Revolver Carry?

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>>33914724

bump. could really use some thoughts on this.

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>>33914724
>>33914778

>>33914724
>>33914778
>>33914797

last bump

>>33914724
I carry a 4" EAA Windicator IWB every day, and I love it. I recommend you do it.

.357 is a hell of a round.

>>33914920

huh... maybe I'm not crazy for dumping the glock.

>.357 is a hell of a round

that was my thinking. statistics on fight stoppage with .38/.357 in 1 or 2 hits is pretty impressive

>old police data from when they carried wheel guns

It's stupid for all the reasons you put in your post unless bears or other large animals are your primary concern rather than Humans.

The trade off of power for less capacity isn't worth it. Your far more likely to need 15+ rounds of "good enough" rather than 6 rounds of overkill.

I have a Ruger Match Champ and while I adore it, it's a "just for fun" kind of gun.

>>33914724
It's hard to find factory 10mm that's loaded to its ballistic potential. Most of it is barely above your typical .40 Short and Weak in terms of power, unless you're buying boutique brands like Buffalo Bore.

>>33914724
I love my GP100, but it's too big and heavy for carry.

Which is too bad. My only other handgun is a Makarov, and that's not good for carry either.

Your far more likely to need 15+ rounds of "good enough"

Do you have any evidence for this assertion? Everything I have seen suggests the majority of non-police shootings do not require even 6 shots to be resolved, much less 15.

>>33914955
I know you don't want to hear this, but ultimately it's a personal choice. This is an unpopular opinion on /k/, but I think in most situations where you need a CCW, anything that goes bang will get you through the situation alive.

Bear in mind that the round you use doesn't matter nearly as much as the skill of the user. Those statistics don't consider that at all. Both police marksmen and dumbasses who can't shoot are included. The results for .357 are skewed, because more skillful handgun users tend to carry them. However, it is still a more powerful round, and stopping power isn't *entirely* a meme.

There are some reasons I prefer the revolver. It's more physically durable, a well-built revolver is a fucking unbreakable brick. It's less prone to jam--you can just keep pulling the trigger. And a criminal can't grab a hold of the gun, the blast from between the cylinder and the barrel will shred his hand if he tries.

Also, of course, the aesthetics and ergonomics. I have good arguments for revolvers, but the real reason I carry one is because I goddamn love the way revolvers feel in my hand.

And ignore anyone that tells you the capacity and speed of reloading is an issue. That can be countered with training: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLk1v5bSFPw

You don't have to be as good as Jerry fucking Miculek, but you can get perfectly good to negate the speed advantage of reloading a semi if you practice.

>>33915008
>Your far more likely to need 15+ rounds of "good enough" rather than 6 rounds of overkill

Everything I have seen puts the median number of rounds for DGU at 2

As some additional evidence to what >>33915068 is saying, consider this vid:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPbTWGEPi2o

Miculek is one of the best revolver pistoleros in the world, so it's par for the course that he would be able to reload extremely quickly. The guy in my video, by comparison, is just some normal nu-male looking guy, and yet he's also able to reload in a quick and skillful way.

>>33915008
>Your far more likely to need 15+ rounds of "good enough" rather than 6 rounds of overkill.

Not really. Most estimates for civilian-involved shootings involve far less than that.

Ultimately, people like OP need to carry what they're most comfortable shooting and carrying.

>>33915068

your response to my post seems to be about the most sound, reasonable one on here.

I believe it may be the tipping point for my decision. I've always like how a revolver fits in my hand, and the way it points. I shoot better from retention with one as well.

capacity and reload speed have always been my major concerns that kept me from thinking one would be a viable option for EDC, but the more I learn, read, etc. the more I realize that 5 or 6 rounds is actually plenty for just about anything I might encounter. hell.... most people CC compact pistols that only hold 5-8 rounds anyway.

I guess my experience in military kind of drilled into my head that I need more rounds. I need to remember that my mission is not to engage and destroy the enemy, or get involved in force on force engagements. my mission is simple self defense against 1-3 aggressors at close range.

>>33914724
depends op, re you big enough to CC a gun that size? 38spl has had a long history of killing people and was used by law enforcement for many years. It goes without saying that .357 out a 4+ in barrel will be more than enough to stop almost any attacker, animal or human. People will say b-but MUH CAPACITY and that is still true, having many more bullets is never a bad thing, however statistics has shown that civilian shootouts use far less rounds than a full size semi-auto can hold. just remember were talking about.357mag, that is a round powerful enough to be at the edge of more than enough for a human target and hand cannon. However it is up to how well you handle the gun, how well you CC it, and how well you like it.

the disadvantages for revolvers that I see for CC'ing are:
-cylinder thickness; though the SP101 lowers it by 5 rounds instead, it's still thick.
-overall gun size is way bigger
-bore axis is quite high
-357 turns into 38 at snub nose lengths


A single stack 9mm operates at much higher pressures and is more effective for the given gun size.

There's no disadvantage to carrying a revolver outside of the average /k/-goer's fantasy where they kill 27 Jamal's and Tyrones trying to assault a helpless white woman.

>>33915459
*unless you try to magdump

>>33915362

>big enough
>for you
I'd have no issue CCing a 4" SP101
>more than enough
yup. I like that too. I'd carry a glock 20 if the fucker wasn't XBOX huge
>>33915408
>single stack 9mm
it's smaller but I wouldn't say "more effective" consider the huge gap in ft lbs.... but I see your point.
>>33915459
this thread and other things I"m reading has me leaning that way. I've spent years with the mindset of I MUST HAVE 15 ROUNDS AND EXTRA MAGS. guess maybe I'm starting to see things differently. I've been a civilian for 10 years now and everyday, carrying a 15 rounder seems less and less necessary. Maybe I'm just getting complacent.

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>>33914724
>>33914797
I love my SP101. It carries fantastic from the 4 o'clock

I love my SP101 (same configuration as pic, with the 4 inch barrel). It's incredibly accurate, reliable, and legal in all of the US and even Canada without having to worry about pesky magazine limits.

If you like it, go with it.

You'll probably end up shooting .38 Special through it, and you'll probably be just as well armed.

I also think DA revolvers have a really nice trigger, which slows you down slightly and gives you a moment to use the sights.

>>33914724
>>33914778
I wouldnt, at least not the performance center. If you ever had to use it and then get it taken away it would be hear breaking, not to mention expensive. But hey its your money. Theyre also pretty heavy, so you can only really OC them or shoulder holster carry
if you really want a revolver there are better options, thats like carrying and IDPA competition gun

Love my sp101 and gp100 but the gp is yuge.

>>33915594
No one carrying an sp101 should be loading it with .38 special. There are better, smaller revolvers for that.

>>33914724
I carry a Smith 637 with .38+p. Works for me.

>>33915008
Unless you live around a bunch of blacks you're not likely to get attacked by more than one or two at a time. Blacks have a nasty habit of swarming people. That's the real reason people like huge mags on carry guns and the real reason ledtists crack down on mag capacity.

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i used to carry a 442, but i find i shoot my mp shield better.
still love my wheelguns, next on the list is a S&W 63

>>33915594
Carrying .38 Special in an SP101 is a waste. There are better revolvers if one is interested in .38 Special.

