ideal CCW

>>33597631
It's heavy, .32 is very anemic, hot loaded .32 and old guns doesn't mix. Very easy to snag it if you IWB. You're not Bond, get something that won't end up killing you.

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>ideal
>a fucking pps in the year 2017

lmao

>>33597647
>.32 is very anemic
We're talking personal defense distances, i.e. point blank pretty much.
Unless you're dealing with a wigged-out druggie, a suicide terrorist, or a naked Celtic tribal warrior, the sound of the shot alone will resolve the situation in 99% of the cases.

>>33597654
The PPS is a lot smaller though.
Pretty much same difference as in the OP pic.

>>33597654
>carrying a fucking beretta and thinking you can be smug at ANYONE

>>33597631
>Thinking you carry with the safety on.
It's a decocker.

>>33597728
I meant more along the lines of carrying Israeli style; with an empty chamber.

>>33597631
Make sure you hold one first. I found that the safety would snag on my thumb if I shot it t2o handed. It was built in the time of tactical bullseye shooting.

>>33597708
It's a gun that can actually be shot. Unlike the tiny bitchguns mentioned ITT.

Single stacks are for tards who can't into cc

>>33597736
If you carry without a round in the chamber, you'll spend the rest of your life racking that slide.

>>33597736
Why the fuck would you use the safety if you're carrying with empty chamber?
Carry it decocked with one in the pipe like its designed for

>>33597736
You're fucking retarded. Get a good holster and carry with one in the chamber.

>>33597631
>engage the safety while racking (under duress)
>>33597703
>sound of the shot alone will resolve the situation in 99% of the cases
>>33597736
>carrying Israeli style; with an empty chamber


ITT: OP proves he knows absolutely jack shit about firearms.

>>33597761
>>33597772
>>33597785
I think it's an added security in some ways to carry with an empty chamber. For instance if you get knocked out or subdued or it falls out of reach during a grappling match, and someone manages to grab your handgun, they might not manage to get the gun to work right away.

Worked well enough for the Israeli operatives who actually had regular firefights.

>>33597772
>Why the fuck would you use the safety
I wouldn't.

>>33597795
Most violent confrontations will involve mugging or carjacking rather than an all-out suicidal assault on your life.

>>33597631
lel tec P32

>>33597812
>I think it's...
I think you're fucking retarded. In your scenario you're already dead.

And no, no, no, weight matters much more than size.

>>33597631
It's a great gun, but a single stack polymer really does carry better. The weight isn't really noticeable until you carry 8 hrs+, then it's a big deal.

You will probably be more accurate with the PPK though.

>>33597736
The PPK locks up like a bank vault with the safety on, no need to worry. Even with the safety off it has a long heavy double action, it's not going to fire unless you really mean to.

>>33597745
>compacts and sub compacts are for tards who can't into cc

ftfy

Love me some p938 for ultra compactness.

>>33597825
You sound like you're more badass than Israeli operators who defeated AK-wielding muzzies with iddy-biddy Beretta .22 pocket pistols, which they carried with an empty chamber.

I wonder if you really are more badass than them.

>>33597831
>The PPK locks up like a bank vault with the safety on, no need to worry
But isn't it so that small finger movements (swiping a safety) are harder to do under stress than larger hand movements (racking a slide)?

>>33597708
This

>>33597825
This. Op proves once again that they are a faggot

>>33597851
Its not about whats harder to do, its about whats faster. And no, you can drill finicky movements too.

>>33597851
If you love your Israeli operators so much, go cut off your foreskin you mouthbreathing jack ass. There is no advantage to carrying without one in the chamber other than jerking off to your action movie fantasies.

>>33597829
The weight of the gun sticks right to your body, it's not a big deal unless your clothes are ill-fitting.
The weight also helps remind you that you're packing at all times.

>>33597867
>jerking off to your action movie fantasies
That's rich coming from someone who thinks self defense is basically a quick-draw duel.

>>33597864
I'll probably try carrying with one in the pipe and do drills to figure out the pros and cons.

The question still stands though; how easy is it to engage the safety if you rack while under duress? And I mean some serious panicked clawing.

Not just for drawing, but in case of malfunction or something.

>>33597869
>The weight also helps remind you that you're packing at all times.

Jesus christ

Whats the /k/onsensus on the lc9s? Thinking on getting one but also considering nano/g43/shield

>>33597882
Well it sure as shit doesn't come down to pissing around racking the slide so they can show everyone "they mean business."

>>33597887
>how easy is it to engage the safety if you rack while under duress?
It's possible that it wont engage unless the gun is in battery, cant remember if it was the ppk that worked like that.

Anyways its all about drilling

>>33597894
Meh

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>saftey on chamber empty

Are you fucking serious? Why on earth would you do that? With a PPK of all guns. Don't be such a massive faggot.

Pic related. Round in the chamber, hammer decocked, safety off.

>lul shoot your dick off

It's a goddamn 12 pound trigger pull in double action. The fuck are you afraid of?

>>33597930
>saftey on chamber empty
I don't even want to use the safety.
Reading comprehension, anon.

>>33597936
Oh, sorry, didn't realize you were trolling this whole time. Carry on.

why not carry a snubbie?

>>33597930
When did they start adding the "Made in USA" tag underneath the Walther banner? Mine doesn't have it. Just a "Smith & Wesson Houlton, ME USA" in plain type on the other side.

>>33597882
Most are though. Muggins-you need a quick draw. Rape-draw faster than he can cum. Held at gunpoint in a robbery-need a quick draw. Raping someone and they pull a gun-need a quick draw. You need to be able to get your gun into action fast. The data agrees with all of us that almost all malfunctions happen when chambering a round. Carry with one in the pipe or don't carry. Or go join your Israeli "special" ops who carry .22 pistols. saged and reported for being a retard.

>>33597961
What?

I'm talking about carrying with an empty chamber, and racking when the time comes.
I'm just asking if it's easy (or even mechanically possible) to engage the safety while racking, accidentally making you end up in condition 1 after racking.

>>33597977
Mine's an Interarms

>>33597631
>racking under duress.

There are only two reasons this would ever occur. Either you've suffered a malfunction, or you carry like a retard.

If you go for your gun, whoever it is that's attacking or threatening you will know that they have a split second to defend their own lives. Assuming they don't have a gun already drawn on you (in which case why the fuck would you try to draw) this means they're going to swing at you with whatever they've got.

So your right hand is going for your gun, their right hand is going for your face, and where would you rather your left hand be? In front of your face, or dicking fucking with the tiny ass slide on your pocket pistol?

>>33597990
>Most are though.
Source?

>>33598005
Here you go you lazy nigger. Look at the most common criminal activities. https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-releases-preliminary-semiannual-crime-statistics-for-2016

>>33598004
>There are only two reasons this would ever occur. Either you've suffered a malfunction, or you carry like a retard.
Or there's a stressful situation going on. Which is basically a prerequisite for drawing your gun in the first place.

>>33597851
>But isn't it so that small finger movements (swiping a safety) are harder to do under stress than larger hand movements (racking a slide)?

I would be more worried about having a misfeed, or failure to go into battery. Plus what if you are using you other arm to fend off a knife attack, or protect your head from being stomped?

>>33598024
Where does it state the most common criminal activities?

>>33598044
>Stressful situation
>Be someone who doesn't carry like a retard
>Draw gun and pull trigger
>Situation resolved

And not a single slide had to be racked that day.

>>33597869
The gun pulling down on your clothes to
>remind you that you're packing at all times
is exactly the thing you do not want to happen.
It doesn't matter if you carry a gun in a pocket or somewhere on the waistband. It will pull down. Even with a belt it will. Sure the gun is hidden, but it will not be comfortable.

>>33597894
I have the pro model, the firing pin has broken twice from dry firing rendering the gun unusable. If you get one, use snap caps.

>>33598055
I'd rather rack a slide than flick a safety desu.

And I'd rather carry with an empty chamber or a safety on than condition 0.

>>33598047
>Plus what if you are using you other arm to fend off a knife attack, or protect your head from being stomped?
Rack it on your clothes I guess?

>>33598057
>It will pull down
If your clothes fit properly, the material should tear before the pants start to sag.
Unless you have an actual gut of course.

