*challenges your 5th gen supremacy*

Maybe they should first start the "serial" production of the 12 or so they were gonna order before they challenge anything, Pyotr.

>>34582457
>catches fire on the tarmac

>>34582457
*doesnt even have the planed engines, but only got non stealth covered ones*

>>34582457
>stealth
Not with these Soviet engines, Ivan

>>34582457
Question from a retard.
Are those rivets? wouldn't they disrupt stealth?
It seems like there's a huge amount of heat coming form those engines, wouldn't it also disrupt the stealth?
Can somebody who's not vatnik or burger answer that?

>>34582457
What, all 5 of them?

>>34582518
>Are those rivets? wouldn't they disrupt stealth?
If you want to get to below a certain level of radar getting reflected: yes. If you arent even near that level to begin with, why bother with it.
>It seems like there's a huge amount of heat coming form those engines
Those arent the planed engines, they literally just slapped others onto it, since they ran out of funds, they are also by no means stealthy in the radar department. The heat itself aint such a big problem, keep in mind there are still the exhausts from the engines, which will light up way more on every infrared detecting system.

>>34582518
Yes.

Yes.

Heat isn't really an issue for the kind of stealth 5th gen fighters use, which is just a really low RCS. Pretty much nobody's fighters have cool enough engines to make a noticeable difference in thermal detection.

They started with good ideas then slav'd up production when they realized rivets and shitty engines would be a lot cheaper and didn't require as much skilled labor.

>>34582457
Look how fucking dirty those planes are, it's supposed to be a photoshot yet they didn't bother to even wash them.
Also do planes like f35 require some special cleaning substance or jutst bucked with water is enough?

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>>34582561
>Pretty much nobody's fighters have cool enough engines to make a noticeable difference in thermal detection.


Nozzle design and bypass ratio have a significant effect on IR signature.

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>>34582561
>>34582737

>>34582568
Your average Ivan would be actually proud that these planes are working hard to protect the Mother Russia.

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>>34582457
*challenges your claim to 5th gen*

>>34582457
Does it tho?

>>34582930
God, I love how horrible the PAKFA is.

>>34582457
>wants to challenge 5th gen; can't find it.

>>34582545
So...it's basically just a showroom piece?

F-22 has been around since Sept. 7th 1997.

In less than 2 months it turns 20 years old and is still the king of the sky.
That's kind of embarrassing for anyone else trying to compete.

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>>34582457
NO

S DUCTS

D
U
C
T
S

>tfw when you get jet engine modulation from the PAK-FA
>tfw you can easily do Non-Cooperative Target Recognition on the PAK-FA
>tfw you can program your plane to label the PAK-FA radar returns to read "Hi, I'm a retarded russian rustbucket, please rape my face"

>>34583068
It's not really possible for anybody to compete to be honest burgers will just throw money at the problem till it's not a problem anymore.

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>>34582457
No S-ducts, uses previous aircraft's radar and engines.

>>34583244
That's because freedom isn't free. It's actually closer to $180mil per unit

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>>34582457
>muh side facing AESA array
Reminder that the side facing array is an inferior solution, the Euro triangles solved it in a far better way.

Russia can't afford anything good in meaningful quantities.

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>>34582457

This programme has failed.
Time to move on, Vatniks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Vhpex6VU-Q&index=25&list=PLSimkl4926qOcVaimLS7Sexdzk0Oa2OCr

>>34583025
Yes and no. It is rather a not fully finished plane that get shoved into everyones face for propaganda reasons. Time will tell, either it stays too long in this state and then it actually makes more sense to make the next version or they finally will have enough money and reason to finish it. At the moment its greatest worth is to learn from what they build and to distract the russboo masses with the fake vibe of being on par with others in that department.

>>34583289
>Russia can't afford anything good. They also can't afford anything not bad in reasonable quantities
Fix'd

3000 F-35
0
0
0

F
-
3
5

>>34583283
how the f this radar works? does it rotate ? and can't it face forward?

>>34582457
*Fails*

>>34583342
Yes, it's a rotating AESA.
Beam steering allows it to look forward at all times and through rotation cover a massive 200 degree arc.

>>34582568
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyHjkJGoMuk

Looks like mostly water with spray cans of aviation-specific foam soap.

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>>34582737
The F135, for instance, has a complex multi-layer liquid cooled exhaust assembly.

>>34582457
>RCS of 0.5-0.1 m2
>no S-ducts
>no rotating AESA
>no production engines
>inferior missiles compared to adversaries
Will-get-raped-by-eurofighter/10

>>34583025

It's a ploy to get the Indians to keep Russian aircraft development going. The first clean-sheet fighter design since the USSR, you can bet there is a lot going on behind the scenes. Especially going by how unhappy the Indians are, and the fact Russia has ordered more Su-35S instead of more than a token 12 PAK FA jets.

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>>34582518
It's not a final version of engine. Tests of final version on an actual plane are going to begin in the end of 2017

>>34584533
>Will-get-raped-by-gripen/10
FTFY
>>34586695
I don't think the russian economy will last until then.

>>34583488

Also of note is the front of that nozzle which shows the cold air bypass

>>34586695
>that webm

That plane has been rusting outside for years and its been that way since before the pak program started.

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>dude inlet blockers lmao

literally where the us was in the 60s

>>34582457
>gets shot

>>34582457
The only thing the PAK-FAilure will threaten is is the russian economy and russian-Indian relations.

>All the amerifat denial in here

Why are you all so intimidated by Sukhoi T-50?

>amerifat
>p-lease give me (You)s
>i beg you, i neeeed them, baaaaaawwww

>>34582511
Seriously, no S ducts. I could make a missile hit one with 100 bucks and a raspberry pi

>>34589806
kek this

>>34582737
>>34582746

Source?

>>34589880
>intimidated by Sukhoi T-50
You know how you laughed at the retarded kids at school who desperately tried to eat sand cake?
Or how you laugh at the drunk fuck on the beach trying to wear his pants as a shirt?
It's the same with the PAK-FA.

>34589880
If you want a (you) you're going to have to sprinkle in a 'fatnik' and 'jingoist' somewhere in there.

>>34589880
>denial
You should not use words you don't fully understand, Ivan.

>>34590323
Well I personally believe in polite discourse, and respect of all of our corresponding nationalities.

