Im looking for some expert advice. Im currently in the market

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>Im looking for some expert advice. Im currently in the market for my first battle rifle. I wanted an Ar15 for the amount of customization however, I noticed the top manufacturers usually have it calibered at .223 I was thinking and Ak-47 for more power. What are some other rifles that offer customization with some power and not to unreasonable price wise.

>buy quality ar15
>buy quality red dot
>buy a decent 2 point sling
>spend your money on an appleseed class to establish a solid base of marksmanship fundamentals
>master the basics
>move onto attending a quality carbine class
>practice what you have learned there regularly at the range
>you are now proficient and more effective than 99.95% of the fuckboys that have ar15s on /k/

Get an ak like an SLR107/107FR if you feel like you are more interested in them. The more you're interested or like a gun, the more you will want to go out and shoot it. The difference between 5.56 and 7.62x39 is negligible, let's even throw in 5.45x39 in there too. It's entirely up to the shooter in terms of what they can do with a rifle.

>>34469165
you need to look up the term battle rifle and figure out some basic stuff first, and then get a gun
remember, 308 is more expensive than intermediate cartridges

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I'm just gonna head this off for ya here, since you seem like someone who's never even thought about firearms until the past couple days outside of the "GUNS ARE SCARY" context, so let's start with some basics, shall we?

AR15s and AK-pattern rifles are not battle rifles. They are semi-automatic carbines. First and foremost, battle rifles fire a FULL POWER cartridge. 7.62x51- a round very similar to hunting rifle rounds- or bigger.
ARs and AKs- which shoot 5.56x45 and 7.62x39 respectively- are good personal defense rifles, and I wouldn't hesitate to carry either for defense.

But, the AK's 7.62 cartridge is slightly more powerful. However, for most of our purposes it doesn't make a difference. That and ammunition can be problematic to find in the States.

The AR and AK both are nearly deafening when fired in an enclosed space, and ammo is expensive. Less so than a .308, but it is still expensive (anywhere from 20 cents to more than a dollar per round, depending what particular ammunition.)

You know what isn't either of those, and is still sufficiently powerful given good shot placement?

A Ruger 10/22.

>Lightweight
>cheap
>takedown models for easy transportation
>Just powerful enough for humans at close range
>Ammo is dirt-cheap
>reliable, accurate, easy to shoot
>You can modify one to do anything you need of it with drop-in components.

Is it the most powerful rifle? No. But it's cheap, easy to practice with, and if you decide to sell it off to buy something more, once you've LEARNED more and figured out what you, specifically, need, it'll hold its market value.

Or you can use it to teach your child, if/when you have one.

Good advice here thanks guys any brands to avoid when it comes to AR-15? I've heard colt is pretty great quality and they are fairly cheap.

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>>34469272
A 10/22 is cool and all (I have 5) but I keep an AR loaded by my bed.

We have a lot of very fat people in America, and COM kills aren't so easy with a 22 when there's 200 pounds of blubber.

A semi 12 gauge would be ideal but I've yet to acquire one.

>>34469297
>Good advice here thanks guys any brands to avoid when it comes to AR-15?

Look into these links, some good pointers on what makes a good AR and what a shitty one has. I used to suggest Colt, primarily the 6920 but apparently they aren't as good as they used to be.

Avoid
>Ruger
>S&W
>Delton
>DPMS
>Windham

https://primaryandsecondary.com/semper-paratus-arms-ar-15-armorer-course-aar/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyAbQZbVjHk

A 16 inch carbine or midlength from BCM would be a solid pick. If I were absolutely on a budget, I would opt for an Aero Precision OEM and get an Aimpoint PRO, some magpul handguards and work from there.

>>34469272
Surprised you didn't mention that .22 will bounce around inside a skull causing more damage than a .223

>>34469272
>AK is not battle rifle
behold! The most retarded man in history

>>34469323
Show me on the doll where Ruger and S&W touched you

They make the best low tier ARs

>>34469332
can vouch for this
buy s&w tho they have a cooler logo

>>34469328
Nogunz git

Get something with quality. "Entry Level" is a fucking meme. ARs and AKs aren't rocket science. Watch youtube vids on disassembly/reassembly and maintenance. Don't go out buying a cheap piece of shit because you'll be let down quick. Buy a quality AR or like first post stated get an Arsenal SLR. I own a SLR-104FR in 5.45x39 and I love it more than my DDM4A1 (I still love my DDM4A1).

Not looking at much for customization but I'm also going to suggest the Czechpoint Vz58 if you really want a 7.62x39.