>>33598087
The force of gravity doesn't go anywhere just because the pants are tight. You will feel it, and it will be uncomfortable.

>>33598078
>I'd rather do a longer, more easily botched operation that requires both hands

No.

>Rack it on your clothes I guess?

You have never handled a gun.

>>33598097
Of course he hasn't otherwise this thread would never be created. PPK is so far from "reigning supreme" as a carry gun it would be obvious to anyone who held it.

>>33598097
>>I'd rather do a longer, more easily botched operation that requires both hands
Under stress, I'm more confident in bigger movements than small finger movements.

>You have never handled a gun.
lmao

Try it anon, it's actually very easy to do.

>be op
>nignog breaks in
>rack my shotgun to scare him away
>nignog mag dumps where the sound came from
>op is kill

>>33598134
>rack to scare him away
OP here, never said anything remotely indicating this.

>>33598078
>And I'd rather carry with an empty chamber or a safety on than condition 0.

Good thing you aren't in condition 0 for a PPK when the safety is off and the chamber is loaded. If the hammer is down, then you're basically in condition 2. Then again, the condition system only really works for guns like 1911s or the Sig p938/p238, so this isn't really an appropriate comparison.

Like others have said, 12 lb double action pull. It's probably safer than a Glock if it has a firing pin stop.

>>33598126
>Under stress, I'm more confident in bigger movements than small finger movements
I've been shot at multiple times. You aren't under "stress." It's pure adrenaline. You will be fixated on the people shooting and lost most motor function. Shortstrokes are extremely common when under duress. You aren't a soldier. You have never been shot or have had to pull your firearm. It's completely different when your life is on the line and seconds feel like an hour. You're civilian as fuck

>>33598149
>Good thing you aren't in condition 0 for a PPK when the safety is off and the chamber is loaded
Pretty sure it's impossible for this statement to be true.

>>33598146
Yeah, your retarded excuse is that some nigger will knock your gun away and try to use it on you. Say op, what happens to you when he racks a round in? You could have stopped the thread but in return, pulled out a piece of metal that's useless without a round in the chamber. You're now just another fbi statistic to make gun owners look like incompetent retards. Try this. Rack a round, put the barrel of your James Bond gun in your mouth and pull the trigger.

>>33598171
The hammer has to be back to be in condition 0. You don't have to have the hammer back on a loaded PPK. Not that hard to figure out.

>>33598161
>You aren't under "stress." It's pure adrenaline.
Dude.

>>33598126
>Under stress, I'm more confident in bigger movements than small finger movements.

You're talking about a very complex "big" movement compared to a very simple "small" movement. You're also removing your only means of defense while getting your gun into action which, thanks to your carry method, will take longer than normal and provide plenty of opportunity for your opponent to interfere

>Try it anon, it's actually very easy to do

I'm curious what gun you've tried this with, but can assure you that it'll be much harder lying on your side with someone on top of you beating your head in.

>Inb4 GBB pistol

>>33597996
There's a small possibility that you'll engage the safety while racking, but in actuality it doesn't really happen. I'm not the guy you were replying to, but I also hope you're trolling when seriously considering carrying without one in the chamber. If you're not confident enough to carry with one in the chamber, there is little to no possibility you have the skill to actually rack and have your gun ready under extreme time constraints.

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Reigning supreme since 1903
Slimmer than the PPK
no external hammer to snag
Superior visual design
Tried and true for over a hundred years
Comfy weight
Minimal recoil for fast follow up shots
John Moses Browning

>>33597825
You sound like a fuckwad

>>33598078
You're retarded

>>33598178
Do modern PPK have any sort of safety for decocked state? Would it fire if you snag the hammer slightly and let it fall? Would it fire if you strike the hammer resting on loaded chamber?

My P64 happily goes off in both cases, not sure about Walthers.

>>33598078
We've been trolled, lads.

>>33598197
Im pretty sure they have a firing pin safety

>>33598175
>Say op, what happens to you when he racks a round in?
Same thing that happens when he simply finds himself with an already chambered gun, only a bit later.

>>33598178
But you're still in condition 0 with the hammer cocked.

>>33598187
Like I said, I'm more confident with big movements than small finger movements when under duress.
"I'm" as in "me".
"Me" as in "not you".

When my phone rings at an awkward moment for instance, I have a lot more trouble doing basic screen swipes than under normal circumstances. But I could throw the phone out the window just as easily.

>I'm curious what gun you've tried this with
Right back at you.

>>33598188
>I also hope you're trolling when seriously considering carrying without one in the chamber.
Well I wasn't.
Just like I wasn't trolling when I said I'd carry with one in the chamber as well depending on the situation.
But the question was about more than that, I was also thinking about malfunctions.

>>33598227
That's great then, OP could carry it with hammer resting on loaded chamber and safety disabled.

>>33597990
If someone is holding you a gunpoint, DO NOT DRAW. I fucking guarantee you that a nigger can pull a trigger faster than you can draw and fire.

>>33597851
Are you an operator you dumb motherfucker? Surely at this point you're just being dense on purpose. Don't ask questions if you're just going to completely disregard the answers with your stupid fucking opinions.

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>>33598235
>Say op, what happens to you when he racks a round in?
Same thing that happens when he simply finds himself with an already chambered gun, only a bit later
If you had a round chambered he would be dead on the ground. Quit being a dumbass. Inb4 this is all a troll and you were only pretending to be retarded!

>>33598113
They're so sexy tho. You just feel powerful when holding/carrying it.

>>33597654
kys berettafag
>>33597745
enjoy your $9.50 an hour job & beetus tubby

>>33598235
>Right back at you.

I have an SD9VE and a CZ 97b. It's a terrible idea with either one and might actually pull my pants down if I wasn't wearing my belt tight enough.

Your turn.

>>33598252
My description was being held gunpoint at a robbery. Meaning a distracted nignog more worried about getting the money and getting out of there than someone in line. I pocket carry and always keep my hand in my pocket when in line anywhere in case this happens. Nigger busts in gun blazing and demands the money keeping most of his attention on the person behind the counter. I draw and fire in under a second if/when the time is right. But yeah. If someone is completely focused on you aimijng a gun at you don't try to draw. But that's rarely the case.

>>33598197
>Would it fire if you snag the hammer slightly and let it fall?

This is an important point, which is why I mentioned the importance of a firing pin block in my original post.. Some ppks (or at least some ppk clones) have firing pin blocks, making hammer strikes/snags basically moot.

>>33598190
I really wish these older pocket pistols would come back in style.

>>33598235
>But you're still in condition 0 with the hammer cocked.

No shit. I'm saying you carry with the hammer down. It's the same concept with the 1911. Assuming the safety is off, chamber loaded. Hammer down = condition 2. Hammer back = condition 0.

Oh wait, are you asking how to de-cock the hammer after racking the slide? Please tell me you're not asking how to do that.

>>33598227
They have a hammer block, not a firing pin safety. With the safety off, you can push the firing pin and it's free to move on its own momentum, but the hammer cannot hit the firing pin without pulling the trigger. With the safety on it rotates a barrel that grabs the firing pin to prevent it moving forward and blocks the hammer from hitting the firing pin.

>>33597631
Remington 51.
It's accurate, fits the hand well, and reliable. Internal hammer so snagging is a moot point, terrible safety but you won't have to worry about accidentally engaging it. Smaller, thinner, lighter than a bersa thunder while keeping the same capacity.
If I didn't just get a new phone I'd have pictures of mine

>>33597631
Bersa thunder 380 plus???
I think so

>>33597812
>would carry without one in chamber
>Somehow a well built safety is harder to activate than racking the slide so I wouldn't carry one in a chamber on safe

Anon you might be retarded

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This gun is actually really nice.

>>33598388
Imagine his reaction when he find out people carry glawks that have no external safety with a round in the chamber

>>33598383
I have one and it has failures to feed like OP's mom has venereal diseases.

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>>33598434

>>33598388
It's not just that, safeties also get flicked by accident. Both on and off.
Much harder to rack a slide by accident.

>>33598434
>>33598540
What in the world makes you think I wouldn't know about that?

