Reccomending a Makarov as a carry weapon in 2017

>>33915693
If you're on a budget, and you need a concealable pistol that you can depend on, this is a great choice. It's waaay better than most budget guns out there. And it's 10839220 times better than a Tyrone classic Highpoint.

They're still relatively cheap and far superior to something like a Taurus. Made more sense back when they were $90-$150.

>>33915693
That was my 1st carry gun.
It's fine
Super thin
Not overly heavy
Enough power to be effective
I would agree that there are better choices, but it's fine.

>>33915693
Why not, disgusting tripfag?
My friend CCs one, and he's more accurate with his $200 Bulgarian mak than I am with my $850 M11A1

>>33915708
>It's waaay better than most budget guns out there.

No it's not.

A shield can be had below 300 dollars.

A SD9VE can be had below 300 dollars.

A Turkish CZ clone can be had at or around 350 dollars.

Because that's what Makarovs cost now. At least 300 dollars, if not more.

>If you're on a budget, and you need a concealable pistol that you can depend on

Ammo is all sorts of fucked. Makarov Ammo isn't common. And lets be honest, if we're talking about a gun for carry, for someone's first carry, having them buy a gun with damn near NO magazines for sale in a store, and RARELY any PRACTICE ammo, let alone actual self defense ammo available commonly, if at all(Besides Hornady, which is meh, at best.)

>>33915708
The Makarov is a great pistol. Fantastic, even.

But 9x18 as a cartridge blows. It's about even with .38 Special, but doesn't even have +P variants that let it produce decent hollow points.

>>33915726
>Made more sense back when they were $90-$150.

I agree with this. But they're damn near 400 dollars now.

>>33915730
>My friend CCs one, and he's more accurate with his $200 Bulgarian mak than I am with my $850 M11A1

Sounds like the problem is you, not the gun you carry.

My issue is >>33915750. There are far better handguns at the same or even lower prices than the makarov, with a better trigger than the makarov, better aftermarket than the makarov, shooting a better round than the makarov.

>>33915693
Because they've not fired a Tanfoglio Witness yet. They're more reliable than a Mak, you can get them on a chassis the same size, they're dead stupid simple to service and you can interchange slides to fire different rounds. They also will work with CZ75 mags. Most of them come with LPA low profile sights as well from the factory so no snags.

>>33915767
Also I forgot, when the poly ones go on sale you can pick one up for 220 bucks NEW. When the steel versions go on sale you can get one for around 275 NEW.

>>33915750
>If at all

Is dumb, because they're not going to be ordering 1,000 rounds of ammo from a website to get decent ammo cost. Not if this is their first weapon for carry, which would be assumed as they're asking.

>>33915767
How do those Tanfoglios compare to a CZ-75?

too expensive, too heavy, too weak compared to a $250 MP Shield 9mm.

same reason they recommend a mosin as a "cheap surplus rifle"

people who were buying these guns YEARS ago haven't looked at the actual prices of them TODAY, and absentmindedly recommend them to poorfags because they USED TO BE cheap.

>>33915809
>Mosin as a cheap rifle

Holy fuck have times changed.

This, is the cheapest mosin right now on gunbroker, without a reserve.

It has 12 days left.

http://www.gunbroker.com/item/644906217

The average cost of a Mosin on GB is like 400 dollars now..
What the hell happened?

>>33915796
Some might argue they're not as pretty but they are just as reliable and accurate. Same thing with durability. There is also a large aftermarket for them because they are popular competition guns. There's even a guy that makes a mini cone bayonet guide rod lmao

>>33915836
>What the hell happened?
if you're agreeing me you know as well as any of us what happened. they became popular to own, so more and more people bought them, and they haven't been built since the 1950s.
it's demand with zero supply.

>>33915875
Where the hell did the demand come from. That's my question.

I own a Mosin. It stays wrapped up in a gun sock, with the ammo I haven't shot (Over 300 rounds, as I havent' finished a single spam can I got in 2012) filling up a ammo can.