>>34590433
>>34590323
>>34590302
>all of this Amerimanlet insecurity
Why are you all so thin-skinned towards criticism? And i bet that's the only thing about Americans that can be described as thin

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>>34582457
>weapon bay doors worse fitted than a Home Depot cupboard
Just fuck my RCS up fa m

>>34590708
>Rust & corrosion streaks on the ducts

What the fuck material are the Pooviets using to build this thing?

>>34590686
I'll have you know that I'm an absolute skeleton, I'm so skinny that if i was conscripted into the Russian military I'd probably be raped to death within an hour of getting off the bus.

>>34582457
>be PAK-FA
>be less stealthy than 4th gen aircraft its supposed to be better than
>have same shitty engines and avionics as previous vatnik aircraft
>never get used due to high risk of getting dunked on by F-22, F-35, F/A-18E/F, Eurofighters, and Rafaels
>so garbage that indians don't even want it
>indians
>the feces species
>don't even want your shit

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>>34590806
>feces species

>>34590686
>criticism
>denial
Ivan, you'd have to discuss and criticise american gear before those come into play.
We're just laughing at russias monkey-see-monkey-do plane here.

>>34582457
>Russians never heard of counter sunk rivets
Wew lad

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>>34582457
*dominates you in in the air*

>>34582737

Do you even know what bypass ratio is? Of course you don't. If you did, you'd know that all fighter jet engines bypass 0% of the air that enters them.

>>34582457
It may have a huge RCS, shitty Russian engines and many other flaws but the PAK-FA is the best looking combat aircraft around.

Way better looking then the F-35 and its usable internal volume.

>>34591694
Are you from 1959?

>>34591694
Turbofans in fighters has been a thing for half a century.

>>34591601
Will Ivan ever recover from this?

Why is this board so anti-Russian?
Russians are only thing preventing Western elites from going wild. Some balance of power is necessary.
That said PAK-FA looks like it's semi-stealthy at best.

>>34582457

AWACS SKY EYE
<Today's my birthday.>

>>34592417
I honestly believe it's because nobody here was alive during the cold war, so they feel like they missed out on the whole "fuck the russians" age, so they just continue their parents legacy or something.

>>34590803
As if the russian military can afford busses....

>>34592417
It's not that the board is Anti-Russian, it's that the Russians are that drunk guy who thinks he's hot shit and talks about how he could kick everyone's ass, and might have been able to—40 years ago.

But now he's just a fat drunkard without the money to back up his bullshit claims, so he keeps lying to try and seem like he's still got it.

Russia is even less of a balance of power to the west than Brazil.

>>34583472
It's called prop wash, it comes in these little one pint concentrate cans and in 55 gallon drums.

>>34592473
This board is very blatantly anti Russian, most threads about Russia devolve into infographics and shit flinging about muh winter war/Ukraine/balt butthurt etc.

Russia and China are the only balance of power to the West.

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>>34582457
*overtakes your 4.75gen with real funding*

>>34592417
>Why is this board so anti-Russian
Something happened around 2014. Before that the relation between /k/ and russians were more tongue-in-cheek, there where definite romanticism around the chechen war, IVAN CHESNOKOV, funny russian prototypes and what have you. My tank vs. Your tank threads where more banterish than hostile.
Then the Maidan revolution happened and /k/ had daily clanketing threads, greatly appreciateing the stalkerish aesthetics of the protests.
Suddenly there was a flood of really fucking obnoxious pro-russian posters who where openly hostile to everything not russian, pushing kreml propaganda and had an understanding of the board culture like someone who had read a briefing composed by a bored bureaucrat.
The really rampant russian nationalism, ROSSYIA STROOONK XAXAXA, how can amerifats even compete???, blaming of homonazi CIA Jews, armata and PAK-FA shilling really made pretty much everyone not russian and Serb hate them.

>Russians are only thing preventing Western elites from going wild. Some balance of power is necessary

You not nessecarily being russian, this is exactly what makes people so wary of russians. Unironically pushing russia as a white knight fighting against (((western imperialists))) when russia is ruled by thieving oligarchs headed by a KGB stooge hellbent on forcing russian influence on unwilling neighbours.

>>34592507
Can you blame us with the constant, blatant and obvious Russian propagandists and revisionist shills?

Modern Russia's greatest contribution to contemporary weapons is cheap civilian ammo and cheap milsurp. They lack the resources to be relevant in any other way. The greatest threat they pose to the west is if they completely collapse and cause yet another wave of unwashed, uneducated, uncivilized refugees to flood into civilized parts of the world bringing their culture of filth, crime and laziness with them.

>>34592511
I'm sure that the J20 has all kinds of issues that we don't know about, but I can at least appreciate that the Chinese have gotten something at least somewhat credible into service.

>>34592585

If the J-20 was going really well, they wouldn't also be buying Su-35S from the Russians. Though, that might partially be because they are looking to copy upgrades for their J-11 fleet.

>>34582518
The fact you can even see the rivets means it's not stealth. Part of the stealth capabilities in the F-22 and 35 (and possibly the J20, thieving fucking chinks) come from a radar-deflecting coating based on the same system as the B-2. Rusky jet clearly lacks this, the rivets would be covered otherwise.

t. former stealth coatings maintainer

>>34592543
Basically this.

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>>34582483
>catches fire on the tarmac
Yes, and?
Just couldn`t pass this, lol.

>>34592417
its because the Russians are worse than Ausies when it comes to shitposting, but theyre not being ironic. Every thread started by a blatant Vatnik is just jerking off about "muh military might" or "muh f-35 is so weak" or "muh capatalism corrupts the people". Seriously, Russians always try to start shit on this website, and you cant argue them because they learned english off the tags on their track suits.

>>34592638
I always had the impression the intended role of the J-20 is more comparable to the Su-34 (deep strike fighter bomber) so it would make sense to have more Su-35s for air superiority and air defence.

>>34593284

They aren't buying so many Su-35S as to be a major part of their air force, only 24 or so. It is quite obviously because they need some of the developments from this aircraft because their military aviation industry is still behind the Russians in some key areas.

So was the idea for the PAK-FA hatched when a visiting American accidentally sat on a model of a Su 27?

>>34587737
>That plane has been rusting outside for years and its been that way since before the pak program started.
Well, it's pretty old footage, IIRC.

>>34593306
Considering how blatantly they ripped the Russian off the last time they purchased planes from them it was suprising they even sold them their newest fighter - but that might just show how desperately their defence industry needs money and contracts.
But obviously these 24 Su-35s are just for 'research'. I bet they would have even only ordered a few planes and 24 was the bare minimum the Russians agreed on.