>>33598266
>my clothes don't fit properly, your point is invalid
Heh.

>>33598255
>If you had a round chambered he would be dead on the ground.
Shit happens if you have a round chambered or not.

>>33598253
You seem upset.
My question was about engaging the safety when racking, for instance when drawing or in case of a malfunction.
My question wasn't about the merits of carrying chambered/unchambered.

>>33598599
>Shit happens if you have a round chambered or not
Ask yourself. Would you rather pull out your gun and pull the trigger? Or pull it out and have to rack a slide, where most malfunctions happen in a split second. Again. You're a retarded faggot who shouldn't own guns.

>>33598855
Considering that actual life-or-death defense situations are much rarer than potential accidents, I'll take the risk of having to rack the slide over the risk of accidental/unwanted discharge.

Drawing is in itself a big movement, racking is just an extension of that. Especially if you drill for it.

>>33598434
I carry a Walther PPQ M2 for work but I don't trust it just thrown in my pocket because there's no external safety and it's striker fired.
I will however throw my Makarov or S&W Model 59 in my pocket with a round in the chamber and safety off.

>>33598599
>>my clothes don't fit properly, your point is invalid
>Heh.

Still haven't told me what gun (that you totally own, I'm sure) you've tried this with.

>>33599009
Ever heard of a holster, you fucking idiot?

>>33597631
if you need to rack the slide, then why did you have the safety on?

>>33598974
Adding a step will always bring more chance of failure. Racking is more detrimental than drawing. If you shortstroke it, you're fucked. If it fails to feed a round, you're fucked.

>>33599147
Think two seconds before you post anon.

Jesus christ.

>>33599009
Does the PPQ even fit in your pocket?

>>33599215
It does in my coat pocket.

>>33599137
I use one for work, but for gray man I just throw it in my pocket, fits pretty nice.

>>33599242
It's called a pocket holster you fucking mong.

>>33597631
How much do PPK's go for now a days? I've seen them anywhere from $500-$1000.

>>33597631
>Racking a CCW
>Using a safety on a CCW

Look at this faggot who doesn't CCW.

Also, I don't trust .380.

>>33599149
Life-or-death defense situations are extremely rare. Misfeeds and short stroking is also extremely rare.

On the other hand, accidents happen all the fucking time.

I'd rather take the minute risk of the former than increase the substantial chance of the latter.

>>33597631
>ppk
>not using sturdier, simpler, more powerful Makarov in 9x18 Real Fuckin' Borscht

>>33599254
That's just meme bullshit.

>>33597736

If you carry with out a round in the chamber.
It just means you have no faith in yourself, or your gear.
You should probably just stop carrying.

>>33599267
>>Racking a CCW
Even if you carry with one in the pipe, there's still a chance you're going to have to rack at one point.

>>Using a safety on a CCW
Never said I was going to use the safety.

I was asking about flicking it by accident while racking.

Read before you post.

>>33599297
>you're not doing [thing] the way I like, so you should stop doing [thing]

Literally gun grabber logic.

Do you guys really keep one in the chamber 24/7 or is this a meme? I thought you would only put one in the chamber if you were going to a bad part of town or something?

>>33599302
>Even if you carry with one in the pipe, there's still a chance you're going to have to rack at one point.

Yeah, if your gun fucks up, which is very unlikely. Let's break it down.

>Extremely small chance of having to perform, slow, high dexterity action that requires both of your hands while being assaulted in a life or death situation
>100% chance of having to perform, slow, high dexterity action that requires both of your hands while being assaulted in a life or death situation.

By carrying without one in the chamber, you are basically simulating carrying a pistol with a 100% chance of jamming.

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>>33597631

People get killed by pellet guns, stopping power is mostly a meme propagated by insecure fatties.

Only exception is if some angel dust PCP hyper nigger breaks into your home, which unless you live in Chicago isn't a likely scenario.

Just shoot them 2-3 times in the chest/neck area and their threat should diminish considerably.

>>33599343
That's how reasonable people would do it.

/k/ however is full of single-minded autists who are incapable of putting things in perspective.

>>33599343
No, carrying your gun actually ready to use is not a "meme"

>>33599280
They aren't as rare as you think. Over a million people every year pull a gun in self defense.
>Misfeeds and short stroking is also extremely rare
Was in the military for 8 years. They are extremely common even among trained soldiers.
If you want to put your life in an unnecessary risk because you think internal safety mechanisms in guns are a meme then go for it. But you're still a retard.

>>33599293
nope.>>33599401

>>33599317

No, the logic is that it's not rare for peopleto get attacked, that they're unable to use their gun cause they're fighting some one off with one arm, now thry can't properly rack the slide.

Go look up security videos on youtube of people trying to fight, draw, rack, aim. You see that over and over again, it usually ends well for the attacker and not for the defender.

What I said is the same stuff that is regurtated over and over again by people like Travis Haley, Chris Costa, John Lovell, Jerry Miculek, even Buck Yaeger and pretty much every other firearms instructor.

Now seeing as you have to rack the slide, you're now adding even more movements needed to get that gun into the fight, this is also increasing your time from draw, aim, fire, cause you added in another movement. You're gonna be under stress, you're heart is gonna be beating like crazy and the adrenaline will be flowing, so it's pretty easy during that time to get a short stroke.

So please, go watch the videos, read the reports, all the data is there.

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>>33597631
Elsie pea 1 or 2.
Smaller, lighter, locked breech instead of blowback, stronger cartridge. Better in every way except nostalgia.

>>33599343
Carrying hot and safety off isn't an issue if you have your gun in a rigid holster (and you mind your shirt tail). Hot ranges do it all the time, but your gun stays in holster at all times unless you're on the line. That holster effectively isolates your trigger completely.

>>33599401
A reasonable person would realize that carrying a gun without one in the chamber equates to carrying a hunk of metal no more dangerous than carrying any other piece of metal. A reasonable person would realize that if you are carrying a gun you are doing it for a reason. That reason is the safety of yourself and others. If you are afraid of carrying a gun thee way it was designed to bee carried then you shouldn't bee carrying at all and are no better than the soccer moms thinking guns randomly go off.

>>33599471
My pistol isn't double action. If there's one in the chamber it wouldn't take much for it to fire.

>>33599439
Damn that looks convenient. Any other options /k/ would also consider in a pocket carry?

I primarily wear close-fitting khakis and knit polo shirts in the summer, so I don't think I can even manage a single stack in an IWB holster.

>>33599371
At some point in your logic you equated racking with jamming.

>>33599427
>Over a million people every year pull a gun in self defense.
Source?

>>33599438
That's a long post for someone who is making the extremely simplistic argument of "CARRY WITH ONE IN THE PIPE OR DON'T CARRY AT ALL".

>>33599317
>Saying there's no point is you doing something is the same as saying you should be prevented by force from doing it.

Literally retard logic.

Look, if you really want, nobody here is actually going to stop you from carving a fucking PPK out of black soap and carrying that, but doing so would be a waste of fucking time and everyone is going to call you a retard for doing it.

>>33599471
Different anon. I was with you until...

> If you are afraid of carrying a gun thee way it was designed to bee carried then you shouldn't bee carrying at all and are no better than the soccer moms thinking guns randomly go off.

You really cannot imagine a situation where having access to a pistol, safety on, would be better than no pistol at all?

>>33599471
>carrying a gun without one in the chamber equates to carrying a hunk of metal no more dangerous than carrying any other piece of metal

This is so fucking stupid it's making my head hurt.

>>33598446
Have ya tried different ammo types?

>>33599493

This is 4chan, even the most simplest answers tend to go over people's head.

>>33599493
>Source?
Are you really that incompetent and lazy that you can't look shit up for yourself? It's in the 2013 cdc gun statistics they released early this year. Let's see if you can use your brain and find it.

>>33599493
>Have jam
>Need to rack slide

>Carry like retard
>Need to rack slide

Racking a slide is an awful thing to have to do in the heat of a confrontation. Fortunately, one of the major potential causes is completely preventable.

>>33597631

Why would you ever rack the slide on a compact pistol under duress?

>>33599503
Safety on one in the chamber is not what I'm talking about. Op wants to carry with safety on without on in the chamber. Reading comprehension is hard.