Can someone enlighten me on .38spl vs .357mag?

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I just want an 8 shot .22 break action revolver to use while girls are watching.

>>33916197
.357 mag is the same case diameter as .38sp, just longer. so you can throw both in a 357 wheelgun.

unsurprisingly, it kicks more, is louder and more powerful. snubnose revolvers are often light, causing significant felt recoil when you fire 357 magnum out of such a small weapon. some prefer to load them with 38 special (or 38sp+P) as a result

>>33916219
Me too bro, me too

>>33916197
.357 Magnum actually has stopping power.

But most people don't carry it because it's loud, and a bitch out of a snub.

>>33914724
I picked up one of those SP101's in the 4.2" for a new backpack gun for black bear country because fuck carrying a 3lb Super Black Hawk.

Thing shoots like a god damn dream with Hornady Leveroution, though I did swap out the grips for Hogue.

>>33915068
My LCR in 38 also is quite smooth rounded and lightweight. Easy to ccw. Relative to stoeger cougar and glock 19.

>>33916385
I feel like Hogue grips are mandatory on the SP. My bigass hands are too much for those tiny stock grips

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>>33916219
>break action revolver

>>33916361
>.357 out of a barrel < 4"

Why though?

>>33914724
>most gunfights are done in 2-3 shots, so these guys cc'ing a double stack wonder-9mm are going to end up with 20+ rounds sitting in evidence
>revolvers are more likely to come in spicy calibers that accept a secondary caliber (ex. 357/38sp, 454 casull/45lc, .410/45lc/45acp with moonclips, etc.)
>if you live in a cuck state with mag restrictions, revolvers are often times viable options
>won't drop evidence in the form of shell casings unless you have to reload
>probably won't jam after 2 shots
>you can force your foiled assailant to suck on the barrel in a more sexual manner before you enact stand your ground

>>33915008
>Your far more likely to need 15+ rounds
if you have the misfortune of living in a cuck state that limits mag capacity, 6 shots of overkill is preferable to 6 shots of good enough

>>33916545
>won't drop evidence in the form of shell casings unless you have to reload

Does this even matter, the gun is going into evidence anyway

>>33916361
>>33916253
anything on ballistics w/ figures? preferably with pretty pictures.

Also, I've got a s&w model 67 so .357mag is a no go. can you rec me good .38spl carry ammo?

Just carry whatever you can shoot the best at speed. Personally I'm way better at shooting my GP100 than any of my semi-autos.

Simply having a gun of any type is 95% of the battle. If you're confident with it and carry it every day, it doesn't really matter what it is.

>>33915170
Jerry uses moonclips, which would require using a revolver chambered in a pistol cartridge (thus negating the primary advantage of a revolver) and the reloads in this video are much slower than a comparable semi auto reload.

>>33915259
Don't buy into the memes anon, revolvers are great backup guns but they offer absolutely no advantage over semi autos as a primary carry piece.

>>33916630
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/38special.html

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/357mag.html

>>33916843
Not true. There can be advantages in carrying a revolver.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rPTk8raXdo&feature=youtu.be&t=17m1s

>>33916630
https://youtu.be/9xkQ5UOj7wg

>>33916844
gracias

>>33916854
>what is 10mm?

>>33916843
Depends on what you plan on carrying. If you plan on going with a duty-sized gun of some kind, an automatic is definitely better. But if you have a choice between something like a J-frame or a single stack 9mm? The revolver actually has a lot of attractive qualities in that kind of matchup.

>>33916866
>what is 10mm?

An expensive autoloading .357 Magnum that requires you to handload your own ammunition or buy expensive factory ammo like Underwood that can't be found locally if you want to be firing full power loads.

Additionally, it pales completely in comparison to any of the other ubiquitous magnum cartridges like .44 or .454 in power.

>>33916514
A CUTE! Seriously, it's adorable.

But 4,5, and 6 inch-ers are just classics.

>>33914724
Fuck your dated revolver, get a tokarev. Half the price, surplus ammo that goes 1600fps and punches through IIIA body armor. Leave your meme 357 at home

>>33914724
Here's how you figure out which one is right for you.

repeat this for both guns.

Set up two silhouette targets, three feet apart and 7 feet away.

put your pistol wherever you'll be carrying it on your person as if it was just another day.

stand at the seven feet from the targets.

Light a brick of black cats and drop them on your feet.

At the first explosion put two rounds into both silhouettes as fast as you absolutely can with a friend timing it from explosion until fourth shot.


Which ever gun you can do that drill fastest with is most likely to protect your life should you need it.


Hell, if you practice this drill enough a highpoint will be enough gun for you.

>>33916977
As a tokerev fan, I have a few qualms with you.

First off, "dated"?
Dude, Tokerevs are old as fuck compared to what these guys are recommending.

And second, 1600 fps?
What's the barrel length? I totally believe it from a PPSh or comparable length SMG, but I seem to recall that being very...optimistic, for a pistol barrel at least.
>>33914724
I actually used to as well, and I bought a Webley.
Now I find myself in need of a .357 carry gun, having found out that I actually shoot slightly better with wheelguns.

>>33915562
even a 4 inch?

>>33916854
I stopped watching after his first two reasons why a semi is less reliable is due to forgetting to chamber a round and forgetting you have a safety. Ignorance of a tool and how to use it is the operators problem, not the tool.

For what it's worth I love my SP101 and you will not regret getting it, but I'm a leaf so I'm not allowed to carry it.

If you're going to carry it I'd recommend switching out the front sight, it tends to get caught on things.

A spring kit will help the trigger pull and if you want to get autistic, polishing up the trigger return spring hole will go a long way.

>>33916624
this is beneficial for a " you don't plan on having your gun go into evidence, and if it did end up in evidence things wouldn't be looking very good." kind of situation. also the situations where you don't want anyone to know where you shot from.

>>33917094
As far as age, revolver tech is FAR older than the Tok. And I may have looked at the wrong fps, oops

>>33917140

As a tool maker (In this case, software) I disagree entirely. If the user is using my tool wrong, I designed it wrong.

>>33914724
google how many shots people fire in self defence situations, and then look at what ends up happening to the people who fire 15 rounds. (they go to jail)
>>33915067

>>33917492
faggot

>>33915362
>are you big enough to CC a gun that size
Skellington manlet reporting in, I CC a Windicator 4" all day erry day. The Windicator is unusually heavy and bulky for its class.

You can CC anything if you believe.

>>33915531
Just carry a shitload of speedloaders on you. That's what I do.

And this fag >>33915408 had one good point: Do not buy a .357 with a 2" barrel. You're wasting your money and getting an expensive, painful .38. Go 4" or better.

>>33917492
You're going to be a very depressed programmer

>>33915049
>Mak
>not a good carry gun
Literally what

>>33916385
I'm currently debating between the sp101 and gp100, the SP feels better in the hand because the GP is fuckhuge. Is the extra round worth it?

