Is 9mm really this pathetic?

Modern hot 9mm loads are the tits. Not gimmick rounds, but nice Speer Gold Dot or Critical Duty.

I've found most 10mm guns to be really temperamental as to what ammo they shoot well.

>>32954875
Do you seriously believe shit because it's in a meme?

Did you neglect to remember that 9mm has been around, and in military service, since 1902, with significantly shitter ammunition than what is available today?

>>32954875
Just pack some hot-loaded or +P 9mm hollow points.

>>32954903
Hornady makes shit pistol ammo.

>joyreactor.com
It's nowhere near as shitty as wherever you pulled that image, Opie.

>>32954875
You really need 45-70 govt for your CC pistol

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.22 bullets kill people so it is utterly stupid to think a 9mm can't.

That said...some loads can stop someone in their tracks from kinetic forces which may be desirable. A 9mm might not do that...but he's still going down at some point.

I still swear by the M9 pistol. Fuck everyone.

>>32954875
If you shoot somebody with 9mm, and they happen to notice, they will be really angry.

>>32954875
Shut up.
You're stupid.
Go away.

Jesus fucking hell...

>>32955024
>don't ask questions
>buy 9mm
>stfuuuu

did you seriously have to make this thread

>>32955008
This is reasonable
Although if you happen to shoot them more than once other people (potential jurors) will be even angrier that you used a high capacity militaryassaultstyled murder spree weapon with children-heat-seeking-missile bullets that expand big enough to make a baby evaporate on impact.

>>32954875
DELETE THIS

>>32954875
there's only one way to find out, and your leg isn't going to like it

>>32955332
Found the glock fanboy

>>32954875
Honestly, you are better off throwing the pistol at somebody than annoying them by shooting them with it.

>>32954875
is this a cuck thread?

>>32955454
Are you a cuck by replying to it?

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>>32954875
Here you go. 9mm killed a grizzly. From the buffalo bore website, guy used hard-cast 147 gn bullets.

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>>32955483
I also have anecdotal evidence.

>>32955454
>>32955459
cuck thread confirmed

>>32955483
Bears (and majority of mammals) have different anatomy than humans.

Ability to penetrate bear "broadside" doesn't translate to being effective against humans.

That said, I don't think 9mm is insufficent. What matters is shot placement and basic levels of penetration.
And by that metric even .32 would suffice.

>>32954903
Ive shot MOST 10mm handguns, everything from Glocks to EAAs to Remingtons and have never had any problem getting the gun to cycle ammo whether its cheap junk or heavy +P. They will all shoot just as good if not better than any other gun, if they are quality

>>32954875
All pistol rounds are weak

>>32957332
Some are weaker than others, and they do provide some marginal differences in wounding as per the Macpherson Wound Trauma Index.

Hence why we don't carry 22lr.

>>32954903
>1 extra millimeter
literally no difference between 9mm and 10mm

>>32954875
That picture is taken from a show called Heroes, I'd say anything at or above 9mm is a good place to stand that ground

>>32957416
1 extra millimeter, and as many as 100 more grains and 250 ft lbs.

Cuk thred confirm

>>32954875
Anything smaller than 20mm is bitch ass pussy shit

.22 LR, 9mm, .38 special, .380 ACP all kill people just fine.

I'd rather not be shot at all but if I got hit center mass I'd rather be hit by a 9mm instead of a .44 magnum.

However the person shooting the 9mm probably has multiple rounds left to put in me while the guy carrying the .44 magnum only has a few shots left.

Fuck sake, /k/ used to be pretty difficult to troll, now it's full of noguns autists who keep shitposting and memeing garbage.

>>32959904
>ft lbs
So being tacked by a football player should be about 3 times deadlier than getting hit with 10mm? After all that's over two million grains going a whopping twenty feet per second.
Fucking retard.

9mm has been the standard military pistol and subgun round for up to 100 years in some cases. It's fine you stupid fuck.

Hell, .32acp was a common police and officer's caliber through WW2 too. Now people act like it'll bounce off your forehead. Some chick capped a dindu who broke into her place with a Kel-Tec P32 last year.

>>32954875
.50BMG is the gold standard for killing people.

>>32960035
To be fair, clothing today are probably thicker and stronger.

>>32960006
I don't think you understand how distribution of energy works

>>32960106
>thicker
This is determined more by where you are in the world and what season it is than anything else.
>stronger
What exactly makes you think fabric has gotten stronger? When designing a jacket people don't typically consider ballistic protection.

>>32960125
I don't think you understand that "foot pounds" is just a slightly more educated way of saying "stopping power" and a worthless argument is the world of ballistics.

>>32954875
9mm is great for self defense, cops kills feral urban apes all the time with it. Choose the right load.

>>32960106

Not sure about that. Winter clothing in the old days used to be a zillion layers of wool felt, not superfleece2000.

>>32954875
You're tarded.

>>32954996
You're tarded.

>>32956363
while they are technically correct about them having anatomical differences what your implying there is tarded.

>>32957389
You're probably tarded.

>>32959971
You actually seem like you may not eat lead paint chips in your free time... you might wanna leave this board.

>>32954996
m9 always was and always will be shit

long may the P320 reign

Think 9mm isn't effective? Let me shoot you with one then.

>>32954875
>Asking if 9mm is "harmless"
> comparing it to .22lr

Troll thread confirmed.

