>*stares at you in the rain*

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Best channel

>I actually hope he gets shilled on here more often
He deserves more viewers.

>>34535814
This.

>>34535799
Agreed.

>>34535814
His videos on bullet drop and meat target performance make me subscribe to his patreon

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>tfw you're on your daily trip to taco bell and the spaceship lands and you're only wearing level 3A soft armor

I think he is easily the most informative guntuber out there right now.

Highly interested. Who is this cat

>>34535965
should have stood behind two perfectly aligned wooden logs 300 yards down range.

>>34535708
Paul Harrell's the kind of dude that you just know, if it were the paleolithic, he'd be bashing niggas over the head evry day

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>>34535799
>not just sowing sand bags together

>>34535991
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2wWktUH71I

The thing about Paul is that he's actually killed a man.

No orger youtubers to my knowledge have done that and give sound tactical advice.

Anyone want the story?

I really liked his breakdown of the Miami FBI shoot out and the evolution of police firearms training.

>>34535965
I got that reference

Also what does this thread think happened when he was involved in the shootings he was involved in

>>34536075
That was a great video tbqh senpai

>>34536071

Yes

>>34536071
>anyone want the story
no, go fuck youself.

>>34536071
Maybe, but only if you poast the link to a bideo by him, or prove you are him

>>34536093
>Also what does this thread think happened when he was involved in the shootings he was involved in
Someone posted a local news article about one of the shootings he was involved in here once. I didn't save it because I'm retarded.

>>34535708
Something a bit off about him, not sure what it is but i feel unnerved watching his videos

>>34536132

Was PH carrying concealed; i.e a civilian?

>>34536155
I think this one was with a rifle and happened while he was camping.

>>34536152

Iktfb

They seem dated like from the late 90s

>>34536168

I know he got shot at when he was shootan innadesert

What the hell is his channel. Never heard of him.

>>34536071
I watch an ex marines channel and he's definetly killed a couple haji's in either Iraq or Afghanistan

>>34536152
He is was a Marine weapons instructor, you kind of get a pissed off math teacher in an inner city school look on your face when teaching 17-29 year olds.

>>34536093
>>34536132
>>34536155
>>34536179
Found the articles about the one with the rifle
http://www.wallowa.com/20061130/i-will-be-exonerated-troy-shooting-defendant-vows
http://www.wallowacountychieftain.com/20070619/harrell-freed-of-manslaughter-charges-in-troy-shooting
>that courtroom art

>>34536111
>>34536117
>>34536126
>>34536132
>>34536155
>>34536171
>>34536168
http://www.wallowacountychieftain.com/20070619/harrell-freed-of-manslaughter-charges-in-troy-shooting

TL;DR


Paul and his wife were camping in a very remote campgrounds during a black powder shoot.

It was just them and 3 fishermen at the campsite.

One night, the fishermen asked Paul and his wife to go to a bar and drink with them, Paul declined.

Supposedly there were no ill feelings or exchanged insults.

The fishermen then went to the bathroom, one got in his truck and for whatever reason, decided it was a good idea to be an asshole and drive straight into the Harrils fire, directly at them.

This apparently went on for a few moments, with the driver running over more of their shit.

Paul at this point grabbed an AR15, and shot the Driver of the vehicle several times(without hitting the passengers).

The man later died, Paul claimed the man was trying to run over him and his wife.

While in court during a pretrial hearing, before any plea of innocence is supposed to be declared, Paul stated "I will be exonerated"

>Gets exonerated

Guys cold blooded as it gets.

>>34536200
maybe thats what im picking up, whatever the dude knows his stuff

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>>34535708

>I'm at the range so please excuse the gun fire
>Mfw

>>34536218

Holy fuck


B A S E D

>>34536218
Damn thats a weird situation, If thats how it actually went down then Kudos to Paul for protecting himself and his wife.

>>34536188
Not to be a faggot but there really is a difference between killing some random terrorist from a couple hundred yards and killing a person attacking you in your own country.
I killed a couple guys laying an IED with my turret gun back in 2013, and last year I had to shoot a guy who pulled a gun on me outside of a bar while I was breaking up a fight he was having with my friend. Completely different feeling.

>>34536218
God damn nigga, the right kind of sociopath.

>>34536256

What's the difference

T. Drunk anon

>>34536281
>killing Americans
>killing sandniggers

That's the difference, would you not feel any worse killing someone kinda like yourself, or killing someone who fucks little boys and hates everything you love?

>>34536218
Deserved

I think Paul did a smart move by waiting long enough so that the truck driver ran over enough shit so there was actual evidence and then shot him
Maybe the truckdriver didnt want to run over Paul and his wife, maybe Paul knew it, but he deadass killed that motherfucker

Gonna give him sum money on Patreon

>>34536256
I have no idea on the circumstances of his combat service, Although at least in a War zone you would be somewhat mentally prepared for what you might have to do, whereas in a civilian self defence situation you have no time to prepare.

However the post i was responding to said "Killed a man" so yeah. but i agree with you

>>34536293
Not to sound like like a mudslimes sympathizer but not all insurgent fighters are religious nutjobs. A good portion of them just hate the allies coming into their country and blowing shit up constantly and are genuinely just trying to drive us out of their homeland.

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>>34536293
>feel any worse killing someone kinda like yourself
Different, but not worse
If I have to kill someone, I gotta do it, no need to feel bad about it, it's not my fault

Or do you actually enjoy killing random people?

>>34536293
Good point

>>34536171
not surprising, the dude probably draws a lot of inspiration from stuff made back then.

>>34536281
The difference is that when I shot the drunk asshole I looked directly into his eyes as I pulled the trigger and later tried to staunch the bleeding.

The two hadji's just got turned into giblets when the IED detonated. (Was fucking hilarious to watch).

>>34536053
>sowing sand bags
mine didnt grow. i either planted them too deep or too early in the season.

>>34536256
How much does range factor into your feelings about it? Would being in a situation where you have to shoot some sandnigger at close range be more akin to the bar shooting?

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>>34536396

>>34536181

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zrH8nn0kAc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv8cByaVyNQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qHVhZXL4kQ

A slightly old fashioned yet still revelamt firearms instructor and enthusiast who is fair and balanced with advice and is not overbearing and absolute with his opinion, instead he encourages the viewer to digest the information he provides and have the viewer come to their own conclusions.

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>>34536396

>>34536397
Honestly I can't speak from experience, I never shot anyone up close over seas. I'm a 74D, which is basically useless as an MOS so I ended up on a turret a lot, so I never really kicked in doors or anything like that. If I had though I really don't think it would be any different than killing a squirrel or deer. I don't understand what deer or squirrels say when I shoot them, same as some fucking insurgent. I did however completely understand drunk fuck praying to god through the air collapsing his lung as his heart pumped all its blood out of his chest.

>>34535814
I'd lay money he's a serial killer

>>34536306
It was later proven in court that the truck was about to hit Pauls parked vehicle, which his wife was behind.

So there actually was hard physical evidence of attempted murder by the driver

>>34536445
More of a Shasta slayer.

>>34536438
I dunno man, Even if someone were a radical islamist they are still Human. They just had a fucked up set of life experiences that got them to where they were.

I'd still shoot one and feel better about the fact that i stopped him from blowing up me and my buddies but that doesn't change the fact he's still human.

>>34536438
Damn anon, that's a shitty night out

>>34536496
Arabs aren't humans

I wonder if Eric shot anybody in Iraq.

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>>34536071
he killed two actually
>and showed up to court looking like this:

>>34536515
Except they are,

>>34536525
>he killed two actually

When?

