How much pueraria mirifica pills can I pop? like what is the

>>7234485
I wouldn't bother if I were you.
There are a lot of market analysis studies that have found a lot of companies selling pueraria mirifica aren't even sticking PM in those pills, it's just random shit or fillers.
But you can take quite a bit. If you look at the chemical analysis the amount of active chemicals in PM is ridiculously small. For all the buzz over "miroestrol" in them it actually only contains a measly 0.002% and it's about total 10% isoflavones.

If you're clever enough you can buy isoflavones and other phytoestrogens in bulk amounts for ridiculously cheap prices though.

You need a lot to get to the point where researchers consider it the "no-go" zone for human studies where phytoestrogens start actually messing around with your endocrine system in severe ways. At around 400mg/day of isoflavones in one case study it raised SHBG to the point of inhibiting free testosterone by about 90%.

>>7234485
most trans individuals that take PM, take between 1000-2000mg/day

>>7234485
as much as you want, because it doesn't do anything

If you're willing to radically alter your hormone levels without doctor's assistance, at least do it with actual tested and approved meds.

>>7236027
What's the point of living if you're not willing to eat strange chemicals off the Internet.
Besides the toxicity of phytoestrogens is pretty low. In infant studies babies had like 50mg/kg of phytoestrogen. Sure it fucked up their sexual development but they didn't die.

>>7236777

I need to see proof this study actually happened. I can't believe that an IRB would approve that.

>>7236912
It's not a study that fed them phytoestrogens, it's what happens when parents feed their babies soy infant foods. It often leads to shorter ano-genital distance, undescended testes, and lack of sexual differentiation.
I've only seen case studies of high phytoestrogen amounts, no actual experimental studies. For adults I've heard of two. One 19-year old had an all-soy diet, so like 3000cal a day of tofu if you can imagine yourself doing that lol. His SHBG shot through the roof and his free testosterone was nearly 0 by the end of the year. He was eating about 360mg/day of isoflavones. He had ED, gyno, and lactation.
Another was an older man that was in a similar situation and often drank 4 to 8L a day of soy milk. He had atrophied testicles, gyno, lactation, and ED.

These days it's pretty readily available to consumers to find isoflavone extractions in purified and standardized amounts so these case studies might seem unlikely to occur again but you can go to the drug store and buy a bottle of 60mg isoflavones/pill for like $30 a bottle of 60. It's also only regulated as a natural herbal product so it's possible for consumers to buy it in bulk assuming you do the correct customs forms.

For all the studies sponsored by the soy industry saying phytoestrogens don't do anything they're pretty apprehensive to do anything above about 90-100mg/day and say it's inhumane. Which is funny considering they push so hard saying soy, clover, and phytoestrogens are harmless except then suddenly say it's inhumane to test it out lol

>>7236777
>What's the point of living if you're not willing to eat strange chemicals off the Internet.
You can get actual HRT meds off the Internet too.

>>7237431
Yeah but there's no 'unknown territory' sense to it. Plus then you're just a bitch to the pharmaceutical industry.
At least with phytoestrogens they're not actively trying to force people to consume them for profit, with the exception of the soy industry I guess. But it's harder to cover up negative studies on uncontrolled OTC substances, especially something as simple as a plant. The soy manufacturers already try to do that and for every study saying phytoestrogens do nothing sponsored by soy manufacturer's there's 2 more disproving it.
In a sense it's safer since you know what the health effects are whereas with pharmaceuticals negative side effects are often covered up for 20-30 years like what happened with finasteride. When you own the patents and distribution rights it's pretty easy to decide who researches your drugs.

Not saying I actually recommend doing this. But it's for science lol

I took Ainterol brand, the R1 capsule. Im pretty sure i took 4000mg in morning and 4000mg at night. I grew boobies took like 9 months.

File: Screenshot_20161117-191117.png (337KB, 1440x2560px) Image search: [Google]

337KB, 1440x2560px

>all these retards saying it doesn't do anything
I've been on the Ainterol R1 formula on 500mg daily for about one and a half months, and I'm at tanner stage 3. No anti androgen.

I'm probably half your size however so you could try double my dose. I've heard that 2g daily is a good guideline to follow and that some trannies take up to 4g daily but I wouldn't recommend it.

Try to buy it off their website instead of Amazon as its cheaper there.