>>34582930
criminally underrated

>>34583472
I am extremely turned on by this video

The PAK FA is not a real contender in this race. It's probably a decent enough fighter, but it's not quite to the level of the F-22. This shouldn't be a surprise to anyone consider the comparative military budgets of the US and Russia. I think they're doing quite well with what they have.

It is, however, unlike what some people claim, a useful thing for the Russians to have. With it they are still able to gain useful experience without necessarily having to invest in building many examples. If the geopolitical climate changes to the point that Russia feels it needs them, they have the ability to build them. Meanwhile, they can refine the design and put it towards the next fighter if that ends up being more practical.

>>34583309
the point of a test aircraft is to find the flaw of the design to fixed it

meanwhile F-35 burn because of tailwind

>>34592543

>all this nonsense

No. What happened was that /k/ used to be multi-national. You had Germans, Brits, Yanks, Aussies, Russians, etc etc. Any nation with an active internet was here and everything could be discussed to some extent with some minor bullshit between them which was equivalent to the bantz.

Then came the redditors and retards. This was shown by the increase in prep threads (there was always at least 1 or 2 but out of 100 or so threads? It kept to itself) and the ARfags (mostly newfags and, obvious why, reddit tier Americans) who ruined every possible thread with their bullshit.

Notice how the Skinwalker threads are repetitive as fuck instead of creepy original ghost stories that are either spergtastic or actually well done?

This stopped the interesting and creative threads where people would fact post and give anecdotes and instead we got roleplayers from meme-centric parts of the internet who thought they were in good company.

The majority of /k/ left at that point to greener pastures and left the memelords, Russians and MAGA faggots who don't realise that shits changed and the guys making the good content all fucked off.

This is the case with alot of boards including /x/, /tg/, /pol/ and a few others.

>>34589806
It doesn't threaten their economy. R&D is a necessary expense for any nation hoping to remain technologically competitive, at least regionally if not globally. If the Russians ever want to diversify their economy beyond selling oil, they need to make investments like these.

>>34591087
Where do you see rivets that aren't flush?

>>34593353
>This stopped the interesting and creative threads where people would fact post and give anecdotes and instead we got roleplayers from meme-centric parts of the internet who thought they were in good company.

I remember some nigger trying to RP as a skinwalker, saying they're actually parasites and other bullshit here and the thread hit the bump limit. That shit was so fucking cringey.

>/tg/

Went to complete shit once everyone tried to do quest thread bullshit and forced the drawfags and contentfags away. Early on there were tripfags who actually posted shit like obscure rulebooks and artbooks, but they all got crowded out by CHECK OUT MY LATEST QUEST THAT I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I'M DOING HAVE NO DIRECTION OR STORY TO TELL BUT ITS """"""""""""""INTERACTIVE""""""""""""" SO IT'S AMAZING!

I will never not be salty over how questniggers ruined /tg/ for all time.

>>34592543
The proper response to stupidity isn't to meet it in kind. I wonder how many of these pro-Russian posters are even Russian.

>>34593353
What drives away the international crowd is /pol/ leaking.
Anyone coming out as a Swede will be met with SWEDEN YES, cuckposting and accusations of being Muslim slaves, French will likewise be called Mohammad, Morrocans and niggers, Brits are all Muslim, noguns fags, etc etc. Since the /pol/ faggotry spills over in any thread touching anything related to France, UK, Sweden and the like it's nigh on impossible to have a good discussion with an international component.
The hate for russians on the other hand is brought on by themselves, the vatnik meme is not of /pol/ origin like the rest.
Incidentally, vatniks are serious offenders when it comes to /pol/ posting.
Go to a thread where someone is cuck posting France or sweden and start badmouthing russia.
Surprisingly often the shitposter flips his lid, being a vatnik out to stir shit.

>>34592638
It's very possible, even likely, that they purchased the plane just to reverse-engineer the AL-117S engine. Chinese difficulties in developing engines has been what has held back their indigenous aircraft development most of all.

>>34593399

>the proper response

is to ban anyone who posts maliciously on /k/.

Bantz are fine. The problem is that the Fatniks and Vatniks aren't welcome on either side. We can't even have threads about either nation now because the Fatniks appear and start going MURICA and the Vatniks respond in kind.

It's literally why any thread about navies boils down to MUH RAMPS posting when nothing else gets talked about.

/k/ just needs low tolerance moderation to crush the faggots who keep posting for responses.

>In December 2014, Russia’s United Aircraft Corporation announced that production of the fighter was ready to begin in 2016.

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>>34593490

>>34592934
Afaik not all of the prototypes have RAM.

>>34593873
Do any?

>>34593138
>1/5 prototypes lights up
>1/180 production builds
There's a difference, buddy.

>>34593490
>"Fatnik" is just a lazy attempt to try to make the facts "wrong" because they don't support the Russian propaganda
>Lazy mimicry insult
Vatniks can't do anything right.

>>34593954

There are already over 230 F-35s.

>>34586695
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTCGJAoAz_8

>>34594302
I was referring to at the time of the fire.

>>34582457
Damn, not even in service yet and it's already been put through a trash compactor.

>>34593490
>implying that vatniks and "fatniks" are on par
Dropped the whole post.

>>34583275
has the f22 ever done anything

>>34583025
Just like everything else in the Russian military. It's all just a circus act to inspire patriotism in their own civilian populace and fear in the civilian populaces of other nations.

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>>34593958
Clapnik is better desu

>>34596210
Using Clap-, Shart- and Fat- is all fine and good when referring to Americans.
Using the -nik suffix is not, -nik has always been used to denote that something is russian or at least of slavic origin, not even in a derogatory fashion.
Calling someone a fatnik or shartnik is to call someone a fat russian or a sharting russian.
The -fats and -claps suffix is far more appropriate, Burgerfats or Burgerclaps for example describe whom you refer to and what their primary attributes are.
Fatnik is a forced meme by vatniks who feel large amounts of butthurt over being called vatniks and their krokodil rotted brains lacked the facilities to come up with a response so they went with the lamest NO U seen outside a preschool.

>>34593382
>he thinks quests were the problem
Board went even more to shit after they got kicked out. It's more than that. I personally blame people being less willing to let conversations wander.

>>34596317
Like all boards, nazi mods and over zealous janitors enforcing their subjective rules did the most damage but quests did get a bit out of hand.
There was times when every thread on the front page was a quest and close to a third of all threads where quests.