>>34536529
Sand nigger detected

Go fuck 7 year old girls or something you disgusting animal

>>34536555
wow you are dense even after i said i'd shoot one>>34536496


>>>/pol/ is that way friendo this is /k/

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>>34536525
The style of that really reminds me of the snake target from a few of his videos.

>>34536555
home invader with a shotgun, he used that 1897 on someone

>>34536664

Paul harrell is truly based

>spouts fuddlore externally
>Shoots a jug of water to prove some assertion about caliber potency

>>34536592
>the defendant so undeniably innocent that they let him do his own courtroom sketch

>>34536071
>No other youtubers to my knowledge have done that and give sound tactical advice.
there are plenty of ex sf guys on youtube

>>34535814
Lurk more; you need to learn how to greentext properly.

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>>34535708
>doesnt know how springs work
>advocates 40 over 9mm
>says he doesnt want to talk about killing people
>talks about killing people and uses it as a reason to listen to him
>claims not to brag
>dumps a whole container on the bench of medals (totally not bragging btw guys :^) )
>mfw all of this

I'm surprised anyone on /k/ actually likes him for the preference on 40 alone, but some of the shit he says is actually inconsistent and stupid.

Not to mention on top of that he doesnt really anything new, that isnt outright shit.

>>34536785
>I disagree
Continues shitposting

>>34536880
I agree with you besides springs.

>>34536880

Are you autistic?

>>34536880
Yeah but its good entertainment.

Maybe he will take over after mr.45 kicks it and his son shits up the channel.

We can only dream.

Dude seems based and has good flow in his speech.

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>>34535708
>tfw paul is my internet highschool crush equivalent

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>>34536894
https://youtu.be/K4FESGjiH3s?t=501
timestamp is at the time he actually claims compressed springs lose tension

despite all those cases of guns stored since ww2 with fully loaded mags that worked perfectly fine

This also kind of goes into his mentality "I SEENT IT SO I KNOW" at this point a gangbanger could come by and say hes killed far more people than Paul and this may very well be the case but you would have to pay me to take gun advice from either of them

>>34536880
He represents the pendulum swinging the other way so he gets a pass. I don't agree with it, but that's how social evolution and cycles work.

>>34536971
Just because it works doesn't mean it didn't lose some measure of spring tension. You can watch a video where a guy stores mags loaded for a few years and there is a length difference between the springs but not enough to alter function.

you know when he reaches into his coat pocket it's gonna b gud

I like how Paul enunciates so well

>>34536961
>Yeah but its good entertainment.
Wouldnt disagree but all these youtube gun e-celebs have to be taken with a grain of salt.

>>34536981
fair enough, although he fails to mention this.

>>34536971
>>34537036
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pch0J9-7i2k

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>>34536983

That shit always makes me kek

>Reaches into coat
>Pulls out a 1911, a five seven and an M9

Gif related

>>34536071
several men, probably he has admitted to at least 3 citizen self defense scenarios where he shot someone, only 1 made the news, but he was also in the military for a long ass time and had a few deployments, but dosent talk about that.

>>34536075
Ive watched that vid like 4 times.

>>34536188
>>34536256
>Ex muhrine
Imma post what i posted in the other gun youtuber thread

almost every other gun youtuber is just a jackass, or some gay wannabe tactical bullshit, in a sea of gay wannabe tactical bullshit, who even if they did serve, its all they talk about, most of it straight up lies, and they were mostly likely just some POG faggot, and if they were special forces anything they did or any kind of verification isnt available to civilians so they could be lying about all of it, and more often than not they usually are. See every other "special forces vet" on youtube theres so fucking many and they are all garbage.

The difference with Paul harrell is he is infinitely better, dosent ram tacticool bullshit down your throat and actually has verification for everything he is, (a army marksmanship instructor, several tours of duty, winner of several state championships for shooting and one of the worlds top ranked blackpowder markmen) which he almost dosent talk about at all because that shouldn't be the point of a gun based you tube channel. I had to do my own research and find out all of that, as well as the fact he has been involved in 3 self defense situations, all 3 of which he resolved quickly and professionally.

Paul is a serious guy who does serious shit, but just wants to talk about firearms and advice, not how operator he is and shove the word tactical in every sentence.

>>34536963
Good luck on becoming a cop

; )

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>>34537257
anon pls don't

not gonna happen anyway, I have like 39 class A misdemeanors + other shit, all expunged.... but ya g/l on the polygraph

>>34536496
>still human
>still
you misspelled sub.

>>34536664
Got a link? I've only heard about the campground incident.

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>>34536673
Shooting water jugs (or soda jugs) is a very effective way to see if a hollowpoint will expand since its the perfect medium, or if shot back to back, an effective way to gauge visually the knockdown force of a bullet when comparing different bullets. Its not a scientific test but it does illustrate some important things.

Which he explains in several vids, if you actually watched them you mong.
>>34536769
see>>34537176

>>34536880
in the springs vid all he does if offer some anecdotes from his experience, and draws some of his own conclusions and always ends hit stories and his conclusions with a similar phrase
>"I'll let you be the judge"
>"You decide"
which is the same shit he does for all of those points.
stop being a huge faggot.

>>34536971
And literally ends that vid with
>"But Ill let you be the judge of that"
Its just his experiences faggot, get over it.

>>34537368
Its in his "shotguns dont suck for home defense" vid Im pretty sure, he also addresses keyboard commandos and faggots on the internet who spout shit with no evidence, and how he tries to give his personal evidence, but agrees that it might be JUST his experience.
Also he reads the comments, and actually replies! It made me feel special.

>>34536071
>No orger youtubers to my knowledge have done that and give sound tactical advice.

Here's Varg Freeborn. Some serious shit this guy went through and knows a lot of the criminal side of self defense. He's been in +100 fights in his life, has done prison time, defended himself with a knife etc.

>his bio
http://www.onelifedefense.com/about-us

Really interesting and informational videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7V6SvVocu5o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYSO3BVq3bw

>>34537432
>done prison time, been in 100+ fights

Im not going to take life, firearms, or legal advice from a convicted felon and degenerate piece of shit.

Harrell seems really down to earth. I enjoyed his Miami FBI shootout analysis video.

NEW VID NEW VID NEW PAUL HARREL VID.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qSVOZfp3R4&feature=push-u&attr_tag=D7_HyW_Df75V8KtI-6

>>34536306
To be fair once is an accident , twice is time to start shooting.

>>34537482
He really needs to do more of that, the advice to wear safety straps with glasses may very well save my life one day.

>>34537483
YOU BETTER RUN 3A

>>34537405
>Sucking his dick this hard because he replied to your comment

I bet you donate to his Patreon too.

>>34536256
Cool sample of 1

>>34537559
Who even has 3A armor anymore?

>>34536306
Even if the drivers intention was just to scare them, that's not the type of person that needs to be walking around

>>34536390
So tell us why you HAD to shoot him huh

>>34537482
That video was great. I hope he does more shootout analysis videos in the future

>>34537577
eat shit faggot, my question and his response where both well thought out and helpfull, your just being a piece of shit.

And I dont contribute to anyone patreon, Im a stingy jew, but I do plug him when I can because he is my favorite gun youtuber.

>>34537590
was probably drunk to

>>34537176
you don't know what your talking about, here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2OdQSgAzNs

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>>34537460
>Im not going to take life, firearms, or legal advice from a convicted felon and degenerate piece of shit.

Your loss, he has good information and he isn't a felon. You're just looking at him with face value and didn't read or skim through any of the links provided.