>>34469323
>>34469165
>S&W and Ruger
both top notch when it comes to entry level stuff.
>Delton
Delton also makes a very decent rifle, I even know a couple guys who use them as their go to 3 gun rifles.
>DPMS
Again entry level shit is good and the offer a lot of different configurations right out of the box. I really like their bull barrel models (bull barrel = better accuracy)
>Windham
Never shot a Windham but after holding one in my LGS I wouldn't mind owning one. Solid build. Isn't Windham also the old Bushmaster owner?

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>>34469328
It's not though. Battle rifle means a select fire rifle in a full size cartridge, just like assault rifle means a select fire rifle in an intermediate cartridge. AK-47s and AKMs are assault rifles, not battle rifles. The semi automatic civilians variants thereof are sporting carbines.

>>34469332
I have no opinions on their objective quality and don't make recommendations for or against them but S&W touched me right here.

>>34469165
So get an AR10 you dingus.

7.62x39 just barely meets the requirements of a battle rifle, and it's hardly on par with accuracy.

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>>34469323
So what would you suggest as top tier brands of ar?

>>34469272
Well that's how you learn fuck face by asking questions.

>>34469613
Aero?

>>34469658
Really? They seem rather cheap to be top tier

>>34469165
AR15 a shit. Don't spend over $800 bucks, as your tastes in firearms evolve you'll come to regret it.

>>34469613
>So what would you suggest as top tier brands of ar?

As in post: BCM. Yes, there are more expensive brands but not everyone needs a KAC and that money can be spent on ammo and training.

>>34469165

The "stoppin powah" difference between 5.56 and 7.62 is negligible. Get an AR. Ammo is easier to find, the weapon system is more accurate and the gun itself is more modular. The AR aftermarket can't be beat. That said, you can assemble your own, it isn't difficult to do.

What you get depends on your budget. There's some idiots in here that are talking out of their ass. If you're a poorfag, the S&W M&P SPORT II is perfectly fine as an entry level AR. PSA makes decent poor fag AR's, as does Aero Precision. Colt is mid-tier, so is Rock River. Daniel Defense, kights Armament, Bravo Company, and Noveske are premium AR's, and you'll pay for it. Black Rain Ordnance is for mall ninjas.

I would stay away from Radical Firearms, DPMS, Del-Ton, and pretty much any other AR company no one has ever heard of.

>>34469323
>ruger
>s&w
>delton
Literally why? They're all solid rifles

>>34469613

Knights Armament Company, Daniel Defense, Noveske, Fabrique Nationale, Heckler and Koch, Bravo Company, Colt, Land Warfare Resources Corporation (now just LWRC), Lewis Machine & Tool, LaRue, Rainier Arms.

I'm sure I missed some.

>>34469206
Appleseeds are great.

I would probably not bring a centerfire rifle to my first one, though. I qualified Rifleman at my first with a bolt gun but a LOT of the newer shooters were challenged by shooting in positions (which is perfectly normal, by the way). Adding .223 cost and noise isn't helpful when you are just learning the foundational stuff.

OP, get a 10/22 or Remington 597 or Marlin 795 or similar mag-fed semiauto and put a $100-$150 scope on it or get Tech Sights, and get a GI web sling too. Zero at 25 yards with CCI Standard or whatever bulk ammo you like and take that to your first Appleseed.

Will definitely have a shorter learning curve than centerfire will.

Thankfully semiauto rimfires are cheap and shouldn't interfere that much with spending money on an AR or AK.

>>34469775
>Knights Armament Company, Daniel Defense, Noveske, Fabrique Nationale, Heckler and Koch, Bravo Company, Colt, Land Warfare Resources Corporation (now just LWRC), Lewis Machine & Tool, LaRue, Rainier Arms.

How to overcomplicate buying an AR.

Stick with BCM or FN.

>>34469328
Kore wa baito desu.

>>34469165
Find a good deal on a Ruger or S&W.

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>>34469650
I think it's more of an indicator that the premise of the question is bad and you're just showing how new to guns you are. Like, haven't even done any research yourself and want it spoon fed to you- new.

>>34469328
>thinks ak is a battle rifle
>calls others retarded
Anon...

>>34469785

What's complicated about that? You can buy any one of those and expect a quality rifle.

>>34470085
Not that anon but I dont think a newfag shooter is going to want to drop that kind of money on an ar. You can build cheaper ones for like 400-500 that will function exactly the same with zero issues.

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>>34469785
>What are the good AR brands?
>These ones
>LOL OH MAN WAY TO COMPLICATE THINGS DUDE
What is fucking wrong with you?

>>34470202
>What is fucking wrong with you?

yeah bro, let's waste time pondering on if I should get a KAC, LWRC, or LaRue instead of sticking with a non-botique gun and spending that time on practice

Fan fucking tastic, go fuck yourself with a rake you hobbyist cunt.

