If the Chinese can do this easily, how come the Russkies can't?

China has like 10 times the industrial output of Russia and maybe 2 times the industrial output of USA now dude.

>>33565038

China spends 215 billion $ on army. Russia 66.

>>33565058
>industrial output

This doesn't count for much in this discussion because a large amount of that is in cheap goods.

We're talking about high-tech design and manufacturing, and what China's recent advancements in this sector mean for Russia's defense industry dependence on Chinese purchases.

>>33565074
>China spends 215 billion $ on army. Russia 66

So is China now the great relevant "other" in the geopolitical landscape, and Russia's presence shrinking?

>>33565099
Yes it's been this way for a while, except Russia still has a nuclear stockpile like 20x bigger than China.

>>33565038
Russia realizes that 2 modern armies are unlikely to ever square off and stealth is a waste of money.

the face of modern warfare is dropping million dollar bombs on rusted out $800 toyota pickup trucks and unused airports full of obsolete grounded aircraft

>>33565058
>>33565074
There's something a bit sad about this. Has Russia now become just some poorfag country bordering China?

>>33565137
Of course, but as a matter of capability.... are the Chinese now better than the Russians?

If this were anytime in the past, we'd be sitting here laughing to death at the notion of reliable high-tech products from China, but it's now 2017 and it seems as though their R&D is world class no longer a laughing matter.

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>>33565178
yep and thanks to our desire for cheap electronics and the latest fucking phone, we gave them everything they needed to get there.

tell me they didn't build a backdoor into every cellar device made in their country

most of China's tech is stolen from other nations

>>33565244
*reverse-engineered

And this doesn't mean that they haven't gained any valuable tech knowledge from the practice. China's next gen is looking really capable.

>>33565239
They didn't build a backdoor into every cellular device in the country, you autist.

>>33565074
And yet all they can do is copy.
>>33565155
What is sad is that gooks likely won't be able to come up with something genuine on their own even if they had the military budget of the US.

>>33565280
>And this doesn't mean that they haven't gained any valuable tech knowledge from the practice
It does mean that they have no experience in developing anything, being essentially just apes who accidentally managed to get into a sport car.

>>33565341
Im American and i think you're being delusional. An ape that understands physics will learn a lot from disassembling and studying said sports car.

China leads the world in several technological fields. Off the top of my head one of them is graphene, but I am not really sure.

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>>33565038
"reasons"

>>33565365
An ape that learns from disassembling sport cars is many decades behind the people who actually develop these sport cars. Even if these people have less money than a monkey, they still know how to develop them and were doing this for all their lifetime and beyond. An ape on the other hand only know how to disassemble them.

>>33565038
>have we entered the era in which the names Shenyang and Chengdu command more respect than Sukhoi and MiG?

> I mean i'm starting to suspect that we've reached a point where China has overtaken Russia in technological knowhow and has become the next best player in military tech

Holy shit Chinik calm down

>>33565423
....this cant be real
>Fifth gen craft made of cheap welded aluminum bars

This cannot be real

>>33565449
You sound like an insecure Russian

>>33565456
Movie prop, static display model.

The photos can be real yet not show what they're implied to show.

>>33565423
>>33565456
It's a parade float you tard.

The J-20 is build at the CACC factory, not some dudes back yard.

>>33565514
Have you been?

>>33565038
China is basically an authoritarian capitalist system in all but name. While corruption is there, the worst of it is kept in check and officials that let corruption actually start impeding national goals get put down hard. The Chinese may not be particularly good at innovation, but they are good at adapting existing tech to their purposes. And whatever gaps they have in tech can be closed by simply outnumbering their opponents. Russia, but contrast, is riddled with corruption that is all but encouraged by the government. Their aviation industry is also saddled with a distinct lack of customers. Most nations that might but what they are selling either buy western designs or are still flying Cold War Soviet aircraft that were given to them via "MiG diplomacy." Russia needs foreign buyers to advance their aircraft industry. China is its own customer and can fund everything itself.

>>33565514
Bullshit
chinese aircraft factory - says so on sign on wall

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>>33565514
likely story

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>>33565652

>history of the PLA
>beat KMT in civil war
>longest rout of the US military TO DATE
>Conquered Tibet
>Conquered Xinjiang
>developed nukes
>beat India in border skirmish
>Invades Vietnam and pushes until Hanoi gets within artillery range
>corvette and minesweeper fends off a Vietnamese naval taskforce


All that in 50 years. And of course its some dumb retard posting his own pseudo intellectual cherry picked shit, from /pol/ of all places.