>>34537629
You just countered with "his experience" anecdotes are wind. Having one experience of defending yourself doesn't mean alot.

>>34537650
Ah yes, the youtuber you claim isnt a tacticool faggot reviewing a piece of several thousand dollar kit while in full kit shooting at "Commie" targets sure shows me he isnt a tacticool faggot.

You sure got me.

>>34537669
>Done actual prison time
>not a convicted degenerate

Sure bud.

>>34537731
He's aiming his videos at servicemen you obnoxious cunt, and he doesn't show you all his medals either unlike your waifu paul

>>34537731
>>34537811
Bret and Harrel do different things and are both fucking great, fuck off.

>>34536171
His video style is delightful.

>>34536210
What's the deal with the pistol shootout? He didn't mention a whole lot of it, doesn't sound like either got hit, how far away they started, sounds like he might of had to advance into fire. It sounds fucking nuts that both of them were alright and having mediators involved after.

>>34536330
>A good portion of them just hate the allies coming into their country and blowing shit up constantly and are genuinely just trying to drive us out of their homeland.
Maybe somebody should tell them that struggling will just make the rape last longer.

>>34537863
I think he had a video about 1 of his shootings up a while ago but he took it down once he started getting popular, probably for legal reasons, or that he dosent want information out there, since he wants his vids to be more informative, than informative about him.

>>34536267
He doesn't sound like a sociopath. A sociopath would of taken life insurance out on their wife and shot the guy after.

>>34536496
>Even if someone were a radical islamist they are still Human.
>still human
Literally everybody is human. Imagine if I told you to read a book and the only thing in defense of the book I could think to say was
>errr.... it's a book. it's got pages and stuff
Would you think that book worth reading? Fuck no. You'd conclude the book was worth jack shit because I couldn't think of anything better to say about it.

If the best you can say about somebody is to point out their species, that's damning with faint praise.

>>34537959
What i'm saying is you can't judge a book by its cover, Just cause their are a bunch of Islamic terrorists does not mean all of them are Islamic terrorists..and not all catholic priests are pedos and not all cops are authoritarian fascists. Use some common fucking sense

>>34536664
that's one of the weird things I like about his videos. I really want a winchest in that model and I really agree with some of the points he was making about it. I practically want to get a spare magazine and spray paint it just to keep it as a snap cap designated one, although I should probably mark them all now that I think about it.

>>34536880
>>advocates 40 over 9mm
He didn't even do that. You should be mad though if you're a 9mm fan since 40 is all around better. The FBI helped out gun manufacturers specifying 40. It's a wonder people are resistant to it. One of my friends favors a 40 and when he told me he practically flinched like I'd give him shit over it when 40 is just overall better than 9 unless you want 1 or 2 extra bullets while every preceding bullet is inferior.
I don't have any base figures for statistics but for 40 and 9 for most statistics I've heard a gun battle is well over before the capacity argument comes up. If you throw reloads in you have like 30 capacity vs. 34 if you have a video game spread sheet of statistics like this do you want a gun that does everything better but has 2-4 shots less but costs a few extra dollars more, or a gun that's a tiny bit cheaper and has 2-4 more shots. I'd go with the 40 until I have a serious budget problem.

>>34538136
That is factually incorrect, FBI developed .40 because female agents could not handle the recoil of 10mm, Modern 9mm hollowpoints are just as effective as .40 with less recoil, faster follow up shots and greater capacity.

>>34538136
>He didn't even do that.

Paul might not be accusing the 9mm of being shit, but at least he's more honest then all you faggots, 40 hits harder and given the ability to control the gun with skill and strength it's clearly the superior choice for cause catastrophic damage to organics.

Paul has inferred no less, he's literally a 40 advocate, and with good reason

t. time based 9x19 shooter

>>34538166
>t. time based 9x19 shooter

who apparently doesn't realize that shot placement is the most important thing

>>34538192
never implied or suggested that, nice back peddling and straw man construction though, you certainly know how to post on /k/

>>34538155

Nothing in your post is factual. The .40S&W fires a 50% more massive projectile than 9mm while firing it at about the same velocity. That equates to about 50% more momentum in the projectile, which comes into play as soon as it hits hard barriers (such as bones). Not everything can be illustrated by hollow point penetration depth in pork marrow gelatin.

>>34536981
Are you talking about the guy that had a bunch of mags with a mixture of exact years and non exact, because he was talking about a direct correlation in that video between the compression and failures to feed.

>>34538215
what?
>The .40S&W fires a 50% more massive projectile than 9mm

No it absolutely does not,

9mm = 124gr @ 1150 fps federal hst

.40 S&W = 180gr @ 1010fps federal hst

>>34537176
that's some weak copy pasta

>>34537257
is that a bad job to go for over all? I seen a super hot chic last time I was at a police station but she was swaying her hips and walking like she knows how to cum and if I seen a girl walking around there a lot like that I'd think she gets passed around a little too much to go for that kinda thing.

>>34538272
You answered his retard pseudo science with your own facile pseudo science response, fucking hilarious

>CCing my brand spanking new .40
>guy behind the counter gave me a deal for the gun, holster, and ammo
>totally didn't get ripped off
>going to the store to get tampons
>someone comes in with a gun and holds up the place
>I draw my gun and tell him to stop or I'll shoot
>he goes to put his hand up then notices ".40" stamped on the slide
>he begins to chuckle
>peoples heads start turning towards me as they too read the slide
>they begin chuckling
>the chuckle turns into roaring laughter
>the robber with tears in his eyes walks up to me and hands me the cash from the register and tells my to buy any other gun
>I look at the cashier who is holding himself up on the wall crying as he shakes his head for me to take the cash

I was shooting my Raven MP-25 at the range the other day, and some guy setting up on the bench next to mine actually pulled out a .40 S&W Glock 23. Several other shooters ran up and urinated on his pants leg while he stood there, weeping. I tossed his range bag out past the firing line, and everyone took a couple shots at it.

>>34538272
>what?
Are you bad with math? 180/115 = 1.56. That means that a 180 grain projectile is 56% more massive than a 115 grain projectile. It's 45% more than the 124 grain projectile, so I just split the difference and said "50% more massive." Do you need me to hold your hand through the rest of the calculation? Momentum is calculated as mass times velocity. Increase one value while holding the other value constant, and momentum increases proportionally.

you said,
>1150 fps is soooo much faster than 1010 fps
It's all of a 14% difference, and I've seen .40 S&W loadings that had higher velocities than that. The mass is much easier to manipulate, and thus plays a larger role in a projectile's momentum. This is why .357 Sig fags are so retarded. Yeah, you can neck down the cartridge to increase the velocity much higher than 9mm, but it's still a 125 grain projectile, and has less momentum than .40 S&W.

>>34538289
I said as much when I posted that, its literally the same points I made in the other thread.

People can only be medically incapacitated 2 ways with slug-chuckers (((boolits))).

A brain stem hit - the only instant and 100% guaranteed off switch.

The other way is blood loss. Blood loss via drop in blood pressure is a time-based situation with boolit wounds from handguns, even with a completely perforated heart a human being can physically function up to around 8 seconds - and that's assuming a perfect high thoracic cavity strike - gun fights are very imperfect, you might want to plan on carving out significantly more tissue.

The more tissue you crush and remove the faster blood is lost. More kinetic energy imparts more trauma, generates bigger permanent crush cavities, shatters more bones and drives pieces of those bones further with more energy, lacerating and causing more hemorrhaging.