>>34596299
lost a double digit number of iq points reading this

>>34596479
That's more than a slight overstatement.

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>>34594341

>>34590265
>>34583168

Noob here, why S-ducks are important?

>>34597946
S ducts

>>34597946

Frontal radar cross section (RCS) of a low observable fighter is the most important aspect to optimise. By necessity a fighters air intakes are front facing, if you don't obscure the turbine blades, then they will drastically increase the final RCS of the plane. The S-duct, as used in the F-22 and F-35, is believed to be the optimal solution, but the Russian PAK FA prototypes seem to be using a different, sub-optimal solution. It is one part of the evidence used to claim that the Russians are not going to produce a truly competitive 5th gen any time soon

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>>34582457

>>34596299
>Please be patient I have autism

>>34598693
Stealth has nothing to do with "Competitive" 5th gen anything.
Pretty much everything in the sky is detectable by a modern radar. Even "Stealth" fighters etc.

Russians probably just assume they will be detected and focus on jamming pods to make actually getting a lock incredibly difficult, if not impossible. MiG-29s could fool an F-16s radar and prevent lock on's (according to the Falcon 4.0 simulator - probably not the best source but its all I got), so I'm sure modern jammers would would be able to fool modern radars, either with target saturation or just preventing a lock.

>>34600767
>Stealth has nothing to do with "Competitive" 5th gen anything.
>Pretty much everything in the sky is detectable by a modern radar. Even "Stealth" fighters etc.
Complete bullshit, or else Russia and China wouldn't be trying (and failing) to build stealth fighters. And stealth isn't "invisible" it's just a lot harder to detect. And you are seriously overestimating what modern radars can do.

>>34600918
Minimizing radar footprints is fine, but clearly no one is going for full "stealth". Modern radar is pretty effective, but modern Jammers are just as good, so the real interesting stuff happens when you throw ECM into the mix.

>>34600997
The F-22 and F-35 are as good or better than the F-117 and B2, though. Your point is baseless.

>>34597946
Eben the J-20 has S-ducts. PAKFATs are the most delusional of /k/ posters

>>34600997

Even assuming that this EW jamming technology is reliable against an advanced AESA, and home on jam technology isn't. How would this jamming effectively take place, if they haven't located the stealthy enemy aircraft yet?

>>34600997
>>34600767

Home on jam is a thing, no lock required.

>>34598745
Get back in your containment thread

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>>34598745
this
>>34601171

>>34602357
rub my belly /k/

>>34600767
>stealth is primarily about detection
why do you think it's optimized in the fucking X-band? targeting radars. nobody gives a shit if your static radar installation can detect the aircraft if your missiles can't establish lock.

>>34593954
>>1/5 prototypes lights up
>>prototypes
Well, I think, prototypes are made for that exact thing - finding out bugs and flaws, before the thing goes mass-produced. On the other hand, if mass produced plane is bugged, that normally means shitty R&D, or that the thing was rushed into production for whatever reason.

>>34600997
>>34600767
Using jammers is to announce to everyone who you are, where you are and to some extent what you are.
SIGINT these days is really good, even if you bring out something radically new from the top secret locker, SIGINT will at least know your approximate locations and that you are not one of their guys.

>>34600767
>because it's still possible to see stealth aircraft they are useless.
The difference is that VLO aircraft are orders of magnitude more difficult to detect than non vlo aircraft.
Think of it like vision;the human eye is also able to see small things and big things, however you can see big things further away.

To put it into perspective, the Su-35 would likely struggle to pick up The F-35 with it's radar above 30km, the F-35 can however see the Su-35 above 200km
>Jamming works sometimes so therefore it's completely fullproof.
If we carry on your logic: jamming is useless because you can burn through it.
Stealth is a massive force multiplier for jamming , vlo and a powerful AESA radar enables the F-35 to offensively jam better than dedicated platforms like the Growler.

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>>34602776
to put it into perspective, your imaginary scenario of a lone f35 flying around against a lone su35, is beyond idiotic, to the point I can't understand how this type of shit ever gets posted
on what fucking planet, will either side fly without AWACs and other support?
how in the fuck would americans engage russians on the european land war theatre (most probably scenario for West/Russia conflict out of any), where ANY su35 will be linked to russia's massive radar coverage?
please just fuck off, buddy, this type of logic might work for durkastan wars, where inbred goat-rapists get blown up in mudhuts and the occasional t72, but holy shit are the amerilards not gonna be able to pull their stealthy gimmicks on russians, you wouldn't even allow the f22 to fly anywhere close to russian radar for fear of having its characteristics logged, the fuck are you doing pretending "russians can't see our shtealth"?
what's the plan, try to cruise missile russian radar installations and then tomahawk them for weeks? lmfao

>>34602885
> cruise missile
hellfire*

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>>34602885
>to put it into perspective, your imaginary scenario of a lone f35 flying around against a lone su35,
Ok, how about we start taking assets like tankers and AEWACS into account then

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>>34582457
That shiny ball of an IRST must reflect things back like nothing else

>>34602900
Cool beans lets look at these assets. How many of them are currently not getting cruise missiled in hangars all over Europe in your potential conflict against Russia? Do your airfields have EW and SAM? How many of those are in protected bunkers. Nigga please, fuck off; I already told you that you're not fighting durkastan and a conflict between Russia and US will not be decided by technological or number supremacy, because it's open fucking knowledge that US and Russia are evenly matched to the point they wouldn't have a war.

>>34600767
And jamming coupled with stealth is even more useful.

Being harder to detect is an obvious good thing for a fighter. The only question is what is the optimum trade off.

Speed and maneuverability are good things too. But not so good that you should sacrifice everything else to get them. No one is building mach +3 fighters even though that is technically feasibly.

>>34602914
>because it's open fucking knowledge that US and Russia are evenly matched
I wonder we only hear that from one side of the discussion, maybe because it is open fucking knowledge to be wishful thinking from russboos.

t. other anon

>>34602932
> redditposting
nice
> jamming
oh, so it's 2017 and after russians have shown to have superior EW for how many years now, amerilards are all into jamming LMAO
meanwhile the US army gave away most of its EW capability and the shit that's left is mostly on planes, and planes can't hold territory as good as land-based units, this has been proven a gorilion times already
stick to jamming walkie-talkies in afghanistan, meanwhile russians jammed an entire tomahawk salvo when burgers tried hitting a durka airfield, THAT must've been fucking embarrassing

>>34602914
USAF >> VVS not even a fucking contest or debate
Currently Russia has nothing to challenge the F-22 with. How is that not a technological advantage?
The strategic deterrent is what matters when it comes to starting wars.

