Drop the T spreading?

You got your thread deleted last time, remember?

I thought Milo was anti-feminist. Isn't dropping the T a lesbian feminist campaign?

>>5182864
Milo is definitely Anti-feminist. As far as dropping the T being a Feminist campaign, I wouldn't think all feminists, but maybe just the TERFs.

>>5182847
Trannies are a blight to the entire LGBT community. Remove the T.

>>5182851
shut up buttblasted tranny janny you can't stop us it's 3 against 1. L, G and B are tired of your shit

>>5182847
>believing that a change.org petition is ever worthwhile
kek

>>5182899
pls sign my petition to rename australian currency dollarydoos its gonna happen xD

>>5182847
How is that going to do anything? T groups already have formed to advocate for themselves. Queer groups in general look out for queers, like HRT and Lamda Legal. And T is still always perceived as LGB by someone so T hangs out with LGB even if they are straight.

All this serves to do is make a select group of LGBs try to gain acceptance in the conservative community at the cost of part of LGBT.

>>5182847
>It has been spoken about here for a bit
> but it looks like there is broader movement to drop the T from the LGBT group.
>there is broader movement to drop the T from the LGBT
>549 supporters

>>5182847
You used the same image hash from last time.

You're evading bans, that's a global ban offense.

>>5182922
>All this serves to do is make a select group of LGBs try to gain acceptance in the conservative community at the cost of part of LGBT.
>implying thats a bad thing

found the commie tranny

>>5182946
I've never posted this image before. And I've never been banned, so I don't think I can be ban evading.

>>5182922
T couldn't fight it's way out of a wet paper bag on it's on without help from LGB tbqh.

Hell T would still be seen as some weird fetish/crazy people thing if it weren't for the LGB community as it's advocates helping them to get recognized.

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>>5182847
>>5182956
You have spammed it before though. Same hash and you're evading.

They're pretty harsh about it so enjoy your vacation from the site for spamming commercial crap.

>>5182966
The part of the LGB community that has helped the T community is still helping the T community. Don't take credit for the work of butches.

>>5182877
Lesbian feminist and terf are the same thing.

>>5182985
Well seeing as I did not post that the first time. And I have never been banned. I'm still fairly confident that I will not be banned for evading a ban that I never received in the first place.

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>>5182988
>implying lesbians, gays, and bisexuals didn't equally have a hand in help T get recognized
Hon please, if it weren't for gay men and women you people would still be considered mentally ill and thrown in mental wards instead of being able to transition.

Show some respect you homophobic hypocrites.

>>5183014
oh hey, you can repeat the same thing that was just said. Oh cool. I wonder if I can do that.

Anyways, yes, LG&B all help T, the LG&B arguing to drop T, mostly did not.

>>5183042
>blaming LGB for wanting to get rid of you now
You can only take so much anon.

>>5183071
If you personally helped then thanks. I've done my share of activism too that has helped all LGB people. Cool. But no, if you are promoting what's behind this movement then no. I'm going to keep hanging out with the butches who want the right to be treated like normal human beings when using the locker room and bathroom, the fairies that want to have spaces free of violence against the perceived feminized male and the bi's who dress up to cater to a specific crowd they want that night but don't think that they should be subjected to harassment for that. I'm just saying, the LGB that really have helped the T are still doing so.

>>5182847
no one gives a shit about the 'lgbt' acronym or community except trannies and other faggots

>>5183107
>butches helped trans people and no one else
Lol wut?

Nigga you just went full tumblr.

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>>5183107
Wow get a load of this trans feminist transbian.

>>5182985
jesus christ shut the fuck up you anally devestated mentally ill monster. are you genuinely autistic?

>>5183134
>>5183130
I just am referring to my experience in the real world, that thing that still is there when you turn off your computer. I have found so many LGB that are of the exact opposite of this opinion and a few that would agree.

>>5183107
There is no such thing as "transsexual." You can't change your sex. If you use the liberal definition of gender, and call yourself a transgender, you'd only be minimizing the affect the word "gender" has on people. Either way, you're retarded, quit riding on the backs of others.

>>5182966
>gay people think they aren't seen as weird fetish crazy people

Ha!heh!kek!lel!lol!lmao!kéKÉ!

>>5183118
>gays care about gay things and I am vaguely against that or uniorincally pointing it out
You do realize you're mentally deficient, right?

>>5183149
I've found in my real world exp that most trannys are extremely homophobic especially towards gay men and imo act very ungrateful to them and others in the LGB community for sticking up for them.

>>5183184
Nope gays are pretty normal now, you trannys will never be. I feel sorry for you tbqh.

Fags flooding this board with shitposting anti trans shit are more annoying than anything else

>>5183265
>Nope gays are pretty normal now, you trannys will never be. I feel sorry for you tbqh.

This.
Gays only have problems because of other people. No homophobia = no problems.

But for Trannies it doesn't matter, because their own head, their own mind, their own body is the problem, no matter if the society is "transphobic" or not.

Transgenderism is a mental illness that has to be treated as such and cured.

>>5183287
Well, where's the magical cure?

>>5182991
Your pretty close,
a lot of political lesbians have a tendency to be TERFs,
but you can be a lesbian and still be a non-fucktarded trans inclusive feminist.

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>>5183280

>>5183292
the magical cure for trannies is assisted suicide obviously

>>5183280
if you don't like it then leave, we're fed up with trannies shitting all over this board, and it's not just gays, it's lesbians that are tired of being invaded by transbians also. so maybe you should stop putting pussy on a pedestal and being the beta keked failed man that you are, bro

>>5183301
>all of this projecting
>all of the replies in this thread by this same non-capitalizing anon
>probably across the board too

It's actually pretty sad. Is this your hobby?

pretty sure the T is gonna stay

>>5182966
i agree to a point.
My theory regarding the trans movement is that there are a lack of trans people willing to publicly out themselves to speak on behalf of the trans community. Most trans people transition and go stealth to live their lives. which is completely fine and they are free to do so. The LGB have done a lot of heavy lifting for the T thus far.

There are, however, more trans advocates speaking out today, some good some bad (every group has their bad apples). I feel that the T is comming around and starting to pull its weight along with the LGB.

>>5183317
>Most trans people transition and go stealth
Ftm's maybe, most mtfs don't pass so going stealth isn't an option.

>>5183321
Not even trans, just tired of this same person shitposting all on this board. People here are too retarded to notice it's always the same person starting these threads.

>>5183325
yeah but still this
It's so much easier being stealth if you can be. You don't have to deal with all that shit. But society only sees the others then....

>>5182890
wait, why you advocating for biscum to be apart of it as well?

>>5183307
man, you really don't know what projecting means. i've only made two replies in this thread, multiple people dont use capital letters you fucking autist.

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>>5182847

>>5183330
if we have to choose between biscum and mentally ill people that want to chop off parts of their body to satisfy their mental illness, which would you prefer we be lumped in together with?

>>5183333
>maybe you should stop putting pussy on a pedestal and being the beta keked failed man that you are, bro
This is projecting.

You're retarded and obvious as fuck.

I mean, yeah you can kick us out. But then you're left with the lesbians who will taint everything with some retarded version of feminism. When they realize gay men can't be extorted for kekbux and won't put up with a bunch of lazy whiny cunts, they'll eventually go on a rampage and murder you too. You need trannies to stop the inevitable culling of men.

>>5183330
>biscum

Why do gay people hate bisexuals? Someone explained to me why gay people hate trannies in the last thread, is there any other groups gay people hate?

>>5182847
I mean why not? Transgender-ism has absolutely nothing to do with sexual orientation. We have nothing in common and therefore, we shouldn't be allies.

I would rather team up with heterosexuals and asexuals than side with a bunch of overglorified freaks with body dysmorphia issues.

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>>5183502
Underrated post desu senpai.

>>5182851
What is the justification for deleting this thread? It's perfectly related to the board.

The issues of T are completely and utterly unlike the issues of L, B, and G.

It makes no sense to include them, especially since they're more trouble than they're worth.

>>5183542
It doesn't matter. LGBT as a brand is set in stone. It will never be changed and there is nothing you can do about it. Your feels and everyone else here mean nothing. Everyone recognizes LGBT. Grow the fuck up and get over yourself.

>>5183546
I never once mentioned my "feelings". Stop projecting.
When gays and lesbians start demanding public funds for cosmetic surgery and hormone supplements in the name of "equal rights", I will concede that you were right all along.

But right now, no. You're the one who is wrong.

