HD Guns

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>>33781953
>can
>not sbr
Why is that? Also what hand guard are you using? I want something to cover at least the 3 lug mount and adapter.

>>33782502
Tbh that handguard needs like, 6-8 more inches for that gun to not look retarded

>>33782525
Ya I was using an osprey on it before the octane came back. DESU it looks a lot better direct threaded but I want to change it as you'll realize if you read the rest of the my post.

>>33782502
Don't want to sbr a lower that only takes Glock mags.

Rail is a MI SP series 9"

>>33782502
That is fucking ugly and I normally like sbrs.

>no buis on home defense gun

Lmao

OP, what state? WA?

>>33783082
Buis on anything is literally autistic.

>>33783103
>Buis on anything is literally autistic.

>Be reid Henrichs
>Enter building
>Optic dead
>Need to use BUIS to clear
>Have to read some larper armchair warrior call buis autistic

You're literally retarded if you don't have buis on a serious defensive gun.

>>33783082
Cleaning rod, extra magazines and pressurized clp. Are all vastly More likely to fix real scenarios than something breaking my optic and not my rifle while also maintaining zero with the back up sights. Like, is that within a single foot difference for a bomb going off? "In the chance I'm exactly 35.2 feet away from a 250 lb bomb and don't get hit by too much sharpnel I'll be glad I brought these buis?


Please keep them on your rifle so I can keep making fun of you.

>>33783114
If you're using your fucking iron sights within a building you're very poorly trained or retarded.

>>33783069
And....ordered. Thx

>>33783079
But the sight picture through the MRO is beautiful.

>>33783147
>Only physical force can cause my optic to go out

You are truly retarded.

>>33783157
Yes I'm sure actual soldiers are retarded and you are super cool spec ops operator.

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https://youtu.be/steNAvbGoT8

Learn something children.

>>33783103
>>33783157
hi noguns, this is not the nerf board

>>33783186
I'm a god damn vet, but that has nothing to fucking do with this. I'm pointing my fucking rifle and shooting any one < 50 feet without my optic anyway.

>>33783221
Okay you're shit and retarded that's fine.

Thank you for your cervix those trucks don't drive themselves

>>33783232
Infantry vet. Goddamn it's like you don't have an argument so you continuously look to undermine my superior argurment with my qualifications to stick with to your cognitive biases like a literal retarded child but because I'm an infantrymen with several deployments under my belt and you're basically a argument regurgitating retard with no understanding of your opinions. So you should fucking lurk moar and stfu or actually practice with your guns.

>>33783338
>Don't have an argument

There's already the Reid video and if you honestly don't think have a redundant sighting system that weighs like a fucking ounce on your AR is a good idea you're just an idiot to begin with.

People with aimpoints use BUIS in the service and you trust a Chinese vortex enough to think it's impossible to ever have anything go wrong?

>>33783398
Nah, I have an acog. Can you be wrong about everything? So far you are.

Also, I can't be bothered to watch a video right now so I'll stick to keeping you my punching bag until later. Maybe he'll have a profound argument I haven't considered?

>>33783475
>I have an acog

Plenty of people run buis with an acog. And the ops image is a vortex dumb fuck pay attention to the thread youre in.

>Can't be bothered to watch a 4 minute video

Just fuck off already you dumb grunt.

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Well this thread got out of hand quickly. Though it is interesting to see a "vet" and a NEET argue about back-up sights.

>>33783491
Difference is actual people who have combat experience have been posted like Reid who say BUIS is a good idea.

>>33783486
>Ugh you dumb qualified, manly, brute! How dare you use logic and have solid arguments! My gender studies professor told me if women were in charge of the world there wouldn't be any wars! She has a doctor's degree so I know she's right!

>>33783520
You can't even watch a 4 minute video and have yet to provide any reason at all as to why you shouldn't have Buis. No surprise this is what passes for logic in a dumb grunts head.

>>33783526
Again, using my infantryman title negatively on a weapons board is probably as close to retarded someone can be and still use he internet. Lol

Can't do the video right now, because where I am. Not because I'm not going to.

>>33783658
You can still provide an argument as to why buis are bad, you said you posted logic where is it?

>If you like weapons you have to like mil or be mil

Literally retarded.

>>33783709
They're certainly not bad. Just a waste of money, money better spent else where. Like a better main optic. I would say weight too, but it's so little I wouldn't really consider that to be a factor.

