So what are all of /k/'s problems with fury?

>>32088774
An M4 outmaneuvering and destroying a Tiger

Its just the same few threads over and over. No new content, ever. This place is madness.

>>32088774
My impression is that it was pointlessly edgy.

>>32088787
And yet we're retarded enough to keep coming back

>tfw when /k/ is the only place/people I can talk about history and guns with

>Star Wars lazer beams for tracers

>>32088793

This

It wasn't about anything

>>32088774
>edgy hollywood flick

>tiger scene
no tiger would advance that quickly and shoot like that on the move when there's a huge open field and plenty of time for him to pick off each Sherman one by one. The positive note on the battle was that it was very possible for a firefly to be a match against a Tiger.

>end battle
could have had the movie without that end battle. fucking dumb. SS are basically the fucking best of the best. Do you really think a whole battalion of them could be beaten by a disabled sherman? gtfo

If the end battle was cut out, I actually would have liked the movie a whole lot more.

>>32088774

Just got back from watching Hacksaw Ridge. Far superior WW2 movie IMHO.

>>32088990
>SS are basically the fucking best of the best.
Hahahahahaha
Dude, they did more fanatical pointless assaults than the fucking soviets in Enemy at the gates.
They were pretty much just fanatical shit-tier past late 1944, throwing brainwashed kids at mg's with a few weeks of training.

>>32089144
Where did you get this information?

Germany may have been shit-tier at replenishing units (instead creating new ones all the time), but they were always trained by frontline experienced instructors that'd at least not feed them bullshit.

>>32088774
The ending battle. Movies often add a glorious "final battle" even to ones based on true stories that didn't have them, like in Lone Survivor.

>>32088786
Technically it was 4 M4s and the Tiger got 3 of them.

>>32089144
Replace 1944 with 1945 and I might agree with you.

>>32089184
>>32089144

Plus, I know for SS units, they'd at least draw some officers and NCOs from other SS units to help lead the new units.

>>32088774

it's shit

>>32088774
Why don't you time travel back to 2014 when everyone still gave a shit.

What did you guys think of scenes such as when Brad Pitt makes the "new guy" shoot some German soldier, or blames him for the death of fellow soldiers, or when ape-face screws with him when the "new guy's" crush dies?

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>>32088774

cut the best scenes

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>>32088774

Not enough women sucking dick for cigarettes.

Character development during them riding around Europe = amazing.
The scene in the town where they have a breakfast fight/rape that takes 1/4 of the movie = terrible.
Tiger fight = a joke.
Climactic fight = made me miss the gritty realism of the Tiger fight.
>>>
A side note. Pitt came out to ft Irwin to do 'research'...post rotation...so even before they filmed the damn thing i knew it would likely be shit since he never got to embed with an actual crew in the field. I figured that his character would be based on stories rather than actual experiences. He did a little better than i expected but in the end Hollywood sucks.

Mel Gibson kicks ass though.

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>>32088774
For some reason it became a Quentin Tarantino film at the end.

>>32088774
>muh 4 shermans per tiger meme

>>32089281
Wow cool, never seen that

>>32089311
That was Brad's doing, he missed inglorious basterds

The Tiger fight was stupid. Everyone was wondering what the hell was going on, all the Shermans were destroyed in one hit but magically their Sherman took multiple.

>>32088774
Some people don't understand the difference between unlikely and unrealistic.

>>32088774
oh boy, why fundamentally there is nothing wrong with this movie it suffers from
"oh hey that war was just long enough so we can
depict everyone as god damn crazy lunatics"

as so it does

sherman vs tiger scene was ridiculous,
so does tiger got all the distance in the world to pick m4 one by one or are they just right at its ass ?
besides at those close distances even m4a1 would not have much trouble with tiger not even talk about firefly ...
but no tigers were invincible so we have to have this ridiculous and over bloated scene

last scene was horrible as well
as historically crew would bail disabled as fast as your mom can eat cake

but no main fuck has to have suicide wish, cos he got complicated past
wife something something, dead something something, Hollywood favorite backstory to "complicated" characters

and everything in between is just how horrible and savage murricans are

>>32089342
You can't beat the easy 8's special sooper secret plot armor

>>32088786
Wehraboo detected

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>>32089281
Holy shit i didn't know that happened hahaha any more pics like this? I only ever saw "clean" photos of Allies to be honest.

And i like Fury cause i like anything that destroys Nazis or Commies and i like edgy shit.

I am not really good with tanks, I barely know anything about them, but were Tiger tanks really -that- tough where direct hits would ricochet off their armour?

>>32088786
If a bridge can beat a Tiger, I don't see why a Sherman can't.

>>32089405
Depends who was shooting.

Early Shermans that the US used did have trouble depending on range.

>>32089373

Check out Tony Vaccaro's photographs. He was an actual infantryman and photographer by hobby so his photos are very unique and candid. Soldiers act differently around Signal Corps cameramen and photojournalists.

I don't remember any other prostitution shots but he did take some of strippers in officer's clubs.

http://www.akg-images.co.uk/C.aspx?VP3=SearchResult&VBID=2UMESQLCI4VTD&SMLS=1&RW=1920&RH=935

>>32089405

http://www.digitalhistoryarchive.com/uploads/2/5/4/1/25411694/article_by_us_army_tank_battalion_commander_-_tank_versus_tank_1946.pdf

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>>32088774
An entire well armed battalion charging an M4 with shovels.

>watching a mainstream Hollywood move

>Not expecting an unrealistic, overhyped, overly patriotic Jewish film

>>32089201
The film was set in 1945

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>>32088786

>>32088990
>SS are basically the fucking best of the best.
Even early on in the war, the SS were mostly just a "political" army, their main focus being on maintaining conquered territory and implementing SS programs to remove "undesirables" and anti-partisan efforts. While some SS battalions were genuinely good at combat, most we're shit at it against actual army regulars from both Axis and Allied sides. In late 1944 as depicted in the Film, the Waffen-SS were mainly conscripts and kids, and while led by combat-proven officers, they were not very good fighters themselves.

Just the last scene tbqh.

>>32089881
Audioslave Murphy did that last scene all by himself

>>32088990
Totally agree

>>32088990
slit nitpick, fury wasnt a firefly it was an M4a3e8 with the 76mm M1A2 gun. Fireflies were british shermans with the 17 pdr crammed in. . Easy mistake to make, they both have long barrel muzzle braked guns but a firefly removed the bow gunner position to fit more ammo.

>>32088774
1) Shia leboof
2)did it have a plot?
3)bad character development, did not give a shit what happened to them
4)that ending battle. Unbelievable that Germans would waste that much effort on a broke-ass tank

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>>32089129
Hacksaw ridge was fucking epic, but i had trouble seeing the screen around my gargantuan erection..

Fury was some pretty good ball-tingling war porn. I hadn't had that much fun sinze the zombie army uprising of 1945.

God I miss the Army...

>>32088990
Clearly wasn't a battalion, understrength infantry company with no support elements at best.

>>32089129

How'd it compare to SPR, TRL?

>>32088990
The Tiger advanced because they hit its position with smoke. It had to move out it so it could see the Shermans.

>>32088990
>SS are basically the best of the best

Yeah site man, other branches would also have a large enemy bodycount if they would count innocent civilians as enemy combatants

>>32088828
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoQTFbPbg_g

The ending.

It was good until they rolled into the town and raped the girl. It was all downhill from then.

The movie was 45 mins too long, as in they could have cut the last 45 mins out of the movie.

>>32090733
I was sitting there waiting for a good few minutes for them to try and fix the track and then take on the Germans using maneuverability, smoke grenades, booby traps, etc. Watching a crew like that MacGyver their way out of a shitty situation is something I enjoy, but the movie was alright otherwise.

>>32089405
The majority of Sherman's, yes. The Tiger's frontal armor was impervious to the 75mm M3, and the side and rear were only penetrable at dangerously short range.

The later 76mm-equipped tanks, while still greatly outranged by the Kwk 36, probably would've been able to penetrate the Tiger frontally in the movie's scenario, and the side armor without a doubt. As much as I love this scene, the need to circle around and shoot it from the rear is made redundant from not only the adequate firepower of the 76mm from any flank at that range, but the Tiger's rear armor is no thinner than its sides at 80mm.

Still liked the movie.

>>32090800
>As much as I love this scene, the need to circle around and shoot it from the rear is made redundant from not only the adequate firepower of the 76mm from any flank at that range, but the Tiger's rear armor is no thinner than its sides at 80mm.

