Spear Thread

>>34144887
I like spears. Quite a lot

File: bill_1.jpg (37KB, 760x503px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 760x503px

>>34144887
Make it about polearms in general desu

>>34144943
no halberds n shit are for fags

>>34144943
Go be a tryhard somewhere else

>halberdfag containment thread when?

Speaking of spears, what would be better in a duel? A spear with a shield our double handed? If you use a shield you can get to the center of gravity so it's more maneuverable

>>34144978
>>34144996
what's wrong? The spear is such a tiny topic, isn't it?

>>34145020
An arm shield that lets your shield hand free.

File: mike_loades.jpg (16KB, 300x300px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 300x300px

>>34144887
Spear lovers unite
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gctjLzCF4I

>>34144978
Staff-length halberds are objectively the pinnacle of melee combat.

>Can use quarterstaff techniques in close combat
>Can poke people from farther away than all but the longest zweihander
>Can chop wood from pretty far away, also necks
>Spike on back can fuck armour up

>>34144887
Another question, what thickness would the shaft of a spear be during the middle ages?

In a world where nobody wears armor or carries a shield or fights on horseback (ie, today, except for riot Police), the simple spear is the ultimate pole-arm weapon.

A heavier head with spikes and axe-blades is just useless extra weight compared to the simple and elegant spear point.

Halberd-fags btfo.

>>34144887
I FUCKING LOVE SPEARS AND BAYONETS. THEY'RE SO SIMPLE, LONG, AND EFFECTIVE. FUCK.

File: roman legion.jpg (80KB, 1000x566px) Image search: [Google]

80KB, 1000x566px

>>34144887
Spears are great for unorganized plebs who are pretending to be organized

A real organized army of professional soldiers need only short swords and shields

File: SH2312_l[1].jpg (75KB, 406x1126px) Image search: [Google]

75KB, 406x1126px

Euroshits please go and stay go.

>>34150828
>>34150828
The spear made Japan

https://youtu.be/nHnQEfHLr2U

File: Yari.jpg (577KB, 695x3009px) Image search: [Google]

577KB, 695x3009px

>>34151834
Good lord jap martial arts demos suck, it would be far easier to understand the techniques their using if they would just perform them as if they were in a real fight but at half speed, that constant stopping when reaching a new position just looks retarded. It would also be great if they picked up full contact sparring and posted the vids online so we could see what this stuff looks like at full speed.

>>34150683
Good bait faggot.

>>34152993
Then go watch LARP-shit.

Real-fighting and dojo-fighting are two different things.

>>34153254
Not even remotely baiting.

Look at the Battle of Watling Street.
Barbarians with pointy sticks aren't even close to competing next to a proper Roman manipular legion.

The so called "dark ages" made great use of long pointed sticks because they had no professional army.
You can't compare the effectiveness of the two

If you transported a legion from the 3rd century to the 13th century, you'd find that legion carving out a fucking state .

>>34153300
Except that Roman Legionnaires employed not one, but TWO, javelins for medium range attacks. The pilum and verutum.

Spears and Polearms were ALWAYS the go to weapons for conscripts to pros from Hellenic warfare to pikemen during the Renaissance. Mounted knights used lances and samurai used bows and spears. Swords were always considered secondary or tertiary back up weapons.

>barbarians with pointy sticks
>proper roman manipular legion
>not realizing that what actually matters are field tactics, grand strategy and military doctrine

Not only are you bait, you're retarded bait. Go back to your shitty video games kid.

>>34153418
>Except that Roman Legionnaires employed not one, but TWO, javelins for medium range attacks. The pilum and verutum.

Auxiliaries and fucking whatever you call 'em
Young fucks
Fugging boots
I'm too drunk to remember

The youngest and most inexperienced soldiers had pila and threw them at the start of combat. Before actual combat started. They ran back after throwing their pila.

In proper combat, it was gladius and shields vs whatever shit the shit barbs had.

>>34147702
It doesn't matter if you're using a sword, spear or halberd.

Aiming for the face, neck, or the armpit is the best way of killing anybody wearing armor.

>>34153473
>I'm too drunk to remember
*Dumb.

File: pikes.jpg (629KB, 3008x2000px) Image search: [Google]

629KB, 3008x2000px

>>34144887
Spears are good, but pikes are even better.

>>34153804
Pikes would be used only on the battlefield though.
You can't use a pike in a duel.

>>34153418
>Except that Roman Legionnaires employed not one, but TWO, javelins for medium range attacks. The pilum and verutum.
Those javelins aren't for melee fighting anon, they are projectiles.

They are too short.

>>34153300
>If you transported a legion from the 3rd century to the 13th century, you'd find that legion carving out a fucking state .
Careful great one, but if the ancient barbarian armies of old can destroy 3 fucking legions in an ambush (at their might), I don't think they stand a chance against medieval armors with better armor and weapons.

File: Roman Air Troops.jpg (58KB, 417x480px) Image search: [Google]

58KB, 417x480px

>>34150683
>>34153300
>>34153473
>confusing pre-marian tactics with post-marian legions
You should drink less because it's made you into a retard.

Auxillia were used because the Romans had no fucking idea how to use spears effectively so they had their barbarian troops do what they did best, the Romans provided the organization and logistics and the actual men in the units did the fighting. Nobody on the Italian peninsula used spears before the Roman Republic besides the Samnites and minor Latin tribes, and even then they were tiny and flimsy things. Romans tried their best to emulate the Etruscans who were the only people who had their shit together besides Greek colonies.

Though I will give you that if you transported a 3rd century legion to the 13th century they would, without a doubt, be an incredible military force on the battlefield. What >>34153418 doesn't seem to get is that the Roman legion was a complete package, it came with everything necessary to effectively be it's own military for an entire state. Legions only needed outside materials, they didn't need equipment or special technological assistance, the personnel responsible for upkeep were soldiers themselves.