.40 is wily and recognized as high energy, laws of physics dictate equal and opposite reactions. If your rounds dump more trauma imparting, tissue crushing kinetic energy into the target it's perfectly reasonable to expect more fight from the gun in return.

Typically, for an advanced level shooter (someone at the 60%-75% mark) .40 S&W adds about ~.10-.15 seconds to splits which is proportionally almost exactly how much more energy they dump in to the target than 9x19 (~50% more) - In my opinion it's a side-grade, a fair trade, whatever you want to call it. The numbers actually skew in favor of the .40S&W but as stated I'm also assuming an advanced level of shooting from the operator so there is discrepancy.

>>34535799
That file name

My sides

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>>34538324
>I tossed his range bag out past the firing line, and everyone took a couple shots at it.

>>34535799
>ratedfor50AE
kek

>>34538374
You are presuming mass and velocity have parity in EK. The equation is Ek = ½mv2. Notice velocity is squared?

>>34538622
we lie in an age where the response to any caliber argument is "only shot placement and penetration matter"

Then when you link to a 5.7x28 EFK round meeting the FBI min penetration and ask people to explain how that round causes the same trauma as a 9x19 they call you a retarded faggot.

But then you ask those same people to explain how a 9x19 causes the same trauma as a .40 S&W and they tell you only penetration and shot placement matter....

>>34537432
>>34537432
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7V6SvVocu5o [Remove]
His family structure seems a lot different than mine was. The top won't carry out violence but delegate it downward but being so low on the totem they already got another fight match lined up. This guy puts holes in that was a pretty common theme.

>>34536330
>notall

I highly doubt that. It's the religious nutjobs that are fighting for some sort of ridiculous glory. Everyone else stays out of the way because they either want the US cleaning up these nutjobs or aren't stupid enough to try and take on a heavily armed infantry.

>>34538665
People argue about which bullet they like best the same way people argue over which (car, shoe, gun, mattress, home style, temperature, color, brand of underwear) is best.

You arent smart for pointing it out, you're a retard for thinking that means anything.

>>34538622
>Ek
Do you have dyslexia or just lack a basic understanding of mechanics? I said momentum, not kinetic energy. The equation is p = mv. Notice how neither m nor v are squared? Muzzle energy is a lot less relevant to the way we use bullets. A 7.62x25 Tokarev bullet has 500+ ft-lbs of muzzle energy, which sounds like a lot, until you realize that those 85 grain bullets basically just dump all of their energy into the first thing they hit and create a massive, shallow wound cavity. You need a heavier projectile to break bones and still retain enough of its initial muzzle energy do any damage to the organs that might be behind them.

>>34538665
>But then you ask those same people to explain how a 9x19 causes the same trauma as a .40 S&W
It doesn't. You can test it with a Paul Harrell-designed meat target.

>>34537609
I know right? They could have just let them finish setting up the IED and disarmed it once they left.

>>34536880
leave

>>34538665
You are correct, there is a belief among the gun community that only the "correct" caliber is worthwhile.
This has been going on for at least fifty years. If it wasn't 9mm it was 40S&W, if it wasn't 40S&W it was 10mm, if it wasn't 10mm it was .357, and so on and so forth.

Spreading disinformation, like .40SW having %50 more energy, will get us nowhere and continue to perpetuate the same pseudoscience that got us into this place.

A 124gr +P Gold Dot will have (rounding) ~410 ft-lbs of energy, where a 180gr Gold dot will have ~420 ft-lbs of energy. The difference is a mere 2.4%.

Where the 40S&W really shines is in barrier penetration. The sectional density of the bullet and extra mass can have a large effect when used on auto glass or other barriers.

>>34538835
t-that's my point, it's a double standard, how did I not make that clear in my post?

>>34538879
thank you, fucking thank you. In a world of insanity and an institutional talking points rather than practical application of logic and culminated and quantified data, there is hope.

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>>34535799
Dubs
File Name

>>34538879
>like .40SW having %50 more energy
This is the second time you've misquoted me.

>>34538879
>>34538899
Why do I get the feeling that you're replying to yourself to avoid addressing me calling you out for misquoting me constantly?

>>34538272
you aren't all that terribly good at maths, are you?

>>34535814
Definitely. He is a wealth of knowledge like Barry was. After Barry died I actually cried. IV went to shit after that. Too much fuckin shilling not even close to what it was with the old boy.

>>34536971
If you listen to his whole talk on springs, he says that he has had some guns lose spring tension over time and others function just fine. Again, he basically says "Here is the info, do with it what you will"

And by the by, most law enforcement agencies recommend rotating your magazines out of service every 3 months.

>>34537938
Not that I know how a sociopath happens, but he went and protected someone else. It sounds like a bunch of bullshit you'd smear him over it.

>>34538821
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEnfCNcGNRU
you're 100% right, a round well regarded for it's penetrating capabilities is shit because of momentum, something that no one else but you, apparently, uses to measure bullet weight

>>34538919
Not sure why you (you)'d me but who ever you're mad at isn't me

>>34538879
energy =/= momentum
energy =/= mass

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>>34538919
>>34538947

>>34538940
*effectiveness not weight

>>34538965
you still misquoted him

>>34538965
Great. Now can you stop strawmanning my argument and address what I actually said? Otherwise, kindly neck yourself.

>>34538940
>be talking about momentum as it relates to hard barrier penetration
>this fag comes along with a video of a bullet penetrating soft gelatin without any barriers whatsoever thinking that he just "showed" me
I don't know where you came from, but fuck off back there. Adults are talking in this thread.

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>ob !YsCdAdj/mY

Adding this one to the Filtered list.

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>>34538992
jesus christ, you are daft, you're the one who's on the defensive, all you fucking parrots can't even formulate a cognitive sequitur position without relying on esoteric facile talking points or you just outright avoid a legitimate exchange of information.

What should I expect? These are the people we're arguing with. (webm related)

>>34539065
Why are you posting without your trip?

>>34536306
I would have shot the guy too.

I know that if every good man killed an evil man there would be no more evil men. I think he believes this too.

>>34539103
Why are you implying that penetration and shot placement are the only two factors in handgun wounding? If that was the case wouldn't a Kel-Tec PMR30 be the perfect self defense tool given the capacity, penetration and shot placement capabilities?

Are you willing to concede there are larger variables at play? Despite you're retarded parroted talking points that you vomit daily?

I'm sorry the lil tripfag booty blasted you, he might be a fag but being that ass blasted by him definitely reveals your power level. (((it's low)))

>>34536496
It's a challenge to convince the grunts, they don't understand the imperial propaganda, They signed on for the scheckles and glory.

Most normies wouldn't die/kill for only freedom and independence in return. That's "crazy".

>>34538992
Ok, your argument is that momentum matters more so than anything else.
In this case, we should all be carrying 45 Long Colt.
250gr @ 1000 fps = 250000 /226000 = 1.106 pound seconds momentum
vs 180gr @ 1010 fps = 181800 / 226000 = .804 pound seconds momentum
vs 124gr @ 1220 = 151280 / 226000 = .669 pound seconds momentum
9mm has 13.5% less momentum than 40S&W, which has a whopping 37% less momentum than 45 Long Colt.
All hail the King, baby.

>>34539143
>Why are you implying that penetration and shot placement are the only two factors in handgun wounding?
Would you like to make the case that they aren't? If so, do so.

>If that was the case wouldn't a Kel-Tec PMR30 be the perfect self defense tool given the capacity, penetration and shot placement capabilities?
What went wrong with your train of thought that you arrived at this question? How is it that you think the 40 grain .22 WMR projectile, traveling at about 1000-1100 fps out of a pistol barrel, is comparable to a 180 grain projectile traveling at about the same velocity? I would really like to know!!

