Would it be possible to create a functional bolter?

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>>31860305
Yeah, it wouldn't exactly be a bolter but yeah.

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>>31860651
Why? Gas op guns aren't exactly fucking rocket science. The real problem is getting the actual bolter shells working like they do in world.

>>31860326

>i sure showed that noob

>>31860305
The projectiles are far ahead of anything we could make right now. Even the most basic bolt is a .75 caliber miniaturized rocket propelled DU grenade with an HEI cap designed to detonate upon target penetration.

As far as the basic gat is concerned, it's nothing too complicated. Proportions are dumb and I doubt our mettalurgy is up to scratch but we could definitely make it. Magazine fed, reciprocating bolt handle, presumably some kind of gas piston, bayonet lug, fire selector. Basic shit.

>>31860305
yes with a mag capacity of 5 to 7 rounds...

>>31860989
frankly you are overthinking this.
20mm gyrojet hedp rounds would be pretty much the same thing in effect.

why not just fire .50 bmg rounds?
much cheaper and it would fuck shit up.

Better question would be is there a single practical weapon in the 40k universe worth replicating.

>>31861257
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBntnnCFvOk
watch this vid, it's pretty goddamn scary what it can do and you can actually use it like a battle rifle.

>>31861165
Except for the fact that bolts aren't simple HEDP rounds. They're diamond tipped depleted deuterium penetrators with mass-reactive detonating caps.

>>31861259
Lasguns are pretty cool. Semi-auto laser weapon, eighty shots per power pack on a normal setting, although the user can opt for increased or reduced power depending on the tactical situation. Packs themselves can be recharged by solar energy, or thermal energy; all an infantryman has to do is leave them propped up by the campfire and they're good to go after a few hours. Obviously very science fiction, but it's interesting to see how they were specifically designed to be as modular and practical as possible for a galactic military.

>>31861365
>They're diamond tipped depleted deuterium penetrators
please nigga depleted deuterium oxide is just water and diamond shatters not penetrates. i would rather have a proper hedp round.

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>>31860305
The gun is easy, the shells are a bit harder but still doable. Bolt shells are basically gyrojets with a more advanced warhead and a conventional gunpowder charge to kick it out the barrel at a fast enough speed to kill at the muzzle.

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I thought bolters ammunition where closer to a shot gun mixed with grenade suppose you could use some sort grenade launcher scaled to the correct size but I am thinking it would weigh quite a bit and that's why Spess Mahreens use them. Probably closet we have is a grenade launcher but don't qoute me on that .

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>>31860326
How do I hide a knife in the UK

>>31861468
the difference is obvious bolter bolts are direct fire high speed shells with a huge range thanks to gyrojet. the grenades are more indirect fire and very slow and limited in range to a few hundred meters.
40mm hedp is probably way more powerful up close than a bolter. it's actually capable to do damage on armored vehicles like afvs out of an under-barrel launcher.

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>>31861468
Take a XM25 grenade, give it an armor piercing tip and a rocket that activates after it leaves the muzzle and you have a bolt.

>>31861516
Yeah I get you and understand I was trying to say the actual payload was similar like impact and then explosion

>>31861468
There are bolters sized for humans too, but they're also weaker than ones used for space marines.

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Posting bolters

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>>31861631

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>>31861649

>>31861546
i looked after it it's not reliable from a 203, you need a mk19 for anti vehicle uses because there are issues with the fuse and the angle at a flat side. but as practice m113 has been repeatedly wrecked by 40mm hedp so it does work.
what it would do to something softer like a xeno? i would hate to clean up after that.

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>>31861659

>>31860305
Maybe you could fit a gyrojet into a twelve gauge show?

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>>31861741

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>>31861752

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>>31861760

>>31861365
This is what autism looks like.

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>>31861770

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>>31861800

>>31861545
This is it basically, or at least without going into the in-universe warhead and construction details and method.

I like 40k as much as the next nerd and Astartes are pretty cool, but ditching the bullshit explanation building a weapon like the Bolter should be possible in this day and age.

>>31861559
sounds like bullshit maybe up close but after 25 yards there will be no significant difference.

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>>31860305
SBS one of these and use slugs

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>>31861825

>>31861838
what ticks me most off about bolters is how they fire a high-explosive ammo and the retards talk about initial charge accelerating it to "kill speed".

high-explosive charges have a kill speed at 0 if they go off. you can even throw them at your enemy (as sometimes hajis do).

