Top kek

can somebody please explain to me the "universal background checks meme"

you LITERALLY get a background check when you buy a gun.

>be me
>walk into gun store
>want gun
>fill out form and they run background check
>?????????????/

>>32995100
Its a gun registry. The only way to enforce people not being able to trade guns for cash is a registry and effectively a tax on all sales

Universal background check means private sale ban, registry, and tax

>>32995123
>registry
dont tell me these jews want to make a list of all gun owners

>>32995123
>its a gun registry
except that's not how it works unless of course they specifically spell out that a registry must be created.

>>32995100
>universal
They want to effectively outlaw the process of private sales to require that you go to an FFL and do a 4473. And probably pay a transfer fee and some "gun safety" tax

>>32995159
how do you enforce no private sales without a registry?

Also you would have the records of all the 4473s which by the way the ATF was illegally recording electronically under Obama and no one stopped them. And if you don't think thats the next step fuckers like John Oliver complained on his show that the ATF only has paper copies and we really should go digital so thats the next thing the libs are gunna push.


tl;dr to enforce it you need a registry and even without one libs are gunna demand ATF can keep your 4473 digitally forever

>>32995159
It's totally not a registry, guys! It's only the one thing they have to implement before they even get to that part! Shhhhh go back to sleep...

>>32995191
What's the difference between physical and digital? One just takes up less physical space

>>32995446
Digital records are way easier to search

>>32995159
requiring manufacturers to serialize and preventing the obliteration of serials is a registry in being
requiring dealers to retain A&D and 4473s is a registry in fact

>>32995446
The former can be used to stoke the ovens before we put you in.

>>32995446
Would you rather the ATF has to search thousands of books that can become damaged in fire, floods, by time ect with no real good search feature.

Or the ATF Can just google what guns you have?

>>32995446
One is a pain in the ass to search in

>>32994971
I've heard that Alaska did this with machine guns. Don't quote me on that when the ATF shows up though.

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>>32995476
>>32995630
>inb4 the ATF adopts "paper records" and starts running them through tabulating machines

>>32995138
>implying they haven't already

>>32996011
prohibited by FOPA

>>32996373
Specifically punch cards, or any sort of machine readable paper records? Could they do it optically like a specialized sort of scantron?

>>32995975
Yeah, and Montana with suppressors.
Basically if it doesn't leave Alaska or Montana respectively they're legal as far as state police are concerned. County or city police SHOULD obey it as well, but... that's your ass you're gambling with, and feds would flat out ignore it and shoot your dog.

>>32996437
If I were living in bear country, I think I might take the risk in Alaska. Probably more bears than ATF agents up there anyway.

>>32996481
A lot of bears are working for the government nowadays because of habitat destruction

Be careful out there

>>32996011
IIRC most of their records are on microfilm

>>32996496
>make illegal machine gun
>ATF bear eats your dog

>>32996404
The ability to tokenize hand writing into text from a scanned image has been around for ages.

>>32996580
Joke's on them, I can't even read my own handwriting.

>>32996011

>running them through tabulating machines

This part is specifically against the law.

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>>32994971
>Breitbart

http://www.gq.com/story/inside-federal-bureau-of-way-too-many-guns

I used to cuss the "letter of the law" kinda problems but it also works the other way.

>>32995191
>>32995446
You retards don't deserve to post here.

>Massive government agency should use ONLY paper for filing simple paperwork and NOT computers because I'm worried they'll have my name
>Want a law enforcement agency not able to quickly ID somebody who is raping and killing cutie 3.14's using a gun through sales records
>Said while posting online using his cellphone after searching "4chan.com" in Google

>>32996834
ATF shouldn't have any records of any guns bought by anyone ever

>>32996845
>Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms
>Shouldn't have records related to Firearms

I suppose the DMV shouldn't have driving records or courts shouldn't have court records either.

Fucking retard.

>>32996834
Unless he's been leaving the gun at each crime scene and buying the gun from a gun store using his real identity, you're dumb.

In fact, you're just dumb. Kill yourself.

>>32996834
>law enforcement agency quickly ID somebody who is raping and killing cutie 3.14's using a gun through sales records
Things which have never happened are not an argument.

>>32996011

Oh look proof the holohoax didnt happen

>>32996868
>Fucking retard.
no. shal not be infringed. all the ATF's dealings with guns are illegal. the ATF is breaking the law, not us. SNS or t-72, they have no right to tell you what you can and can't own.

>>32996834
>Ive never heard of stolen guns
>The law is never ever wrong
>LEOs are emotionless robots who could never abuse nearly god-like power
>The government is mostly good and will do the right thing

Alrighty then.

>>32996893
Oy vey goy the Nazis ran my grandfather through an IBM machine and punched 6,000,000 holes through him.

