As Nazi Germany. How do you survive WW2 intact?

>>31452117
Not invading Poland or any nation afterword.

>dont invade poland
>let fascism spread throughout the world with significantly less opposition
>Mussolini reforms Italian army
>increase efforts to buddy up with mexico and argentina
>try to get turkey to come back around
>let the japs die, they woke the sleeping giant in the first place
>fight off the USSR with everybody's help when the time comes

>>31452117
Surrender after the first day

>>31452145
>Collapse due to the massive loans you have taken and cant repay without war spoils

Don't pick a fight with both Russia and America at the same goddamn time

Industrialize first. Set up quotas for allied nations manpower, and heavy equipment. Let the USSR attack Poland first, etc.

Also something totally lost on Germany, you need a navy to fight the UK.

Take advantage of internal divisions for the British empire, etc.

>>31452117

Be the first to make a nuclear weapon and a ballistic delivery system that can reach the main land USA. Nothing gets the worlds attention like leveling their capital from the comfort of your own living room.

>>31452322
They couldnt even beat russia on its own

Replace Hitler with someone who isn't retarded

>>31452117

fire Goring and Udet

>fucked dunkirk
>fucked stalingrad

>>31452365
They could if they would have went after the Caucasus Oil Fields.

>>31452390
No, just tell Hitler to listen to his generals.

>>31452402
Taking winter gear would help, too.

>>31452310
You mean the loans that you never even repaid because they were dropped?

>>31452365
They could if the USSR didn't get its gear from the USA

Nerve gas warheads for the V2s

>>31452621
>They could if the USSR didn't get its gear from the USA
Barbarossa had failed before any significant amount of lend lease had arrived. Defeating nazi germany would have taken longer without it but it still would have happened

>>31452635
What is that supposed to accomplish besides making the war a chemical cluster fuck?

File: 12321643_10153937550914140_2640738558048402797_n.jpg (9KB, 237x223px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 237x223px

>>31452427
If Russians couldn't win without winter, why did they win Kursk and Operation Bagration in summer?

>>31452402
You seize the oil fields, good. Now you have oil fields. No extraction facilities, those were destroyed by the retreating Russians. No line to bring it to your refineries in Germany, Austria and Romania. These refineries are already working at full time with the production of the small European oil fields. How do you turn that oil 1000 miles deep in enemy territory, ripe with partisans, into good quality fuel for your vehicles on the frontline? Do you bring your oil on tankers through the Black Sea where they"re pretty much undefended against Soviet submarines and the Royal Air Force, because your tiny Kriegsmarine is out in the Atlantic and the Italians got pearl harbor'd? Do you bring them by rail or road, exposing these sensitive, soft and squishy targets to every partisan from Moldova to Azerbaidjan? Do you ask to go through Turkey, and risk an attack from the south by the British, who will then join forces with the Soviets? Do you build refineries here, in enemy occupied territory, and bring the fuel directly to your troops ; all of this, with the partisans still around?

Of course the partisans are no 101st Airborne division, but you can't guard efficiently 1000 miles of railroads - because Nazi Germany never had enough trucks for its first line divisions, let alone for logistics - when a hand grenade stuck behind a rail can send your precious oil train into the nearest ditch.

It isn't like Hearts of Iron where capturing the oil field means you get a boost to your oil production. Logistics wins wars, it is more important than any cool tank or rifle your army can field. This is why the Germans didn't win any war since 1871. They can fight battles, but their pants-on-head retarded 18th century tier idea of massive battles to discourage the enemy from fighting isn't viable in the industrial era - which began more than 100 years before WW2.

