Are clone armies ethical?

>>32236029
>Clone Army
>Drone Army

Welcome to the mind of George Lucas. It's not actual violence because they are not humans.

It's the Mario jumps on turtles philosophy.

Is it ethical to create an entire army out of children artificially accelerated through childhood for the sole purpose to die as pawns for the benefit of worthless citizens who are either too lazy or too cowardly to fight their own wars?

The Jedi deserved order 66.

Are any armies ethical?

>>32236029
Fuck you, I wanna fight to.

>>32237400

A volunteer army is automatically superior to a clone army.

>>32236029
No, as they're slaves.

However, if you was to ask them if they want to remain in the clone military once they're at the "graduation" age, then that'd be fine.

>>32236029
>Army of slaves
So, Republic was Bad guy there?

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>>32236180
Oh shit.

I never took it this way. Holy shit. Fuck the Jedi.

>>32238826

Although the Jedi wasn't really behind the creation of the clone army, they should have considered the ethics of using it more than they did (since it did come back to bite them in the end).

>>32238935
They were more than happy take command of that army. And on more than one occasion more than happy to sacrifice the lives of clones for the sake of republic citizens. They bitched and moaned about the ethics of slavery, but were more than content to use a slave army to prop up their morally bankrupt government and call it justice.

So yeah fuck that. I'd sooner say a draft, or even forced conscription of felons as a basis for military service before I'd say cloning is acceptable even if all the hypothetical technological challenges could be overcome to make it a potential reality.

Realistically a clone would still take the regular amount of time to grow and age as a human, so they'd be pretty damn inefficient and nowhere near cost effective. Not to mention each would still be sentient unique people, just merely the same genetically. It's like saying using twins in the current army as human shields is ethical. Because that's basically what clones are, an 18 year delayed twin.

The Clone Army was actually shit. The Empire had to stop using them because the alien rebels had developed anti clone weapons during the Clone Wars.

>>32236029
>>32236118

Hell no they arent ethical.

In the storyline for star wars it was all a rushed thing for the galactic senate - here is a clone army, somehow its just here, it can beat the hell out of the droids so do we use it?

Questions likely would have been floating around about what to do with them after the war was won, plenty of people probably would have seen them as dangerous or just unethical for them to be forced to continue to live. More profit-minded factions probably would have wanted to give them jobs as security or as workers for brute labor.

Overall nobody got a chance to really question it because Dooku had it made under Sidious.

>>32239118
It did its job though, it was a firing squad against every jedi in the galaxy, and then it was a shoe in the door for the emperor to maintain the first vestiges of empire control.

like most, they were disposables

>>32239114
They were had growth acceleration, so they reached maturity in like 7 or 8 years or something

>>32236029

Not even close to ethical.

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>>32236118
t. guy who hasn't watched the clone wars.

>>32239077

What are you on about the jedi didn't want to even have a role in the war in the fist place. They were unceremoniously thrust into the war as generals of an army that they weren't even aware of.

>And on more than one occasion more than happy to sacrifice the lives of clones for the sake of republic citizens
What's the issue here? This happens in the real world. It's the job of soldiers to fight and die for the very citizens they swore to defend. Also don't pretend that Jedi weren't taking a great number of casualties themselves (the size of the order was greatly diminished before order 66).

>they were more than content to use a slave army to prop up their morally bankrupt government and call it justice.
They didn't call it justice, the jedi hated the war just as much as any clone or citizen caught up in it. They were dealt a shitty hand and played it out. Speaking of corrupt governments, I don't know if you seem to have forgotten but they were more than aware and were taking steps to prevent the government becoming worse (watching palpatine, using Anakin to spy, trying to fucking arrest him).

>>32239305
You're a dumb presumptuous bitch. I've seen that abomination.

>>32239334
Pardon?

>>32239305
The difference being in the real world every single ass we have in theater has a choice and made that choice to join the military. Not a single clone trooper was given that choice. None of them signed a contract, or swore some some sacred oath to defend god and country. They were created on a factory line like we'd do with any modern weapons system. This comparison between real world soldier and clone trooper is also true of the Jedi as well, they have choice where the clones do not. No one is forcing them to take part in the war. They are "guardians of peace" not military officers or government officials. And even should the government see fit to appoint them officers in this new military, none of them are forced to accept it the way clones are. They are free at any point to resign their commission, hell resign from the jedi order if they want to. Do clones have that option? No they do not. They have no rights, no future. The only thing that awaits them is either death on the battlefield or if they are "lucky" an artificially quick death by old age.

