Scout rifle thread

weird and obsolete.

>>34673678
a neat curiosity from a bygone age. AR-10 does everything better and is more available

>>34673696
rude, how so?

>>34673704
Scout rifle idea pretty much equals "simple, robust and fast all-rounder gun". That's practically what the lever-action rifles already achieved back in 1800s, and did it actually better too. A mag-fed bolt-gun doesn't really offer any major pros over them, other than making it easier to use normal, sharp-tip rifle rounds.

A "scout gun" of 2000s would have to be semi-automatic at very least. Something like SKS is pretty good all-rounder innawoods gun, that does not trigger noguns black-rifle haters instantly.

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Cool enough that I bought one (sorta, HB version with no irons)
It's nice, light, shoots good and mags are cheap. That said I live in a Cuck country so I'd rather just get an AR.

>>34673745
Yes, but the SKS is both heavy and bulky for what the scout rifle ought to be. An M1 carbine in 7.62x39 would be a better approximation and an orgasmic weapon.

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>>34673783
Wouldn't an SKS with a plastic stock qualify then?
you could even use one that could let you mount a long eye relief scope on it.

>>34673759
right there with ya
it was the most combat capable rifle i could buy in my country, as semi automatics are not allowed above .22LR

>>34673811
yeah we arent being disarmed so we can be macheted....
..
.

>>34673811
Yeah that's basically what I was going for. I can't even have semi .22s, so the closest I can get is a remington 7615, which I'll get at some point when they're cheaper. You in the UK?

>>34673696
>>34673703
>>34673783
Spotted the people who have no idea wtf a scout rifle is.

>>34673830
no, i wish
i live in the sad little country of guatemala
gun laws here are strict as shit and our gun violence rate still manages to be unbearably high, imagine that

>>34673851
You don't say?
Well at least you got some semis, it's fucking impossible to get one here unless the gub'mint gives you special pardon basically.

>>34673745
>A "scout gun" of 2000s would have to be semi-automatic at very least.
Why? You say bolt offers little advantage over lever, but auto offers little advantage over bolt.

>>34673783
A scout-rifle should be all-in-one all rounder weapon, which a barebones SKS would fill pertty nicely. It's really not too much heavier than a typical scout gun with a scope on top.

That being said, the VZ-58 with folding stock and a compact 10-20 round magazine + pack of clips would most likely do the trick way better this ay and age. Light and fast, reliable and simple, compact size and decent accuracy. It could be even better in a carbine-length.

>>34673845
>Spotted the people who have no idea wtf a scout rifle is.
I do. An useless side-grade hybrid of old ideas, a jack-of-all-trades gadget that's underwhelming in most cases.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qucXL7GzoVg

>>34673864
>but auto offers little advantage over bolt.
almost 10 times faster rate of fire is a "little" advantage?

Considering even hunters widely use semiautos nowadays, limiting your arsenal to late-1800s designs is quite bizarre.

>>34673866
By definition they're chambered in .308 or neato, have long eye relief scopes and iron sights, and weigh less than 6 pounds. An SKS couldn't be a scout rifle. The ideal scour rifle would be a Mauser or a 700.

>>34673862
what a shame, truly
do you see that ever changing or is the UK permanently against the idea of self defence?

>>34673923
Dunno man, probably. Though a dude in australia just got let off for shooting a robber http://www.firearmownersunited.com/2017/07/25/self-defence-win-as-australian-home-owner-shoots-burglar-and-is-not-charged/
So that's pretty good news for anyone who might want to defend themselves

>>34673866
>>34673875
Jesus christ, go back to /v/ kid. You don't know wtf you're talking about.

>>34673941
you wouldn't believe how much of a pain in the ass it is to defend yourself down here
our defense law has that whole "you have to respond to a threat with measured and appropriate force" meme so people get prison time for using lethal force on an attacker that the (((judge))) deemed wasn't a sufficient threat
and then there's some real 'out there' stuff, like the fact that if you shoot anyone with hollow points in ANY context it's ruled as murder because "hollow points are designed to kill"
to be honest, all laws are severely retarded here, but this one is especially so

>>34673960
How about you go back to leleddit or what the fuck you came from.