>>5183552
See you at pride, faggot

>>5183553
That's not an argument, faggot.

either drop the T, or add BL for the boylovers in our midst.

>>5183555
You ignored my argument in favor of your strawman. LGBT is a brand, it would be fucking stupid to change it. Eat a dick.

>>5183561
Brands get changed all the time, actually. Nothing is set in stone. Now that everyone sees what you are and how you behave, no one will want to deal with people like you.

>>5183563
Yes just like Ford, Coca Cola, General Electric, McDonalds, Walmart, Sony. You're fucking retarded.

>>5183567
Who owns the LGBT brand?

>>5183563
P.S. because I know you're autistic
>Notice how they never changed their core names

>>5183570
The public, and until it becomes unecessary to refer to someone as different because of their gender/sexuality it will remain LGBT.

>>5183567
you clearly don't know much about retail if you think that Walmart has never had a name change

>>5183575
So no one is protecting the LGBT "brand" except for this nebulous "public"? That doesn't sound at all like the corporate brands you listed. Nothing at all is protecting the LGBT "brand". The T could easily be dropped just like more letters can be added on (LGBTQP etc). Why is that not a problem, but removing the T is?

You're essentially bragging about infiltrating a group that has nothing to do with you and co-opting it for your own ends to the direct detriment of everyone else.

>>5183578
It's still Wall's mart you fuckass
>autism

>>5183581
The original chain was called Walton's, not Wall's mart, you moronic shit puck.

>>5183580
Because it's part of the core name. It will always be LGBT no matter how many letters are added. Not GLBT not BLT its LGBT. It's been LGBT for decades. Everything is discussed as LGBT issues. We are all referred to as LGBT americans. It's a fucking brand.

>>5183584
>Tfw when you argue over semantic name abbreviations because you're an ass devastated nerd

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>>5182847
Free us from this containment board and let our whoring be spread across the entire website.

>>5183591
>get proven wrong
>don't have the grace and civility to admit you're wrong
You're not making a good case for keeping you people in the group.

>>5183591
sort of like your asinine argument over whether or not LGBT should drop it's T. Kudos, dipshit.

>>5183595
Honestly if you're such a dicksucking tumblrite that you feel /this/ strongly about identity politics and who does and doesn't belong then I dont think I want to be in the same group as you. It's embarassing

>>5183598
Except Walmart never dropped the Walton part you illiterate cock. They abb-re-viated

>>5183588
all of this completely one hundred times and forever.

>>5183580
>anyone thinking the mainstream public gives two shits about how a bunch of fags organize the alphabet
we're all fucked in the head, it's all the same to 90% of the world. nobody cares how you feel, we're all in the same foxhole so shut up and deal with it.

>>5183603
yes they did! the original title was Walton's Five and Dime store. Sam abbreviated the title to Walton's for his storefront and later dropped off a good half of the store title and changed it to Walmart.

Get raped.

>>5183612
>Core Name
>Walton
>Mart
>You learning how to read

>>5183612
Notice how its not called Lesbians and Gays but also Bisexual and Transgender Store
>LGBT

>>5183617
How many more mental gymnastics are you going to perform before finally admitting that you were wrong?

Wow he kept his name in the title. Clearly that was the "core name" of his store and not the vital chunk that emphasized the fact that it was a discount store.

>>5183623
Two steps ahead of you and you're a dollar short>>5183623

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>>5182847
Lol, the only people who give two shits about Milo are Goober Gators.

Oh look it's this thread again.

Flagged the petition for hate speech.

>>5182847
As if there is some kind of LGBT commission that can decide such things. T will be 'dropped' once people start not associating one with the other.

Oh! I didn't notice it was Milo at first. Disgusting.

Milo is an autistic retard and a prime example of why journalism is shit

Gavin Mcinnes has a piece that's about two years old where he suggests to the GLs to throw BOTH of the BTs under the bus. Just search Taki's mag to look for it.

More recently, Return of Kings had a hit piece on bisexuals in their regular article feed.

And a few nights ago, I was listening to some conservative talk radio where the host, Joe Pags, solicited calls from LGB people to gauge whether they appreciated being lumped in with the T's.

This divide-and-conquer meme has been percolating among the right since before the trans "fad" peaked throughout 2014, but now they feel emboldened to go full bore with it. All memes aside, I do find it concerning tee bee aych.

t. a bisexual shitlord who actually consumes this type of content regularly, and has picked up on the above worrying trend.

>>5182847
>Is this something the rest of /lgbt/ can get behind?
yes

>>5183725
>>5183717
>>5183653
>>5183633
this desu

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>associating yourselves with political groups at all
>forming organisations with acronyms and genuinely caring about what special acronym group you belong to
>associating yourself with said group because of whether you do or dont like interacting with male reproductive organs

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>>5186425
>being this triggered

I can't wait for GLAAD to go "Haha, no" to this retarded shit

>>5186442
Skyward Sword is the best Zelda tho

>>5186450
>being this triggered that someone doesn't like Milo

Let's drop da t
let's drop da t
let's drop da t

>>5183480
Gay people are just generally hateful, and bitter.

>>5186454
>skyward sword
>best Zelda
Pfft everyone knows ocarina of time is best Zelda ever. That or a link to the past on snes.

>LESBIAN
: a woman who is sexually attracted to other women : a female homosexual

>GAY
: sexually attracted to someone who is the same sex

>BISEXUAL
: sexually attracted to both men and women

>TRANSGENDER
: of, relating to, or being a person (as a transsexual or transvestite) who identifies with or expresses a gender identity that differs from the one which corresponds to the person's sex at birth

One of these does not belong.

>>5186529
Trans belong more than L or B does. They're useless letters. L is just female gay, B is just gay plus straight. Making it LGB would be pointless, just call it the gay community.

>>5186512
You nostalgia fag!
Nah jk
Those are good too

>>5186563
Just call all non-exclusively straight+cis queer. It works

Then instead of the LGBT community, it can just be the Qmunity

Biscum here

I agree

Transgender is not an orientation.

>>5186639
we are all sexual minorities
why is this still baffling to you idiots

>>5186713
>lesbian
>a minority
All females are lesbians but most like cock because of instinct.

>>5186501
>Gay people are just generally hateful, and bitter.

Lol you all belong together. Transgenders and Faggots

Minority politics never fails to disappoint. Having reached a point where you have political influence, you quickly identify a new outgroup to cement your position.

People younger than you and I don't need this. We gotta stay together. We gotta for the children.

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>>5186763
>All females are lesbians but most like cock because of instinct.

It's pretty obvious our interests don't align.

You could see that in the whole fiasco over Houston's equal rights ordinance. It would have outlawed employment discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation or sexual identity, but the whole thing fell apart over.... bathrooms. Access to bathrooms for transsexuals, that is. A scare campaign was started over 'NO Men in Women's Bathrooms' (literally what it said on the signs), and it completely worked; it got trounced, 2-1. Everyone was shocked, because it's a liberal city and we've had a gay mayor for the last five years. But no one here was even talking about the gay employment discrimination issue... it was all about transsexuals and bathrooms.

>>5186891
To be honest, the blame there should be more on the idiot people who believed the scare campaign, not on the people with a medical problem.

>>5183333
>>5183338

Just came from /pol to laugh at you guys :P

>>5186891
The problem here is that people are unable to focus on more than one political issue at a time on average.

>>5183502

I signed it after I read this post.

GTFO trannies.

GLAAD stands firmly with the transgender community and unequivocally rejects the outrageous and destructive idea that the ‘T’ be removed from LGBT. For decades, transgender people have worked alongside lesbian, gay, and bisexual people to advance equality for everyone, often leading the way in the movement for full equality and acceptance. Many trans people are also lesbian, gay, and bisexual -- they are an inextricable and invaluable part of the LGB community. At a time when anti-LGBT activists continue to attack the basic rights and protections essential to all of our lives, we must stand together, rather than succumb to the ruin of divisiveness.

- GLAAD CEO & President Sarah Kate Ellis

Shitposters BTFO, go sign some other ineffectual petiton, kek

>>5186891

Just goes to show how much the general public can't stand trannies.

>>5187019
*the old voters and MUH CHILLUNS parents moreso than anyone else

>>5182921
desu, I'd sign that petition

>>5187044

Right, the people who actually go out and vote.

