M1 garand help

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Here's the bore

>>31796695
I think that looks like a pretty decent bore, but I mostly lurk here and shoot .22's at paper so I don't know much about what the bore should look like.

>>31796701
I thought so too but I'm really looking for input from someone who knows about these rifles.

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Here's the pics from the m1D

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>>31796720

The m1D guy seems to know a lot more about his rifle so I can provide more info if that's desired.

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>>31796728

And the last pic of the m1D

a loose gas cylinder can effect accuracy, but you can fix it by peening the barrel splines.

>>31796734

I should probably add that I want the most functional rifle, collector's value comes second. I really want something that works and is accurate before I worry about parts correctness or cartouches.

>>31796690
>square receiver cut

cool, you should buy it

>>31796751

Can you explain? Is this something I can fix or does it need gun smithing?

>>31796758

Is that purely a collectors thing?

I know literally nothing about these guns

>>31796762
http://thecmp.org/training-tech/armorers-corner/gas-cylinder/ the cmp website will give you all the info you need for the most part.

>>31796766
yeah, at one point (from what I have been told) an M1 with a squared up cut in the receiver was at one time a Gas Trap rifle.

>>31796782

Neat, I know those are more valuable. As far as the throat erosion goes, is it a big deal that this guy knows nothing?

The guy selling the m1D had exact measurements, but his was worn out.

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Bumping, thread is getting buried

>>31796797
http://www.m1-garand-rifle.com/m1-garand-assembly/vintage.php

It's a model that's seen combat, or possibly has seen. Anywhere from SN 25000 onwards.

>>31796858

It did end up in korea so I would assume that it did see combat in ww2 and korea.

Is the throat erosion reading a big deal though? All I have is a pic of the bore, no erosion measurements. I want something that is reasonably accurate

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Bumping

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Bump

>>31796690
900 is about market rate for a garand. I'd ask for a bullet test for you to eyeball the Muzzle erosion.

The M1D is a bit of a hassle. The 3/5 erosion wont make it a terrible shooter but it won't be the best. You probably end up having to replace the barrel if you want the best accuracy. Plus I think the scope and mount are kinda expensive

>>31797131

Thanks for the information, best reply so far. The seller says he doesn't have any 3006 to do the eyeball test but it's good to know the m1d is out. I really want a rifle that is reasonably accurate and would prefer to only replace the gas plug so I can use modern ammo

>>31797183
Overall the Garand is gonna be giving you really good groups even if there is erosion problems, it is not a big of a deal as it seems. The difference is gonna be at most 1moa. Go for the rifle you think is gonna be the best for your personal historical tastes.

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>>31797230

Well the m1D obviously has more historical value than the parts gun. For all I know, the korean rifle could be shot out too.

Thats the problem with these historical guns though. They are fun and have value outside their function, but theres a lot of worry concerning their condition. Sometimes I wonder if I should just stick to my sks, mosin, and vepr. The russian surplus just works and there's no question of them breaking.

>>31796902
From my reading ME is more for barrel serviceability and less for accuracy. A barrel with a 5+ me will still be accurate enough. Stuff like receiver to stock fit, rear sight condition, trigger condition, crown condition, and gastube fit will have more of an effect on accuracy then a few ME numbers.

http://www.fulton-armory.com/%5Cfaqs%5CM14-FAQs%5CTEGauge.htm
Bit of a read but it'll learn u about ME.

Me and te numbers are good for buying garands for sellers who use it as a bench mark and have the belief that its the end all be all of accuracy. So if the seller doesnt know the me readings then spook em and try to get the price lower quoting unknow barrel life.

The one with a loose gas tube will have accuracy issues since the front sight is attached to it. Find out how much itll cost to fix it and use it to low ball the seller.

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>>31797365

Heres the description of the m1d. It sounds like you know a good bit about these rifles.

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>>31797365

Just emailed the korean rifle guy with a new offer of 775. I mentioned the barrel and loose tube. We'll see what he says

Pic related is how I feel when I'd rather buy an m1a but its illegal

>>31797587
The m1d is more ready to be a shooter than the other. The first garand i got had a loose gas tube and couldnt print a group till i had it peened. The m1d seems ready to go with no fuss and 5ish on the me is still within serviceable limits. That m1d would be a steal of he can come down a bit. They go for 1200 on cmp so the guy is not ripping you off like most m1 sellers. Most of the time you see guys asking well over a grand for a service grade they just recieved in the mail for 700ish. You dont need to get a scope for the D and can use the iron sights. Its just neato to have incase you do find a mount and a scope later on.