>>34673907
>By definition they're chambered in .308 or neato, have long eye relief scopes and iron sights, and weigh less than 6 pounds.
All fine yet old definitions.
You can almost as much done with some smaller calibers than with .308, scope can be planted on almost any rifle, and sub-6 pounds ain't even a challenge this day and age.

>>34673875
It's not 10 times faster. You are exaggerating. Shot recovery, not working the action, is the limiting factor in rate of fire, which is not that important to begin with. Most of the time, the first shot is all that matters.

>>34673979
What in tarnation
That's pants on head retarded.
No shit they're designed to kill, they're fucking bullets.

>>34673678

I'm glad we're having this thread, we haven't had a a scout rifle thread in what? 2 days?


what I'm trying to say is that we have a fucking scout rifle thread ALL THE TIME.

>>34673993
i think they legitimately believe the meme of shooting them in the limbs or """non vital""" body parts so they stop attacking but they don't die
because that's totally how guns work

>>34674003
They must have played too many video games or something.

>>34673992
>It's not 10 times faster
it can literally be.

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I recently bought one of these beauties for an absolute steal of a price
How did i do, /k/?

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>>34673678

I recently bought a savage scout 11, while I get the arguments that there are better guns than the scout concept, I thoroughly enjoy this particular fun. I don't have an optic on it currently, but I suspect that once I get one I'll enjoy it even more.

>>34673989
>b-better say he's from reddit

If it's not .308 then it's not a fucking scout rifle. Name me one sub 6-pound semi auto that meets the criteria for a scout rifle. "Old definitions" wtf are you talking about. Jeff Cooper came up with the concept in the 80s. There is no "new" definition of a scout rifle. It's either a scout rifle or it isn't. Everything you suggested definitely isn't. Do you want to acknowledge that you're talking out your ass, or would you prefer to embarrass yourself some more?

>>34674036
noice
what did it cost you?
how is the trigger?

>>34674019

what did you pay?

>>34673875
topkek gr8 b8 m8

>>34674046

I have not played with the accutrigger or whatever its called, whatever the factory setting is currently works for me. Its my third gun so I'm still on the far lower end of the learning curve and I take things at my own pace. Someday I'll play around with it and see if a different setting works better.

I got it for 520 new.

>>34674057
god fuckin damn what a steal
nice going, anon

>>34674038
>If it's not .308 then it's not a fucking scout rifle
so if 8mm Mauser would be more popular, and I'd made a 1:1 copy of any scout rifle out there in said caliber, yet made the gun even lighter and have lower recoil... it'd not be a scout rifle?

Didn't know scout-kids were this autistic about the definition. Practically the same as saying "it's not a REAL Assault rifle if it doesn't fire 7.92 Kurz!".

>>34674063
it literally wouldn't
how hard is it to grasp that things have set rigid definitions
it could be *almost* a scout rifle or *essentially pretty much* a scout rifle, but it wouldn't be a scout rifle
just like an ar15 is not an assault rifle
it might also be able to do all the things a scout can do and more, and be better at it, but if it doesn't fit the definition, it's not a scout rifle

>>34674063
You suggested a VZ 58 or an SKS could be a scout rifle and you're gonna say I'm the autistic one? Neither of those rifles fit a single one of the criteria.

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>>34673678
All I want is a modern bolt gun, with a Mauser style stock, iron sights, slick as fuck 60° throw, and accepts modern mag designs (pmags, g3 mags, etc). I just like bolt actions, and I like plinking at random shit around the farm.

If you actually use the firearm for anything other than fun, scout rifles are pretty outdated. You aren't dealing with precise sub moa shots with one, so a semiauto works fine.

>>34674063

The concept of the Scout Rifle does have an accepted definition, and Cooper settled on .308/7.62NATO as *the* chambering.
His main concern was finding ammo, anywhere.

However, as he aged and tinkered with the concept, he did addendum that a standard chambering of .308 Winchester/7.62×51mm NATO or 7mm-08 Remington for locales that forbid civilian ownership of cartridges in chamberings adopted by military forces or for its "slightly better ballistics."