2016 is gonna be great

>>5182847
>Nov 6, 2015 — GLAAD stands firmly with the transgender community and unequivocally rejects the outrageous and destructive idea that the ‘T’ be removed from LGBT. For decades, transgender people have worked alongside lesbian, gay, and bisexual people to advance equality for everyone, often leading the way in the movement for full equality and acceptance. Many trans people are also lesbian, gay, and bisexual -- they are an inextricable and invaluable part of the LGB community. At a time when anti-LGBT activists continue to attack the basic rights and protections essential to all of our lives, we must stand together, rather than succumb to the ruin of divisiveness.- GLAAD CEO & President Sarah Kate Ellis

>Nov 6, 2015 — This is unequivocally wrong. The hate that killed Matthew Shepard killed Zella Ziona. The bullies at school aren't just harassing the gay kids, they're harassing the transgender kids. The parents who could provide loving homes for the 400,000 children in foster care aren't only lesbian parents, or gay parents, they're bisexual parents and transgender parents. This idea that we are somehow separate and apart is patently untrue. We are one movement, stronger in our unity. We are one community, period. And the Human Rights Campaign will not be done working until equality reaches every single one of us. - Human Rights Campaign President Chad Griffin

Mouthbreathers BTFO

>>5186891
Conservatards want to deny you rights just the same, throwing trannies under the bus like you have time and again won't change their viewpoints on you.

If you want to blame anyone, blame the idiots doing the fear campaign.

>>5183265
>>5183265
>tfw transbian fujoshit who literally nosebleeds at gay boys and thinks theyre adorable and about the best thing in the world
>tfw don't harass them like weirdo faghags
i thought every transbian was fujo???

>>5186529
Bisexuals ARE gay. Same as most pedophiles. It's purely a political move to try to separate them away from the other gays in order to make fags more palatable to the general public who is repulsed by them.

>gay people are born that way, and they can't change it; therefore, they deserve status as a protected class
>but what about the vast majority of gays who are attracted to both genders?
>b-but those aren't True Gays™!!

>gay people have never hurt a fly! why can't you give them rights yet??
>but what about all those children they molested?
>b-but those aren't True Gays™!!

You'd think people would catch on by now.

As for lesbians needing their own noun, no they do not.

>>5183330
Because biscum are infinitely better than the mentally retarded

>>5187408
>We are one movement, stronger in our unity. We are one community, period.

Didn't stop them from kicking the pedos out

>>5188147
The gay men are still here

>>5187676
> Bisexuals ARE gay.
No, "gay" refers to people more or less exclusively sexually attracted to members of the same sex. Trying to apply that to all bisexuals is fucked.

>Same as most pedophiles.
But not as fucked as this. We don't even have the resources to form a representative sample of pedophiles from which to draw conclusions about trends in their sex-preference among children.

What we do have a good sample of are child molesters, the majority of whom do not possess the distinct neurological condition referred to by the term "pedophilia".

It makes sense. Trannies have a different mental type of illness than LGB. LGB is sexual orientation. T is gender identity.

>>5183287
>But for Trannies it doesn't matter, because their own head, their own mind, their own body is the problem, no matter if the society is "transphobic" or not.
the body is not much of a problem if trans people don't have to go through the puberty of their biological gender. which means trans people need to be recognized and accepted early in their lives. which means if society isn't transphobic but accepting most (for some all) of the symptoms transgenderism shows are prevented which prevents mental illnesses that stem from transgenderism.

I am a transgender woman and a proud member of the Australian Gay Community, I am personally offended the subject is even up for discussion.

In a time of strife, discrimination and exclusion we came together under one banner.

To talk of exclusion and discrimination of people of your own community of which some incidently ARE gay, bisexual or lesbian is beyond the absolute pale and something I never thought I would live to see in my lifetime.

Let us hope exclusion never raises its ugly head in our community ever again.

>>5187676
>>5188179
Gr8 b8 m8. Now go back to pol.

>>5186978
What about disabled people? They have a medical problem (often much more legitimate than being insane), and still we don't force every company to accommodate their needs, for example by installing special bathrooms.
>>5186631
>Qmunity
Someone should get a noble prize for inventing this word.
>>5183351
Trannies ARE the culling of men.
And there's plenty of feminazis who acknowledge trannies as women or at least as non-men.

>>5183325
>implying most ftms pass
>>5183293
All feminists are fucktarded.
The ones that aren't have given up on calling themselves feminists, and invented new labels.
>>5183287
Except there is no cure. Same as for homosexuality.

>>5183265
thank you for making my life better. you personally, master gay 4chan man.

all my lols

Honestly, anyone who fucks a tranny, or faps to a tranny is a homo. Trannies themselves are all homo, regardless of what craziness theyve deluded themselves into - like the thought that if a mtf fucks a man its straight sex. Its not. Its gay sex, period.

I would know, Im a realistic tranny.

>>5188735
>pick any gay guy
>whole life revolves around being gay

it's a sexuality, not an identity, i swear!!111

>>5188881
That is just not true.
Though sex and relationships are a big part of any person's life, be they gay or straight.

>drop the T
Not gonna work.

Straight people are gonna lump us together anyway because "all lgbt is this weird icky sex thing".

You have a higher chance of convincing a pro-Palestine liberal that there's a difference between zionism and judaism, and that not all jews support Israel, than you being able to convince a straight person that T doesn't belong with the rest of LGB.

>people thinking that a change.org thing is going to stop EVERYONE from saying it

>>5188879

>2015
>Still being a terrible liar

The more trannies act like assholes the more gay/bi men and women will turn on them. Already signed the petition

>>5188881
If you met me you would assume i was straight until I actually kissed a guy in front of you

I write part-time for a sports blog

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>>5189179
That feel when never met a tranny IRL.

The thing you all are forgetting is that you'll never be able to get trannies out of the LGB community. Virtually all trannies are gay in some way, either in relation to their gender identity or assigned sex. The only exception is asexual trannies (and you'll only be able to keep them out if you reject the argument that asexuality is queer).

>>5189268
That you know of.

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>>5189314
I really doubt that any of the people that I ever knew was a passing tranny.
The ones that I saw on dating sites all looked kinda like this.

>>5189338
>The ones that I saw on dating sites all looked kinda like this.
Do you not understand what passable means?
If they look like that then they obviously aren't passable, if they are passable then you wouldn't know they were trans unless someone told you or something like that.

HRC response:
>Nov 6, 2015 — This is unequivocally wrong. The hate that killed Matthew Shepard killed Zella Ziona. The bullies at school aren't just harassing the gay kids, they're harassing the transgender kids. The parents who could provide loving homes for the 400,000 children in foster care aren't only lesbian parents, or gay parents, they're bisexual parents and transgender parents. This idea that we are somehow separate and apart is patently untrue. We are one movement, stronger in our unity. We are one community, period. And the Human Rights Campaign will not be done working until equality reaches every single one of us.

What fucking nonsense. Did they even read the petition? No one ever said the Trans community doesn't face harsh treatment, and no one said that Trans people aren't at a higher rate of being violently attacked like Zella Ziona was. So does the sex offender population in this country, and at a much higher rate than transgender people mind you. Just because a group is facing discrimination doesn't mean that all members of the LGB community should have to take it in like a wounded puppy. The transgender population in this country is first of all so small that politically it makes no sense to attach their problems to the greater movement, and secondly it's not about sexual rights but about changing people's very minds concerning the nature of human gender and sexuality. And not all LGB people support that. I'm gay and whether someone is male or female matters a lot to me since that's how I define my sexuality. Having a large group of trans activists who are actively trying to blur that line between male and female not only doesn't serve my interests, but it goes blatantly agianst what I believe in when it comes to human sexuality.

But of course I'm supposed to fight for their causes and their rights because x amount of trans people are murdered every year.

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>>5189370
That's my point. I never saw any kind of passable tranny on LGBT online datings.
Even if they are indistinguishable from a real woman, I assume they'd mention it in their profiles that they are trans, so that the chasers can find them?
Or do you mean the passable trannies use dating services for straight people? But that ain't gonna work if they are pre-SRS.

>>5189389
>But of course I'm supposed to fight for their causes
how much did you fight? like at all? and how did you fight?

>>5189414
None. At all. Ever. But part of the reason for that is the "LGBT" community not acting in my interests at all, and to be quite honest I don't think they've ever given a damn

Because, as you can see clearly by the HRC statement, this is all about politics and forcing a political movement onto LGBT people. And I don't support it. And I won't fight for it

>>5189426
so you're not doing anything? that sets your posts in a different light you know?
but anyways so what you're saying is you don't want to be associated at all with the LGBT at all and don't want them to represent you? fair enough but then how did you get the idea that you have any say in the matter who, these strangers to you, should consider their allies and who don't?