It is not pleasant to shoot. It is not pleasant to use, and it definitely isn't something I'd call a plinker.

So yeah, where did all this demand come from for what is literally the worst center fire rifle I've ever fired?

>>33915693
It is small. It kills. It is unshakably reliable.

>>33915909
>Where the hell did the demand come from. That's my question.
We created the demand by memeing the rifle. I'm not even joking btw.

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>>33915693
i saw a thread where anons were seriously recommending Taurus and tokarovs as CCW guns about a month ago.

i think were being invaded by fucking reddit and poorfags again.
if you seriously cant afford a $500 handgun, you should be prioritizing better. for one, get off 4chan and work more.

>>33915944

It's not even a good rifle, but I'll be honest, I bought one because of the memes. ANd because it was a hundred dollars.

>>33915966
>if you seriously cant afford a $500 handgun, you should be prioritizing better. for one, get off 4chan and work more.

This is a terrible mentality.

Besides, 500 dollars is not the "Reliable gun" spot like it was in the 80s. You can get a perfectly serviceable handgun for 300 dollars, chambered in a caliber that they sell at walmart.

Hell, There's a SD9VE I bought on a whim because I was able to get it for 230 dollars.

TWO HUNDRED AND THIRTY DOLLARS! That's nuts! A reliable, modern handgun. For Two hundred and thirty dollars!

>>33915693

It's small, it's thin, it's reliable, and it will kill somebody.

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ITT: Leon Vulva uses his alternate tripcode

I came here to remind everyone that makarovs have dick grips.

>>33915836
tfw a fin nugget costs close to $1000 in leaf land, at least we still have $250 SKS's

>>33915693
We haven't updated our memes.

The Mak and the Moist Nugget used to be so stupid cheap that they were actually an excellent value, for the money, especially since the ammo was also dirt cheap and available in bulk.

Good god, does anyone remember the glory days of the handnugget? Used to be those were under a bill.

Those days are long, long gone, and we need to shut down the echo chamber and get with the program.

Milsurp in general just ain't what it used to be.
The 2017 poorfag/starter memegun equivalent to the mak/nugget are probably the Shield or SD9VE and the Axis or American. Or something like that.

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>>33915750
>in a store
Who gives a shit, the internet is a thing.
>let alone actual self defense ammo available commonly, if at all
Again, internet.
Underwood makes a +p loaded 95g XTP and 115g hardcast 9x18 that are great.
As far as plinking ammo, I picked up 2 cases of Wolf a while back for less than .17pr shipped.


>>33915762
>but doesn't even have +P variants that let it produce decent hollow points

You were saying?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAEbbhRJNYw

>Giving any number of fucks about what people carry

Why? If you hate [gun], and don't CC [gun], then why give a shit if someone else does? I swear you guys aren't even old enough to own a handgun.

>>33916565
Boxes alone aren't enough. Show me some statistics.

Unless it manages the minimum FBI penetration and gets decent expansion consistently, then it's not viable.

>>33915693
It's thin, sleek, and is a semi-auto with a manual safety that holds plenty of ammo.

It's really not that bad of a choice, as long as you don't fuck with the decocker.

>>33916609
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1izBXZejuqA
The only gelatin test I could turn up.
>95 gr UNDERWOOD 13.4"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WA_xpdT-zaU
Velocity test
>Underwood 9x18 95gr XTP: 1198fps, 303 ft/lbs energy at the muzzle
>Hornady 9x18 95gr XTP: 999fps, 210 ft/lbs energy at the muzzle

It's consistent, nothing less than I expect from Underwood.

>>33915693
Not too expensive, relatively small, thin as fuck. I mean you could go memelord supreme and get a Glock 42 with a 9mm Makarov conversion barrel but it's just not the same.

>>33916192
You can still get a 91/30 for 199 though...

>>33915693
>playing R6Siege
>play as spetznaz
>GSH18 does 30dmg
>Mak does 70dmg

The fuck? Single stack Russian ".380" out performs modern double stack in the new Russian 9x19AP.

