Would a deagle be a good bear defence gun?

>>34515486
I don't think so. Bears don't have opposable thumbs to hold the gun

>>34515486
they jam too much n r a meme

>>34515486
>Defence
What does it matter yuropoor? you can't own one.

>>34515746
You say that but they're made out of rugs, artwork, and delicious meat.

>>34515486
I used to own one. It jammed like crazy. I sent it back to the factory and they polished up the feed ramp and bolt, but I'd still get jams. Apparently, this is normal for these guns.

>>34515486
Why are you defending bears? Fucking PETA!

>>34515486
at least you didn't post a .44

>>34515746

I have literally seen traps with zero work who have more everything than this chick.

>>34515936
Then go jack off to them fag boy

>>34515906
They are meant to be accurate, and durable. They are not meant to be reliable and are finicky with ammo and shooting technique.

>>34516130
Theyre not finicky with ammo, they only need hot ammo in them. Shitty light loads will have problems cycling.

t. Buddy used to own one with a titanium nitride barrel. Shit was balling. Even used to carry it sometimes (IWBA No holster)

>>34515936
Fag

>>34515936
You mean you've seen men with fatter asses and bigger boobs than this woman? What a surprise.

>>34515936
I don't know why this makes me angry since she's way out of my league to begin with but I really dislike you're opinion and think you should stop posting, everywhere, forever.

>deagle
This isn't call of duty.

>>34516788
Post your guns right fucking now

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>>34516270
This. Included with the desert eagle is a card with the recommended brands of Ammo. use those and keep it clean after each shooting at the range, and the thing will run like a champ. It needs the hottest loads that can be safely loaded for each caliber in order to effectively cycle the gas system.

Brands I have found that worked:

American Eagle
Fiocchi
Priv Partizan surprisingly enough, though it definitely runs dirty and requires more aggressive cleaning after trips to the range.

Those are the ones I can remember off the top of my head.

As for the OP, I'd say .44mag is the absolute minimum I'd consider for a bear gun. Generally folks will use shotguns with slugs or lightweight rifles in order to penetrate the heavy hide/bone that a bear, particularly if you're going into Grizzly country will have. If the deagle is your only option, i'd upgrade to the .50 ae just to be on the safe side.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNR2Uh08FrA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkvORr1m1Ao

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Put this on your head and it should protecc

>>34515936
More everything including dick

friendly reminder that bear spray has higher survival rate than using a gun and, since bears dindu nuffin, it's shitty to kill them when you're the dickhead who is invading their territory

>>34517049
>44mag is the absolute minimum I'd consider for a bear gun
What about retard hot 357 mag? Like the Underwood meme penetratior.

>>34517629
You realize that's the same as saying if you get assaulted by niggers in the projects then you shouldn't shoot them or fight back in a way that would harm them because you're in their territory

I feel like you may actually be a colossal dicksmoking faggot

>>34517634
Problem is those loads won't physically fit the magazine of the desert eagle. I handload for mine, and you have to basically violate every safe relaoding practice for the .357 and the .44 since they're rimmed revolver rounds. The rounds were originally developed for revolvers, so as a result, you often have to load them hotter, and seat the bullet much much lower than what the recommended OAL is for the round in order for the rounds to fit the magazine. Those super hot underwoods or the FTX polymer "Missle Tips" are specifically not recommended for use in the deagle because they're simply too long to properly fit in the magazine and cycle.

That's kinda why the .50ae is recommended because it was designed from the ground up to work in the deagle only, so you can get a bit more leeway with those than you would with the .357 or .44.

>>34517713
Intradasting. So stick with 50ae in the DEagle. Got that. Do you think the extra hot ammo out of a revolver would drop a bear? Not OP by the way, I'm just briefly hijacking the conversation.

>>34517670
The problem is that the bear doesn't know any better while niggers... ahhh...
The point is please don't kill bears when a less lethal option is avalible. Feel free to follow up with a gun if it doesn't work but bears are not for killings.

>>34517742
Stuff like the Underwood hard cast? Oh hell yeah. Hell, there's several short barrel revolvers that are designed around super hot rounds to use against bears. Things like the Ruger Alaskan, The Smith and Wesson .460XV or 500 will definitely handle bear, even in the short barrel configs. Hell even a glock in 10mm with some underwoods, will be adequate if you really want to dump rounds downrange.