>>31452117
>How do you survive WW2 intact?
Turn Poland into buffer state. Now you can't invade USSR and USSR can't invade you.
Take. Fucking. Malta. By any cost, by any means. Mediterranean sea must be secure. With all resources from never happened Barbarosa operation Germans can kick Allies from Africa in a matter of month and get short road to all resources of Africa. Then you can do whatever you want. You can take Middle East, because you've got shorter logistic chain than Brits, you can use Soviet railroads to transfer stuff to Japs, you can take rest of Europe up to Gibraltar, anything. Except march on Moscow.

if the USSR had attacked poland first, could nazi germany use this as casus belli to "liberate" poland and invade the soviet union without intervention?

Do not invade Poland.

Do not start war.

Develop nukes.

>>31452117
>WW2
Strange game. The only winning move is not to play.

Summon more demons, make the moonbase do more work, annex Poland and Austria without going through belgium or france, turtle hard.

>>31453950
God, what if the Nazi moonbase is a real fucking thing, and they would return when Earth turns more right wing, that would be the shit.

>>31453924
>if the USSR had attacked poland first
Only question - why?
All that shit is based on one and only one hypothesis. That Stalin had irrational desire to conquer Europe in general and Poland in particularly. Which in short can be described as "STALIN WAS EVIL" .
IRL he was not. IRL non-aggression pact had very clear idea about independent Poland as buffer state. IRL Stalin had a lot of problems in his country and not a single one of them could be solved by invading Poland before Germans. Or by conquering Europe.

>>31453984
Explain why the USSR battled Poland in the 20s, and the expansionist war with Finland?

Under absolutely no circumstance invade the Soviets. Call Hirohito and bitch slap him over the phone for even dreaming of attacking the US, offer material aid in invading China. After Britain is under control, focus on conquering African colonies under former British and French rule, extracting as much resources/slave labor as possible. Speed development/production of aircraft, tanks, wonder weapons, and make efforts to replace the K98 with StG44/45's as quickly as logistically possible. Make inroads in the middle east to eventually take India and eventually help take China outright, with the understanding that Asia belongs to Japan. If Stalin gets nervous that we're starting to surround him, offer him the Friend Price on tobacco, oil, French whores and saffron.

Wait.

Don't fight Russia. Tell Japan not to fucking with America until European front is won.

>>31453984
I was asking if they had *hypothetically* done so
the point of this thread is to come up with a made up scenario

>>31453990
>Explain why the USSR battled Poland in the 20s
Because it was Trotsky idea about global revolution, which was idiotic in first place.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_in_One_Country
And because there was a problem of Leningrad safety which was not possible to solve peacefully. Soviets tried to do that, Finns showed middle finger. BTW, Finns already invaded USSR before in 20th, so Leningrad safety wasn't something excuse, it was a real fucking problem. That problem was solved.

Just pause every once in a while and let shit settle down. They fucked up by constantly biting off more than they could chew and it finally kicked their ass.

Everything up to invading Poland was smooth.

Re-arm the Rhineland
Annex Austria
Get your Sudetenland and then grab the rest of Czechoslovakia
Get Danzig back. The League of Nations isn't gonna do shit about it.

Then chill out for a while. Instead of signing a non-aggression pact with the USSR try to negotiate an alliance with Poland. Play "good cop" for a while and try to get back in the good graces of the rest of Europe. You got fucked at the end of WWI but you got most of what you had to have back. Keep building your military and tell Japan to go fuck off. That attacking the US idea is just a bad plan.

Sign a pact with the Baltic states. See if you can get the UK or France to do it too. Bring Poland along. Become the heavy lifter in a Europe vs. USSR alliance and then when the time is right go fuck the Russians shit up with the blessing of the rest of the continent.

Keep the Jew killing on the down-low.

>>31454075
Marxism is an internationalism movement, so the idea that it isn't expansionist is kinda stupid.

It's true that Stalin wasn't a Marxist when he wanted "socialism in one country", but his attack of Finland proved that he could do the same thing Hitler did if there's a security threat to the USSR.

>>31452339
>Industrialize first
How dumb are you?

>>31454090
He is not. German industry was pretty meh.

