Hey hydrostatic shockfags, if energy is what matters, explain

>>34456993
That question is composed of 3 non-sequiturs duct-taped together.
Why don't you go ask a friend to shoot you with one, then come tell us.
Don't forget your phone book.

>>34457047
I don't think you know what non sequitur means. It means the conclusion does not follow from the premises.
>>34456993
"Hydrostatic shock" is a meaningless buzzword used by advertisers and people who want to sound like scientists.

Kinetic energy is useful in physics, but it is irrelevant to ballistics.

Arrows kill the same way every other projectile does: bleeding. Nobody dies immediately when they get shot except in the movies. They bleed out. Sometimes that happens fast, and sometimes slow, but they bleed out. The only exception is if they get shot in the brainstem.

>>34456993
k= (1/2)(m)(v^2)
More mass means more kinetic energy

If broad heads can kill you then why can I die from lack of oxygen?
Hydrostatic shock is bullshit, but so is your post. KYS

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This is now a /k/lassy thread

>>34457459
The point of his post was that the usually cited figure of 1000 ft lbs being needed to cleanly kill deer is bullshit. An arrow would be lucky to have even a quarter of that. Kinetic energy doesn't matter. Blood loss is all that matters.
>>34457294
Who cares?

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>>34457486
>polymer pistol
>classy

>>34457486
How is the H&H? Closest I've tried is the Orlik Dark Strong Kentucky. Also what pipe?

>nice USP

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>>34457486
EDC thread?

>>34457171
This isn't necessarily true

The last paragraph is true for most handgun rounds, low energy shotgun pellets etc...

Once you step up to a rifle caliber, you introduce violent energy transfer as a wounding mechanism.

There are studies that detail exactly when rounds start to do significant damage via "hydrostatic shock", but I'm too lazy to provide them.

TL;DR, look it up its real, however it's inconsequential in most pistol calibers.

>>34457869
Yes, rifle bullets damage tissue by their speed rather than size, but the cause of death is still bleeding.

>>34457955
Energy transfer ruptures blood vessels and destroys tissue. So yes the cause of death is still blood loss, but the mechanism of the wound is different in practice and is MUCH harder to recover from.

>>34457486
>/k/lassy
>Polymer framed handgun
>Aluminum cased ammunition

Kek

>>34458212
Yes, but more energy does not necessarily mean more bleeding. A man running at full speed has more energy than a 357 magnum, but I'd rather play tackle football than be shot.

>>34457589
Not that anon, but it's underwhelming like most MacBarens. I'd get some Dark Star, as I really think that process is similar to the "firing." Also, that Orlik is the same thing as Peter Heinrich dark strong flake.

>>34457486
I think you loaded that wrong.

>>34456993
You really should watch this. If you still think JHP or HP are worth carrying for lethality then that's on you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXwPtP-KDNk

>>34458321
I never did like that football player / bullet analogy. It completely ignores cross section to the point of absurdity.

Hammer a spike through the top of his football helmet and then choose if you'd rather be shot with a .357 mag or gored in the chest by a linebacker.

>>34458465
Sorry didn't mean to say "you" specifically just "you people reading this" in general.

>>34458465
I don't carry hollow points for wider wound channels. I carry them to prevent my bullet going through my target's chest cavity and creating a lead deposit in some little girl's skull off to the side and behind him.

>>34458498
Where are you that this is a concern when most likely you will be spraying rounds to protect yourself. You make no sense.

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>>34457817

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>>34457171
Nigga... bullets cause crush injuries and there is a definite difference between high and low velocity bullets. Arrows are different and cause cutting injuries. If it was simply a matter of bleeding to death people that get shot would keep running around and shooting each other for nearly an hour in most cases.

>>34458516
In my home, where both my kids are on opposite sides of the hall from our master bedroom, and where I get maybe 2-3 oh-so-robust layers of shitty gypsum drywall from anywhere else in the home.

How many layers of drywall does it take to stop a 9mm FMJ, by the way? Honest question, never tried.

Did you know you can die from all sorts of things? Op might need to know that a broom handle shoved uo his ass can make him bleed to death or pulled out of his ass and beat him over the head.

>>34456993

9mm is roughly .380 inches

.45 is roughly .45 inches.

So the difference between 9mm and .45 ACP is roughly .07 of an inch.

.50 BMG is only .05 of an inch increase in diameter. If your absolutely overwhelmingly shitty argument holds true than .50 BMG should be only marginally better than .45 because energy transfer doesn't matter. Yet .50 BMG can rip a man apart, blow through concrete and defeat steel armor that would stop .45 ACP until the end of time.