Also you cried that my opinion was unqualified, and now youre upset I referenced it? Cum on dude.

>>33783805
>Dude I'm totally infantry dude

Yeah I totally fucking believe you retard.

A set of buis is like 60 bucks. Less if you have a fixed front post. I got my MBUs rear for 35.

>>33783836
35 bucks you should have put towards a optic that won't fail, broke ass nigga.

Yup basic ass leg infantry.

>>33783866
All optics can fail you stupid fuck especially if they aren't etched glass reticles. it's about having redundancy.

>>33783879
>Muh murphies law! Muh redudent systems!

Don't buy cheap shit and it won't break.

>>33783999
>Muh expensive optics will never break it's impossible.

It's a fucking red dot filled with electronics running off a chink battery. It can break you retard. It's about redundancy and when you can have redundancy by adding a fucking ounce to your gun why wouldn't you?

You constantly talk about not buying cheap shit while you're complaining about adding a set of 60 dollar signs to a gun.

None of the reasons you provided are logical at all besides the money argument and even still it's fucking 60 dollar for a set or 40 dollars for a rear. Even that's a shit argument.

>>33784041
What's your main optic? That's why you're wrong.

>>33784041
This.

And the optic doesn't even have to break for you to be up shit creek. What if the lens suddenly gets splashed with oil, mud, or your buddy's blood. Sure, you could clean it but that takes time.

>>33784080
You can literally Google any optic and find anecdotes of failure if thats what passes as logic or proof for you.

I'm not playing games, you haven't provided any logical reasoning this entire time.

>>33784122
That's why I run optic with QD mount and BUIS. Perfect in my opinion.

>>33784124
Even buis? Or are those exempt from having back ups? What about your barrel? Lol how much of your "defense rifle" do you have back up of?

>>33784122
First good argument for them, however, I'll keep people's blood, mud, and oil out of my rifle. Dust is an solid argument against optics all together though.

>>33784219
Oh boy now you're strawmanning.

One provides no downsides and no detraction and is a back up to something that has many points of failure. You're being obtuse as fuck.

>>33784258
I want as little shit to get caught in brush on my rifle as possible. I want as few things that can go wrong on my rifle as possible. I want my rifle as light as possible. I want my rifle as cheap as possible. Finally, I want my rifle to be accurate and as easy to use as possible.

Where does having buis fit into that? I'd just run iron sights if I couldn't afford a durable main magnified optic.

>>33781953
Jelly but I can't say I like what options you chose on that SP01.
How's that shotgun?

>>33784329
Holy shit you still don't get it.

Even the most expensive fucking optic has many points of failure.

Flat folded buis are not going to snag on fucking anything

Magpul MBUs weigh fucking nothing.

Adding buis doesn't add more things to go wrong on your rifle.

And they have zero to do with being accurate.

Fuck me what a whole lot of nothing. If you want "as few things to go wrong as possible" just run irons by themselves then.

>>33783866
> 35$
> Out of 1200$
Fuck this is entertaining

>>33784402
My acog is as durable as your faggoty low profile irons that fold down. Which can also break and pop up and hinder the use of a better optic. Basically your still fucking stupid and I'm still laughing at you two hours later.

>>33784452
Are you so fucking stupid that you don't know what redundancy is?

Everyone in this thread is likely laughing at you right now. Even if what you said was true and the acog was more reliable than buis that isn't an argument against having buis or having redundancy.

>>33784329
Not having a BUIS is like not carrying a spare tire in your daily driver car. Even if you have high quality wheels/tires that are particularly resilient, the consequences of one of them getting fucked up validates carrying a spare.

You're all retarded.

>>33784219
>I'll keep people's blood, mud, and oil out of my rifle

The whole point is that you can't control those things. I am super careful with all my guns--I hate seeing any kind of scratches, dirt, etc. I am not a clumsy person--far from it. But the fact is that when you take your gun out hunting or if you are in a defense situation you can't always control your environment. Guns get dropped or fall over. Mud gets splashed on your optic while you're tracking game. Hell, once I was out hunting early one morning and a wet dew-soaked leaf happened to fall and stick to the objective on my scope. It confused the fuck out of me until I figured out what happened.

Good BUIS weigh next to nothing and don't present a snag hazard. (Believe me, snagging on shit is something I hate too).