>>31454086
Welp, it wasn't "same thing Hitler did", because what he did had no rational reasons. Only ideological. Stalin and Soviets were reasonable and scientific to the level of Borgs. Problem was that no one liked USSR in that time, and no one feared USSR in that time, so threats to USSR were real. A lot of countries, Poland and Finland in this list too, wanted to solve some of their problem by marching to Moscow.

>>31454076

are you fucking 12?

>tell japan not to attack the US

go learn some history

wtf?

>>31454132
>Welp, it wasn't "same thing Hitler did", because what he did had no rational reasons. Only ideological.
What? Hitler invaded Poland in the presume of taking back Danzig, which is a key security/economic concern of Germany.
>Only ideological. Stalin and Soviets were reasonable and scientific to the level of Borgs.
Bullshit.
>Problem was that no one liked USSR in that time, and no one feared USSR in that time, so threats to USSR were real. A lot of countries, Poland and Finland in this list too, wanted to solve some of their problem by marching to Moscow.
Except the USSR attacked them first.

>>31452117
Don't split Poland with Russia. Drag out the negociations for the German-Soviet Frontier treaty. Russian military command is still suffering from the purges and by November they're also fighting the Winter War. Since we haven't had to deal with the battles of France and Britain we've still got the manpower to match the Russians. Attack by November 14th and we've got an advantage.

Most importantly, we haven't begun the invasion of France and it's still assumed that France has the greatest land army in Europe. There's no unifying fear that Germany will conquer Europe and nobody gives a shit about the Soviets. We can prosecute the war on Russia without them receiving Lend and Lease or having another front open up on our west.

Focus on advancing on the Russian south. Capture the farmland by March and hold it through the growing season. Even contesting the farmland through the growing season is enough. If we can hold on until September the Russian army will starve. They'll try to import through St. Petersburg but that can be lessened with submarine warfare.

>>31454162
>Except the USSR attacked them first.
So what?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Karelian_uprising_and_Soviet–Finnish_conflict_of_1921–22
You have problem with security of your second largest city, you've got country who already invaded you not so long ago, and this country now with support of all major players on political map fucks with you. Border incidents and provocations were so frequent, that Finns fired at their own diplomats once. You need to solve that particular problem with security of that particular city. Stalin solved it.
>>31454162
>What? Hitler invaded Poland in the presume of taking back Danzig, which is a key security/economic concern of Germany.
He invaded Russia because of ideological reasons. Invasion in Poland was much more complicated than that and Poland can be blamed for that world shitshtorm even more than Germans.
>>31454173
>Attack by November 14th and we've got an advantage.
You will not be able to deal with USSR in 1939. First of all, France is under Franco-Soviet Treaty of Mutual Assistance which still in power, since no pact between Russia and German in power. Second - Soviet masses of tanks and planes are not outdated now. They will be 1941, but in 1939 they are force that can beat the shit out of you. T-35, T-28, even BT-7, right now thay are kinda top of the line. Third and most important - you have no experience. Soviets had more experience than you, because they had Japs, they had Finns, they were in Spain. You had only Poles and Spain.

>>31454266
If the USSR attacked them first, the USSR is wrong, no matter what, unless the opponents false flagged it.

>>31452117

If WW2 has started already:

> Start using less than 10000 different and overcomplicated models for everything
> Stop every other naval construction except uboats until 1942, as a plan B. Ideally, at the beginning of 1941 they should be at least 350% more of the historical number.
> Fire (literally?) the three idiots (Goering, Hess & Himmler) immediately.
> Crush Poland as it's on already.
> Proceed historically up to 1940
> Don't let the Brits escape from dunkirq
> After a total victory in Dunkirq propose to the allies the best possible peace deal for them. Something along these lines: no reparations, just giving back Alsace Lorraine and maybe German East Africa. Something so reasonable and magnanimous they might want to accept.
> If they don't, fuck, time to try to starve them with uboats before it's too late.
> Fuck off Japan.png
> Then deal with Russia in a more reasonable manner, lure them in to have them be the aggressor, destroy them operationally on the field without overextending. Use Poland, White Russia and Eastern Europe as the batllefield, don't be autistic about holding every inch of terrain
> Also, FFS, ditch immediately Jodl and just promote Manteuffel, Guderian and Kesselring.