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Well I love Ruger so I'm not gonna try to talk you out of it, but if you're the type to just chase raw numbers then feel free to throw money at a G32

>>33916433
Heh. My manlet hands love the SP's. Wish ruger woukd comeout with a larger frame with a smaller grip

>>33917940
It's up to you, really. It's only one round either way

>>33918318
Does the SP have more "kick" since it's not as much of a tank?

>>33915093
The FBI has been telling us for years that the median average distance of a defensive handgun use is 7 yards.

t. Paul Harrel

>>33915408
>-357 turns into 38 at snub nose lengths
So what does .38 turn into at snub lengths?
If you use a 158 gr projectile it's going to be much more assertive than a 110 gr 9mm.

>>33918541
It stays .38, with no appreciable power loss.

You see, .357 relies on a slower burning powder (typically) and requires more barrel length to achieve maximum velocity.

Of course, if you find special ammo or reload yourself you can use faster powder which will give you some velocity increase. But you might as well just carry a 4" barrel to begin with, if you're gonna bother with lol magnum.

>>33918451
This is great until your target is at 25 yards.

>>33918413
I don't have a GP, but the .357 recoil on the SP101 easily manageable. It's not much more inconvenient than hot 9mm out of a polymer semi-auto, in my opinion.

>>33914955
well i mean, .38 is basically a 9 so
>>33915068
this if you want to carry a revolver you just want guaranteed reliability,
whilst feeling ok about having (possibly) fewer shots and more weight, which is fine.
if you're fine with using .22 magnum for self defense there's the NAA Sidewinder, which is well made and super light

>>33918681
>.38 is basically a 9
Not true at all, even .38+P is weaker than 9mm

>>33918655
Sweet thanks for the heads up man. Do you use moonclips for yours? Are Rugers good?

>>33917867
9x18 isn't a great caliber for hollow points.

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What does /k/ think of the 327 for EDC? Also, are chest holsters a meme?

>>33914724
>You can't use a semi auto pistol grip on a pistol that isn't a semi auto

Wow it's literally nothing kill yourself moron

>>33919272
>chest holsters a meme?
no, its pretty useful for government work because you hands can be free and if your attacked you hands will naturally go to your chest where you hands will be. Just to elaborate, you hands go to your chest automatically for most things. Having your hands at your sides isnt natural unless your actively walking....and you can comfortably sit down.

Also good for hiking for the same reasons.

>>33917140
He did NOT say that.
He said many people are incompetent with semi autos and as such, for them a revolver might be a better option.

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How come no one told me the SP101 came with a 4"bbl before now? EXPLAIN YOURSELF /K/!

I was gonna get a GP100 next month, but it's for reals gonna be an SP101 in 4" now. GP100 is fuck huge. I don't even care about that 6th round to have a more trim package but in 4".

>>33915015
>hard to find
Underwood will accept your order 24/7.
You know, on this new thing called the interwebs. You're actually using it now.

>>33919580
Get the 4.2" SP-101 in .327 Fed Mag.

>>33920504
Nope, 4.2" in .357. I'm already set up for .38/.357 reloading.

LCR, LCRx

Problem solved

>>33914724
>I'm starting to think about ditching my wizbang9000 for one thanks to the .357's performance out of a short(ish) barrel
>t's makes 9mm look like a fuckin BB gun.

Meme. Hard to argue with empirical evidence; 9mm has killed a lot of bad guys around the world and will continue to do so.

Seriously, carry whatever you want to carry; truth is terminal ballistics should be the least of your concerns as any of the common modern defensive calibers are adequate.

>>33920612
>truth is terminal ballistics should be the least of your concerns as any of the common modern defensive calibers are adequate
aye, truth

>>33920522
Hornady .327 dies are pretty inexpensive and if you're Maeposting you should already be a fan of .312 bullet diameters.

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>>33921195
Meme rounds are cancer. Your suggestion is bad and you should feel bad. I'll stick with an awesome performing mainstream caliber tyvm.

>>33921287
>calls things meme rounds

Opinion discarded.

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>>33921195

Owner of .327 trying to get it to go mainstream to reach economies of scale cheapness or designer of the cartridge shilling?

Why anyone would recommend some wildcat round over one of the most proven performing cartridges ever invented boggles my mind.

>>33921455
.327 $32.99/50
.357 $30.99/50
.327 1500 fps
speedy little fuckers

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>>33914724
I can carry this guy SOB, and in a shoulder holster in winter, and I'm sure the 29 would do even better to conceal, but in the end if your stuck on a revolver they do have their merits, grips alone for the comfort when shooting vs carrying the magazine in your hand could be a strong enough pro for some people.

>>33917476

>recommending people carry a tokarev
>shit safety (if there is a safety)
>shit caliber for self defense
>shit ergonomics
>shit sights
>spotty reliability
>snappy recoil

vs. revolver

>double action, drop safe
>proven and capable with a massive variety of loads in .38sp to .357mag
>replaceable grips
>modern, replaceable sights
>eliminates ammunition-based failures
>recoil can be mitigated by using as light or heavy loads as you are comfortable with

Don't get me wrong, I love the Tok, but the only advantage of a TT-33 over any other gun is that it's thin as fuck and doesn't have a long or thick grip- for a full size handgun you could conceal it easily. Generally the biggest problem is that while you can conceal it easily, it's not really safe to carry beyond condition 2 without a drop safety and questionable mechanical safety- an original, as-designed TT-33 can only be carried safely at half cock.

Obviously it has very little aftermarket support to mitigate things like ergonomics or terminal ballistics- you can buy wrap around grips, and hollowpoints probably exist somewhere, but these are very boutique offerings and something like replacing the sights would require professional gunsmithing. Obviously these problems don't exist for a revolver as they have widespread industry support.

If you're recommending a TT-33, my guess is that you've either never shot one, or it's your only gun.

>>33921511
>gunbot.com
>search .357 " Showing 1-100 of thousands for 357 magnum ammo
Range: $0.238 - $0.359"
>search .327 " Showing 1-100 of 190 for 327 federal magnum ammo
Range: $0.415 - $0.871"

That doesn't even take into account the VAST amount of choice in reloading options for .38/.357 versus .327 mag.

Fail cartridge is fail next to the icon that is the .357 magnum.

>>33921622
My bad that was ammoseek not gunbot but results are similar in revealing the snowflake failboat that is the .327 magnum.

>>33921455
>.327 Fed. mag
>wildcat

That word doesn't mean what you think it does.

>it's a "/k/ angrily shitposts about not understanding economies of scale" episode
I will happily pay an extra few cents a round for a sixth round in my carrygat.

>>33921841

I'm not buying a SP101 for CCW because revolvers are fail for CCW compared to auto options in any category. I'm buying one for keks. Might take it hiking OWB with #9 shot for snakes and such...still carrying the glock as well though because I heard jamal has been seen in the woods one time so muh capacity!

>>33916875

This this this. Mega this. Though for home defense an 8 shot .357 mag with a 5 inch barrel does seem pretty nice too

If you're going to get something just to shoot .38 special just get 9mm

>>33916890
Do you plink and practice exclusively with full power magnum loads? Neither do I. On average it's about the price if .45auto

And 180@1200 is a full power load, 180@1000 is completely adequate for self defence, everything hotter than that is just pushing numbers for the fuck of it

>>33915008
>Your far more likely to need 15+ rounds of "good enough" rather than 6 rounds of overkill.
I can understand wanting more than 5 or 6 or 7, but what do you (as you put it) *need* 15 rounds for?

