Who would buy .40 S&W over 9mm?

>>33906856
The black man

>>33906870
The sad man

>>33906921
Behind brown eyes

An Operator.

It's for when you fell for the 9mm is for wimps meme but aren't enough of a man to carry .45

It's for when you fell for the 9mm is for wimps meme but aren't enough of a man to carry 10mm

It's for when you fell for the 9mm is for wimps meme but aren't enough of a man to not carry

>>33906856
But thats not what my grandpu used against nips.

>>33906933
but .40s&w is more powerful than .45

It's ideally suited for subcompact hand guns and that is all. The slightly greater mass helps make up for the loss of muzzle velocity when fired from a sub 3.5 inch barrel.

>>33906927
No one knows what it's like

>>33906964

>dont let your memes be dreams

>>33906971
.40 s&w has got greater muzzle energy than .45 acp which means it's more powerful. Whether or not it's a better round due to this fact is up for debate.

>>33906968
If I swallow anything evil

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>>33906997
>>33906964
>>33906856

>>33907012
sounds like .40 is super effective. It not only stopped the robber but also paid for itself on the first use

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.40 is only better than 9mm if
>you have to use FMJ only
>10mm isn't available/allowed

And even then, that really only makes a difference if you're using strictly full-size pistols with close to or as much capacity as a 9mm full-size, so extensions are necessary. Then and only then would .40 be more useful than 9mm.

Otherwise:
>9mm is fine
>.357 SIG for more punch than 9x19
>.45 for extra punch at close range
>10mm for full power

Always remember when it comes to calibers:
>shot placement is king
>capacity = more potential shots = more chances of vital shots
>a vital shot with a .22 will kill you faster than a non-vital shot with a .44

>>33907008
Put your finger down my throat

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>>33906856
My first gun was a .40 because I honestly didn't know what the difference was. This was about 6 years ago at what seemed to be the height of .40 hate. I honestly felt like I dun goof'd having not paid more attention to the caliber wars and was convinced that all the memes were true. Eventually I started doing my own fact-based research and found that the .40 wasn't as bad as memes would have one believe. Comparing typical FMJ loads, you're getting near the power of .45 ACP, but more round capacity and velocity. Compared to 9mm, you're getting roughly 25-30% more power. JHP rounds in .40 also expand more reliably than 9mm. I got around to shooting 9mm and .45 guns and found that the "snappy" recoil is blown way out of proportion with felt recoil being similar to .45. 9mm was definitely softer, but there's no reason to believe that somebody can't train themselves to overcome such a small hurdle. And all the legends about .40 blowing up guns is comes from handloaders shooting over pressure rounds with early Glocks.

When you start looking at the facts instead of parroting memes, it's pretty clear to understand why the .40 became so popular and earned its place as one of the top 3 pistol cartridges.

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>>33907012
>diffuses hostile situation
>brings joy to every one in the vicinity
>pays for itself
...All this without a single shot fired.

Guess I'm a .40 guy now.

i would like someone with autism to document whether 9 or 40 is m ore prevalent in rap lyrics.

>>33906856
Not even the fbi apparently, and they made it and pushed for its adoption the entire life of the cartridge only to announce they are dropping it for 9mm.

>>33907089
This guy gets it.
>.40 stronk

I did

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>>33906856
pew pew pew

>>33907836
.357 SIG is best autoloader cartridge.

>>33907089
Earned its place because the FBI adopted it, and police departments wanted to be like the FBI. Then civilians wanted the same caliber the cops were using. So really, it is as popular as it is because you are all clueless sheep. Kys

>>33907884
?

No.

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40 is a great round, the internet is just a vapid shithole that requires pointless debates

>>33906856
The only reasons the FBI and many police departments are switching back to 9mm are to save money and increase female qualification scores.

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>>33906856
Why would anyone post this thread 10 times a day, 7 days a week?