As Cooper wrote, "A true Scout comes in .308 or 7mm-08."

The .243 Winchester is an alternative for young, small-framed, or recoil-shy people, but needs a 22" barrel.

Cooper also commissioned "Lion Scout," chambered for the .350 Remington Magnum cartridge.

>>34674086
That's retarded but I like it. Looks like some mad max shit.

>>34674086
i was enjoying this picture until i spotted the pistol grip

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Is it possible for an AR to achieve the same role? Is the bolt action a necessity?

>>34674113
Jeff Cooper said a semi auto scout rifle is possible as long as it meets the weight/accuracy/compactness requirements. 99.9% of the time, they're bolt-action.

>>34674113
Yes. I'd say so. A modern AR or one of the many semi-autos available today with any number of modern optics could do the job, and probably better.

>>34674113
According to purists ITT, no.
According to me, who only cares about the intended role and behavior of the "scout rifles", yes. In fact, a sporty semi like in your pic would IMO be way smarter choice now in the 21st century; easily available ammo and parts, light weight and accurate, good enough to drop a durr and anything smaller, and obviously OK for self-defense against other people.

>>34674113
you stop that!
i don't want to get a boner at work

I'm building a scout concept rifle.

Base Rifle is a Remington 700 SPS Tactical with the 16in barrel. In .223

I have a bolt on clip slot machined for the rear reciever ring and will be able to load from stripper clips. The front base will sport a Burris fast fire red dot. Add a Willams or Lyman rear peep sight and a tech sights Marlin front assembly and I'll have a nice all a round Urban bolt gun

>>34674059

thanks, i'm pretty happy with my purchase. i realize savage isn't exactly top of the line or anything, or so some people say, but i decided to go with the savage scout for both the price and because i've been particularly happy with a mk.ii i got for plinking. i got a marlin that may end up being a total lemon and id like to avoid the experience of being frustrated with a new fun as much as possible.

if i had one complaint it would be the magazine, and only because spares are sort of expensive, and it feels unnecessarily bulky. its not the sort of thing that would fit efficiently in a carry vest, at least by the looks of it.

>>34674304
the mags are pretty blocky, yeah.
but i think that's something that can be worked around
shame about the marlin, buy would you mind telling me in more detail what went wrong? i was considering getting one of them as my first gun before i decided to get the scout, and i wonder what would have happened if i did buy it

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HOW DO YOU DO FELLOW LIGHTWEIGHT RIFLES

>>34673678
Dumb now that red dots and reliable semi auto exists, but I like the Ruger scout. I would mount the scope on normally though.

>>34674348
hi, handsome

>>34674348

Is that a magazine or are you just happy to see me

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I love my scout

>>34674348
What scope is that? I've been wanting to switch to a good ler scope. This one's mine with an aimpoont >>34674606

>>34674617
Vortex Scout 2-7x
5/5 breddy gud

>>34673923
I would like to think so. I know that UKIP wanted to lift the handgun restrictions and have stronger self defence laws. Though they have faded into obscurity. A couple of years ago my (now ex) girlfriends boss shot gunned his daughter and grand daughter to death at their farm. Turned out it was an illegal puppy farm. Ex didn't know at first, though she obviously found out later and reported it. Was fun dropping her off there and seeing police everywhere. Even weirder watching the news seeing pictures of someone you have met.

Shit like that makes people knee jerk to ban everything. Exactly like Dunblane.

I'm saving, after I have bought some other things I'm applying for my FAC and getting something to shoot on my nans farm

>>34674013
Only if it's full auto.

>>34673783
Isnt that a mini 30?

>>34673864
>Putting fast, consecutive shots on a target without disrupting your sight picture has no advantage over a bolt action

>>34674348
hi daddy

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if you have to bring a rifle, at least make sure you bring a proper one.
Faggots

>>34674036
>I dont have an optic on a gun that is/was designed to not have an optic.
>what is a scout rifle even?

>>34674621
What rings ?

What's the fucking point when AR-15's exist?