>>34515906
T. Limp wristed faggot

>>34516270
>Theyre not finicky with ammo
Spare me the white-knighting. You literally get a list of "approved ammo" in the box when you buy one.

>>34517837
t. nodeagles.

Get buttblasted more.

>>34515486
Can I still buy a deagle that hasn't been fagged up with that stupid top rail?

>>34515936
fucking faggots

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>>34515486
It can work, though you better be familiar with it's handling and behavior.

The .44 Magnum Desert Eagle has recoil comparable to a 1911 so followup shots should be Eazy Peazy, and using some good heavy FMJ or solid copper bullets it should be enough for a good sized bear.

>>34515906
>limp wristed fag who can't be bothered to learn a specialized sporting weapon
Like at least 80% of all Deagle malfunctions are user error.

>>34515746
Who is this beautiful specimen

>getting a 5 lb pistol that is infamous for jamming in its .357 and .44 magnum variants and requires that you either be an investment banker or reloader to getgud with its .50 AE variant for use against bears.

Just get a Glock 20 bro.

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>>34515936
I'm a fag enough to like traps and I think you should fucking neck yourself, flat chested women are wonderful.

>>34519861
This.
If it's good enough for Slædepatruljen Sirius to fend off polar bears, it's good enough for you.

>"The weapons carried also reflect the harsh conditions. Only bolt-action rifles (M17/M53) perform reliably. The standard SIG210 Neuhausen sidearm was recently replaced by the 10mm Glock 20, as the stopping power of multiple 9mm rounds proved to be insufficient against a polar bear."

>>34515936
I hope you get dysentery.

>>34515936
Post proof. Lots of proof, so that I can assess and verify your claims

>>34515936
Please go back to your containment board you filthy queer. It's dad we can't still burn you fucking sodomites on the stake.

>>34515906
No. I have literally never had mine jam, with exception to letting little bitch boys shoot it and limpwrist.

You're a little bitch boy, ain'tcha.

>>34519619
They don't make em anymore. Have to scoop one used.

>>34515486
Mostly, no. Jamming aside, they don't shoot lead well because of the gas tube getting fouled quickly, making them more prone to jam than the already shaky QC.

>>34522810
>shaky QC
"I have never held one!"

And there's options to hardcast bullets.

>>34519619
Ca compliant versions dont have the pic rail

>>34519819
I guess that explains why 80% of all Desert Eagles jam, huh. Idiot.

>>34521628
>I'm so insecure about my masculinity that I'm going to samefag three times calling your a limpwristed bitch boy
>That'll make me more manly!!

>>34523200
That was my first post itt, champ.

>>34517865
This.
I've got a metric fuck tonne of desert eagles and the 50ae all came with recommended ammo. Fiocci is what I stuck with and didn't try much else.

They do punish poor shooting technique, so if you hand yours to some tiny chick with less grip and forearm strength it'll magically become a hi-point.
Also worth mentioning is the 44 and 357 desert eagles are much more forgiving in terms of both ammo choice and proper technique. The 357 is so much fun it's actually one of my favorite handguns in my collection.

>>34523200

Welcome to day/k/are. Enjoy all the mindless manchildren (most of which are noguns)

>>34523231
>being a bandwagoning insecure bitch
Doesn't make it any better.

>>34515486
Alright deagle wizards, so then how do I make lead based reloads for this thing?

>>34523319
hi-points have god tier reliability. direct blowback is almost impossible to fuck up

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>>34515936
Back to /b/ with you

>>34523704
To be fair I do not own a hi-point. I'd always heard from internet forums they were garbage, but perhaps there's the error right there lol.

>>34523792
theyre heavy and not particularly accurate, but they go bang every time. their bad reputation comes from being $200 and used mostly by those who dont know how to use guns in the first place.

>>34515936
>liking tits on a trap
shoo shoo

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>>34517144

>>34515746
This. Leave bears alone.

>>34523200
It's not a Glock, you should not have even remotely the same expectations as for service pistols or any other kind of pistol really, if you fail to handle it or feed it incorrect ammunition, then that is user error.

You're using the wrong stance, you're limpwristing it, you're using the wrong ammunition, you're holding it wrong.

>>34523704
But they're also clunky and recoil awkwardly.