This way Maaaaybe i say Maaaaybe you have a slim chance

>>31453001
It's not about taking the oil for yourself. It's about taking it away from the Russians.

>>31452310
>paying debts
>ever
Every country post-ww2 called, they're laughing at you.

The dollar is a fucking debt-based currency now, sure, it's not sustainable, but the principle is if anyone ever tries to cash in on your debt you invade their country. What's the use in honor or sustainability if it cuts into the governor's dollar?

>>31453001

see >>31454430

>>31454278
This guy knows what's up.

My only differences:

>somewhat re-arm and rebuild Poland under german command, remind them the Russkis are worse. Use them to keep the Russians busy.
>Avoid the UK until continental Europe is under complete control. Play politics as needed.
>Leave Japan to deal with America. Support them openly, but double cross them. Support the Chinese.
>Have Mussolini assasinated, install loyalist government.
>

File: Immagine.jpg (21KB, 943x98px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 943x98px

>>31454054

How come during WW2 America had impressive cities with skyscrapers and effective public transit, while Europe had boring, unimpressive cities with the tallest buildings being government/church related?

File: Panzergrenadier.jpg (722KB, 1600x1152px) Image search: [Google]

722KB, 1600x1152px

>>31452117
Do not underestimate the Soviets and the Americans.

>>31452117
Not have a retarded centralized economy which can't sustain itself (requiring you to plunder neighboring nations to survive economically), for starters

And not picking fights with people, for another, additionally, don't let an artschool reject micromanage war efforts.

Basically don't be Nazi Germany.

>>31452353
>scrape together effort to make one nuke
>use the only one you have to pick a fight with one of the world's biggest military powers, and giving them the excuse of showing no mercy
SMART

Wonder weapons and STG44s won't help you when all your resupply comes in on wagons

>>31454430
>>31455670

Yeah, because Central Asian and Siberian oil fields and lend lease fuel don't real.

>>31454098
German industry was second in the world.

>>31456518
Yeah, it was so cool that their total amount of tanks produced was smaller than USSR's production of a single type of tank. Keeping in mind russians had to evacuate tank production thats not very impressive.

>>31456577
And Russia makes more tanks than Germany today, so what? Germany's industry is stronger because industry is about more than just tanks.

>>31454609
>tries to cash in on your debt
Are you in high school? This is not how debt works, let alone how national debt works.

>>31456250

Who sad anything about one nuclear weapon? It keeps America out of the war by the mere threat of it.

>>31456667
Not by that much. And current German tanks are actually that much better than Russian ones to compensate for the difference in quantity.

>>31456716
>missing the point this badly
Industry is more than tanks. You can't compare two nations' industrial capacity by comparing their tank production and nothing else. Is this hard?

>>31456697
Why would America be threatened by nonexistent German nukes? German code was broken, German secrecy was compromised, and even if the US doesn't know that Germany has no nukes, Germany has no way to deliver any bombs to the US.

>>31456726
They produced less of everything else too, you know. And you can easily compare two nations's industrial capacity by seeing who reks whos capital, that is very easy.
German industry produced too small amount of too inefficient designs to be anywhere near second place in the world.

>>31452117
Well for this I'm curious about some terms. Am I Hitler? Do I have full control over every aspect of the country? Am I already at war?

>>31453939
t. WOPR

>>31456577
It was about fucked up efficiency of capitalistic Germany against Borg-like organization of Soviet tank-building-cities. They even had tank crews on that factories doing part of job, so they learn their tank while assembling it.