>>33599497
>>33599438
>>33599297
>>33599471


Let's do a little experiment anon.

Jamal is blocking your path, and about to teleport behind you.

Would you rather:

1) have no gun at all

or

2) have a gun with an empty chamber

These are your only two options.

If you picked option 2), then you admit your "carry chambered or don't carry at all" argument is bullshit.

>>33599537
Cool, please ammend my post to:

You really cannot imagine a situation where having access to a pistol, safety on, no round in the chamber would still be better than no pistol at all?

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>>33599286
>sturdier
lower quality steel
>simpler
more moving parts
>more power
marginally with none of the ammo choices

Not to mention:
>disproportionately large for caliber
>ugly as all fuck
>backwards safety
>worse heel release of all heel releases
>shitty finishing / tooling
the list goes on

yeah you picked a real winner there

Threadly Reminder:
Makarovs are stolen German designs. All subsequent posts are rightful deutsche clay

>>33599508
Tell that to all the police that died when it was policy to carry with an empty chamber pre 1990's.
You can't predict what will happen. If someone grabs you by the arm "most niggers" then you can't rack the slide. If someone grabs your arm and you have one in the chamber you can unholster and shoot without needing that other arm.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVPiic-ELoM

>>33599560
Quit moving the goalpost to suit your retarded post you idiot.

>>33599575
This

>>33597812
Numerous videos on YouTube of someone trying to rack a slide as they are being shit or assualted. Carry right or not at all.

>>33599587
> If you are afraid of carrying a gun thee way it was designed to bee carried then you shouldn't bee carrying at all .

Anon, now don't get angry that you said you'd rather be completely unarmed than be forced to carry a gun you'd have to rack.

>>33599537
>Op wants to carry with safety on without on in the chamber.
Quote where I said this.

Right fucking now.

>>33599553
I never made that argument (first post you quoted), but in that situation I would rather have a particularly sharp pencil than no weapon so the "better than nothing!" argument is stupid.

Yes, something is better than nothing.

No, that doesn't excuse handicapping yourself by carrying in a far inferior manner.

>>33599575
>pre 1990's
You mean when 99% of law enforcement used revolvers?

>>33597745
>Single stacks are for tards who can't into cc

Totally dude, I love thicc fat grips so I can print like a motherfucker and have more bullets than I need.

Face it if you're CCing and you need more than 7 round in a magazine then you're probably dead anyways.

>>33599610
I stand by what I said. If you are afraid of your firearm you shouldn't be a gun owner. You shouldn't carry. You only put your life and the lives of those around yours in danger.
> you said you'd rather be completely unarmed than be forced to carry a gun you'd have to rack
Wrong. I would never carry without one in the chamber. I'm not retarded like most of the people in this thread. Take out your firearm that you carry without one in the chamber. You can only use one hand. Try to make it not just a piece of metal. >>33599575 linked a good video showing how quickly you can lose access to using your other arm. You assume that you will be able to rack a round. That's often not the case.

>>33599603
>Carry right or not at all.
Answer this post pls anon: >>33599553

I'm really curious as to your answer.

>>33599670
Leo used Glocks from the 80's on for the most part. Swat carried revolvers but always main carried rifles in raids.

>>33599665
>I never made that argument
But you did.

You defended that notion that I should carry the way you like, or not carry at all.

>>33597761
wow...actually made me think..

>>33599680
I wouldn't be carrying with an empty chamber. Niggers can't into animu teleports. Situational awareness is more important than carrying a firearm. Argument-discarded.

>>33599697
I defended the person telling you your stupid shit carry method was stupid and shit.

>Would you rather have a sharp pencil or nothing?
>SEE? SHARP PENCIL IS GUD EDC GUISE

>>33597728
It's a decocker-safety. With the lever flupped down, you can't fire the gun. That being said, yes, most people just decock the hammer and flip to fire.

>>33597812
That works both ways; if you're not ready to roll, and you're fumbling for the slide, and the other guy is locked and loaded, you're fucked.

I don't care how good Mossad is; you're losing reaction time to solve a safety issue that isn't even there. If you've got a good gun, and a good holster, you'll be fine, it's not gonna go off. Cops all around the world do it literally every day.

>>33597745
You ever actually shoot a PPS? It's pretty soft shooting for a subcompact. Yeah, it has a little more snap, but it's very controllable, and accurate at 8-10m.

Just bought a Shield from PSA for $320 with free shipping. FFL charges $10. SW has a $75 rebate. All in all got a 9mm shield for $255. Will be my 1st single stack 9mm. How did I do /k/?

>>33599683
>Leo used Glocks from the 80's on for the most part.
The Glock was first adopted by LEO in the US in 1988.

>>33599738
1988. Not the 80's... Sometimes I honestly believe /k/ is retarded.

>>33599553

Your question serves no purpose at all, you're just getting upset that people are calling you out on it and you're trying to justify your lack of zero to no training and bad choices.

So in the end it's your gun, your life, your choices. If you can't be bothered to do a little bit if research to see how what we said is right, instead of argue with the people who give you advice, I don't know what to tell you.

Here is a few vids for you.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tTXAJhSnFgE


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rVPiic-ELoM

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bMbIC0RPBRs

Would post more, you're probably not gonna watch, so I won't waste any more of my time.

So good day to you sir, ma'am, attack helicopter or what ever gender you follow.

>>33599703
You literally dodged the question.

1) no gun at all
2) gun with empty chamber

Choose.

If you chose 2) that means you never get to use the dumbass argument "carry chambered or don't carry at all" ever again.

>>33599731
Do you carry a PPS? How easy is it to conceal in well-fitted clothing, like say summer wear in the Southwest?

>>33599723
The person was advising me to not carry at all rather than with an empty chamber.

That's literally all his post was saying.

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Y'all posting in a troll thread. Pic related: I carry everyday decocked, one in the chamber, safety off.

>>33599754
You can tell Colion Noir is a lawyer. Even if you cut out the rhetorical devices, his argument is still quite sound.

>>33599753
1988 is 2 years "pre-90s".

Pretty sure 2 years is not what >>33599575
was talking about when he said "pre 90s".

The truth is that semi-auto pistols were extremely rare in police use "pre-90s". So that post is bullshit.

>>33599754
Just answer the question anon.

1) no gun at all
or
2) gun with empty chamber

You chose 2)?

Congratulations, you just realized the whole "CHAMBERED OR NOTHING" schtick is just empty bravado talk.

>>33599780
You are now aware that OP never said you shouldn't carry with one in the chamber.

>>33599755
You are strawmanning you fucking retard. I would never carry without one in the pipe so I would never be in that situation. How about a new question.
Tyrone is blocking your path with 2 friends. You have one second to draw and fire before they are on you. Is your gun without a round in the chamber any more useful than a piece of metal in that situation? Or would you rather have a gun you can pull out and pull thee trigger without extra actions required. If you chose 1. then you agree that carrying with an empty chamber makes your gun a piece of scrap metal with no more use than a penny in your pocket.

OP:
>I prefer empty chamber

/k/:
>RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>33599831
>I would never carry without one in the pipe so I would never be in that situation.
Good for you.

Now pick one of the following options:

1) no gun at all
or
2) gun with empty chamber

Remember: you can only pick one of these two options.

>>33599791
You got called out for being a retard. I am >>33599575 and that is obviously what I was talking about. And semi-autos were actually used a lot. Most officers carried 1911s or Glocks instead of revolvers. remember that most officers served and carried 1911s overseas. The "all police carried muh wheelguns!" is a myth.

>>33599767
>Advising

Yes, and you said he was a gun grabber for telling you that if you're too limpdicked to carry a gun properly carry might not be for you.

>>33599835
So much for discussion about the ideal CC gun.

Way to go, OP. Imagine what your thread could have been. Imagine and weep.

>>33599780
I really want one. I'll be getting my carry license and picking up one of these beauties next year. Any advice on what to look for?

>>33599856
Nope. Only you retards that carry empty can answer your retarded strawman argument. The rest of us carry with the 3'rd option. One in the chamber safety off. Add that into your retarded question and I'll answer it.