>you're retarded parroted talking points that you vomit daily?
I'm going to have to ask you to put your trip back on, ob. Go back to whatever containment thread spawned you until you learn to speak to other people with a little bit more respect.

>>34538272
Shot placement is king. Gtfo 40fags.

>>34538324
I was there. It was a fud bath.

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>>34539174
All that effort and the cry babbby blocked you prior, a shame.

Don't drag the convo down to that pedantic level though, when some retard talks about ballistics never take your real, logical data and format it into talking points digestible by /k/ in reductive one liners, it literally only undermines legitimate and intellectual points.

The best response to the wave of ballistic Einsteins is simple sequitur, logical reasoning, it breaks them like twigs, they can only exist in the compartmentalized vacuum, it's the one environment they can survive because in that vacuum its a 1:1 scenarios they've read about (non academically) and they're comfortable defending it.

>>34539212
Nice non answers and deflecting, you are skilled at internet retarded bullshit, good job

>FBI "made" .40 it must be better
>FBI switching to 9mm
lol

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>>34539244
I'm sorry, I have never heard anyone say that momentum matters for anything except hunting large game. I just had to say something.

It is true, though, that it is easy to argue about guns and ballistics if you've never shot or owned one.

I admire your collection, have you received anything new recently?

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>>34536396

>>34536210
>To begin with, the last of the day's light was taken up with caring for Mills who was still alive when they arrived at 5:30 p.m., but died later at St. Mary Medical Center in Walla Walla.

5.56 btfo. Cant even kill a man reliably with 6 shots.

>>34538879
>Where the 40S&W really shines is in barrier penetration. The sectional density of the bullet and extra mass can have a large effect when used on auto glass or other barriers.

I only slightly agree. Welcome to 2017. I now raise you bullet design.

http://libertyammunition.com/product/civil-defense-9mm

MAC is a fucking moron for shilling IWI but here is his test video

enough.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nr6h44Pu4sM

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>>34539174
Let me summarize my argument for you, since you appear to be retarded.

Somebody said "Modern 9mm hollowpoints are just as effective as .40" (>>34538155).

I then countered this by pointing out the absurdity of such a claim, highlighting momentum being the main difference between the two calibers, with the implication that such a difference in momentum would necessarily result in different ballistics, and explaining when that difference would come into play (>>34538215).

Then you (or somebody) voiced your incredulity in a nonsensical way while failing to understand the math underlying what I'd just said (>>34538272).

I clarified (>>34538374).

Then you put on your tripcode and made an even more retarded post, conflating momentum with kinetic energy (>>34538622).

I once again clarified (>>34538821).

Several retards had a side conversation and jacked themselves off in their misunderstanding (>>34538665 >>34538879 >>34538899).

I started to get annoyed (>>34538919).

A wild retard appeared (>>34538940).

I corrected him (>>34539039).

I challenged you to start using your brain (>>34538992).

Someone filtered you (>>34539049).

You projected (>>34539065).

You or someone else was retarded and once again misunderstood what is being talked about (>>34539143).

I challenged him/you to use his brain/your brain before replying to me next time (>>34539212).

You have engaged in another logical fallacy, this time moving the goalposts for no reason. The conversation was about whether 9mm and .40 are different. Why you brought up .45 LC is beyond me, but you ended your post with some kind of weird tagline, most likely projecting again - probably repeating what your mother says to you when she's sick of your bullshit (>>34539174).

I think if there's one take-away from all this, it's that I have demonstrated an immense amount of patience in wading through all of your bullshit to show you how wrong you are, despite the fact that you continue to act like an asshole.

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>>34539281
But but .40 is a bigguh boolit how cud that be??

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>>34539288
I might be on your side per conversation topic and logical, non retarded reasoning, but you're still tripfagging outside of quarantine so fuck off with that.

I mean we can be familiar and all, but I'm gonna have to call you a bitch in public, I hope you understand.

>>34539288
What the hell is wrong with your computer's font? Are you on some weird version of Linux?

>>34539343
That's fine. I forgot to take it off when I started posting and figured the damage had already been done. Now we just have king autismo here making himself look like a fool accusing everyone of being me w/o trip

>>34539377
nah it's win10 and I'm running Flux

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>>34539377
font looks like Roboto or poppins, obviously one of the lt of thin versions

>>34539389
Explain how I made "myself look like a fool." From my count, I have convinced you of the veracity of my argument, which is implicit in your post here: >>34539174

If you still don't understand what my argument was after I even outlined the conversation for you, then you have no business replying to me.

>>34539413
>veracity

You act as if your contaminated opinion reflects reality, it doesn't. Physics (at least while observed and enacted on this planet) are quantifiable, observable and documented to an academic degree to allow us to infer and extrapolate accurate and impressive conclusions on a plethora of physically (quantum physics) related topics.

You are a luddite, sir, you a conformist, a parrot, you don't understand what you say, you just relay reductive non-contextual talking points on quasi related subjects as fact, it's embarrassing, I can't even respond to you on a terminal ballistic academically focused level because you don't have a foundation for the skyscraper you are trying to convince me you have built.

Yikes

>>34539473
>opinion
You misspelled fact.

>>34539413
Leave him be he's to far gone to re-tract his statement

>>34536330
Semites don't have a nationalist mindset like that, besides Egyptians and Libyans. They have a tribal mindset. They have no concept of "their country" and their greatest enemies are the other tribes a few dozen miles from them. They would rather work with Americans to destroy their tribal enemies than unite with their tribal enemies to oust Americans.

>>34539500
>opinion
>You misspelled fact.

The measurable and defined reactionary position of a Luddite, ladies and gents. Your parents are either retarded or ashamed, that's not an insult, just an observation.

>>34536071
Yeager has killed lots of people. And that's not a joke about the ambush in Iraq.

>>34539530
Can you try again without all the buzzwords? Who am I kidding, of course you can't.

>>34537609
With bar guy he pulled a pistol out and threatened to shoot us while waving it around. As I drew my gun he leveled off, I ended up shooting him first. Pretty sure his drunken state was the only thing that allowed me to get my shot off first.

With IED bro's, I didn't HAVE ago do shit. I WANTED to. Of course that's not how it officially went.

>>34539725
>Can you try again without all the buzzwords?
Sure can. you're a stupid faggot and you don't know shit, go to bed you have an early class.

>>34539335
This is one of the most intricate posts I've ever seen on 4chan. Good job

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>>34539784
>>34539530
>>34539473
This is so cringey to read.

>>34540350
Wow, impressive contribution. I'm sure you are a distinguished shooter. Next time just lurk.

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>>34540580
>trying to get in the last word even when you have nothing to say

>last word
Is that what we're doing?

OK good. You are a dumb child faggot who couldn't operate his transgender way out of a paper bag, if you want to have a discussion, or better yet, a range session regarding real pistol shooting and defensive practices, I'll be around.

Fucking East Coast cry Babbie and their own dick jammed in their ass, I'm ashamed I grew up there.

>>34537587

People who might wear armor anywhere other than at the computer or larping on the range.

>>34540350
>look at this faggot and laugh

>>34540350
wait, really? you don't know the area?

sheesh what are you going to do when dad stops paying for your board?

>>34539628
who has he killed?

>>34540676
Type 3 doesn't weigh much more, isn't much thicker and will do a lot more.

If you think what you are doing might get you shot at 3 is the new minimum.

>>34540950
...what? Are you fucking retarded? Type III is going into ceramics and steels, IIIA is fine against 99% of what the average cop/ security guy is going to face without suiting up in steels.