>>5189453
>so you're not doing anything? that sets your posts in a different light you know?
No, I'm not doing anything. But there are national organizations that are attaching my name to transgender acceptance simply because of my sexuality and my support for same sex marriage and gay civil rights. I have supported gay anti-suicide hotlines and groups both financially and through volunteer work, but I don't do shit for LGBT centers or HRC or these groups precisely because they do not speak for me and they are fighting for things I find ultimately trivial, pointless or even regressive.

I get a say because it's my sexuality they claim to speak for. If you think it's wrong for me to speak against their speaking for me just because I'm not on the frontlines then please let me know which avenues I have to travel down to make my voice heard.

>>5189426
fag apologist detected

how's the cognitive dissonance treating you?

>>5189268
It's funny because the only ftm tranny I met was a massive cunt.
But she already was before starting anyway so it doesn't really matter.

That actually makes my experience with trannies 100% shit.

>>5189482
>cognitive dissonance

how?

>>5189396
Well the people that use lbgt and especially trans-specific dating sites are generally the bottom of the barrel that have to settle for chasers. If you're passable enough to go stealth then you just use normal dating sites and some mention that they are trans in their profile just so they don't have to deal with the whole "big reveal" or they leave it out to avoid chasers because it's just the unpassable ones who settle for chasers.
A lot of big dating sites like okc are gay-inclusive now so it's not like they really need to use a service specifically for straight people which isn't really the norm now anyway.

>>5189477
>that are attaching my name to transgender acceptance
your name? have i seen your name being posted anywhere in this context already? so they just take your name and are all like "this guy supports tranny rights too!"?
>I get a say because it's my sexuality they claim to speak for.
they don't. they are fighting for human rights that are denied to people with a certain sexuality and/or gender identity. they are not a political party that say "gays don't want health insurance" as an example.
>and they are fighting for things I find ultimately trivial, pointless or even regressive.
still doesn't explain why you try to tell people what to fight for especially if it is only based on your personal opinions.
>If you think it's wrong for me to speak against their speaking for me
it is because they are not speaking for you. these strangers fought for your basic human rights without you doing much. now you're telling them to stop fighting for others because you personally don't like them.

Well, let's talk without homophobia/transphobia or past activism.

In a rational way, should the T be removed from LGBT ?
Well...yes. Because it is two subject totally different. Even if homophobia and transphobia are linked the same way that they are linked to sexism, both situations are just not related.
There are transgendre peoples who are also gay/bi or lesbians. Transexuality is NOT a sexual orientation and keeping the T does not explaining it to non concerned peoples.

But, let's be honest, T will not desapear. Because if the situations are different, both activism are linked. And many LGB peoples fight for trans rights. And many trans peoples fight for LGB rights.

And union make you stronger.

>>5189536
>your name? have i seen your name being posted anywhere in this context already? so they just take your name and are all like "this guy supports tranny rights too!"?
I don't remember voting on the term "LGBT" and yet I'm lumped in by any one who learns of my sexuality simply because of who I sleep with.

Look, the point is that transgender aims and goals are not the same as LGB aims and goals and it's time to stop pretending like they are just to gain strength in numbers. It's dishonest.
> they are not a political party that say "gays don't want health insurance" as an example.
See that's where you're wrong, they're not jusst a huiman rights advocacy group, they are very much a political group that supports candidates and spends a large portion of their budget on public and political outreach. If it were up to me Glaad and HRC would be disbanded but I can't accomplish that so all I can do is criticize them where I see fit.

>still doesn't explain why you try to tell people what to fight for especially if it is only based on your personal opinions.
I'm not telling them what to fight for. I'm telling them to stop assuming I support Ts just because I'm L, G or B. And all I can do is tell them how much I can disagree with them, so why are you trying to shut me up?

>these strangers fought for your basic human rights
It's a political group. These people are not Ghandi. They spend their time bitching about how gays are treated in the media. They do very little in the way of actual reaching out to the community.

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>>5189389
I'm sorry people trigger you that much by existing, but organizations like glaad and HRC work to advance natural rights, not pander to your protocols of the elders level delusions.

Maybe if you actually wrote a petition that wasn't full of insane fringe claims and argued based on a rights framework, not one of abolishing get anything goes your feels don't like, all the gay organisations wouldn't have laughed you out and vowed to help everyone trans.

Loving the blowback.

>>5189568
>I don't remember voting on the term "LGBT" and yet I'm lumped in by any one who learns of my sexuality simply because of who I sleep with.
what does this even mean? people who get to know you assume you support transgender people because you're gay? they outright tell you that? if so then they are pretty retarded but a short sentence from you could fix the matter easily.
>Look, the point is that transgender aims and goals are not the same as LGB aims and goals and it's time to stop pretending like they are just to gain strength in numbers
where is the difference? simplified it is about gaining equality that is denied to us because of sexuality or gender identity. that bullshit about blurring the lines between male and female has nothing to do with anything. that shows you know little about transgender and about male and female.
>See that's where you're wrong, they're not jusst a huiman rights advocacy group, they are very much a political group that supports candidates and spends a large portion of their budget on public and political outreach.
well obviously they are trying to get recognized by the public and politic. how else are they going to accomplish anything? but please show me an example where they support a candidate or a law as an example that had nothing to do with gaining LGBT rights. like saying LGBT doesn't support nuclear energy because of whatever reason.
>all I can do is criticize them where I see fit.
you can criticize all you want but i can criticize your critic too and so on.
> I'm telling them to stop assuming I support Ts just because I'm L, G or B.
so who is them in this case? the people you meet personally or the strangers that basically have nothing to do with you that fight because of their own ideologie?
> They spend their time bitching about how gays are treated in the media.
that's a good thing. years ago they bitched about gays getting beaten and disowned and other things. so they did do quite a lot, didn't they?

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>>5189680
This.

>>5189686
>what does this even mean?
It means that my sexuality is somehow influencing how I vote, at least in the public's mind, because of the aims of groups like GLAAD and HRC. That perception is damaging.
> simplified it is about gaining equality that is denied to us because of sexuality or gender identity. that bullshit about blurring the lines between male and female has nothing to do with anything. that shows you know little about transgender and about male and female.
Gender identity and sexuality are not the same thing or even close to the same thing politically so you are dishonest by connecting them so easily. And secondly are you not telling me that most transgender activists don't try to remove gender-based applications to pretty much everything? Have you been in academia?
>but please show me an example where they support a candidate or a law as an example that had nothing to do with gaining LGBT rights
When did I say it had nothing to do with LGBT rights? Every action they make ostensibly has to do with LGBT rights, my beef is that they include all LGB in support of T for no reason whatsoever and that includes their support or defense for any Transgender-related bill or law.
>so who is them in this case? the people you meet personally or the strangers that basically have nothing to do with you that fight because of their own ideologie?
"them" in this case specifically is the HRC and GLAAD
>that's a good thing. years ago they bitched about gays getting beaten and disowned and other things. so they did do quite a lot, didn't they?
Those were actually good causes. Bitching about media portrayals of anything is fucking retarded, pointless and censorship. It seems to me that groups like GLAAD care more about some comedian using the word faggot in his stage act than actually changing public policy on the Civil Rights Act for instance.

>>5189680
>I'm sorry people trigger you that much by existing
Why are you being so defensive about this? I don't want to harm trans and I didn't even say they were wrong about their goals and aims as a movement, all I'm saying is that I don't support it. And I'm sick of gay groups tackling these issues as it only serves to alienate me politically from LGB-related issues in general. I'm not allowed to express such beliefs?
> natural rights
what? What natural rights are they fighting for? What could even be considered a "natural right?" Employment is certainly not a natural right.
>Maybe if you actually wrote a petition that wasn't full of insane fringe claims and argued based on a rights framework, not one of abolishing get anything goes your feels don't like, all the gay organisations wouldn't have laughed you out and vowed to help everyone trans.
I didn't write the petition and I certainly wouldn't have worded it like whoever did

>>5189833
>I didn't write the petition and I certainly wouldn't have worded it like whoever did
Then you shouldn't associate yourself with the petition. That's hurting your image more than associating with the trannies does desu.

>>5182966
>if it weren't for the LGB community as it's advocates helping them to get recognized
lol as if lesbians advocated for trans people

>>5189839
I haven't even signed it. I'm just voicing my support for removing T from LGBT in this thread. Sexuality concerns and gender identity concerns should not be conflated.