>> I want my rifle as light as possible. I want my rifle as cheap as possible

This is already forcing you to compromise. If you really want a rifle that's as light as possible then you're talking about an SBR tax, expensive carbon-fiber wrapped barrel and forend, magnesium or polymer lower, etc. Those things are counter to your other stated goal of as cheap as possible.

Since you're already making compromises, why not add a miniscule amount of weight to your rifle for a very practical backup?

>>33784478
>Even if what you said was true and the acog was more reliable than buis that isn't an argument against having buis or having redundancy.

This.

And while I love the ACOG, the fact is that in a critical situation all it takes is a splash of something to render it useless until you clean it. My BUIS work just fine after being splashed in the mud.

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Bought this today it was made in 1989 and goes with my other Winchesters.

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>>33784557
>all it takes is a splash of something to render it useless until you clean it.

Even Trijicon acknowledges this

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>>33784587
My other Winchesters.

>>33784506
I feel like that's an bad example. How often do you have to replace your optic? If you've never replaced it how can you compare it to a car tire?

>>33784591
$60 dollars on their website. they would never do that for money would they? Plus if your model isn't one compatible with the irons you'll need a new one. Because you're a super special forces who knows that you HAVE GOT TO HAVE buis. otherwise you'll get pwn- i mean, shot on the battlefield.

>>33784548
Because it's not practical. I'd have to replace my mounting system, as well as relocate my optic to a less ergonomic location to fascilate a part that literally does nothing until something breaks and also doesn't break so badly that it shifts the zero on the back up sights and then it also would cost more than an entire range day?

>>33784591
Holy shit, I completely forgot about those...I guess I do have back up irons in my A.R


Hahaha

>>33784613
It may not be a matter of having to replace it outright, it could simply be that whatever threat you're facing cannot be addressed with the optic right that very second.

I can relate a hunting example. I was out with a buddy at his family's property hunting coyotes and feral hogs around dusk. I had my scope dialed up to 10x because the area where we were seeing coyote activity was a pretty good distance away. Suddenly I hear something, turn my head, and see a hog walk out not 20 feet from where I was hidden. It was much faster to tilt the rifle 45 degrees and nail him with the irons than it would have been to lower the mag on the scope--assuming I would even hit at that close of a distance due to parallax.

>>33784677
That's a good reason, for hunting for sure. However I practice a good bit of point shooting, I'm not using sight for humans with weapons that close.

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>>33784452
Durr looks like I can't use my sight now

>>33784730
Just because you're good with point shooting doesn't mean that should be your only option. A BUIS provides the option of an aimed shot, but doesn't limit or prevent you from point shooting. If going against humans w/ weapons at close range, you do yourself no favors by limiting your options.

>>33783082
This gun is designed to shoot people who are INSIDE my house.

I probably wouldn't even use sights at that range.

>>33784765
That's not that bad, but limits fov.

Unnecessary risk.

>>33784901
Limits fov if it magically happens to have the latch break which it likely won't.

Further more looking through it it hardly hinders vision at all. That's a 3x optic.

>>33784882
Exactly how small is your house?

>>33784882

You picked a rifle with a magnified optic for short-distance shots inside your home?

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>>33784765
>burris sight on a PSA gun
>acting superior

W E W
E
W

>>33784955
Unashamed poorfag. I'm not taking my gun into combat just proving a point.

Also nothing wrong with Burris optics.

>>33784955
>Psa and Burris

I'm not familiar with them so I can't bag on it.

>>33784917
>Latch magically breaks.
Whew lad we're arguing redundency here. Don't defeat your own argument.

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>>33781953
Glock 19 with Surefire XC1 and 34 rounds of Federal HST 124gr +P

>>33784993
My point was even if it did break it wouldn't matter

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I keep the AR loaded with Winchester PDX 1 defenders in a 30 round P mag (although only 20 rds of PDX 1 and 10 of XM193) in my closet and my Glock 19 loaded with Federal HST 124 gr JGP rigged in a holster under my bed. I need to get a light for it I know.

I'd love a 9mm AR pistol or SBR as it would literally be the perfect home defense gun if you ask me, but I just can't get over how fucking ugly they look.

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>>33785213
I'm home, thank you for the long conversation during a otherwise boring day. I'm going to watch that video now.