>>34602937
> we can EASILY beat russia, we SWEAR
multiply by 100, read every day, and then tell me "someone" is not feeling insecure
newsflash, the US hasn't been able to push russia around since the yugo wars, all that's left is making a stink or the equivalent of leaving doggie bags of shit all over russia's neighbourhood
because if you could've fucked with them directly, you would have
america can't touch russia in war

>>34602941
>after russians have shown to have superior EW for how many years now

You seem to be projecting the army lack of organic EW to the air force. They have long had dedicated jamming aircraft and squadrons. I can assure you that the AF has never lost sight of the importance of EW.

What is this conflict that proves Russian EW superiority?

>>34602941
>muh russian EW
This meme and its companions needs to die. You just got to love how everything US can work and has its limits and russian stuff just exists and works therefore everywhere and everytime, not even taking into account if it exists in an reasonable amount for example, see OP. Saying that as an non american.

>>34602941
>stick to jamming walkie-talkies in afghanistan, meanwhile russians jammed an entire tomahawk salvo when burgers tried hitting a durka airfield, THAT must've been fucking embarrassing

Get the fuck out of here. Next thing you're going to claim is that the "Donald Cook Incident" actually happened.

>>34602948
why are you pretending that in this day and age EW doesn't HAVE to be in all branches?
that's the one point your pathetic "opinion" is built on, and that point is weak.
Russian EW superiority is proven by the fact that on top of having EW in their airforce, they have entire land-based EW divisions, which can make huge areas of land untouchable, something planes have a much higher difficulty of achieving
you wanna tell me that the fuck-huge dishes at russian EW installations do the same as a couple growlers? don't make me laugh, fatboy

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>>34602946

>newsflash, the US hasn't been able to push russia around since the yugo wars

>>34602957
Remember that Georgian war where some Russian planes got shot down by their own BUK systems. I guess that just proves how good their EW is when they can't jam their own tech which they know inside out.

>>34602946
>> we can EASILY beat russia, we SWEAR
Already starting with the strawmaning? Who would have guessed, may that is also the reason why most people think that russboos are nothing but empty talk around here. Russia and the US isnt even close to be on par, hell every scenario that is getting pulled is already revolving around the fact that Russia is in the defense, you dont see people discussion a land attack of Russia on the US, because everyone knows this will never happen. So how are they on par? It doesnt make sense and is just wishful thinking, with blocking out the elephant in the room.

>>34602963
>they have entire land-based EW divisions, which can make huge areas of land untouchable

Cool. Now they have shield generators too? Fascinating Russian tech.

>>34602964
> we bought governments and forced countries into a war-profiteering alliance
yeah ok, but how is that relevant to russia?
you think being a natocuck is forever or something?
95% of countries in NATO openly say that the wouldn't fight in a war to defend another, so yeah sounds like a good alliance for sure

>>34602978
see >>34602957
Russians have something? Magically works everyime and everywhere of course! No matter the numbers or known countermeasures.

>>34602978
Explain launching 50 tomahawks at an airfield, and losing half of them in a region where Russian EW is known to be stationed. Not a couple, but HALF

>>34602980
Sounds like numbers you pulled out of your ass for sure.

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>>34602980
>when people willingly and freely join an defence pact against you and you must make up exaggerated and fake stories to cover your insecurity

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>>34602980

>yeah ok, but how is that relevant to russia?

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>>34602984
Where do you get your numbers from?

I have never seen an honest accounting of the damage done from the Russian or Syrian side. Just some pictures here and there.

They could have flown a drone around to prove that only such and such a number of hits happened. But they did not.

>>34602997
> the russian or syrian side
Excuse me, but are you not even going to mention that US themselves have admitted to only hitting the airfield with half of them? Oh, that's right you think there were "other targets" like the desert floor.
The same fucking day, planes took off from that bombed airfield, and if that's not enough "proofs" for you, then you're obviously just an asshurt shitposter

>>34602984
That is explained quite easily: You are an idiot that fell for russian propaganda or know that it is not true but still claim it out of desperate.
>When even sputnik news shown satellite photos with 44 destroyed targets.
Common, make us all laugh and show us one of the old news article where the russian ministry of lies err defense babbles about 23 hits.

>>34592088
Maybe they have, but they still have no bypassed ratio to speak of. Jet fighter engines use 100% of the air that enters them. It gives poor fuel efficiency, but high levels of thrust. Same rhetoric as any powerful car engine. Lots of fuel is used to get more power.

>>34603005
Pulled from desuarchive:
From a former thread a little collection of the bullshit we had to deal with the likes of you:
>only a small part of Tomahawk hit because they are so shit
>only a small part of Tomahawk hit because they got shot down by the russian air defense
>the attack did little damage to the airbase and it is operating again
>at the same time it was a blow that crippled the SAA, ISIS is taking direct advantage of it and christian minorities in syria are in direct danger of that
>the Tomahawk werent able to destroy the landing strip or it was repaired quickly
>the Tomahawk only did little damage because of russian EW fucking with the Tomahawks
>...

How does it feel to be an useful idiot for the russians? You probaly even think you are enlighted with that "exlusive" knowledge, which is made up of changing fakes every other week.

>>34603005
>Excuse me, but are you not even going to mention that US themselves have admitted to only hitting the airfield with half of them?
LIAR
LIAR
LIAR
PANTS ON FIRE!

>>34602996
>>34602997
Everyone knows the "way" Eastern European countries were forced around was not legitimate, and the fact NATOcuckoldry is held in "high esteem" will eventually escalate the pendulum swinging the fuck right back.
Like, it's PAINFULLY obvious that all of east europe will eventually fall back into Russian influence, you think Washington can afford to bribe EE slavshits forever?
One day people will wake up and be like
> Hey, why exactly are we in an alliance with some multi-culti niggers, that just won't stop with homo and pro-subhuman propaganda AND are making us fight in their war-profiteer durkastan campaigns?
> fuck this lmao

>>34602984

>...and losing half of them in a region where Russian EW is known to be stationed.

Like the story about the USS Donald Cook being "disabled" by a Su-24, this only happened on Rossija24 and RT/Sputnik, not in the real World.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/06/07/world/europe/anatomy-of-fake-news-russian-propaganda.html

>>34603020
This is what a post look like when you are on RT and on krokodil.