>>32996879
Go buy a gun, kill someone, then toss it. I'm sure you'll get a visit once the ATF goes through those files...probably 9 months later.

If you think the ATF shouldn't keep electronic records and THEN complain about slow NFA turnaround your also a fucking idiot.

>>32996900
Records in NO way undermine (infringe) your right to buy or own a gun unless you are already prevented by law.

>>32996905
Found the Sovereign Citizen. You forgot to ask if you were being detained.

>>32996868
>I suppose the DMV shouldn't have driving records or courts shouldn't have court records either.

Sounds good

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>>32996928
>he thinks people use guns they bought from an FFL to commit homicides

>>32996868
Does it say in the Constitution that the right to drive shall not be infringed? Doesn't seem like a very good argument.

>>32996868
What part of shal not be infringed do you not understand?
Retard

>>32996928
>If you think the ATF shouldn't keep electronic records and THEN complain about slow NFA turnaround your also a fucking idiot.
Not an argument.

>>32996928
>Records in NO way undermine (infringe) your right to buy or own a gun unless you are already prevented by law.

lok up the meaning of the word infringe dude. you may be surprised....

>>32996928
The NFA shouldn't exist

That's my main issue with it. Not turnaround times.

>>32996928
>I have no counterpoint to the American ideal of questioning the morals of government
>I know! I'll call him a sovereign citizen! Then I'll make a joke about it!

>>32996928
Im not going to take the time to point out how many ways yoy are so awfully wrong.
But suffice it to say you're a fucking idiot and you're agument is libtard logic and libtard lies

>>32996936
Third world country tier. Imbecile.

>>32996946
They do. Regularly. GTFO /pol/.

>>32996952
>>32996954
>>32996965
Records in no way infringes on your right to own a firearm. None. Zero. If you think it does then explain HOW or your argument is void.

>>32996962
It is tho.

>>32996971
Tough shit. It is.

>>32996990
Yeah. You definitely are one. I'm surprised you backwoods retards use the internet. I thought most sovereign citizens were anti-technology too. Guess I learned something today.

>>32996992
>calls me an idiot without refuting point
>and say's I'M the one using liberal logic
Kek. You aren't fooling anybody.

>>32997025
>all these replies yet still no arguments
Sad.

>>32997025
Liberal gets on the internet, gets shrek'd, resorts to retardation! Many such cases! Sad!

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>>32996834

>Using gun sale record to identify rapist

>>32997025
Registration leads to confiscation

Always

End of discussion

>>32995138
The atf got caught with a defacto gun registry a while back.

They were collecting a registry of gun owners via holding on to purchase information.

According to them they simply "forgot" to delete all of the millions of purchase records and the personal information of the buyers. For two decades.

>>32997025
Oh look California and NYC start using their "universal" background checks to start infringing on people they SWORE they were never going to infringe upon by confiscating the guns the suckers in good faith registered. Get fuckt liberal

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2013/12/05/gun-confiscation-underway-in-new-york-n1758137

oh you own a gun we dont like suddenly? we'll make it illegal for you to own it...

>>32997025
>Records in no way infringes on your right to own a firearm. None. Zero. If you think it does then explain HOW or your argument is void.


It's not that the keeping the records explicitly is an infringement, it's that not keeping them stands in the way of the government if they wanted to infringe on my right to own a gun. Administrations change like the wind, there is no guarantee that down the road it couldn't be used maliciously.

Look at the the concern amongst the Democrats about the list of illegal immigrants from Obama's Dreamer act, or the De-facto Muslim registry created by the National Security Entry-Exit registration system that the Obama administration quickly disposed of before Trump came into office. In both of these scenarios, there was a registry of persons that the old administration did nothing about, but could be affected if the new administration decided to do something wit. For all we know, Elizabeth Warren could be the next president, and all of a sudden "Assualt Weapon" owners are public enemy number one, I'd rather just not have the list exist in all three cases so if they do something they really have to have consensus to go through with it.

>>32996990
Questioning government?

This is America, we shoot the government and ask questions later

>>32997025
>Records in no way infringes on your right to own a firearm. None. Zero. If you think it does then explain HOW or your argument is void.
IN CALIFORNIA, NEW YORK, and MASSACHUSETTS,
guns are being banned the fuck out through make and model.

If the government has records of the specific guns you own, when legislators start banning shit, you'll either have to give up your guns or they'll arrest you for not surrendering them when they have a record of you owning banned shit.

>>32997025
>Records in no way infringes on your right to own a firearm. None. Zero. If you think it does then explain HOW or your argument is void.


Im pretty sure the nazis used a registry and computers to genocide the jews.

