Night Operating

>>31602460
does operating in my dreams count? it happens at night.

Very challenging, very slow. Even using NVGS youre not anywhere close to the same level capability as day time. Depending on what type you use, your depth perception goes to shit - and need to use lasers to aim which is significantly less accurate. Theyre heavy on your head.

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>>31602460
If you want an accurate simulation OP you should tape a set of toilet paper tubes just infront of your eyes and attach a brick to your head because night time operating is limited FOV, depth perception and heavy/batteries.


The worst part about night vision is if your friends dont have it. I am forever cursed to wander around in the woods alone.

>inb4 some fag posts the gpnvg-18
Nobody here owns one

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>>31602533
>>31602460
I also forgot to mention:
Everything is expensive, even the surplus stolen shit is expensive. If you dont have $5000 or so to put into NV you are going to have a really hard time doing any sort of operating

>>31602533
If that is your experience, you have some fucked up NVGs. Yes, it is more uncomfortable than without, but even after hours of active operation, I'm fine. Also, the advantage you gain in an engagement at night well out weighs the limited FOV, which is really only bad out to about 5m - 10m.

>>31602601
The entire post is a hyperbole, obviously NV is handy

>>31602460
You do the same shit at night you do in the day.

During humvee school there is a night drive you do with NVG's. The moon was so bright we didn't need them.

There is also night shoots with NVG's to see the laser of your peq-15. Sometimes hadjis mortared the base at night. Honestly towards the end I'd just throw my blanket over my head and keep sleeping.

>>31602601
So you're saying nonNVG countertroops should endeavor to breach the 10m line before engaging so as to put nighttroops into a disadvantaged state?

Either that or we should just flareshock them.

>>31602460
>What does proper training for this entail?
Turning them on, turning them off, changing the battery and don't lose the cunts or you'll get your arse kicked.
Aside from that, same as anything else- if you can see them, chances are they might be able to see you

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>>31602460
Night vision goggles are a must for any form of stealth and effective combat. If you don't have NVG, you either need to move slowly in the pitch black night, seeing almost nothing, having to feel your way forward, which is really bad for any sort of non-organized warfare, or use flares or other sources of light.
If you have no NVGs, then:
Before dark:
>mark ALL friendlies in a visible manner, eg. white cloth
>ensure EVERYONE knows the countersign / keyword which is used liberally to ensure you're not shooting at friendlies in the dark
>place mines, claymores, traps, alarms as necessary
>ensure light sources are covered
>perform any work that requires noise
After dark:
>keep quiet, unnatural sounds will guide anyone to your position
>let your eyes get accustomed to the dark for at least 5 minutes before you need to perform in the dark.
>engage enemy at a closer distance than at day, you may not even see them far away and will have trouble engaging effectively
>use flares when necessary, ALWAYS close your aiming eye when light is being used
>if someone has NVG, make sure he has an abundance of tracers loaded

>What does proper training for this entail?
The excessive training of all ordinary actions and routines to the point where they can be effectively performed in poor light conditions. Make sure everyone knows how to do everything well, then train them multiple times in the dark, so everyone has a clear idea of just how hard it is to function in a pitch black environment. Everything takes more time.

That's for a organized military if they happen to not have NVGs. It all depends on what kind of operating you're doing exactly.

>>31602730
>Mark all friendlies

What in the fuck? You civilians can sound straight up retarded with these long rants of advice. God knows which movie or video game you learned it from.

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>>31602763
Shit, do I need to go tell my Senior Lt and whatever staff officer approved the manual they're completely wrong? Get your head out of your ass, boot, you mark friendlies for fast identification and actually being able to see them in the dark, especially from behind. Have you ever been in a pitch black forest?

http://puolustusvoimat.fi/documents/1948673/2258487/PEVIESTOS-SKK2015.pdf/bafdd566-cf69-4cb8-b985-40f3f24e439c

>>31602640
>Driving with NODs
>He doesn't used thermal cameras

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>>31602828
>giving some pog trucker optics worth more than the man himself

>>31602788
>Senior LT

That's the retarded shit I'm talking about. The fuck is a senior LT? A 1st LT?

>Reading a manual

No I've never been in a pitch black forest because I was deployed. I know guys who were that trained in Japan tho.
>>31602828
You must be new age Army or something. Marines didn't have that shit.

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>>31602523
This. It's a pain in the ass quite frankly.

There's noting as shitty as walking all night staring into a little green orb, trying to figure out if that's a nice deep hole to stumble into in front of you or if the ground's just a different colour. Even worse when the weather is shitty.

On my first EX after completing training and getting to battalion I was asked by one of the senior guys if my HMNVGS was all adjusted and focused before it got dark and we went on with routine, I thought it still was (did it before we left) but didn't double check because I didn't want to look like I was talking shit and I didn't want to be that guy to ask. So there I was for the rest of the night struggling to see in already shitty drizzle and mist conditions, praying that I didn't lose the guy in front and get me and everyone behind me split from the rest. Never made that mistake again. But even at the best of times using one still sucks.

It's pretty funny when you're in the woods at night and you're face to face staring at another guy, who's staring right back at you, both trying to figure out who the fuck that is no more than arm's reach in front of them. Then you realise it's your OC or something.

>>31602854
>That's the retarded shit I'm talking about. The fuck is a senior LT? A 1st LT?
Yliluutnantti (premiärlöjtnant in Swedish) is a Finnish military rank above luutnantti (löjtnant) and below kapteeni (kapten), equivalent to a senior lieutenant. It is used in the Finnish Defence Forces (army, navy and air force) and the Finnish Border Guard.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senior_lieutenant
>Reading a manual
Read and trained in its contents.
>No I've never been in a pitch black forest because I was deployed. I know guys who were that trained in Japan tho.
Yeah, well I've been in pitch black forests. I've spent more time in them than I wanted to and I've been trained in leading a squad's combat in pitch black conditions with limited NVG capability.
For the sake of effective movement without NVG and to keep spacings from getting too tight, the back of each soldier is marked with something visible, eg. a white cloth, so everyone can easily see the guy in front of him. In a similiar manner, you mark firing positions, foxholes, etc and the routes to them. An effective way of doing it is cutting the bark off pine or spruce, which will then be visible in the otherwise dark tree.
In the autumn and spring, it gets so dark innawoods, you literally can't see the ground you walk on. You can make out the general shape of it, but you can easily walk into a pitfall or a ditch. You can't even tell friend from foe even if they're standing in front of you. All interactions in the dark pretty much start with "who's that?".
Of course using lights is a no-no, since without assumed superiority, light discipline is absolutely important. A single flashlight innawoods will reveal your positions to a drone or plane flying overhead.

>>31602460

Same as during the day, just darker

>>31602953
Your terminology is different then.

I was in the USMC as an Infantryman and a turret gunner. I've been on many night operations. In northern Iraq we were trying to catch smugglers entering the country from Syria. We used night optics a lot.

We wear headbands on all our kevlars that have IR cat eyes on them. So we are always marked ahead of time.

I know jungles can be dark also. Some of the guys said the canopy was so thick it would be pitch black during the daytime.

>>31602788
I cringed reading this