>>34593329
why not just 1 plane then

In truth china already got what it needs from previous jets (SU-27, etc etc), J-series is not fully in production yet over concerns on the 6th gen race and waiting for a more production friendly variant to come.

Both the J-31 and 20 need to get their engine-hours kinks out first, then the factories have to be prepared to make them etc etc.

>>34603005
>Excuse me, but are you not even going to mention that US themselves have admitted to only hitting the airfield with half of them? Oh, that's right you think there were "other targets" like the desert floor.
Show me your sources then. Because in those satellite photos they are way more than 25 areas hit.

>The same fucking day, planes took off from that bombed airfield, and if that's not enough "proofs" for you, then you're obviously just an asshurt shitposter
Sure. No way that could not have been a show of defiance. I mean you can't just land a plane on a runway and takeoff. That's impossible.

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>>34603024
yea yea, hey ukraine how did that revolution go?
ready to join NATO, or did you bungle everything meaning the country slowly but surely will fall back towards Russia?
maybe this time, they'll annex some more shit, but my advice to Putin would be to keep the frozen conflict going, that was real smart, and eventually just shill a pro-Russian candidate, because EVERYONE knows that your "anti-corruption" revolutions are not gonna fly anymore

>>34603036
>Territories annexed to ukraine

That working makes no sense.

US claimed a high hit rate and damage. Of 58 out of 89 launched.

Russia claimed low effectiveness. So they could have flown a drone around and revealed the number of targets hits. But they did not bother.
It's just their MoD shitposting as usual.

>>34603046
I don't think drones are a thing Russia has, mate.

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>>34603036

>ready to join NATO, or did you bungle everything meaning the country slowly but surely will fall back towards Russia?

Does this look like a people that wants anything to do with Russia anymore?

>>34603036
>russian economy: crumbling and sanctioned
>russian resserve funds: running out in the next year(s)
>russian currency: lost half its worth in the past years
>russias reputation in Europe: Lunatic you got to defend yourself from, goes through a lot of steps of former nazi germany
>russian military: Stopped projects everywhere, at the same time conflict in ukraine and syria already brought it to its limits
>russian population: already going back after a little positive development
>...
Russia will win any second now, any second...

>>34603036
So, NATO is total shit you say? But guess what, countries still will join it because of russia, really makes you think how shit must be compared to that?

>>34603035
t. a cuck and his cuckpedals
you do know that you're absolutely disgusting to talk to, like you're the most pathetic sack of human trash possible: a disgustingly obese, zit-ridden, sadcase fuckboy?
are you fucking stupid, or is some part of you tied to the american "competence" on the world stage? because that competence has been looking hella incompetent the last [n]decades, anytime something that's not a CIA-funded durka operation shits up a country, your armed forces completely shit the bed in all categories, yet you're here writing your sad little stories
The NUMBER ONE world super military ultra top power cruise missile'd a durka airfield and the durkas took off from it the same fucking day
> it was a show of defiance
Lmao, go eat a shotgun bitchboy you're done here, because the next thing I'm gonna talk about is that US super epic navy seal prison ISIS raid, that happened rougly around the time Russia was showing off how they're were murdering durkas
> speaking of "shows of defiance"
and then the amerilard seals managed to get themselves killed whilst doing this "raid" and had to call in drone strikes in a hostage rescue mission
and these events happen like 10 times a month for amerilards, you're a fucking joke nation and a borderline 3rd world shithole as well
if it wasn't for multi-national corps abusing ameridumbs in every hole possible, you'd get balkanized overnight and shat on from every spot on the planet
watch your back, americuck

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>>34603020

>Like, it's PAINFULLY obvious that all of east europe will eventually fall back into Russian influence

Do you have any idea of just how much Russia is hated in Eastern Europe?

>>34603060
> the most recent joined country is montenegro, a literal nobody village-state that was DEFINITELY added as a purely political and money-related move
your alliance a shit

>>34602963
>land based jammers
Those things that can barely jam off the shef walkies in Ukraine?
Those things so ineffective that they cannot prevent OSCE drones from flying over and photographing russian jammer stations in Ukraine?
Those things limited by the horizon?

Meanwhile the US has entire air wings using Compass Call jamming planes, assets so efficient that russhits can only dream about it.

>>34603064
faggoty 90s kids from the EE have been shouting about "muh Russia" because that's what they were told to shout, and it isn't any different from USSR indoctrination
whenever some fucking kiddo tries to tell me [x] country hates [y], in fucking europe of all places, I want to curb stomp them
this is fucking europe, everyone and their mother has fought each other at some point, and frankly you'll be hard-pressed to argue that your nu-age pro-nigger LGBTdemocracy is gonna last in EE, because that's just not true
Not to mention that West Europeans, can open a history book any time and see how EE is basically a band of political prostitutes anyways, and how they join or not join alliances, shows literally nothing, because that's what prostitutes do.

>>34602984
>59 launched
>58 hits
>half
Russian """"education"""

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>>34603062
What you will never understand is that the US maybe bad, but Russia still manages to look like an obvious worse alternative to most countries.

>>34603068
An alliance is defined by the strongest members not some minor. But please continue, we love to see how you desperately try to come up with anything to have an answer, which is even more fun, because half of it would proably been seen and defended as positiv if Russia would do the exact same thing.

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>>34603084
>LIES RUSSIA STONK! EVERYONE LOVES US! STOP TELLING OTHERWISE OR WE REEEEEEEEEEEEE!

