What sort of operating mechanism would a bolter use?

>>33656331
Faith in the Emporer

>>33656331
Gas operated

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>>33656430
>>33656331
Gas operated with a well lubed gas chamber.

Short stroke piston I'd say.

Given that the shells it fires are mostly rocket propelled with an initial booster charge, they could operate on recoil, blowback, gas operation, or some kind of very fast auto loader that uses no energy from the shells to operate, depending on how big that initial charge is and probably whoever is writing about it.

Whatever the gyrojet uses. It's a rocket not a bullet.

>>33656331
Kicker charge for the first stage of propellant probably cycles a boring old piston.

>>33656331
Short stroke gas operation on most patterns of Imperial bolter, the weird part is the charging rod just south of the muzzle, like a giant .75cal USFA Zip.

>>33656993
>boring old piston
You spelt reliable and proven wrong

>>33656346

As usual, the first post is best.

>>33656346
That only works if you're a librarian or a very, very confused Ork. Everybody else had better prove their faith with the holy oil and the anointed cleaning rod.

It probably operates on a interchangeable gas operation/recoil action as they are also designed to operate in hard void. Void combat would require a closing of the gas tube and a heavier base charge or "kicker" for reliable recoil bolt carrier cycling otherwise you may have to manually cycle the action. Bare in mind I'm not 100% on how effective a gas operation would be in hard vacuum to the greater pressure difference on gases escaping around the bolt shell at firing so I could be wrong in my assumptions.

>>33659617
Librarians don't use bolters though, the use force staves and brain lightning.

>>33660023
>14.5 PSI ambient making a difference on a system that operates with tens of thousands of PSI

Honestly the only thing that vacuum does to guns is make them cool down more slowly.

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>>33660041
As I said, I'm not 100% on it. The base charge probably only applies as much pressure as a 3" 12 Guage so any loss of pressure may make for unreliable cycling but it may not, I'm just guessing.

Cooling would indeed be a major issue so they may use bolts similar to the stalker pattern shells which are a compressed gas system for any kind of extensive void engagement to minimize heat build up. Or maybe a cooled thermal sleave. The setting rarely goes into the fun details of weapons and when they do the writer's lack of engineering or scale really shows (I'm looking at you IA tank armor stats.)

>>33660122
Less environmental pressure means more relative pressure in the charge.

>lack of engineering or scale in writers
Oh well now that you've just /thread...

>>33660038
Plenty of librarian figurines with a bolt pistol in one hand and a force stave in the other.

>>33660147
I understand in the shell and at the point of combustion you have more relative pressure. It was more the gas escaping around the bolt and through an unsealed gas system in vacuum where I was thinking there may be an issue in reliability as you would still see some pressure loss however minimal compared to atmospheric fire.

>>33660232
>It was more the gas escaping around the bolt and through an unsealed gas system in vacuum
Is the gas system sealed in atmosphere?

If it isn't, why would it matter one way or the other?

>>33656331
it looks like it is long stroke gas piston

>>33660273
There are still gases in atmosphere (obviously) that the expanding gas will have to push against. That same resistant pressure (14.5 to 17 psi for Earth atmospheric pressure) would be absent in vacuum so that same amount would bleed off and not be there to cycle the action in theory.

However all of this was assuming the weapon was built for atmospheric tolerances and not void from the get go. If it's the latter you would just see slightly higher pressure on the gas system in atmosphere rendering this whole point I've been bumbling around with is moot.

tl;dr gg no re me

>>33660348
>that the expanding gas will have to push against
So expanding gas pushes against atmospheric gas and that would give expanding gas more power to cycle an action versus expanding gas bleeding out into a vacuum?

Tell me, do you have any paper, theory, or even a bit of math to back up that fluid dynamics hypothesis?

>>33657637
You spelled spelled wrong

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>>33656430
>>33656993
>>33659617
>>33660122
>>33660394

>>33656331
Aren't Spess Muhreen guns rocket guns or something?

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>>33660674
Get out newfag

>>33660394

wow... what kind of idiot doesn't know "spelt"?

>>33660041
you'll want special lube or else it'll evaporate and metal on metal friction points will start welding together.

>>33660836
Vacuum welding does not work that way.

>>33660841
oh, yeah?

>>33660674

Something more akin to a cased gyrojet cartridge. The cartridge is used to give it a respectable muzzle velocity and then the gyrojet boosts it further.

>>33660861
You need two extremely clean surfaces of similar materials, usually the same alloy, and they need to be extremely high surface finishes, on the order of mirror smooth.

Even with all that, it can be a challenge to get them to weld.

Even after that, you'd need to make sure the oil evaporated without leaving any residue.

Even after that, you'd need to make sure the powder charge hasn't left any debris between the surfaces.

Even after that, you'd need to make sure the surfaces don't have any sort or surface finish or patina or anything like that.

See where I'm going with this?

>>33660376
Nope, hence it just being a guess based upon my own loose understanding of the physics involved. You are more than welcome to annihilate it with actual math.

>>33660989
Like you, I don't know a fucking thing about this shit but I like being a dick on the internet and condescendingly poking holes in other posts without having much to contribute myself.

>>33660999
Fair enough upside down Satan.

Pretend you have two bottles with the same amount of gunpowder in them and an electric igniter in the base.

One bottle has a sheet of paper resting over the top. The other, the control, has nothing resting over the top. The gunpowder is then remotely ignited.

Which bottle has higher pressure before the paper is blown off?

This is the principle I was working with.

>>33661024
>Which bottle has higher pressure before the paper is blown off?
How do you know when the paper is blown off when there's no paper on the control

I think it might be more of an experiment if you put a cork in the bottleneck, have one bottle in a vacuum and one bottle in atmo. Then you measure the speed of the cork with the only variable being atmo/vacuum.

>>33661037
The paper part was meant to represent that even a little resistance increases pressure, not the vacuum principle.

On your experiment idea I think it would be more appropriate for the bottles to have a small hole in the side to represent some bleed off from the imperfect seal of a firing gas operated weapon. Then measure how much pressure is needed to pop the cork in atmosphere and vacuum.