The average /k/ommando might know this, but I don't think anyone here really puts themselves in the mindset of the characters - it's easy enough for us to do a quick google search and find out exactly how much armor an enemy tank has and the minimum range a certain cannon needs to be at to pierce it - but if you're out on the front in 1944, that kind of information is hard to come by.

Maybe they didn't get the memo about the Tiger's armor specifics, or they weren't sure a shot at the sides was worth trying.

>>32088774
It was made by amerboos.

>>32089144
>enemy at the gates
Nice source

>>32088786
We won the war, didn't we?

The dumbest thing about the final battle scene was that it was entirely unnecessary.

The SS detachment wasn't on route to fuck up a disabled Sherman tank. They apparently had no shortage of Tigers capable of doing that. Their objective was to go and fuck up a supply depot and Fury was apparently the only thing between them and that objective (besides whateverthefuck rear echelon troops are stationed at said supply depot, who are presumably armed with more than their limp dicks).

So great, the crew of Fury manages to surprise this column of Germans by pretending to be dead and then opening up. Bunch of Germans get killed. So far, a bit wonky but plausible.

Then all these supposedly well-trained SS guys decide that they really have nothing better to do than literally do Soviet-style human wave attacks at this useless disabled tank. They are shown surrounding the tank. They can clearly get past the thing. Why not leave a few dudes sitting outside staking the tank crew out while the rest continue on to their objective? If the surprise is blown, why not just fall back and find something more productive to do? Why the fuck are they shooting at it with small arms? Surely they know that as impressive as an MG42 is 8mm Mauser won't do spit to any tank.

It's just... sure there were inaccuracies in the movie and they went with an edgy aesthetic over what the characters probably would have actually said/done. But the final battle scene makes no sense by the film's own logic.

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>>32088774

There are many problems with this film. I could take an hour or two and list them all
but the film isn't worth it. Instead lets take a step back and look at a few of the overall
themes that we're forced to endure.

Tiger tanks work alone. There is no additional motorized units. No other support elements,
not even a remainder of tanks at a maintenance repair point. One tiger negates all its
long range advantages and charges heedlessly into ramming range with Allied tanks.
The trailers depicted this as a looming threat and possible build up-Strategy to kill it.
Instead it was a Cameo kill."Those stupid Germans, America wins every time."

Brad Pitt uses an STG44 to gun down little German children in Hitler youth uniforms.
Two things Hollywood Jews can't stop doing. 1. pushing for moral bankruptcy and 2,
dehumanizing Germans as frequently as possible. We needed to go there, we needed
our "American Hero" character to be the killer of children on the big screen. "but it happened!"
"It showed the horror of reality" ..... It was an in and out scene, with sloppy writing that went
for the quick and dirty shock value. It was as appalling as the prostitution scene.

The Prostitution scene. Obligatory beaten Germans, lets downgrade there women as well
as human character, and American soldier morality to fucking starving women for food as they
stare with hollowed eyes. Then they get killed by a collapsing building or something. If I were a
ww2 veteran I would think I would like to be remembered for battling a determined foe rather then
fucking the starving women of the country that was just destroyed.

And lastly the end scene were a disabled American tank fights off hoards of SS soldiers who
throw themselves on American machine gun bullets. There was nothing connecting the audience viewer to the movie at this point by the sheer detachment of reality. No tactics, just line em up knock em down Hu-ra 'Merica. Terrible movie.

>>32090830
>>32090800
Wouldn't circling around to the sides and rear, even if it is stupid, give you a flatter surface to shoot at?

I thought tanks could actually fuck up a lot of shots at sloped or non-vertical armor, and that shooting the side/rear of a tank was effective because hitting the armor dead on was better.

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>>32088774
It was shit, but anything better would be wasted on its target audience.

>>32090830
>that kind of information is hard to come by.
That's bullshit.
German tankers were given data on enemy tanks and how to engage them, and I'm sure the US was no different.
Pic related, a page from the Tigerfibel.

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>>32089281
This. I liked the characters, the authenticity of the setting.
However, every combat scene is beyond terrible. Easy Eight's main gun is guaranteed to penetrate Tiger I's front armor, among some of the more jarring problems. The final battle isn't actually as retarded as armchair generals like to say - an SS company, like most of the German "army" in late 1945 would be stuffed with pensioners and children with no training, inferior weapons and even without uniforms. If those people were brainwashed enough to fight, they would absolutely engage a static tank and die in the attempt.

>>32090916
>Tiger tanks work alone, etc
All your arguments would apply in 1942. In 1945 that Tiger probably was on the verge of breaking down and crewed by a crew of 16-year olds, and lucky to function at all. The peak of German advanced armor development and tactics was the Battle of the Bulge. From then on it was nothing but down. Everything broke down, advanced tanks were replaced by StuG III and Panzer IV's, and well-trained tank crews were in extreme shortage. Everything was in extreme shortage. Germany was collapsing.
>>32090916
Sex for food were extremely common amongst German women. Use of child soldiers by Germans is well documented.

>>32088774
Literally the worst tiger crew of all time

>>32088793

This

And the ending was dogshit

>tank crew utterly wrecking a whole fucking infantry company of supposed eastern front vets

>>32088990
Yeah, that end scene got a little silly

>>32091262
What's interesting about that series is that it makes no distinction between M4 types whereas it distinctly mentions the 76mm T-34 and the 85

>>32091360

It wasnt a Volkssturm unit so it wasnt completely incompetent. In the movie I think they specifically mentioned that the particular SS element in the movie was coming from the Eastern Front, so they would still have a leadership capable of leading.

Yeah, nah, it makes very little sense.

>>32088990
>tripfag knowing jack shit

Who could have guessed

>>32089405
>>32090800
an important point is that while the armor might not be penetrated by some guns, hits might still result in spalling or damage, it's not like it's a video game where armor=X gives immunity to damage < X

>>32089570
what makes you think they where well armed for taking on a tank? They had a few panzerfaust and no other proper AT guns

>>32091423
SS was always shit, and no, by late 1945, every German unit was effectively the same as Volkssturm, whatever they were called.

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Most of the reasons wehraboos hate the film are comical. I mean, really, a laughing stock.

Take the Tiger fight, for example.

>No Tiger commander would have moved forward in that situation!
His line of sight was blocked by white phosphorous.

>He should have reversed, so he could keep shooting the shermans!
His line of sight was blocked.

>Then he should have just waited for the smoke to clear!
It was white phosphorous.

For worshipping the masters of chemical warfare in the previous war, wehraboos are sure idiots when it comes to what chemicals light your lungs on fire when you breathe it in.

>>32091484
>SS was always shit

Opinion discarded

>>32091579
It pretty much was. They were known for being too be told not to run into their own artillery barrages

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>>32088828
>>32090624

>>32091596

So your judgement of an entire branch is based off a rumor?

>>32091596
> told not to run into their own artillery barrages
A very good explanation of this would be that they advanced faster than they could adjust (artillery)fire.
In combined arms warfare, infantry and armor are constantly moving under the protection of friendly artillery, sometimes danger close, so the notion of actually telling your troops to 'slow down' is entirely plausible.

>>32091120
Tiger I's were basically nothing but vertical armor.

Better reason would be as >>32090830 said, they probably didn't know they could penetrate the front armor and went for the sides/rear instead. But honestly the reason is most likely the filmmakers didn't know what they were doing. Hell, they probably gave Fury the gun they did because it looks cool.

>>32091412
The Tigerfibel is from '43, so the 76mm M4 is a no-show.

>>32091564
>His line of sight was blocked
Then you get clear of it and then engage rather than saying "well since we have to move several meters, we might as well just charge."

>the masters of chemical warfare in the previous war
That's like saying the British are the masters of tanks and the Germans are the masters of flamethrowers just because they used them first.

>>32091579
SS was much worse initially than Heer in terms of training and command. Their separation from the army was one of the many grave mistakes the Nazis made that lost them the war long before they invaded Poland.
The SS units fighting in Germany, including Battle of Berlin, weren't even "aryan". They are French traitors, Romanian volunteers and the like. Basically Osttruppen, and they were actually equipped worse than what was left of Heer at that point. There wasn't much difference between them, Volkssturm and Volksgrenadiers at this point.

The second half is totally ridiculous and undermines the first half.

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>>32091667
The film showed that the 76-mm gun was failing on the front plate. In reality, this gun could at least hole the mantlet according to German period testing.

I defend this movie up and down all the time, but it's because the majority of /k/s criticisms of the film are fucking retarded. From a cinematic standpoint, there are a lot of things that could have been done better.