>>34524774
>you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong!
You can say it four different ways, but I was using the recommended ammo listed on the sheet provided by the manufacturer, and I was holding the gun correctly with a tight grip in line with my arm and a weaver stance (also recommended by the manufacturer). I've shot dozens of other snappy-recoiling handguns and never limpwristed a semi-auto due to a deficiency in my grip. I even made a video of myself shooting it before I sold the gun to really figure out what was going on (if I find it, I'll convert a clip to webm and post it to this thread), and my grip was fine, even in slow motion. Also, the gun didn't malfunction unpredictably. It would ONLY happen on a fully loaded magazine for the first few shots, and the only type of malfunction was failures to return to battery. If the magazine was only loaded half-way, it would never malfunction. The issue was the slide losing velocity while feeding tight rounds from the magazine.

>>34523850
Well maybe I oughta add one to the collection then.
Thanks for the heads up, /k/omrade.

>>34525091 again.

Here's the video of me shooting a Desert Eagle and experiencing the jams that I talked about. Sorry about the watermark. I don't own a video editor, and had to download the trial version of this thing in order to crop my face out of the video. You can slow the video down, freeze-frame or whatever you like. The gun does have more recoil than other semi-autos, but I am not limpwristing it. If I were limpwristing it, then it would jam sporadically and more frequently, not only on full magazines.

https://a.pomf.cat/apgmql.webm

If you want to skip through the video, it only jammed on the first two shots of the second magazine fired. Further testing showed that every magazine would cause the jams, just intermittently. The first few magazines fired in a range session were less susceptible to jams, and when the gun got dirtier, it would be more susceptible to jams. Downloading the magazines by two or three rounds resulted in no jams.

The Yankee Marshal talked about this same issue in a video he made - he thinks there's something about the magazine feed lips that retain the top round in a loaded magazine too tightly. He actually modified his magazines' feed lips and got better results. I've read on other forums, that people have clipped coils off their recoil springs in order to speed up the velocity of the slide, which also improved reliability.

I don't like modifying my guns in order to get them running reliably, so I just sold it and moved on to better guns. My current "big bore" pistol is a Sig P220 10mm, and it's been 100% reliable and much more fun to shoot.

>>34524774
>>34521628
>>34519819
>>34517837
I didn't go to all this effort because you baited me with this low level name-calling. I honestly think that there are genuine, good people (not any of you) in the thread who are interested in the truth.

>>34519832
I believe it's the Amazon Dress Shop Girl. Obviously now modelling swimwear.

Don't get a pistol for use against bears. If one pops up out of nowhere you're going to be shaking like a bitch and most likely miss. With a bigass round like a 44, you won't get many followup shots either. Use a shotgun with slugs or a 308 semi auto like a PTR or M1A, you'll be far better off.

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>>34525955
These sorts of posts always make me think that the person giving advice has NO fucking clue what they're talking about. Where and how do you think people are encountering bears in the backcountry?

If I'm in bear country, then I'm already going to be decked out in 35 pounds of gear, food and water, at minimum. There is no room on my body to sling a full size battle rifle or a shotgun in a way that would allow me quick access. Sure, I can strap it to my backpack, but there goes your "if one pops up out of nowhere" scenario. The reason I carry a handgun is out of necessity. I just can't hike, or go flyfishing, or do any other thing I'd want to do in the backcountry, with a full size rifle at low ready.

>If one pops up out of nowhere you're going to be shaking like a bitch and most likely miss.
I've seen many bears in the backcountry. I've never had one charge me, but they are just animals and will die when killed, like other animals. You don't have to be so afraid, anon.

>>34526036
Ok friendo have fun missing and getting your throats ripped out

>>34526116
Have fun even getting into the backcountry with a PTR 91 carried at the low ready with all your gear on your back. I'll be having fun 20 miles down the trail while you're still wheezing up the first hill.

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>you got to go .458 win mag or bigger for GRIZZZZZZ!

Why am I crazy to think that 300 grain .44 mag hard cast bullets would be ok for Brown bear defense as a last resort? Why do the same fags that shit talk .44 mag preach 10mm? Even hot loads have less than half the energy. Why do fags insist on fucking elephant cartridges for bear? Yes, they're big, but they're not that big.

Also fuck anyone who seriously uses the word grizz.

>>34523684
Well first, don't use unplated/exposed lead bullets for it full stop. Exposed lead bullets will foul the gas port. You'll need at the minimum Berrys plated or something like that in order to safely shoot it out of a deagle.