>>32236029
Nope but at least they can be put down for good, with drones and robots, your enemies can recycle them for their own use. Well, you can use clones meats for consumption or fertilizes.

>>32239405
You said I >>32236118 didn't see movie.

Sure they show some human on human violence. But very little, usually a blaster shot. Most notable is Darth Mail and Dooku, which they don't show being beheaded.

If every droid Obi-wan, qui-gon, and Anakin killed were a human they were slicing up with sabers, it would of had hiring rating and less soccer moms would approve. That's what I'm saying.

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Let's talk about shit that is actually plausible using today's technology

Is it ethical to perform selective breeding to create superior soldiers?

>>32239510
Is it even feasible to perform selective breeding on humans over a long enough period of time for such a program to produce any significant number of superior soldiers?

>>32239510

We can already make superior soldiers through the use of better equipment. The real benefits of selective breeding/genetic manipulation would be in the creation of better officers. Having a super commander is for all intents and purposes better than having a super soldier.

>>32239450
>None of them signed a contract, or swore some some sacred oath to defend god and country.
I see where you're coming from and while it does suck I think many people forget that they were also programmed to be soldiers, it is quite literally in their DNA. I never claimed that a clone army was ethical I'm just defending the jedi here. Speaking of which the jedi were forced into the war as each and every one of them had sworn an oath to the republic. Now while you are correct in that they could have left and abandoned their duties for the sake of ethics, how would you look at officers and men of our armed forces abandoning us days before an invasion? The whole conflict was one shitty tragedy for everyone involved to serve the needs of a few (Sidious and friends).

>>32239507
I suppose I misinterpreted what you said. Yeah its hard to sympathize with the CIS because of the droids but as you said, the clone wars does have a decent bit of human on human violence (take the Umbaran arc for example).

>>32239560
We already did that in a variety of animal. The question is whether we have the patience for it

Selective breeding is already happening in human. That's why niggers have more melanin than whites or why inuits are stockier than other indians

>>32238806
CIS>Republic=Empire
Didnt Sidious want to consolidate power so those aliens from outside the galaxy wouldn't wreck them when they arrived?

>>32239609
Yeah, I left out Windu killing Jango too. Which they did show his head roll.

I still think droids were used to "minimize" violence.

>>32236180
to be fair the JEDI did lead the clone soldiers from the front, and DID fight in the wars, is just that such a limited number of jedi wouldmake fighting a entire war with them..unfeasible.

>>32238708
to be fair, slavery is/was sorta legal in the lucas universe...as seen by the retarded amount of slaves liveing, working, and dying under their masters.

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>>32236180
Thought you were talking about Spartan II's for a second.

>>32237716
>this nigga never seen the clone wars gene bred clone supersoldiers vs atrocious stormtrooper 'volunteer' amateurs.

Lol. Clones actually made fun of the volunteers even into the empire days.

>>32240433
The argument applies to the Halo universe too. Granted I'm not up on the lore nearly as well with Halo as I am Star Wars, the one difference I can think of off the top of my head if i remember right, the Spartans weren't artificially aged were they? Either way, any and everybody behind the program responsible of kidnapping children and forcing them into that sort of life should be put up against the wall and summarily executed the same way the Kaminoan cloners should be.

>>32239756

It was illegal in the Republic, but pretty much anything goes in the outer rim.

>>32236180
Jedi were the only people in the Republic who actually treated the Clones like people, in a sad twist.

>>32240637
They all got away by throwing the one person who cared about the Spartans under the bus. Then again, that was in the books and the books are kinda shite.

>>32240772
Well, ONI had a lot more deniability with the SPARTAN program on top of it.

The children kidnapped were replaced with clones (that all invariably died of organ failure or whatnot) and the augmentations and armor rendered them unrecognizable to anyone.

Plus they also managed to just get them working in time for a huge threat (the Covenant) to show up and divert eyes away from their unethical super soldier program.

As for what happened after the Human-Covenant War, I wouldn't know because there weren't any more games made after 3 (and Reach).

>>32236180

You know Lucas missed a huge opportunity by not having the clone just openly rebel against the Jedi Order

>>32236180

100% agree.

The fact that the Jedi were OK with using the clones complete invalidates them.

