfort regardless, thats why no one complains (except for assholes) when a child is crying on a bus or something

>what about at music festivals and concerts where the ladies room always has an hourlong line, should girls be banned from the mens room?
Yes of course, or else men would unfairly be forced to wait in an hour long line too

>We have gendered bathrooms to label
No, we have sex segregated bathrooms for the comfort of the people using them.

>There is nothing sacred about bathrooms
It's not about anything sacred, it's just that a nonpassing tranny feeling uncomfortable because they're using the restroom of their natal sex is actually less important than a whole lot of cis people feeling uncomfortable about the nonpasser using the restroom the nonpasser would prefer. It's simply a matter of which makes more people uncomfortable.

>>7918207
/pol/ack lurker here, tbqh I think that it should be done on a more common sense basis as there are definitely legitimate Mtfs whereas I don't want hons in the women's room, although this would be difficult to enforce

>>7927851
>we have sex segregated bathrooms for the comfort of the people using them.
The same reason we used to have race segregation!

>>7920213
>abolish gendered bathrooms
And how would this work, they are all stalls with proper walls and doors rather than dividers, I'm genuinely curious

>>7927871
What a ridiculous comparison

Some sassy old black woman ought to smack you silly, princess

>>7927888
Not an argument

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>>7927897
I don't really need to argue when you're comparing state sanctioned white supremacy to mens and womens public toilets

>>7920213
>forgetting literally every country in the world is mostly gendered bathrooms
>forgetting the countries that have unusually high numbers of unisex ones tend to be progressive hellholes with much bigger problems to worry about than a tranny peeing next to cis girls

>>7927912
>state-sanctioned racism is totally different to state-sanctioned sexism!

>>7927960
No one is going to take you seriously when you compare trannies feeling uncomfy with the mens and womens public toilets to the horrors of apartheid you dumb-dumb...

>>7918356
obvious bait

>>7928265
So you have no genuine reason for considering the two different.

>>7928296
One reduces an entire race of people to second-class citizens and the other makes nonpassing trannies feel uncomfortable in the public bathrooms.

I cant really make it any more clear than that.

I sincerely hope you are being deliberately obtuse.

>>7928311
I think you're a hypocritical sexist.

>>7928392
I think you're just a troll who tries too hard to keep up the masquerade.

Bye.

>>7928436
>I think you're a troll!
>Bye.
I don't have to read the convo, feminist sensed.

>>7928436
I didn't think you had any argument for your sexism.

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>danielle muscato

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsZ9NeWuL5Q

>topkek

Yes, that is really her

>>7928451
Good eye!

>>7927643
>Here are the minimum things I consider should be done for transition:
>Letting you hair grow
Are you retarded? You can't be trans without long hair? Have you never seen a woman with short hair, or even bald?