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>>33785213
Alright, the single point he makes in the video for iron sights is a back up to faulty electronics or poor PMCS both are negated within my acog. A pretty big point he doesn't understand is using iron sights in CQC is a bad idea. Even a red dot is kinda sketchy compared to the tried and true "point shooting" method.

>>33785541
If you ignore mud, fog, water, broken lenses etc yes they are.

I'll still take them because why the fuck not. I have a prism optic as well.

>Red dot is sketchy at cqc

I have never heard this and it seems to me that isn't true especially looking at 3 gun or the like.

>>33785586
anti fog lenses, if my lenses broke my zero would be lost on any flip up sights receiving the same force. The argument against them or for them come down to a lot of different factors. I feel like we've covered most in this thread at this point.

As far as <50 feet with full human silhouette I think it's reasonable to practice to a point of landing a hit from a simply held rifle about half a second. with irons my eyes simply go through too much different planes to do so. (hell, maybe I'm wrong because it's been different for me?)

>>33785700
There wasn't any good argument against buis ever presented.

I've never seen 3 Gunners, competition guys or to my knowledge military special forces practice point shooting at that distance but I don't know.

>>33785731
Every CQC range I've done I did point shooting...

here are my arguments against it.

1. money you should put towards a better main optic.

2 shit to get snagged on things.

3. weight.

4. quick detach optic required or reduced FOV

5. depending on the particular buis you run they could fully prevent using the main sight in the event of a BUIS failure.

6. Modern high end optics are incredibly reliable to the point most events that can cause damage to your optic will probably destroy the rifle or kill you too.


weight these and decide if having a back up sights is worth it with your system for your purpose.

>>33785820
1. It's 35 bucks
2. It's folded down
3. It weighs like an ounce
4. Folded down MBUs don't reduce fov
5. No they don't. Ever. Never seen that.
6. Not as reliable as irons and also redundancy

>>33785949
1. 35 bucks spent on a better main optic.
2. then it's another thing that than break.
3. weight is weight. put a few rocks in your pocket they're only a few ounces and you can use them to distract your enemies in your training scenario with 34 hostiles and... you get the point
4. folded down buis can if the latch breaks.
5. I've never seen many types of optics not break in 10 years of gun ownership and several years in infantry or multiple deployments.... according to you though that's no reason for me to trust them without BUIS
6. nearly as reliable as iron sights is enough for me to trust my life on it. Fuck redundancy.

>>33786402
Why? Why not just spend an extra 35? If you've already got an aimpoint micro what does it matter?
2. So? Even if they break (highly unlikely) your gun still functions that makes no sense.
3. We're talking about an ounce that could literally save your ass more than loads of other shit you carry.
4. No they can't not to mention acog mounts lots of time sit the scope over the rear buis. There is no blocking.
5. Good for you. Doesn't mean they don't. I don't see why you wouldn't own buis knowing it has happened to people and has lots of things that can break.
6. >Fuck redundancy

I get the feeling you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

>>33786538
35 bucks brings me closer to a thermal scope. Now that I would want some canted back up sights on, but that would come AFTER I can afford a 7000 thermal. As that would make me literally twice as lethal as any amount of redundancy.

you're right, I made my arguments against it. If you disagree it comes down to opinion. we're long past either of us arguing facts. there are pros and cons of buis, you find the pros to outway the cons, and I do not.

>>33781953
>dindu shot up a car on my street
It's time to move Anon.

>>33786803
The rent is cheap and I enjoy the entertainment.

>>33786775
Because there aren't any reasonable cons and I explained why. It's literally 35 dollars for my rear sight, if that's your only argument so be it.

>>33781953
what's the fun on top?

Alright I'm not even him but please explain why BUIS are a bad idea? And if you even try to say weight savings I'm just going to preemptively call you a noodly armed faggot because a set of magpul buis weighs nothing.

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>>33785820
>>33787796

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anyone here use a "pistol" on a sling as an HD weapon? I was thinking about getting a scorpion evo and adding a sling rather than SBRing it

>>33787838
...okay? Yes that's a shotgun. Anyone who's not 10 years old and retarded can generally handle a 12 gauge.

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>>33787874
there really ain't no pleasin' internet folks.

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>>33787924
Da fuck?

>>33787924
nice woman hands, barbara.

you still haven't answered my question.