>>33907884

>40 is popular because of the sheep following the fbi
>9mm is best because fbi says so

kys

>>33908086
>all the recoil of a .45 will the stopping power of a 9mm
>great round

>>33907884
The fbi adopted because it was good.
I'm sorry, but I'm not your lighthouse guiding you through the sea of memes.

>>33907059
>.357 SIG for more punch than 9x19
The increase is negligible. If you insist, use 9x23mm Winchester.

>>33908364
>The fbi adopted because it was a compromise over 10mm
fixed

>>33908364
The FBI adopted it because they felt that they had to do something after the Miami shootout, but the process neutered the 10mm to become negligibly better than the 9mm that they started with.

>>33908411
>+200fps
>negligible

>>33908446
According to pretty much every test and statistic, 9mm, .40 S&W, .45 ACP, and .357 SIG incapacitate with the same efficacy. You need to get to at least hot 10mm or hot .375 Magnum to produce appreciably better results.

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So they can shitpost relentlessly on /k/

>>33908471
>.375 Magnum
You conceal carryin' bolt guns, anon?

>>33906933
Snappier round than .45.

I've got 9mm, .380, .40, .357 Sig, .45 ACP.

And I used to own a .357 Mag. But I sold my fudd gun.

>>33908489
You mean that you don't?

>>33908489
>not packing a double-barrel Obrez
gonna get killed innastreets

>>33908195
You must have some real bitch wrists if you believe it to have the recoil of a .45 AARP

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>stopping power

.40 is better than 9mm at hard barrier penetration, including windshields and bones.

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>>33906856
Who would buy anything over God's own .45 ACP?

>>33908658
Do you want to poke holes in the threat or do you want to disintegrate it?

>>33906856
I if were not legally allowed to buy 9mm Luger or 9mm IMI.

>>33907059
>a vital shot with a .22 will kill you faster than a non-vital shot with a .44

Best post on /k/ in months.
Soooooo many "gun people" have no idea what this means, and never will.

>>33909260
>RULE #1.
>Shot placement is king.
>RULE #2.
>Caliber is queen.
>RULE #3.
Capacity is last.

>>33907836
>>33907854

.357 SIG is badass but it's too expensive for me to shoot

>>33910898
roll your own FMJ practice ammo
people bitch about how hard it is to reload but it's really no different than a bottlenecked rifle cartridge

>>33909260
>>33907059
The problem is that .22lr will not actually punch into vital areas, niggers. Energy is a thing. Penetration through bone is a thing. Rounds tumbling, yawing, expanding, and fragmenting are all also things. Here's the quick rundown, in order from best to worst:
9x25 Dillon >/= 7.5 FK BRNO
10mm
.357 Sig
9mm
.45
.40
.380
.32
.25(not legal to carry in Texas)
.22(not legal to carry in Texas)

>>33910947
>he thinks 9mm penetrates further than .40 or .45
>he thinks .45 penetrates further than .40
leave, /noguns/

Many of you are missing a big point here.

Wear on your guns. Studies have been done showing the .40 guns wear out sooner than 9mm because of the loads and size of the gun. I honestly would rather have a longer lasting gun with more ammo per mag.

>>33911335
This

More bullet instead of bigger bullet

>>33906856
A smart man who plans on converting it to .357SIG

>>33911335
If you're shooting enough to wear out your gun, regardless of what caliber it's in, you can afford to perform the requisite preventive maintenance and/or just buy a new gun.

>>33912048
Proper care is easy. Spare parts become a problem over time. There is many other situations where a longer lasting firearm is more useful. Like SHTF, break down in trade, discontinued series or even you are on the run.

Buying a new gun isnt always the best choice. There are lemons out there. I like my older guns. They can be trusted not to explode, FTE to FTF. Why risk my life on a new gun? Not saying your option isnt bad, just pointing out it could have a bad end.

It's fun to have different calibers?

>>33906964
>>33906997
.40 only has more energy than .45 if you literally dont know what +p is.

.40 cannot even into it. .45 +p has more energy

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>>33907884

>>33911324
This guy

>>33912299
You sound like a noguns.