>>33565702
kek, those "victories"

Three reasons

>Money
>industrial capacities
>high status of education in the Chinese society

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>>33565038

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>>33565702
>chinks actually bragging about invading vietnam
>an invasion that ended in an incredibly embarrassing defeat for them, despite their massively superior numbers

Christ, at least when Americans do it they preface it with "muh k/d" rather than "at least we made it kind of far before getting our assholes crushed harder than a kid in a Chinese escalator"

>conquered Tibet

you mean incorporating a desperately poor and fledgling state is something to brag about now?

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>>33565038
There sure are a lot of words and good arguments in this thread. It would be a shame of someone were to implode all of them with a simple reminder that the Chinese still can't manufacture their own fighter grade engines, let alone design them.

*reminds

>>33565423
Taiwan Teng, pls.

>>33565821
the chinese are vermin. you may think niggers and arabs are bad, and they are, but the chink has a depravity to it which will make it eat babies if it can help it to show his superior status over others.

>>33565239

Well they likely don't considering the Chips used in apple devices is made in South Korea/Taiwan. The factories in China just do assembly of chips and boards made elsewhere, because Chinese chip fab technology is not competitive.

>According to a report by the Korea Evaluation Institute of Industrial Technology, the average gap with China on 24 key industries like biotechnology and displays was 0.9 years. This means if Korean companies make no effort, China would catch up in that amount of time.

>“China’s improvement of industry is changing the structure of the value chain between Korea and China,” according to Cho Chuel, the director of Chinese industry research at Korea Institute for Industrial Economics & Trade. Rather than the previous vertical structure where Korea made value-added, high technology products, competition will become more equal, and Korea will need to invest more to produce competitive products, he said.

It's not really a question if China can become technolgy leader in pretty much everything but we are at the point where we are only talking about the when.

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>>33565652
>Chinese hasn't win any wars against foreign powers over 400 years
This what /k/ and /pol/ actually believe....

I like it, keep it that way, whatever make you sleep better at night anyway.

>>33565947
tell me more about their domestically manufactured jet engines

>>33566654
>>33565760
>>33565831
This meme is almost obsolete.

Chinese engine technology has caught up in such a short time it's scary, the Russians took almost 30 years to make their RD-33 not dog shit, the Chinese went from making sub-par RD-33 knockoffs too giving RR, P&W, and GE a real competitor in under 15 years.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xian_WS-15

That's their J-20 engine, once it's finished maturity.

The uprated WS-10 is what's in the J-20 prototypes now, which is what powers their J-10B lightweight fighters.

Their newest turbo-fans in the C919 airliner is also using an Chinese made alloy that is outperforming the NxGEN engines so far in tests.

In another 10 years, China = bad engines will be no more.

>>33565099
Since the collapse they won't recover for another 50 years desu

>>33566899
>In another 10 years, China = bad engines will be no more.

In another DECADE, the US might have SSTO spaceplanes, for god's sake.

You're telling me that in 2027, China will have the capabilities the US had in the 80's.

>>33565821
Can you please find me any evidence that the Chinese lost in Vietnam?

Literally every military historian outside China and Vietnam agrees that it was a stalemate. This is a fact.

Sorry to burst your butthurt meme.

>>33565121
Exactly this. Russian economy is basically the same size as Italy's IIRC.

>>33565280
*stolen
Okay, so you learned how to make a bow while looking at bob's bow. Good.
Oh. Now Bob has gun, and he shot you before you could learn it.

Good fucking game fishface

>>33566987
>SSTO spaceplanes
>in a decade

Not gonna happen. But interesting that such vehicles would use scamjet engines, a field where China is top tier.

>>33565432
This.
Chinaman btfo

>>33567144
>But interesting that such vehicles would use scamjet engines, a field where China is top tier.

negroid nobody said they would use scramjet engines

also if china was top tier then where was their SR-71

>>33567144
>Not gonna happen.

ayyyy but people whose parents were literally eating each other are gonna catch up to 60 years of Western jet engines in like two lunar festivals, tops

>>33567082
>stalemate
>china still thinks they dominated.
Calm down Tofu, you should have won but couldn't.

>>33567165
SR-71 doesn't use scramjet engines.

Also why would anyone use the SR-71?

