.22 vs .357 vs 9mm

>>34515978
>Reasoning is that he doesn't want to kill anyone.
he knows .22 kills a lot of people every year right, and that a gun is designed explicitly to kill something?

>>34515978
If you shoot someone it's because you need to kill them.

It's only justified if you are in fear for your life. And if that's the case you don't want 22. As much because rimfire sucks as the weak ass round.

>>34515978
It's either shoot to kill or go to prison.
That's basically the law here anyway.

>>34515978
handguns only kill someone 1 out of 7 times someones shot, and thats all calibers. at least get a .380 or 9mm it wont kill them plus theyre centerfire, rimfire is unreliable - thats actually a good arguement

NOW GIT OUT

Fine, let him get a .22 handgun.
a .22 magnum.

Shoot him

>>34516021
>As much because rimfire sucks as the weak ass round.
It's the ricochet round, it ricochets and you'll become such a skilled shot you can stop them with one hit to the leg, git gud the leg shot won't kill or ricochet into the brain to bounce around 6 times, the ricochet round can bounce around up to 6 times in the skull.

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>>34515996
He knows, he's just trying to minimize the chance.
>>34516025
What state?
>>34516061
Irrelevant, people have shit aim.
>>34516141
My guess is that would be too powerful

>>34516061
That's why you aim for the head.
I also doubt you're surging a heart shot.

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>>34515978
Get him a PMR-30.

Buy him a 5-7 and tell him it's a .22

>>34516168
CA. Applies obv to private property carry.

>>34515978
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Salisbury_Road_shooting

>>34516187
>>34516182
I'm not buying shit, I have a car and gun hobby, and that's already eating my bank account

.22-250?
or a .223 sbr/pistol if that counts.

>>34515978
Tell him a story about 1986 Miami shootout, where most of agents had 9mm guns.
https://youtu.be/04dUCT-qO3c

You need to tell him that it is only acceptable to shoot in self defense (out in public) if it is a life or death situation. If he doesn't need to kill the person he is shooting as quickly as possible, then he doesn't need to be shooting that person.

Also, show him a couple videos where wounded people continue to be a threat.

For example, this video (yes it's bloody)
https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=885_1420607869

If the guy in this video say, had a gun, he could have shot those cops.

Another video:
https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4b0_1432071639

Notice how the guy who approached the car, whom the driver shot point blank range in the fucking stomach, still managed to get some shots off.

Even shooting someone center mass is no guarantee that will immediately end the threat they pose.

So, going back to what I said: If the person you have to shoot doesn't need to die as soon as possible, then he has no legal grounds to shoot that person.

In a home, it's different. You have so much more leeway when shooting someone who is in your home. And often times being shot at scares criminals away if they are in a home.

>>34516021
It doesn't suck, it's just not designed to to reliably kill humans. Its meant for small game and plinking. It's like saying a pocket knife is useless because it won't cut down a tree.

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>>34516297
I'm going to try this.

>>34515978
>Doesn't want to kill
Tell him not to fucking bother then and just carry a fucking knife.

>>34515978
Your reasoning is correct. He is a retard.

>>34516297
>If the guy in this video say, had a gun, he could have shot those cops.
He's lucky it wasn't a hollowpoint .22 it would of expanded and ricocheted around and he'd be walking around with stumps for legs now.

>>34516316
Rimfire sucks because it's unreliable. It's like saying a car sucks because the brakes don't always work when you need them.

>>34515978

Let him know that if he doesn't kill that basket ball American then he's going to be wrongfully sewed for some reason or another and it's going to be very costly

>>34516061
So shoot them 7 times. Got it.

>>34516182
Is that a fucking compensator?

Shooting with the intention to do anything but kill/incapacitate is illegal in almost every jurisdiction. Some even have additional laws regarding "maiming". If one doesn't admit such intentions it would be hard to prove in court, but it sounds like he's naive enough to spill the beans.