For example: If they HAD to do a 1 Tiger vs. 4 Shermans scene, they could have improved it in the following ways:

1. Made it so that the titular tank crew was NOT the platoon command. Platoon Commander should have been a secondary character, a hardass who was every bit as experienced as 'Wardaddy' if not more so. A character who pulls his own weight, and perhaps, even helps to rescue the crew of the Fury earlier in the film. This tank, who would be the 'lead,' should have been the first to go. That way,

a) There would have been more of an emotional impact from seeing a character we were made to love, snuffed out all at once.

b) It would have been more accurate; shooting the lead tank of a column to stop the rest and force a confusion.

2) At some point in the film, the "willy pete" ammunition should have been better explained for the benefit of the audience. Perhaps a question that the new crew member has for the loader/gunner.

3) I personally feel that more of the Shermans should have survived for the final battle, to make it easier to swallow. Or, at the very least, surviving crewmen from the down tanks should have been cobbled together into a loose infantry section. When a tank is knocked out, it is very rare for the entire crew to bite the dust.

4) They hinted at the fear of Tigers operating in Germany at the beginning of the film. It should have been established that the crew had no faith in their guns based on previous experiences. Perhaps the aforementioned platoon leader could have known better, but when he bit the dust, everything goes out the window.

>>32091687
>Then you get clear of it and then engage rather than saying "well since we have to move several meters, we might as well just charge."
And you do that by moving.

If a wall is in your face, and you take a step backwards from the wall, you still can't see past the wall.

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Did the 76mm gun on Shermans even have smoke/WP rounds? I'm sure the original script called for Fury to be an old beat up 75mm Sherman that happen to have survived all the way to the near end of the war.

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>>32088774
The real war was basically counter-insurgency at that point. I wish battle scenes was actually realistic, with Germans being utterly steamrolled and having their shit pushed in by the unstoppable might of the invincible Allied war machine. Drama and excitement can be created without coming up with implausible scenarios like a tank platoon just riding into the sunset with zero support from other armored units, mechanized units, air force and artillery.
They did nail it with the air raid scene.

>>32091753
Page 564 of Sherman: A history of the American Medium Tank by R.P. Hunnicutt lists an M88 chemical round (listed as designation HC B1 M88 Shell, Smoke.)

>>32091687
I thought it was updated until '44? I could've sworn that I had seen an image with the IS-2. Though it's entirely possible I'm just crazy.

>>32091744
That doesn't excuse charging.
All they needed to do is get clear of the smoke.
That doesn't involve charging the enemy.

>>32091779
>Germans being utterly steamrolled and having their shit pushed in by the unstoppable might of the invincible Allied war machine.
No one ever does that because it is too risky to not depict America as the underdog, that's why these films always do the same "hordes of Germans with Nazi super science that only American grit and determination can save the day, and the world" depictions, no matter how ridiculous.

>>32091813
I don't think the Tigerfibel was updated at all, they just made extra materials to go along with it over time.
You might be right though.

>>32089301

>"amazing" character development

Do you really think this? The movie was downright cringy at points. I felt like I was watching one of those Steven Segal movies that he craps out every few months.

>>32088774
Gee. Maybe because 30 minutes of a 2 hour movie Brad Pitt stops to play house with those 2 German bitches. Snoozefest.

>>32091884
I'm glad you're not a commander of anyone.

>Driver, move forward! Once we're out of the incendiary cloud, stop!
>They just put more smoke on us. That's not very fair, now is it? Driver, move forward, again.
>Fucking god dammit, this shit is getting frustrating. Forward.
>AMERICANS AND YOUR OVERPOWERED FUCKING SMOKE SHELLS HOLY SHIT

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>>32088774

General retardation in every scene.

Also perpetuates the stupid meme of 5 Shermans to 1 Tiger.

Also far more grim and cynical than the war was. The WW2 vets who saw it were pretty outraged the US forces behaved like depraved criminals.

Not to mention the combat depiction in the movie is John Woo-tier.

>>32088793

>My impression is that it was pointlessly edgy.

Same here.

They went to extreme lengths to try to make it look grim, but the results were comical at best - like that scene were a tank is hit by a Panzerfaust, so the injured crew man jumps out of his tank, runs onto the middle of the road and stares the other American tankers in the eyes and shoots himself in the head. Haha.

Whoever wrote that is a fucking manchild who played too much COD2.

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>>32090624

Oh look, those look nothing like that crap in the movie...

>>32091921
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjPkBKZXy74

>injured crew man jumps out of his tank,
'Injured' meaning 'on fucking fire.'

And it's really more like 'flopping' out of his tank, than anything.

>runs onto the middle of the road
He does no such thing.

>stares the other American tankers in the eyes
Again, does no such thing.

>shoots himself in the head.
There are so many thousands of psychological factors that surround such a situation, it'd be a waste of time to even bother with this. Yes, he shot himself. He was also on fire and screaming bloody murder.

Jesus Christ. You people make up the dumbest shit to complain about this movie.

>>32091884
I don't think trying to make America looks like the underdog this was the case here, or at least it wasn't that simple.
Imagine the following: you take the film's quiet drama scenes, the dialogue, characters and all that, and replace the battles. Instead of Easy Eights, put the characters into a company of M26 Pershings with full air and artillery support, slaughtering their way through crumbling Germany without taking a scratch, and the final scene is them just getting shitfaced and pissing on German POW column from atop the bridge.
If you do that, all the dialogue, American interactions with Germans, etc, start making much more sense, there is no discrepancy, and the film is that much more realistic.
>>32091903
WW2 was pitch-black, even on the Western front. See >>32089281 for an easy example. Allied soldiers weren't Soviets, and certainly weren't Nazis, but they were brutal, as any soldier in any war. It's just how things always were. And I don't know what vets you're talking about, the interviewees I've read about praised Fury for authenticity.
>>32091921
Let's see how rationally you behave when concussed and covered with sticky burning fuel.

>>32091899

That was a great scene with great tension. You can always skip it on the DVD to get to the 'splosions.

>>32091899
You have to be at least 18 in order to use this website.

>>32091934
This post just kind of personifies this thread.

Butthurt wehrboos making shit up and saying "fuck you" to reality while doing it.

>>32091360
>All your arguments would apply in 1942. In 1945 that Tiger probably was on the verge of breaking down and crewed by a crew of 16-year olds, and lucky to function at all.

All very stupid assumptions. You can go read a book about Tiger units in 1945.

>>32090633
>western culture conditioning has taught you that men do not become like a god with the power to do anything within imagination when socioeconomic status and moral boundaries have been thrown out the window

>>32088786
>Literally_WWII_The_Eastern_Front.gif

It helps that the things break down from a stern look.

>>32092005
And that's exactly how the war started in real life. German nationalism is inherently built on delusion. Maybe they are just secret masochists who actually subconsciously enjoy being invaded, annexed and culturally enrich every once in a while.
>>32092007
No one doubts they existed. The quality and performance of those units is another matter entirely.

>>32091993
No. It wasn't. It was dog shit.
>>32092000
Jesus Christ, you and him must be kissless virgins. Well over 18, it was shit. Maybe if they shortened the scene by 1/3 it'd be tolerable.

>>32091564

>His line of sight was blocked by white phosphorous.

Uh-huh, and you have a reverse gear.

Not:

>Commander, can't see shit!

>RAMMING SPEED!

>>32092036
Wall is in your face.

Take a step back.

Guess what's still in your face?

Line of sight isn't magically restored by reversing.

>>32092034
If you have this sort of attention span and interests at 18, you should consult your therapist and get prescription for Adderall.

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>>32091596

>It pretty much was. They were known for being too be told not to run into their own artillery barrages

You obviously know almost nothing about the various fighting units of the Waffen-SS, some of whom were the most formidable, professional and competent units every fielded in WW2.

Most German strategic operations hinged on the performance of premium Waffen-SS units and armor. Their fighting spirit and skill were unmatched, only one unit from the entire Wehrmacht came close and that was Grossdeutschland.

You have to be 18 to post here.

>>32092052
If you like that shit, take another estrogen pill and go watch a chick flick while you're bf fondles your feminine penis.

Scene was way too long. You aren't 18. The entire premise was "oh we better accommodate them so they don't flat out rape us." Stop calling other people kids, you fucking kid.

>>32092081
You might actually have real no-joke autism.

>>32092089
I'd say something like that if I couldn't articulate an argument too.

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>>32091967
>>32091975

>Making excuses for a shitty ass, comic-book based fantasy pseudo-war movie which depicts Americans as subhuman villains and rapists, Germans as subhuman, suicidal zombies, a comical depiction of combat with no basis in reality or even attempting to learn tactics, no historical realism whatsoever and perpetuating cliches and myths.

Kill yourself. You obviously don't belong here if this appeals to you.