Really activates the almonds doesn't it.

>>34457817
I thought that grip had turds painted on it until i opened the thumbnail

>>34458558
4 layers (2 walls) offers almost no protection from anything. 15-20% of energy reduction tops. HP does the tinest amount better but you still need like 8 walls or a couple of 2x4.

>>34458609
Guess I better not miss and hope the bullet stays inside the shit head intruder then.

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>>34457171
Hydrostatic shock

Hydro-Static
relating to or denoting the equilibrium of liquids and the pressure exerted by liquid at rest.

Shock//archaic
collide violently.

TL/DR: Hydrostatic shock relates to the transfer of energy from one medium to another, usually regarding something fluidic, and the resulting disruption of that medium.

The bullet impacts, your flesh jiggles, trauma occurs if its in an area where there are lots of soft jiggly organs that tear like tissue paper, i.e. spleen.

An Arrow works off of mechanical cutting force. as another anon said, a bullet tends to crush. Here is hydrostatic impact at work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeW_JbtEHkQ

Note the bullet does not simply make a small hole. The tissue "Explodes" as it ripples outward from displacement.

A deer shot in the head with an arrow, will likely not explode. It will get cut and bleed out if in a vital area. However deer are stupid, and dont have huge brains, and a lot of their head is sinus cavity.

>>34458567
.50 is a more massive bullet going significantly faster. bad analogy, chief.

>>34458567
>no guns detected
Listen, theres more powder behind .50 BMG and if we're talking about mass instead of velocity than .5 BMG has more bullet mass than .45 ACP.

0/10

>>34458465
It's more to prevent over-penetration and the liability that comes with it; lethality is incidental, barely ancillary.

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>>34458567
see .45 ACP, now see .50BMG.

Diameter of bullet is not indicative of actual mass, nor velocity.

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>>34458426
>>34457589

I love it. Old Dark Fired is my go to, I like Dunhill Nightcap also. I'm always open to try more tobaccos, though. Pipe is just a basket pipe I got for 30 bucks.

>>34458306

>aluminum

That's nickel, son

>>34457817

Sounds good, closest to current EDC pictured

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>>34456993
this is a poor bait post, but you faggots need to learn some physics

an arrow is not going fast enough to cause hydrostatic shock. hydrostatic shock is a byproduct of the transfer of energy from one mass into another. specifically from a bullet into living tissue, which is almost entirely water. water is nearly incompressible, like hydraulic fluid in a brake or clutch line. when that fluid is suddenly pressed, it has a tendency to burst its volume: circulatory lines break and tissues tear with the concussion. instantaneous blackout from a hit to a large volume of liquid is possible, and usually followed by bleed out.

aim for the heart, ramon.

>>34458482
>It completely ignores cross section to the point of absurdity.
Because using kinetic energy as a measure ignores everything to the point of absurdity.
>>34458552
>If it was simply a matter of bleeding to death people that get shot would keep running around and shooting each other for nearly an hour in most cases
You'd be surprised how often that happens. Most people who get shot make it to the hospital, where they are patched up and live to tell about it.
>>34458567
Those diameters all sound small, but when you consider that 45 ACP has 60% more impact area than 9mm, you realize the difference is important.

>>34458627
Static means still. When a body gets shot, the fluids inside it are anything but still.

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>>34459308
anon. At the speed at which the bullet transfers energy, they might as well be static. Your body is not transferring fluid about at 800-1300FPS.

There is no saving face here. Just exercise some grown up shit. Let me help.

Step 1. Oh shit. Im wrong. Guess ill just deal with it and realize no one really cares that much.

Step 2. Guess I can move on with my day/ life. Fuck it.

Step 3. Dont make the same mistake, first time was ignorance, second time is arrogance and stupidity.

>>34456993
>implying hydrostatic shock is just caused "by energy"
>literally not having any clue as to how physics works in relationship to a discussion but getting all opinionated
>lol what even is change in velocity over time
>lol clearly theres no difference in the way a bullet imparts energy to a target and shoving somebody, just looks at the numbers
>high frequency oscillating pressure waves? man that's way too many big words for my brain to understand

>implying broadheads can't only kill things due to energy
>implying that even if they could it would somehow disprove the idea that a bullet could wound with energy

>>34457171
>>34457515
>>34457955
>>34458321
Jesus, gotta love the way that the pendulum has swung from mindless idiots blindly believing in "knock down" power to facklerism these days. Would't be surprised if your ass spent it's free time wondering how people could think hydrostatic shock is real when people manage to survive being accelerated to several hundred miles per hour in a plane and then stopping over the course of several minutes.