Even with +p .45 wouldn't have more penetration then .40 it'll give .45 way more awesome expansion but it'll lack even more penetration then regular .45


Jesus Christ a lot of fucking no,guns talking shit they have no idea bout.

.40 cal is better especially in jhp
Since it'll give deep penetration while still expanding.

>>33908477

>BHAAANNEEEBLADE

Also, that is a damn nearly perfectly camouflaged Leman Russ on the rug.

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>>33906856
>Who would buy .40 S&W over 9mm?

A .40 is ideal if you want:
1) Steel
2) Compact and slim frame
3) Best JHP performance

A compact full-steel handgun with a smaller frame than a .45 with a higher capacity than a .45 and better combined expansion/penetration than a 9mm for the same frame.

A full-frame handgun can get better performance with 45 +p load while having more manageable recoil

A 9-mm is a better option for polymer frame or a subcompact for the lighter recoil at slightly reduced expansion/penetration even with +P loads.

TL;DR
Conditional CCW ideal

>>33906937
>10mm

10mm was a mistake
It should have been a necked cartridge for better managed recoil
40 SW was a mistake
It should have been a necked cartridge... AKA it should have been 357 SIG

Why did 357 have to be such a market failure
It does everything 40 SW tried to do but better

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>>33907854
Bruh

>>33913647
Thats not a 9x25 dillon

>>33913535
>Why did 357 have to be such a market failure

Mostly because it was expensive mainly. And even gun nuts would rather not have to reload necked cartridges. The full-power stuff that makes it worth it is even more expensive. Also the fact that it's a novelty cartridge means that there is little variety in choice of gun to shoot it with and of that set of choices, if you don't want a Glock, you have to be prepared to drop some serious dosh for a good gun that isn't going to quickly develop cracks on the slide.

Realistically, you're better off just buying a decent gun that shoots one of the top 3 and spending the rest on ammo.

>>33913676
Was thinking about getting the 9x25 barrel cause why not

>>33913647
>no TD
t. typical glawk baby.

>>33913744
Was 45 GAP expensive when introduced? I'm surprised it failed when it had fucking Glock backing it.

>>33906856
There's nothing wrong with .40. The amount of hysteria surrounding it and people selling off all their .40s out of shame was fuckin insane i couldn't believe what a bunch sheep the gun community was full of.

>>33914400
>people selling off all their .40s

This means buying a 40 right now is a really good idea.

Trump + LEO surplus dump. Never going to be cheaper. Ever.

>>33914328
That's the thing: Only Glock seriously backed it. Plus very few organizations adopted it and of those some moved on to something more common.

>>33907089
Yeah I was pretty much in the same boat when I bought my first .40 gun. It was the only gun I could buy that I could find ammo more.

>>33914328
>Was 45 GAP expensive when introduced?
Compared to 9mm and .40 at the time, it was. It was also more expensive than the .45 ACP, but only slightly. Still holds true to this day.

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>>33906856
>I live in a mag restricted state
>I can always find ammo
>I get great deals on .40 trade ins, partculalrly LEO trade ins
>I un-ironically enjoy the snap of shooting a .40, its manageable but it feels more powerful

I still usually use a 9mm though, but I have more .40s and .45s

>>33914739
Cheap LEO trade-in guns are honestly the best reason to buy .40

No reason to buy new when you can get a perfectly functional police trade-in Glock for ~$350.

>>33912619
We're talking about power here no guns. Not penetration or expansion. .45 +p Has more energy than top of the line .40 loadings by a notable margin.

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>>33906856
Can someone explain to me how 40 S&W is simultaneously underpowered yet hot?
It's an oxymoron.

>>33914866
People just bitch that it's not a 10mm.

And the right gun can make a .40 feel like a nine with the proper recoil spring and other designs.
A .40 is pushing a heavier bullet at roughly the same speed as a 9mm. Seems pretty good to me, and you only lose 1 or 2 rounds in a mag.
People act like the capacity is cut in half or some shit.