>>5189824
>It means that my sexuality is somehow influencing how I vote, at least in the public's mind, because of the aims of groups like GLAAD and HRC. That perception is damaging.
GLAAD and HCR have nothing to do with it.

It's the public. The public who are so ignorant and uneducated and placant with their satisfying heterosexual life that anything that deviates is a complete foreign concept to them.
To them all of lgbt is sexual deviance and what those letters mean is trivial.

It's not US that lump lgb and t together, it's THEM.

>>5189833
>Why are you
GLAAD and HRC don't exist to chase after your childish urges, they're here to lobby for civil rights and civil liberties and everyone here who's ever donated to them did so under that premise, not so they'd push your Protocols of the Elders manifesto.

Don't like it? Then don't get involved with them rather than demanding they become your personal servants.
>What natural rights
Freedom from coercion, freedom state sanctioned theft. If you sign a business contract, rental contract or employment contract and then try to cheat it by citing the other party's orientation or gender, then it's still theft.

>>5189824
>at least in the public's mind
that means there needs to be more work done in recognizing LGBT people as diverce and facetious people that have nothing more in common than being lumped in the same group by non-LGBT people/the public. it means nothing else.
>Gender identity and sexuality are not the same thing
biologically no, though similar and maybe vaguely related as far as science can tell. politically yes, they are the same. like i said it is us being recognized as human beings with the same rights. health care for transgender people is just something that comes together with basic human rights.
> And secondly are you not telling me that most transgender activists don't try to remove gender-based applications to pretty much everything?
that's retarded, we try to be recognized as our gender, not trying to make two genders one. not saying you are lying just saying that these activists are either misguided non-transgender allies or retarded.
>my beef is that they include all LGB in support of T for no reason whatsoever and that includes their support or defense for any Transgender-related bill or law.
so it goes back to you trying to tell other people what to fight for? if L,G and B people decide to fight for T as L,G and B people who are you to tell them not to?
>Those were actually good causes.
yes, they were. what i am saying is it is a good thing the most important thing for them to bitch for is something this irrelevant.
>changing public policy on the Civil Rights Act for instance
so you want to them to go into politics? earlier you were bitching about them going into politics, now what it is?

>>5189890
>Protocols of the Elders manifesto

second time you've used that slander. It was just as irrelevant and inappropriate the first time.

>Don't like it? Then don't get involved with them rather than demanding they become your personal servants.
I'm not demanding anything other than the ability to speak my opinion.
>Freedom from coercion, freedom state sanctioned theft. If you sign a business contract, rental contract or employment contract and then try to cheat it by citing the other party's orientation or gender, then it's still theft.
Freedom from coercion is not a natural right. Really the entire concept of "natural right" is ludicrous to begin with.

>>5189906
>if L,G and B people decide to fight for T as L,G and B people who are you to tell them not to?
I have no problem with HRC or GLAAD or any individual group supporting whatever they want, but every time someone uses the term "LGBT" they are indirectly wrapping millions of people into one ideology and that type of mentality needs to be challenged.

>yes, they were. what i am saying is it is a good thing the most important thing for them to bitch for is something this irrelevant.
My point is that their causes now, chiefly their obsession with how the media portrays gays, is destructive and in my opinion a form of censorship
>so you want to them to go into politics? earlier you were bitching about them going into politics, now what it is?
Well I'd want them to actually get something done. If oging into politics to get the CRA extended to gays is that answer then I would support that. What I don't support is them organizing boycotts of shows or movies for being too homophobic or transphobic.

>>5189918
>second time you've used that slander

>Doctors not doing what muh feels want = a plot to enslave your girls
Maybe you shouldn't associate with something that crazy then.
>Freedom from coercion is not
People sure aren't allowed to steal from others and infringe on their ;liberties with impunity or sanction from the state. It's a pretty basic idea.

>>5189568
So both you and trans people don't want basic rights to not be denied based on something about you can't change? Why do you also pretend that there isn't a nicely-sized portion of trans people who are also LGB?

Just fess up to the fact that they make you feel "icky" and your arguments come from a place of hate rather than the logical one you're trying to make.

I also don't know why you think anyone would give a fuck if you don't support T, no one cares, you aren't some big important person. No one is forcing you to support the T. I mean, it's pretty transparent why you don't and it's our right to express how much of a piece of shit you are.
In summary,
get over yourself, fag.

>>5189933
Why does everyone else have to stop using a word or an organisation that's been around for a long while just because it triggers you.

Why should I be forced to serve your infantile desires?

>>5189933
>but every time someone uses the term "LGBT" they are indirectly wrapping millions of people into one ideology and that type of mentality needs to be challenged.
that's very different than demanding LGB to be seperated from T! in addition you are saying LGB needs to be dropped as a term too because it is indirectly wrapping millions of people into one ideology. but what ideology are speaking of? the ideology that every human being deserves the same rights regardless of sexuality and gender identity?
> Well I'd want them to actually get something done.
you are discrediting everything they have already achieved like the things i mentioned already and gay marriage as an very recent example.
to the rest of your post, yes i am against censorship and transphobia and homophobia needs to be battled with information and talking not demonizing those that express it.
can i assume you are in line with the parts of my post you didn't reply to?

>>5182847
Welp, /pol/ openly admits to organizing the petition and pretending to be gay just for the sake of false flagging gay men and making lgbt fight itself.

https://archive.4plebs.org/pol/thread/55097523/#55097523

If I were you, /lgbt/, I'd use the report tab in Change and show them this stuff.

>>5189942
>Doctors
whoa buddy I don't remember any discussion of any doctors. I think you're assuming a position I don't hold. I'm not anti-trans or against trans surgery, or skeptical about dysphoria, etc. I merely disagree with the political aims of the group.
>Maybe you shouldn't associate with something that crazy then.
I'm associating myself with my opinion. I did not write nor did I sign this petition.
>>5189949
> Why do you also pretend that there isn't a nicely-sized portion of trans people who are also LGB?
There's a nicely sized portion of blacks that are LGB as well but that doesn't mean I support Black Lives Matter
>Just fess up to the fact that they make you feel "icky" and your arguments come from a place of hate rather than the logical one you're trying to make.
Icky? I have no ill will whatsoever for transgender people. I merely do not want their movement to co-opt the entire gay rights campaign, and that's what I see them doing. And it's not Transgenders' fault for the most part, the vast majority of transgender activists and campaigners are not trans themselves.

>I also don't know why you think anyone would give a fuck if you don't support T, no one cares, you aren't some big important person
I'm only me. And all I can do is speak my opinion. I'm not asking any one to take me seriously and I'm not expecting any one to.

> I mean, it's pretty transparent why you don't and it's our right to express how much of a piece of shit you are.
This is the kind of nonsense that really pisses me off about this entire issue. Please quote where exactly I've been unreasonable or insulting or denigrating toward the transgender community. I have not done so. I have merely spoken my opinion and expressed my desire to remove the political interests of the LGB community from that of the T community, yet somehow this means I hate transgender people in general and wish nothing but the worst for them.

>>5189987
>whoa buddy I don't remember any discussion of any doctor
The petition explicitly argues that medicalized transsexualism will enslave all the women and children.

>>5189981
>the ideology that every human being deserves the same rights regardless of sexuality and gender identity?
>sexuality and gender identity
There you go again! Conflating those two issues just because it's so easy to do so! My entire point is that these issues are very different and they cannot be attacked by the same methodology and will not be supported by the same groups of people. There's a difference between tolerating what two people do in a bedroom and changing your own perception of the concept of gender in order to accommodate for the trans population. Because don't try to pretend that's not an aim of the transgender population.They want special accommodation to be taken for their gender identity from others. How many stories are there about transphobia coming just from some guy calling a MtF "he"?
>can i assume you are in line with the parts of my post you didn't reply to?
Yeah I'd say so

>>5190002
>>5189987
And just to add to that, you threw a trantrum when GLAAD and HRC shot down the petition and claimed they didn't really read the whole brilliant and beautiful thing.

Maybe the insane, women and children being enslaved by medical jews rhetoric is half the reason they came down so hard on it.

>>5189982
>making lgbt fight itself.
They didn't need to do anything.

>>5190002
Another reason I didn't sign the petition

Apparently this thread is only for this idiotic /pol/ petition and any outside discussion of the entire concept of the term LGBT is not welcome so I think I'll just leave if people are just going to assume I support this petition

>>5190015
>changing your own perception of the concept of gender
Why would that be the case when the whole purpose of medicine is to change sex traits?