>>33565702
>KMT army aka the only official standing army in modern warfare to defect to enemy ranks on an army level
>barely rout an army literally running into your encirclement (thanks macarthur) due to being unable to close the pocket
>conquered a bunch of unarmed mountainniggers
>beat out a bunch of muslim qing remnants and mongol muslims
>stole nukes from russia and U.S. at the same time
>poo in loo
>advance a shorter distance than the U.S. army into vietnam while applying a force that's approximately ten times greater
>build a literal fucking carrier because claims in southern sea are being beaten back by third world countries still under communist rule
There were some genuinely intriguing massive maneuvers conducted by the PLA by the late 40s on an operational level - principles such as "fight the enemy when they're not ready" were applied on an unready enemy. None of them are relevant in a modern context - their own military exercises repeatedly demonstrate this. This is on top of their antiquated small squad tactics as well as unrealistic strategic expectations as soon as they step out of china proper.

>>33567209
Are you asking why the US chose to build, and develop the SR-71?

>>33567234
>>stole nukes from russia and U.S. at the same time
I MUST KNOW MORE

>>33567241
Your asked why China doesn't have a SR-71.

Mostly for the same reason why the USA doesn't have any SR-71 in any form of service for decades.

Even ignoring the fact you used the SR-71 to reflect from the fact that China is cutting edge in scramjet technologies.

>>33567254
The russian side is obviously more poorly documented (though the records for missile transfers are on wikipedia at this point), but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qian_Xuesen

>>33565038
When you look at it and think, That plane looks funny there is a reason. It has a huge wing area and canards too so induced drag has to be obscene. Then you have the dinky little tail fins compared to other twin tailed aircraft like the F-15, F-18, Mig-29, etc. that makes me wonder about its stability and rudder athority.

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a weapon to surpass the F-35?!

>>33565038
>And while we're at it, how come some major European nations are opting for F35 purchases instead of developing their own next-gen contender?
Because much like NATO it's easier and cheaper to let the US do all the heavy lifting.

>>33565239
Dude, it's a basement. Just fine the chink door and brick it up.

>>33567356
The flying wing concept has been around for decades now and it's not necessary to have a separate tail fin to even control the aircraft.

>>33567082
Could you tell me what it means to be in a stalemate when your objective is to move forward? If you're the aggressor a stalemate is a loss. Vietnam was a loss for the US. Vietnam was an even worse loss for the chinks

>>33567324
>recruit genius chink
>he helps you build rockets and shit
>accuse him of being a communist and kick him out
>he actually turns into a communist and instantly gives the chinks access to missiles and nuclear weapons within only a few years out of spite

kek

>>33567425
It's a win-win. Foreign F-35 orders means higher overall numbers resulting in lower per-plane cost also for the US.

>>33567520
McCarthyism is a hell of a ride.

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>>33565038
>If the World''s #1 economy can do this easily, how come the world's #7 can't?
I dunno, you tell me.

>>33565038

Is that why they are still buying shit abroad? I don't know like let's say Su-35s?

>>33567547
>implying
>/k/ in charges of economics

tbqh what China (and Russia as well) really lack is material science.

You can have the smartest engineers in the world but if you can't have decent alloys to work with, and quality control, it's still gonna be garbage

>>33568817
Why can't they just steal the science from Euros?

>>33565083

China might become independent, but I expect India and Russia's Middle Eastern allies to remain major buyers of Russian weaponry

The funny thing is that high end manufacturing is starting to move back west with the increasing advent of automated manufacturing. Can get non shit chink quality without cost of transport, and robots are extremely good workers. Very curious to see what happens to the Chinese economy when automation really kicks in

>>33566899

>It is intended to power the Chengdu J-20 fighter,[1] which would be able to achieve supercruise.

>Intended

But insufficient and not able

>would be able
(?)

Would be able... but its not able so.....

>>33565083
>a large amount of that is in cheap goods.
that are cheap in large part due to currency manipulation

the words "china" and "fair trade" dont go together. I'd tariff the living fuck out of steel if i was making america great again.

>>33568952
They have the science, it's just that nobody wants to put in the effort and time and money to actually make high quality steel and alloys when you can just make a pallet of shit quality steel with the top plate up to spec and scam the fuck out of the people.

>>33566899
>>33566987
Honestly, I'm not very qualified to judge how close the Chinese are to making an engine that prove they can work on the edge of aviation technology, and so will keep a "believe it when I see it" attitude. However, looking at the type of research the US is doing and the stuff Russia is already making, I'm a little skeptical about China being able to completely catch up, or come up with some technology that will circumvent established aviation technology any time soon.

