Prove AGP theory wrong in one post.

>>7772739
Blanchard is Canadian.

>>7772752
he was born, raised, and attended college in the united states and moved to canada in his late twenties, if that changes it any

>>7772739

It hurts my feelings therefore it must be wrong.

I'm mtf trans with a cis girlfriend. The theory that transwomen transition because of a sexual fetish of getting off to being female is ridiculous and stupid.

My cis girlfriend gets turned on by looking at herself in lingerie and makeup and outright says that feeling like a sexy woman is the best feeling in the world. So is she an honorary tranny?

I don't have this feeling at all, I get turned on by being beat up

>>7772739
Innate sense of gender in very young children.

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>>7772760
>if that changes it any

so he's either running from the law or refusing to serve his country.
why would anyone voluntarily live in canada?

>>7772770
>My cis girlfriend gets turned on by looking at herself in lingerie

Most cis women do, but we can't let the trannies know about that....

>>7772770
>>7772781
Is she turned on because she knows guys will like her or because she literally gets off to herself?

>>7772807
The latter, she doesn't even like guys

>>7772810
Describe what she thinks/feels in detail please.

>>7772739

I fantasize about men with faces.

>>7772775
It does feel the whole theory was created to issue transgender will be looked at negatively regardless, women take interest in their body but if a bi or lesbian trans does it oh no some self loving perv and trans thst are into men are just super gays.

Sounds like the typical men are all sexual deviants while women are sinless angels nonsense.

>>7772815
How am I supposed to know? Usually when she gets like that we go right to sex

>>7772891
I thought you might have talked to her about her sexuality.

>>7772900
We have talked about our sexualities, I just never asked her "hey why do you get off to yourself?"

>>7772815
Not her, but I think that a lot of "AGP" is simply the product of same-gender attraction (gynephilia), rather than the cause of said attraction.

For example, I'm not "AGP", but this kind of thing will happen to me very occasionally under specific circumstances, like if I'm looking at nudes of myself without my face showing, or I'm walking in front of the mirror in lingerie to see how I look, and I'm not focusing on my face. Because my brain doesn't recognize it as myself, and I'm attracted to women's bodies.

>>7772908
Fair enough, but without that we can't really talk about whether she's the same AGP as many trans women.

>>7772911
Some "AGP" being like that would explain why certain cis women seem to be AGP.

Why do you have to not see/think about your face to feel that about yourself?

Maybe that's the line between occasional "AGP" in lesbians and AGP as a cause of attraction.

>>7772863
>while women are sinless angels nonsense.
Except the theory applies perfectly to FTMs too, just reverse all the genders.

AAP FTMs are gender-conforming females whose sexuality has flipped and want to become the man they love the same way AGP MTFs want to become the woman they love. HSTS FTMs are extremely masculine and GNC lesbians the same way HSTS MTFs are extremely effeminate and GNC gays.

>>7773250
No, the theory is just as stupid and homophobic when applied to FtMs. Guys who are straight are all super-masculine? Gay ones are all girly? Fuck, I hate you people.

>>7773404
Anti-Blanchardians confirmed for not knowing the thing they are against.

>>7772770
The main question is, do any cis women stare at their ass in panties and enjoy it in a fetishistic mindset, fiddling with their clit until they cum

>>7773500
probably

>>7773500
Maybe, but I don't know of any trans women who do that either, that sounds like legit AGP.

>>7773420
A*P lies on a spectrum. A*P does not cause dysphoria. It results from a multidimensional interplay between the spectrums of neurological sex (almost cis-----dysphoric); crossing with the range of sexual orientation neurology (androphilic-gynephilic) and with the range of sexual-behavioral neurology (feminine-masculine) and the range of hormones.

A cis AGP man will have an almost, but not quite, cis neurological sex. His gynephilia and masculine behavioral characteristics will internally identify his feminized neurology, creating an erotic self-target. This is exacerbated by the presence of testosterone catalyzing magnetic attraction to a female target.