>>5190017
No, my beef with how HRC responded to the petition is how they did so. They brought up a case of a transgender woman being attacked and used that as reasoning for all LGBT people to support trans rights. Well I'm sorry but millions of people are murdered around the world every year and I can't be bothered to support each and every group just because they are at a higher risk of attack.

Am I the only one who thinks the petition sounds rather TERFy?

>>5190022
Yeah but now they know to fan the flames anyway just because they can. Most probably don't even care about LGBT political issues or people, they just like how powerful anonymously sowing confusion, hatred, pain and discord on the internet makes them feel.

>>5190042
TERFs and right-wing extremists are the same type of people. Their rants seem very similar because they are very similar.

>>5190040
>Well I'm sorry but millions of people are murdered around the world every year and I can't be bothered to support each and every group just because they are at a higher risk of attack.
Said the gay man who benefits directly from special government protections for hate crime, employment discrimination, marriage, etc.

>>5190015
> they cannot be attacked by the same methodology and will not be supported by the same groups of people.
both of this is objectively wrong.
they can and are being attacked by the same methodology: it's something neither of us can change about us and repressing it means sacrificing a huge part of our quality of life.
they are supported by the same group of people. the HRC and the GLAAD are examples you yourself gave.
>and changing your own perception of the concept of gender in order to accommodate for the trans population.
that's twisting words and it can be done with gay rights just the same. it is about tolerating what people do to their own bodies to raise their quality of life. we do try to be recognized and treated as our gender. anyone who wants special rights is retarded.
> How many stories are there about transphobia coming just from some guy calling a MtF "he"?
you've found stories on the internet and now you're generalizing. isn't this similar to the thing you are complaining about being lumped in with LGBT? you are also implying that homophobia issues are non-issues because the HRC complains about the word faggot in TV.

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>>5190055
>>5190042
Funny how both of them insist medical treatment for transsexuality will enslave all the women and children.

That's some tinfoil right there.

>>5189987
If you supported this shitty petition, you are a shitty person.

Not because you think T shouldn't be with LGB as dumb as that is, but because you didn't read the petition as it basically made crazy and hateful claims about all trans people.

>>5190101
forced suicide would be the best treatment

>>5190255
>TFW roaches get angry when the rest of society doesn't follow their commands
yawn

>>5190069
we shouldn't though
two wrongs don't make a right

>>5190274
everyone would be better off though

>>5190125
those claims are very true against the majority though

>>5190321
Don't you have some Jews to be crying about

>>5182847
Don't care.

what do LGB do for trans rights. all trans right stuff is fought by the trans or queer community. all LGB does is bitch and moan when the spot light isnt on them. now that trannies are starting to be more visible its like a dying celeberty trying to stay relevent

>>5190337
Jews don't bother me. Trannies on the other hand are disgusting. This board is proof enough of that. I wish moot had the foresight to just name this /lgb/ and create /trap/ for all the trans bs.

>>5190555
the only reason this board exists is because of trannies. if you dont like it make more threads about topics you like, hide bad threads or get the fuck off this site if you get so triggered by trannies posting

>>5190555
It's always about throwing tantrums when GLAAD and moot don't cater to your whims. You can't function as an adult.

#LGBPnotLGBT

I really don't understand this whole thing, now that gays have it fairly ok in western countries they want to throw the trannies under the bus?

doesn't that seem really fucking mean and in opposition to the very image gay people have tried to project of themselves for the past few decades?

"Oh we finally got our acceptance, but these ugly trannies are holding us back because they are ugly and make people uncomfortable so let's just stop supporting them even tho they've fought with us since the beginning"

this situation just makes me dislike gay people desu.

>>5191395
For the most part it isn't gay guys.

Pol admits they statue it and pretended to be gay guys as a way to bait people into fighting each other.

>>5191395
This

Those fags are a bunch of hypocrites

>homosexuality is normal, transgender people are freaks though

No, both are mental illnesses, if homosexuality was normal we wouldn't be here today because the human race would have died out a long time ago.

And now after finally getting close to acceptance, they want to discriminate agaisnt transgender people.

>discrimination against gays is bad, it is ok to discriminate against trannies though

kill yourself

>>5191395
Gay people are catty women

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>>5191512

>homosexuality isn't normal

Pic related. GTFO you mentally ill freak.

>>5190717
That P better stand for pansexual.

>>5191746
It's a mental defect that prevents you from doing of what you are are supposed to do:reproducing, so no it's not normal by any definition.

>>5191788
Who says reproducing is something you are SUPPOSED to do? Reproduction is a species-level need, not an individual-level need.

>>5191788
There is no 'supposed' in nature. Get over it.

>>5191746
Not trans, and behavior that gets eliminated by evolution kinda counts as abnormal by definition.

>Check your ableist privlege1!

>>5191793
>Who says reproducing is something you are SUPPOSED to do?

Evolution, you genetic dead-end.

>>5191795
Positive and negative selection say otherwise.

Phenotypes without viability wouldn't be kept if it weren't for penetrance and recessivity.

Not trans, just pointing that bit out.

>>5191793
>>5191795
Look I don't hate homosexual or transgender people, but saying that it's biologically normal is just wrong.

>>5191804
>what is kin selection

>>5191824
It's biologically abnormal because it's uncommon, not because it prevents reproduction.

>>5191804
Wow. GTFO you are the only faggot here right now. Evolution is not a divine decree of what is supposed to happen you fuckwit.

You are why I hate the modern atheist movement so much. You all mantle that title and spout things that sound scientific with no appreciation for the underlying principles. You are no better than the dogma spouting bible thumping shitheads you all deride. You've just become a dogma spouting text book thumping shithead.

None of you fucking retards sees the common problem with both of you, namely you're thumping books and not reading them. You make me realize the worst thing about the holocaust was that it was ever stopped and wasn't simply adopted far and wide to get rid of fucking ignorant ass hats.

>>5191824
Never said it was 'normal' though. But even then, 'normal' means nothing to nature. It just does its thing. Nature does not value. It just happens. Nature is chaos. I know it seems easier to think everything has some sort of intrinsic value, but it doesn't.

>>5191824
So gays who get a surrogate are biologically normal? Or those that have kids at any point through any means? Cool.

>>5191823
That's still no 'supposed'. It's just 'if x, then y'. Nothing about what SHOULD be done or what is GOOD.

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>>5182921
That was literally the most retarded thing in the news this year.

>>5192043
why does he want to kill bell

>>5182890
"our shit" being providing a hugely disproportionate amount of time, funds, and legal sacrifice and still getting thrown under the bus time and time again?

"We'll come back for you" is the lgb rallying cry. So much is owed to T. Pay up now that you have social capital, faggot. Come back for us.

>>5190573
>trannies say hurrr durr make threads about topic you like
>make threads about how disgusting and mentally ill trannies are
>trannies wahhh muh oppreshun!
make up your mind you freak

>>5192145
This mad people laugh at your autistic rants

>>5191846
Jeez, only said that its biologically a negative trait that's always selected against. Not the same as saying being gay was wrong, why so touchy?

Saying its harmful from an evolution standpoint isn't judging.

>>5191854
Yeah, and that's an example of penetrance and how it can spread.

Don't hate gay men or transsexuals, I was just talking bio so why act like a bunch of angry queens?

LGB = sexual preference
T = mental illness called gender dysphoria

The T should never have been there in the first place. Can we also rewrite history that T was never added?

This thread is too long to read, but do any trannies actually want the T to be in LGBT? Someone give me a rundown on what Ts who want to be in LGBT are saying

>>5192277
The main concern for me is T on its own would be too small to push for legal protection that gays already have

>>5192291
what legal protection? like what war are you seeing happening that involves the lgbt "community"? what's to stop another minority from joining the lgbt "community"?

even the lgbt "club" at my uni never talked about trans shit because it's totally unrelated

>>5192347
Were there any others onboard during stonewall?

If not, I'm just gonna go with what >>5187408
GLAAD said.

>>5192383
>Were there any others onboard during stonewall?
don't even know what that means

inb4 you're BANISHED from the lgbt community!!

I'll ask again: what legal protection do you, as a T I assume, want specifically

>>5189001
Need I post my hormones?

>>5192427
>I'll ask again: what legal protection do you, as a T I assume, want specifically

I'm not anon, but I'll take a shot at what I suppose is wanted
>no discrimination in housing or employment based on status as transgender
>allowed to use public bathrooms of the gender he or she identifies with
>If imprisoned or put in jail, placed in gender group that he or she identifies with
>cis men or women, whether gay or straight are not legally allowed to not be sexually or romantically in a person based on their status as transgender.