Nobody else would have been able to field something so incredible, the legionaries would be squaring off against peasants armed with spears and, if lucky, bits of armor here and there. They would be barely drilled, and ultimately, every day they were spent being spearmen was a day they weren't farmers which was economically dangerous. Really, the legionaries would be peers with ragtag mercenary companies that couldn't hope to have the same tactical finesse of a cohort.

Not to mention the auxillia, if you took a legion from Africa and moved them to Frankia then there's a good chance the barbarians would be right at home; Roman doctrine intentionally made people serve their time far away from their homes.

Plus the exposure to new armor and weapon styles would make the legion adapt.

>>34154227
To be fair, the roman legions had the most troubles with the barbarian pikes and greek phalanx.

Greek phalanx in particular, they had to retreat and lure the phalanx to hilly terrain for easier flanking.

>>34154249
Sure, but 13th century armies did not have anywhere near the same fighting elan and prowess as the Greek phalanxes or their own ancestors. They were peasant conscripts, starving North Koreans compared to WWII 101st Airborne, ultimately prolonged use was limited by hard economic limits.

I imagine a legion would deploy it's auxillia on the flanks first, and then rush forward with the main body once the enemy committed. You do have to remember that tactics in the 13th century weren't incredible, they were limited to the troops they had, and the legion could be more flexible and more cunning as a result.

I think they would have the most trouble with English armies that were extremely archer-heavy, the Romans never encountered anyone that employed something like the longbow in that amount.

Now if the Romans were transported to England and somehow made friends with the locals, that would be a force to be reckoned with.

>>34154294
Dude, the roman had troubles with germanic barbarians that were fighting with basic weapons they have, you are talking about 13th centuries medieval troops who just recently experienced the crusades and various civil/continental wars.

It's much likely it's going to be a massacre because the spear of roman auxilla cannot hold against chainmail-wielding knights, and halberd-wielding sergeants.

It's going to be massacre, but not for the roman troops.

>>34154316
>It's going to be massacre, but not for the medieval* troops.

>>34144887
welp, time to fire up EB2

File: 1477396206256.jpg (4MB, 3514x2827px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 3514x2827px

>>34154337
Why would you assume anyone here know what obscure acronym you're using?

>>34154350
Not that guy but I know it's Europa Barbarum 2.

I think it's better if he fires up Attila desu.

>>34154350
because we're all NEETs.

>>34154350
The kicker is the cat. Who's the artist?

>>34154359
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Bloch

File: swiss_guard_57.jpg (539KB, 1181x886px) Image search: [Google]

539KB, 1181x886px

Hey /k/, I actually have a question relevant to the thread subject for once.

I've seen plenty of political protests where people open carry ARs. Carrying a firearm to a protest can really open you up to a lot of legal problems. But what about open carrying a halberd? If touching your OC rifle under certain circumstances can be charged as brandishing, what about just carrying a pole weapon around? I can't think of any state law in the US that prohibits the open carry of pole weapons in public and I just really want to be able to defend myself during a riot with a pike.

>>34154522
People wouldn't take you seriously at all.

Or they are scared, americucks fear melee weapons.

>>34154528
>People wouldn't take you seriously at all.
Well you don't have to dress like a fluffed faggot like the Swiss Guard are, but honestly polearms and swords are dangerous as fuck. Maybe it's just that the only people carrying those in the modern day for "self defense" are fat autistic NEETs.

why did the romans not use the phalanx?

how did the testudo counter the phalanx?

>>34154543
Well, some people do associate swords and melee weapons with video games so they don't take them seriously, it's a very irrational belief.

>>34154549
They used phalanx but they got their shit kicked by gaul and iberians who used sword and shield so instead they copied the gaul and iberian way of fighting.

They countered phalanx by flanking and terrain.

>>34154549
>phalanx moves slow
>phalanx is weak on right flank
>phalanx loses formation on rough or broken terrain
>phalanx is vulnerable to missile attacks
>phalanx is weak to ANY flanking maneuver
>testudo wasn't intended to counter phalanx, it was intended to shield ranks from missiles
>legionnaires were far more flexible, fast enough to outmaneuver heavier infantry and well-armed enough to survive missile attacks and crush light infantry

>>34154563
>>34154578
but it's strange to me that the phalanx just stopped being used, imagine that a testudo going against a phalanx, the phalanx would win

File: image.jpg (2KB, 30x30px) Image search: [Google]

2KB, 30x30px

>>34154578
>pic related

>>34154590
Phalanx was used though, look up pyrrus the great vs the roman army.

Pyrrus was superior tactically but Roman got the logistics down.

Can't beat that.

>>34154590
>but it's strange to me that the phalanx just stopped being used
The phalanx as a general infantry formation was cost-effective, but worked best in areas with enough geographic constraints to prevent major flanking maneuvers. Phalanxes quickly became ineffective as the main body of an army when deployed in open terrain or against missile troops, so they clearly lacked flexibility. A tight formation of polearms never really became obsolete; their use just changed depending on geographic needs and capital. Pikemen supported by musketeers were the cornerstone of most European armies from 1400-1700.

>imagine that a testudo going against a phalanx, the phalanx would win
You're missing the point, they aren't used in the same roles. Legionnaires had flexibility, and were fast-moving for heavy infantry. Legionnaires only formed testudo to shield from missiles, there was never a reason to do so in pitched combat. Legionnaires can launch their own missiles, and would probably prefer to skirmish with a phalanx with missiles before flanking. Nobody in the ancient world intentionally charged into a full strength spear wall because that's literally the ONLY strength a phalanx had.