>>33916849
It's almost like siege is total garbage and doesn't deserve to be part of the rainbow six franchise.

No idea.
The cartridge is complete shit and I have no idea why the Russians adopted it and left the 7.62 tokarev.

Get a zastava m57.
Cheaper than a makarov and a lot more powerful.
Price for brass ammo is almost the same too.

>>33916135
In this post: anon doesnt realize SSB has been around waaaaay fucking longer than leon

>>33916849
>lets see what are good russian handguns guys
>FUCK THERES GODDAMN NOTHING
>THERES JUST THESE TWO
>well one has a ton of rounds and the other has like none
>perfect, balance it like the other low capacity handguns by giving it a ton of damage

>>33915836
>What the hell happened?

Surplus isn't imported anymore because Syrian and Ukrainian civil wars generate demand for them.

>>33916887
>No idea why Russians left Tok and went Mak

Makarovs are faster to produce, more durable, easier to repair, and cheaper. That's it.

Because it's a cute vintage you mongaloid.

>>33916887
>I have no idea why the Russians adopted it and left the 7.62 tokarev.
It's little bit weird and seems counter-effective but makes sense.

Ordinary SMG's in Soviet military were on their way out by the time 50's rolled in. They've had AK and they were fine with it, then they've shortened it like 10 times. As SMG's stopped being a thing, the need for pistol round that has decent energy went away with it. 7.62 Tok wasn't adopted because of it(it had more to do with the fact that it's the same calibre as their rifle ammo), but it was kept in service because of it.

Soviets generally hated pistols, saw few reasons for using a powerful one now that 7.62x39 was a thing for close quarters. Still, there were people who needed pistols for practical reasons, so they've designed a pistol and a new cartridge. 9x18 is I think the most powerful cartridge that can be used in comfortable and compact blowback pistol. Blowback meant that it was super-cheap, and super-simple to use and maintain.

>>33915750
>for sale in a store
Why does this even matter nowadays? Most people order their shit online, and you can find milsurp magazines from a dozen outlets on the web, and take your pick of ammo off of Ammoseek.

>>33915750
>Tripfag
>Filtered

>>33915693
It's a reliable gun with an external hammer and safety (some people like that) that can be had at Tyrone special prices.

If you pull the trigger, it goes boom without blowing up your hand, that's good enough.

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>>33915767
My nigga

>>33915796
Price not considered - Favorably.
Price considered - BUY THEM ALL

Here's some tidbits you won't often hear repeated:
Tanfoglio's Force (Witness in the US) is of course a clone of the CZ-75, but they made a few key changes in the safety and firing pin block, which gives Tanfoglio guns a better trigger out of the box than a CZ.
CZ is now, in turn, knocking off Tanfoglio with their new Omega trigger. Yes, we've come full circle.
What's this Tanfoglio style firing pin block matter for, you ask?
You know how people raved about the slick trigger on the Block-less Pre-Bs and CZ-85 Combat compared to the (admittedly still good) trigger on the FPB CZs?
This is because when CZ introduced their firing pin block, they made a real dog of it, and your trigger pull actually has to move the block out of the way, adding resistance and grit to the pull.
Tanfoglio's firing pin block (which they introduced before CZ did, fyi) is in a sense passive - as you pull the trigger, the block moves away under its own weight, and has zero impact on the trigger pull.
Between this and good manufacturing quality Tanfoglios and most clones (Caniks need not apply), have triggers superior to non-Omega CZs

Almost every CZ clone on the market is a Tanfoglio design -- Canik, Jericho, Sphinx, AR-24, they're all copied directly from Tanfoglio, not from the CZ-75 proper as is often implied.