>>31455931
As long as Italy isn't invaded, Mussolini is fine to leave in place.

>as pseudo-Hitler, make phone calls with Il'Duce every evening around 8pm to make sure shit is going good with his end.
>coordinate industrial works with Italy, get them producing long barrel Pz.III asap.


As allies go, the AXIS were very dysfunctional, remedy that asap.

>>31456379
Siberian oilfields didn't exist until mid-Cold War.

However you are correct about the rest + high octane gas imports from USA.

>>31452310
Germany fucked their own economy.
The terms of ther Versailles treaty were harsh but could be managed.
This if before you take into account concessions made towards the Germans.

They basically spat their dummy out and fucked up their economy to spite people.

>>31452339
>Let the USSR attack Poland
It's doubtful they'd have done it without Germany's aid.
>you need a Navy to invade Britain
And air superiority. And years of experience. And the ability to sink sjips using aircraft. And landing craft. And intact ports. Sea Lion was a joke.

>Dont holocaust your Jewish scientists and engineers
>Standardize vehicles, guns and everything else to lessen the logistical load
>Spend the money on nuclear bombs instead of von Brauns rockets (the rocket program was literally more expensive than the Manhattan project)
>Subamarines, everywhere - fuck the surface fleet
>Fuck London, bombard the airfields
>Fuck superheavy tanks, RPGs for everyone!
>Mobilization of the industry for war on day one instead of in 1943

>>31454278
>starve Britain with U-boats
Convoys, ASDIC and other such tactics and advances nulify that really.

>>31456111
What?
I'll bite.
Europe had ventures old cities no one wanted to knock down.

>>31456987
Dönitz wanted 300 subs, he got 80.

Duh, of course you cant get the job done if you only get 1/4th the subs you need. Convoys are one big juicy targets and ASDIC is done by warships - also viable targets for WW2 subs.

And then there's the undetectable electro-subs which never hit the sea as the war ened when they left the shipyards in numbers.

>>31456963
>spend money on the nuclear bomb
It wasn't just about money. They didn't have the personalities to get a project on the scale of the Manhattan project to work. They weren't even willing to work with each other.
They also had nothing to deliver a bomb with.
>bomb the airfields
And fighter command just moves them out of bomber range, lose the BoB regardless.

>>31457038
>undetectable
[citation needed]
>wanted 300
Still wouldn't have helped once convoys, allied technology and Germany's top secret military code being utterly broken comes into play.

>>31456748

Did you even read the premise of the original thread?

>>31457042
The Manhattan project is a who's who of European science, hece my first point - dont holocaust your Jewish scientists.

>>31457076
>Germany's top secret military code being utterly broken comes into play

Canaris, head of some German intelligence agency was a traitor, he supplied the British with everything they needed because he was disgusted with the Nazi state. That can be mitigated by not being a disgusting Nazi state, see point one of this post.

>>31456987

Up until 1942 u-boat were extremely effective, and in 1941 they were very close to killing the uk supply routes. Later on they are useless, i concur.

But if you could get 220 uboats produced in 1940 instead of the 50 that were actually built, as well as enough crews, you'd make a HUGE difference. (200 uboats were built in 1941, production peaked in 1942 with 238)

>>31452117
>How do you survive WWII intact

By not fucking starting WWII. Become like the USA in terms of production, gradually over time. If the German military industry was able to produce to the degree it did during the war, surely it could have done the same to become a munitions and arms supplier for the world like the US did.

>>31454054

> After Britain is under control,

And thats where your theory becomes retarded. That wasn't ever going to happen. Every single time its been played out it has been a crushing defeat for Germany.

It wasn't possible.

> Speed development/production of aircraft, tanks, wonder weapons

Why not just add a "win the war better" while you're in the realm of reality breaking?

>>31456518

They were outproduced by the US, UK and Russia. Not even slightly. Convincingly.

