Real talk /k/ has shit like this made helicopters redundant in

File: chaff.jpg (43KB, 736x490px) Image search: [Google]

43KB, 736x490px

>>33995100
they have chaff which might let them get away.

Didn't US forces use Apache's against radar and AA sites in the opening of Desert Storm?
I believe that with carefull planning theyre feasable but I wouln't want to be hovering around in high altitude (for heli's) like they have been doing in the recent low intencity conflicts

If you're a shitter, sure. Skilled pilots will fly NOE to avoid non-radar guidance systems, while chaff can be used for radar guided shit. Its a bit like people assuming tanks are obsolete because if you sit out in the open you'll get fucked by a Kornet, which misses the nuance that western tank crews are taught not to expose themselves and to move evasively, something apparently beyond Saudi and Turkish tank crews.

File: San Carlos.jpg (72KB, 800x445px) Image search: [Google]

72KB, 800x445px

>>33995130
Rapier uses a 3D dagger search radar to find targets, an IR imager called Darkfire to track a target and a lidar called laser fire for fire control.

You can shot out as many chaff and flares as you want, but the odds are against any helicopter or low flying jet.

>>33995189
>If you're a shitter, sure. Skilled pilots will fly NOE to avoid non-radar guidance systems

go play some cawadooty

>>33995196
>He thinks nape-of-the-earth was invented by CoD
Oh the irony

>>33995203
>Thinks i'm referring to NOE and not his moronic gaming terms to describe real life pilots.

>>33995189
NOE flight opens you up to being in the engagement envelope of systems that will fuck you even harder and you can't even use countermeasures against.

SPAAGs eat helicopters.

>>33995100
Aren't stealth helicopters a thing?

>>33995203
>nape
kek

>>33995100
Lol, decimate what, 10% of a helicopter? The word you're looking for is annihilate, nigger.

>>33995192

can confirm, its biggest weakness are the limited range and operational ceiling & vulnerability against HARM and cruise missiles. Optical tracking is hard as well especially when the target is too fast or flying evasive maneuvers. Helos usually sink fast to avoid a Rapier missile, fixed wings do sharp turns or try to outspeed the missile.

Although I only have experience with the swiss version, which consists of a separate tracking radar, an optical tracker and the launcher unit with the search radar built in.

It's a bitch to get to work, mainly due to stupid cable connectors, but once it runs, it does its task pretty well.

No, helos aren't obsolete. Not even close. While anti-air weapons may be getting pretty lethal, their emplacement/employment regulate them to being a defensive weapon. Until there's a counter to helicopters that's as agile or nearly so, they'll be useful.

>>33995137
Iraqis did not have any AD able to engage low flying helicopter during night.

File: C__Data_Users_DefApps_AppData_INTERNETEXPLORER_Temp_Saved Images_1494309376790.png (2MB, 1242x2208px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1242x2208px

>wanted to join RAF as weapons system operator
>this thread has made me unsure

Fat pussy to ease my nerves

>>33995100
Both and neither. Low-level AA has gotten a lot better, but helicopter tech has improved and the basic tactics still work.

Give it 20 years, and ask again. Then drone swarms will probably replace helicopters.

>>33995906

As AA operator you are pretty much screwed because you're obviously one of the first targets for enemies. Especially if your unit is the one on radar watch or your position/concealment is bad.

You are either taken out by commando forces or get a missile in your face.

Exceptions are highly mobile AA systems and MANPADS as well as long range SAM launchers with sufficient protection against those threats.

Basically if you are MAA, it is a game of hide and seek paired with some mind games. Aircraft will probe your operational space in the hope that your radar or a launch exposes your position. Then you relocate and the game starts again.

But on the other hand, it is one of the comfier jobs during peace time.

>>33995100

Redundant means doing the same thing.

I think the word you are looking for is "ineffective"

>>33995100
Dunno, have guns made tactical trucks obsolete?

File: EFlSK.jpg (523KB, 3040x2022px) Image search: [Google]

523KB, 3040x2022px

>2017
>not using orbital drop pods for insertion

>>33995100
Attack helicopters are delicate things.

You can't use them to attack emplacements, that's just asking to get shot to smithereens.
However, their main purpose is to bring lethal ordinance quickly from basically anywhere (unlike jets, which require runways and all that shit).

So storming convoys or supporting a skirmish that ensued somewhere unexpected are still viable situations.

>>33996695
>Using the most easy to intercept method

shiggy

>>33996151
I appreciate the detailed response but by weapons system operator I meant shooting at things from a gun mounted on a Chinook

>>33995281
>le decimate means to take 10% of something
fuck off michael, no one invited you here

>>33996720
I'd agree with this, I feel like delicate is an overstatement though. They're not necissarily a niche role, they just have certain conditions that need to be met to maximize their risk vs. Reward.

Honestly in training with American apache pilots, they've lost a lot of technique and skill due to the current low tech, no risk engagements they've been in. When it becomes force on force my tank platoon was demolishing the apaches (you know, those things that tanks are supposed to be afraid of) . Their ttps seriously need to be revamped.

>>33996720
>You can't use them to attack emplacements, that's just asking to get shot to smithereens.

>yfw they were the first wave in the Gulf War

>>33995100

Don't helicopter missiles outrange these? I mean, what's preventing a heli from detecting a SAM from a mile away and shooting an ATG missile at it like any other tank?

>>33995100
There was recent force-on-force done between airforce jets and army helo's, and the helo's actually won the exercise due to their agility and creative positioning, chopper are underrated as fuck, and actually compete with MBT's for funding. Just sayin'

>>33996724
>Wasting a missile on a single invader

>>33996896
Decision making is the most important thing for chopper pilots, it can be difficult to control yourself into being ultra safe

>>33997281
When that invader is being shipped to orbit and dropped in a vehicle that can survive rentry, "waste" doesn't really come into it

Could launch two SM-6 and still be economically less out of pocket than the other guy

>>33997241
I know what you are referring to and it's 100% a meme. That exercise is total bullshit that is still posted here as truth all the time.

If you look into it you'll see how dumb and meaningless it was.

>>33995100
Before asking about SAM making helicopter redundant (?), ask yourself, what business do helo have in area covered with SAM?