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We've got the individual technology for creating bolters, so making a gun that fires HE equipped gyrojets that are launched by traditional means is certainly doable.
But such a gun would be most likely fuckhueg, unreliable and impractical. Granted a nicely funded and specialized research team could make it practical, but there is no niche where a bolter would justify the expense.

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>>31861914
>high-explosive charges have a kill speed at 0 if they go off
except most enemies in 40k wear armor or have extremely tough skin, and you aren't penetrating anything up close without the kicker charge because even if the rocket was activated inside the barrel it wouldn't be able to build up enough speed to penetrate most enemies at the muzzle, which was the main problem with the Gyrojet systems

>>31861986
you don't need to, an explosion up close from a grenade will still turn your insides to mush even if you have armor on. and like i said hedp which means high explosive fragmentation is half of it the other half is a shaped charge ammunition like heat. so it basically blows softies like ogyrins to pieces and penetrates armor up to 50mm rha and still turns you into mush.

>>31861914
Their gimmick is that the warhead only detonates upon penetration in order to ensure the bloodiest, grim-darkiest kill possible. It's a world full of scary space aliens and giant superhumans in suits of armor, that shit has to travel at speed to penetrate any likely target.

>>31862024
or a rather simple explanation the speed of the metal stream coming out of a shaped charge warhead is many times it's traveling speed which is nearly insignificant in the equation.
a heat round fired from a cannon or going off point blank from a stand has pretty much the same penetration. except the rotation of the round if the liner is shaped to counteract the rotation then the round must be fired and have that rotation to develop a stable stream of liquid metal. so there is that.

>>31862061
>Their gimmick is that the warhead only detonates upon penetration
that is actually dependent on the round itself, they use multiple types if i remember correctly. some detonate before impact and act as a fragmentation grenade and some are simply rigid core armor piercing.

>>31861914
It's basically SAP ammunition. It penetrates and then explodes inside, doing far more damage to the target.

>>31862089
The "standard" bolter round does what was stated.

>>31862227
yeah sap needs speed to kill, but most bolter rounds don't. there is only like two types out of 12 or more that rely on kinetic energy from the projectile. btw sap usually has a soft ballistic cap to stabilize and lead the penetration so they botched that up too. they also don't seem to have any idea why du is used as penetrating either. the retards writing the fluff actually think the harder the hyper-velocity pentrator is the better.

>>31862236
and? it is pretty inconsequential to the topic even if we only make the incendiary or frag bolt it's still a bolter.

>>31862269
>yeah sap needs speed to kill, but most bolter rounds don't.
Most bolter rounds do in fact rely on it. That's how they achieve the penetration in the first place. Yes, even if it doesn't penetrate a target, the explosion might kill them anyways, but that doesn't mean they don't rely on physical penetration. The charge does FAR more damage when it explodes on the inside. Hence why it's SAP instead of straight HE.

>>31862276
>inconsequential to the topic
The topic is how bolters, and thus the standard round, works. If you want to talk about the specialist rounds, mention that round by name. Otherwise, don't try and confuse things.

>>31862314
>and thus the standard round, works
nope
>Would it be possible to create a functional bolter?
nothing about it there
the standard round is retarded plain and simple.
let's stick with things that actually work and are quiet devastating.

>>31862302
if you look at it the majority of bolter rounds don't rely on penetration. they simply explode or throw shrapnel or ignite or dose you with acid or psychic energies.

>>31862348
I'll disagree with you there. If you look at the REAL majority of bolter rounds, you'll find that they're just the standard SAP-type rounds. There are a number of specialist rounds, but that's just it- they're specialists. Even if you added up every single round of all the specialist types, they would be nowhere near close to the number of the standard rounds. So yes, it would be PROPER to discuss the standard bolter round.

>>31862336
>nope
Sure, talk about the fucking pitiful amounts of specialist rounds that nobody thinks of when they're talking about the bolter. You have to mention those rounds by name.

>the standard round is retarded plain and simple.
It's just a round with a delayed fuse and a penetrating tip. Not retarded. Very useful when dealing with any significant armor at all.

>>31862348
From what I remember, only two rounds (metal storm and inferno I believe) actually do things outside of the target, most of them just change what happens when they penetrate.

>>31862412
There was also the one which created a black hole type thing.

>>31862412
but they can't penetrate shit with diamond and hydrogen atoms with extra neutrons anon it's not possible!
why are you insisting on bullshit?
hedp rounds would do much the same as bolts do in badly written wh40k fluff and they actually work. actually pierce armor and blow you apart.
the fuck is wrong with you guys?