>>33921591
>If you're recommending a TT-33, my guess is that you've either never shot one, or it's your only gun.
>you've either never shot one,

It's this ^. I think I've maybe seen one in my entire life at indoor pistol ranges and I go a fair bit.

>>33916253
>38sp+P
and what is that?

>>33921622
It's been out for nearly a decade and NEW guns are still coming out for it as well as solid defensive loads.

If someone is reloading it they don't need a vast array of reloading components because they can use the very good projectiles available or cast their own.

Not to mention the .32H&R and .32S&W which is around 32cpr

>>33923405
>180@1000 is just expensive .40 S&W
ftfy

>>33914724
Im unironicly getting a 4" .44 mag for cc. Fight me.

>>33921622
Was literally holstering a GP100 while standing in the ammo aisle at BassPro and gave you the sticker price. Don't give a fuck for your comparison shopping or your reloading meme.

>>33924226
S&W 69?
From what I've read, you woldn't really lose that much velocity going down to the 2.75" one.

>>33924438
629. Im getting it for $450 so I'm not gonna complain about the extra inch.

>>33924480
Nice. What ammo are you planning on carrying? Is this for people, or critters?

>>33924226
You're a big guy.

>>33914724
>not carrying 125 gr underwoods that get ~1600 fps out of a 4" barrel

>laughingasians.jpg

>>33915008
TBQH i used to be a hicapfag myself, but after years of reading anecdotal reports and examining multitudes of ballistic tests i've changed my opinion on the subject slightly.

The vast majority of DGUs don't call for a high capacity handgun. Cover is a precious and fairly uncommon commodity in the kinds of transitional and public spaces where DGUs tend to occur. Without body armor and without cover you are frankly rather unlikely to be able to run through 10+ rounds of JHPs without dropping your opponent or getting shot multiple times yourself. You really shouldn't be expecting to get off 5-6 shots in a DGU without your opponent getting off several shots on you too. This is a worst case situation whether or not you incapacitate your attacker at the end of it as your own mortality is fairly likely without extreme luck or ineptitude on the part of your opponent.

Fortunately the majority of SD shootings are won by the person who gets accurate shots on target first, which tends to be the one with the best training and preparedness.

While it's certainly true that not running out of ammo is priceless in a gun fight, I'd argue that you're best off with whatever handgun you can put 2-3 effective(emphasis here) rounds on target with the quickest.

Furthermore, there is a fairly great body of anecdotal evidence, both expert and amateur, that seems to indicate that all rounds aren't created equal.

Some examples of this would be the forum convo posted by an ME in the mid 00's(deadmeat, i have a link somewhere if you're interested) who performed numerous autopsies involving firearms over his career and the multitude of available laymans tests involving various handgun rounds and cuts of meat(can almost here you cringing through the screen) or BG and most importantly actual bones(specifically fresh ones). cont l8r

>>33919232
Use ball then.

>>33924656
examining a multitude of these sources seems to indicate that while 9mm is certainly adequate in most situations(straight on hit through ribs/sternum) it does indeed seem to evidence a greater frequency of irregular trajectories and in particular deflection off of bones than .40, .45, and .357.

All three of these rounds tend to almost always crack bones they even glance up against(with JHPs) and keep on trucking in a straight line whereas 9mm(even JHPs) will with some frequency deflect off of them assuming a new trajectory while only slightly gouging the bone in question.

What i find most worrisome about this is the relative lack of study regarding it. many industry professionals seem to take gel testing as gospel(fackler, GKR, etc) and claim that the medium gives a fair representation of actual terminal ballistic performance. When questioned about this there response has historically been to refer to a single study(wolberg gel relevance testing) which examined autopsies but specifically excluded any cases where bones were struck. Frankly i just feel like this is another part of the ballistic discussion where people are presenting partial understandings of complicated subjects as a end-all-be-all truth.

>>33924742
>using ball

>>33924751
In closing, training trumps everything.

Putting 2-3 rounds in an opponents thoracic triangle will almost certainly do the trick with any combat caliber round. Doing so in a timely fashion is the way to win any gun fight that doesnt devolve into hollywood esq shit show territory.

IMHO, an opponent going down ASAP is just as priceless as not running out of ammo. But the former is a factor in every DGU that involves shooting whereas the latter is only a concern in a very, very small subset.

Because of this i think carrying the most potent round you can effectively utilize is slightly to moderately more important than increasing capacity, in particular, as capacity increases you start to hit the land of diminishing returns more quickly than one does with increased per round potency.

>>33922938
>9mm in a revolver
Enjoy your finicky moon clips.

>>33923688
Google is your friend, no guns.

>>33914724
>there are no 10mm pistols for concealed carry I'm really interested in.
The Glock 29. G2G.

>>33923405
Yes.

>>33925179
A bigger concern with 9mm in a revolver is bullets jumping the crimp.

>>33925179
Moon clips for rimless cartridges are actually really nice.
Because the extractor groove is CIP-defined, it gives clip manufacturers something consistent for them to spec their product off of, resulting in clips that are thicker and sturdier than typical for rimmed cartridges and don't require any worry about what clips work best with what brass.

>>33926270
What ammo is that?

>>33921903

>in any category

Please tell us how an unreliable small cheaply made pocket semi auto in 380acp is better than a small revolver in .38+P?

>>33918866

Yes but you're also forgetting that .38+p can come in weight of 180 or even up to 200 grain.

And one of the most underrated factors in perfomance is sectional density, of which the 9mm doesn't have.

But yes technically the 9mm has more speed.

>>33924751
>What i find most worrisome about this is the relative lack of study regarding it.
That's because there are too many uncontrollable factors to consider. Good science is reproducible; fackler et al use ballistic gel because no two bullets of the same caliber will ever do the same thing when shot into a slab of meat. That's where the performance minimums come from: the 12" of penetration is meant to account for the 'unaccountables' like tissue and bone density, etc.

>>33924823
>carrying the most potent round you can effectively utilize
Truth. Funny how this old saying keeps coming back (heard it from an old fudd when I was just a kid!).

>as capacity increases you start to hit the land of diminishing returns
The capacity argument makes the most sense when discussing frame size; specifically in the subcompact category where a pocket 9mm (m&p shield, xds, lc9, etc) can give you a respectable 7/8 +1 while still retaining adequate terminal ballistic performance.

>In closing, training trumps everything.
which, IMO, is why 9mm is the superior choice for the AVERAGE shooter (ie someone who carries for SD but doesn't have a lot of time/money to put into training) because for any given budget of time/money you get more training benefit from 9mm than any other modern defensive caliber because of ammo cost and ease of use. Shooting enthusiasts need not apply, as the advantages of 9mm hit diminishing returns the more willing and able you are to spend time and money on training.

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>>33923405
Sig 10mm ammo is quite warm @624ft/lbs and $27/50 where I live. Also fuck moose...