I have only three grievances with Tanfoglio guns:
One, the cheaper steel frame guns have cast, not forged, frames. This is pretty much only an issue on 10mm, which has developed something of a reputation for cracking frames and slides when fed a steady diet of full power loads.
Two, you only get one choice on safety - Cock and lock. Tanfoglio does not offer decockers -- though IWI does on the Jericho, which is a Tanfoglio design.
Three, Tanfoglio says no +P ammo. I don't know why - if they can handle 10mm, 9mm+P is nothing - though upgrade the recoil spring anyway.

>>33915836
>Buying on GunBroker
Secondary market cost is usually $200-$300

Admitting I'm in a cunt where I can't carry and I want to get a handgun for recreative shooting with an option on usefulness if shtf, the only problem with the mak would be the rarity of the ammo in a scenario where I can't order online right?
Because I've gotten enamored with the design.

>>33917711
Thanks for the extensive info on the Tanfoglios. I had honestly never considered them for purchase up until recently because I thought they were just some low quality knockoff, but I found out that they were the ones who actually manufactured the original Jerichos. That got me interested in them.

I assume the ones with the cast frames are the standard Witnesses, and the ones with forged frames are the Elite/Match ones?

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>>33916585
>tfw Russian and can't own one

>>33916912
obama put tariffs against russia so they cant import them any more

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>>33915693
I honestly don't know, especially when you can get a CZ82 for the same price and it's better in every conceivable metric.

>>33915693
Because only the Tok is the correct answer.

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>>33918223

>>33918701
>CZ82
>not shit
pick one and only one

>>33916933
Vintage has no place in carry.

>>33917613
Because new people exist.

Never forget that everyone isn't a gun person, and this confusion is aimed at people recommending new people Makarovs.

>>33915693
nexus of poorfag and slavshit memes
>>33915708
>not drop safe without the manual safety engaged
>heel release
>9x18
>blowback
>weighs half a ton
>bulky as fuck
Yeah, totally better than an M&P Shield.

Anyone who carries a Mak and has bought a gun since acquiring the Mak is fucking retarded.

YOU'RE BACK!!! OH GOD WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN?

>>33918751
The tok is worse for carry.

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>>33915693
There's some redneck that open carry's a mak in one of those shitty nylon OWB holsters you see sold at Walmart.

I think hes doing some kind of citizens security as he gives anyone that enters while hes on "duty" the stink eye as they browse the store.

He doesn't even work there, he just sits there drinking coffee for several hours while talking to the attendant and harassing customers.

Makarov fags in a nutshell.

>>33918701
The cz 82 has all of the same problems as the mak does, with the added factor of being MORE expensive with even less options for it.

>>33918832
*He regulars a local gas station.

>>33918827
actually you would recognize this name probably if anything probably. Shit dude why did you leave the se/k/ret santas? you know how much of a nightmare it was?

>>33918846

>>33918827
Writing. And lurking.

>>33918829
Eh. I wouldnt carry it but:
>better caliber
>button release mags
>slimmer
>lighter

>>33918854
why have you not come to nuggetfests?

>>33918865
Cause I'm in Georgia.

And I have a real job.

>>33918853
Because someone kept saying I was doxing people and somehow stealing credit cards for running secret Santa, and I was tired of it.

>>33918882
we had one in VA and most of us have jobs. Mong.

>>33918890
And you didnt witness me go way over my head with it and still deliver? Everybody spouts shit deal with it. Now hopefully creep senpai can handle it all alone

>>33917958
I can buy mak ammo at my Academy Sports near me

>>33918891
Virginia is still a 6 hour drive, and the amount of guns I would bring would get me flagged as a gun runner.
>>33918895

Honestly I was tired of that whole mess.

>>33915909
Demand literally came from everybody harping about how cheap and plentiful they were, even unused out of the box. Who wouldn't want a rifle for the same price as a few lattes from Starbucks?

>>33915693
It has 26 parts, I have never had a single malfunction out of mine.

>>33919011
But do you carry it?