>>31862433
>but they can't penetrate shit with diamond and hydrogen atoms with extra neutrons anon it's not possible!
If the justification was stupid, the mechanics of what they're trying to do are not. In fact, they're quite feasible. You're just too autistic to figure that out. Further, HEDP isn't great about penetrating armor and causing lots of damage on the inside. Can work, but not great.

>>31862302
biggest problem with sap round is they only really work to the round diameter in rha.
shaped charge at least can do multiples of that.

>>31862454
>In fact, they're quite feasible.
see this: >>31862460
they are not really that feasible as we understand physics today.
>HEDP isn't great about penetrating armor and causing lots of damage on the inside.
where the fuck did you get that from? nothing would remain from you if it penned your armor.

>>31861957
I want a Meltagun so bad hnnnnnghhhhh

>>31862481
I always liked them because they're described as almost completely silent in all of the fluff. Like, hardcore spec-ops motherfuckers stick to a ranged microwave because melting people from a distance is actually quieter than cutting throats.

It's a fun setting.

>>31862481
isn't melta-gun is just an x-ray projector?
kinda fits the description of what it does. a powerful x-ray projector would melt/incinerate everything in it's path. now how to do that without a nuclear explosion is the magic.

>>31862506
if it was microwave a tinfoil armor would completely protect you from the effects...

>>31862523
"Melta Weapons are heat-based weapons which work by sub-atomic agitation of the air. Targets on the receiving end are heated to the point of being vaporised. The effect on flesh is fearsome to say the least, while vehicles can be reduced to molten slag. Most melta weapons use highly pressurized pyrum-petrol gases with a two part injection system which forces the gases into a molecular state, which will vaporise just about anything. Unfortunately, due to the high power consumption and range dissipation, the weapon is only effective over very short distances, but anything caught in the blast is likely to be destroyed."

Microwave.

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>>31862348
The standard bolter round is designed to penetrate and explode inside the target. The explosion size depends on the author, it ranges from just over fist sized to killing 3 humans and injuring several more. It's complete overkill for grunts and mostly serves just for fucking with their morale, but the real value is in putting down the enemy elites with a single shot or gradually wearing down literal monsters by slowly taking them apart. If they fail to penetrate they will just explode on impact, but whatever they hit is so strong that it probably won't be bothered by the explosion at all. This is the vast majority of bolt ammunition.
Everything else is specialized shit. Some of it is just fancier bolts that are stronger, fly farther or have lock on options. Then you have the more "normal" Sci Fi stuff, like toxins, incendiary, nanobots (destroying the machine spirit in 40ks instance), EMPs, mutagens, etc. And finally you have the over the top 40k shit, like bolts that create miniature black holes, warp portals, null fields, Daemons,... As with everything else in 40k, you can stuff whatever the fuck you want inside the bolt, as long as you claim that it's archeotech or Chaos.

>>31862514
Dark age of technology is a hell of a drug.

>>31862536
>two part injection system which forces the gases into a molecular state
>forces the gases into a molecular state
jesus, i hear my elementary chemistry teacher rattling in her grave spinning like a turbine

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>>31862481

We all do brother, we all do.

>>31862536
do you even know what microwave is? cause it's not gasses "forced" to molecular state... like you could find gas in non-molecular state anywhere... that would be plasma.

>>31862460
Not exactly, no. SAP works like any AP round works, except it explodes once it's inside what it's hitting. That's it.

>>31862475
>where the fuck did you get that from? nothing would remain from you if it penned your armor.
Not really. All it's good for is poking little holes. Never mind that the small size of the projectile majorly limits how effective the penetration will be. No, instead SAP actually explodes inside a target and causes massive damage internally, whereas HEAT just hopes the little jet hits something important.

>>31862553
It's a microwave that cooks space ayys.

>>31862543
what the authors were snorting is the helluva drug when they wrote up all this nonsense.

>>31862569
They were snorting tea and crumpets.

>>31862541
>As with everything else in 40k, you can stuff whatever the fuck you want inside the bolt, as long as you claim that it's archeotech or Chaos.
yeah let's stuff a black hole into one then, i guess that solves the issues here.

>>31862569
It's the corniest of the corny '80s science fiction. People take it too seriously.

>>31860989

wouldn't the fact that it's a gyrojet make the recoil not so arm shattering?

>>31862564
>All it's good for is poking little holes.
have you seen heat explosions on the other side? the over-pressure would turn you to tuna paste and squeeze you out or the joints of your armor, cooked and partially burned to cinder.