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THIS WAS A GOOD THREAD UNTIL AUTISTIC PEOPLE STARTED ARGUING ABOUT 9MM v. 40S/W.

@34540580
@34540699
@34540713
>it wasn't enough to get the last word, I need to show him who's boss!

>>34539495
That was funny, surprised by the effectiveness of the 3A give how shot up it had been.

Although the concussive blow that punches through is enough to not want to be shot even with the body armour there.

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>>34536396
Ebin

>>34536971
There is such a thing as spring creep, and it depends on the load, duration, and environment. A properly designed spring will be fine, an underdesigned one won't.

>>34539335
Nice

>>34540751
teammates

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>posted in this thread yesterday
>wake up to this shitshow

Fucking stop.

40S&W more reliably penetrates farther while expanding more.

There is literally nothing up for debate there, and if a pistol round expands more, and penetrates more, it's a more lethal round.

All this fucking extremely autistic debate about slight changes in kinetic energy are retarded, because neither round will cause enough damage thru hydrostatic shock to matter.

>>34540751
He has been in numerous shootings, both as a cop and a defense contractor. He has said he has killed people and there are records of it.
I don't know the names of all the sand monkeys and niggers though.
>>34541622
>If I was in an ambush in a foreign country this is what I would have done because I'm so oper8r and bad ass.
You are more of a try-hard faggot than Yeager has ever been.

>>34538940
>tfw losing an argument about caliber so i try to change the subject back to shooting gel blocks and shot placement

>>34538155
>That is factually incorrect, FBI developed .40 because
Well if that's a fact whom exactly are you quoting as to why the FBI did that? What's the source, at some point this "fact" came from the horses mouth whom exactly are you quoting, and from what conversation did this little tidbit of a fact come from? I'm a little curious how you got to be privileged with this factoid.

>>34536188
Is it Brent 0331? Love that dudes channel!

>>34542683
Hey retard
>Although it was selected for service by the Federal Bureau of Investigation in 1989 from the aftermath of the 1986 FBI Miami shootout, the cartridge was later decommissioned (except by the Hostage Rescue Team and Special Weapons and Tactics Teams) after their Firearms Training Unit eventually concluded that its recoil was excessive in terms of training for average agents' and police officers' competency of use and qualification.

Literally the second paragraph on the wiki page, citation at the bottom of that page.

Of course that is generally assumed to mean woman and office workers couldnt qualify with 10mm, seeing as how the agents who were actually expected to use it stuck with it, (the HRT teams) and now that fbi has dropped 40 for 9, its self evident that if you cant have 10mm, you might as well have 9mm isntead of a gay half measure of both, but the benefits of neither

>>34542957
That paragraph is on the wiki for 10mm, describing the conditions when they rejected 10mm and got ammo companies to make .40. My bad didnt post link.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/10mm_Auto

>>34542957
Is the .40 S&W not more powerful than 9mm?

Where does this "Benefit of Neither" meme even come from?

>>34543070
Not as powerful as 10mm, not as light shooting or the capacity of 9mm. Orginally it was even thought they could just sub 40 in 9mm guns which broke a lot of guns, so the guns arent as light as 9mm either. A shitty half measure all around.

>>34543070
talking to cops at the range, they all agree that .40 lacks necessary stopping power and say you need at least 9mm

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>>34539335
>when the doctor of an asylum gets so annoyed he starts screaming back at the patients

You know they're arguing with the voices in their heads too.

>>34543187
All the ones near me think it's the tits but only because the FBI uses (used) it. I usually show them the report from the FBI that shows all the common calibers pretty much do the same thing and they go "oh..."

>>34543233
I've read the reports too, the dimensions and other numbers look pretty similar but these guys (texas cops) swear the .40 sucks in real life application because of generally worse penetration and mag capacity

>>34542957
okay einstein, good job you found the quote, now which part is the citation for where it came from, who put it on the wiki. It doesn't seem to specify anything about women and "sissy wristed" guys, in fact it also says it included police officers and not just the FBI.

Sounds like you heard a meme, then taken it as a "fact" and just started regurgitating it like a high schooler or woman does when they hear gossip.

>>34543110
So a slightly heavier gun

>Glock 22 weight
34OZ Loaded.....

>Glock 17 Weight
32OZ Loaded....

For a more powerful round...

>.40S&W
180g @ 1000 FPS or,
135g @ 1350 FPS

>9mm
124g @ 1060fps or
147g @ 950 fps

The .40 is a more powerful round than 9mm by any metric imaginable. It is also only marginally heavier. How is that a bad trade off?

Explain yourself.

>>34543471
Look faggot, I gave you a source, a citation and a quote, do you wanna keep moving goalposts or do you wanna defend you point that .40 isnt a shitty half measure?

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>>34543533
Because its not 10mm. It dosent have the power of 10mm which makes up for 10mm's lower capacity and higher weight, and its not as light, light shooting, or has the capacity of 9mm.
If Im going to drop 9mm for something bigger why wouldnt I go with 10mm? if I wanted something with more capacity and lighter shooting why wouldnt I go with 9mm? The FBI agrees with me.

.40 is the ballistic equivalent of an El camino. Not the hauling capacity of a truck, not the comfort or ease of use as a car.

Just a shitty half measure.

>>34543541
I didn't move the goal post, I asked you where it came from and a citation--- who said it-- from the start.

You believe everything you see on tv too?

>>34543624
I already provided that information.

>>34543597
Can we all take a second to acknowledge how idiotic this argument is?

Are you daft?

The 10mm most people even shoot is literally 40S&W P+ lmao

10mm fags are the most nonsensical people in the gun community

10mm gun options also FUCKING SUCK and are horribly finicky

>>34543533
It's terminal ballistics efficacy is essentially the same as 9mm terminal ballistics with modern expanding ammo.

>>34543655
You're wrong though.

You get several more inches of penetration with .40 than equivalent 9mm loads, with more expansion.

.40 EASILY meets the FBIs 18" gel test and reliably expands whereas only a few loads in 9mm both expand adequately and penetrate past the 14" point.

.40S&W is simply a more powerful round, can we stop this nonsense?

>>34543641
Plug in .357mag, and .38 special into each one of those sentences and youll see that your wrong. Here Ill do it for you so you can see how stupid your being

>The .357 magnum most people even shoot is literally .38 special P+ lmao
>.357 magnum fags are the most nonsensical people in the gun community
>.357 Magnum gun options also FUCKING SUCK and are horribly finicky


Because that is almost exactly the same relationship between 10mm and .40

>>34543712
What are you even talking about?

I'm saying most defensive loads for 10mm are almost exactly the same as .40 S&W defensive loads, and few guns can reliably shoot the original hot 10mm loads, nor would you even want to shoot the original 10mm loads for self defense.

.40 and watered down 10mm(IE, 80% of what's on the market) already meets 18" of FBI standard gel testing penetration.

So why on gods earth would you step up to 10mm and start losing the quick follow up shots you can achieve with .40?

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>>34543633
Alright I see you already taxed your handful of braincells having to find a wikipedia stub.
>Look there is a citation at the bottom of the page! I DONT KNOW WHICH ONE LOL BUT ITS GOTTA BE TRUE!

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>>34543738
>I'm saying most defensive loads for .357 magnum are almost exactly the same as .38 special defensive loads, and few guns can reliably shoot the original hot .357 magnum loads, nor would you even want to shoot the original .357 magnum loads for self defense.
>.38 special and watered down .357 magnum(IE, 80% of what's on the market) already meets 18" of FBI standard gel testing penetration.
>So why on gods earth would you step up to .357 magnum and start losing the quick follow up shots you can achieve with .38 special?