A transbian, on the other hand, might have an mostly female neurological sex [she wishes to keep her dick], strong gynephilia and masculine leaning behavioral neurology, which will target her mostly female neurological sex. However, her estrogenic hormonal profile will keep her from feeling the magnetic attraction, thus blunting or even dissipating her fetishism.

This is further supported by the fact that bisexual trans people tend to have half-AGP; AGP that wasn't nearly as strong as their gay counterparts. That the more naturally feminine a transgirl is, the less her AGP tends to impact her. The extra dimensions of behavioral neurology and simple human oddness can account for the existence of csts transbians and AGP straight mtfs.

>>7773500
The question also should be what if those women were given T from the start of puberty and being feminine was a taboo for them, since AGP tends to go away with transition and all.

>>7773567
It's pretty common for gynephilic MtF's, especially before hormones.

>>7773500
Is that supposed to be a thing trans women regularly do?

>>7773596
Er.. yes? Tranvestic fetishism is common in pre-transition MtFs

>>7773500
Before I started hormones looking at my ass in panties just made me feel ashamed and embarrassed of myself, not fucking aroused. Looks pretty good now but I still don't get off to it

>>7773653
Look I appreciate the anecdotes here but tranvestic fetishism is common in MtFs. There's no need to be triggered.
What's your sexuality?

>>7773583
>the spectrums of neurological sex (almost cis-----dysphoric);
How do we know neurological sex like this exists? It doesn't explain dysphoria over social roles and clothing.

>A cis AGP man will have an almost, but not quite, cis neurological sex. His gynephilia and masculine behavioral characteristics will internally identify his feminized neurology, creating an erotic self-target.
I haven't heard this theory before. How does his gynephilia select himself as its target? What is the feminization in his neurology?

>However, her estrogenic hormonal profile will keep her from feeling the magnetic attraction, thus blunting or even dissipating her fetishism.
Then wouldn't gay men get AAP, not FTMs?

>This is further supported by the fact that bisexual trans people tend to have half-AGP; AGP that wasn't nearly as strong as their gay counterparts.
How do you know this?

>That the more naturally feminine a transgirl is, the less her AGP tends to impact her.
That could also be explained by there being two kinds of trans woman.

>>7773665
>How do we know neurological sex like this exists?
Brain scans and other research.

>I haven't heard this theory before. How does his gynephilia select himself as its target? What is the feminization in his neurology?
It's just an erotic self target. It's a detection of a female object within one's own neurology, possibly extending to tactile sensations.

>Then wouldn't gay men get AAP, not FTMs?
No, because the attraction of the homosexual FtM, to men, is catalyzed by estrogen, thus the erotic self-targeting is also catalyzed by estrogen.

>How do you know this?
Studies and extensive experience.

>That could also be explained by there being two kinds of trans woman.
Which does not explain the massive inconsistencies, the fact that MtF behavior seems to lie on a spectrum between straight-gay, and that there are exceptions to the rule such as AGP straight MtFs and classic TS transbians.

>>7773665
>It doesn't explain dysphoria over social roles and clothing.
Humans are social creatures, why is it surprising that trans people want to belong with the group they identify neurologically?

>>7773420
Except that's quite literally what the person I was replying to SAID, you idiot.

Are you getting something out of the plain English that's different from what other people are? Because if so, maybe you should consider that you guys are not explaining this theory very well.

>>7772775
>why would anyone voluntarily live in canada?
Name. Name!

It's fucking French. He seems to be from a Catholic area. Canada even has special Catholic rights.

Canadian cock chopping has even been done in quebec, until some hon decided to torch the clinic.

>>7772739
AGP theory simply takes old three-type transsexualism theories and hacks them back by deeming feminine-introversion impossible and thus defining all less-absurd transwomen as obligatorily histrionic.

I have agp and I love the mental effects of hrt
would the theory say that I only like it because being more feminine turns me on? because that's just stupid

>>7772739
Prove ETLEs exist in one post.
Spoiler: you can't because there is no such proof, just speculations based on various neuroatypical people being attracted to things that they also wish to become. The reason is unknown. Since you can want to be something without being attracted to it and you can be attracted to something without wanting to be it the relationship between the two is not at all clear.