>>33565038
The chinese can't even build their own jet engines, the russians still have to do it for them

>>33569058
India is also advancing rapidly in indigenous tech

>>33565038
Im so sick of these fucking shitpost threads every fuckingday. F-35, vatnik, 50cent imposters. fuck all you cunts

>>33571003
.........what? Its just a discussion of military tech dude.

>>33570974

I hear they've almost progressed to toilets now.

>>33570974
India isn't going to go anywhere because they will be destroyed by muslims killing all the hindus.

Cultural bias or something like that.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/07/business/china-defense-start-ups-pentagon-technology.html?_r=0

Of course China will catch or overtake in fields with more frequent breakthrough developements which render old stuff obsolete faster than in fields where there are mostly only little steps and improvements.

>>33565038
>how come some major European nations are opting for F35 purchases instead of developing their own next-gen contender?
What's the point if it's going to cost a shitload due to the small number of units produced and perform worse?

>>33565038
Absolutely, you can bet America spends a lot of time and money making sure they have plans ready for any sort of chinese attack.

Americans have a hard-on for planning every possibility and preparing contingency plans

>>33565038
>If the Chinese can do this easily, how come the Russkies can't?

Mainly because Russia doesn't have an economy that's anywhere close to China's. Russia is on the verge of becoming a failed state.

>>33572960
And then throwing the plans away because reality is a bitch.

>>33565652

>WW3 hits the fan
>China unleashes his own nuke trains
>lobs a couple of missiles towards Italy
>Mafia Intelligence shows that their targets are not military installations
>Meanwhile at Naples they have already stolen one of those nukes and proceed to open it to resell parts for scraps
>300 screaming chinks with space suits broke through a small inspection door installed in the body
>slaughters the napulè
>a war breaks inside Naples
>Vesuvio goes Hollywood
>Stromboli too
>Etna coughs and implodes
>Italy is no more
>WW3 ends as the other nations have already dealt with space chinks
>World economy collapses cause no more chinks
>Best Korea starts to unleash their nukes
>America lobs some Patriots at them but half of them miss and lands in Syria
>Putin goes full zarodinu
>'mmmmurica is no more
>Best Korea has left the building
>everyone's squatting and drinking vodka
>alien faces when

>>33574221
abundant kek
>>33572982
When will this meme die? Russia isnt in that poor an economic condition.

>>33572692
Eurofighter Typhoons though......

>>33565099
Welcome to 2000, the next few years are gonna be rough.

>>33567413
And J31 is a weapon to surpass the Super Tucano, right?

>>33569394
Do you have that screencap? I need to save it.

>>33574356
prime example

Remember when Trump wanted to show China who is the boss in the world?

I think we are all forgetting the part where China stole literally all of the data on the f-35. This gives them a massive leg up.

Secondly, China has a defined role for the j-20 and they aren't beating around the bush trying to make it perfect. It's a frontal stealth maritime striker, meant to take out tankers, surface targets and other vulnerable assets that the US could deploy in or over the ocean.

>>33574640
>I have no idea what I'm talking

>>33574585

Its pretty obvious Kushner, Ivanka and all of the corporate heads he appointed as ministers and the CEOs he met after his inaugaration have told him that a partnership with China is going to be far far more profitable for them than anything relation with Russia, so he's changed his tact.


That and the fact that Mattis hisself has said Russia is the biggest threat to America and Europe, not China

>>33574777
It's blood money, though. China is an ethically unsound country.

>>33565038
The Euros are buying F-35's for the same reason that they bought F-16's 40 years ago.

>>33565466
This

>>33574867
Who fucking cares?

China is unethical, that is why they are doing so will. Because the Neo-Confucian Chinese elite is willing to do what ever it takes.

>>33574867
And is America which doesn't believe in climate change but in clean coal.

>>33574943
America has more nuclear and solar power plants than anyone else.

>>33567657
Only after you tell me why you would post that retarded chart

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>>33574448

Nothing can surpass the Super Tucano.

Russians are poor as fuck. They can't afford anything good in quantity.

>>33569274
Obama already did:
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/26/us-hits-china-and-others-with-more-steep-steel-duties.html

>>33574448

Thats what its marketed as

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Has any chink autism in the last two years topped My Scenario Stands?

>>33575055
What's wrong with it? Its GDP in terms of PPP

>>33569394
This is the correct answer. They're culturally incapable of the type of honesty and top-to-bottom rigor that is required to produce materials required for 5th generations and beyond engines.

>>33565760
The thumbnail pic makes it look like Johnny 5

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>>33574480
got you senpai

>>33577716
Holy fucking excellent read

>>33577716
I kek every time. Must have post in every chicom thread.