Next, powder, I've used 24 grains of winchester W296 or Hodgdon's H110 with a 240gr plated/jacketed solid using Starline brass and loaded to 1.585 oal. That seemed to work best for me. Lots of boom fireballs.

>>34526515
Can't even powder coat?

>>34515486
.500 S&W or nothing.

>>34526896
Newp, the pressure involved and the sensitivity of the gas port basically makes any exposed lead of any kind a big no no with it. It'll clog up and then you have to send it to Magnum Research to fix it.

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>>34526322
.500S&W for alaskan browns min, 20mm preferable

>>34525628
Cool. Mine has still never jammed.

>>34526036
I was riding my dirt bike on a trail 4th of july weekend and ran into a black bear @ 15m when I stopped for some water. Never thought I'd have that happen where I was.

>>34517865
I said theyre not finicky with hot loads you fucking mongoloid

the real question is
would it stop a young latino shielding himself behind a hardcover encyclopedia??

>>34515486
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALveW3PVGkE

>>34524100
Fuck bears, and fuck you.

>>34527303
>with hot loads
No Desert Eagle is designed to fire +P ammunition. Why don't you sit down and listen to people who actually own and have owned these guns. Adults are speaking.

>>34527613
Post your deagle and proof

>>34527758
>>34525628

>>34517629
Fuck off hippy piece if trash.

>>34527613
I think its' more along the lines of having to load "hot" in the sense of near the top of the CUP line rather than going over it. I'm loading near the top of what my lyman manual recommends for the 240gr plus having to seat the rounds lower probably adds to the pressure.

>>34527385
Related
https://youtu.be/hMdsHioSCxo

>>34528082
This looks fun as fuck.

RIP retarded beaner who only used one book.

>>34515936
You walked into that one.

>>34528082
>he paid actual money for printer paper instead of using phone books
goober should've asked his relatives or asked online. He could've spent the money on, like, 2 rounds of .50 AE

>>34523792
They're not nice, but they're rugged and seem to largely work fine if your magazines didn't come out of spec in the box (though their customer serivice is free and basically begs you to take advantage of them). They're also safe and have a very generous and accommodating warranty.

If you're poor, and it's all you can afford, well, it's something, things could be worse. Compare to small caliber Ring Of Fire style pocket pistols known for various reliability problems, low power, horrible safety issues (the sear tripping when it shouldn't), and the Hi-Point starts looking pretty good, even if it's heavy and has the ergos of a cheap gas station squirt gun

what kind of holster would one even use to conseal carry a deagle?

>>34531750
None. Because that's dumb.

>>34515486
They can be used for bears, my Dad has taken his 44 may version hunting for bear defense many times. They are accurate, and can be chambered in powerful rounds.

>They require hit loads to cycle properly, not an issue for bear
>Big, bulky, and heavy

Other than that they are actually alright.

>>34522810
>Jamming
>No lead

Bullshit. I've shot a Deagle plenty and it cycles 100% as long as you use hotter ammo. You can even shoot lead out of it as ling as you don't do it regularly and deal with cleaning if afterwards.

The Deagle gets a lot of shit but it's really nowhere near as bad as a lot of people act like.

>>34526322
A10 BRRRRRRRRRRRRTmm is the absolute minimum for Grizz self defense.

>>34523716
What the hell am I seeing in this pic?

>>34531928
He's right about the lead, you shouldn't use any bullet in which there's less than 3/4ths of a copper jacket.

Unjacketed bullets will shear off in gasports and begin to clog them, this is a known phenomenon.

>>34531941
Stormtrooper training.

>>34526036
Nigger what are your dirty socks doing on your water bottle's cap?

>>34515486
>High caliber
>Semi-automatic
>7+1 rounds (8+1 if .44)

Don't see how its any worse than a .500 or a .44 revolver. Besides weight and cost...

>>34533799
The difference is that the Deagle has less harsh recoil than a revolver, but it's also significantly less reliable.

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I'm going to Glacier National Park in Montana in a few weeks with my family, and my mom is totally and completely no-fun. Wouldn't let me store my disassembled handguns in her house for a month while I was out of the country. I don't feel totally safe or comfortable going to bear country like that without one of my handguns (.45 1911 and 9mm M&P shield), but I also don't want to get in a fight and piss her off. I respect my parents and won't go behind their backs on this, so is it worth the fight to bring my 1911 along or should I just let it go?

>>34533908
How old are you?