Because you're retarded apparently. .40 fags are really butthurt about their purchases.

>>34543690
how can gel blocks be wrong, it's all about shot placement! stopping power is a meme otherwise if i chose anything than a 9 I'd go with a 10 because stopping power! anything short doesn't have the stopping power even though it's bigger heavier and faster, those are all bad things it'll break a 9mm pistol and you'd lose a bullet, capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity
See how many times I wrote capacity? That's how many bullets my 9 has
capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacitycapacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity capacity
that's how many a 40 has, you see how big of a different that is?

>>34541051
>@
Go back to wherever you came from.

>>34543712
Just to further my point.

.40 S&W Federal HST 180g

>18.5" of penetration
>.72" of expansion

This is literally perfect.

Whereas
9mm Hornady 135g Critical Defense P+

>18.1 of Penetration
>only .47" of expansion

Both under FBI Gel block protocol.

.40S&W simply expands more when given the same penetration.

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>>34543834
>Just to further my point.

>>34543803
I carry a .38 Special revolver lmao

I know you carry a 9mm.

>>34543810
If we're talking service sized handguns (17rounds of 9mm, 15 rounds of .40)

We're talking about a loss of 2 rounds (out of more than a dozen) for better killing power.

I think that's a fair trade.

Gel Blocks are just a scientific way to measure the objective power of a round.

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>>34543887
I actually carry pic related, an old .357, i still think .40 is a shitty half measure.

>>34543810
They shot a capacity capacity capacity of 9mm at matix and Platt in miami but even with all that capacity in them they kept shooting back more effectively ... with less capacity capacity. So what's was that point again?

>>34543947
only 10mm has stopping power
women and sissy faggot men are preventing real men from being men using big boy guns with recoil
if it doesn't has stopping power it has to have capacity and be in 9mm otherwise the bullets are weaker than 9mm while beating the gun up with the excessive extra power, 40sw dumps all it's stopping power into the gun instead of targets so it works exactly the same as a 9mm except it beats your gun up faster.

Gosh this is a stupid conversation.

I believed the memes and regretted buying my .40 Sig for over a decade, until I saw Paul's video.

The more powerful round is more powerful. End of discussion. Does the increased power justify the slightly small capacity and slightly higher recoil? You be the judge.

>>34544034
>You be the judge.
EVIDENTLY this triggers the insecure 9mm users. Shame they had to ruin this thread with their autistic screeching. How dare somebody have a different opinion than them.

>>34537755
Euro laws are diff.

>>34542957
"but the benefits of neither"

>allows for the design of high capacity pistols, as with 9mm
>uses projectiles that have effective barrier penetration, as with .45

Sounds like .40 is the best of both worlds to me.

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>>34544926
>listening to a euro talk about guns

Bruh thats even worse.

>>34544956
Pic related

>>34538324
I have a Glawk .40 with a 9mm conversion and soon a .357 sig barrel if all goes well.

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>>34539212
it's all about energy transfer. There's a reason holopoints exist. figure it out.

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>>34543655
>misspelling "its"
>making up a vapid phrase like "terminal ballistics efficacy"
>"'essentially' the same"
>mentions 9mm "modern" hollow points, while ignoring .40 hollow points, as if those don't benefit from the same modern advancements in bullet engineering

I'm gonna give you a 2/10. Some retards might fall for this.

>>34543690
>You get several more inches of penetration with .40 than equivalent 9mm loads, with more expansion.

Penetration depth isn't a really informative metric. You can design a hollow point so it consistently penetrates to only a certain depth in gel. The important test is how much the projectile will penetrate after breaking through a hard barrier. A lot of people cite "car doors" and "windshield glass" here, but a much more relevant example of a hard barrier would be a bone.

>>34543712
>>.357 Magnum gun options also FUCKING SUCK and are horribly finicky
Are you trying to imply that I can shoot 10mm out of my M&P40?

Reason why FBI switched to 9mm was not because "it's better" or "it's equal", but because it's good enough with much lower recoil

>>34545106
The same way you can shoot .357 out of a .38 revolver you idiot.

Jesus christ read the context

>>34543803
Stop strawmanning. He is correct that the Colt Delta Elite and Glock 20, which I'd argue are the most popular pistols in this caliber, both have issues with hot 10mm loadings, either exploding or cycling.

>>34543820
It's to not give him (You)'s, newfag.

>>34536075
I know right his channel is pure education

>>34536396
>mine didnt grow.
You can't water them, so they only grow in really hot places like the desert.

>>34545129
So buy a gun built for the 10mm, not a shitty retrofit of an existing design. The same way drop in .40 barrels make 9mms explode, starting the whole glocknade meme.

>>34544979
>Pic related
What?

>>34544999
What?

>>34545125
In other words, you admit that your analogy is completely pants-on-head retarded?

>>34537405
>Its not a scientific test
It could be.

>>34545159
>So buy a gun built for the 10mm, not a shitty retrofit of an existing design.
Name a single one that fits this criterion.

>>34545178
Bren-ten.
>>34545165
see
>>34543597
>.40 is the ballistic equivalent of an El camino. Not the hauling capacity of a truck, not the comfort or ease of use as a car.
>Just a shitty half measure.

>>34536496
Leftist pussy right here guys

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>>34545218
>Bren-ten.
>not a retrofit of an existing gun
wewlad.

>>34545218
>>.40 is the ballistic equivalent of an El camino. Not the hauling capacity of a truck, not the comfort or ease of use as a car.
>>Just a shitty half measure.
9mm Luger compared against 7.65mm Browning is the equivalent of an El Camino. Not the hauling capacity of a truck, not the comfort or ease of use as a car. Just a shitty compromise round.

>>34545249
"The Bren Ten models borrow some traits from the famous CZ-75 pistol design, however the "ten" was designed from scratch for the 10mm round and is not an offshoot of the CZ line of firearms."

Its actually closer to the Hi Power internally, and borrows aesthetic features from the cz75.

>>34545271
Think of your own metaphors next time.

>>34545272
Just like how the S&W 1006 was designed from scratch and is not an off-shoot of the 5906. Did you get your high school degree from Wikipedia too?

>>34545283
Use better metaphors that are less easily defeated next time. Preferably metaphor that actually make any sense.

>>34544956
>>allows for the design of high capacity pistols, as with 9mm
9mm has high capacity, 40 can't have high capacity, 9 is the highest capacity. Being less than 9 makes it low capacity.
40fags btfo 9mm best mm, why use 40 when you can just get a 10 instead and have STOPPING POWA

>>34545409
5.7x28 has high capacity, 9mm can't have high capacity, 5.7x28 is the highest capacity. Being less than 5.7 makes it low capacity.
9mmfags btfo 5.7mm best mm, why use 9 when you can just get a 40 instead and have STOPPAN POWAH

You're retarded.

>>34543287
Not too surprised since texas cops used to carry .41 mag fairly commonly

>>34536880

You are getting shit for this, but you are 100% correct

His mindset is based as fuck, but he has a very fudd-like opinion in the face of overwhelming evidence which is common in the gun world.

>>34537405

Properly calibrated gel is more effective to test cartridges. It's literally why the FBI created the standard instead of "shootan' jugs".

Plus look, when your shooting was with an AR-15 which ended it fast, why recommend anything else in the world of sub $400 AR-15s.

>>34541291
This desu, that concussion alone could probably kill you if it hit the right organs.