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>>33915693
let it be said that I generally dislike modern handguns. I haven't yet met a plastic wonder-nine that I thoroughly enjoyed shooting and I wouldn't really be comfortable carrying any of them. This combined with the fact that my hands are absolutely tiny means that my options for an ideal carry piece are pretty limited.

the Makarov and its various copycats fill a pretty delicious niche for me, they're relatively inexpensive to buy and feed while being very comfortable for me to shoot. Is it the ideal pistol for most people? No, disregarding personal taste there are better choices available. That doesn't mean a Mak won't fuck somebody's shit up.

>>33915693
Because I can.

I bought my 5th Makarov last December for $199 at Sportsman Guide. I also picked up a P83 for $189 at the same time. They can still be found for good prices. I think the sale at Sportsman Guide was over a month long. They are built like a tank and will last forever.

Will it kill easily enough?
If the answer is yes, then it's fine.

>>33919146
If your hands are too tiny to wrap around a Jericho compact you might be better off with a revolver than even your Mak. Something in me has a feeling though that you just don't like modern guns as an opinion and us it as a means of justification to not shoot one enough to negate that feeling. I feel you though in the regards of we're gonna shoot what we want to. Something about dick grips and a 47 lb recoil spring does something to the mind in terms of LARPing as one of Ivan's personal bodyguards. Is fun da

>>33919146
> No, disregarding personal taste there are better choices available.

That's all I'm saying.

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>>33918701
>>33918793
I definitely like the CZ-82 but never in my life have I been able to un-fuck the mag release. It's so fucking garbage.

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>>33915693
Because they are too poorfag to get a real carry gun. Poorfags make poorfag decisions which is why they are forced to defend them.

>>33915693
>SweetSoulBro !!H5XdMKmBv5G
who?

>>33918832
I don't know if that story is true but I lol'd

>>33920924
An old tripfag and author of the RPG, Ops and Tactics.

>>33917711
can the tanfoglio take cz75b magazines? also did tanfoglio change the magazine design at some point like cz did between the cz 75 and cz 75b?

>>33918137
>up until recently because I thought they were just some low quality knockoff,
If EAA wasn't such a shit-tier importers using the butterface covered in makeup marketing instead of the actual competition credentials,that would help a lot

>>33918701
The CZ has some nice features and the sights are way better, but it's mechanically worse

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>>33915693

It's a nice reliable and compact pistol.
I conceal carry one

>>33920924
Guy that's been here for about a decade and knows a good bit about smith and Wesson autos, whereas you are just copypasting shit you've seen recently instead of asking anything constructive

>>33923827
>ball ammo

>>33923856
IKR! cant believe people still carry that stuff ever since it stopped being able to kill people in the mid 1990s when well designed JHPs started to become more common.

>>33923856

>Range day

>>33915693
Does it kill people dead? has it killed people? does it put rounds down range quickly and accurately?

>>33915968
Its good enough. How many people shoot beyond 100 yards anyways? How many try to hit more than just a paper plate. Most probably use it as a adequate cheap deer rifle.

>>33915693
It actually works quite well.
>small and compact but not useless meme tier size
>good ergos
>cheap, effective round(better than .380)
>reliable proven design

It's not hard to see why. This certainly isn't a gun that you'd want innazone but it reeks of comfy

Makarov is great, but the double action trigger on it is too heavy for carry

>>33915765
Have you ever even held a makarov? The triggers are pure sex. Far better than any of the stiker fired pistols listed. And also the fixed barrel makes maks VERY accurate. To top that off, mags can be had for 25 bucks and its pretty basic to buy ammo online, and saves the person a lot of money doing so.

are mako's ammo really that hard to find?

>>33925414
9x18 is fairly common, most shops have it in stock.

It's cheaper than .380 too.

>>33925440
hmm i wonder if i could mil a con-kit to make it fire 9mmP

>>33915693
i carry mine. its personal preference faggot.

>>33922265
It depends. Some of the tanfos can take 75b but others can not. There's a list on the cz forum in the clone section that breaks them down

Where the hell can I buy Bulgarian mags without getting my dick ripped off

>>33925899
eBay?

>>33925899
from bulgaria?