>>34470214
>someone asks a question
>question gets answered
>immediately sperg out, say the answer is overcomplicated
Are you OP? I think you need to go kill yourself. Like, now, pls.

>>34470214
>sticking with a non-botique gun and spending that time on practice
does the person who gets a DDm4A1 somehow have less practice time than someone with a PSA special?

>>34469323
Would things like a mid-length gas system and different barrel twist matter for a beginner, or be worth the extra cash?
I've been looking at getting an aero ac15 mid length for about 520 shipped without a mag or rear sight since I heard it has some nice features you don't usually see on entry level ARs, but would an AR beginner even really benefit from or notice those over some other basic brand like Ruger?

Thinking I'll just get a colt since they aren't ass and just slowly upgrade it for my needs

>>34470311
Don't get a colt unless it was made before 2003.
They've kind of turned into a meme.

>>34470311
Any models of colt that suck?

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>>34469165
>I was thinking and Ak-47 for more power
I was considering helping but nah. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>34470317
Seriously? Son of a bitch it's just hard to decide with everyone contradicting each other I want a complete for $700 or less

>>34470332
Anon it is much cheaper to just go buy a lower locally and order a parts kit and upper to assemble yourself. Watch a few youtube videos it literally takes less than 10 minutes and is as easy as screwing in a few things and inserting a few detents.

If you want a full rifle and probably dont know how FFL transfers work, just go to your damn local stores and check them out. Most places are going to over charge you so good luck finding anything in that price range at a normal store.

http://www.primaryarms.com/MCategories+AR-15-Complete-Guns?order=onlinecustomerprice:asc

http://palmettostatearmory.com/ar-15-05/pa-15-rifles.html

https://www.midwayusa.com/ar-15-complete-uppers/br?cid=23443
^lots of uppers, most of which fit on any lowers unless they're in a battlerifle caliber(308 etc). They also have full rifles but again I don't think you know how to do FFL transfers so good luck.

Again, I would just go to local stores and check them out a bit. Not a lot of shitty ars up there; and if it were me I'd just buy a lower and build it from there

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1omm6jY7Gg
The building part starts a bit after 2 minutes, and no you don't need a vice or anything fancy to do it besides a soft hammer and maybe some pliers.

>>34470442
i know how FFL transfers work Im just looking for the best quality for a reasonable price

>>34470295
>Would things like a mid-length gas system and different barrel twist matter for a beginner, or be worth the extra cash?

As for midlength vs carbine: midlength shoots just a bit smoother but this is not to say you cannot use a carbine, it is an extremely trivial thing but I personally opted for a midlength. Some people will tear your ear off for using carbine length but will ignore the fact that an overwhelming majority of the US military uses 14.5 inch carbines just fine.

I can't say about twist rates but the two common ones are 1:7 and 1:9. I personally don't give a shit about the twist rates and never bothered to check if my gun is 1:7 or 1:9. I shoot XM193 and use 55gr TAP for HD.

>>34470442
>Anon it is much cheaper to just go buy a lower locally and order a parts kit and upper to assemble yourself. Watch a few youtube videos it literally takes less than 10 minutes and is as easy as screwing in a few things and inserting a few detents.

Then you make a thread on /k/ wondering why your AR isn't extracting or feeding reliabily, get a fucked up trigger and completely ignore castle nut staking. I see this shit TONS of times.

>>34470927
If you manage to bungle building the LEGO kit of the gun world you're to stupid to be using guns to begin with. Not even that anon either, you just have no idea how stupidly easy it is.

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>>34470927
>doesn't trust himself to assemble an AR
Sad!
>completely ignore castle nut staking
This is retarded. Staking the castle nut is piss-easy and sure as hell doesn't harm anything but it's such a fucking non-issue if you apply anything resembling the amount of torque you're supposed to when installing the nut in the first place. My middy didn't have it's nut staked for years and only had the punch treatment because I was bored one night and I'm not even going to bother with my Block 2.

>>34469486
Sorry but Bull barrel=cool barrel= consistent barrel=accuracy

>>34470927
>Then you make a thread on /k/ wondering why your AR isn't extracting or feeding reliabily, get a fucked up trigger and completely ignore castle nut staking. I see this shit TONS of times.
I see that from normal complete ars too. If everything is in spec it should be fine. If not, return it.

>>34470927
>AR isn't extracting or feeding reliabily, get a fucked up trigger
Sounds like something that's 99% certain to be a manufacturer defect and not the fault of some anon who was pushing pins into place.

>>34470442
OP here switched home home pc any recommended build kits?