>>33599856
Boy you really have a hard on for this because it's the only area of this entire debate where you think you might have a point.

At least there's an implied understanding that your carry method is inherently retarded in the fact that you've backed down to "w-w-ell it's better than nothing!"

The point the anon who told you that was making however was not that it's better to have no gun than one without a round in the chamber.

The point is that if you, as an individual person, are to fucking terrified of your gun that you cannot bring yourself to carry it in the proper way, you, as an individual person, may not want to carry.

>>33599761

I home carry sometimes, like if I leave the front screen open to let some air in, or some guys I don't know are doing work on the house, or car won't start and rando guy comes to jump/tow. I live in a place where ccw permits are kind of restricted. I can't exactly give you a proper answer but;

For fitted summer clothes; yeah it can do it. I've tucked mine in an IWB holster, shorts, fitted tee. No one has ever noticed (or at least never said anything). You can feel it there, but it's not uncomfortable. I'm about 5'8", 160lbs. Perfect size for me. Smaller mags work better for fitted clothes.

Talking M1 model btw.

>>33599883
I carry one in the chamber, safety on. I just practised hitting the thumb safety as I draw and aim. 2nd nature by now. Yes it slows me down a bit but real life isnt high noon duels.

>>33599903
>5'8"
Opinion discarded

>>33599439
Just picked up one of these myself. Recoil is surprisingly good for such a tiny gun. I can fit the whole thing in my pocket easily. In terms of accuracy and cal it's pretty shit, but you can take that thing anywhere.

>>33599754

This right here.
OP is just a scared faggot who shouldn't carry.
Cause he carries without a round in the chamber.

>>33599903
Btw, when i say "fitted tee," I don't mean skin tight.

If I bend over it starts to print. If you stand up straight though; pretty much invisble.

>>33599858
You were talking about two-three years pre-90s?
And this was supposed to be statistically relevant?

>>33599861
>use guns the way I want or don't use guns at all!
Sounds like what gun grabbers say, yes.

>>33599868
You're blaming me?

>>33599883
>Nope.
I accept your apology.

>>33599922
>OP is just a scared faggot who shouldn't carry.
Literally gun grabber logic.

>>33599242
Where do you work that issues ppq? Or is it yours?

You people care way too much about how other people prefer to carry.

>>33599919
I'm just saying that if it hides that well on a smaller guy like me, most people should be fine.

>>33599935
proven troll at this point. The fun's over /k/. nobody is this stupid.

>>33599890
It's better than nothing, and the risk of accidents is greatly reduced.

>>33599811

My God.
Shut the fuck up you stupid faggot.
The more you talk.
The more obvious we know that you are talking out of your ass.
You are just mad that ppl are calling your faggot ass out.
I hope some one stabs you.
As you bleed out.
You realize every one is right but you is right.

Kys faggot.

>>33599935
Listen, if you want to """"carry"""" despite clearly being terrified of guns, I can't stop you. I won't even try. I'll just tell you you're a fucking moron.

You'll notice that no matter how many times I call you a fucking moron, you actually aren't stopped from behaving as a fucking moron.

You've just been called one.

You fucking moron.

>>33599961
>carrying without one in the chamber means you're terrified of guns
Ok lol.

> PPK
> pitiful penis killer

>>33599958
The same could be said of a long rubber dildo, but that's also nowhere as good as a properly loaded firearm.

>>33599974
This "unchambered guns are useless" meme is getting out of hand.

>>33599966
>Be so afraid of ND's that you completely undercut the point of carrying by making your gun unready to fire

They don't bite, anon.

>>33599966
What other reason is there to do such a retarded thing?
>afraid of shooting yourself
>afraid of shooting someone else
That's it. Those are the only reasons to carry without one in the chamber. Your girlish liberal fear and ignorance of the firearm you carry. You don't trust yourself with it. That's it.

>>33599737
Damn it I want a shield for $320 but I never used FFL to transfer.

>>33597631

Oh boy.....this thread...again. don't you got better stuff to do That doesn't involve trolling?

>>33599987
While that's true, i think you should go watch some of the several videos of people dying from israeli carry until you realize that it isn't really a good idea.

>>33599991
>>33600007
I'll sacrifice a bit of "combat effectiveness" to reduce the risk of accidents, yes.

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>>33599920
I picked up a Boraii holster to go with mine. Love it !

>>33600049
You are now aware that I literally said at the start of the thread that I am very open to carrying with one in the chamber, just not all the time.

>>33599780
Nice I have one of these, is it one made in SC?
I really liked it but For the capacity/round/weight I just didn't really think it was a good trade off. I went to a G43 for EDC. Still one of my favorite handguns to take tot he range though.

>>33600054
You can't really be combat effective if you're in a split second life or death situation, and you're sidearm isn't ready to fire.

Don't listen to Mossad. Every other police/military unit on earth carries with one in the chamber.

>>33600054
>"combat effectiveness"
>putting that in scare quotes
Holy shit you are retarded.

>>33600054
So you admit that you don't do it because of fear and ignorance? The gun won't go off without you pulling the trigger. You are as ignorant as the gun grabbers.

>>33600010
Its going to be a bit awkward because the FFL I use sales shields. His price is like $399 though. Then you add 4.5 tax and $2 for transfer and thats another $20 bucks.

>>33600091
Not all situations are like that.

>>33600096
>scare quotes
What?
"Combat" usually refers to military situations, and I'm talking about civilian situations.

>>33600098
>because of fear and ignorance?
Fear, yes.
Ignorance, fuck no.

I'm at least as fearful of accidents as I am of malicious intent.

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>carry a Nazi gun
>use Israeli tactics
epic troll XDDD

>>33600130
>"Combat" usually refers to military situations, and I'm talking about civilian situations
You must love being proven wrong. http://www.dictionary.com/browse/combat

>>33600130
because of fear and ignorance?
>Fear, yes.
>Ignorance, fuck no
So yeah. Fear and ignorance. You wouldn't have any fear of your firearm if you weren't ignorant on how it functions.

>>33600157
Now look at the first word you see in the "noun" section.

>>33600168
I don't know about you, but my life is full of little shit that should be physically impossible, but happens anyway.

>>33600130
>civilian situations
That is a Completely "arbitrary" Distinction. In Fact, I would say "civilians" need to be more Combat "effective" because They don't have a "fire" "team" to back them Up. Plus They Can Use "defensive" Loads, which Makes them "more" "deadly." "The" "military" "has to" "Abide" by "all sorts" of "Treaties" and "Regulations."

MOLON LAVE

>>33600172
Good thing "combat" is used 99% of the time as a verb!

>>33600242
And I used it as a noun, and was referring to its use as a noun.

>>33600199
Such as?

>>33600255
>"Combat" usually refers to military situations
In what way is that not a verb? "refers to military situations." "Military situation" would render combat a verb and not a noun.

>>33600061
>Boraii holster
How stiff is the material? Looks nice.

>>33600257
An orange rolling out of a shopping bag and blocking the front door just as I was closing it, allowing my cat to escape between the gap.

The cat was sprinting before the orange even hit the ground. If I had managed to close the door, the cat would have probably broken its nose crashing into it.

>>33600130
If you're in a situation where you need to go for your pistol, your life is definitely in danger and time is always of the essence.

>>33600284
This discussion started with "combat effectiveness".

>>33600300
What about that is impossible to happen though? Unlikely-yes. Impossible-no. A modern firearm will not go off unless the trigger is depressed.

>>33600294
It's pretty stiff kydex it holds its shape well to avoid printing

>>33600340
And my cat will not escape unless the door is open.

>>33600323
The origin of the term is irrelevant, the exact same principles apply. Stop being an autistic retard and learn to understand context.

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Anyone carried a CZ P-01 Omega or a similar compact 9mm doublestack for CC before? On paper it looks great - most of the advantages of a full sized pistol but with a smaller frame and lower weight.

The pistol I already have is a 10mm so I don't think 9mm recoil will be an issue.

>>33600363
Great logic there mate.
>I opened my door any my cat escaped!
>I pulled the trigger on my gun and a bullet came out!
It comes back to fear and ignorance. Your gun WILL NOT GO OFF UNLESS YOU PULL THE TRIGGER. You are afraid you will pull the trigger. Or you are afraid the gun will magically go off.