>>5192573
aren't those things already accomplished (in the US at least)? maybe i'm just a privileged passer

>>5192587
Not federally, and not in many jurisdictions. Some states and municipalities have protections, but most don't.

>>5192622
oic, I'll just go back to staying out of it I guess since I don't have to worry about any of that

thanks for giving me a real answer

you people are pathetic, reducing youreslves down to literal letters and arguing which letter is good or bad

>>5192145
>>5192259

>faggots being this much in denial
>hurr durr my mental illness is more normal than the other one

>>5192494

Sure, lets see them timestamps hombre

>>5192821
We should probably add schizophrenics to the acronym too then xistah

>>5191846
>You all mantle that title and spout things that sound scientific with no appreciation for the underlying principles
>i'm so much more knowledgeable and smarter than you all but i'll rather use two paragraphs attacking a random person for using an argument i don't like instead of specifying what's wrong with the argument
you sure showed them!

T is unquestionably mentally ill.

There is no responsibility of the public to revise public infrastructure of the mentally healthy to accommodate the mentally ill.

All u fags should be buried in the same hole u fuckups

>>5183287
Trannies got no problems if they're accepted as the opposite gender by their peers and the gov and medical science can do its magic well enough.

Trannies have been too marginalized and harmfully stereotyped to get mainstream support until very very recently and apparently people are already trying to turn things on reverse. For the vast majority of the world it's not even as good as muricas situation with trans rights.

>>5194219
Are mentally ill people still ill after they're treated and show no symptoms? Why should mentally ill people not be treated to make them functioning members of society?

>>5182847
I don't have a problem with T, I have a problem with the SJW~y and feminist~y parts of the trans community.

I have a great friend who is a bisexual transgirl and who isn't a SJW or batshit crazy feminist and I wouldn't want to boot her out, however I'd happily remove peoples gay-cards for SJW faggotry or Feminism.

>>5186501
doesnt at all surprise me

>>5194299
This would do the movement a lot more good than arguing over whether trans people are experiencing the right flavor of marginalization

Fuck you faggots,You guys are jealous you cant find a 9/10 big dick alpha husband who will shower you with goodies like me,I support Irans position either you go all out and become a female or you get hanged.Non-genetic girls are the best female body with male intelligence,what more you could ask for,what a fucking dream.

Fags would love to convert men like me to join them with their degeneracy. FUCK OFF AND KILL YOURSELF.

This is an absurdly good idea

>>5194262
There is no treatment for Gender Dysphoria.

Suicide rates are still ridiculously high after transitioning.
They can never truly become the sex they want to be.

>>5196103
I feel compelled to point out that, with modern technologies and care, suicide attempt rates for post-transition MtF and FtM persons are very close to the suicide attempt rates of cis women. While not ideal, it's disingenuous to refer to those rates as ridiculously high.

>>5196182
General pop attempts suicide at like 4-5%?
Trannies attempt it at over 40%.

You gotta a source that says women are attempting suicide at roughly the same rate?

>>5196103
I have GD or whatever you want to call it and I look at it as a mental illness with no cure. It kind of sucks to feel hopeless, but what else could I do if my brain is messed up in that way

are studies about GD even allowed anymore? science has become so overly politicized by dem libs

newmoot really needs to add a /psy/ board and #DropTheT

>>5196280
No I feel for you.
No judgement or hate, but there are a number of transgender people who think they have the human right to disrupt the infrastructure of mentally healthy individuals putting healthy people at greater risk for sexual abuse in public, in order to spare their own feelings.

I don't think this is acceptable.

There is reasonable cause to defend the rights of mentally unhealthy, but I don't think we should set a precedent where the rest of society must conform to an individual's fantasy/delusion/hallucination/unwell feelings.

>>5196103
>Suicide rates are still ridiculously high after transitioning.
They're also ridiculously lower than pre-transitioning. Can you at least acknowledge that you're taking an anti-science and anti-medicine position?

>>5196324
he's not though
stupid trannies try to make it like their position is some enlightened new science when they literally believe they're the opposite sex because they somehow "feel" like them

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>>5196318
>I don't think this is acceptable.
I don't either. I think more work should be put into figuring out why some people think like this instead of bending society around the illness, because given the choice I would not want to feel this way. I'm even a Christian and I believe what I'm doing and feeling is morally wrong

Meanwhile, we have a liberal majority in government that turn every fucking thing into a civil rights issue. Case and point: pic related

>>5196103
>>5196258
Actually, there isn't a statistically significant difference in mortality after they medically transition.
>>An established body of medical research demonstrates the effectiveness and medical necessity of mental health care, hormone therapy and sex reassignment surgery as forms of therapeutic treatment for many people diagnosed with GID… Therefore, be it RESOLVED, that the AMA supports public and private health insurance coverage for treatment of gender identity disorder.

>McHugh does cite one study from 2011, by Cecilia Dhejne, MD and colleagues at Karolinska Institute in Stockholm. However, he misunderstands Dr. Dhejnes work. In the paper, Dr. Dhejne states that the study was not designed to draw conclusions on the efficacy of transgender surgeries, yet McHugh does exactly that. A closer reading of the paper shows that the increased mortality is in those who had surgery before 1989, and that mortality in trans people after 1989 is not statistically different from the general population. A recently published paper by Dr. Dhejne and colleagues shows that the regret rate for those having surgery from 2001-2010 is only 0.3%. Dr. Dhejnes work shows that outcomes for transgender surgery have improved tremendously in the past 30 years, which supports the HHS decision to remove trans exclusions.
>The American Psychiatric Association and the World Professional Association for Transgender Health no longer view transgender identity as inherently pathological. Dr. McHughs views are stuck in the past.

>Dan Karasic, MD Health Sciences Clinical Professor of Psychiatry, UCSF Member, American Psychiatric Association Workgroup on Gender Dysphoria Member, Board of Directors, World Professional Association for Transgender Health
Just because you've deluded yourself into believing your rants doesn't mean real life works that way.

>>5196324
>Can you at least acknowledge that you're taking an anti-science and anti-medicine position?

I think this illuminates a problem in the discussion.
Science is first and foremost a discourse or dialogue with a community.
There is no "anti-science" or "anti-medicine".
There is less supported theory and more supported theory.

Your assumption is that I am "against transitioning".
I would not deny anybody the capacity to do whatever they wanted to their body, or dress however they like, as a woman or man (within social acceptable norms).
Transitioning may indeed help these people in some capacity, but it does not clearly treat the issue in any effective or complete capacity.
There are people who have misinterpreted the medicinal practice of allowing gender dysphoric people to transition as some admission that it is not a mental illness, and believe they are some form of identity that merits activism for its own rights.

I wish for Gender Dysphoria or whatever they are currently calling it to be appropriately classified as a mental illness.

>>5196340
What happened in 1989 that so dramatically changed these numbers?

>>5196381
Well according to all the studies every major organisation cites liike, >>5196340 you're dead wrong about the efficacy.

Also, the AACE lit review says it's a disorder of sex development, that seems more accurate given the bio evidence.http://aace.metapress.com/content/2k70161258g45656/

Don't know if you want to call it anti-science or anti-empirical, but it is kinda childish to claim all the evidence out there and the overwhelming majority of the med community is wrong and insist your arm chair judgments must take precedence over it.

>>5196381
>I wish for Gender Dysphoria or whatever they are currently calling it to be appropriately classified as a mental illness.
GD here and I 100% agree with this. It should also be studied as a mental illness. I believe in God as well, but that doesn't make me anti-evolution. I don't understand why most e-trans can't accept the fact that while there are some politics involved that it is at its core a mental health issue.

As for mortality, I had a friend commit suicide this year so I really don't care what the numbers show. There is a huge problem and it is solving this mental illness.

>so you're anti-trans!
No, I just think the focus should be on the bigger issue. I'm one person with GD and I would rather have restrictions put on my life but research into my disorder funded. I'm one person with GD and I would rather not disrupt the lives of others to accommodate me. I'm one person with GD and I don't want to have GD. It really, really sucks.

I'm not surprised at all. This is the old "Fuck you got mine" attitude. Homosexuals are now more or less socially accepted in the US so they are cutting off the dead weight because why should they ever stand up for anyone but themselves?

A lot of minorities do this once they "make it". Like jews turning on the irish, the black turning on jews and so on.