>>31457115

>Canaris, head of some German intelligence agency was a traitor, he supplied the British with everything they needed because he was disgusted with the Nazi state.

Do you legitimately think thats the only point? That is minor compared to other things the guy raised.

>>31457184

>Up until 1942 u-boat were extremely effective, and in 1941 they were very close to killing the uk supply routes.

Completely meme tier. They had only two very very short periods of success, both which were shut down almost immediately. They never even came close to starving out the UK. 90+% of shipping got through.

>>31457115
>the Manhattan project was a who's who of scientists
Who were only one key part of it. Germany didn't have the industrialists to pull it off either.
>Canadian gave it to the British
The Poles had already had success in the 30's and have this information to the British. The code was broken because the allies had the minds to donut and the skill to keep the Germans from finding out, don't kid yourself.
>>31457184
You'd have a huge difference, for a while, but it would still be countered. Spent matter how many U-boats you have if the allies can work out where they are.

>>31452353
Why the fuck attacking the US? It wasnt the enemy for germany at the start. Stop reflecting your country as that important in the start of the war.

>>31457365
*minds to do it

>>31457369
Because the USA obviously wanted to get in on the action from the start of the war

See: oil embargo on Japan and declaring war on Germany

>Seperate Hitler from military powers, keep him purely political
>Let generals plan out invasions when they want, how they want
>Enjoy show as generals invade X country without fear of hitler modifying the plan

>>31457571
>oil embargo
They choose not to see oil to who they want. Maybe they should have fucked off out of China then
>declare war on Germany
In response to Germany's declaration of war against them, you doublenigger.

>>31457642
>enjoy show as Generals wait until '41-'42 to invade France
>fail miserably since the French and British are actually prepared

>>31452353

How to build a nuke, by Germany

> 1. Expell all the jewish scientists
> 2. Disregard anything written by Einstein because it's Judenphysiks
> 3. Start a war with Britain, and subsequently Australia, Canada and the Congo, thus cutting yourself off from 90% of the world's Uranium supply
> 4. Declare war on Russia, cutting yourself off from the last 10%
> 5. Fail to develop nuclear weapons

>>31454430

Still doesn't matter, if things got really bad, the Americans were producing enough oil to cover all their own needs, the British, and the Soviets.

>>31457771
US warships were shooting at German subs on sight and there were US troops occupying Iceland to protect it from potential German invasion, all in the early months of 1941. That's just the tip of the iceberg that is US interventionism in WW2.

File: image.png (245KB, 444x638px) Image search: [Google]

245KB, 444x638px

>>31457815
Relevant pic

>>31457184
>and in 1941 they were very close to killing the uk supply routes
U-Boats sank 4 million tons of allied and neutral merchant shipping in 1940 and 1941 combined. Britain had about 24 million tons of merchant shipping when the war broke out.

>>31458026

There were also just about one quarter the amount of U-boats requested.

>>31456697
It took the US a lot of time and effort to build their first bombs, testing, research, they used the only two bombs thet had on the Japanese.

Consider now that Germany was running a retarded centralized economy at the time, do you think they would really have more than one or two, within any time? This assumes they would even have the logistics to research one functional bomb, or a delivery system.

Consider also that they need somewhere to test this, where will they test it without the others finding out?

But say they sent a bomb (or two) at America, what will then stop the Americans, out for your blood, from invading your country?
They would have cause and justification which would make Pearl Harbor look like nothing, hell, they were already developing nuclear weapons on their own, you could very well expect retaliatory strikes, followed by a land invasion.

Finally, did there even exist any rocket delivery systems at the time, which had enough reach to get across the world, while carrying a nuclear warhead? ICBMs didn't exist yet, they would either have to launch from a ship (which involves having to get dangerously close to the American Navy), or deliver it with a plane (which involves somehow getting that plane into American airspace).

You make it sound like it would be easy, but it really wouldn't. How would you stop the Allies from finding out through espionage?