>>34533929
20

>>34515486
If you're gonna 50 cal, go S&W .500 or go home. 50AE can't compete.

>>34529871
Hah! That actually sounds damned fine in its own way.

>>34533933
Just bring your gun. If your mother can't deal with it, then that's her problem.

>>34533950
Naw man, I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to disrespect her wishes like an angsty teen.

>>34533908
You're at surprisingly low risk of bear attack at GNP, depending on your activity. Don't approach, stay backed off, don't carry around bacon and candy bars.

Seriously, your chances of death by being "culturally enriched" in any urban area are far, far greater than a random Grizz attack. I'd wander all over GNP unarmed long before I'd feel comfortable walking around NYC or DC where you pretty much have to be unarmed.

>>34533982
if you're smart you'll carry bells or something else that makes constant noise on your person
bears attack when startled but will generally book it if they hear you coming
applies doubly for black bears

>>34533982
That testimony makes me feel better. We'll only be day hiking, but certainly won't be shying away from the difficult and remote trails we can find to do in a day. Is there just a low density of bears there or what?

>>34534000
>>34533982
also, I'm pretty sure my parents are going to go for some bear spray. Opinions on that? I've heard it can really only serve to enrage the bear more or be generally useless if it actually has to be used.

>>34534008
not that guy, but avoiding bears is about not being retarded
bears don't want to kill you and will only attack if they're truly desperate or feel as that you are threatening them or their cubs

don't act like prey, don't sleep where you eat/cook, don't go anywhere near cubs, and don't feed bears

>>34534039
Well sure, but carrying isn't about only doing it when you know you're going to get into a situation. It's precautionary. People can do all the right things and still get mauled.

>>34533908
Sneak lots of bacon into your mothers backpack. When the bear charges her, save her with your 45 stopping power. She'll love guns then.

>>34517865
Its a gun specifically designed to fire hot 44 and 50 loads, of course its not going work as well with baby ammunition.

>>34534102
bears act very predictably
readiness for any eventuality is good, but with bears, effort is better spent avoiding getting in a situation where you either shoot a bear or die

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>>34526036
>>34526165
>If I'm in bear country, then I'm already going to be decked out in 35 pounds of gear, food and water, at minimum. There is no room on my body to sling a full size battle rifle or a shotgun in a way that would allow me quick access.
Sounds like a "You" problem to me.

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>>34533908
>I respect my parents and won't go behind their backs on this, so is it worth the fight to bring my 1911 along or should I just let it go?
>>34533933
>>34533972
>Naw man, I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to disrespect her wishes like an angsty teen.
1. You are a grown(ish) man, act like it. If she can't deal with it maybe she needs to grow up, or realize that you are grown up and can make your own decisions.
2. Why even ask if you are just gonna bitch out about not "disrespecting" your mom in the next reply?

Both 9mm and .45 is better then nothing.

>>34515486
Like wtf nibba just draw a circle on the ground they cant get past it

>>34534315
Alright dude, I'm fortunate enough that my parents have bought and paid for this trip for me entirely. They offered me a plane ticket, so I took it. I'm not really in a position to piss her off like that. This woman is fucking TERRIFIED of my firearms. The one time I showed them to her, she began shaking with fear and crying and yelling at me to get them out. Not even exaggerating. I'll fucking fight her on it if I think it means saving her life, but otherwise I won't. It sucked having to deal with that situation at home, and I can't imagine what that would be like on the other side of the country. Not worth my time or energy if I can avoid it.

>>34534151
>hot 44 and 50 loads
>hot
There's that word again. Desert Eagles are rated for factory pressure ammunition only.

>>34534182
>rucking a hundred pounds of gear in the military
>going into the outdoors for fun, leisure and enjoyment
These are two completely different things.

>>34534370
Why doesn't your mother respect your rights, your interests or your ways of thinking? There is something wrong with this mother-son relationship. Are your parents divorced?

>>34534370
>I'll fucking fight her on it if I think it means saving her life, but otherwise I won't.
But you can't know that until you NEED a gun to save her life, and then it's too late if you don't have one.
Derp.

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>>34534436
>rucking a hundred pounds of gear in the military
>going into the outdoors for fun, leisure and enjoyment
Rucking a hundred pounds of gear in the military is going into the outdoors for fun, leisure and enjoyment.

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>>34534469
Gee, it sure looks fun, though, doesn't it!