>>32088990

>SS
>Best of the best
>Units made up of random rabble that wanted to take a shot at Ivan

This better be b8.

>>32092028
>No one doubts they existed. The quality and performance of those units is another matter entirely.

No, I mean you can actually go buy or pirate a book, from any one of the published Tiger tank commanders, who operated into 1945, and actually learn how they operated and who they operated along side of, instead of making bizarre theories pulled straight from your asshole.

>>32092051

Wow dude, you're stupid. It saddens me that my tax dollars pay for your meth addiction.

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>>32092125
>Oh shit he called me on my bullshit, and with a clip of the scene to boot. I better tell him to kill himself.

/k/ really is cancer, these days.

>>32092149
Do you have an actual argument?

>>32091975

>US soliders
>Brutal
>For taking advantage of whores

Nigga wut?

Unless you are burning whole villages down because of partisans or scorch earth tactics, shoot most of the prisoners since you can't transport them or afford the manpower loss to guard them and every once in a while have your lieutenant have a nice short trip into the woods with a loaded pistol and the unit rapist. Then you don't know what brutal is.

Fucking hell even the French and Brits where more brutal than Americans in WW2 in Europe.

>>32092051

>Sight blocked
>Reverse
>Find different path with less obstructions towards target

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>>32092153

It's still a retarded grim dark scene that never once occurred IRL.

The manchild COD2 ranked server veteran who authored that part of the script obviously saw this footage:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBI9d0-IfEM

But it wasn't dramatic enough, so they had to increase the retardation by 100% with an unrealistic, gratuitous and implausible suicide.


But he didn't find it dramatic enough

>>32092185
>Get more smoke in your face after taking a disproportionately long time to re-position the tank, all the time under threatening enemy fire and having drifting white phosphorous swirling around your engine intakes.

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>>32092171

Well you're too retarded obviously to notice that the Tiger was sitting in an open field and had ample room to maneuver and reverse without obstruction, so investing any time into your autism would be a terrible waste of my day.

This thread would be best served if you just wandered back to /d/ or /mlp/ or whatever depraved cesspit your crawled out of.

>>32092200

>disproprotinately long time
>reverse for 30 seconds
>twist left or right for 15
>advance for 30 seconds

>Reverse 50m-100m
>Still have White Phosphorous on your tank

I didn't know that the Long Tom fired Willy Pete.

>threathening enemy fire

All the more reason to retreat, If you get shot at your immediate response will not be fix bayonets and charge.

>>32092200
>so lets just advance into said fire

Dumbass.

>>32088774
last tank scene

>sit down in the field for hours, shooting bullets towards a tank instead of flanking or using the 1529215 panzerfausts which was seen in the scene when they were marching

>engaging when they're at the tank instead of when they're approaching on the road

>>32092200

>LARPing about a movie made for the Xbox demographic.

Consider killing yourself.

>>32092195
>It's still a retarded grim dark scene that never once occurred IRL.
No soldier, ever, in human history has ever killed himself irl? Wow, you must be a real historian.

>The manchild COD2 ranked server veteran who authored that part of the script obviously saw this footage:
He also obviously heard the story of Audy Murphy, since he was paying homage to that engagement in the last battle scene. He also must have seen Greatest Military Clashes on the Discovery Channel in 2003, since it was an episode of this series that started the Tiger vs. a platoon of Shermans meme.

None of this has anything to do with anything, though. You dislike the movie, so you made up some stupid shit that never happened and got proven wrong. Sorry your ego is that fragile.

>>32092250
>No soldier, ever, in human history has ever killed himself irl? Wow, you must be a real historian.

Not once under such circumstances. Human instinct forbids it.

>>32092230
>I didn't know that the Long Tom fired Willy Pete.
Irrelevant. This conversation isabout advancing M4s. You're proposing the Tiger should have wasted time on maneuvers that would be ineffectual in diffusing the situation.

>All the more reason to retreat, If you get shot at your immediate response will not be fix bayonets and charge.
It might be if your line of sight is blocked and you're being beset upon by an enemy that is faster than you.

>>32092240
>Dumbass.
Alternatively, have your lungs conflagration from sitting in white phosphorous. Or reverse and allow Shermans to just overrun you while you still can't see anything.

You'd make a good soldier.

>>32092247
I don't think you know what LARPing is.

>>32092273

Not to mention the deep dark thoughts of suicide happen when things get quiet and you are all alone with them.

>>32092273
>People kill themselves over family problems, economic troubles, neglect, etc all the time.
>No one would ever kill themselves to end pain and suffering that there is no escape from.
>'Human instinct forbids it.'
No, it doesn't.

Keep making stuff up, though.

>>32092273
No him, but what fucking instinct? You're stunned and brain-damaged from explosion, shocked, covered in sticky, burning oil. At this moment, that officer wasn't even a human being, he was just a burning, screaming brainstem, all he could think of is making that pain stop. You've clearly never been in pain, you fucking sheltered pussy.

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>>32092282

>Doubling down on a failed, unrealistic, Windtalkers-tier chick-flick.

Guys, I know how we always call each other autists and such, but I genuinely believe we have a live one here....


Dear lord. Containment procedures in effect, right fucking NOW!

>>32092282

>Irrelevant. This conversation isabout advancing M4s. You're proposing the Tiger should have wasted time on maneuvers that would be ineffectual in diffusing the situation.

The WP has limited effective area retard, that's what my hyperbole is about. And it's not fucking wasting time.

YOU DO NOT ADVANCE IN UNKNOWN CONDITIONS WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE TO

>It might be if your line of sight is blocked and you're being beset upon by an enemy that is faster than you.

Again retard, open field, limited covered area, good vision outside of the WP zone.

WHY IN THE NAME OF FUCK WOULD YOU ADVANCE THROUGH IT AND NOT GO AROUND IT OR RETREAT?

>>32092250
>>32092300

Samefag.

Stop making excuses for a terrible, lightweight flick.

>>32092286
In Iraq we had to send a guy home. No could find him. After 4 hours we did, sitting in a tent, m16 condition 0, getting ready to suck start it. Fucking pussy, he was a Jew also if it makes stormfags giggle.

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>>32092302
>I don't have an argument.
>Better call him an autist.
Come on, Anon. Come up with something. I know you can do it.

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>>32092302
>>32092309

>>32092305
>NOT GO AROUND IT
Reversing, turning, shifting gear forwards, and turning again yields only more smoke in your face if the Shermans aren't on top of you already.

>RETREAT?
Shermans moving forward are faster than Tigers moving in reverse.

>>32092332

>Reversing, turning, shifting gear forwards, and turning again yields only more smoke in your face if the Shermans aren't on top of you already.

The tiger is now powered by steam power m8

>Shermans moving forward are faster than Tigers moving in reverse.

Smoke like tracer works both ways, if you can't see the enemy nor can they. You need not outrun them, just get behind the smoke, not to mention the Tiger tank is equipped with this innovation known as a turret, the gun can be pointed at the shermans, which are too close together might I add, while you are busy getting out of the smoke.

I wish I could ask about a place where I can find real actual discussion of weapons and matters of warfare and not a cage of mentally ill degenerates throwing shit at one another, but then again, if I myself knew of such a place, I'd have never told anyone about it for the fear of attracting exactly the sort of "discussion" that dominates not only this board, but also this website and all of the Internet. This is why people like Legionfag and Oppenheimer were stuck here - they just didn't know where else to go.

>>32092374

Go find a small forum or other small comunity, or people in person.

Usually for actual discussion I do so on a small forum in my language or just talk over Team Speak with my budds.

>>32092363
>The tiger is now powered by steam power m8
Never said it was.

>Smoke like tracer works both ways, if you can't see the enemy nor can they.
Except the Shermans were already making best speed at the Tiger. They know where it is. If it tries to maneuver around the smoke cloud, they fire more smoke at it if they aren't on top of it already. The only way they could not see it is if it reverses, in which case they win again because they move faster than it can get away.

Moving forward was the most direct, fastest way to clear the smoke cloud. If they stopped, they would get more smoke on top of them.

SOrry. That's just how it goes.

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>>32089281

LOL! There's a *huge* queue there!

She sure got enough sausage and protein that day. And the next. And the day after that. And...yeah.

Nevertheless, a nicer fate than getting caught by slav pieces of shit.

>>32092282
>you'd make a good soldier

By your standard, you'd be a fantastic one for running straight into an enemy field of fire and not taking advantage of the enemy's inability to see you.

>>32092374
We have real discussion. Just ignore shit posts.

Please don't act like this thread should be ultra serious. We are discussing a Hollywood movie. It's your expectations that are wrong.