>>32240701
Not in any way that really mattered, they didn't offer them any choice really beyond how they (collectively as a unit) painted their armor. What were the clones even fighting for? So what if the Separatists left the Republic, it wouldn't affect their lives any. It wasn't like even if everything had gone perfectly and they had won the war that the clones would have benefited from it in any meaningful way. Were they going to be made free men? Given a proper retirement? Hell a normal life span even? All they realistically had to look forward to was the thanks of an indifferent republic and the satisfaction of a job well done for all twelve minutes of left their short lives.

Yes the Jedi may have occasionally said a kind word, some may have even considered them friends, but the fact is they were more caught up and concerned with propping up a government than they were doing what was morally right as Jedi like they were supposed to.

>>32240433
The horrible shit that happened to the children in the Spartan program was worse than what the clones went through, but I'd still say the Spartans were more justified than the clones.

>>32239691
In a nut shell yes. But that wasnt why he did till scouts in the far outer rim made contact with them.

There are several books on this subject. Or if you like i can pull up some youtube videos that break it down to a mere 5-8 min

>>32236180
Which would make sense if the Sith didn't convince a couple of rogue Jedi to commission the army, before either converting or killing those Jedi. The Jedi just discovered it years later when it was exactly what they needed in that situation.

The more I think about it, for a mystical secret order that's supposed to be full of some of the greatest philosophical minds in the universe, the Jedi were really stupid.

>>32240913
The saddest part about the whole thing was they had all the pieces literally spoon fed to them by the enemy but the still refused to see what was right in front of them. They knew since the end of the first movie the sith were back. They spent ten years after learning that apparently doing absolutely nothing. When one of their most respected master leaves the order, goes on to tell a Jedi directly that the Sith control the senate. They're still all too happy to take command of a mysterious army that shows up out of nowhere, and was made for that same senate. It also just so happened to be created right about the time they first learned their enemy they thought had been destroyed for a thousand years resurfaces out of the blue. Really stupid doesn't even come close.

>>32240913

Having your order live directly on top of a Sith Temple that constantly weakens your abilities would do that after a few thousand years.

>>32240884
This. They needed more reinforcements and better soldiers for the upcoming shitstorm by the covenant.

There are plenty of Jedi that would be more than ready to fight off the separatists, but fuck them because they are higher class citizens with superpowers and don't need to get dirty.

>>32240907
I'm not familiar with this bit of the universe. Was sidious worried about another race, other than what we already saw, coming in and challenging the Republic's rule?

>>32240998
>forgetting that they did indeed fight them hand to hand down and dirty in the nitty gritty

Jedi were fools but goddamn man.

>>32240998
Unless I'm remembering things wrong, wasn't the Spartan II program started before humanity knew anything about the covenant? I thought the fact that they were able to be put into service against them was just a stroke of luck on the part of humanity.

>>32240998
>>32241009
Jedi did indeed fight, but even then then the Jedi were flung into a war that didn't really consern them.

The Jedi fucked themselves when they let their order slowly change into a political enforcement group instead of simply remaining the Jedi order
The Sith were the only ones who remained true to their ways, which is why they'll win in the end.

The Jedi were all too happy to fight for a political movement and then when they were handed an army they took it without question.

>>32241001

No they were pretty much going to enslave,rape,and kill anything that wasnt from thier home world.

The "old empire" and "new republic" got butt fuck all the way to the core worlds
And lost every major battle till they decided pool everything they had for one last ditch effort to cut off supply lines to the core worlds.
Give me like 15 to find the videos.

>>32240997
>>32240989
To weaken your connection to the force, yes, not weaken your deductive reasoning.

>Shit, things are getting tense. It would be great if we had an army.
>Hey, I found an army at the edges of the galaxy that was apparently made for us.
>Well that was lucky, thank God we're not walking into a trap.

An order of warrior monks should of really seen that coming. Instead, Yoda and Obi Wan are on a ship pacing around figuring out how they were played like Kazuhira Miller.

Granted, they only took the bait every time because they were unable to act any other way at the time. They took the clones because they knew the CIS were going to start a war, it was take them or be conquered. But they had plenty of warning.

>>32239510
We should be using breeding to improve the human race right now. People fuck and have kids with no consequences as it is. Let's start picking people to breed with each other and compensate them monetarily.

As to op's question

Droids - ok
Clones soldiers - not ethical

>>32241001

This video explains it a good bit.
https://youtu.be/jDf-AbTGvmk


Thrawns exploits and skirnishes with them are in a video somewhere.

There are several others out there that go into geeater detail.