I am pretty sure if Obama had a registry he would try to genocide the gun owners

>>32997025
>Records in no way infringes on your right to own a firearm.
>Refuse to provide your personal information when buying gun
>can't buy gun

>>32995123
the part that pisses me off is the part about the tax because the ffl is providing a service of a transfer and is not the one selling the gun. The ffl however does have the right to charge a transfer fee and the state has the right to tax that as a service but in my opinion you should not have to pay tax on something that is being sold privately, also people below 21 are having their rights abridged because an ffl is not going to transfer a pistol or stripped lower to someone under 21 because simply they cant where before an 18 year old could legally buy a pistol from a private source.

>>32995516
Hearty KEK. You get it.

Here's how thing with paper records works
>We just passed a law making X scary salt rifle illegal
>now all we have to do is simply sort through the entire massive stacks of paper that are organized by date/name/manufacturer or whatever it is to find every single person who bought X and send the black vans to his house

Compared to
>SELECT name, address
>FROM gun_owners
>WHERE gun='X'
>ORDER BY privilege_score DESC;

Its about limiting the power of information.

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>>32994971
>Breitbart

>>32996868

no constitutional right to drive

>>32995446
One can be searched in an instant, can be data mined, have analytics run against it and lost to the Chinese. The other is a bear to use.

>>32995159
>warehouse full of paperwork that links serial numbers to purchasers

How is that anything BUT a registry?

I really want to hear your attempt at an explanation.

>breitbart
>fake newz: the site

>>32997630
>records in no way infringe on your right to own a firearm
>refuse to purchase firearm with serialized government printed bills
>can't buy gun

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>>32996627
>>33000914
>I..I...I'm with her

>>32995201

>a conspiracy is true if it proves my point

>>32994971
I hope my county will make a resolution. tho my sheriff has already stated enforcing the new gun laws wouldn't be a priority.

>>32996928
>I'm sure you'll get a visit

Only if it's found, and somehow linked to the shooting. CSI Miami isn't real life.

>>32997025
in·fringe
inˈfrinj/
verb
actively break the terms of (a law, agreement, etc.).
"making an unauthorized copy would infringe copyright"
synonyms: contravene, violate, transgress, break, breach; More
act so as to limit or undermine (something); encroach on.
"his legal rights were being infringed"
synonyms:

>>32995100
Universal bgc means no private sales without a background check. The only way to enforce that is with a registry.

>>32997025
>They do. Regularly.

Sources and statistics, pls.

>>33004767
>California didn't have a long gun registry in the 90s
>They didn't use it for confiscation shortly after
Man, what timeline are you in?

>>33004969
He has none because even the ATF admits sales records and 4473s have always been utterly useless for investigating crimes and none are ever solved due to them.

>>32997491
>computers

Dude. I know you're trying to help, but please don't. We got this.

>>33000914
>>32996627
>F-f-FAKE NEWS!!! DRUMPFKINS!!!
I've said it to dozens at this point. Though accompanied by a slanted editorial news stories from Breitbart are sourced with original publication cited in the editorial. Breitbart is the right-wing CNN.

>>33003197
Those serialized bills aren't connected to your name. There's no explicit record of when they change hands.

>>33003197
>implying barter systems don't exist for private sales
Tons of people get guns as payment for services rendered.

>>33005007
Yes, you and I know that, I want to see what kind of creative writing from what Alt Left website he dumps out for us to laugh at.

I like it when these trolls show up. They're good practice for when it matters.

>>32995123
>registry

uh-oh.. thst's the first step.

>>32996952
Well you have a freedom of movement, and it could be argued that automobiles are a vital form of transportation in the modern world. Meaning that the government impeding or restricting your access to a vehicle could be considered unconstitutional.

However that's not nearly as cut and dry as "shall not be infringed"

>>32996437
Montanan here. Good fucking luck with that shit.
BATFE took a big shit on the Montana Firearms Freedom Act. When people sued it got overturned in federal court.
That was 7 years ago. Quit parroting shit you heard on the internet as if it was valid legal advice. You're gonna get some sovereign citizen dipshit's dog shot.
A bunch of states introduced similar legistlation and the same thing happened.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montana_Firearms_Freedom_Act

>>33004753
>>33005029
>Breitbart is the right-wing CNN.
Fox News is the right-wing CNN. Breitbart is the right-wing Huffington Post.
I'm not a liberal. You're fucking retarded.

>>32996834
Implying the first thing a criminal does when he gets a hot gun isn't file off the serial number. What good is your gun registry then? Where is your god? Give me a logical response? Stupid ass backwards ignorant pussy bootlicking brownnosing senseless registry wanting grandma fucking nazi.

>>32996928
They do faggot, I can't just give carl 1k gir his ok luger collectible without going to an ffl doing all kinds of extra bullshit and most importantly paying fees and making sure the gov gets its cut.

Whereas today I can show my ccl give money walk away with a new heirloom in a private sale.

>>33005012
IBM invented the computer to kill jews