>>34515978
It's not about killing. It's about stopping the threat.

Some people will stop being a threat if they see a gun, some won't.

Some people will stop being a threat after the gun is fired, some won't.

Some people will stop being a threat after they are hit, some won't.

Some people will stop being a threat when they are seriously injured, some won't.

Some people will only stop being a threat when they are incapacitated (knocked out, dead, shock from blood loss, etc). This is the only reliable way to stop a threat.

He has to make his decision about what he'll do in those situations. A realistic fake works in scenario 1 but leaves you unprepared for the others.

It normal not to want to kill people. That's how every normal adult should feel. It's a good thing for him to feel this way but he has to come to the conclusion that there are scenarios where the right thing to do it use lethal force. There are situations where nothing less than lethal will work. Ultimately, he will have to make a decision on his self defense plan and he'll have to live or die with it.

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Everyone in this fucking shit thread should be raped repeatedly with your bad dragon until you make a sincere apology to .22

>>34515978
>not shooting to kill
"Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft."
t. cowboy roosevelt, not commie roosevelt

Try some force on force in the back yard. Get a rubber knife and fake gun. See if he can even draw a tiny gun to stop you from stabbing him. That should at least convince him to get a physically larger gun which will likely be a larger round.

>>34516787
F

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The apologists in here...

>Hurr, killed more people than any other cartridge

No.

>*Insert* some dude who died from one

People have died in an inch of water - that doesn't make it normal.

>Gross misunderstanding of physics

Bullets are not flubber.

There is no such thing as a reliable semi-auto .22LR it's probably the the most overrated and shilled for cartridge in existence. If he wants to be a little bitch tell him to track down a Beretta 3032.

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>>34517961
Mossad uses .22

Just gotta get gud

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>>34517961
>low level operator can't even use .22

sad

>>34515978
get him keychain mace and some tampons.

>>34515978
Rimfire is WILDLY unreliable. There is just as much a chance he pulls that trigger and it goes click then boom.

People don't like 22lr for that reason.

>>34515978
Buy pepper spray. Firearms are inherently lethal items. If he's not willing to take the chance that he might kill using one , he might want to buy a tazer or the like. A 22lr can still kill in the right places.

>>34515978

"First and most importantly, 22lr is well known for not as reliably firing as centerfire rounds, in an automatic it's known for not cycling nearly as reliably either so don't miss. Also, I looked it up and you can see 22lr does kill often just not as quickly, someone dying in front of you versus slowly on an operating table still means you killed someone. Ask yourself, do you want a gun that pokes little holes and won't stop someone trying to hurt you immediately so they can't or do you want something dramatically more reliable and known for stopping a person sooner. Ultimately it's your money, if you just want a plinking gun that would be better to carry than nothing then it's fine, but it's an awful choice for a dedicated carry gun if you own others."

Done.

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>.22 can't kill

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Maybe go the other way with the argument. Tell him to go even smaller than the .22 Why not a .177? Why stop at .22? And them let him tell you that the .177 is too small. Then you say, "Ok so there is a point where the caliber will become insufficient by your own rationality right? That's what I have been saying about the .22." There is a window where there is a commonly accepted range of caliber to use for an intended purpose.

But even if you still can't convince him to get a larger caliber I would still let him get the .22...because after a while of being immersed in the realm of carrying he will probably come to the conclusion that he does indeed need a larger caliber. Let the .22 be his stepping stone. And yes he is a retard. But he is at least on the right path. I guess...

>>34515978
>How do I talk some sense into him?

it's his life

tell him to get a ruger sr22 pistol and practice shooting 1 & 2 handed until he can get 5" groups at 7 yards shooting about 1 a second

until then tell him he has zero sense if he starts carrying

there is so much more to CCW than what gdamn caliber somebody is using that you too are a fucking idiot if all you are doing is arguing about 22 vs 9m

safety first eh ?

holster ? what carry position ? where carry ? in the car ?

etc
etc
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