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>>33926956
see
>>33922938

>>33923693
IDGAF .357 has so much more to offer than .327. Like most new calibers they are a solution looking for a problem. They are something to market and move units in a heavily saturated market filled with durable goods.

>>33924373
>Had his gun unholstered in public
>Didn't just shoot someone
>Buys ammo at Basspro.
>Thinks reloading is a meme
Your opinions are worthless.

>>33924572
People.

>>33924591
4u

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>>33927987
Purchased.

>>33914724
Sp101 in 327 fed mag. 6 shots, same performance as 357, less recoil. Only downside is difficulty in finding ammo

They are fine for CC. I cc a 3.5 in 460 XVR loaded with buffalo bore 460 mag

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>>33928290
Noice no hillary hole.

>>33914724
>low capacity
not an issue if you're not retarded
>long reload
not an issue if you're not retarded
>more muzzle flash
not an issue if you're not retarded
on and on and fucking on

home defense pack whatever the fuck you want, you're not carrying it around. CC, pack whatever you're most comfortable with. if you factor in capacity and reload you're fucking stupid. you shouldn't need some 30 round glock unless you're trying to play hero, which isnt what concealed carry is for

if you want to be a cop, then be a fucking cop. concealed carry is self defense and getting you and your loved ones to safety, not rushing into danger so you can play hero, CCW doesnt mean you're a fucking plainclothes cop

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I've been thinking about getting pic related for concealed carry. Looks small, compact, and comfortable. Plus, having a low bore sounds nice.

>>33928951
I've heard the Rhino is actually pretty good for a .357 snub.

>>33928951
It's a 6 shot .357 so it's not small. Google around and look at the insides of that gun. It's a clockwork nightmare. I also saw pics of one blown up. Since the bore is on the bottom it blew up right into the dude's hand. A kaboom in a normal revolver usually just blows the top strap and that half of the cylinder off. Also, as has been stated, .357 out of a 2in bbl is a fucking waste. For the size and weight you should get a small 9mm imo.

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>>33928951
>small, compact
not really

>>33928803
I refuse to buy cucked revolvers.

>>33929025
>I also saw pics of one blown up.
Because of a squib.

>>33929114
How's that not small?

>>33917492
As a IT admin i can tell you by that metric there has never been a properly designed program ever.

>>33929114
>not really
>smaller than the Glock

Looks compact to me. Cylinder design gives it a slightly flatter profile too.

>>33917492
No, it's your fault for not taking into account different user cases

Good design should be natural and intuitive for the majority of users with minimal instructions

>>33927972
Stupid, illiterate fagtard...

Holstered is not unholstered

Giving you today's price isn't buying a damned thing

You, as a humanoid, are worthless

>>33915620

You get the gun back after the investigation is complete, you know.

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>>33930168
>gets butthurt because my comparison is more thorough than his comparison
>calls me illiterate
>doesn't know what a present participle is

"holstering" To put (a gun, for example) in a holster.

I think you need to lie down anon. Trying to think is obviously straining for you.

"holstering" the act of placing a gun inside a holster.

>>33930360
>>Had his gun unholstered in public

Learn to read

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>>33930182
>You get the gun back
should somebody tell him?

>>33930400
>used the word holstering
>holstering means "to place in a holster"
>doesn't understand that something has to be
>out of a holster to then go into one
>being out of a holster is "unholstered"
>words have meanings
>anon is a moron

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Best carry gun. Prove me wrong.

>>33924373
>Was literally holstering a GP100
>holstering

>>33916843
No mechanical failures are a pretty significant advantage.

>>33930457
>made in Miami
>best anything

>>33930469
Engrish professor & liberal arts faggot, how should it be worded to not offend the empty safe space between your ears?

>>33930451
Wait until this cuck learns sentences can end in a preposition.

>>33930518
Okay jamal who didn't finish middle school i will translate your babble into words that convey what I assume you meant with your babble.

>>33924373

I was carrying a holstered GP100 in an Uncle Mike's nylon holster while standing in the overpriced ammo isle at Basspro and gave you the two sticker prices I saw that reinforced the point I wanted to make.

I don't give a fuck that your comparison encompasses a wider range of data points than my comparison, thereby completely destroying the basis for my argument, or that I don't know enough about reloading to coherently disagree with your point on that topic either.

>>33930571
Who is this super sleuth that knows my name, age, grade level, and accessories?
Amazing!

>>33930469
Reads like an already holstered gun, not a gun in perpetual motion, always holstering.
Trying to say the same sentence your way makes less sense, colloquially.
Damn grammar bot, get a life.

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I want this in RL, I'm a fag when it comes to wheel gats so I don't know shit, where do I start? What brand and model gets me closest to Kellog's fofo?

>>33930360
>>doesn't know what a present participle is
Fun fact, there are no Bass Pro Shops on any Ivy League campuses, you grammar snob.

>>33930715

It's a Model 29 with aftermarket parts. Also your tastes are shit.

>>33930816
Well if everyone had the same tastes you wouldn't know what taste is. You should thank me for having a "shitty" taste, this way I can validate your "superior" taste. Thanks for the info though kid.

>>33914724
just carry famas

>>33914724
As someone who has carried exactly three different firearms in his lifetime (Colt Official Police (.41LC), Beretta 92 model of some sort (It was a department gun, 9x19), and now that I am retired a LCR (.357)) I would say to get the wheelgun and see if you like it, but keep the glawk in case you don't. Train on the revolver and carry both of them on alternating days.

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I Liike revolvers because I feel safer with them. Glocks give me a tinge of nervousness about shooting my dick off so if i were to carry one I would be thinking about it all day and never truly comfortable.

How bad ass would a modern Le Mat style revolver be? 7 rounds of 357 and 1 of 460 sw.

>>33930972

That would be fun as a hunting gun but I'm not sure how you would accomplish it from a mechanical standpoint.

>>33931185
1) Who discloses a potentially patentable idea on 4chan?

2) If it does work, complexity leads people to assume there are more failure modes.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it

>>33927071
>reproducibility...

While entirely true that shots into meat will have serious reproducibility issues I dont think that gel tests with embedded bone(preferably a simulant) cylinders or plates would suffer enough from this issue as to out weigh the potential information that could be gained.

What id like to see is an expansion of ballistic testing protocols(at least experimentally) to include some straight on and some angled shots against a gel block with an embedded bone plate(depth/thickness of average male), series of bone cylinders(rib depth/thickness), and larger bone cylinders(femur depth/thickness).

Of course the problems that come to mind with this would be if a simulant of sufficient quality and similarity to bone exists and sufficiently controlling pre-bone impact angle/path to obtain somewhat reproducible or at least valid results.

Even if the problem of a proper simulant is solved it would be likely to require a bit of trial, error, and perhaps even luck to get good hits. Then you'd have to do it all over again with a different round. while they may never be exactly identical i think you may very well be able to draw some broad conclusions, which to me seems better than ignoring post bone performance entirely.


Oh, and I do in fact shoot/carry 9mm these days. IMO the fact that I can practice ~50% more per dollar with it and almost brainlessly stack 2-3 rounds right on top of each other at social distances makes it a better choice(personally) than .40, .45, or .357.