Re-barreling the is the thing that comes to mind that may be an issue. But after thinking on it some more you would have to take it to a smith even if it didnt have a scope collar on the barrel shank. So no worries. When it does come time to re barrel it (wont be any time soon though) barrels are easy to come by if youre not trying to make the gun "date matching". Criterion and douglas make barrels for the m1 so they'll be available when ever you need it.

Any who. If the guy with the m1d can come down some then i would go for that. Assuming everything is tight like the gas tube, stock fit, and rear sight to name a few.

Otherwise the standard m1 will be fine if he's willing to take your offer. It'll be about 100ish bucks to get the barrel repeened by a smith and after that you'll have a plain jane m1 for 875ish.

>>31796690
>Garand
>$900
buy a Finn Nugget for $300-400 and literally burn the rest of the $900 & it will still be a wiser investment

>>31800330

Are they really that finicky? I already own a finnish mosin

>>31800590
honestly? I have no idea, but seriously, $900 for a WWII -milsurp? Even if were "from factory straight to storage, never issued, never fired, stored with the same level of care shown to centuries-old books and/or priceless works of art in museums" -tier rifle with the stock signed by Ike and Patton $900 would be too much for what people are essentially buying "because that's what my grandpa was holding when he died after getting his thumb stuck in the rifle while reloading"

>>31800702

Kek first time I have laughed today.

But yea this has been in the back of my mind this entire time. Nuggets and sks's are cheap and guaranteed to work but this is a lot of money to put into one older rifle. Historical value was the most important thing for me until recently when I got tired of never hitting anything. I can barely see a 100 yard target and need optics to go further

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CMP Friendo..

>>31800702

lol
Newfag or retarded?

>>31802561
define "newfag", I have been lurking and writing here on-and-off for a few years.

I get being willing to pay more for something due to historical value and/or because it's from one's home country, but $900 for a WWII surplus, which in this case isn't even close to being in unissued condition?

>>31802561
also: I haven't been diagnosed, but things like "AS" and "autist" have been used to describe me by people both face-to-face as well as over the Internet

>>31802700
$900 Garand will hold its value no matter what. It will also keep increasing in value.

Compare it to an AR, for example. It can be had for $500, but is run of the mill with no history and wont increase in any value unless there is a scare.. but even then, it drops down to normal prices.

Milisurp rifles hold a vast amount of history for many people, and they are a ton of fun to shoot. Sure, it may ne a niche, but as rifles are shot and worn down, the remaining ones increase in value. Plus, theyre just fucking cool knowing that theyve probably been used in actual war and had a dead nazi on the other end of them or something.

>>31802814
>Milisurp rifles hold a vast amount of history for many people, and they are a ton of fun to shoot.
as I said I am aware of that, it's the insane amount of $900 that I have a problem with, millions of Garands were made, meaning there's no shortage of them, there are a lot of much rarer milsurps from the same time period that even in never issued -condition no-one would pay $900 for.

>>31802923

The Garand cost $85 to make during WW2.
Which according to government inflation stats, is about $1,200 today.

>>31802966
so you are saying that there's nothing wrong about the rifle in OP being sold at 75% of the inflation-adjusted cost of manufacture?

>>31803001

Yes.
(also, government inflation numbers are of course fraudulent, so it's actually a much better value)

>>31802923
There's probably more of a shortage than you and I think. Sure millions were made.. but hundreds of thousands were also lost to war, lying at the bottom of the sea, in Korea, etc. The thing is, millions may have been made, but theyre sure as fuck not making any more (unless you want a shitty reproduction), and theyll last for hundreds of years if taken care of.

>>31802966
go take a look at WWII -surplus rifles that are *not* American & show me even *one* mass-produced design (available in USA in significant numbers) that someone has paid $900 USD for, the high-quality ones that one usually hears like K31 and M39 are both well below that marker, even in never-issued -condition & despite thet fact that their production runs total in hundreds of thousands instead of millions

>>31802923
>>31803001
It's the market that drives value, People are willing to pay $900 therefor that's what they cost.

>>31803097

You're comparing it to bolt action rifles, which were way cheaper.
Go look at prices for G43s and SVTs.

>>31803030

In your experience, is the garand a straightforward and reliable rifle, just as much as an sks?

>>31803127

Yeah, it's pretty simple.
Just watch some youtube videos on how to use it.