>>34602885
Nice goalpost moving, you've managed to not disprove anything i said
>lone f35 flying around against a lone su35
Sorry sorry 2500 F-35s vs 250 Su-35s
>AWACS
VLO works against AWACS as well: Russian AWACs will struggle to get tripple digit detection range, US AWACS will see the VVS taking off from their airfields just like they did to the Iraqis in gulf storm.
>other support?
high wavelength radar is at best going to give the Russians a limited GCI capability, have fun with those Mig-21 tactics.
>where ANY su35 will be linked to russia's massive radar coverage?
you need to actually prove that this system is integrated, you can't just assume it is because it fits your narrative.
>you wouldn't even allow the f22 to fly anywhere close to russian radar for fear of having its characteristics logged
The Russians have almost certainly detected F-22s on VHF already, the USAF aren't going to give a shit in a SHTF scenario
>"russians can't see our shtealth"?
you keep aggressively repeating this strawman
>what's the plan, try to cruise missile russian radar installations and then tomahawk them for weeks?
>>34602914
>How many of them are currently not getting cruise missiled in hangars all over Europe in your potential conflict against Russia?
NATO has allot more cruise missiles than Russia, allot more assets than Russia and allot more airfields than Russia.
>>34602941
>oh, so it's 2017 and after russians have shown to have superior EW for how many years now.
Have they? They've jammed allot of walkie talkies and civilian drones in Ukraine, which has sent allot of western media pearl clutching, but this is nothing that the US isn't capable of doing.
>meanwhile russians jammed an entire tomahawk salvo when burgers tried hitting a durka airfield, THAT must've been fucking embarrassing
>Jamming an INS guided missile
>believing Sputnik
>'MH-17 was shot down by an Su-25 cyka'
why am i arguing with you

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>>34603074
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uiFhs5eg1c
> russians let osce fly over, they would have obviously tried to jam them to make osce lose drones
good fucking lord, cockhole, even the amerilards are admitting Russians fucked you up with EW and drones in Ukraine, it's time to give it up

>>34603084
Are you serious or are you trying to make russians make look like brainwashed idiots, that need to be glassed? You seriously cant tell from your post.

>>34582457
Look like fucking shit

>>34603084

>nu-age pro-nigger LGBT democracy

Kill yourself.

>>34603105
> russians gonna be glassed
that's a common fantasy from some EE slavshits whose slavshit nations never accomplished anything, but it's safe to say that between russia and the EE, if anyone's gonna get glassed it's gonna be the little slavshit haters, who thought amerilards are gonna back them (they didn't because amerilards don't actually have any balls)
real talk here, do eastern european monkeys ACTUALLY believe america will risk getting nuked over them?
do you really really believe this? it's cute, that's for sure, but the shitposting related to it is getting pretty fucking tiring
the russian paras alone (whose active service probably makes up more than all of EE combined) could take the butthurt-belt tomorrow and NOTHING would happen, you could trust me on this

>>34603084
>whenever some fucking kiddo tries to tell me [x] country hates [y], in fucking europe of all places, I want to curb stomp them.

Most of eastern Europe remembers being part of the Warsaw pact, sorry to burst your bubble.

>>34603118
And somehow whenever I talk to an eastern european who's not a subhuman-tier unemployed/uneducated piece of shit, or a kiddo with a meme-degree, or dumb teenage slut, but an actual man who worked in the commie times, what they've got to say about the modern EE "politics" differs a FUCK of a lot, from the bullshit you spew about Russia.
Ok, so the warsaw pact happened, how is this related to modern day Russia? If I asked you this question irl, you'd stutter like a little bitch and change the topic. Now THAT'S fact.
Anyways, nice going jumping out of the USSR straight into the EUSSR, that's definitely gonna work out, we've all seen the impressive things slavshits have done with EU funds for the last decade.

>>34592511
Those winglets in the front remind me of Kiwi!
https://youtu.be/sdUUx5FdySs
You can do it little guy!

>>34603128

>but an actual man who worked in the commie times

You know, pensioners are not the future of a country...

>>34603143
neither are fuckboys who ran off from their homeland to clean toilets

>>34603117
I never said that you are going to get glassed. Geez, can you even make one post without exaggerating or make up something? All you display is your unability to contain yourself, your infatile abilty to grasp, or better said to get wrong, reality. No wonder Russia is in such a bad shape, it is always busy with coming up with exuses, making up fake stories and blame others for all their own errors. Your country is going through the same steps of a former crumpling empire as germany before WW2, if you actually are interested in your country you would stop that at once, but your are to arrogant and selfish to do so. And no, i didnt say you are nazis. Why i have to add this? Because you grasp every straw of misinterpreting the other side, so you have an exuse for your next baseless attack.

Seriously, fix your country. It is in dire need of help and all you do is driving it deeper in the mud.

>>34603096
>this kills the vatnik

>>34603128
>I talk to an eastern european who's not a subhuman-tier unemployed/uneducated piece of shit, or a kiddo with a meme-degree, or dumb teenage slut.
I don't think you talk to many people at all to be honest

>>34603143
> w-we are the future!
Now this is how you know your country is about to get fucked with various NGO-involvement, outside corp interests, and perhaps even ethnic-clashes as well
Nobody below the age of 40 should be allowed to have any sort of fucking opinion related to running the country, you "politically-involved" faggots are the fucking death knell and I say this as a 25 year old

>>34593353
>was actually learning quite a bit in this thread until it devolved into complaining how there are no good threads anymore and trying to find something to blame.

Create the posts you want to read in this world

>>34593353
> russians
actually you've got eastern europeans pretending to be americans and russians
the russian weapons board is way better than this shithole
anyways, nice reddiposting

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>>34603098
See pic related.
Russian jammers are shit, only if they take a NATO drone not prepared for jamming they have a chance at being effective. Otherwise they are just sources of russian embarrassment.

>>34602914
>How many of them are currently not getting cruise missiled in hangars all over Europe in your potential conflict against Russia?
Far more than the extremely limited number of surviving russian fixed radar stations, the rest would have eaten storm shadows, tomahawks and JASSAM-ERs.

>SAM
Patriot PAC-2, PAC-3 and ASTER is more than enough to deal with any russian cruise missile.

>russia
>evenly matched
1985 called, they want the last time russia could match the US back.

looks like a highly sculpted and polished commie turd to me.

>>34602900
That cheeky thunderbird

>>34590708
My good, look at it! Even copycat Chinese >>34602357 can make much neater internal bays than that!

>>34603183

this

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>>34603010
>they still have no bypassed ratio to speak of.
>turbofans
>no bypass ratio to speak of

nigga what?

Also look up what the bypass ratio for a modern fighter engine like say the 119 is

>>34603293

I'd really like to know if China pulled off 3d shocks with their intakes like the US did with the F-22/23

This is one of the main reasons Russia can't into s-ducts.

>>34603156
>Obey your Patriarchs as they guide you to your death!

>>34589880

Well, there are going to be 12 of these things build "until" the mid 2020s, so our 187 F22s will manage just fine.

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>>34591758

Bitch please.

>>34603010
I was the one that posted the chart.
Read the figures: the highest BPR on the chart is only 1.4, relatively speaking that is nothing (787 has BPR of 10), but as the chart shows even a small amount makes a big difference to IR signature.

>>34593284

The smart money is that it's primary missions is high speed, deep strike at tankers and AWACS.

