Flee or respond to active shooter?

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>>32826211
I get the fuck out of there because stopping a shooter is the job of the police.

I carry for when me and mine are directly and immediately threatened. If the shooter is in the same store as me, I'm going to shoot, but I'm not going to charge in and play hero, that would only lead to reports of multiple shooters and the possibility of getting mistakenly gunned down by cops.

>>32826211
>be me
>hear shooting and see people running
>oh god im getting that feeling
>theregoesmyhero.mp3
>start to run into mall
>unholster my gun
>fire off 2 .38 shot at him
>get shot with ak
>we both die
>realhumanbeing.exe

imagine this scene also https://youtu.be/vp94AFms0V0?t=1m33s

>>32826211

Run/drive like hell. The purpose of ccw is a last ditch self defense, not to play hero.

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You
>are not law enforcement
>have no fucking idea what is going on and who is the shooter or where he is
>have a family to go back to
>may be mistaken for a shooter by law enforcement
>may get shot and killed

I'm at my car and not any immediate danger so I get the fuck out, that's what I do. But this is /k/ so disregard a rational course of action I TAKE OUT MY CONDOR PLATE CARRIER OUT OF MY TRUNK, THROW MY CCW SASH ON AND GET OUT MY SKS TO FIND THE SHOOTER YEAH!

>>32826211
Get in my car and drive the fuck out of there.
I don't need to be some hero, I'm not a cop, just a guy.

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>>32826308
>>32826306
>>32826286
>>32826258
OP here - that's sort of what I expected but I was curious.
Would your response change if the shots were coming from a children's daycare across the street?

>>32826425
no
and your use of children to emptionally muddle the situation is despicable

call 911, get out of dodge

>>32826211
flee. If you seek an active shooter, you'll be charged with vigilantism

>>32826425
No.

Pull on heartstrings all you want, the ideas would stay the same. Such a thing would be even worse as the kids would play witness as well, and are likely to just say that you were a guy with a gun VS someone who tried to help the situation.

It's more reason for the cops to shoot you, and likely that you could end up seeing a child as a shield.

>>32826425
Are you from buzzfeed writing about how the 'alt right' wants to find excuses to shoot people or something?

>Liberals hear loud bangs, run outside screaming
>fight instincts kick in, run in armed and start clearing hallways and corners
>run into cop, get tased in nutsack
>it was just party balloons popping
>charged with causing terror to public and assault

Yeah, I'm getting in my fucking car and leaving unless I left somebody inside. It takes an errant fart to set of mass hysteria in America these days. If they come out into the parking lot that's another story and I'm shooting them in self-defense when they're pointed away from me.

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Unless I'm being directly threatened, fuck them, they asked for this.

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>>32826440
>>32826475
Fair point.

>>32826476
No, I'm not a journalist. I'm a Canadian gun owner and we just had a shooting yesterday in Quebec. Non-LEOs are not allowed to carry firearms in Canada so there's basically no good-guy-with-a-gun possibility here.

However, last year when the Moncton shooter blasted a few cops and was wandering around people's back yards looking for cover I got in a debate with some friends about the appropriateness of firing on an active shooter as a civilian.

Although I don't live in Moncton my city is nearby and very similar in a lot of ways, in that there are lots of single family homes where people own long guns.

At that time I thought that I would barricade myself in my house and ready my weapons. The debate was about whether it was ethical (legality aside) to shoot a known cop-killer as he stood unaware in your backyard.

If you see an agent you do what we do. You run, you run your ass off.

However if your running leads you to a corner because you don't know egress routes, fight. After fight laydown, place hands upon head, comply with all orders given.

Worst case scenario, I'd hang around to provide medical aid from the kit I carry in my car.

>>32826211
I leave. I have no duty or obligation to protect white peoples.

>>32826711
what if the shooting is in a mosque

>>32826211
>As an armed citizen, do you respond or wait for law enforcement?
I get out of the parking while I can.

>>32826717
Wait for the police to show up, surely they have all the answers.

>>32826711
People like you are the reason things will never get better.

>be me at mall
>just bought delicious beef jerky
>hear gun shots in the mall
>think nothing of it
>go home eat beef jerky, jerk off and got to sleep

>>32826641
Concealed firearms are there for YOUR protection, not the protection of anyone else. Though if you happened to be targeted next to other people it could easily work in their favor as well.

In general, there is no training or obligation to go and engage in a gunfight with a shooter, although some people do in fact do this and have been successful--while others not quite as much.

A story about two meth-head white people shooting inside a walmart comes to mind, a CCer wounded one of them, was killed, and they committed suicide when the police closed in on them.