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>>33914866
It's a shortened version of 10mm Auto, hence the pejorative ".40 Short & Weak", but it still clocks in at around 180 power factor even with mild factory loads (for comparison, 9mm is typically loaded to 135-150, while .357 Magnum is more like 185 for duty loads)

>>33914952
>power factor
...english?

>>33915004
It's a competition thing: bullet weight * muzzle velcity / 1000
It measures bullet momentum, and therefore, indirectly, recoil, ability to knock steel plates/bowling pins over, and how "hot" a round is.

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>>33906856
me. i did it twice in fact.

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I have problems that need solving

>>33914810
>power
You have no idea why you are fucking talking about outside of a brief glance at Wikipedia.

>>33906933
>aren't enough of a man to carry .45
You mean 10mm.

>>33915118
Yes i actually do famalam. In common parlance power refers to the energy of a round. Not only is this common knowledge but it was specified as being the topic of discussion earlier. .40 does not have more energy than +p .45

If you cant understand that then im not sure what to say.

>>33915176
Joules imparted are only part of the equation in terms of efficacy in wounding, the .40 is faster and bringing up buffalo bore meme rounds you may as well throw the whole damn thing out and settle with 10mm for the amount of recoil/ expansion because you can get that moving a hell of a lot faster with heavier bullets or simply down load it and wind up with similar .40 ballistics.

>>33910947
>.25(not legal to carry in Texas)
>.22(not legal to carry in Texas)
These are illegal to carry in Texas because they are too powerful and blow people in half

>>33913744
>for a good gun that isn't going to quickly develop cracks on the slide

Why don't people who want power in a handgun just get a revolver? It sounds like people are pushing automatics to fire cartridges they're not really built for.

>>33908411
I was going for more common, modern defensive handgun cartridge. If anything, I would have said .38 Super if not .357 SIG.

It's sad that .40 was supposed to be all "no compromise" but in reality it's lame and only useful for .357 SIG due to the Sig's diet .357 Mag ballistics in an automatic. I can justify using .357 SIG, but .40 is just as dumb as .380 and .22 short.

>>33915302
We aren't talking about wounding, tard. we're talking about power. You're literally butting into an argument about one subject and trying to make it into an argument about something else. If i meant to say that .45 creates larger wound volumes per round than .40 then i would have said that.

Oh and pro tip it still does.

10mm I can understand, but this is just a more expensive 9mm

>>33914929
>the right gun can make a .40 feel like a nine with the proper recoil spring and other designs.

... what guns were actually designed for 40 then? It seems like everything was a retrofitted 9mm, which then of course suffered early reliability issues and recoil problems.

>>33915406
USPs for one. the USP9 actually has part of the slide cut away for lightening

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>>33915406
Uh, that stopped being a thing in the 90s dude.

HK USP, M&Ps etc etc and hell I have a Ruger SR40c that is as soft shooting as a nine, and I'm not the only one to say that.

>>33915370
'Power' is useless for anything but competition, .40 has better penetration and in easily obtainable loadings better expansion than .45. If the only thing you cared about was wound channels from ball ammo you may as well carry down loaded .50 AE

>>33907836
.45 not in the line up...HERESY!!!

>>33915440
>M&P
Ass, worse than Glock in terms of needing a heap of aftermarket parts
>HK
I've only seen bigger POORFAGTEARS markups at an art gallery, and that was literally shit smeared on a canvas
>Ruger
... actually doesn't look terrible, if a little ugly.

>>33915370

Listen here faggot no guns I'm the original guy you replied too.

.45 doesn't have more,power it has momentom since it's a bigger round. Power doesn't mean shit if it can barely penetrates the targets heart or major organs.

44. Magnum has more fucking power then .45 auto not just cause of power but because it can give deep,penetration.

I sold my glock 30s and bought a glock 19 not beauce recoil but becuase .45 doesn't have the penetration I'm looking for. It's outdated as shit.


For dat reason im going to carry a glock 22

.40 cal stopping power WITH penetration .45 can't give with 15+1 rounds on tap.