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>>33788139
But I did....>>33785820 <-------------Right fucking here.

>>33787852
There's some braces out that are worthwhile and the ATF cleared shouldering them if it makes a difference to you. No stamp needed.

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>>33788178
1. money you should put towards a better main optic.

its literally 80$ at most for a set of Magpul gen 2s

2 shit to get snagged on things.

folded down? you're a special kind of fuckup if you're getting your folded down irons snagged on shit. where do you live, the fucking amazon rainforest?

3. weight.

see: noodle arms and bitch wrists

4. quick detach optic required or reduced FOV

I have neither of those issues

5. depending on the particular buis you run they could fully prevent using the main sight in the event of a BUIS failure.

I've never even heard of Magpuls failing.

6. Modern high end optics are incredibly reliable to the point most events that can cause damage to your optic will probably destroy the rifle or kill you too.

I want you to take the most expensive optic you have, then put it on a rifle of your choosing (if it fits). now hold it as high as you can over your head upside down. you following me so far? now drop it on the ground.

don't worry I'll wait.

>captcha wanted apartment buildings
>I gave it all the street signs instead.
>still worked

FUCK THE SYSTEM

>>33788221
I'll gladly drop my rifle from above my head once you post a time stamped video of you doing the same with just your BUIS on and posted.

>>33788219
I figure if I was going to buy a brace, I may as well just go the SBR route since it'd be nicer. I was hoping that a sling would be good enough

and the atf clarification was for braces """accidentally""" touching shoulders, not intentionally buying braces to circumvent sbr laws

>>33783658
I know a bunch of infantry men who are dumb as shit and know nothing about guns. You're just another one of those.

>>33783866
Thinks $35 is a lot.
Calls anon a broke ass nigga.
Yo I had $35 worth of tacos last night mr infantryman I should have put that towards a ... what was your setup in the sandbox?

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>>33782502
>>33783079
Try this one on for size

>>33781953
OP, what optic and mount on your AR9? I ordered a burris fastfire for mine but in order for it to be a cowitness height (ie useable), it is on a huge riser which looks really dumb. Tiny optic, huge riser, why not get a bigger optic.

Probably going to put the thing on my wasr.

>>33784765
You cant use your sight because its a fucking burris

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← when I need to sweep the street clean

>>33785334
What is that a fucking bushmaster carbon 15? Hahahahaha the infantrymans expertly chosen weapon with all his war and killing knowledge. Now the superlight and cheap part make sense kek.

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>>33788551
Same, but there's a lot more of your demographic that don't know shit about guns.

>>33788568
Watch the pennies and the dollars will save themselves.

>>33788579
Not a fan of pistol caliber rifles.

>>33788610
Something something twenty six inches hide yo kids hide yo wife hide yo doggo ATF sneaking in yo windows and they shooting every body.


goodnight /k/ can someone guess this bullet?

>>33788681
Revolver nugget bullet

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>>33788697
>Fucking two minutes

You're good. But then I guess if you know that one, you know that one.

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>>33788716
It's the only uncircumcised bullet I know of

>girl won't put out, guess I'm here for a few more minutes.

>>33788732
Just how quiet is that? I was thinking about my second can going being on a lever .22 with subies being a great alternative to a daisy.

>>33788635 O.R.C Good little rifle. I have no complaints shoots anything and I haven't had any failures from it at all
I've fired about a thousand rounds through it. I average about 3 moa, five round groups without fancy loads.

>>33788818
>girl won't put out, guess I'm here for a few more minutes.

do some of you faggots just come on here to act as cringy as possible for laughs or something? jesus christ

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>>33788818
Very quiet with subs. Ti-rant 45 so it's a fucking huge can. From shooter perspective I think it's louder than my 1911, but from my friends who have gone shooting with me, they say it is stupid quiet.

Either way, they're both quieter than a paintball gun. About the same sound. Bullet hitting the berm at 25 yards is as loud as the gunshot.

This thread has taught me to compromise. I removed my rear iron sight, but left the front one on. I'm going to sell it on ebay and put that $30 towards upgrading my optic to be $30 better than it currently is.

>>33788854
You're the one who can't into anonymous. You might as well put on a trip so you'll have a reason to maintain your identity. Whelp, I think my girlfriend's bull is nearly done with her so I can go back to bed.