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>>33931214
Yeah I know I shouldnt disclose it.. it's just too juicy and my friends IRL arent super gun dorks. I'll be so fucking pissed off if someone beats me to it and especially if they do it based on something i posted here but I know the chances are unlikely.

I know that it may be impractical for self defense because it introduces more parts but I know it would be a cool range toy at the very least and I think that if the engineering was well thought out and if enough time went by for people to trust it, then it could also be used to add an extra round for defensive guns.

Shoot one without ear protection and tell me you want to carry that shit and risk shooting indoors or in a car. It hurts, a lot.

>>33931936
>not getting .380 revolver

>>33931391
You might do better and get the capacity you are looking for by having stacked bullets in an extra long cylinder, fired electronically, just like the metal storm. Hell an 8 round 357 with just a little longer cylinder could hold a total of (24) 38 short wildcats. I'm saying wildcat because I don't know if such a round exists.

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>>33914724
I carried a 3" SP101 in the winter when I lived in Minnesota. When people are wearing enough heavy clothing to keep warm in -20 degrees, penetration needs to be a major consideration. Haha. Also, no worries about conceal-ability because I was wearing all the clothes I owned. As long as you aren't a beta-male in skinny jeans you shouldn't have any trouble. Only problem I had was finding a good IWB holster. Eventually ordered one from Ruger made by Bianci.

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>>33930715
Get a .44 Dan Wesson revolver and get an aftermarket barrel/shroud from EWK arms.

http://www.ewkarms.com/zen8/

Then have a machinist or gunsmith drill some holes in the shroud.

Some dude on the Dan Wesson forums already did it.

>>33930182
if and only if you live in a gun friendly state and even then its no guarantee. A trial, especially one involving a murder charge could take years before it over and the cops most likley wont take care of you gun. I know, ive seen it first hand
it why I use a vanilla glock 19, If I loose it I genuinely dont care

>>33924048
And having a bullet that performs well at that velocity in an easy to shoot package is bad why?

>>33925197
So show us the boxs and the gun

>>33927972
>357 has so much more to offer than .327.
It has a lot of the same shit with marginal differences. I love variety, but for most if us that only goes so far as finding what we like and sticking to that.

But hey, its OK I understand you hate new things

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I need a holster for this bad boy. what kind of holsters does /k/ use for their revolvers?

>>33933504
>marginal differences

Like mass availability of a large variety of loaded ammuniton and reloading components at lower prices than your snowflake caliber along with a far greater number of new and used firearms chambered for it.

I understand you autistic hipsters hate things that are popular and successful but, like it or not, there is a reason 90% of the brass on the ground at the pistol range is 9mm and finding a .357sig brass is like spotting a unicorn.

.357 is a classic while .327 is a marketing gimmick. Deal with it or get into .45GAP I hear that's gonna be the next big thing.

>>33930972
>Glocks give me a tinge of nervousness about shooting my dick off
Why? Glocks have three distinct safety mechanisms to prevent unintended discharges.
If you want to be extra safe, you can install a different trigger spring to increase the pull weight to 8 or 12 lbs, and there's an aftermarket slide plate now that allows you to physically obstruct the striker's movement just like you would on a gun with a hammer.
https://taudevgroup.myshopify.com/products/striker-control-device
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgzRXi_0Guw

>>33933694
or you could just buy a pistol that won't give you glock leg or glock cock in the first place.

>>33933535
Basic bitch range holster? I like this one from triple K because it can do crossdraw as well as strong side. Driving OC with crossdraw is comfy as fuck.

https://www.triplek.com/product/440-lightning-strong-sidecrossdraw-for-revolvers/

>>33933672
6 rounds instead of 5, there you go, that's the reason to have a .327 revolver.

Not a good choice for a regular range gun, but neither is .357 unless you reload.

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>>33933712
Please elaborate on your reasoning for putting revolvers, which may or may not have any passive safety mechanisms at all, in that category.

>>33933672
Oh I'm autistic AND a hipster for liking something even though it's isn't as mainstream as possible? You are aware that a person can like both super common guns/ammo AND interesting ones right? What I don't understand if your need to draw some line in the sand like you have literal stock your favorites.

>>33933712
Funny how it's called glock leg, yet the 10 functionally similar pistols that came afterwards don't have that issue, so long as we ignore all the NDs that came long before glock was ever even an idea. Many of them in the eras of DA/SA autos, DA revolvers and SAO everything

It's almost like it's a meme

>>33933730
>unless you reload.

Which I do.

I love my revolvers but I CCW a G19. Whether it's 5 rounds or 6 a wheelgat is outclassed as a CCW these days unless you're Yankee Marshal and are convinced that hard barrier penetration will be the only way you will ever survive a gunfight as a civilian.

MFW glacko will never release a variant with an actual manual safety

>>33933786
>hard barrier penetration will be the only way you will ever survive a gunfight as a civilian
Even then, .40 S&W and .45 ACP both do just fine against hard intermediate barriers like auto glass and bones while still royally outclassing similarly-sized wheelguns in weight, capacity, and ease of reloading.

>>33933812
ehrmagherd yankeemarshall is gonna die if you don't worship .357 wheelguns as the ulitmate CCW guys!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57CvQ9ubjfA

YM is one of those guys who can't admit that he CCWs a revolver because he just REALLY likes them. He has to spend a shit ton of mental cycles justifying it with convoluted logic and extremely unlikely scenarios.

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>>33926270
Nice wheelgat friendo

>>33933865
Sounds like me whenever i get a new carry piece and start shitting up caliber war threads about how it's clearly the best.

Disgusting.

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>2017
>carrying revolvers

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>>33933865
>ehrmagherd yankeemarshall is gonna die if you don't worship .357 wheelguns as the ulitmate CCW guys!

Does he say "caliber cucks" in this one, too?

>>33934010
A real man is honest. Insecure fags need excuses.

Real man: "I CCW a Walther PPK because it makes me feel like James Bond." Anons then shit on him for being a cringey autistic fuck with no real concept of the inadequacy of his chosen CCW. Real man has no fucks to give and goes out for martinis.

Insecure fag: "I CCW a .327mag SP101 because I get one more round in the same size package as the 5-shot .357 with comparable ballistic performance". Anons explain how fail 6 rounds is even if they are nuclear tipped projectiles. Insecure fag argues until thread hits post limit because MUH NUMBERS GUYS.

>>33934010
>shitting up caliber war threads
pissinginanoceanofpiss.gif

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>>33934014
>2017, not carrying a revolver

>>33933786
I've had enough malfunctions with semi-autos to prefer the reliability of a revolver.

>>33933812
>.45 outclassing anything

Top kek mate, .45 is for range fun and the year 1944.

>>33934151
>i've had enough malfunctions...

genuinely curious, i average maybe 1 malfunction every thousand rounds or so. maybe 700-800. and that's over multiple modern handgun platforms.

>>33934219
Yeah i wanna hear this too as my rate is way lower than yours but my training ammo is all reloads so no random factory ammo fails. One example: my current CCW gen4 G19 has a round count of 4265....ZERO malfs. Had some malfs early on with my LCP but those went away after some shooting.