If you're talking about total disassembly, it's kind of complex.
But on the other hand, basic field stripping is extremely easy, and that's all you need in most cases.

>>31803127
not him, but the M1 Garand is the smoothest and most well balanced rifle I have ever shot. I had an SKS, which was a great rifle, but it just didnt have the same solid feeling of a semi automatic 30'06.

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>>31803097
All american milsurp is expensive. 1903's go for anywhere from 650 (in shit condition) to $1500

I got a great deal on mine for $799
All matching Remington parts, in excellent condition, and dated 1943. I could sell it for $1000 pretty easily.

>>31803104
so I have noticed, hence my comments >>31800330
>>31800590

sooner or later the Garand collectors will wake up, realise that the prices have gotten out of control, the demand for >$900 Garands will disappear & people will be stuck with their Garand collections that no-one wants, while people buying M39s now that they are still available for $300-400 will most likely still be able to sell them for a fat profit long after what I am now dubbing "The Garand -bubble" has burst.

>>31803126
oh, so now the *function* is what justifies the price?

>>31803192

>The Garand -bubble

lol
They're only going to become more and more rare dude.
Please stop giving advice on things you know nothing about.

>>31803167
>the M1 Garand is the smoothest and most well balanced rifle I have ever shot.

it's mostly because of how heavy it is

>>31803192
I meant >>31800330
instead of >>31800590

>>31803206

I already explained that semi auto guns cost a lot more to make.

>$900 for a WWII semi-auto .30-06 battle rifle is not seasonable
>because some autist on 4chan says so

>>31803226
>>31803226
still wrong, I meant these two posts:

>>31800330
>>31800702

>>31802546
>Sold out
Good suggestion.

>>31803211
>lol
>They're only going to become more and more rare dude.
yes they are, so are plenty other designs with just as much history (& much smaller production runs, making them even rarer), still 'murican milsurp is selling for 2x as much regardless of the condition

>>31802923
You obviously don't know much about surplus then.

>>31803097
SVT 40
K98k (not Russian captured)

>>31803285

Please stop giving advice on things you know nothing about.

>>31803227
and of course what something cost to make 70 years ago matters *today*...

I have a beat-up car from '80s, it's inflation-adjusted price is $40k USD, wanna buy it for that price?

Of course you don't, yet you are willing to pay the inflation-adjusted manufacturing cost for a beat-up rifle

>>31803342

>and of course what something cost to make 70 years ago matters *today*...
Today they cost $2,000 to make you fuckwit.

>>31803206
>oh, so now the *function* is what justifies the price?

We're obviously being trolled here.

>>31803373
so? we are talking about used goods in less-than-stellar condition that people are paying almost the full price for just because they are American, at the same time things like M39s are sold & bought by fudds like the typical dime-a-dozen -91/30s & treated as such (I know things have changed, but don't pretend they were appreciated for what they are for most of their history in USA)

>>31803483
It's almost like demand has an effect on price...

>>31803407
>>We're obviously being trolled here.
>can't be bothered to try and see things from the other side's POV
>decides to call the other side troll instead

>>31803507
how many times do I have to repeat myself?

>>31803507
>It's almost like demand has an effect on price
This. You can thank Saving Private Ryan and Band of Brothers for the increased interest in US surp.

>>31803521
Until you understand the basics of economics.
>But a M39!
Demand for a M39 is lower than for a M1. Cry harder that you can't afford a couple grand for a minor purchase and forget about milsurp, it isn't for you apparently.

>>31803547
>Cry harder that you can't afford a couple grand for a minor purchase and forget about milsurp, it isn't for you apparently.
FYI I am not American, this whole shitstorm started from a fucking joke some autist decided to take seriously & for some reason I made the decision of trying to explain the reasoning behind the joke and/or try to explain how bizarre I find it that people are actually paying $900 for a rifle that is easily available.

>>31803604
>Easily available
Oh really now? And where did you come to this conclusion?
>They made millions of course!
Then you're even more retarded than we thought. Millions made =/= millions available, especially on the secondary market.

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>>31803547

OP here, I made the thread this morning.

The M1D ad is now gone. All that's left is the korean rifle with the loose gas tube.

I'll admit that the garand intimidates me but I'm interested. I'm very skinny, about 135 pounds and 5'10". The m44 carbine is biggest rifle that I can support and fire accurately without bench support. I have exceptionally bad shoulders and cannot work out. The only way I can shoot the garand would be from a supported position.