Also keep in mind,this is legends not cannon

>>32241143
Wait wait wait. The Republic was fighting wars before CIS?

>>32241143
Im mildly drunk and im spelling,and typing like a,tard at 2:30 AM on a south african spear and rock disscusion forum i think im tapping out.


Go down the EU rabbit hole as much as you like. You will get lost or find something,cool.

>>32240637
>>32240433
Spartans don't stray from base humanity until 16 when they get all the augmentations done.

They're just kidnapped.

>>32241160
No the repubic was re established after the empire fell. The remnents of the empire held the outter rim and they basicly just flung dicks for awhile had a few wars yada yada . just watch,the videos its a fuck load of info.

>>32241182
That sounds so cool, why didn't Disney use that for the 7th movie?

>>32241202
Not that far along yet. When the invasion happens you are pretty much onto the childrens children of hanxleia and luke and (i fucking forgot who he fucked jade I think?)


There are several videos by that guy explaining what happens and how it all ties in.

Stop trying to reason for characters in poorly written movies. The characters' decisions don't make any sense because Lucas rushed the creative process and churned out a garbage script. The ethics of a clone army and the extinction of the Jedi isn't "sad" or "a twist" it's stupid, just like the movies. There's no room for deep questions in a movie that can't even handle basic expository dialogue.

>the Original Trilogy is the only trilogy

>>32239510
>>32239560
>>32239571
I think it's more likely that we will stress nanobots or serums that bolster strength and healing abilities.
Selective breeding on humans would take too long for fights with other humans, if aliens invaded and we had a couple hundred years on a galactic scale maybe.

There's an excerpt from Guns,Germs and Steel that talks about why oaks/acorns weren't domesticated, including the time between generations of trees, and a few other factors.

>>32240801
Can you imagine if Master chief ran into his clone with his parents. That shit would probably destroy him mentally

>>32241015
the umbara arc was amazing. The clone episodes are all pretty good in general, they really help put the whole absurdity of using a cloned army in general.

>>32236029
Why the empire never stuck with camo, I'll never know

>>32236029
>>32236118

always felt the battles in star wars were kinda dumb

they all line up in formation like nepolen days and march and fight like that and wear white

it just felt dumb

>>32241307
If the new halo's touched on that I might play them more

>>32241057

Yup. The program was originally created to combat the insurrectionists. It wasn't until very late afterwards, right after they started using the Mark 3 or 4, if I remember correctly, that they had first contact with the Covenant.

>>32236180

Maybe the Republic should stop disbanding it's military after like every 5 years when there are sith lords.

>>32242781
Sounds a lot like the Republic's problem. The senate being in a panic every few years because they planned poorly does not grant them the right to create a slave child army, nor accept ownership and responsibility of that army just because it was politically convenient.

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>>32240701
>>32240861

And the few jedi who realy carred left the order...

>>32236029
The Jedi were initially appalled by the idea of using clones but realised they really had no choice if the Republic was to survive the war with the Separatists.

The Jedi got fucking played like little bitches though, they should have paid attention.

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literally less ethical than using mass conscription and full war industry to send troops and equipment to the front to die by the regiment load

at least conscripts would be treated like humans and be fighting to protect their planets and families unlike a clone army of literal slaves being sent to die

>>32240637
>Kaminoan cloners
>>32240637
>executed the same way
can't we just hore them out like twilikes?

>>32242528
that really only happened once

>>32243493
I thought that IG regiments were composed of PDF volunteers, though.

>>32243637
It varies regiment by regiment
Usually the best of the PDF are allowed to join the guard or forced to do so

>>32243637

depends on the regiment

Cadians basically force every male to join the grimdark spess cadets as a young teen then serve time in the real army

>>32236180
Technically anakin did bring balance to the force
Only 2 sith and 2 jedi left at the end of 3

>>32243724
Yeah. What the fuck did they think was going to happen?

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>>32243724
There were numerous Jedi that went into hiding after Order 66, and the Force was still at an imbalance because of Sidius's power trip. Not only that, but they began getting new dark Force users to hunt down the remaining Jedi. Anakin brought balance to the Force after killing Palpatine in 6

>>32239700
Jango wasn't outwardly human in appearance in his full body armor so he was effectively a robot to audiences. A Jango with no helmet would never be decapitated. Isn't the first movie the only one with any degree of gore (bloody cut off arm, smoking skeletal corpses of Luke's aunt and uncle)?