>people more concerned with following rigid guidelines set by a man who never saw combat and was trapped with the tech of the 80s rather than the concept of a relatively light, versatile rifle that defines the scout rifle concept
Missing the cocksucking forest for the trees, Cooper had some good ideas but his acolytes need to be slapped around a bit.

>>34674113
Yes. Original AR-10's fit weight requirements, now all we need to do is commission manufacturers to start making pencil barrels again.

>>34673745
Levers are heavier and weaker than turn bolts. Detachable box magazine is infinitely better than tubular under every concievable situation. The difference in rate of fire is negligable. Levers are akward as fuck to work if prone or firing from a supported position. Levers are more difficult to clean than bolts.

Jesus, I can't think of a single advantage lever rifles have over a bolt gun. And wouldn't you know it, neither did the rest of the world when the turn-bolt design was universally adopted over lever actions at the turn of the century. Don't get me wrong, they're fucking cool. But in no way are they superior to bolt action

>>34675506
Pencil barrels are fucking stupid on a 5.56 rifle. That's doubly so for .308. They stopped making them because everyone realized the relatively minimal weight savings was not worth barrel whip and stringing that rivaled spaghetti noodles

>>34675789
Gee anon I guess you better tell the guys at FNH...

>>34674904

look closely at >>34674036 and you will notice that it comes with a rail for a scope

the factory irons are bretty good though, i'd just like to see how far i can send lead accurately

>>34674324

yeah so first the ejector would stop working after a few rounds. i replaced it with a "bear proof" ejector, and since then that particular issue has not reappeared

the next problem came with the screw that holds the forearm in place. it keeps breaking, sometimes it takes 20-25 shots but for a few replacements it broke immediately. i contacted marlin and they said they'd send me two new ones that are stronger, according to the person i talked to on the phone... and they never showed up. i called again, said the same thing, and now i wait.

i will not sell that gun, but i regret buying it.

>>34675656
>Levers are heavier and weaker than turn bolts.
Okay sure but it's not like they suffer reliability issues regardless
>Detachable box magazine is infinitely better than tubular under every concievable situation
Yeah sure if we are talking semi autos or shotguns. What real gain do you get with it out of a scouting rifle that you really aren't going to shoot more than a couple rounds from even if you do have to use it?
>The difference in rate of fire is negligable
100% Bullshit. Bitch about cowboy action all you want but when it comes to ROF bolt actions can sit the hell down
>Levers are akward as fuck to work if prone or firing from a supported position.
Confirmed for never actually have shot a levergat. It's not any worse than the majority of bolt action guns. Unless you are completely unable to can't the gun 15 degrees to the side for whatever reason.
>Levers are more difficult to clean than bolts.
This is true but they can run a long fucking time without issue with decent lubrication.

>>34673704
Because the AWB sunset in 2004 and now the commercial market is flooded with .308 semiautomatics.

I'll give Jeff Cooper the credit he deserves, but the guy said and wrote shit that was relevant at the time, was later superseded, and is still parroted (most often incorrectly or in the wrong context) by fudds to this day.

Even MARSOC finally replaced their 1911s with glocks. Welcome to 2017.

>>34673678
I made my own version for shtf. Cost of current build is a little less than $3700 to include gunsmith cost. Total spent on trial and error probably almost 8k.

New version Winchester 70 long action 30-06
20inch proof carbon barrel 1:10 sporter profile
Mcmillan hunters edge stock aics magwell
Dovetail barrel iron sights folding leave and hooded folding front
2 piece talley light weight rings
USO 1-10× scope with internal level mildot

Weight is 9lbs with optics and loaded

I have a cheek riser that holds 5 rounds of 175gr fgmm for ranges above 600yds

Mags usually are loaded with 168gr fgmm which gives me my best group of 0.38moa, avg of 0.5moa. Ive had success with match ammo while hunting elk. If shtf happens, i have data sheets for fmj and remington ammo. With federal american eagle 150gr i get about 1 inch moa. With remington core lokt, 1.5inch.

>>34677831
Marsoc replaced 1911s because it was cheaper to get glocks and marines are poor. Also the 1911 requires trained gunsmiths familiar with the system, which are rare and few outside the competition units.