>>7242456
kill urself my man

>>7242467
Stay mad soylent shill

File: Natural-Thailand-Pueraria-Mirifica-Bust-Breast-Enlargement-Capsules-100-Grains-Must-Up-Breast-Augmentation-.jpg (163KB, 800x800px) Image search: [Google]

163KB, 800x800px

>>7241906
>Ainterol brand
how about those cheap chinese brands?
is there something i should look for in the ingredients, to verify if their version of PM will be as effective as ainterol?

>>7242687
You're putting that into your mouth you giant faggot, why risk it when us other anons have vouched for Ainterol?

>>7243107
i know but ainterol is trying to jew me out of extra 50% for shipping costs. It's expensive as it is.

>>7243225
>jew me out of extra 50%
Try buying it off their website if you aren't.

If you want it cheaper, buy the powder off Etsy and put them into capsules yourself. I can't guarantee their effectiveness however.

>>7243340
i am buying from their website
and it keeps going up with every bottle so it's not like you can pay a fixed shipping cost for several of them

>>7243367
Buy the powder off Etsy instead if you're really concerned about the cost....

>>7243340
I don't know if any manufacture does it yet for PM but for buying other phytoestrogens like from kudzu or soy when you order a standardized Powder ask the seller for a COA (certificate of analysis)
All bulk powders for supplements, herbs, etc have a COA. If the seller doesn't have it they're selling fake products. They'd need the COA to import it to begin with.

>>7243499
They do for PM last I heard.

>>7243591
I dunno I've never seen any PM sold as standardized extracts. I've looked for miroestrol standardized powders and I've never seen any.
It's pretty easy to find isoflavone powders though. I bought 880g of pure isoflavones for about $200 CAD lol

File: estrogen_seed.jpg (37KB, 400x350px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 400x350px

Would taking a handful of flaxseed be equal to a few pills of PM?

>>7247122
polyunsaturated fats help reduce your DHT level but on their own they won't feminize you. Just not potent enough.
I take an omega-3,6,9 supplement that has some flaxseed in it. Has really improved my facial skin and helped with wrinkles.

>>7234555
Do you know if there is there a difference between soy isoflavones and SI 'extract'? ty

>>7247249
Not sure what you mean by SI extract.
If it's a standardized extract it should tell you the amount that they standardized it to.

>>7247278
I mean "soy isoflavones extract"

Like if the bottle says 1 serving contains 400 mg of "soy isoflavones extract" and not just "soy isoflavones", would the potency be different?

>>7247292
Usually only a percentage is isoflavones, around 20-40% is what most are standardized to.
But if they don't give you the actual number they may have just done an ethanol extraction or something like that and never analyzed it. So you might get a lot, you might get nothing.
Even if you look at bulk powders from wholesalers the highest extraction I've seen is 80%, but 10-40% is most common.
You can also look for red clover, but it contains coumestrol, which is a phytoestrogen, but its toxicity is relatively unknown. It's pretty easy to find red clover powder in bulk though, usually it's like $10-$15/lb.

For example, NOW foods has a soy isoflavone supplement that's 150mg standardized to min 40% isoflavones. It's kind of expensive though, but they all kind of are. But that's kind of why most people say trying to feminize with herbs is somewhat ridiculous. Not cause it's not necessarily possible, but the costs can quickly become astronomical.

>>7247356
Sorry but if you're still there, what is the max dose of red clover?

Or really, what is the best phytoestrogen or isoflavones supplement and is its max dose?

I've done research by myself and can't find any, scared to take red clover powder w/o the max dose knowledge

ty v much

>>7247788
>best
Just take Pueraria Mirifica. It's as strong as Estrogen if not stronger

>>7247788
Well the study they quote on wikipedia says 22ug/kg is the max "tolerable intake" whatever that means.
But red clover has 1322mg/100g of coumestrol... which is a lot.
Like if you go to the drug store and buy red clover it's probably in like 500mg pills so you take 2 and you're already at 13220ug lol

A lot of women take it for menopause and similarly a lot of men take it for prostate problems so I think a lot of the fears aren't quite founded in reality.

As for isoflavones I've seen one study that was one month long done in males and they took up to 16mg/kg and there were some side effects but nothing deemed that severe anyway. They concluded most of the side effects were due to their pre-existing conditions since many of them were alcoholics (Phytoestrogens are said to reduce the tendency to want alcohol which is what they were studying).