>>34534447
lol no they're not divorced. Dad is fine with guns, but he wouldn't ever buy one himself. He definitely looks down on me for carrying for pd, but he doesn't say anything and generally doesn't care about being around me when I'm carrying.

My mom shot a 22 when she was much younger, but that's it. She hates guns, hates seeing guns, doesn't ever want to touch guns, doesn't want anything to do with guns. That said, she doesn't give me shit for buying them and liking them or carrying (with the exception of when I first told her I carried). The only time she gets pissy is when I want to bring one into her house, especially the handguns. She allowed me to store my AR there because "it's so clearly for hunting" (I told them I'd use it for hunting even though I've only done that once and use it more as a range gun and life and liberty). She doesn't like the handguns because they're people killers according to her. I have a very healthy relationship with her otherwise though.

>>34534679
>Dad is fine with guns
>He definitely looks down on me for carrying for pd

Let me get this straight. Not only is it part of your lifestyle to carry a gun, but you also work for a police department in some capacity that requires you to carry a gun? And your dad "definitely looks down on you" for doing that? Yeah, no. That guy ain't fine with guns, and he also has serious issues empathizing with his son. Your family needs some serious therapy sessions to sort out all the problems with this picture.

>>34534719
shit sorry, pd = personal defense, not police department.

Not sure if that would really even change your assessment of the picture though. Regardless, I disagree.

>>34534781
>Not sure if that would really even change your assessment of the picture though.
It doesn't. You have your reason for doing a thing that affects and hurts no one. Your own family wants to disallow you from doing that thing for selfish and emotional non-reasons.
>Regardless, I disagree.
Are you a rational person?

>>34534811
I don't think I could fully put into words how disappointed and angry I am that my parents, especially my mom, are so vehemently opposed to something that I see as essential to my personal safety and the safety of people around me. I think it's insane that they disapprove of it.

HOWEVER, they aren't trying to keep me from carrying. It's literally just "no guns in the house" rule. They hate them with a passion, but that's all they ask of me. It's annoying as fuck, don't get me wrong. I want to bring a gun for bear defense, but since I'll be staying under the same roof as them in Montana, I'm going to ask permission. I don't think any of that is indicative of an unhealthy family dynamic of any kind. This is quite literally the only thing they have any sort of problem with me doing.

>>34534008
Actually the GNP area has about the largest grizzly population in the lower 48, and around 2 million visitors a year, but only 10 fatal attacks at GNP since 1910. Most recent was last year, freak accident where a guy trail biking at high speed ran square into a grizzly. Have to go back almost 20 years for the last one before that.

For comparison, there have been 6 fatal attacks in the Yellowstone area just since 2010. That number's still pretty low when you think of the fact that there are 4 million visitors to Yellowstone every year and you have to figure far more than half of them act like dumb-as-a-rock tourists when it comes to bear safety. My guess is more tourists feeding bears around Yellowstone, more trash bins everywhere acclimating them to the idea of people = food, etc., and yet still incidents are remarkably rare.

>>34534964
Got the stats on attacks in generally readily available? I think I might raise the question about carrying, but I won't fight for it.

>>34534914
You're expressing cognitively dissonant ideas when you say "they aren't trying to keep me from carrying, they just don't want me to have guns in the house." Do you live at home? Are you expected to spend time with your parents? You are legally an adult now and able to make your own decisions in life. My parents wished I'd become a doctor, but that doesn't mean I had to "respect their wishes" when I was your age. They don't have to know what you have under your clothing, and they have no right to express outrage when/if they find out that you're carrying.

>>34535098
>>34535098
No, I don't live at home, so it's really not a problem the vast majority of the time. And yeah, it pisses me off. It pisses me off every time I think about it. But I didn't bring it up to bitch about my parents' rules. I'm never going to change their mind on this, and it's not worth ruining an otherwise near-perfect relationship. It's not worth it at all. I pick my battles, man, and this isn't one of them.

>>34535184
You are fooling yourself if you think your relationship is near-perfect, but that they have this much power over you. This is a deeply flawed relationship, although granted, most parental relationships are.

>>34535199
>this much power
I buy and shoot and carry and do whatever I want 99.99999% of the time

I think you might be a little deluded yourself dude.

>>34534469
Most people who did that shit in the Army complains about ruined knees and spines.

They make sure to wear you out with that shit, it's not like a recreational hike at all.