>>33600392
Nobody's talking about the origin of the term, only the usage.

As a noun, "combat" typically refers to military situations.
And even in military situations, "combat" is typically too inflated a term to describe isolated small-scale skirmishes.
Let alone one dude in the street fending off uppity hood rats.

>Stop being an autistic retard
Says the faggot who got triggered by quotation marks.

>>33600421
Plenty of people do it. I think the P-01 is kind of bulky and heavy to carry comfortably.

Also grip is kind of long, tends to print.

>>33600431
Shit happens all the time.
Not having one in the chamber greatly reduces the risk of dumb shit going Rube Goldberg on me.

>>33600458
Tell me how the gun will go off with one in the chamber besides pulling the trigger. Answer me that.
>Not having one in the chamber greatly reduces the risk of dumb shit going Rube Goldberg on me
It also increases your chance of a malfunction and increases your chance of getting killed in a situation in which you need your firearm.
Once again leading back to ignorance and fear.

>>33600518
>It also increases your chance of a malfunction
So do hollow points.

>>33600543
Want to know how I can tell you're retarded?

>>33599515
Negatory, and the ammo was garbage, but I don't think that fully explains why I was averaging more than one malfunction per mag.

>>33600543
You're just disproving your method more and more. If hollow points malfunction when already chambered, imagine how bad they would be when you need to chamber one in the heat of the moment!
>inb4 you only carry ball ammo or were just pretending to be retarded

>>33600596
I'm saying trade-offs are made all the time.

Hollow points (while better these days) are inherently more prone to misfeeds, but still tons of people choose marginally better terminal performance over marginally better reliability.

>>33600625
That's wrong though. Modern semi-auto pistols are designed around hollow points and modern hollow points are much better quality than ball ammo. If you have any data to back up your claims please provide it.

>>33600130
>Not all situations are like that.

Not all situations require a gun either, but since you're going out of your way to be prepared for situations that call for a gun, why limit yourself to only being prepared for ones where the attacker calmly allows you to rack your pistol?

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>>33599572
Does this trigger you, tripshit?

>>33600653
1911s and Glocks are still among the most popular pistols, and they were designed for ball.
And the "hollow points or bust" meme is much older than modern HP ammo.

And what makes hollow points inherently less reliable isn't the quality, it's the fact that the nose is hollow while nose roundness is instrumental to feeding.

>>33600667
>why limit yourself to only being prepared for ones where the attacker calmly allows you to rack your pistol?
To reduce the risk of accidents.

In terms of just how much they print, would a thinner gun or a gun with a smaller grip print less?
For instance, M&P Shield vs Glock 26?

>>33600625
>Hollow points
>marginally better terminal performance
*sigh*

>>33600714
You know what would reduce the risk of accidents even more? Not carrying a gun at all.

If you're willing to take the risk of carrying a gun though, you should actually try to take fullest advantage of the one benefit it gives you.

Otherwise you're just carrying a free goodie for the guy who gashes your throat while you fuck with your slide.

>>33600767
>You know what would reduce the risk of accidents even more? Not carrying a gun at all.
You know what would increase your combat effectiveness? Always keeping your gun in your hand.

At this point, I don't think the op is a troll. He's a legit downy, which is rare even here. He's moved the goalpost on his "arguments" and then creates a new one not even relevant to the topic at hand.

>>33600772
That's considered brandishing, which is against the law in most cases.

>>33600772
Very slighty. Maybe. Though being stopped by the police and disarmed would probably count as a reduction in self defense capabilities.

But while we're making compromises, let's look at the pros and cons of empty-chamber carry.

Pros:
-Slightly more protected from magical gun pixies shooting you in the leg, assuming said pixies are dexterous enough to operate a safety but not strong enough to rack a slide (everyone knows this about gun pixies of course)

Cons:
-Requires attackers to calmly and non-threateningly announce their intentions before drawing any weapons or attacking so that you have ample time to prepare your defense.

>>33600838
>He's moved the goalpost on his "arguments"
Show me one such instance.
Use quotes.

>>33600842
>>33600855
Not if you keep your gun hand in your pocket.

>>33597703
>the sound of the shot alone will resolve the situation in 99% of the cases.
oh boy, did joe biden find k? just rack the slide really loud and fire it off into the air, that'll scare them off!

>>33600873
1) never said the sound of racking a slide would scare people off (though it might)
2) never said you should fire into the air

>>33600861
>Not if you keep your gun hand in your pocket.

Some people actually do that with pocket pistols if they feel threatened or like they're in a bad area.

The down side is the normal drawbacks of pocket carry though, that if you have to reach in to grab it unexpectedly (as can be the case) you don't necessarily have full knowledge or control of its position and rotation.

Hammerless revolvers are, in theory, designed so that they can be used from a pocket or bag.

>>33597745
Half the time I show off my 32 it gets called a bitch gun, i call it my bitch gun. i really doubt anyone that's been hit by a 32 calls them a bitch gun though.
i'd rather have a 32 than no gun even if it doesn't work to stop someone chances are if you're in a fight with a 32 your odds are a lot better after they been hit a few times with it.

you ever stub your toe on furniture or something and think "fuck that hurts!" then you start hobbling around or sit down and kind thing ouchie and breath heavily and stuff? I really doubt a 32 is going to feel any better than that.

>>33600885
>Some people actually do that with pocket pistols if they feel threatened or like they're in a bad area.
You mean the same situations where I would definitely rack one into the chamber?

>>33600885
you have to reach in to grab it unexpectedly (as can be the case) you don't necessarily have full knowledge or control of its position and rotation
It's called a holster you dipshit retard. Why do you /noguns/ even come here?

>>33600861
>Not if you keep your gun hand in your pocket.
If it looks like you are grabbing a gun, then actually that's brandishing too. But let's say you're right for the sake of argument, and you can do so in an inconspicuous manner. If I am being accosted by some melanin-enriched individuals, and I have my pocket pistol in my jacket pocket, you're damn fucking right my hand is on the gun. Are you telling me you wouldn't? You would rather, upon the approach of suspicious criminal-type group, pull out your gat and rack the slide? Or do you wait until they're on top of you? Do you know how retarded you are not to take every advantage?

>>33600895
>Racking gun at will
>In public

Even if you don't get the cops called on you pulling out your gun to rack it, congratulations, you've achieved normal carry, what you should be doing all the time.

>>33600903
>Talking about the disadvantages of loose pocket carry
>HURR HOLSTERS

>>33600941
Why would having your hand in your pocket the whole time look like you're grabbing a gun?

>>33600943
If you're in a place crowded enough that you can't rack your gun without it being seen, chances are you're pretty god damn safe from attack.

>>33600943
>HURR HOLSTERS
To be fair, there are such things as pocket holsters.

>>33600988
>Why would having your hand in your pocket the whole time look like you're grabbing a gun?
But we agreed for the sake of argument that it wouldn't be in a manner that would be considered brandishing. It would look like you just have your hand in your jacket pocket.
>If you're in a place crowded enough that you can't rack your gun without it being seen,
Holy shit what the hell is this guy even talking about?

>>33600294

How does it handle jeans while sitting?

I had to grab some cheap bulky holster that prints, but inot as a gun. Looks like im carrying insulin everywhere but at least no one thinks I have carrying.

>>33601014
>It would look like you just have your hand in your jacket pocket.
Exactly.

>Holy shit what the hell is this guy even talking about?
Racking your gun without it being seen?

>>33601029
>Exactly
I'm sorry, are you trying to make a point?
>Racking your gun without it being seen?
Do you really think all crimes happen when you're completely alone with the perpetrator?

>>33601054
>I'm sorry, are you trying to make a point?
Just that having your hand on your gun at all times is safer that not having your hand on your gun at all times.

If maximum safety is what you want (and it should be god damn it reeeee), that's the only way to go. And anyone not doing so should probably stop carrying altogether, and hand in their guns at the nearest "moms against guns" jamboree.

>Do you really think all crimes happen when you're completely alone with the perpetrator?
No?