>>32088990
The most retarded trip fag on earth

>>32092440
Move forward when it is the best option. In this case, it was the only effective option.

>>32092421

>Except the Shermans were already making best speed at the Tiger. They know where it is. If it tries to maneuver around the smoke cloud, they fire more smoke at it if they aren't on top of it already. The only way they could not see it is if it reverses, in which case they win again because they move faster than it can get away.

>They know where it is
>While both moving
>Lacking proper fire on the move capability
>They will not make any adjustments themselves while in the smoke
>They will all 3 go at full speed and possibly collide either with each other or with a 50 ton tank in a low visibility enviroment
>While spamming the gun into the smoke and emptying the ready rack and fatiguing the gunner and loader

Do you know how tanks work, especially WW2 tanks?

Or their tactics?

>Moving forward was the most direct, fastest way to clear the smoke cloud. If they stopped, they would get more smoke on top of them.

So?

Just because it's fast and direct doesn't make it smart, advancing into the force shooting at you when you can't see them or fire at them is beyond retarded, something a tiger commander would not do unless he had a Wittman complex as Tigers where given to better crews than other vehicles

Fastest way of a cliff is jumping down, yet nobody recommends that.

>>32092488
>>Lacking proper fire on the move capability
>Do you know how tanks work, especially WW2 tanks?
I do. I also know that the M4 was partially stabilized. Not to mention that they were already moving when they were laying smoke.

>>They will all 3 go at full speed and possibly collide either with each other or with a 50 ton tank in a low visibility enviroment
What? Their goal is to surround the Tiger. Not drive through the smoke screen allowing them to do just that.

>Just because it's fast and direct doesn't make it smart, advancing into the force shooting at you when you can't see them or fire at them is beyond retarded, something a tiger commander would not do unless he had a Wittman complex as Tigers where given to better crews than other vehicles
Your proposed solution would be to expose vulnerable side armor and delay in maneuvers that would afford the Tiger crew less overall time to engage the enemy before being surrounded.

Driving forward was the only viable option.

>Fastest way of a cliff is jumping down, yet nobody recommends that.
Has no relation to the situation being discussed.

>>32092374

It's a crappy movie. The shit flinging in this thread is proof of it.

The only people defending it are mentally ill or had some sort of stake in the production of the movie.

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>>32088774
Didn't Shia lebouf have an actual tooth knocked out for that role?

>>32092553
>The only people defending it are mentally ill or had some sort of stake in the production of the movie.
Yeah, ad hominems and name calling are common debate tactics when one side doesn't have any idea of what they're talking about.

>>32092543

>I do. I also know that the M4 was partially stabilized.

Only 2 units out of the whole US Army knew how to use it not to mention by partial stabilizing it means that the gun bounces around less meaning less wear and tear on the mount, not actually counter enough for a stable shot or counter act gun recoil.

>Not to mention that they were already moving when they were laying smoke.

Again dumb thing

>What? Their goal is to surround the Tiger. Not drive through the smoke screen allowing them to do just that.

Moving in a tight 3 formation is not gonna do that, if they plan to surround it they will have to go around the smoke which will take time as you said and slow them down considerably.

>Your proposed solution would be to expose vulnerable side armor and delay in maneuvers that would afford the Tiger crew less overall time to engage the enemy before being surrounded.
>Expose vulnerable side armor
>Going backwards

>Driving forward was the only viable option.

Please tell me you don't have a drivers license.

>Has no relation to the situation being discussed.
>Danger straight ahead
>Best way to deal with it is to drive straight ahead closer to danger

Do you have assburger syndrome or something?

>>32092579

There's that mental illness kicking in. Can you afford professional help? If not, I'm sure a Church can try to counsel you.

>>32092578
Yes, the cut on his face was real too and he would take a razor to reopen it every day. He also converted to Christianity.

He went hard and deep for this role

>>32092581
>Only 2 units out of the whole US Army knew how to use it not to mention by partial stabilizing it means that the gun bounces around less meaning less wear and tear on the mount, not actually counter enough for a stable shot or counter act gun recoil.
Your claim that only two units in the Army knew how to use it is false. You'll never be able to substantiate that.

Plenty of publications make clear the usefulness of the gun stabilizer in actual firing. Saying that it was only for preservation of the mounting is rather silly. You'll need a source for that.

>Again dumb thing
How so?

>Moving in a tight 3 formation is not gonna do that, if they plan to surround it they will have to go around the smoke which will take time as you said and slow them down considerably.
They are fairly spread out as it is in the scene. And moving forward while turning takes substantially less time than it does to change gear, reverse, change gear, turn, move forward, and lay the gun on a new target.

You're really pulling at straws.

>Expose vulnerable side armor
>Going backwards
Considering that you have repeatedly said you wanted it to turn in order to get around the smoke cloud, yes. That exposes it.

>Do you have assburger syndrome or something?
>>32092601
>There's that mental illness kicking in. Can you afford professional help? If not, I'm sure a Church can try to counsel you.
Ah, the sweet sound of wehraboo frustration. If you guys can't formulate an argument, why are you wasting our time?

>>32092664

>How so?
>Have the whole field to maneuver
>Can already start diverging to make the sorounding quicker
>Pack in close to increase the risk of colision

>They are fairly spread out as it is in the scene. And moving forward while turning takes substantially less time than it does to change gear, reverse, change gear, turn, move forward, and lay the gun on a new target.

Let's see:

Turn:
>Drop breaks on both sides to slow down then on one side long enough for a turn while loosing most of the speed

Reverse

>break
>change gear
>accelerate

Not much of a difference

>Considering that you have repeatedly said you wanted it to turn in order to get around the smoke cloud, yes. That exposes it.

That's after you get out of the smoke and a bit behind it and if by then the shermans don't show up.

>Ah, the sweet sound of wehraboo frustration. If you guys can't formulate an argument, why are you wasting our time?
>Spend multiple posts arguing with you
>One final sentence in one of the posts that is not meant to be an argument or be presented as such means I can't formulate arguments

So how far down the assburger scale are you?

>>32092553
You realize most people on this board have 0 concept of what real war is like, don't you?

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>>32092663
>He also converted to Christianity

There's something about this line right here that doesn't make sense to me. Surely you mean he just went to church or read the Bible or just generally furthered his understanding of christianity?

>>32089342
I thought it only took one, and it was a glancing blow off the side.
Could be misremembering.

>>32092727
>Can already start diverging to make the sorounding quicker
>Pack in close to increase the risk of colision
You said the fact that they laid smoke while on the move was dumb. Don't backpedal. Tell me why that was dumb.

>Not much of a difference
Absolutely gigantic difference, if you know how the transmissions of the vehicles of the period (and, more acurately, the vehicles in question) work.

The M4s can do all that without having to stop. The Tiger will have to move, stop, turn, and move again. None of which will be done at its full speed.

>So how far down the assburger scale are you?
Not very. It's not relevant to the conversation, anyway. Why are you trying to distract the topic?

>>32092747
It took a glancing round on its side armor (This one's dubious.)

And then the Tiger skipped a round off of its front hull at the most shallow angle possible. This one was entirely correct; the round absolutely would not have penetrated anything from such an impact. There was nothing to even bite in to.

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>>32092753

>You said the fact that they laid smoke while on the move was dumb. Don't backpedal. Tell me why that was dumb.

You can miss

>Absolutely gigantic difference, if you know how the transmissions of the vehicles of the period (and, more acurately, the vehicles in question) work.

It's not that hard to slow down a vehicle on soft ground to it's stand still and the M4 might not have to stop but it has to slow down a fair bit otherwise it risks topling over.

>Not very. It's not relevant to the conversation, anyway. Why are you trying to distract the topic?

Again I know all that, and so do you, so how far down the scale are you?

>>32088774
The whole move was "ok" no big horror in term of senario.
The /k/ related cringe:
>Tiger scene:
For drama intent the scene didn't make scene, first there is obvious editing glitch when the Fury get behind the Tiger: the cannon position of the Tiger switch at every panel with no logic, then the position of the fury make no sense either. Second with his 76mm cannon the Fury could have just shot in the side of the Tiger and it would have worked perfectly.
>the ending scene:
We're hitting high levels of improbability but it's still possible.

>>32092773
The side one was also against the logs, right?

>>32092663
Not sure if that's dedication or his usual brand of ridiculousness

Shia's been kinda "off" ever since he broke away from starring in the transformers movies

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It wasn't a bad movie but it wasn't great

I liked coon-ass cause he reminded me of my TL

Diversity cut scene
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHYq_37y5lg

American ruffians cut scene
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fU8NNM91iaA

Chocolate bar cut scene
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk-xMr56ccY

Don't remember if this one is cut or not, but eSeS is ebil :DDDD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xREH8hYAip4

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>>32094072

Jesus...