Other carriers have been more effective, but when it's a handgun vs a rifle it's really an uphill battle.

I don't carry but even I know that in an active shooter situation, you should always try to flee. Fight if you have to, but running should always be the preferred option.

>>32826717
He would be the shooter.

>>32826750
>people like you
I'd bet money he's just a white teenage troll. His plan is perfect because everyone is glad when he leaves the building.

>>32826475
Oh man I can already picture some retarded kid running his mouth at an officer
>I heard bang bang I run out to see guy holding a gun banger bang bangs at another guy who's also a bad guy because he has a gun and they bang bang bang for like one hundred seconds!

>>32826211
>As an armed citizen, do you respond or wait for law enforcement?
I load up my car and bounce. I'm not a cop.

>>32826750
Right I'll go storm the mall and get shot by police in the process. Eat a bag of dicks please.

>>32826779
this

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>>32826211
If myself or my family is at risk I'd drop him like a bad habit with my CCW.

If not I'd watch him slaughter some sheep. Shit would be better than television. If it's European people being killed I might cum.

>>32826822
Is the shooter not supposed to get shot by the police or something?

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>>32826425
I get the fuck out of dodge. It doesn't matter what is going on.

The widely established and agreed-upon protocol for these things is you:

>run
>hide
>fight

Fighting is the LAST DITCH contingency for when your life is being immediately threatened.

Walking in and trying to play hero muddles the situation, further increasing the Police's response time, getting more people killed, and getting yourself shot / in immense legal trouble in the process.

If intervention sounded like a good idea to you, don't carry. You're just causing more shit for the rest of us with.

>>32826211
>TFW no wife or children
>Rush in because misguided sense of morality
>See you later space cowboys

>>32826891
It has worked out resonably for some of the people who have done that.

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>>32826835

>>32826896
that just reminded me of the guy that kicked in his neighbor's front door and charged him with a katana because he had loud porn on and wanted to save a rape victim.

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>>32826911
Not even.

>>32826921
No way anyone did that.

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>>32826641
If an armed person happens to saunter onto your property while there happen to be reports of a cop-killer wandering around in the same area, then you have a lot more reason to consider a violent response.

However, freak incidents happen, and trying to go after an armed fellow is never a good idea if he isn't directly threatening you. You're making the right call by hunkering down in your home.

The ethics of shooting a "known cop-killer" is questionable since you could not verify that the guy was the perp beyond a reasonable doubt without putting yourself in extreme danger and, as with your previous example, making the situation incredibly complicated.

I mind my own fucking business.

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>>32826938
Fair point. I would probably just hunker down and wait it out, not least of which because I don't really want to shoot anyone if it can at all be avoided.

Having said that, in the Moncton incident there was a pretty cohesive picture of what was going on via social media and radio and tv... and there wasn't much doubt about whether the guy in pic related was the one the cops were looking for.

I was kinda surprised that no civvies shot at him actually.

Pretty much any CCW class will teach you that if you're not in immediate danger you nope the fuck out.

The first part any equation that results in you not getting shot is avoiding a deadly situation. I don't get paid to put my life on the line for people I don't know. If I get killed by doing so my family isn't taken care of. I would for sure get the hell out of there and not think twice.

OTOH, if I were in a store already and some fucker started shooting people up, and I had any sort of advantage, I'd take the shot. Lots goes into this though, trying to discern if there are more than one shooter, etc. Would really suck if you shoot some prick only to find out his buddy is behind you with a bigger gun.

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>>32826641
Someone armed wandering around my property that's not a cop?

Hmm

>>32826425
>children's daycare

That would only reinforce the tendency of a sensible CCW holder to stay away.

Yes, everyone will pat you on the back if you somehow manage to incapacitate the criminal with no casualties before the police can get there; however, real life is not like the movies. If you intervene in such a situation and people, especially children, end up dying, you can expect to be sued into oblivion in civil court if you're still alive afterwards. It doesn't matter whether your actions were made with the best intentions or even if you directly saved some lives. A skillful lawyer will be able to successfully argue that your presence worsened the situation/caused the death(s) of his client's family member(s) and make sure that your attempt at playing hero is a costly one.

This is why anyone with common sense who found himself in such a situation would ultimately say to himself, "That's unfortunate, but it's not my problem," and simply leave.

>>32826937
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5vZ8OPtwRg

>>32826641
As to this situation, it's pretty tricky.

So you hear on the news theres this cop killer going around.

Some asshole strolls into your back yard with some guns.