>>33600084
It's one of the Interarms ones made in Virginia. It's just so comfy to CC. I did recently buy a full size 9mm P99. I'll probably CC that a lot but I'm waiting on my custom holster.

>>33599439
Fuck I really wish they waited a while and saw the feedback the American was getting before patterning the new LCP after it

>>33601081
>Just that having your hand on your gun at all times is safer that not having your hand on your gun at all times.
Except you forgot that weather usually dictates what kind of clothes you can wear. If you can wear a winter jacket, then pocket carry definitely has merits.
>No?
I know this is hard, but please try to follow along. If you are in public and you see someone looking at you suspiciously, and you take out a gun and rack the slide before he's on top of you because that is the only way your gun will be of any use, then to any bystander it will appear as though some nutjob just pulled out a gun and racked the slide and everyone else is running away. Congratulations, you just committed a crime.

>>33599878
Sorry, I don't know much else about other PPK/S versions.

>>33601133
>Except you forgot that weather usually dictates what kind of clothes you can wear. If you can wear a winter jacket, then pocket carry definitely has merits.
You can put your hand in your pant/shorts pocket along with your gun too, anon.

> If you are in public and you see someone looking at you suspiciously
I was talking about racking before or as you enter a shady area.

>>33601195
>I was talking about racking before or as you enter a shady area.

Which will be conveniently totally vacant as per your hollywood fantasies?

Even if there's one other person on the street that looks kind of shady to you, so you go to rack you gun, guess what fuckboi? They're calling the cops. Even if they'd actually been planning to mug your shit, you'd be in the wrong.

Good job protecting yourself from fucking gun gremlins though.

>>33601195
>You can put your hand in your pant/shorts pocket along with your gun too, anon.
But can you fire it from within your pocket? If not, that's actually worse than a good holster. Fyi, baggy clothes look terrible.
>I was talking about racking before or as you enter a shady area.
You. Are. Retarded.

>>33601195
>be op
>about to go to a shady area
>pull my gat out and rack a round in
>few minutes later have to use lethal force against a dindu
>the cameras show you racking a round before the conflict which the dindu's family could use against you to fuck you over
>op now has to spend a few years in prison and pay the dindu's family

>>33601226
You rack when it's convenient, or when it's necessary.

>>33601245
>But can you fire it from within your pocket? If not, that's actually worse than a good holster.
Right.
Because it's harder to draw your gun-holding hand than it is to draw from a holster.

>You. Are. Retarded.
Lol, why?

>>33601261
Good luck proving beyond a reasonable doubt that you racked that round because you were looking for someone to kill, and not because you were simply entering a shady area.

Also, that same logic applies if you racked it at home. Or if you simply have the gun on you.

>>33601310
>You rack before you holster it

FTFY

>>33601313
What if I prefer not to a lot of the time?

We have gone from "I don't want to carry with a round chambered because safety" to "I am going to fiddle-fuck with my gun going in and out of places that I think I might be robbed in."
Congrats, you just made the case for carrying with a round in the chamber while at the same time managing to be even less safe by not having the gun in a certain condition with consistency.

Full. Fucking. Retard.

>>33601310
>Good luck proving beyond a reasonable doubt that you racked that round because you were looking for someone to kill, and not because you were simply entering a shady area
It's happened before. They would ask you why you didn't have one chambered before that. It could be seen as a premeditated shooting. Depending on location it could fuck you over big time. Better to just have a round chambered at all times and only unholster when stopping a threat.

>>33601310
>or when it's necessary.

When you put it in the holster is when it's necessary.

>>33601318
Then you should get over it ang start taking carrying a weapon seriously.

>>33597631
If the PPK was good enough to kill Hitler its good enough for me.

>>33601322
I called this like 2 hours ago. People like op get btfo every time there are threads like these and they always end up playing the "I was trolling!" or "I was just pretending to be retarded!" excuse.

>>33601310
>Because it's harder to draw your gun-holding hand than it is to draw from a holster.
Have you ever tried to do this in real life?
>Lol, why?
Yeah no, you're retarded.

>>33601318
Then you get the fuck over yourself and carry it properly.

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>>33601322
>>33601346
He's trolling, you fucking idiots. Stop reply to him and this thread will sink to page 11 where it belongs.

>>33601322
I always included the option of chambering a round.

And it makes perfect sense to arm yourself in accordance with the situation.

>>33601328
>It's happened before.
Hey, if you want to protect yourself from unjust legal action, stay the fuck at home or go into the jungle.

>>33601339
>When you put it in the holster is when it's necessary.
Spoken like a true badass.

>>33601342
How about you get over yourself and I'll carry however the fuck I want?

>>33601346
>I called this like 2 hours ago.
And I specifically mentioned carrying with one in the chamber 6 hours ago.

>>33601352
>Have you ever tried to do this in real life?
Yes.
And it's faster to draw your hand which is already holding the gun out of your pocket.

>>33601366
Does my personal preference trigger you?

OP:
>I prefer empty chamber

/k/:
>RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

A lot of you faggots really need a life.

>>33598270
You're going to draw and fire in less than a second? You do actually plan on hitting the robber, right?

>>33601375
>And it makes perfect sense to arm yourself in accordance with the situation.
Except that doesn't tend to pan out in reality. The reality is that we are sometimes less than mindful than we would like to be. Consistency is a way to mitigate that.
>And it's faster to draw your hand which is already holding the gun out of your pocket.
Doubtful, unless you wear baggy clothes like a sperg. I would advise against this.

>>33601408
Read where he says his hand is in his pocket on his gun. So yes it's really not hard to draw and fire in that time if you practice d&f drills. From his post he is in line so the perp would be within a few feet of him.

>>33599302
We're trying to help you not get yourself killed, you retarded fucking asshole.

If you'd rather not take the advice by people here who actually carry, taken classes, and have had to draw, by all means, be a fucking idiot with a weapon and get yourself hurt or killed.

>>33601402
He can carry empty all he wants. But he's acting like it's dangerous to carry with one in the chamber and spouting other bs.

>>33601463
>he's acting like it's dangerous to carry with one in the chamber and spouting other bs.
I have repeated over and over and over again that I personally would prefer a slight reduction in my combat effectiveness in return for significant safety gains.

I never once judged the merits of carrying with one in the pipe, and even repeated many times that I would carry with one in the chamber too if the situation warranted it, or simply for assessment. The first time I said this was 7 fucking hours ago.

You people are fucking retarded.

>>33601462
I tend to do the opposite of what spergs with zero reading comprehension try to tell me.

>>33601535
>in return for significant safety gains
That's wrong though. It puts you more in danger not having a gun ready to go when you need it.

>>33601590
This. Every cop/fed/shooting instructor/military personnel will tell you to carry with one in the chamber. It's much safer than carrying with an empty chamber. Admit this and we can let this shitty thread die.

>>33601590
>It puts you more in danger not having a gun ready to go when you need it.
I was talking about safety from accidents.
I'll be simply carrying the gun or handling it a lot more than I'll be actually using it in a life-or-death situation. Therefore, accident prevention is way up there on my list of priorities relating to concealed carry.

Way I see it, simply having a firearm on me (even with an empty chamber) is already a significant increase in my defensive capacity compared to not carrying.

And to me, it makes sense to carry proportionally.

I'm now done battering your sensitive minds with my personal opinions.

>>33599930
> If I bend over it starts to print

Thanks for the info.

This is my big fear, especially since I have very young kids. Any chance of a 6' 180lbs person fitting the PPS M2 in a front pants pocket?

>>33601667
>I'm now done battering your sensitive minds with my personal opinions
Seems like you're the one with the sensitive mind here. We've just been disproving your retarded carry method and explaining why it's not smart to do. That's all. You are the one that kept trying to defend it and strawman all our arguments to try to make it seem like your carry method isn't idiotic.
There you go. That's not an opinion. That's fact. Now you have permission to leave my thread. saged

>>33601372
>>33601372
>>33601372
>>33601372
>>33601372

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>mfw I see that OP has been nonstop trolling /k/unts all day and shows no sign of stopping

>>33601705

Probably not? The PPS is small, but not Rohrbaugh size. It'd have to be a pretty big pocket, using the 6 rd mag.

How do you feel about appendix carry?