>>5196415
>insist your arm chair judgments must take precedence

I did grab my initial suicide/attempt numbers from prominent transgender figures who seemed intent on creating alarm about a situation you feel is appropriately resolved.
You're totally right that I didn't devote a lot of time to pulling up or reading studies, mostly because its 4chan and I didn't care that much, but I feel appropriately invested now.

There seems to a significant lack of data regarding suicide/attempt rates after surgeries.
Maybe it's too well highlighted or something, the most I can find is that one particular swedish study that directly studies it.
It samples 300+ people.
The newer UCLA study seems to avoid measuring suicide/attempt rates before and after surgeries, which seems strange to me considering it appears to be pretty thorough.

I will absolutely concede it suggests the efficacy transitioning beyond 1989, though I'm still not sure it's really treating the issue in general.

What is the objective of transitional surgery?
Is the conflict of gender dysphoric individuals simply because they don't visually appear to be the sex they feel they are?
Is it enough for them to visually appear as the sex they feel they are?
If it is a true conflict of sexual identity do they not feel any distress over their inability to procreate or have functional sexual organs or be 100% the biological sex they desire to be even at a genetic level?

It may displace some significant amount, even an effective amount of stress to appear as they want to appear, but does it eliminate all of it?

>>5196645
NOBODY LIKES TRANNIES.

deal with it

>>5196872
>What is the objective of transitional surgery?
to alleviate gender dysphoria which at this point can only be done reliably and efficiently by transitioning. also surgery, i assume you mean SRS though there are multiple different surgeries, are optional and only a part in the process.
>Is the conflict of gender dysphoric individuals simply because they don't visually appear to be the sex they feel they are?
dysphoria is hard to describe and varies. i think the most important part for this discussion is that it very often the cause of crippling depression and social anxieties because of what you described and the social aspects of it. the depression and anxiety fails to be treated with anti depressants and therapy on its own.
>Is it enough for them to visually appear as the sex they feel they are?
the goals differ greatly. but for most it is not only appearing as their gender but also being recognized as their gender. some are never happy with how they look and some are happy with only minor improvements, that depends on the person. some have to have the surgery to be happy and some can and may want to live without the surgery.
> not feel any distress over their inability to procreate
some do some don't. some people don't want kids, some people don't need biological kids, some people have depression over the fact their infertile. that can happen in cis people too.
>have functional sexual organs
i can not talk about trans guys but trans women have functional sexual organs after surgery if the surgeon didn't fuck up. before surgery the sexual organs of neither die off if the person doesn't wish it.
>100% the biological sex they desire to be even at a genetic level?
some do some don't. though genetic is rather irrevelevant. there are XY cis women and XXY males. besides the genitals themselves the hormone levels determine everything that differs between male and female. bone structure, muscles, fat placement and so on.

>>5196872
>>5197151
cont
>but does it eliminate all of it?
some report not thinking about the fact they are trans anymore after years of transitioning and living normal lives.
though it doesn't have to eliminate it at this point. most report that transitioning greatly increased their quality of life and mental health. at this point there is no better treatment and according to the studies that suggest that the problem is a non-plastic part of the brain there is likely no better treatment in sight for a long time.

>>5183307
>thread has 101 unique posters
>now 102 after this post
>IT'S JUST ONE PERSON YOU GUIZ NOBODY ELSE HATES US BUT ONE PERSON

So what you're saying is you're from tumblr?

>>5186512
Only egoraptor and his dick suckers thinks Link to the Past is the best Zelda.

>muh 2D zeldoors!
>muh 2D purity!
>Zeldoor can not be brought into the 3D realm correctly despite it being done several times and is loved by millions

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>milo

>>5197287
You are correct that his propensity for race-mixing is distasteful.

>>5183557
>LGBTBL

That looks retarded as fuck.

>>5194219
People literally say the say about gays you oblivious retard.

>>5196335
>stupid trannies expect me to listen to science and research and brain scans over MUH FEELS that they're gross and wrong and dumb dumb doody heads

>>5197148
>tfw the majority of humans still think faggots should be put to death

>>5201135
underrated post

>>5201141
>tfw the majority of humans still think faggots should be put to death
god i wish

>>5190553
nah let's get this shit right. it's L and G people.

Is it too much to ask for all people to be free and equal?

>>5201131
Gays don't demand their own bathrooms or to use the wrong ones.

They work entirely within the infrastructure of healthy individuals.

>>5186802
>>5186802
>>5186802

>>5205396
>They work entirely within the infrastructure of healthy individuals.
That's not what the majority of normal people think, they think gays are forcing themselves on everyone, redefining marriage, changing the law to benefit them and make it illegal to speak out about against their degeneracy, shoving their perversion into public, and corrupting and abusing children.

>>5203812
Well you're in luck then, the "accepting" crowd are just a loud minority that force their agenda through media and politics.
Most of the word still ignores the deception and see all faggot FREAKS for the mentally ill perverts they are.

>>5182847
I'm not from these parts, but it's a good thing imo.
Treating LGBT as one thing leads to a nasty binarity; either all-in or all-out, especially in politics.

opinions
I have no real problems with people coming to terms with their own sexual desires and deciding they are into same gender exclusively or among others. On the other hand, current state of treatment does not in any way treat dysphorias via operations other than doing a shoddy cosmetic job with no functionality and it seems that is not going to change in a long time.
/opinions


Also, even if it would 'win', nothing will change and people will continue to treat it as one regardless.

>>5206242
just an mtf who wants to die, anon. no need to sperg out

>tfw no right to die

>>5182864
No this move was started by a gay man.

>>5183633
Even then I dont think they give a fuck about him either-he's just a piss stained faggot looking for a paycheck. He's such an attention whore i'm surprised the kardashians haven't inducted him into their klan.

>>5186563
Wasn't it LGB for some time tho? I thought the T was added much later.

>>5186763
>Has taken too many dickings to the head

>>5187676
This is why gay men get so much hate, they think they are superior and think everyone else envies them. Most of y'all look like neanderthals and are such drama whores you cannot stand anyone else getting more attention than you do.

>>5186478
There are so many of them, and its so funny!

>>5192347
Trannies always argue that everyone is out to get them and they are the most oppressed, no surprise they pretend there is a war against them.

>>5194299
Spoken like a true faggot.

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>>5194991
>You are all jealous of my imaginary life!

You ain't fooling no one, hon.

>>5208996
>always
I'm mtf you were replying to. I don't consider myself oppressed or that anyone is out to get me. I also rationally think the T in LGBT is absurd.

It's probably just a vocal majority from the tumblr generation insisting it remains, but just know that there are successfully transitioned transsexuals out there who are on the side of LGB not including unrelated identity issues.

>>5209101
Why is it people always blame tumblr for shit? It isnt the only place on the web thats fucked up. I dont go there, I was talking about on this very board, who I have seen are far more whiny.

>>5208926
Absolutely not. Are you retarded?

>>5209418
sorry I don't frequent this board (this is probably my 10th post ever on it)

i was just using tumblr as a strongly associated stereotype. i don't blame tumblr

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>>5183280

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>>5194991

>>5209565
you're dumb as shit. fuck off

>>5182847
And every organisation cited in the petition has come out to ridicule the author and his manchild alternate reality.
>Lambda Legal
>Nov 9, 2015 — It is unfortunate that we even need to respond to this divisive petition because we did not wish to draw more attention to it, but let us be clear: We reject the call to divide our movement and the wrong-headed reasons offered by those supporting this petition. We are fighting together for an end to discrimination and violence based on sexual orientation as well as gender identity and expression because these are all forms of prejudice and abuses of power that are rooted in hatred, fear and a lack of understanding of those who are perceived as not conforming to gender stereotypes. Transgender people helped lead the way for our movement's liberation at Stonewall and even before then. We are one movement commonly seeking the liberty to be our true and full selves, to be free from acts of bias and to live our lives with dignity. When times get tough – as they have in the recent political loss in Houston, and in the many tragic instances of murder and suicide across the country – we must strengthen our community and our movement for justice, not divide it. Lambda Legal will never stop fighting for all LGBT people and people living with HIV. We will win together.

Getting GLAAD, Lambda and HRC to actually help trannies was the result.

Pretty much your clasical example of blowback. Gotta thank pol for that.

>>5214352
Guess you Could say the petition worked out in the end...

Just not the way op wanted it to.

>>5182847
Good to see >>5214352 >>5187408 showing the petition totally backfired. And it's pretty pathetic that even after /pol/ spammed it everywhere it got so few signatures. They've totally lost their edge.