>>33934219
1 malfunction every thousand rounds is the problem

The biggest issues I've had is stove piping and failure to deliver a round into battery. Typically, it's related to the gun being dirty.

My revolver, on the other hand, has never malfunctioned mechanically.

The guns I've had issues with are a Sig P320, a walther ppq, and a Berretta M9. I've never had the issue with a glock, but I don't own one myself to test its long term reliability.

>>33934535
>Typically, it's related to the gun being dirty.
I.e., you prefer revolvers because you're a lazy ass who can't be bothered to keep his guns lubricated and, optionally, cleaned, and revolvers are more tolerant of neglect than autos are.

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>>33934130
>those borders
What are you doing, love?

>>33914724
>low capacity

Most gun related incidents are resolved in under 2 shots. People who think they need 17 rounds and carry 3-5 extra mags are just morons. Not sure what kind of shit they think they are going to run into. Revolvers are perfectly fine carry options.

What about a ten shot 22 revolver for self defense?

>>33937945
Beats a sharp stick

>>33937694
Old thinking is old. Doesn't much searching to find plenty of instances of multiple attacker incidents where 5 or 6 rounds would be woefully inadequate. Whether it be home invasion, flash mob style attacks, groups playing the e"knockout game" etc etc the list goes on and on. Feral youths run in packs.

>>33938429
How many pokes with a sharp stick do you get before you have to reload?

Jus sayin bro

>>33938440
And if you git one proper, the rest run, same as its ever been...

>>33938489
Why miss your chance at a bag limit due to limited capacity?

Ok I have a 4inch secuirty six and I'm thinking for home defense and cc.

I read that .357 has been watered down on amo compared to ammo in the past.

I read underwood .357 is closet load to orginal .357 load.

Going 1500 fps put of 3in barrel so 4in probably 1600fps

Question is which is better

The gold dot bonded underwood or xtp underwood. I don't like that supposably there both bonded which means will give penetration which could bad enough since it's 1500 fps already

>>33939908
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/#357mag

>>33914724
Carry what you're most comfortable with.

Statistically speaking, everything you said is par for the course, with the addition that *you will* need to carry a backup gun for your revolver in the untimely event that your revolver will have a stupid malfunction (cylinder won't turn, hammer locked in place, trigger stuck, ect.) Other than that, if you don't like to carry semi-autos for whatever reason, you're not going to carry one, and that shouldn't limit you to carrying nothing.

I personally carried a Colt Trooper 4" .357 for a little while. Didn't like the weight so I swapped it out. T'was a lot of fun to shoot, though.

Is there any modern equivilant to a Iver Jonhson .32? I like how nimble they are but finding one in a reasonable state is hard.

>>33916890
>le 10mm is expensive meme
It's just as expensive as 357 magnum you cock gobbler. touch a fucking computer before posting about shit you have no idea about

>>33939908
Nothing on underwood that's why I asked .

Btw .125 gr I'm going to be using.

>>33941397
You're getting too caught up in raw numbers anon. There is no magic bullet. Damn near any of the loads linked in the following post will kill the shit out of anything.

>>33940313

That basic bitch Remington 158gr SJHP load will get the job done like a mofo and it's like $35 for 50 rounds.

>>33939908
.357 is already a hot, high recoil round

Don't load anything you can't shoot comfortably.

>>33938481
who the fuck gets 10 holes poked in them from a 22 and keeps fighting? who? just saying, jackass

>>33939908
I'd go with the gold dot. Probably get better expansion and penetration isnt likely to be an issue considering. can't seem to find any tests on the 125 GD at those kinds of velocity though

>>33942378
The accomplice of the guy you just dumped your entire cylinder into.

Is a snub like a S&W 642 good for carry?

I've heard snubs are unpleasant to shoot, especially if you're using +P ammo.

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>>33914724
>not carrying a full sized .455 Webley with cast lead Mk. III manstopper boolets

It's like you don't want to drop meth-head redguards in one shot.

>>33943971
It's good for carry, but bad for shooting.
Expect to do most of your practice with standard pressure ammo and only load up a few dozen rounds of +P per range trip for recoil control practice.

>>33914724
>>33915562
I'm planning to buy a 3" SP101 in the next week or so.

The 3" barrel seems like the best compromise between concealment and 357 performance to me.

>>33944143
Figures. I like revolvers, but perhaps I should just get a semi-auto for carrying.

>>33944369
I love revolvers, too, but yes, automatics are better for carry in nearly every way that matters.

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reminder to never, ever use Hoopes #9 or other ammoniated solvents on new-production """blued""" S&W guns

>>33943476
Nope. Still got 15 rds left

>>33943971
It's not that snubs are unpleasant to shoot so much as that a lot of people are thrown off by how you have to hold them differently than your typical automatic.

They have a very different recoil impulse due to no reciprocating slide (it's kind of like a shove into your palm rather than over the web of your hand). Because of this, gripping the gun as high up as possible like on an automatic is actually counterproductive on a lightweight snub, because it sends the gun right into the web of your hand.

This, combined with the fact that they are the class of handguns that are most sensitive to bad habits and improper pistol technique when it comes to accuracy loss, is why they have the reputation that they do. The flipside of this, of course, is that someone who is able to shoot a snubnose revolver proficiently is likely someone who has extremely good pistol technique in general.

>>33945832
Is that one yours? If it is, I'm sure you know that the manual tells you not to do that. While it is stupid that the new bluing is weaker, Hoppe's has always been a "use sparingly and according to instructions" sort of thing. I wish I could have shown you how many nickeled guns I've seen ruined thanks to their idiotic owners disregarding the warnings to not use Hoppe's or any other solvent containing ammonia on them.

>>33945832
Luckily, I use Ballistol for everything

.357 is a great round, but the drawbacks outweigh the advantages. Try a Glock 10mm if you want power. But in most situations a 9mm will work just fine, especially with the wide variety of loads out there.

>>33945832
>buying S&W in 2017
You only have yourself to blame.

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>>33916219

Why not...NINE?

>>33918637
>self defense at 25 yards
Have fun going to jail for shooting people in the back as they flee. I bet you'll make an excellent cock pocket for the aryan brotherhood.

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>>33934074
Hi Archer.

Jokes aside, this post gets it. The real important scale for firearms, regardless of role, should be this.

Do I like it?
Will it function?
Have I practiced with it?

Then way down on the list is silly shit like most of the posts in this thread.

>>33921511
Perfecta .357 FMJ is about $16/50rounds at my local walmart, and its good ammo. Idk why people think its so expensive

>>33947593
I have one of those! It's so much fun.

>>33915008
15+ rounds? What the fuck do you think the average firearm incident looks like?

>>33915049
A Makarov not good for carry? What the fuck? Skinny jeans and fitted T's are your life or something?

>>33917492
As an author I agree with you. It is not the burden of the creator not the audience to get information across

>>33914724
I carry a Smith and Wesson 686, with .357 mag. 7 rounds, plus 2 speed loader full. It's easy to use, reliable, easy to load. It's a great revolver. 38 Special for just putting rounds through it, 357 Mag for carry and serious self defense practice (and god forbid, use). I'm in the dictatorship of Mass, a 10 round magazine state, so frankly, I think this is a pretty fine choice.