Once again .40 cal is the best shitty round of the 3 becuase it gives more penetration then 9mm while still giving more expansion. And way better then .45 cause it has more,penetration while,still giving more expansion.

And it has a higher cap then .45

12+1 15+1 is still high cap.

Recoil ain't shit if you shoot fullsize and lift wrights and don't dress like a tight clothes wearing faggot.

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>>33915360
>Why don't people who want power in a handgun just get a revolver?

That's what people willfully ignore to justify whatever meme round they want to keep on a pedestal. If power was really all that mattered, going with a revolver opens up a whole world of magnum rounds that totally eclipse automatic cartridges.

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>>33915538
I actually like the aesthetics of it, it's different than the rest of the generic polymer wonders on the market.

>>33915573
I have the full sized SR40. No gripes about it aside from the magazine disconnect.

>>33915546
>power
>>33915370
>power

LISTERN HERE FAGGORTS
POWER IS A MEASURE PER TIME UNIT
THEYRE NOT BATTERY POWERED

>>33915538
>>33915440
>>33915425

Any others?

99% of the market being slapshod 9mm conversions is pretty fucking shit.

>>33915609
>No gripes about it aside from the magazine disconnect.
Literally the easiest thing to remove. I did it the day I bought it.
It's just a half moon shape piece of metal that pops out of the slide.
I think it actually made the trigger better too.

>>33915622
Dude, those were just some ones off the top of my head.
Glocks aren't even like that anymore since 3rd gen on. Literally no modern .40 made in the last 15+ years are 9mm conversions anymore.

>>33915611
Fuck up and respond proper to what I said. Your mom loves the power I give her in my stroke game. She sed it's better then yours or your fathers.


Haaannnnnnnnn

>>33906856
Someone who wants to switch out the barrel to .357 SIG.

>>33915466
Power is useless for anything besides doing work which is what causes wounding in the first place. Without energy a bullet is nothing but a lump of ductile(typically) metal sitting stationary somewhere. you can try to argue semantics with me but even drunk and tired Im probably better at it.

Looks like I'm going to humor your whole "butt into an argument clearly talking about which loading has more energy than the other and try to turn it into an argument about penetration and expansion" ploy though. can't wait for the part where you start ignoring data and devolve into claiming you're still right.

Easily obtainable loadings(Ranger T and HST) offer more expansion than any .40 loadings meeting FBI minimal requirements. Lower expanding rounds such as hornady Critical Duty offer almost identical penetration and expansion as such brands in .40. Oh and i never said anything about ball ammo. perhaps that's just the direction you're going to try to hamhandedly steer this discussion towards next...

>>33915637
>Literally no modern .40 made in the last 15+ years are 9mm conversions anymore.

Then why the fuck does everything think that if they buy a 40 it will have worse recoil than both a 45 and a 9mm while cracking their frame and still doing fuckall penetration/expansion

Can't I just throw a better recoil spring on one of the 9mm converts?

>>33915671
>Then why the fuck does everything think that if they buy a 40 it will have worse recoil than both a 45 and a 9mm while cracking their frame and still doing fuckall penetration/expansion
Memes and poor designs on some previous guns with weaker springs.

And the problems with the conversions of yore were chamber support from poorly fitted chambers that caused cases to rupture and blow up the guns and crack the frames.
Not a problem anymore.

>>33915546
>.45 doesnt have more power....

Yes it does. i can provide links to commercially available .45 ACP +P loadings with ~600 ft-lbs of energy. .40 tops out around 530.

>Blah blah blah .45 bad .44 mag better

Literally not even anything to do with whether .40 or .45 has more energy. starting to think you're one of those types who just cant admit they're wrong and desperately tries to change subjects.

>blah blah blah bitching about what he carries and making claims about which combat caliber is best

KEK. still nothing i was talking about, jesus im starting to think you might actually be somewhere on the spectrum

>blah blah blah u r faggit

Wow, such argument, really amazed me with your logic and all. you should debate for a living.