>>32092005

>Is presented with a cut scene showing a laser-like 10 foot long green beam floating through solid objects

>Calls them Wehraboo


Yep, butthurt autistic case confirmed, the other anons summed you up nicely.

>>32092436

My 16 year old grandfather was sodomized by British troops.

You're the same as Slav-niggers.

>>32088774
i don't give a shit about the technical stuff, the accuracy, or the cinematography.

the fucking writing blew worse than my wife. war movies are reduced to endless cliches and bullshit

>>32094223
That must of been a nice dinner time story.

>>32088774
In the first tank battle the 76mm Shermans would have been able to comfortably penetrate the Tiger from the front at that range.

>>32094297

And what range is that?

>>32088793
>My impression is that it was pointlessly edgy.

I appreciate that they wanted to make it more gritty and realistic than the prototypical Clark Gable American war film, but it's like they just got lazy an went for the other extreme. Aesthetically they aren't too far off, for the time and place it's probably one of the better physical depictions of the dogfaces in their OD Mackinaw coats, which were often criticized by commanders for looking like homeless rags, but making every country boy in the film out to be a slack jawed murderer is obviously the bias of the writers.

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>>32094476

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>>32092172
>Fucking hell even the French and Brits where more brutal than Americans in WW2 in Europe.
Complete horseshit detected. Americans were seen as barbarians. Which is why they didn't take POWs (or shot them after they got them, wew warcrimes) and Germans usually shot them as well in return. Same could not be said for the Brits.

This movie is basically a gigantic masturbatory fantasy of how Americans would like to see themselves. Fighting against overwhelming odds for some pure and noble idea.
Instead what really happened was the largest most powerful countries in the world set out to destroy a much, much smaller geopolitical and financial thorn in their side, long before the war proper even began.
And they've been feeding their people -and every other people under their defacto rule- this shit for generations so now people actually believe it.

I think it's pretty clear to all why Germany was so completely and utterly destroyed, culturally and socially speaking (complete with a US-engineered holocaust) while Japan, for example, faired much better in that regard. On needs only look for the post-war plans for Germany. :^^^|

>>32091599
but this is at night.

>>32088774
The two issues that stood out to me the most were that the Tiger charged forward to engage tanks which were substantially more maneuverable than itself, who's guns turned faster. Basically a guarantee that you'll get yourself shot in the ass exactly like they did. Second issue was the ending scene, specifically when the germans nailed them with the RPG. Why didn't they just shoot it into Fury's engine, igniting the tank and almost guaranteeing that they'd immediately kill everyone in the tank? Also the commander gets shot multiple times in the chest and still lives long enough to do the whole heroic sacrifice thing, when in reality he probably would have been unconscious within seconds due to massive trauma or plummeting blood pressure.

>>32095349
>for some pure and noble idea

I liked at the end where Pitt didn't give some long melodramatic speech about dignity and duty, he just said "this is my home" and they stuck around. Compared to Hank's speech in Saving Private Ryan, which felt pulled straight from Robert Redford in A Bridge Too Far.

>>32091360
t. i eat american revisionism for breakfast
you are fucking brainwshed cletus, go fuck your sister in your pick up

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>>32092172
>the unit rapist
naughty naughty

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Love seeing all the butthurt wehraboo's

>>32094072
>Don't remember if this one is cut or not, but eSeS is ebil :DDDD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xREH8hYAip4

They were, loved seeing SS cocksucker get owned :D

>>32088828
Found the guy who never fired a belt-fed weapon.

>>32095897
t. Asspained wehraboo

>>32089144
By 45 (and earlier) the SS was drawing a lot of manpower from prisons. And were receiving minimal training. Still doesn't mean that a company of them wouldn't BTFO a disabled tank.

>>32090830
They would have known about the specifics of the Tiger from the one the Brits captured in Tunisia in 43. Armor-wise the Tiger I didn't vary much model to model.

>>32088774
there wasn't a single thing that seemed real about it

contrived 'war is bad mmmkay' story line
tracers looked like star wars lasers
homosexual tension between brad pitt and shia lebouf
contrived, cliche characters
unrealistic warfare
stupid pointless story
main protagonist had zero development, one minute was peaceful guy the next he was frothing at the mouth kill da nazis muthafuckaaaaaaaaaaa


overall if you didn't sperg on the autistic points that kommandos love to pick apart, the overall story was incredibly lame and something that you would see from a banal 50s WW2 movie just with modern levels of violence instead of something insightful or interesting

>>32088774
I was basically a movie about fags.
Fags in a tank.
Wardaddy?
Any one who fought in WWII would cut the face off of any other soldier callin him daddy.

Movie should have been called Tank Boys.

>>32091736
Love it

>>32091934
Watch the tracer go through this guy in slo-mo, dumbass.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=8c4cfc9028

>>32092067
Common in all armies where you are marching infantry or armor behind a pre-planned rolling barrage.

WWI: See the (US) 28th Infantry Regiment at Cantigny (a masterful attack and hard won victory [Soldiers were almost running into the rolling barrage in the initial attack]).

WWII: See the 37th Armor Battalion (under brilliant Creighton Abrams) attack into towns during the Bastogne breakout campaign on the heels of artillery barrages. They (Armor companies) were in the towns as the last rounds were falling.

This *is* "how it is done". Pros do it this way {stay on the coattails of the arty barrage}.

>>32088774
/k/ only has one problem with Fury, and it's the same problem is has with everything else /k/ dislikes:

It's well-known and popular.

>>32091599
Why does everything keep exploding?

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>>32088774
Felt as though Brad Pitt was forcing his voice acting and lines and not letting it flow as naturally as he has done in other movies.

In Inglorious Bastards it had a comedic satire to the movie so the voice fit, but it feels like he tried to transition it into this movie and the seriousness of it felt like an undertone.

Honestly that was about it. It was a really entertaining flick with good action scenes and a full circle that good 'coming of age' story should have. Happy I payed 7.99 to see it in the theaters.

>>32091885
The scenes of them in the turret in the first third of the movie were 100% accurate. I know because i was a tanker. Everything else in the movie was shit.

>>32088774
I couldn't figure out why the German's just didn't run like a 1/4 mile around the tank at the end of the movie, then hit it from all sides. Seemed kind of dumb to have everyone keep running at the front of it.

>>32094202
Only the guy on the left got hit by the MG42. The other tracer is not 'floating through solid objects'. It's behind that soldier. You might not realize this but there's a little thing called 'perspective'. In case you didn't realize, in those pictures the tourists aren't really holding up the leaning tower of Pisa.

>>32088774
Probably one of the first fights when they are going to kill the anti tank guns in the wood line. The half tracks were already hit and destroyed. Then when Brad pit and his faggot crew roll up in a tank the German guns somehow weren't dialed in anymore and they were shooting high.

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>>32088990
L A F F I N

The SS a shit except one or two elements. It was not unlike, say, SEAL Team 6. Except ST6, you know, is actually good. The SS was a political and propaganda tool made up of fanatic nutcases who thought Hitler was the messiah. Much like yourself it seems, ya fucking wehraboo.

>>32098712
>a political
Yes - as an army branch independent from Heer.

>propaganda tool
Not anymore than any other military force that nazis had.

>of fanatic nutcases who thought Hitler was the messiah
This is bad for their performance how?

>The SS a shit except one or two elements
If we are talking about actual WAFFEN-SS combat units than it's more like "except for a better half of it". They received better armament, better recruits, better material, better supply compared to the Wehrmacht forces, and were used more carefully - and thus survived longer and gained more experience, especially on the Ostfront. Of course, the larger Schutzstaffel organization included MP-tier scrubs like units of concentration camp guards and occupation forces, but those were explicitly not Waffen-SS.

Waffen-SS were never ZE BESTETS OF ZE BEST, but they usually meant quite more troubles as opponents than some yet another panzerdivision due to generally better supply, equipment and experience. That's just how it is.

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So what are all of /k/'s problems with Saving Private Ryan?

>>32099166
Spielberg kikery.

>>32088774
They killed that nice egg eating german girl.
Other than that I thought it was a good movie.