>>34677897
What happened is that they replaced their 1911s with a lower cost, functionally superior alternative that requires less specialized maintenance.

1911s are neat, but I got it out of my system with the one I own and I don't plan on buying any more.

>>34677775
Why did you bother refuting every point individually if every answer was going to be "NUH UH"?

>>34677865
You must be some kind of lunatic. Why make a scout rifle that costs 3700+? You don't really have a scout rifle, that's basically a precision rifle set up

The ability to shoot all 308 is a plus. A semi auto might not cycle with sub sonic loads. The ruger gsr is threaded so a suppresser would make a great shtf addition

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>>34673678
idk about the concept but the rifle is fine

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>>34678078

>>34678012
Your entire post was your opinions, what else was he supposed to do

>>34674348
>>34674606

lel these shits literally weigh double a scout rifle

>>34677865
>Scout rifle
>9 lbs

Bruh

>>34678196
Congrats, you got my joke

>>34674063
Iirc Cooper also used the term "psuedo scout"
I love scout rifles btw, but prefer my leveractions

>>34674012
>>34674003
it does make sense if you don't consider the fact the a warning shot might hit somebody

>>34675257
Sorry, can't remember at all.

>>34675789
>Pencil barrels are dumb because of POI shift
>Scout rifle
Anon, it's not supposed to be a combat rifle. Heat stringing is irrelevant.

Ruger scout looks fun

but its like $1400 here in leafland, fuck that

>>34674135
shouldn't a scout rifle be able to kill a bear?

>>34678176
>Opinions

I guess, In the same way that 9mm is an effective man stopper. While technically an opinion, it's one widely held and with observable evidence

an AR10 completely shits on the concept

>>34673678
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueaDzUieuS4
I own one of these which is technically a scout rifle, bretty good desu

>>34678278
Nah, first shot accuracy is fine but you shoot more than 5 rounds of .308 that's a problem. Hell, even shooting at a range under ideal conditions you're going to get poi shift. 8 oz isn't worth the 15minutes between groups. The rest of the world has already figured this out

>>34678050
Its my version of a scout rifle, if it makes a difference to you, it weighs 7lbs unloaded and without sling which meets the weight requirement of 7.7lbs

Yes i catered it toward a precision rifle set up. My idea is, light weight to move around, 30-06 for ammo availability, and high ish power mil scope to range objects, and accurate out to 1000yds for "scout sniping" in dreamer shtf scenario.

>>34678212
9lbs with optic, loaded 30-06 mags, and sling. Unloaded and without sling its 7lbs which meets the requirement.

Btw aics 10rnd mags with 30-06 is heavy, and my leather sling is also sort of heavy.

Ill admit my rifle is essentially a light weight precision long range rifle.

>>34678433
30-06 for availability? Do you live in Alaska or something?

I guess more than anything it seems like you liked the idea of a scout rifle, then ignored it while constraining your precision build to arbitrary requirements. But hell, if you like it and you have money to blow I guess

>>34673696
Fpbp

>>34677865
What a waste of fuckin money lol

>ctrl f "scout shotgun"
>not found

wasn't that in a 1942 or somthing

>>34678455
Worse, was in california at the time when i first started my build. 2012 gun panic showed me 308 was impossible to find for almost 2 years, yet 30-06 could be found everywhere. Its still a very common round found everywhere.

And i didnt move away from the idea, I hit the requirements, and was able to have it serve dual purpose as a precision long range rifle. I guess my concept was more toward "scout sniping" train of thought.

>>34678617
Wasnt a waste for me, cause now I have my ideal rifle, exactly how I want it. And during the majority of the trial and error I had a no worries income at the time.

>>34678630
How would one work, wouldn't it just be any solid pump gun?

>>34678317
Too heavy

>>34678196
I'm not a pussy and can carry weight

>>34674019
>absolute steal of a price
defined as?

>>34674135
What does that gun do that an M4 carbine couldn't?

Scout rifle is a dumb af idea now that design and technology have moved on. It barely even made sense in Cooper's time.