>>33915705


Show me a .45 round with more power them .40 cal WHILE STILL giving the penetration that .40 cal and 9mm can give.

your forgetting that the power means shit,if it cant hit a major organ . It BARELY meets the FBI minimum in gel test. I shot a red brick twice with .45 fmj and it only scratched the surface not even a dent.

I'lll respond tommrow when I wake up.

>>33915759
In .230 gr btw not no faggot 185.

E

>>33915759
Yea, im not going to go ahead and start examining the FT-lbs of every .45 acp cartridge with gelatin testing available to prove something i wasnt even talking about in the first place.

Power means shit in general and i never said anything different.

Plenty of .45 loadings make 12+" of penetration. HST, Ranger T, Crittical duty, critical defense, gold dots, and several others do for example. some of these are even in the 14-16" goldilocks zone some people prefer.

You saying that .45 FMJ wont even dent a brick is both anecdotal and hilarious. also, in case you haven't noticed, people aren't made of those anyways.

You're just butt devastated that .45 offers loadings with more energy than any .40 loading. others with more expansion, and still others with comparable expansion and penetration. As soon as i prove any of these points you'll immediately transition to some more obscure and unrelated argument.

>>33915816
>even arbitrarily defining what weight the other anon should use

Just stop. Next you'll be saying anything with more energy than a same weight .40 round has to be excluded too.

>>33908477
>that Cobra HISS

nice

>>33910947
.25 and .22 are perfectly legal to carry in TX, there was a .32 minimum to qualify with, but I think that's been removed.

>>33915848

No it doesn't it barely passes, even worse gelatin still isn't compared to human flesh you would still have to subtract the inches when hitting human flesh compared to gel.

Look at lucky gunners gel test .45 barely passes compare to 9mm or .40 cal

I shot a brick twice with .45 at close range and didn't crack.

I shot another Brock twice with 9mm and behold it cracked in half. These were full brooks with no holes in the,

Face it .45 is outdated compare to 9mm and .40

It doesn't have any energy compare to.40

I'm glad I sold my glock 30s as much as I hate to say this I bought the .45 is bigger then .40 so it's better then the rest meme. Prove it like you sed you would.


>>33915890

Why use anything but what the original designer designed the caliber to be.

Just fucking stop your a no guns you have no idea how weight x velocity works.

Just stop already your only hurting yourself becuase you fell for the .45 like I once did.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTTDgZZZFa0

>>33916128
>40 disintegrates concrete
Holy shit

>>33915368
.38 Super is inferior to modern 9mm, though.

>>33912299
>>33914810
>>33915176
>>33915370
>>33915705
>>33915848
>muh wikipedia numbers

/noguns/ retard. If you're a /noguns/ lurker, never out yourself like this; get some serious range time before posting here.

>>33918121
Thank you anon , at least someone here owns guns.

>>33910947
>22lr doesn't punch into anything

You must not be aware of people killing giant hogs with 22lr SUBSONIC

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4J7kgpIaGeI

22lr will punch through things.

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>>33912299
I'm a Retard Shilling for a Cartridge I Don't Even Own: The Post

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...
10....
mm

>>33906856


.40 is good because there are tons of weapons out there chambered for it and the ammo is dirt cheap. And it's a good round for self defense. Would I prefer 10mm? Yeah, sure. But it's expensive to practice with.

>>33916128
I was surprised by this. Paul seems like the type that says capacity and recoil are all that matter but he seemed to prefer .40 in the end.

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>.40 Short and Weak is dying
>Literally shit tier sales in that caliber for a while
>No one wants one

LMFAO

>>33915538
Dude I got my USP40 for like 500. You have to be a SERIOUS poorfag to not be able to afford that.

>>33919282
T-time for a .355SIG renaissance, r-right?

>>33915547
Why don't they make a 6 round cylinder for those big revolvers? The sides are open. They could just make the cylinder a little fatter. 5 rounds don't make no sense.

>>33906856
The people that couldn't decide whether or not to get a .45 or .9mm so cucked operators buy them