>>33788869
Now that's pretty sexy. I was thinking about a solvent trap for my cheap car gun but I kinda want to stay on this side of that line. Are there limitations on what silencers are used for?

>>33783205
Yes it is faggot

>>33788916
I dont understand your question. Get a can, get a threaded barrel, shoot things.
Most states allow cans for hunting if you want one for that. I just enjoy shooting quietly.
I'm getting big into 9mm subguns so I'm probably going to get a dedicated can for them with a HK style 3 lug. Don't know what can yet though.

>>33788916
Solvent traps typically cost $50+. That's $50+ that could go towards upgrading your main optic.

>>33789009
I really do need a thermal scope...

Thank you based Anon for the sound advice.

>>33788964
I'm talking about carry conceal carry transport self defense. Also know absolutely nothing about hk or three lug

>>33789050
Thermals scopes cost nearly $7000. That's nearly $7000 that could be spent upgrading your main optic.

>>33789059
You legally own the can so obviously you can transport it.

Idk how in the world you would CC with a can.

Self defense is fine, though expect to lose your pricey NFA item for a while

>>33789076
But I don't... I manage a trust that owns the device.

>>33789071
But a thermal scope would be a main optic...

Anyway, is there anything in your life right now that's bothering you? I'll listen if you want. I kinda feel like you're reaching out for help, but don't quite know how.

>>33789097
>a thermal scope would be a main optic
If, and only if, I did not have a preexisting main optic. I already own a main optic therefore money should be going towards upgrading that main optic.

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>>33789086
Are you trolling or did god forget to hit you with the smart stick?

>the millions of people who submitted form 1 and 4s and had them approved cant take possession of their NFA item nor can they transport them.
k

>>33789125
I am not a man who assumes. The amount of illegal sbs I've seen has been reason enough to question laws even if everyone is doing it. Or pistols being posted on face book with vertical forends attached.

>>33781953
5.56 Ar barrel and handguard? Looks great.

>>33789223
How is that relevant, at all? You're talking about the legal ownership of a can and being retarded about it, so your point is that you've seen illegal NFA stuff. Idk what to tell you, you don't seem like you are mentally sufficient to possess an NFA item so I would just not.

>>33791635
You're just a pretentious cunt aren't you?

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>this thread

>arguing over having 2 ounces of backup sights that cost $60

>>33783202
reid got his good [point.
Just different school of though.
But why not have a iron sight? it's not that heavy

>>33783221
>>33784730
>>33784873
>>33785541
>>33785731
>>33785820
My though on point shooting.
1st.
As long as the space allows me to get into a firing position when sliding the pie, i will have my weapon at a ready to shoot stand, of course the muzzle will point down to a 15 to 30 degree angle so i have a better line of sight to search for target. And it takes half a second to lift the weapon up to the eye level and shoot.
(but sure it's tiring, and CQB is a meat grinder)
But those house clearing drill that requires a team to rush in there scaing all angle, it sure doesn't allows us to slide the pie slowly.

2nd.
point shooting can ensure you hit the vertical target no problem. But if you care about shot placement, you want to hit the balls to drop the enmy, or you want to hit the heart to have the enemy die in 5 to 10 seconds, or you want to hit the enemy in the spin or face T area to end the enemy right there?

I guess that's when the failure drill comes in, two shot in the chest (point shooting ?) to ensure enough pain and shock got applies to enemy target body, then a snapshot to the face to end the target.
So they don't have 10 second to fight back!

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>>33793281
10 degree lower?

>>33788579
This is a cheap shit amazon picatinny riser.

I was having the same problem as you so it is a temp solution.

Vortex just came out with an AR height direct mount for the viper/venom. They use Fast fire III mounting so that should work for you.

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>>33793281
and then ppl worry about not having the weapon in retention might allows enemy to take the weapon........ (that's a part of being a meat grinder situation ain;'t it?) so do the point shooting then?

>>33789246
lol it's a PSA 20inch and PSA 15inch rail

I bought it as a beater but I actually fucking love it

do a cqb alone for enough time, you will get shot.
Take a 50/50 chance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pefGPjfOnrs&feature=youtu.be&t=296

>>33787703
R700 VTR in .308

Actually just sold it and built a 6.5 Grendel upper

>>33784390

It works and it is light as fuck.

That's about all there is to say. It is a cz branded Turk shit