AGP theory relies entirely on the existence of ETLEs, which are (currently) unfalsifiable. This means we can't accept the theory for now any more than we can accept the theory that unicorns are real but imperceptible by any means. That there is no direct proof that unicorns don't exist does not mean that we have to entertain that they exist until there is proof for their existence. This is the reason the medical community gives for rejecting this hypothesis, a few fringe journals aside.

>>7773685
>Brain scans and other research.
What is the evidence from scans or other research that there is a brain sex?

>It's just an erotic self target. It's a detection of a female object within one's own neurology, possibly extending to tactile sensations.
How does it detect a female object within one's own neurology? What exactly is "a female object" in neurology? What do you mean tactile sensations?

>No, because the attraction of the homosexual FtM, to men, is catalyzed by estrogen, thus the erotic self-targeting is also catalyzed by estrogen.
I don't understand what you mean. If female hormones prevent AGP in transitioning MTFs, why wouldn't they prevent AAP in pre-transition FTMs?

>Studies and extensive experience.
Links or examples of bi MTFs having weaker AGP?

>Which does not explain the massive inconsistencies,
What inconsistencies?

>the fact that MtF behavior seems to lie on a spectrum between straight-gay,
How does that contradict the two kinds of trans woman theory?

>and that there are exceptions to the rule such as AGP straight MtFs and classic TS transbians.
There are exceptions to everything. You said the more feminine a trans woman is "the less her AGP tends to impact her", with "tends" admitting there are exceptions there too.

>>7773703
How does their brain know which group to identify them with?

Social sciences aren't real sciences so they cannot have theories.

>>7774000
>by deeming feminine-introversion impossible
What is feminine introversion?

>>7772775
Why would you want to live in the US, the country that tries its hardest to royally fuck its own people and the rest of the world for a few bucks?

>>7774083
>AGP theory relies entirely on the existence of ETLEs, which are (currently) unfalsifiable. This means we can't accept the theory for now any more than we can accept the theory that unicorns are real but imperceptible by any means.
A theory doesn't have to be falsifiable to be acceptable.

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ok many errors exist inside Blanchard's research metholodgy

Sampling Errors.
>The number of subjects with clinically diagnosed gender dysphoria is not provided, therefore some, or even all, of them are not relevant subjects for study.
>It is not stated if any of the sample had transitioned, were in the process of transitioning or were considering transitioning.
>Gender dysphoria was self diagnosed by the subjects and transsexuality was determined by a single question, thus not following WPATH or DSM diagnostic guidelines.
>Low or sub-threshold self measured gender dysphoria subjects, and self admitted transvestites were included in the full sample for factor determination (30% of the sample).

Technical Statistical Analyses Errors
> No tests for normality were undertaken, given the high Coefficients of Variation (CV) shown (the highest being 523%) non-normality should have been considered and tested for.
>The core statistical test (Newman-Keuls) has a high ‘false positive’ rate, is not valid for varying sized sample data and not valid for non Gaussian data.
>Sample sizes were averaged using the Harmonic Mean (most commonly used in financial analysis), no results or discussion was provided as to why this was chosen in preference to other means or the impact on the Newman-Keuls test results or why another and valid test was not used.

Question Errors.
>The questionnaires followed the Core Question, Sub Question design. While this is appropriate for detailed analysis, it leads to multiple counting and score inflation when used as a measurement scale. If the Core question is answered with a yes, then at least one other Sub question will automatically be answered with a yes as well.
>No measures of intensity (frequency or recency of fantasies or actions) were used.
>The core question (#12) in the Autogynephilic Interpersonal Fantasy Scale is incorrect, with a score being given for non interpersonal fantasy behavior, thus the results would be inflated for this test

>>7774382
>there was an error in the stats
>this proves the theory is wrong

>>7774699
Blanchard’s 1989 paper where he ‘proves’ AGP for heterosexual, asexual and bisexual trans women (relative to birth sex). He did nothing of the kind, in fact his own results disproves his hypothesis.