Read a book, nigguh.

>>34458567
9mm = .355 fyi

>>34458730
you don't seem to be getting that anon is saying the argument for bullet diameter is retarded and that its not how it works.

>>34459457
oh and while were at it hydrostatic shock sounds stupid because it was a catchy name made up by laymen and doctors to describe a phenomenon that they were observing. The latin roots of the words separate parts isnt a good condemnation of the concept, in fact it's kinda tarded to bring up as an actual point.

maybe spend less time cooking up shit bait and instead go read some of the many sources out there that show evidence of proximal and distal physical damage being caused by bullet wounds(not to mention short term physiological changes).

>>34457171

HS shock is very real. ask any trauma surgeon.

>>34457550
You know what it's a lot classier than? Being no-guns.

>>34458778
>>34458426
>>34457589
do you guys just order tabacco online? my buddy gave me one of those wood pipes you buy at gas stations but ive never had tabacco to smoke, i dont even think theres a smoke shop in my city. its all marijuana stores

>>34460871
Any gas station should have loose tobacco.

>>34457817
>vape
The only reason I don't want to have you sent to a gas chamber is because you'd probably enjoy it.

>>34459440
The fluid moves radially outward at high speed. It is not fucking still. The word shock implies that it is not still.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIv03PlMG2g

>>34459532
The roots are actually Greek, not Latin.

>>34457171
>Nobody dies immediately when they get shot except in the movies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89UliEiQQyU
No bleeding can put animals down that fast.

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>>34457171
>Nobody dies immediately when they get shot except in the movies.
I dunno 'bout that. This doe went down like she'd been electrocuted. Maybe you need to go hunting with a 25-06 and see if your Internet learning applies in RL.

>>34457171
>"Kinetic energy is useful in physics, but it is irrelevant to ballistics."

LOLOLOLOLOL. JESUS CHRIST YOU'RE A FUCKING RETARD. KEKIMUS MAXIMUS. Holy shit. Thanks for the laugh.

>>34461587
>>34461623
I have gone hunting. Animals die very quickly, but it is not instantaneous. There is a brief time they are alive before the brain runs out of oxygen. When they drop, it is because blood pressure is so low they become unconscious. Death happens after that.
>>34461885
Not an argument.

>>34462222
>There is a brief time they are alive before the brain runs out of oxygen.
Even complete cut off of blood flow leaves around 9 seconds of conscious in humans case (very well established fact from wrestling see blood choke), I think animals stamina is not less than that and you can see drops much faster than 10 seconds.

>>34457817
T. Homosexual

>>34460871

100% online. Most brick and mortars are a shit, and very few actually blend their own stuff. Really easy in the US, but I've had stuff delivered from nearly everywhere.

>>34462222
>>34461885
Right, lets get some basic definitions out of the way.

>Kinetic energy - Energy associated with the movement of some body
>Potential energy - Energy attributed towards the possibility of movement or work, in relation to other bodies or forces.
>Ballistics - "The science of projectiles and firearms, study of the effects of being fired on by a bullet, etc"

How are you possibly divorcing these concepts? Physics is the whole system that makes the analysis of ballistics possible. Try to describe to me any concept with a moving body without using physics, its going to sound retarded.

Hydrostatic shock is not a buzzword, and furthermore arrows and bullets definitively do not kill in the same manner. Have you ever wondered why broadheads are sharp? It's because they're meant to sever arteries and exsanguinate the target. While bullets can achieve the same thing, they do create secondary damage from the massive energy imparted into the target that grossly deforms and further damages surrounding tissue, aka hydrostatic shock. Have you ever watched a slo-mo video of ballistic gelatin being struck by a round? It inflates and deforms to ridiculous proportions before returning to normal dimensions, rupturing arteries/tissue/organs in the process.
There's a reason >>34461623 has a giant fucking hole in it, and that arrows don't create this same sort of exit wound. If you're still going to cling to the idea that bullets "bleed everything out" you're really just arguing semantics and being a cunt.

The point I'm trying to convey here though is; your comment about physics and energy reveals how little you understand ballistics, and betrays you as a fool.

Dude wtf OP
I came here to correct and maybe make fun of you a bit but damn man I'd need to cite too many of your posts.

Physics isn't easy to understand, but damn homie at least get some fundamentals from YouTube or khan academy.

Ballistics totally rely on kinetic energy

HST is measured, it's like your denying climate change

>>34462499
> What is shock

>>34460699

You're just upset that you need to pretend to have class