>>34471175
Not really build kits for ARs. Just buy the individual pieces from reputable companies. Some things like a lower parts kit, will obviously come in a kit with everything for your lower receiver. It isn't hard to build one, and it's better to do so before you can build it to your liking from the ground up. Just try it anon, you'll be glad you did.

>>34471175
see >>34470442
midwayusa is one the largest online retailers but essentially you just need-
>5.56 cal lower- you're pretty much paying for brand name here
>lower parts kit- these are about 30-40 bucks and should all be pretty similar if they're in spec
>upper assembly charging handle and bolt carrier group(90 bucks)- this is where most people drop their money.

A lot of people talk shit about Palmetto but honestly I've never seen any problems with them.
http://palmettostatearmory.com/ar-15-05/barreled-upper-assemblies.html

Just be sure to find one in the caliber you want, 5.56 and possibly one that comes with a BCG and charging handle.

Here is one now with the BCG and handle - http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-midlength-5-56-nato-1-7-nitride-freedom-upper-gray-with-bcg-ch-516445338.html

So again,
>lower and parts kit--- 100-150
>upper with BCG and CH --- 300-infinity
And the rest is spent on mags and ammo. Maybe an optic once you've become familiar with the rifle and have more of an understand of what you want it to do.


There is also a website, http://www.ar15builder.com/ if you wanted to do a bit of dress up like those flash games we all used to play as kids. C'mon I know it wasn't just me. .... Oh....

>>34471311
pretty confident i can do it for a decent price
Good lowers? heard of Anderson?

>>34471499
Anderson is a fine brand. It's on tier with others like Sig saur, S&w, Spikes, Aero and ruger. Which is to say about mid-tier.

Here is a general once over of the tiers of AR uppers. I personally prefer Rainier arms and Daniels Defense, but all of these options; even the budget builds, are viable and quality enough for your first rifle and most likely will outlive you if you take care of it.
Most barrels have a livespan of 25k-35k rounds which is like 8k$ in ammo anyway.

>>34471560
Whoops forgot the link
https://www.pewpewtactical.com/ar-15-buyers-guide-how-to-choose-your-first-ar-15/

>>34471566
>https://www.pewpewtactical.com/ar-15-buyers-guide-how-to-choose-your-first-ar-15/
>I LITTERALLY JUST FOUND THIS 15Min AGO
thinking of going Anderson Lower with Midway Ar-stoner parts kit and then doing something more exotic for my upper receiver, thoughts?

>>34471612
Sounds like a normal base. As previously stated when you buy a lower you're just paying for branding unless it's made of pot metal. Should be fine. Same with the parts kit, surplus or ar/stoner is perfect.

The upper is really where you're going to be spending your money and time. I would personally go with just a basic a4 style with whatever barrel length you want.

Keep in mind if you ever want to swap anything out or free float the handguard or anything like that all ar uppers can do it.

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>>34469165
>thinking an Ak-47 for more power
>AK
>more power
>"power"

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>>34469328
I-Is this......... Is this bait?

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>>34469756
Why do people shit on dpms and del-ton? are they really that bad? my dpms lower on a bcm upper has held up great and my buddies del-ton upper has over 2k rounds of steel and brass and is still chugging fine.

>>34472034
AK does have better barrier penetration, what if he knows there's a room full of criminals surrounded by cinderblock?

bushmaster for 499$ free shjipping ready to throw a rail on later

https://www.freedommunitions.com/bushmaster-qrc-optic-ready-carbine-5-56-nato.html

>>34472319
It's because they're not DD, KAC, Noveske, (insert another gucci brand AR). Del-ton and DPMS are great brands but because they don't go for 1,500 plus everyone thinks(HA) they have to be shit tier compared to those rifles.

It's like buying a Bentley and calling a Subaru shit because it doesn't cost as much.

>>34469305
That's actually a valid point, though you can always aim for the throat or the center of the thigh. A 10/22 is light and fast enough to where being capable of hitting that from 30-50 yards shouldn't be hard, even for a beginner. I'm just going off what I saw teaching my ex-girlfriend and a couple of old friends to shoot, generally the ones that asked to start on a "real gun" didn't progress as fast as my ex-gf, who started on a .22. Plus you can always resell it.

>>34469324
A shot to the cranium is pretty difficult sometimes on a moving target. Also I've seen .22s pierce both sides sometimes as well, so that's not exactly a reliable statement.

>>34469328
You're confused. AKs ARE a 7.62mm cartridge, however it's actually an intermediate rather than full-power due to the relatively-small amount of powder behind the bullet.

>>34469650
There's a difference between "I don't know this subject, so I'll go ask some finer points", and this, which was "I cannot research for myself, so I will try to get someone to spoonfeed me."