>>32091934
why would the germans dig a bunch of fox holes in the middle of a big field with no where to go and nothing to defend when theres a nice ridge line to hide in and set up ambush

US Army Staff Sergeant tries to force buck privet nobody to commit a war crime around dozens of others just for the sake of being edgy. Drunk soldiers blowing up a piano as they are using it. Because edgy. For some reason Tiger refuses to turn its turret. For some reason the SS troops fight the tank head on and they defeat over 100 soldiers who are armed with lots of panzerfausts and panzershreks. They dont use them

>>32099166
I don't really have any, it's made by people who don't have autism when it comes to World War 2 so they over look a few details and the movie is generally pretty decent in every other other way. I can understand the criticisms about Fury though, the actual movie is just pretty bad putting aside autism. Like the battle at the cross roads just made no sense to me and kind of just shit up my opinion of the entire movie. If that whole scene wasn't there I'd have a lot better opinion of Fury, again in the context that it's made by Hollywood and not WW2 history autists.

>>32100057
This desu~

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>>32088990
There are different kinds of SS units
>Crack Combat Proven units
>Meh Tier volunteers
>Garbage
>Worse than Garbage
>Kill their own officers bad
The guys in the film a probably lower on the list.

>>32098882

>Waffen-SS were never ZE BESTETS OF ZE BEST, but they usually meant quite more troubles as opponents than some yet another panzerdivision due to generally better supply, equipment and experience. That's just how it is.

Overall inexperience was one of the biggest weaknesses of the Waffen-SS, their high-casualty tactics meant that you had a lot more turnover, a lot less average experience in the ranks, and an NCO corps that was being chewed through very quickly, which is especially bad when doctrine calls for a lot of NCO autonomy. On the Western Front, Waffen SS were not used more conservatively than Heer units. In fact, looking at the deployment of Waffen SS units during Operation Cobra, one might make the conclusion that von Kluge threw the Waffen SS into the way of the advancing Americans so the more effective Heer units could retreat first. The 1st and 2nd SS panzer divisions lost a combined 450 tanks and around 80% of their infantrymen in the next 3 weeks, and had to be completely rebuilt for the Ardennes offensive.

The part about them getting better equipment is true, much to the chagrin of the Heer, who would preferred to have that equipment themselves. Combined with the overall high casualty rates of Waffen SS units in combat, this meant they were giving valuable equipment to units that were politically reliable but not as competent, and losing that equipment at a faster rater than Heer units.

The true asset of the "elite" units of the Waffen SS is their fanaticism. In situations where Heer units would have surrendered or retreated, Waffen SS units could stand and fight, and inflict some casualties on the enemy while suffering horrendous casualties themselves. Allied soldiers had little appetite for dying to a fanatical defender when it looked like the war could be over before Christmas.

>>32088774
Brad was way too sexy

>>32091450
>fausts
>rifles
>MGs
>tons of men
>still literally charges a tank with shovels

>>32095349

The Americans were seen as barbarians in comparison to whom? The Nazis? Probably not? The Soviets? Definitely not.

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>>32088990
The end was not too unbelievable.

>>32095349
Go home, /pol/nigger.

>>32100607
Germans had by far the lowest instances of raping and looting.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Also; "the nazis".

Why did they let the ss spread out before attacking? Wouldn't it have been better to slap the shit out of them while they marching grouped up?

>>32100607
>The Soviets? Definitely not.
As Red Army moved through Poland Stalin issued an order for summary execution as punishment for rape, and they were looting rather as much as everyone else, American propaganda memes aside.

>>32101513
They had the highest instances of exterminating entire towns and villages to a man, after which it's technically no longer looting. Those tens of millions of civilian casualties on the side of Soviets and Allies did not happen just from kikery.

>>32102154
Sources and sources?

>>32099892
Because it was needed for the movie to show normies how combined arms work in a nice flat obvious battle.

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>>32097650

This. You've summarized my thoughts exactly.

>>32088787
This, literally the only thing Fury threads do is attract the autists who want to show off how much they know by nitpicking flaws in a Hollywood flick so they can feel good about themselves for having read a couple of basic armored warfare books. I don't know how many times I've seen the
>TRACERS LOOK LIKE LASERS WTFOMG
complaints from people who base their knowledge on what actual tracer fire looks like on video game and movie depictions.

>>32098465

>Tries to rationalize outright flaws

Pathetic.

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>>32102283

Except it only showed normies how war is NOT fought.

Now the idiots are going to think you assault the enemy by driving 4 tanks line abreast into an enemy ambush, and hopefully the PAK guns in concealment all miss their shots and your own tanks, nailed them accurately, on the move, and then drive over the skulls of the German retards who obviously don't know how to fight a defensive war, and dug a trench in the open and have no AT hand-held weapons, while your infantry (who are underpaid extras) pull off some OPERATOR tier bullshit in the background like rolling around sideways under fire.

Honestly, that opening "battle" was the stupidest depiction of combat I think I've ever seen. They did it better in the 60s and 70s with far less gratuitous and gruesome violence.

Frankly the film left me with a bad taste in my mouth.

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>>32105134
>and have no AT hand-held weapons
People who critique movies without having seen them need to fucking hang, but that's par for the course for Fury threads.

>>32088774

-THE SHIT-TIER "LUNCH" SCENE
-THE SHIT-TIER END BATTLE
-CRAPTASTIC DIALOG WITH LITTLE TO NO PERIOD JARGON OR SLANG, BUT LOTS OF MODERN DAY TALK
-UNLIKABLE CHARACTERS
-WEAK ACTING

OVERALL: C MINUS

SEE "BOB" FOR FAR SUPERIOR WWII FILMMAKING

>>32088774
When will Hollywood stop making WW2 movies? There is no stone left unturned, even a movie about saving art pieces came out. Their beating a dead horse endlessly.

>>32106507
When they stop making money.

>>32088774
>casting even stevens in a "serious" movie
c'mon now.

>>32106515
I understand , it doesn't interest me anymore. I am sure 20 years from now a "new" WW2 movie on top of the 100 more due before then will come out in this endless loop of WW2 movies.

>>32106553
People like it because it's seen more of a war about good vs. evil. As opposed to every conflict we've had sense.

>>32106528
That beaners a shit fucking actor too. In fact, Brad Pitt is a pretty fucking horrendous actor as well

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>>32106515

>>32106582
honestly, i completely forgot that hollywood's token beaner was in the movie. he's that forgettable.

>>32092273
You're fucking retarded

>>32088774

I liked it because Allies were obviously the bad guys.

>>32094223
Bet his boipussi was choice back in the day

>>32088774
My biggest problem is that it isn't a very good film.

>>32088774

Excessive edginess and unlikable characters.

>>32094072
I saw all of those scenes when I saw it in theaters? Did they cut it later?

>>32089281
That guy in back with a camera

>>32106507

>There is no stone left unturned

There's like a million fascinating angles/stories about WW2 that filmmakers have NEVER committed to film. I mean seriously, do you even think for a second before this kind of stupidity spills out of your mind? Study the war for 3 or 4 years and then come back and talk to us.

>>32091423
it seemed to me they were a volksgrenadier unit which, if they were using soldiers from other branches such as the Luftwaffe or the Kriegsmarine would make a slightly better point and would explain why they seemed to have somewhat effective individual units with a mass of "zhukov human wave guize!" tier units overall, and would also explain late war camo smocks and better weapons.

>>32088793
Thread

Hatedg the fucking film. Stupid af

>>32091967
Idiot

>>32088828
>I want to fit in and criticize something I know fuck all about so I'm going to make up something that's actually wrong

kill yourself

>>32091403
Truuuu, but just remember...

Eastern Front= Untrained Farmers with zero combat knowledge other than we shoot at each other and charge blyat

Western Front= Actually trained soldiers who were taught actual tactics and how to actually use their weapons

:^)

>>32099166

GI's die in pain and agony making their suffering clear and creating sympathy for them.
Stormtrooper germans all die very quick and possible suffering is blurred out and only shown from a far. Furthermore the wehrmacht soldiers all have shaved heads and look like rats.
It's very subtle and well made propaganda piece. Gobbels would've been proud.

>>32111959
That the thread was on page 10 and this retard bumped it.

>>32111963
As did you.

>>32110439
>who were taught actual tactics and how to actually use their weapons
more like

sherman zerg rush kekekeke. The allied soldiers of the Western Front weren't as combat experienced or well armed as their adversaries the Germans. They did have numerical and material superiority; most importantly air supremacy

>>32112048
Nope, I saged newfag

I really liked it

Fuck the haters. At least it was somewhat different to the 999999999999 MURRICA WW2 released since '45

was still MURICA though

>>32111959
The Germans are fighting for Hitler. Why should we have sympathy?

>>32112287
Not him. I don't disagree with you necessarily. But you know not all of them had a choice right?

>>32088774
The Tiger fight was a fucking joke.