>>33933694
Ehh well it's just a personal preference thing. There is something tactile and extremely obvious about revolvers that my brain recognizes while with striker fired pistols I always feel like I have to be conscious of the gun. Im generally an over cautious person though and ive avoided dangers from being paranoid once or twice so my protective instincts are reinforced. I know that it is in my head and glocks are safe as long as you dont pull the trigger, but I can't help preferring to carry revolvers every day. If i was getting in shootouts all the time I would be more motivated to carry something more effective but less comfortable.. its always a balance but the 327 has 8 shots so it's not at much of a disadvantage and most people carry mouse guns anyway.

>>33932449
I like where your head is at but i think there is a market for a lemat style gun based off the popularity of the judge. There is also a level of confidence people dont yet have with electronic "primers," and I already stated my cautious nature. I dont think I would carry something like a modern lemat right away. But who knows maybe electronically fired guns will seem safer in the future.

>>33948662
I should also say I'm 6'7" and 270lbs. It might be a bit big as a concealed carry if you're not a beanstalk Irish Viking.

speer gold dot .357 mag

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>best edc

>>33950497
If you're going to carry a gun that big with .357mag ballistics you might as well go Tanfoglio Witness, double stack 10mm 1911, or G20/G40 and get way better capacity. Hell, even a Delta Elite or other single stack 10mm 1911 will give you the same capacity in a much slimmer gun.

>>33917855
This.

>>33948457
Would a Makarov be better for carry than a snub nose like the LCR?

>>33950938
.38spl+P is way better than 9x18.

>>33951070
Not out of a snub barrel.

>>33914724
Just get a Glock OP. They are fantastic at any job you could want them to do. Don't let the revolver shills force you to pick up an outdated weapon.

>>33951282
Glocks are as outdated as revolvers. They have had zero real advances or improvements since they were launched, which has resulted in a gun that is stuck using late 80s tech and responding to late 80s marketplace trends. The only reason they haven't completely crashed and burned yet is simply because of the nigh-religious faith that the LE community has in them. They will go away faster as fast as revolvers did if this is ever challenged, and the deserved victory of the P320 over the G17/19 may well be the beginning of that challenge.

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>>33951282

>>33951282
As a revolver shill, I support this sentiment.
A Glock 23 with a 25¢ trigger job and a NY1 trigger spring is basically a .357 revolver that weighs half as much and holds twice as much ammunition.

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>>33951413
>.40 equal to .357

>>33951450
>implying they're not
In fact, I'd go so far as to say that .40 S&W is better than .357 Mag, since all self-defense ammo is designed around the same FBI penetration standards, and .40 S&W will have 26% more permanent cavity volume than .357 Mag for any given penetration depth and expansion ratio, not to mention .40 S&W being a more popular law enforcement cartridge and thus getting first dibs on any new bullet technology that comes along.
I'll concede, though, that .357 Mag has more case capacity for Buffalo Bore hardcast bearfucker loads, if you want a gun that's good for two- and four-legged animals.

>>33952280
All of those points apply equally well to 10x25 and a G29, which actually does have .357mag ballistics.

>>33951282
May as well just get a hi point or some smaller 9mm m1911 then

>>33951356
FUCKING FINGER RIDGES YOU MORON

>>33951070
Is it?

>>33954746
Not that anon, but: yes. 9mm is a joke. Using a Ruski 9mm = might as well carry .380

>>33937694
Skewed by the number of instances where no shots are fired and the would-be assailant fucks off at the sight of a gun.

>>33954746
Depends on the barrel length of each gun, and the ammunition used.

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/38special.html

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/9makarov.html

tfw considering sp101 special snowflake edition for a blackup piece

>>33955819
if it's for backup you really ought to go with an airweight J-frame
the SP101 weighs as much as a Glock 19

>>33914724
I've been thinking of getting a revolver to get into appendix carry.

>>33957381
Maybe. But weight never scared me any and the recoil reduction should help with double taps

>>33919320
Also much more difficult for someone to try to nick your gun.

>>33958655
You can't pocket or leg carry it, get an LCR for that. But it's great in a holster.

>>33950614
A fullsize semi auto will likely print more than an 8 shot revolver due the grip size differences.

>>33952280
Then you'd be wrong. Where do you even get that 26% number from?

>>33961801
1.255 is the ratio of the area of a .4" wide circle to a .357" wide circle, based on the assumption of a right cylindrical wound channel.

>>33961866
Oh i see, you constructed an intentionally narrow argument with essentially no real world merit to support your ideas. yea if a .40 caliber bullet expands at the same ratio and penetrates to the same depth it will have a greater wound volume. This isn't really a thing in the real world though.

.357s greater energy allows for bullet designs with greater expansion ratios to penetrate deeper than less energetic rounds with the same expansion ratios.

That is to say, one can reasonably expect a .357 mag projectile that expanded to .70"(2x ratio) to penetrated further than a .40 S&W round that expands to .80". Similarly, if both rounds expanded to .7" you would expect the .357 mag round to still out penetrate the .40 due to it's greater available energy.

Because of this in the real world the .357 will typically be capable of producing more voluminous wounds.

>>33962021
Some guys shot some goats and .357 kills goats faster than .40

Fuck goats.

>>33962021
Given the same expansion ratio, .357 would have to penetrate 26% deeper than .40 in order to have the same permanent cavity volume, and 1) most don't, and 2) even if they did, it would only matter in comparison to .40 loads that penetrated 14.34" or less, since at that point the equivalent .357 load would be exceeding the 18" upper threshold of desirable penetration.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/#357mag
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/#40SW

>>33961638
How would it be appendix or crossdraw?

>>33963777
I don't carry appendix so I'm not sure if the 4" barrel version will work with that. I wouldn't get anything less than the 3" barrel model, and even that is a compromise shooting .357

Crossdraw is fine. The small handle and thin frame are the main appeal, comfort wise.

>>33964288
I'll probably get a crossdraw rig for it then

>>33964613
or you could carry strongside like a normal person

>>33964635
Already have a primary handgun for strongside/ shoulder carry

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>>33964635
mfw

>>33964642
>not carrying your gun and backup gun OWB and IWB, respectively, at the same spot on your belt so you only have to practice one drawstroke

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>>33964744
>not distributing your gunwwight so you end up walking like a cripple or overstressing your belt

>>33964788
Nobody'll ever suspect that the "cripple" is actually carrying several guns; not only is it gray man, it'll make urban youths think you're easy meat, not knowing it's the last mistake they'll ever make.

>>33964843
Fair, but im not willing to sacrifice my mobility

>>33964909
Just carry the same weight in guns on your weak side (ideally duplicates of your strongside rig) and affect a limp.

>>33964744
Are you suggesting we lay out our weapons on our belt like a samurai?

>>33965062
The Glock 19 and J-frame are basically the katana and wakizashi of the modern street samurai

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>>33965101
Carry all 4

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My edc. Smith 360j