>>33604315
How comfortable is that working at a desk?

>>33597631

Ppl carry without a round in the chamber? This is why we can't have nice things.

>>33597631
I quit carrying mine after some home ballistics testing. 9/.40/.45 > .32/.380

Also the chances of "accidentally" sweeping/snagging the slide mounted safety off are near as makes no difference, nil.

Also the chances of "accidentally" pulling the trigger in DA are, again, near as makes no difference, nil.

Why would I carry 7+1 of .380 when for the same weight/general dimensions I can carry 8+1 of .45, 10+1 of .40 or 12+1 of 9mm in the M&P Compact.

Also recoil in extended shooting sessions (more than 100 rounds) gets old. It has a bit of bite. An M&P 45 is easier to shoot.

Yes the PPK/S is a very good little gun. But it is no EDC for me.

>>33601820
The facts are not in dispute.
You simply don't like the fact that I personally value everyday safety from accidents to such an extent that I'd compromise some combat effectiveness.

>strawman all your arguments
Name one. Use quotes.

>You try to make it seem like your carry method isn't idiotic.
>There you go. That's not an opinion.
"Idiotic" is literally an expression of opinion.

>>33599737
Picked up the 45 version, thanks.
That's a pretty insane deal considering the rebate. Why did s&w have such a rebate?

>>33605169
>Also the chances of "accidentally" pulling the trigger in DA are, again, near as makes no difference, nil.
I agree 100%.
But knowing that I personally defy all physical logic nearly every day, I fear "nil" translates to "distinctly possible" in my case.

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M A K A R O V
A
K
A
R
O
V

>>33607138
Isn't that chunkier and larger and thicker than a PPK?

>>33607190
yes but it's more powerful, and really is just as easy to carry

>>33606609
>But knowing that I personally defy all physical logic nearly every day, I fear "nil" translates to "distinctly possible" in my case.

So you admit that you'll probably ND even if you carry without one in the chamber anyways?

Well, that's something then.

>>33599439
I just picked up the lcp2 a week ago, and I've never had a gun hurt to shoot more. And I've shot the LCPc before that. I know they widened the grip to make it more comfortable, but it doesn't fit my hand right at all.

>>33607220
>even if you carry without one in the chamber anyways?
No.

Also, I'm thinking more of AD.

>>33600733
The grip length is longer on the shield than the 26, which is a factor. I own both and even with the longer grip, for me the shield conceals much better because of the thinner profile.

I thought that the carry with one in the chamber argument was put to rest 5-10 years ago. Is this high function trolling, or low function autism?

>>33607319
You're making it sound like there's a law in effect on this.

Not coping well with deviations from perceived standards is a tell-tale sign of autism, anon.

>>33607330
Put to rest as in pretty much every authority on the subject recommends carrying with one in the chamber. But it's a free country, if you are retarded enough to think that it's the best move, maybe it's a good idea for you to not have a live weapon within reach.

>>33607351
>muh "everyone else is doing it"
Again, not coping well with deviations from perceived standards is a tell-tale sign of autism, anon.

>maybe it's a good idea for you to not have a live weapon within reach
Here we go again with the "carry chambered or don't carry at all" meme.

Answer this simple thought experiment:

You're under threat, would you rather have:
1) no gun at all

or

2) have a gun with an empty chamber (but full magazine)

If you answered 2), take a second and reflect on how dumb you are for parroting fudd-tier bravado.

>>33607367
Most people don't steer their cars with their feet and work the pedals with their hands...fucking sheep. I'll give you a hint...everybody does it because it's a good idea. Well, since you have nothing to lean on other than name calling, it's obvious that your argument is weak. And yes given absolutely no other choice, it's better to have an empty chamber. But that's a non starter, because nothing other than your own fear and inadequately prevents you from racking that slide and carrying on with your life.

>>33607387
>yes given absolutely no other choice, it's better to have an empty chamber
I accept your correction of your earlier statement.

>you have nothing to lean on other than name calling
Says the guy who accused me of either trolling or autism in his first post.

My argument is well-laid out across the entire thread, but you simply neglected to read it. Which is on you.

I know about the possibility of needing one in the chamber in very specific defense situations, but I am willing to trade combat effectiveness in these very specific situations for a general increase in safety from accidents.

I have witnesses way too many Rube Goldberg, final destination-type situations unfold to trust carrying a chambered gun day in day out.

>>33607404
>I accept your correction of your earlier statement.
>>33607387
That isn't me you fucking aspie. God I wish there were ids on /k/. Your retarded "Pick one of two options that have no relevance and are there only to try to justify my retarded method of carry." I'll say it again. Add in the third option of having a round in the chamber and I'll answer it.

>>33606450
You try to make it seem like your carry method isn't idiotic.
There you go. That's not an opinion.
>"Idiotic" is literally an expression of opinion.
It's the same way that calling someone that fucks a plugged in blender idiotic. It's a fact that what you are doing is idiotic.

>>33608347
>That isn't me you fucking aspie.
Suuuuuuure.
Even if that wasn't you, maybe you should announce that you're not the same person when you butt into a discussion, replying within minutes and are the only other person posting for hours.

>Add in the third option of having a round in the chamber and I'll answer it.
Oh no no no.
People are literally saying "if you don't carry with one in the chamber, it's better not to have guns at all".

I'm not the one who came up with those two options.

>>33608368
Unless you have my actual IQ results, "idiotic" is an opinion.

And if you're calling me an idiot for not carrying chambered, what do you call people who don't carry at all?

>>33608380
>Oh no no no.
>People are literally saying "if you don't carry with one in the chamber, it's better not to have guns at all
Nope. I am saying if you are too afraid of having one in the chamber you shouldn't carry a gun. Big difference.
>And if you're calling me an idiot for not carrying chambered, what do you call people who don't carry at all?
Guns aren't for everyone. I know a lot of people that freeze when in danger and wouldn't be able to pull the trigger and would only endanger their life and others.

>>33608434
>I am saying if you are too afraid of having one in the chamber you shouldn't carry a gun.
So this: >>33607351
>>33607387
was you.

Why were you trying to lie?

Anyway, you are literally telling me having no gun is better for me than carrying a gun with an empty chamber.

Therefore, answer this question:

You're under threat, would you rather have:
1) no gun at all

or

2) have a gun with an empty chamber (but full magazine)

If you answered 2), take a second and reflect on how dumb you are for parroting fudd-tier bravado.

>Guns aren't for everyone.
So what do you call those people?

Apparently I'm a retard for not wanting to carry with a loaded chamber, so people who choose not to carry at all must be mega-hyper-ultra mongo braindead right?

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>>33608460
No you idiot, none of those posts are mine. This is my first time replying to this thread since like 15 hours ago.

>>33608482
Way to show how new you are.

Anyway, you are literally telling me having no gun is better for me than carrying a gun with an empty chamber.

Therefore, answer this question:

You're under threat, would you rather have:
1) no gun at all

or

2) have a gun with an empty chamber (but full magazine)

If you answered 2), take a second and reflect on how dumb you are for parroting fudd-tier bravado.

>>33608460
>Guns aren't for everyone.
>So what do you call those people?
/noguns/, what else? They are actually a step above you because at least they are aware carrying a gun isn't for them. You hold onto the belief that you will be able to chamber a round in any situation and you don't trust yourself to not Nd. So yes. You are better off not carrying.

>>33608494
>They are actually a step above you because at least they are aware carrying a gun isn't for them.

Again you are implying that having no gun at all is better than carrying with an unloaded chamber.

>>33608497
If you're afraid to carry with a round in the chamber, you will be too afraid to even pull a gun in a dangerous life or death situation. Let alone try to chamber a round.

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>>33608516
Cool argument bro. This is what you're reduced to now.

I knew there was a big payoff coming lmao.

>>33608567
How so? You are afraid of in impossible situation where your gun magically goes off in your holster. Imagine how you will react when there is a twitchy nigger aiming a gun at you with his finger on the trigger. I'm glad you finally admit you're a troll though. I knew someone couldn't be that stupid.

>>33608609
Not "magically", accidentally.
And not necessarily in the holster.

And I love how you're trying to use your clairvoyance and telepathy skills to win an internet argument.