>>7247814
I kind of doubt it. Miroestrol isn't heavily researched but it's not much more potent than coumestrol and it's only present in 0.002% amounts. Meaning in 2000mg of PM you'd get 40ug. That's barely enough to even get to the IC50 to bind to estrogen receptors and then you'd still need enough to overcome the EC50.
I've looked at examine.com's sources saying the primary chemical in PM is miroestrol and most of their sources go to articles that have nothing to do with PM at all, or they were using purified miroestrol from chemical suppliers injected into mice.
PM does have a lot of isoflavones, and examine.com said isoflavones aren't the primary estrogen in PM, but the citation they quoted once again had nothing to do with PM lol

File: 1459506027564.jpg (6KB, 200x194px) Image search: [Google]

6KB, 200x194px

>>7237353
>mother didn't feed you exclusively soy infant foods

>>7249203

Have you heard of the baby that died because their retarded parents fed them a vegan diet from birth? I think the baby lasted just two weeks. Although I feel you, senpai. I often wished my mother would buy soy milk since middle. Now that I found out I'm lactose intolerant, she buys almond milk.

>>7234485
2 grams per day is a very nice "high" dose

Usually people need between 500mg and 2g

>>7242687
>>7243107
>>7243225
Ainterol and all the other organic brands are fucking expensive

I tried some and they worked, but the bulk stuff from that gook on Etsy is just as effective and I bet it might even be their supplier

>>7249574
Yeah I think people misunderstand the difference between dosage total and dosage in mg/kg.
Plus in studies of mice they have to use upwards of 50mg/kg to achieve the same blood serum levels as 1-2mg/kg in humans due to metabolic differences. It gives a false sense of security.
Phytoestrogens alone probably can't completely feminize you though, but personally I don't think they're as "inactive" as its purported to be. But you never know, maybe with the right combo of phytochemicals you could 'safely' achieve what pharmaceuticals do.

>>7249664
My understanding of it is

Drugs > pueraria >>>>>>>>> food

>>7250012
Maybe if you can get it in bulk I guess.

I'm in Canada and when I order bulk products they tend to get seized by customs. But I only order from the US now and it's been alright as long as they ship UPS. UPS handles the natural product importation forms so it doesn't get seized.

I've only experimented a bit. But my usual supplement intake is ethanol extracted red reishi standardized to 4% triterpenes, 30% polysaccharides, omega-3,6,9 oil, and a 40% EGCG green tea extract. They're all also 5-AR inhibitors and I took them daily long before I thought of phytoestrogens.
But when I added about 300mg/day isoflavones and 1.5g/day red clover (couldn't find a standardized bulk powder for red clover) I did get weird orgasms and a bit of ED. I only took it for like a month though. Maybe I'll keep going, just nervous cause there's no long term studies.
On the plus side it cleared up my facial wrinkles and acne lol

File: mpvshot-2016-04-08-00:04:38.069.png (258KB, 852x480px) Image search: [Google]

258KB, 852x480px

>>7250161
>300mg/day isoflavones
…where do get those

>>7252321
I used to buy bulk supplement powders from china. It was cheap, but customs might freakout about it if they see a kilogram of mysterious bagged powder going through the border from China.
I buy from a few different places now. I bought a bunch from NutriCargo last that was a 40% standardized powder. It's more expensive than china though but probably safer. I don't know if it's high quality or not, I never used it much. I've used other supplements from them and they seem fine though. Comes in a nice resealable bag, well packaged, good shipping as well. The taste, smell, colour, and texture matchup with other isoflavone supplements I've had though.

Even if it doesn't feminize you it's good to add to your supplement routine. It really really improved my skin. Like it was a really surprising improvement after just a month and I've tried everything to reduce my forehead wrinkles from chemical peels to microneedling. But when I added those isoflavones it just flattened them right out.

>>7249574
whatever yo

>become fem or androg adult
or
>die as a child

either way better than the horror film i'm starring in

>>7253321
What wouldmake your life better?

>>7234485
Ladyboy placebo won't do anything.

Herbals are a scam.

>>7253398
not looking like a gross fully developed man

File: brows.jpg (7KB, 229x220px) Image search: [Google]

7KB, 229x220px

>>7253439
>Ladyboy placebo won't do anything.
to white males*

it actually works well on asians but not on sexually dimorphic masculine hulks that are white males tbqh

>>7253521
It won't do anything, period, Kayla