>>31454278
>Don't let the Brits escape from Dunkirk
There's the little matter of a whole French field army and a shitload of missing petrol between that and possibility. The Germans didn't "let the British escape", they ran out of fuel.

>>31458045
U-Boats were opportunistic. They preyed on isolated older boats that were too slow to keep up with convoys. Increasing U-Boat numbers by 400% wouldn't increase sunk tonnage by 400% because then the U-Boats will run out of easy targets and will have to go after tough targets.

Building 300 U-Boats to start WW2 is just not realistic for a multitude of reasons anyway.

>>31457937
Your point? Occupying Greenland isn't an aggressive action unless Germany was thinking of invading (which would make it a valid US move). As for shooting U-boats on sight, that's what months of aggressive behaviour towards US merchant ships and a torpedo attack on the US destroyer Greere gets you.
Germany was the idiot aggressor, sorry Hanz.

>>31458200
They didn't run out of fuel so much as run out of operational tanks. Their panzer divisions were at like 20% strength and strung out for miles due to breakdowns.

>>31458212
Sending an infantry division so they can take over the Brits and lighten the load on Britain is not an aggressive action?
US also trained British and Canadian pilots, and repaired British boats, including warships. US was building weapons for Britain on order, and openly discussing how to share the responsibility for protecting British convoys.
US was not isolationist and neutral. It was obvious to Germany and everyone else in the world that the US was simply waiting for the right moment.

>>31452117
Not be Nazi Germany.

>>31458150

Perhaps I need to clarify here. Obtain nuclear weapons and a delivery means before ever firing a shot. Testing can be performed in Libya which is controlled by Italy and is friendly. I'm not saying use the thing just get it and make is clear that you will use it if there's any intervention by either Britain or the United States in your invasion of main land Europe.

>>31458651
Why not just invade and take over Britain and United States?

>>31458274
I'm certainly willing to believe that Canadians trained with Americans, and that America probably even supplied planes to train, but I doubt many Americans were in charge of Canadian flight school.

But aside from the Flying Tigers and whatever they called the ones sent to Britain, I doubt there were more combat experienced US pilots than Canadian or British ones.

>>31458732
>Germany
>staging a land invasion on America
>not being a complete clusterfuck of dead Germans and failure
Holy shit Fritz, get a grip.

>>31458274
You just keep slipping backwards don't you. Isolationism doesn't mean that you should just stop selling anything t people involved in a war.
As for them being aympatheticntowarsa the British, well it helped that the British didn't go around threatening US shipping, you reap what you sow.

File: 4910150+_bd5b5405ac1c05afa8060409d29d2a17.jpg (33KB, 1024x576px) Image search: [Google]

33KB, 1024x576px

>>31458780
>Can't even realistically consider an invasion of Britain at the peak of their power.
>Somehow build up to the point where an invasion of the US is any bit feasible.

>>31458780
>whooosh

>>31458651
>Obtain nuclear weapons
That's delightfully vague and unspecific; "just obtain them"

>>31452390
No.

>>31452408
This.

>>31458780
Shit, even attempting a land invasion of Britain would have fucked them. >>31458651
>make it clear you will lose it
The only way the Germans could deploy it would be on a flatcar/ship.
They did not possess an aircraft that could realistically deliver it.
So they'd only be able to use it against an attacking force and given the power of the early nuclear weaponry, it would have been bad, but not enough to stop then getting their shit pushed in eventually.

>>31458150
>Germany was running a retarded centralized economy at the time
Sorta but not really.

Corporations were still independent, and competed viciously. Usually playing political favors off against each other to get this contract, or sabotage someone else. And they did this because if Heinkel won a contract only Heinkel made money off of it So they each had their own separate jet program, and if they'd only worked together they probably would have had fighters and bombers in 1940.