>>34535305
There is a point in every person's life when they need to realize that they are an adult and your previous parent-child relationship can't continue in the same way as it did when you were 12. When you were a little kid, your parents told you what to do because you really didn't know any better. When you grow up (sounds like you've got some work to do here), you'll realize that you're both adults, neither you nor your parents are all-knowing or perfect, and you need to learn to treat them (and they you) as a fellow adult.

>>34533982
>>34534000

These are good advice. Even if you do manage to draw and shoot in the event of a bear attack, you need to hit the bear in a place that will disable it - generally the CNS. Even if you hit the bear in a location that causes it to bleed out later, this will be cold comfort if you are already dead. Again, the objective is not to kill the bear but to survive the encounter by deterring it.

Brown bears are very tough, and your quickdraw aim and knowledge of bear anatomy needs to be really good.

It's much, much better to not to encounter a bear in the first place and practice basic bear safety practices.

Bear spray works on the same principle as pepper spray, and while it's still not guaranteed it's still a better option than shooting a firearm and not hitting a fatal location: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/jwmg.342/abstract

>>34535559
Just to put it in perspective, an adult grizzly can charge up to 30 miles per hour and you need to hit a target area about the size of a small ball dead on in that period of time. Bear spray at the least doesn't have to worry about fine aim.

>>34535559
>http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/jwmg.342/abstract
>"We compiled, summarized, and reviewed 269 incidents of bear–human conflict involving firearms that occurred in Alaska during 1883–2009."

Wow that sounds SUPER DUPER scientific, bro. I better hang the ol' musket on the wall and pick up one of them new, fangled pepper spray cans to be absolutely sure I deter any bears that come my way!
https://youtu.be/nU5cMZymSr0

>>34535559
that seems like a really interesting article, but I can't access it.

Even when we take every other single precaution first, I can't come up with a reason NOT to carry though. Do everything else first, use bear spray first, and have a firearm as an absolute backup.

>>34535613
lol dumb bitch

>>34535676
Yeah. It's not like the pepper spray is at all inadequate in rainy conditions or anything. It's totally just her fault for being dumb and female.

>>34535559
If the goal is to make a bear fuck off, I really doubt you would need to hit vital organs if you were repeatedly poking deep holes in its torso and making extremely loud noises.

>>34535640
Yeah, if you want to carry in the woods, there's nothing wrong with that - and don't get me wrong, firearms can deter a grizzly bear. But it should never be Plan A - and in any case, bear incidents tend to be relatively rare for the reasons outlined in >>34534039 - "don't be stupid" is good advice.

>>34535613
It's the Journal of Wildlife Management. What more reasonable source would you accept other than people who actually work in the field? Bear attacks are relatively rare so the sample size is small for a reason.

>>34535753
It's one thing to shoot at a bear that's some distance off and not aware of you. It's another thing entirely when the bear is already in the "fight" response and actively charging you - it may take a few seconds for the pain response to register and in that period you can be severely mauled.

>>34515786
First comment, best comment.

>>34526036
>he thinks you need a battle rifle for bears
AK will do just fine, friendo.

>>34535841
I doubt any bear is going to ignore its body getting ventilated by 124gr pieces of metal hitting its body at 2400fps.

>>34535690
Just imagine how bad your shit would be fucked if you sprayed, missed, and wind blew that shit back in your face.

>>34535791
This is an appeal to authority. Just because an article got published in a trade journal does not make it the answer to everything, or even completely valid.

I have read this article before, although it's been a few years since I was on an academic license and I can't view the full text right now, but just looking at the abstract, I can see that you aren't looking at it objectively. It seems like you (or >>34535559, if you want to squirm out of it by claiming you're a different poster) are using the article to claim something that the authors never set out to prove.

The results of this article don't show that a given bear is more likely to stop attacking when one of either a gun or pepper spray is used on it. All it's showing is what has happened when the people who did use guns on bears used them. There are a ton of uncontrolled variables in data like what they're using. I would call it less of a scientific experiment (i.e., where there would be a control group and a test group that only has one variable changed) and more of an epidemiological survey (i.e., a broad survey of medical injuries to show the effects of bears on humans, in connection with firearms).

>>34535388
Can confirm. Knees, ankles and spine are worn out and I am about inch shorter than before having nice recreational hikes.

>>34523850
The accuracy is a myth, they shoot just as well as any gun (albeit with cheap plastic sights). Their weight also dampens down recoil quite a bit so even the higher calibers are easier to keep on target..