I have zero 3006 but 4k rounds of 7.62x54r stocked. Given everything, does the garand still make sense? I'm bad at making decisions

>>31803604
again my point here is that $900 for beat-up Garands isn't sustainable unless someone starts buying them in bulk & scrapping them, people who are paying $900 for a milsurp rifle aren't very likely to sporterize it & use it for durr huntin' until the rifle falls apart & replacing it with another when it does, they are far more likely to be pretty careful with how they handle their $900 investment, so the number of Garands isn't probably going to start plummeting any time soon.

>>31803629
>Then you're even more retarded than we thought. Millions made =/= millions available, especially on the secondary market.
I didn't say "millions available", did I?

>>31803640
I'm not a big fan of the Garand but they're good rifles. If you like it, for whatever reason, I'd get it. CMP is sold out and will probably remain so indefinitely, so you're not gonna find a better price for the most part.
>>31803691
Number owned isn't the number available dipshit.

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>>31803737

Fair enough, thank you. The svt 40 would make sense given my increasing stock of 54r but are even harder and more costly to find. I do have a hakim in 8mm but the ammo availability sucks

>>31803838
>Ammo
Reload. If you want to shoot milsurp, reload. My 8mm loads cost around $0.35/rnd and I never worry about availability. Even for x54r, because my reloads aren't corrosive or subject to import bans/executive orders.

>>31803192
this is never going to happen. there is a finite supply of rifles and parts. In fact i doubt the CMP will be selling Garands at all in a few more years simply because there will be no more.

I bought my 1st Garand about 25 years ago, $375 it was a POS, but i didnt know any better or care, i just wanted one
Bought my 2nd 15 years ago, $650 but it got stolen, which sucks because that one was brutally accurate and 7.62mm
my current rifle i paid $800 and something, dont remember the exact amount

now i see shot out, dinged up, 70% finish, brown patina-ed rifles all over the place for $850-$1000 and feel bad for the people considering buying one of those. Then again, they're never going to be cheaper that they are right now. I just cant picture the price dropping out of these things anytime soon.

>>31803883

Where do you find .311 projectiles? I google searched and can't find them anywhere

>>31803737
>Number owned isn't the number available dipshit.
I never said it was, here's the thing I thought would have been obvious: let's say there are 300 000 Garands in USA, it's impossible to say how many of them are on the market at any given time, but chances are we are still years away from the point where one would have to start hiring private detectives/shit like that to find a Garand on sale, that's what I mean by "easily available"; not having to start hiring people to help you look for one.

In any case 300 000 Garands in USA, there are bound to be some Garands on the market at any given time, but let's assume for teh argument's sake that for some reason all Garands are taken off the market (the total number stays the same though), the prices will rise for some time, but still with 300 000 of them in-country the point will come where people will rather decide to be without a Garand than to shell out, say, $10k for one, after some time people who hoarded Garands as an investment will start selling them, but with the demand for Garands having disappeared with the rising price they sell slowly, bringing prices down as it's the buyer's market now, and as the value drops the "investors" will want to get rid of their investment before it loses any more value, speeding up the drop in value...

>>31803983
Try 310, since that's what they're sold as. Same bullets (mostly) for the Enfield and Arisaka rifles.
>>31803987
You're making so many assumption in your theory you may as well include something about unicorns.

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>>31804019

Good call, I'm showing some results now. Cost averages around 30 cents per projectile so I'm not sure how much I would save by reloading but the option is there.

>>31804019
Why are you even arguing with that dingleberry?

>>31803950
>this is never going to happen. there is a finite supply of rifles and parts. In fact i doubt the CMP will be selling Garands at all in a few more years simply because there will be no more.
let's assume the market dries up completely (which is unlikely, there are so many of them that the probability of every owner deciding to sit on their Garands & never selling them is rather small-), the prices will keep hiking for some time, but the mere knowledge of how many rifles there actually are in USA is bound to stop the hike at some point, by then Garands will be investments & will get treated like any other investment after the value of that investment stops growing...

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>>31796690
Op, they are both pretty good deals. A legit M1D has some serious value and it looks legit from the pics. The Korean rifle is a good rifle too, would be a fun shooter, try to haggle that price. The gas system can be fixed pretty easily. Their value keeps going up and up too. In 2013 I bought too Garands for $650 each. So worth it.

>>31804102
Well it depends how you want to look at it. You won't save (right now) compared to steel cased corrosive surplus, BUT you will compared to most modern production ammo, and it'll be more accurate and cleaner. And, aside from the cases obviously, the components can be used for other calibers that don't have surplus ammo available (303 British, 7.7 Arisaka, Etc.).
>>31804113
I'm still at work and bored. Already watched 4 C&Rsenal videos.