>>32960082
and engine blocks

>>32954875
Handgun rounds suck for killing things in a timely manner unless you hit the CNS in the no response zone. Technically speaking an aggressor can stay in the fight for atleast ~4s before being rendered unconscious by hypovolemia(this is assuming a perfect shot where you sever the aorta and heart). The vast majority of people decide to stop after being shot, or are so overcome by fear/pain that they do so without consciously deciding to. If you want to put something down in a hurry your best bets gonna be an intermediate rifle round or shotgun. a huge jump in terminal performance occurs at this point, although its still true that such weapons will not kill an attacker immediately, merely cause such trauma as to better persuade them to stop. medical professionals cant even tell the difference between wounds from a .45acp and 9mm firearm. not even gonna get into remote or radial wounding effects because facklerite faggots go full autist when you point out that theres a case for energy sometimes actually playing a role in wounding effects under some circumstances. besides, that shits gypsy magic involving planetary alignments and shit, AKA not the kinda thing to bet your life on.

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>>32954875

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>>32960720

>>32954875
get a glock 29. i own a m9, g17, p07, g20 and i'm telling you just get the 10mm.

>>32960131
bullshit. you can legally hunt deer with a 10mm and not a 9mm or 45 for a reason, fud stain.

>>32960807
>gun laws
>making sense

>>32960126
holy shit this thread is full of fucking morons and trolls trolling each other

>>32954939
Debatable

>>32961123
IMHO Hornady makes meh pistol ammo. Both of their major lines offer less expansion than other manufacturers of SD ammo while claiming that their polymer tips provide benefit without much substantiation. one of their lines does offer deeper than average penetration so i could certainly see some reasons for going with that due to personal predilections in some situations. That being said i cant really think of a situation in which they'd objectively do better than their competitorsfor a single specific use except perhaps for a hybrid woods/street load meant to offer better deeper penetration on light skinned medium sized game while probably not over penetrating two foot.

>>32961081
If you weren't such an insta-sperg, you would look at the ballistics of each round and find out why you're fucking retarded.

10mm is more similar to .357 magnum than 9mm. It comes with a heavier grain load on top of being a larger bullet, and hilariously outdoes both .45 and 9mm on ballistics tests.

>>32961763
10mm is actually more in between .357 mag and .44 mag lol. furthermore, hunting regulations vary wildly by state and many simply specify bullet diameter. EX. in some stats with a <.22 round minimum its illegal to hunt with 5.56mm but legal with 9mm.

>>32961622
Thoughts on Buffalo Bore and Underwood pistol ammo?

>>32961763
also, do you really mean to defend the usage of solely ft-lbs as a means of determining the effectiveness of handgun rounds? Thats just a measure of energy and doesnt tell you shit about how it actually behaves in any media...

>>32962060
>10mm is actually more in between .357 mag and .44 mag

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/357mag.htmlhttp://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/10mm.html
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/44mag.html

Take a look at the muzzle energy graphs. 10mm is equal/slightly weaker depending on loading to .357 Magnum when fired out of a barrel of the same length and far weaker than .44 Magnum when fired out of a barrel of the same length.

>>32962068
Underwood has some interesting +p+ loads which have various niches depending on weight and bullet type. they're products are particularly useful if you seek extreme performance from a round in any specific category and are willing to sacrifice in others. Ex great penetration with no expansion or great expansion at the cost of penetration or greater likelyhood of core jacket separation. In general they have a good rep and id use them in certain unusual circumstances. buffalo bore on the other hand has a little bit of a murkier reputation and supposedly inflates velocity/energy sometimes. I trust them a little less and would be more inclined to go with underwood...

>>32962085
>>32962060
I'm not the anon you were previously talking to

>>32962113
This is why I didn't compare it to .44 mag; because I actually visited this first.

>>32962113
Was talking more terminal effect wise but if youre an energy fag then id point out that by your own reasoning out of a 4" barrel the 135gr pow'r'ball is clearly the superior game(by about 33%) round than the .357 loadings because it has more energy than any other 10mm or .357 loads...

>>32962134
Ah.

Was asking because Hornady, Underwood and Buffalo Bore are the only ones making 9x18 defensive loads.

>>32957416
found the poser

>>32960006
>tacked by a football player
hundreds of square cm area
>getting hit with 10mm
less than one square cm area
Lrn2pressure fgt pls

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>>32957416
>>32959904

Meh it really comes down to the Case Length. 19mm vs 25mm case is a big difference.

The reason why is because in terms of capacity you've got about 3mm wasted on the back end because of case webbing and primer. The above difference is abit more like comparing 16mm vs 22mm length.

If you had a 9mm with a 25mm case, even if it wasnt necked down you'd be able to push heavier rounds (more capacity for then) or put more power into one.

Make it 28mm long (like the five seven) and its probably gonna hit like a 10mm does.

>>32961763
45 case capacity is lower and usually its not even full. You've also got to have the bullet seated deeper to hold it snugly.

>>32962348
most of those rounds tend to penetrate similarly, about 10 or 11" atleast in BG. Personally I'd go for the hornady FTX for greater availability.

>>32955483
You call that a bear? That's a large dog you jackass.

>>32954939
>hornady
>shit
I remember my first gun

>>32964317
He's right though, their loads are low power, minimal diameter garbage.

http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/

>>32960126
>When designing a jacket people don't typically consider ballistic protection.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQM6zLiSn1E

>>32960035
>.32acp was a common police and officer's caliber through WW2 too

It was used by police because it was considered less leathal than 9mm/.380 caliber.

Also we are talking about non-frontline officers.

I'am not saying it ineffective, my great-great-grandfather capped 3 guys in the trenches with some cheap Eibar .32.

>>32955483
Why is the bear biting a stick?