>>34602388
Okei

>>34598693
Thx

>>34603706
Don't forget the 230 F-35s and counting.

/k/ has turned into such a shithole over mere 1.5 years I've been checking it. Not that the people here deserve better.

>>34603909
>russian shills and vatniks flood /k/ in ukraine conflict, fuck it up with their proofstering, russian propaganda and what not, ruin every basis of good discussion with endless shitposting
>this is somewhat /k/s fault.
How about no. And no, the "fatniks" arent the same or it aint their fault to the same degree. Every platform that allowed anonymous discussions around that topic and didnt show them the door right form the start suffered with the same problem.

>>34594341
lewd

>>34582457
Why don't russia just go and cancel that garbage pile?
They should spend the money on trying to get Su-35 both good enough and in sufficient numbers to match the latest European fighters.

>>34603955
This

>>34605359
>Why don't russia just go and cancel that garbage pile?
Shared development with India:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukhoi_PAK_FA
>it was reported that India and Russia had agreed on a preliminary design contract where each country invests $6 billion;

>>34606614
India should really cut their losses and leave. They got scammed unusually hard this time around.

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>>34590806
>feces species
Holy shit, thanks anon. I literally laughed out loud at that.

>>34596156
Have you?

>>34596156
nope, it's figuratively worthless
it made some money for lockmart tho

>>34592473
>>34593262
>he actually thinks those posts are made by russians

how dumb r u.
Not many russians go on this site at all. They have their own places.

>>34602906
Fun fact, it can actually turn around and put up a cover, which I don't think totally fixes its radar signature, but it helps prevent waves from bouncing around in that see through shit.

Still, its not very flush. The F-35's targetting pod isn't perfect either but Its better than that.

>>34612615
>Not many russians go on this site at all. They have their own places.
I wish this would be true.

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>>34603084
Damn son, you Чyкчa are getting more pathetic by the day.

>>34612615
There are at least posters who starts to post "proofs" from .ru links if buttblasted enough and who speak russian.
Also, going by /int/ there are still genuine russians on here.

>>34612703
the irony, esl-kun complains about russians on 4chan

>>34612739
This
Even when they are not many, then they are posting as much as 5 average users.

>>34602267
>Home on jam
are you aware how jamming works?

there are a bunch of different types, even back in the 60s there were 3 different types of jamming. These days likely more.

Your "home on jam" device will have to be exactly calibrated to the specific jamming pod and setting the enemy is using, and that's just not going to happen unless you're up against a very old aircraft with well understood ECM capabilities.

>>34603084
this
special snowflakes from eastern europe are starting to get on everyone's nerves
never mind the shit poolacks did to everyone, all the smaller village-states have got dirty little hands too
fuck off with you nigger-tier wewuz oppressed stories already, you got fucked up because you were weak

>>34613074
and since when should anyone give a fuck about what some weak pushovers think, nobody does in the real world even if they might pretend the 21st century is all about "equality" and whatnot
yugoslavia got broken up by germany and the us not because of "freedoms" but because together they would be a stronger unit/country and now they're a bunch of helpless mini-states
exactly the same shit with the ussr/warsaw pact
enjoy your eu loans, dipshits, it's definitely gonna work out in the long run rather than being self-sufficient

>>34613074
>you got fucked up because you were weak
It is this mentality amongst russians that drive EE into the arms of NATO.
Russia has no one but themselves to blame for NATO expansion. They should also see this as natural and good because now russia is weak and they think that being fucked due to weakness is all fine and dandy.

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>>34613074
I understand your point, but you should chill, seriously.

>>34582457
China has already more J-20 in service than Russia will ever have T-50.

>>34592638
Su-35 is a political act.

24 SU-35's have no strategical value at all, in fact China has already >20 J-20's in service while there are 2 Su-35's in China right now.

>>34592511
Majestic Af, but could use better engines

>>34614509

Pretty much everyone is in agreement that 24 Su-35S is the minimum Russia would allow them to buy, as the Chinese are desperate for anything to reverse engineer to improve their engines.

>>34612800
>Doesn't know what broadband antennas are
>Doesn't know you can lock into a jamming signal before firing

>>34582737
No modern IRST system looks for the heat source but for the created background clutter, which render such hiding attempts ineffective to a large degree.

>>34615264
In fact such attempts can even result with the opposite effect and the aircraft appears like a black hole for that IRST system.

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>>34614632
How long until the Chinese can get their hand on a good engine to copy?

>>34615317
>implying that isn't a stealth feature to blend into chinese air

>>34615398
kek

>>34615275
>Implying that an aircraft would be colder than its background

>>34592417
The organized propaganda effort by the Russians on this site pissed me off. It was obvious to anyone with half a brain.

>>34615317
>chinese aircraft tactically dispersing the smoke screen and initiating evasive maneuvers

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>>34582518
>Are those rivets?
Yes
>wouldn't they disrupt stealth?
Yes
>can someone who is not a...burger answer?
Eat a dick communist. Free country.

>>34596210

I like Shartnik most.

Americans look diseased and they go shopping at Walmart with leaky bowels.

>>34615398
i lol'd

To me, and this is just what I think.. The PAK-FA bears a resemblance to the YF-23 from the front. If the Russians can successfully copy / acquire the YF-23's over all design, I think it could potentially be a real threat, to whomever they are fighting.

... If they can fund it... Big IF.

>>34617510
YF-23 had DSI and S-ducts though.

>>34615317
It's not the engine, or even the design of the engine. The chinese probably have these. It's the material science, and more specifically, the methods by which said materials are made that's china's problem.

To give you an example, the very latest turbine blade technology involves the growth of a blade as a single allotrope (crystalline structure) of the alloy into its final shape with little to no final machining. How it's done is very closely guarded by the western companies that have that technology. Heck, even making some of the exotic alloys and composites are closely guarded.

If I gave you a piece of exotic alloy from one of those engines and you analyzed it, you could determine it's atomic makeup, but you wouldn't know how to manufacture that alloy unless someone told you or you invented the process in isolate.

It's one of china's biggest hurdles in terms of modern tech. They're 15 years behind the west in terms of material science.

>>34582518
just learned today. heat stuff is attenuated heavily by the atmosphere. physical airplane is a black body radiating surface so broadcasts across the entire spectrum. will see body by radio etc way before you see the heat plume

>>34582930
how can Slavs look at this and not laugh?

>>34619821
it's comfy