>>34522862
I have owned two and shot the .357 version a friend had. It raped brass and that's nails on a chalkboard for reloaders. He's talking bear defense and in that manner we're talking hard cast lead which leads quickly to fouling. Reading comprehension next time and try to stay on subject.

>>34532285
Arigato

>>34534679
>She doesn't like the handguns because they're people killers according to her.
They are obviously for protection against wild animals...

>>34536811
It's definitely the only reason I carry my 1911 when I'm hunting

>>34536573
>we're talking hard cast lead which leads quickly to fouling.
In a Desert Eagle, the reason not to shoot unplated bullets actually has nothing to do with fouling up the rifling. The problem is you can get shavings and bits of lead scraped off the bullets and into the gas port, which is basically impossible to clean out, once it gets shit in it.

>>34536875
This. As others have said multiple times in the thread, DO NOT SHOOT UNJACKETED ROUNDS in your Desert Eagle. The gas port will foul, and Magnum Research will have to unclog it for you at rape-wallet prices.

>>34535920
You'd be surprised. There have been documented cases of Bears, mainly pissed off Grizzlies, that have been shot in non-vital points that still continue to charge the shooter despite sustaining pretty grievious wounds. You pretty much have to land shots on their head or somehow punch through their hide and ribcage to strike a vital organ in order to stop a determined charging Grizzly.

>>34526951
>t. magnum research

>>34527613
>adults are speaking
>speaking

Youre on the internet friendo. Im probably older than you.

>>34538020
Act like a child, get treated like a child.

>>34534428
Yes, and many factories produce ammunition at much lower pressures than the SAAMI standard for these cartridges. Are you a professional moron or just a talented amateur?

>>34538119
The whole "these here bullets is real warm" schtick is complete fuddlore. Standard pressure is standard pressure.

>>34538146
For max pressure sure. But there are definitely brands that load closer to that max SAAMI pressure line than others. It's the only way to explain why some brands will cycle the desert eagle with all other things being equal (brass/bullet weight/oal etc).

Fiocchi in my experience loads their rounds definitely at a higher pressure than others. I've noticed increased snappiness with their rounds both with .44 mag, their buckshot/slug shotgun rounds, and their 9mm.

>>34538182
I never encountered a .44 magnum factory loading that wouldn't cycle my Desert Eagle.

>>34538228
I've encountered a few. Hyper-X was a brand Turners carried. Supposedly ran super "clean" to cut down on fouling. Turned my .44 deagle into a single shot pistol and short stroke every single round.

Magtech I've also had very dicey luck with, granted they're remanufactured rounds so that probably has something to do with it, but I'd have random short-strokes with them too.

Fiocchi or American eagle or my handloads worked the best honestly. Prvi Partizan actually also made some good ones, though they run kinda dirty.

>>34538257
>Hyper-X
Google returns nothing, so I'm guessing it was some local fudd's handloads?

Magtech is not remanufactured ammo. You appear to be confused here. I never had an issue with Magtech .44 mag in my Desert Eagle. The SJSP 240 grain loads are on the manufacturer's recommended ammo list.

>>34538305
My bad, it's actually HPRAmmo

http://www.hprammo.com/

That's the brand that turner's carried and that one did not work in my .44.

As for the other one, let me go back and look at the box. I haven't touched it since a year ago when it wouldn't work reliably and I threw it in storage and I haven't gotten around to selling it off

>>34538345
Alright my bad, it's a brand called BVAC. Apparently they're a big ammo remanufacturer so that's probably why it didn't work.

>>34538345
HPR was not on Magnum Research's approved ammo list, as I recall. I tried some loaded with Hornady XTP hollow points and it cycled the slide just fine, but just increased the jamming a lot more.
>>34538391
I'm pretty sure it has more to do with the overall length of the round or the curvature of the bullet, something like that. As long as you stick to the approved ammo list, you should be fine.

>>34538403
Yup, never strayed after those two. Stuck with American Eagle/Handloads/Fiocchi after that.

>>34515486
anything is a good bear defense gun with enough bullets

>>34517472

That meme is trash and you need to neck yourself

The revanant didn't have a deagle.. he came out OK.. ish

>>34534469
Man that episode brings the feels every time. When I see this picture I just want to watch it.

Also i would recommend the glock 20 in 10mm as well. Easier to carry and reliable.