>>31862541
>overkill for grunts
Maybe most species' grunts, but Orks make it seem pretty reasonable.

>>31862595
well by the looks of it the bolter weights about as much an a mk19 nade launcher. i wouldn't worry about recoil from a 4 inch barrel.

>>31862597
And we're dealing with creatures that wouldn't even BLINK at that. You need to cause massive trauma to stop them. No, overpressure will not do. A tiny stream of damage will not do. You need to pulp them completely.

>>31861365

only 80 shots leaves something to be desired, how many rounds of ammunition does a modern rifleman carry anyways?

>>31862617
80 shots per pack.

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>>31862617
That's eighty per magazine, not eighty total. A combat load would be something like 8-12 mags, pretty similar to what we use today.

>>31862611
it's not a tiny stream after the resistance stops from the armor it expands explosively that's my point. also hedp ammo often enough detonates inside especially fired on lighter armored target and if will damage equipment and sensors on heavily armed targets even if it fails to penetrate. it's really the best overall round. not especially anti-armor it's multi-purpose sure. the armor that infantry can carry is not really resistant to heavy sluggers not even space marine armor so it would be considered light armor in this case.

>>31862633
ig is best suited to trench warfare and creating killzones for the enemy with artillery and mortar fire traps heavy bolter emplacements and the lasgun. really when i played ig it was like chaos marines fell from one ass to an other they never got to my men.

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>>31862584
In the Forge of Mars trilogy the DAoT ship fires miniature black holes to fuck up some Eldar.
In one of the GK books there is a Titan [spoiler]which got possessed by a Daemon, but the AI was so strong that it convinced the Daemon it was actually AI all along[/spoiler] that used Daemons as ammunition for it's Vulcan canon.
As I've said, it's 40k. "It's Chaos/archeotech/a new OC donut steal Xenotech, I don't have to explain shit" is a completely valid argument.

>>31862611
you would die from the spalling alone.

>>31862674
That ship actually missed the first shot, then used a time weapon to make it not miss. Against an eldar ship going at the speed of light driven by a farseer.

>>31862693
>then used a time weapon
they could just make a left turn instead of a right in hyperspace and they could do that.

>>31862656
I really doubt that, and I have NEVER heard of that being the case, because HEDP is a contact detonator. It doesn't have a delayed fuse at all.

And yes, the SAP nature of the standard bolter round is more than plenty to work just fine. And no, the armor that many infantry carry in 40k is certainly heavy armor. Space Marine armor is resistant to heavy stubbers, but will not hold out forever against them. You have to realize there is some very effective armor in 40k.

>>31862677
I somehow doubt an Orc or a Carnifex would really care much.

>>31860326
I think a 15mm gyrojet/cased rocket would be totally feasible. Just give it a case and a charge to get it going down the rifled barrel, and then let the rocket do the rest. The recoil wouldn't suck too bad since it just needs to give it enough speed to get it spun up and ready to go, it would probably kick like a Barrett rifle and have a muzzle velocity of about half that of a regular Barrett. You could get lighter solid projectiles with larger rocket loads for kinetic penetration, fragmentation loads with/without a timed detonation, etc. The cartridges would be long as fuck to accommodate the powder charge, rocket fuel, and actual warhead; maybe 7" or 8" long?

>>31861394
Yeah, DU, tungsten, or amorphous zirconium/titanium metallic glass would all be better for their self-sharpening properties.

>>31862735
>Carnifex
they don't care much for bolts either they are vehicles in game mechanics. you would better bring tanks to tussle with one.
as for orcs they are not that tough. bayonets can do them in 40mm hedp would plaster them all across the battlefield. 20mm hedp is probably survivable as a single shot depending on where it hits. they are big brutes and all. a short burst would have them dead most likely tho same as with bolters.
>Space Marine armor is resistant to heavy stubbers
that's news to me. you mean to tell me it would ping off a .50? naah...

>>31862780
indeed, tungsten is kinda shit tho when it comes to self sharpening.

>>31862757
more like 12ga than 15mm

>>31862061
HEAT rounds don't need speed, and I'm sure you can get the quarter or half-inch steel penetration you need from a 15mm or 20mm shell to kill any light or heavy infantry you hit.

>>31861845
For reference.
What is that?
Because I want that.

>>31862840
that was my argument too, but some dudes have the fantasy rulebook stuffed up in their anus.

>>31862553
I think the best we can do to justify that explanation is say it uses microwaves to superheat gas into a jet of plasma that is directed at whatever you want to melt.