>>34538166

It's also is less accurate, harder to shoot, wears the fuck out of firearms, being dropped by it's creators and most LE, and expansion benefits are not significant than 9mm.

9mm is literally the universal service cartridge, and the only other service pistol calibers that are worth it are .45ACP and .38 Special that are American as fuck.

/ak/ stream night
we're going to watch CatShitOne, GunsmithCats and Upotte! They will start after "shoot 'em up" finishes, which I just put on as a place holder.

Post /ak/ girls and guns ITT
livestream
DOT
com
/7hateslivestream

>>34539335

Real World:

All service pistol rounds are shit. Buy the one that hits 12"-18" of penetration and has the most rounds.

If you are planning on being in a real fight, you need a fucking carbine.

>>34545882
>It's also is less accurate,
Straight up lie.
>harder to shoot,
There is a lot of variability here. I do not like the S&W Shield 40, I think that's so snappy and the grip texture so slippery that the gun tends to slip out of my hand. But I shoot a UPS40 and Glock 23 practically as well as any 9mm pistol, with the difference only measured in milliseconds.
>wears the fuck out of firearms,
No one who posts on /k/ will ever shoot their guns enough for this to be an issue.
>being dropped by it's creators and most LE,
Irrelevant bandwagon fallacy unless you follow LE adoption so closely that you previously owned only .40 caliber handguns "because that's what the police use."
>and expansion benefits are not significant than 9mm.
Straight up lie. Do you think that a .35 caliber bullet expands more than a .40 caliber bullet given the same projectile technology?

>>34545925
Great job. You read through the entire conversation and still didn't understand what it was about.

>>34536218
He shot because the man driving the truck (Mills I think his name was) reversed at a high speed directly towards a car which Paul's wife was hiding behind. If he had continued at the speed he was at he would have ran into the car and crushed his wife. One thing I found interesting about the story is that it snowed 2 inches the following night.

>Kill a guy in self-defense
>2 feet of snow cover up all evidence for your case

I doubt think he slept much that night. When the snow melted they found that the tire tracks of Mill's truck were indeed heading toward the car Paul's wife was hiding behind, and at the right speed it would have been potentially fatal, matching Paul's claim.

>>34541685

And the FBI is dropping .40 along with about every LE organization because there hasn't been any issues with 9mm.

The issues are lol pistol caliber is not a rifle or pump/auto shotgun.

>>34545947
I disagree, Paul seems like a very hard boi despite his warm demeanor, I bet he's the type who could sleep like a baby after that.

>>34543533

Modern 9mm expands nearly same size, it's not as wearing on firearms, you can carry more rounds, you get fast follow up shots, and it's the standard worldwide caliber.

It's better than dumbass Fudd-logic back when gun companies needed more sales

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>>34535708
Always reminds me of...

...and of my dad.

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>>34545043
>penetration depth isn't a reliable metric
>hard barrier penetration is

Are you actually retarded?

>>34545979
Follow up shots are nearly just as fast in a .40 S&W service handgun when compared to 9mm.

Most 9mm loads that penetrate to 18" during the FBI Test only expand to about .50" whereas federal HST in .40(can be found literally everywhere) expands to .74" while also penetrating to 18".

The .40 load is also heavier, and therefor would deform less going thru a barrier.

Stop this madness.

>>34536496
>sandniggers
>human
Lel

>>34546046
>informative
>reliable

What is the deal with people misquoting me in this fucking thread? If you can't understand a word in someone's post, look it up in a dictionary; don't just paraphrase by substituting some other word at random.

The topic of my post was meant to address this comment: >>34543655
>It's terminal ballistics efficacy is essentially the same as 9mm terminal ballistics with modern expanding ammo.

Barrier penetration is the metric that INFORMS you of the fact that the cartridges are not "essentially the same." Since .40 caliber hollow points are designed to penetrate to about the same depth as all other service calibers, you're not being informed of any differences in the ballistics by looking at that metric.

Stop replying to me unless you're going to read my posts for comprehension BEFORE typing out your comment. Use a dictionary before replying to me next time.

>people call Paul a fudd because he says from a purely mathematical perspective .40 S&W is more brutal than 9mm
>when his carry and duty guns are 9mm
>when he carries a .25 pocket pistol
>when his SHTF pistol is a 5.7, king of muh shot placement guns
As always, Paul is a good boy who is giving information without advice. Make your own choices.
I want someone from Patreon to convince Paul to do a joke video where he has visor sunglasses, a made-up Harrell Tactical shirt, his handlebar stache, and keeps mentioning how many people he's killed; starting casually and by the end of the video talking like he's committed wartime atrocities alone. Then a story about how a guy with a 8" 1911, steel wrists, and recently converted to the LDS Church can beat any armor.

>>34545948
If whatever caliber the FBI uses is so important, then I assume you used .40 exclusively prior to about 2012?

>>34545979
I feel like I've read this post dozens of times already in this thread, and every single time, you get BTFO in the same way.

>>34546086
>What is the thing with people misquoting me in this fucking thread?
don't talk to me or my short and weak rounds ever again

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>>34546104
>thing

>>34545178
Glock 20.

Yankee Marshal says the same thing, in a less polite manner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77ct95sfRMo

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>>34535952
>His videos on bullet drop
do you think he really had a retard who thought that a .30-30 was going to drop 20 inches 70 yards from the place it was fired

>>34538324
Top kek well done

>>34546120
>thang
To propel a heavier bullet to speeds around the same as 9mm it requires more force. More force is more recoil equal and opposite reactions. Cherry picking gel test results is kind of silly hollowpoints are not consistent and there isn't really any proof they expand in gel the same way they expand in flesh. 9mm just has less material to expand there is no way it's going to perform as close to what a 40 can do.

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>>34536396

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Gunssmith Cats starts in 5

livestream
DOT
com
/7hateslivestream

>>34538215
This really depends on the loading.

Buffalo Bore 9 +p+
147grn @ 1400 f/s = 205800 grn*f/s

Double Tap 40 S&W
180 grn @ 1100 f/s = 198000 grn*f/s

9mm +P+ brings more to the table than some 40 loadings.

>>34546454
Highly doubt that load would get to 1400 with a 147G bullet out of a pistol

I also can't imagine that would be safe to fire in most 9mms and reliably run in guns that could safely fire it.

>>34546454
Dude you're actually straight up wrong.

BB 147g 9mm only reaches 1150 FPS.

And that's in a +p+ loading

And it's still a smaller, lighter bullet than most .40

>>34546454
Where are you getting these numbers? The manufacturer indicates that this is a 1150 fps loading.

>https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=120
>Item 24C/20 (+p+) 147gr. Jacketed Hollow Point
>1179 fps -- Browning Hi Power MK111, 4.6 inch barrel
>1131 fps -- Beretta 92F, 4.9 inch barrel
>1165 fps -- Glock 19, 4.0 inch barrel

It's also pretty retarded to compare a +P+ loading that may be safe to fire a few rounds of, but not really good for your gun to train with, with a standard pressure loading from another caliber. If you want to push those kinds of numbers and deal with that kind of recoil, just buy a .40S&W to begin with!

>>34535814
Shilling on here got me to view
Best practical gun youtube channel

>>34546500
>>34546529
>>34546551

You guys are right, I transposed my numbers.

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>>34543863
>tfw no Pontiac G8 GT Ute
Fuck you, man. It still hurts.

>>34546454
>9mm +P+ brings more to the table than some 40 loadings.
Right because that is going to wear your gun a lot less than 40, and it's not like you can't get +p 40

>>34535708
I stare back