>>31804237

I have been buying cases of brown bear for about 50 cents per round as of now, but reloading would be a fun hobby. I have roughly 2k surplus, half of which is steel core, and 2k of modern commercial ammo.

>>31804301
That's about what my reloads costs ($0.52/rnd). That's also based on the assumption that I'll only get 10 loads out of a case though. If I get 12, it drops the cost per round significantly.

>>31803547
>Until you understand the basics of economics.
it seems you are the one who's unfamiliar with economics; the worth of an investment can't grow infinitely, at some point the growth of its value will be overtaken by inflation, the last one hundred years alone has shown many examples of what happens when the value of some form of investment starts shrinking, thinking that guns' value will only go up when they are far from being eternal is naïve, it's also what people have said about pretty much every single form of investment that has ever existed, right up until the moment their value plummeted...

>>31804345
You keep talking about investments. No one, with even a modicum of intelligence, thinks of guns that aren't machine guns as investments. The return is abysmal and constantly under threat of legislation.

So yeah, you're still retarded.

>>31804341

Can you break down the numbers for your reloading costs? I'd would learn a lot.

I know privi partisan brass is really good, and I heard that seirra match king projectiles are excellant. No idea about powders or other brands though

>>31804395
Gimme about 30 minutes,I'm about to punch out and drive home.

>>31804373
>You keep talking about investments. No one, with even a modicum of intelligence, thinks of guns that aren't machine guns as investments.
pray tell then, why is the first thing anyone ever says when talking about a milsurp in good condition that "its value will go up in the future", why does the future value matter if the gun "is never an investment"?

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>>31804449

Ok, I'll be here!

>>31803640
If that was a real M1D you goofed. You should have been on that like white on rice and nevermind the bubble talk. That's like a '68 Fastback Mustang with a 428 CJ, chances the market drops out on such a car would be slim and none. Same with a M1D Garand, a real one anyways. And seeing as how it is gone already I'm guessing that's about as liquid as it gets from an investment/collectible standpoint, even if it was a little long in the tooth.

I collect a lot of different things, own a couple Garands, a TNW MG34, a Sig 550, gold coins, discontinued lego sets, sea cans full of older (80/90's) BMW's. An M1D Garand for under a G-note would be up there. A rare opportunity I would not pass up again.

My advice. Wait. If it takes a couple months, give it time. A Garand will come up that's fitting for your needs at a price that makes sense in regards to both utility and collectability. When it does come up, blitzkrieg that fucker like your life depends on it. Do not dither! The Garand is one of my favourite shooters and every American should own one.

>>31804685

I honestly know nothing about these rifles. My entire collection is slavshit, save a few. I didn't know that was such a good deal and the other anons who posted hours ago did not make it sound like it was a big deal. To clarify, it did not have the scope or mount. The barrel was also heavily worn, 5 at the muzzle, 3 in the throat. Don't know if this info makes a difference or not.

>>31796705
900 isn't bad if it's in good condition.

Buy it and take it to the cmp store and let them go over it.

>>31804837

>drive to the cmp store

Thats over a thousand miles from my house.

>>31804739
I saw the picture, my '45 is similar. A scope and mount will set you back about a g-note, and if you really want to get anal you pick up a cheek pad for a couple hundred. Go find a complete $2200 M1D, or less.

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>>31805094

>g note
>collects gold, guns, and bmw cars

Are you a wealthy millionare playboy? Your writing style is unique

>>31804739
http://www.gunbroker.com/item/592893948

$2565, 9 bids already and still 11 days left. Nice condition gun, probably better than the one you were offered, but puts into perspective where the market for M1d's are.

>>31805151
Lol! Hardly, would like to be, and might still accomplish that goal. Contractor by trade, I have that hoarding gene, but have a rule about it, only collectibles with some sort of utility or hobby interest. Or gold, which is about as money as it gets.

>>31804477
Fucking construction...

Anyways, load data for the x54r. Assuming you use 51gr of IMR 4895 and X bullets with PPU cases...

$0.17 powder charge
$0.05 per case (assuming 10 loads per case, easily doable with this load)
$0.24 Speer 150gr .311 bullets
$0.03 CCI large rifle primer
$0.02 rounding error

Add it all up and you have $0.51/rnd.

>>31804837
There's a cmp in one of the confederate states!

You can also have it shipped there.