1. The Tiger would never have driven into the middle of a field, that's just stupid
2. At that range, the 76 on the Sherman should go right through the front of a Tiger. Those shots shouldn't be bouncing.
3.This is 1945. It should be a Tiger II, the number of Tiger 1s on the Western Front at that point was single digits.

>>32112300
Course not. But Hitler still has to die, and they're kind of in the way.

>>32106311

>CRAPTASTIC DIALOG WITH LITTLE TO NO PERIOD JARGON OR SLANG, BUT LOTS OF MODERN DAY TALK

This is a big one.

These people talk and act like modern American White trash and ghetto hoodlums.

The mannerisms of people in the 1940s were very different. It was a much less vulgar time. The vets who saw this film flipped their shit.

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>>32112302
>3.This is 1945. It should be a Tiger II, the number of Tiger 1s on the Western Front at that point was single digits.
Why are these threads always riddled with people who like to think they know what they're talking about when it comes to nitpicking a movie, but actually don't?

>>32112339
>implying the only redeeming quality of these spergfests isn't seeing a bunch of pseudo intellectuals make fools of themselves

>>32112339
Because, I dunno, it's true? There were only a few isolated instances of engagements with Tiger Is after Normandy (where there were 2 and 2/3rds battalions of them). By then, Tiger II production was underway and all Tiger battalions on the Western Front were equipped with Tiger IIs.

There were still Tiger Is in Italy.

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>>32112381
>There were Tiger Is in Europe at the time
>Y crew in movie encounter Tiger I?
>Crew even expresses amazement that there's a Tiger left to engage them
Kill yourself.

>>32112403
You and I both know they only did it because:

1. Tigers are a meme, the audience expects you to have on even if it doesn't make sense. Even Band of Brothers tell into that trap.

2. They had the money to borrow the only working Tiger.

#2 is justifiable just because "this is cool", but I'm quite sure the real reason is #1.

And AGAIN, just to reiterate this, Tiger Is were so rare after Normandy that the US tanks only ran into one 3 times.

>>32112339

>Shows a Tiger in Berlin, which was obviously the Eastern Front

>Claims there were Tiger Is on the Western front.

Shit for brains.

I'm fairly confident there wasn't a SINGLE Tiger I in Western Germany by that time.

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>>32112403

>Budapest

>Western Front

>>32112381
If they had replaced the Tiger with a King Tiger, the engagement would have made sense, and also have been more believable given that there were King Tigers about.

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>>32112425
>but I'm quite sure the real reason is #1.
I'm quite sure the reason they used the Tiger I is that the Bovington Tank Museum didn't have a working Tiger II and the only place that does have one is in France, and that trucking it over to the site that they were set to shoot on, or trucking the 4 working Shermans the BTM was letting them use to France, would have been ludicrously expensive. So, we have;
>Limey museum that's letting you use a half dozen of their tanks, one of them a German type that objectively was present during that time
>Tanks and shooting locations are all in bully ol' England
vs.
>Shipping tanks over the Channel, entering into god knows how many insurance and liability spider webs in the process, and blowing through millions

Here's something I'm "quite sure of"; you're not old enough to post here and are a total autist.

>>32112431
>I'm fairly confident there wasn't a SINGLE Tiger I in Western Germany by that time.
>>32112470

>>32112374
Guess you were right, this is kinda funny.

>>32112470
Except it was no objectively present at that time. The last one, I believe, was destroyed by a Pershing in the Ruhr somewhere. Other than that you have the one that backed into a house (your pic) and another one prior to that where it was gang raped by Shermans. That's IT. Any other Tigers US tankers encountered were in Italy.

If anything, you're the autist. You seem incapable of proper conversation.

>>32109545
nice arguement

>>32092309
>no arguement

>>32112490
>Calls others autists
>Thinks the exact Tiger tank in the movie should have been one of the few actually present
>Still can't wrap his mind around the circumstances behind the making of the film
Did you think the titular tank was real, too?

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>>32094223
Eternal Anglo strikes again!

>>32112490
The type was present, you freaking out over it not being literally one of the few present in reality is as dumb as freaking out over the Fury tank never having actually existed. If you want documentaries, you have plenty to choose from.

>>32106507
There are whole mountains left unturned. Its just that they didnt involve US so hollywood wont make them. For whatever reason average americans cant read subtitles and get angry if they cant larp as world savior in ww2

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>>32112560
Ummmmmmmm...

>>32112560
Reading your movie is for fags.

>>32112568
>half of the movie is in English

>>32112425
>Tigers are a meme

Except for, you know, their combat record and average 4:1 K/D ratio.

>the audience expects you to have on even if it doesn't make sense

Yeah sure, the normies and the public at large know about Tiger I tanks.

>>32112603
You would have been better off building several more Panthers for how many Reichsmarks and time it took to make one Tiger.

Plus, the Tiger wasn't superior by 1944 anyway, the IS-2 existed. Hell, a Sherman with a 76 could take out a Tiger. It was the Tiger II that was the problem.

>>32112597
>half of the movie is in English
People sure do like to lie in these threads. Wonder why.

>>32112622

>You would have been better off building several more Panthers for how many Reichsmarks and time it took to make one Tiger.

Except the combat record proves this statement very wrong. The Panther was straight up defective.

>>32112740
They never entirely fixed the gears, no, but the simple fact is, in the couple of years they produced Panthers they built as many as they had Panzer IVs up to that point. In the same period they built only 1700 Tigers of both types, both of which were also mechanically unrealiable.

The simple fact is, if you have several Panthers instead of 1 Tiger, you can have armoured support in multiple places at once, or a bunch in one place. The Panther had better frontal armour, its gun was just as good, and it was easier to manufacture and thus, many more could be made. It's the best tank they had, and to build fewer just so you can have your precious Tiger is dumb.

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>>32112622
>Plus, the Tiger wasn't superior by 1944 anyway, the IS-2 existed.

The Tiger could still easily knock it out with a little bit of skill. The IS-2s were heavy, lumbering monsters with a turret traverse speed counted in hours. Sure if you could train your gun on any target and hit it, the 122 mm could annihilate anything, but the problems were actually spotting and hitting shit in time. It wasn't a good tank for tank-on-tank duels.
>Hell, a Sherman with a 76 could take out a Tiger.

Very wrong.

You niggers seem to forget that the 76 mm is based on the very old 3-inch used in the M10 Wolverine which is based on a Navy gun from 1918, lol, was deemed INADEQUATE against German heavies as far back as 1943 by Ordnance.

Please stop peddling memes and very bad cliches.

They had to develop a very expensive HVAP round for it to make it useful against armor, and by the time HVAP went into circulation (early 1945) there was no German armor.

>>32092310
First casualty of our platoon was a ND he was sleeping with his rifle like a teddy bear under his chin and blew brains out, we thought it was a suicide.

>>32113086
Haha wtf. Give that dude a Darwin award.

>>32106507
Never, did you not see tge out cry against Call of Duty Infinate Warfare not being another WW2 game?

Meanwhile shit like BF1 has more automatic weapons in the hands of rank and file than WW2, Korea and Vietnam combined.

Holy shit OP here, I made this thread blackout drunk after watching it for the first time (I thought it sucked) and now I got to read through one of the most autistic arguments I've seen on this board in a long time. Some of you are beyond cringe tier wannabe historians. I pity you and may God have mercy on your souls.

>>32106507
WW2 games will go on for a century.

>>32112858
Every Wehraboo needs to watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNjp_4jY8pY

>>32112302
The most annoying thing is the Tiger driving at them. They could easily have pulled out of the WP, gone static, and the gunner could have made line switches since the Shermans were only a few metres apart, and put a shell into all 3 within a minute.

The other silly part is the Tiger hits Fury right in the hull from under 50m, and somehow a few metal tubes memed the round like its fucking War Thunder.

>>32105134
Jesus Christ, watching all those PAK crews miss their shots as if they never sighted their guns and then watch the interns cosplaying as GIs hipfire their Garands through the German position was painful.

>>32112305

Seems like a reason to sympathize with them right there.

You don't have to hate someone to kill them, although it helps.

>>32112313

I was wondering about that. I mean, I imagine that under the stresses of war, certain societal norms of conduct break down, but I've been under the impression that Americans in the 40's weren't as foul-mouthed as more recent generations.

Oh, and I gotta put this out there: the part where Pitt's character forces the new guy to execute a prisoner has to be one of the most pointlessly edgy things I've ever seen put to film.

>>32112490
I may be wrong but I think both the Pershing and Tiger were N/S after the fight.

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>>32113397
>GIs hipfire their Garands
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marching_fire
These fucking threads