How are you sure its the dude shooting cops? can you be 100% sure? Are you sure he isn't wearing body armor and your nugget round might night take him down? Are you sure you can actually hit a moving target and won't get a mag dump through the siding and fiberglass insulation that makes up most houses?

If you can answer yes to all these questions, shoot the prick. If not, I'd wait until you know he's actually trying to get into your house.

>>32826211
For the most part I would just GTFO. I have a wife and responsibilities.

I'm an excellent shot though, so if I saw someone Alluha Akbhar'ing a mall or something, and I had a clear shot + cover + quick means of retreat, I would probably try to shoot him. If I succeed, gun goes back in my holster and I sit calmly out of the way while LEO's swarm the scene, and eventually tell them "I was in fear for my life or the lives of others, I need a lawyer, and I am invoking my 5th amendment right to remain silent."

If I fail, I GTFO before he can shoot back.

>>32826211

Respond.

This reminds me of the Boston Manhunt and the Tsaernev brother's shootout. If I'd been in one of the homes nearby and had a clear line of sight on the brothers, I probably would have taken the shot - but only because I would be (1) relatively out of danger (2) the targets are clearly engaged in a gun battle with the police (3) I'm sufficiently removed from the situation that the Police are unlikely to decide to shoot me just in case.

If there is any question you're better off barricading yourself and lying in wait.

>>32826990
>there wasn't much doubt

That pic could have been someone from /k/ who, upon hearing shots fired nearby, took weapons from his car and moved in to play good Samaritan.

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>>32827118
Touche.

>Pull out my glock and run inside
>Stand in the corner and wait for him to walk by
>Empty my entire magazine in his back
>Pull down my pants and rub my nuts on his face

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>>32827167
dude that's fucking shit.

an XM177 sound moderator reduces muzzle flash to about zero while likely functioning as just an effective compensator or brake.

0/10

>>32827176
>family opens admin report
>get banned from mall for camping

>>32826641

>Point gun at him
>"HEY!"
>cop killer turns toward you
>blast him
>"it was self defense"

I think it would be unethical to let a murderer continue murdering if you had a good opportunity to stop him. If he wanted to stop he'd put the gun down and surrender

>>32826211
bunch of fuckin' slack jawed faggots up in here

the police tell you not to respond, which is wise -- if they'll be there in time. but that's just an expectation. they generally don't, so, there is no threat to you. it's not like you're going to draw your sidearm first and move towards the sound second, anyway, that's tactically unsound for a concealed carrier. so how is a cop going to mistake you for the bad guy and shoot you?

the other half of statistics is outcomes. and outcomes show that would-be mass shootings are stopped by armed civilians (usually concealed, take note) more than any other form of intervention (MMA jarheads, knife fags, locks and barricades, police, god, etc.)

me, i don't go to malls.

>>32826211
>Non-LEO
I can't help but read that as not in Low Earth Orbit. Sadly I am generally not I am generally not in Low Earth Orbit.

On topic: no, getting the fuck out. I have no information, am at massive disadvantage, and would stand to get fucked for trying to help if I did. It might be a different story if I had friends or family still inside, but I'd probably be more likely to try to expedite their escape (bringing the car around front etc) than actually go back in for them unless I had reason to believe there would be a decent margin of success. Making the situation worse IS a possibility, especially if I don't know what I'm up against.

>>32827348
you're not particularly intelligent are you. Keep being an armchair warrior and reading website graphs instead of being outside. I know if there's a mass shooter indiscriminately shooting at anything that moves I'd wait to draw my firearm until the gun was pointed at me!

Good one, Op.

Let's say someone takes up a position in the middle of my street, waves an ISIS flag and starts shooting at people.

If I see the guy actually shooting people down, I can in theory get a rifle and take him down.

I'll be a hero for about five, maybe 20 minutes. That is at long as it will take for the cops to arrive at my door, arrest me for participating in a shooting incident, confiscate every metal object in my hope then haul me off to prison.

Oh, I will still be a hero to the people. But there is nothing in the law of my country that will get me out before 7-10 years, I will never see my guns again nor will I be allowed to buy one. Of course, I will also have lost my income and my house by the time I am back on the street because banks. Hurray for justice. My fondest dreams are that one day politicians will die because defending them isn't legal.
in my street starts shooting at each other. Unless I watch it starting, I won't even know who started

>>32827628
Which country faggot?

>>32827680

Norway. Nice place really. But we don't see a lot of street combat. Faggot.

>>32827813
You just need to import more violent mudslimes.

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>>32826641
>Buzzfeed
>Journalist
nice one mate

>>32827055
milady intesifies