>>31862797
>they don't care much for bolts either they are vehicles in game mechanics. you would better bring tanks to tussle with one.
What the fuck is wrong with you? No they aren't. Do you have any clue what you're talking about? Everything you've said in this post is retarded. You've never played the game in your life, let alone know the lore.

>>31862876
the fuck are you talking about? carnifex is dreadnought class piece. it's not something for the infantry to handle.

>>31862986
Carnifex is classified as a monstrous creature, numbnuts. It's not a vehicle by far. The only difference between it and infantry models is that it has a higher toughness. This is as opposed to any of the vehicle models, which have a completely different ruleset. And yes, Marines can take them on with just their basic bolters. Not ideal, but you can do it.

>>31862735
>Space Marine armor is resistant to heavy stubbers, but will not hold out forever against them.
so basically like an m113.
good then it would get rekt all the same from hedp ammo or even 20mm ap.

>>31862841

Not him but it's a Fostech Origin 12.

>>31863027
>so basically like an m113.
Not really. .50 will punch through the M113 in many situations without needing a huge amount of sustained firing. Never mind the fact that bolters won't penetrate Space Marine armor without a good deal of the same. Only a specialized variant can, and then at a great cost.

Would it kill you to know the background of what you're talking about?

>>31863062
the way i gather just about anything can pen space marine armor at the right places. only the main plates are really strong. joints belly and the helmet is not even really armored.

>>31863062
>Never mind the fact that bolters won't penetrate Space Marine armor without a good deal of the same.
sauce on that fagget bolts go through that shit like knife through butter. in fact even lasguns pen it half the time.

>>31861649
Is there a known guide on how to do this somewhere?

>>31863090
The armor value, pretty much every book involving space marines getting shot by bolters (off the top of my head the Space Wolves and Salamander series, I believe it also showed up in at least one of the Caiaphas Cain novels at least once, and in one Ultramarine novel I read years ago that I can hardly even recall). Not to mention the disconnect between game rules and lore.

>>31863079
Sort of. There are definitely weak areas and areas which are weakened by fire, but the chances of those getting shot are fairly low, and even if they are shot they are still armored.

>>31861365
>Depleted deuterium
>Penetrator
Pick one, and it can't be the first one

So what did you guys think of the Lord Inquisitor prologue? Like aside from the horrible voice acting.

>>31863720
I imagine the VA is better in German, where it originally is supposed to be, but the Imperial Fists in the parade made me hard. THAT is how Space Marines are supposed to look.

>>31863769
Does anyone have a link to this german dub I keep on hearing about?

>>31863671
This. Deuterium is already an isotope. It can't be 'depleted' like uranium or plutonium.

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>>31860305
12gage HE rounds already have a system to arm themselves after they're out of the gun's barrel. If you could make a round based on those ,but that activates a rocket once the grenades arms itself(and is at an OK distance from the shooter by the way) ,and add a DU tip with a small timed detonator on top of it. Bang(quite litteraly) you have bolter ammo.

Then all you need is a bolter(saiga with corresponding furniture for example) and you're good to go.
Or you could make anything, like pic related, into a xeno slaying "bolter". The possibilities are endless...
Bonus point if you manage to fire it in high brass mag magnum round for headstart.

>>31860305
Take the Gyrojet system, upscale to .99 caliber or whatever the fluff is.

wa-la.

Zero recoil, high-velocity all-purpose rounds that only need a short barrel for primary stabiliation.

>>31861271
I fucking loled at the bolt just punching him in the arm

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>>31861649
That fucking grip gets me every time.

>>31864232

Is that a FAMAS?

>>31860326
How do we make a functional Land Raider?

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>>31861845
Pretty much this.

>>31860305
Its a combination of standard and gyrojet projectiles. It could be done.

>>31862595
the bolter is a combination of gyrojet and standard ammuniton. The projectile is propelled through an explosion out of the weapon and then activates the gyrojet propulsion

>>31862514
Its like flamethrower, but the liquid is not napalm-based , its plazma

Bit off topic. Sounds like a lot of anons read the Warhammer 40k stuff, does anyone here actually play the tabletop game? I used to when I was little but I got out of it because the community for it was fucking terrible.

>do anons play the WH40K tabletop game?

>>31863121
not a good guide but a description of how a guy did it. They call em Super Shorty AKs
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=613515

unfortunately all the other threads are too old and either 404 (boards got wiped / recreate in the past couple years) or the pictures 404 because the imager hoster is garbo