>>32243875
Fake cadets head got cut off too. Other than that I think that's it

>>32243903
*vader
Damn phone

>>32239691
>aliens from outside
Not canon anymore.

>>32240801

Why didn't they just create clones to turn into Spartans?

As I recall, the SPARTAN II Program had narrow genetic requirements that the kids met. So the plan was kidnap these kids then replace them with flash clones right?
Said clones were expected to (and for the most part did) die shortly thereafter.

So why not just use normal clones? They made the point of establishing flash cloning as distinct from "traditional" cloning so the latter exists, right?

And the flash clones were more about making Halsey feel better than necessary
program secrecy weren't they?

>>32241307
>>32242757

There's an episode of Halo: Legends that deals with this happening to one of the other Spartans.

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>>32244732
shitty walt disney.....


*move hand jedi like* star wars 7 doesn't exist

>>32244954
Because their cloning technology was limited meaning the clones would never live very long or would be very unhealthy.

>>32243875
Darth Maul got cut in half in Phantom Menace, Luke slices off the Wampa's arm on Hoth.

>ethical :no
>cost effective: no
>combat effective: hell yes

>>32236180
Ethics are a social construct, they're a fucking multi-species space society, we have no way of answering that afaik (maybe SW society etc... is better explained in the EU but I have no idea if or how in depth that's fleshed out there)

And even in "today's" society, I don't think such a concept would be 'unethical'; it's ultimately the greatest reduction in potential loss of life and limb for the citizenry. Obviously there are issues with completely ceding military control to such an entity if total control cannot be guaranteed (e.g. the same issue if a nation entirely privatized martial services and then is defenseless without them or if in conflict with the power structure of the PMC [or in this case the human commanders/handlers of the clone army], or since this isn't even conventional privatization so to speak if some terminator type thing happens and all the clones rebel)

>>32243767
I wasn't expecting the Imperial Inquisition!

>>32246369
No one expects the imperial inquisition

What makes you think you're not a clone?

>>32246499
Because I'm not a good solider, and I don't follow orders.

>>32236180
Not an incorrect view but very narrow minded, the creation of the clone army was authorized by the sidings and then approved in the open by the senate, I believe that the jedi would lead whoever would fight as they always have but the prequels are pretty much all about power being moved from the jedi to the Senate. At the end of the day they needed the numbers and took whatever source they could, rather than conscription unwilling civilians and felons they build willing and capable soldiers from scratch.

>>32246142
That's all well and good to call it a social construct if you're some clueless citizen that gets to sit on his ass in the core worlds twiddling your thumbs blissfully unaware while some poor literal ten year old is getting blown in half, or shot through the gut by wave after wave of battle droids on your behalf. If you're that ten year old that has no stake in the fight, how relative does it look to you? This is all to prevent the horrible crime of systems leaving a system that is laughably corrupt and incompetent, that has the gall to approve of a slave army, and then proclaim that there mission is justice. That He's got no family back at home, no ties to the culture or history of the Republic, and his home world is a miserable water planet that is constantly raining filled with long necked alien freaks that would just as soon recondition (kill) him if he happened to take pause for just long enough to consider the injustice of his own situation. You can't even call the clones willing either, capable certainly, but not willing. Not when their only choice is to either conform to the idea that their sole existence and duty is to serve a government and citizenry that do not even treat them as living beings, or to be killed by their creators.

>>32246557

Maybe that's exactly what you're supposed to think about yourself 0_0

>>32240531
darth vader told them shoot like cops

>>32241174
They got them done as young as 13.

>>32241271

>actually taking jared diamond seriously

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>>32236180
The clones are the ultimate it ain't me when you think about it.

>>32236180
When did this happen? I don't remember this in any of the the three movies. Is it perhaps some shitty fan-fiction?

>>32236029

People dying is people dying. Better to have one manufactured for the purpose.

>>32246557

Fugg. Good arc, feels arc.

>>32243724

You do know that at least close to a 100 Jedi survived that shit. Go read the books.

The Republic is already a slave holding culture Droids clearly are AI. The only change with clone troopers was the organic nature. The Star Wars universe is actually kinda creepy and this has bothered me for years. Clone Troopers are child soldiers

>>32243724
Balance of the Force meant killing all the Sith.

>>32236029
Yes. They are but mere improved DNA strains sold by consent, createdfor the sole purppose to fare warfare and eventually die.

I think the lynch-pin of this subject is the willingness of the clones.