>>34673678
I like the concept but all the ways its been executed have been all wrong

Ruger scout >plastic magwell
Steyr scout > too rare and too wierd
Marlin model 1895sbl > literally just a lever-action

>>34678433
$8000
1.5 MOA

lmao, should have just bought a scar and nice variable

>>34680741
The plastic mag well is actually not bad. I thought it would be a problem when I realized it had one, but I've used the shit out of it and never had a problem with the mag well. Really, it's just a liner and the structural parts are either wood laminate or metal

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>>34673678
This thread has happend. Search for it.

>>34674038
>If it's not .308 then it's not a fucking scout rifle
Wrong. Cooper allowed for 7mm-08 as well. The idea was a 3kg rifle that could kill a 300kg animal at 300m. With some newer full power cartridges that are ideal for use in the bush like 6.5CM and .458, I don't think Cooper would be too upset.

As the AR-10 matures and we get lighter models, a semi-auto iteration of the scout rifle could appear in the next decade. It may not fit the form Cooper envisioned 30 years ago, but it will fulfill the function of a handy, light, powerful rifle that works when you need it to.

>>34675789
POI shift on light 5.56 barrels is negligible with modern metallurgy. InRange just did a video on it. With .308 you're right though, you can't just do a pencil barrel, fluted maybe.

>>34680710
>It barely even made sense in Cooper's time.
It made sense to Cooper due to him being a belligerent drunk.

>>34673678
Most people on /k/ don't even know what a scout rifle is supposed to be. They think tossing a scope on an M1A makes it a scout rifle, which is patently false.
>>34674113
Is it chambered for a round big enough for the Dark Continent? under 3 kg?

>>34681791
It made to sense to cooper as he was a safari hunter. Scout rifles are for carrying often and shooting rarely, not the other way around. They are decidedly NOT range rifles.

>>34680710

Shoot .308s?

Be more reliable?

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What's the point anymore? You can just assemble a lightweight AR-10 build with a fixed power low magnification scope, which would give you greater magazine capacity and modularity.

Also, I don't think the Steyr Scout's accuracy holds up today. ~2 MOA out of a bolt gun is atrocious by today's standards and even a basic bitch AR-10 would meet or exceed that while being semi-auto.

>>34680745
1.5moa with cheapest shit ammo. Sometimes i get sub moa sometimes i dont, thats the problem with shit ammo. And rifle is 3700 total, not 8k. 8k is total spent on different stocks, and optics. So the 4k i spent extra equals to a schmidt and bender 5-25, a manners t chassis, and a vortex razor. So its not like i bought a bunch of cheapo shit thats laying around lmao.

Why is everyone hung up on the cost? 3700 isnt that expensive for what I have. Look at GAP and tac ops, those are 4k+ rifles. Mine came out cheaper, and lighter than those, with almost same accuracy.

>>34673845
The Jeff Cooper Scout Rifle Concept is:
>bolt action
>blind magazine for ""simplicity""
>stripper clip guides
>1.5x LER scope on a fixed, non QD mount, no other optic allowed
>fixed iron sights too
>chambered in .308 or .30-06 ONLY unless you have a vagina, in which case 7mm-08 is acceptable
>wood stock with Monte Carlo stock
>equipped with a Ching Sling, no other styles or clones allowed
Anything else isn't a Jeff Cooper Scout Rifle.

And obviously, a Jeff Cooper Scout Rifle is fucking retarded.

>>34674019
Unless you got it new in box for under $350, you fucked up bigtime.

>>34682925
>bolt action
Yes, SA at top end still cant rival BA at top end
>magazine
Yes, easier for transportation of ammo, and reloads
>stripper clips
Yes, but obsolete now that magazines are plentiful
>what you said about scopes
Wrong, a variable was fine, and my 1-10× can do everything a 1.5x fixed can do. And at that time period qd mounts were shit, nowadays they are good to go.
>iron sights
Yes
>chambered in 308 or 3006
Wrong, he preffered those rounds because of milsurp and availability, but he wasnt dead set on them.
>wood stock with monte carlo style
Wrong, i dont even know where u got this one from
>ching sling only
Wrong, i dont know where you got this one from either