His analysis used a poor and inappropriate statistical test (infamous for false positives), not designed for varying sample sizes and requires continuous Gaussian data to be valid (data is discrete, non gaussian and bounded).

Sample sizes: homosexual: 117, hetosexual 19, bisexual: 58, asexual 18.
Core Autogynephilia Test
Asexuals and Heterosexuals were significantly the same.
Heterosexuals and bisexuals were significantly the same.
Asexuals and bisexuals were NOT significantly the same, meaning the other relationships barely met statistical validity..

Visual inspection shows Asexuals and Homosexuals had similar Core AGP scores.

Autogynephilia Interpersonal Test
Homosexuals, asexuals and heterosexuals were significantly the same with all having low scores.

He assumes that AGP causes asexuality and bisexuality in trans women, with no proof.
He stated that bisexuals are not really aroused by men at all.
He stated that asexuals are such because AGP ‘crowds out’ their sexual desires…again no proof.

So there you have it, Blanchard’s own results do NOT show (in fact disprove) the hypothesis that ‘homosexuals transsexuals’ (HT) do NOT have AGP, and ALL hetero/asexual/bisexuals (H/A/B) do and are all the same.

>>7774729
>He stated that bisexuals are not really aroused by men at all.

They're not.
They're aroused by cocks, in the case of bisexual men and pussies in the case of bisexual women.

>>7774745
care to show your research and reasoning for that?

i've heard plenty of bisexual men talk about enjoying men for other reasons than their cock (muscles/similar interests/body hair).

>>7774754
>your research and reasoning for that?

Blanchard's 1989 paper clearly shows this.

>>7774382
Jesus, that's bad. I don't understand all of this, but the sampling errors alone look terrible to me.

>>7774699
No, it proves that the results of the study are unreliable.

Imagine you have multiple bowls of water and you want to measure their temperature. You take a thermometer and measure each one. Sounds good?

Now imagine the thermometer is stuck at 14C. Your methodology is terrible, and now your experiment doesn't tell you anything about the temperature of the water.

This doesn't mean the water in the bowls ISN'T 14C. It could be. You haven't disproven that.

But it could be 4C, or 22C, or whatever. You don't know, because you measured it badly.

>>7774790
In this analogy are the thermometers penises?
I hope they are penises!

>>7774382
If less flawed research was done, what do you think it would show?

>>7773583
Interesting theory, i'm a not sure if i'm a cis AGP man or a non transitioned transbian. I would of been very open to being a transbian as a young teenager, but I grew up in the 90s where teenage AGP transition was unheard of and AGP boys were forced into the closet.

>>7775510
>but I grew up in the 90s where teenage AGP transition was unheard of and AGP boys were forced into the closet.
;_;

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>>7772739
Every thing having to do with AGP is really just for sexual pleasure and kink turn ons because its taboo for males to experience anything of the opposite gender.

>>7775850
why does that make it for sexual pleasure?

>because its taboo for males to experience anything of the opposite gender.
this is really sad.

>>7774372
>A theory doesn't have to be falsifiable to be acceptable.
No. The scientific method demands that you prove your hypothesis by testing it. A theory that can't be falsified i.e. tested and shown to be false (or conversely shown to be true) is not scientific.

Consider a claim like "transsexuals have souls of the other gender". We don't even consider it because there is no way to disprove it or prove it.

>>7776780
Your fallacy is believing the only facts are science.

>>7772739
Seriously? No-one can disprove AGP theory?

>>7773583
>This is further supported by the fact that bisexual trans people tend to have half-AGP; AGP that wasn't nearly as strong as their gay counterparts.
How do I tell how strong my AGP is? I never get off to anything else but I'm bi.

>>7786602
Strong with the boy, AGP is
Undergo transition he will not

>>7791399
or she will, whatever, I'm not the AGP council for transition