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This whole thread for me thinking of how great a movie this question would make. Imagine a movie about a platoon of clones and the horrors they see in battle. So basically a saving private Ryan gorey type of movie with clones while delivering the ethical question of using the clone army.

>>32253406
I disagree, better to have people who volunteer for it and understand what they're dying for.

>>32253767
That's a good point many droids are shown to develop distinctive personalities. Apparently they regularly memory wipe droids to prevent this, which is all the more horrifying.

>>32254721
They were mentally indoctrinated from birth, so their "willingness" is difficult to judge. There were a few deserters who saw the war as bullshit or wanted to take a different path, but they were statistical anomalies. TCW/Rebels further muddies the topic with the mind control chip and the desertion/defection of clones like Rex.

>>32255099
Battlefront 2 always made me believe they were tricked into thinking the Jedi were evil. But the clone wars had some good moments like that

>>32239560
China does it to produce Olympic winners. Yao Ming is the product of such an arranged marriage between very tall people.

>>32245126
I thought there was only 4-6.

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>>32255128
The problem with that angle is how sudden the inevitable betrayal was. I understand being pressed for time in RotS, but one would think that more grunt clones would stop and ask if any of it was legit. After all, these were people who had fought and bled alongside them for years. Most Jedi weren't terrible bosses, either. They clearly liked the clones, treated them as people, and were uncomfortable with the idea of the clones being conscripted to fight an ultimately unethical war.

>>32255233

His parents are both professional basketball players.

What a shocking and inhuman country China must be, where people with the exact same interest and career meet one another and then have a child who follows the same career path. Certainly this could have only been the product of communist eugenics.

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I can think of even more immoral manufactured armies.

Like these guys. Programmed and designed to fight, genetically engineered to obey, and drug-addicted to keep any defective ones in line.

"Do you really want to give up your life for the order of things?"
"It is not my life to give up Captain, and it NEVER was."

>>32255272
.5 chinklets have been deposited to your paypal,

>>32253867
Where there is light, There must be shaddow. -digimon

>>32255322
yeah the worst part is unlike the clones, they understand their situation but at the same time are helpless to do anything about. it would be some sort of existential hell 24/7.

>>32255392

The Dominion will go down sooner or later. As Weyoun himself said....

"The Founders' ability to control the Jem'Hadar has been somewhat......overstated. Otherwise we never would have had to addict them to the White."

Unfortunately, the only true way to liberate the Jem'Hadar for good is to fix them at the genetic source.

>>32240531
That is because the empire have shit standards.

>>32255984

A mistake of the franchise was introducing us to the Stormtroopers first (the "elite shocktroops" who can't hit the backside of a barn).

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>>32256103
>the "elite shocktroops" who can't hit the backside of a barn if that barn is named Skywalker, Solo, or Organa, but are perfectly cool with hitting unimportant, nameless Rebel barns
Fixed that for you.

>>32256135
That was the 501st

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>>32236180

>>32236029
>>32236180
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeuZz6J5tvc
>Clones are better because they have "loyality" versus drones.

>>32256135

Honestly the Empire rented aimbots during that battle.

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>>32236029
Reminder that only TOR era star wars is good

>>32253717
Most of the books are no longer canon.

>>32244954
They mention in Fall of Reach about full human cloning being unstable and illegal, they can only clone organs worth a shit

>>32257057

Sucks. I loved the Imperial Civil War, which is exactly what would happen.

>>32256674
>The clone troopers just stand there and get shot at the beginning of the video
What a shit show.
I've seen gary's mod gifs flow better than that.

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>>32256724
>aimbots
I thought the Empire scrapped the CIS droid army after the Clone Wars.

>>32256183
yea that was in battlefront II right?

>>32258211
Yes thought it was obvious though since they actually killed people and accomplished their objectives

>>32236029

Well considering China has one and no one cares, they must be.

>>32236180
But that's fucking wrong.

t. A big Star Wars nerd

>>32255377
Nope, Dark Side is cancer on the Living Force, which feeds into the Cosmic Force

>>32236029
Is war ethical?

>>32243875
Dooku has both of his arms cut off with the stumps shown a good couple of seconds. Then he proceeds to have his head cutoff with his head rolling. Star Wars is pretty morbid in how some people die.

>>32261763
Excuse me, you don't see his head roll but you see his headless body with cauterized wound visible.

>>32243875
ESB had Luke's decapitated head during the Dagobah training sequence and his hand during Bespin, IIRC. Then RotS showed us Anakin burning alive on Mustafar.