Meanwhile the US government told everyone that the B-17 was the bomber they were going to build, and then told everyone that they were going to make money building it. And they basically repeated this through every branch of military production.

At the end of the war the US military had 2 types of trucks in service, and they had interchangeable parts. The German military had about 50 types of trucks, most with non-interchaneable parts.

Centralized economics killed Germany alright... the American kind.

Ironically the MIC that exists now is closer to what Germany had than what we had in WW2.

>>31458822

What do you want man a detailed step by step plan from beginning to end? Start your very own Manhattan Project try and keep it as secret as possible. In parallel start developing aircraft and ballistic missiles for delivery. Don't invade anyone until you have your super weapon your ace in the hole.

>>31453939
Fucking Swiss

>>31454160

I history just fine. You read all that and the Japan comment was what you focused on? The gist of it was stay out of Japan's business. What possible help was Japan to Nazi Germany? The answer to that is none faggot. They just attacked the worst possible country in the world to attack and then the Germans followed them into war with that country.

That was an alliance that made zero sense.

File: 1468976739638.jpg (29KB, 299x382px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 299x382px

Get a better Fuhrer
Don't underestimate the power of stupid people (Communists) in large numbers.

>>31459367
>Opening a second front for the US
>implying that Japan didn't have the entire Pacific in their pocket before the US joined the war.
>implying their loyalty to the 3rd Reich wasn't the strongest compared to the Italians.
The only thing worse than your history is your rebuttals.

Going to just leave this here.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I98P1AxQRUM

The Russians had killed 8 out of 11 Germans which had fought in WW2. It is unrealistic to believe that the winter was the only success for the Russians, for many things take play. One being that how Hitler wanted to do more then 3 things at once, all hundreds of miles apart. Another thing simply being 80% of troops had been foot-mobile, walking from Warsaw to Moscow is quite the fucking bitch. Russian roads and railroads were smaller in size, and the terrain and nearly none of said roads caused great difficulty.

>>31452408
literal cringe you fucking autist

>>31452117
As it turns out, I have recently read up on German Interwar military doctrine for a briefing. The German Higher Ups knew the only way to achieve victory was to strike and wing decisively and quickly. Fight too long, and coalition forces gain enough power to overwhelm or outlast you. Also, Germany thought more defensively, at least with their air force. Interesting stuff, no doubt.

>>31452402
They did. They just committed too little resources because they were trying to Moscow at the same time. Hitler executed spontaneous change of objectives but allocating piecemeal amounts of units, until shit goes south. Then they respond with increased reinforcements; further draining resources for other, more important, objectives.

>>31454059
But think about it.
>full resources of German military.
>No long range fighter escorts or bombers (provided by the US) to counterbomb and intercept.
>full on German Blitz
>even radar cant save you now.
>imagine even a fraction of the invasion troops Germany used in Russia and imagine them landing on British shores.
>even your God cant save you now

>>31461122
Sorry meant to post that to >>31457319

Kill the idiot who is currently Fuhrer along with Goebbels, purge the SS who steal resources and time from the Wehrmacht, and use the concentration camp inmates to form many new strafbattalions.

>>31459466
>One being that how Hitler wanted to do more then 3 things at once, all hundreds of miles apart.
Or you can just bunch up your army and zerg the middle. Now your logistics are clogged up and your flanks are exposed. Good job, you are literally worse than Hitler.

How do we bring fascism back to the front of world politics
I miss it lads

>you will never hit golden gold balls off the capitals roof into the dirty favelas below with Pinochet

>>31458026

> Britain had about 24 million tons of merchant shipping when the war broke out.

Yea, and the US had 40 million and could build 15 million a year.

It's like trying to mop up rain.

You hit diminishing returns as the number of U-boats increases, and also increasing losses as escorts are more likely to run into submarines and sink them.

>>31452117
Invade Romania via Hungary, then invade the USSR. No war with Poland means no war with the UK or France. Convince Japan not to attack China, but to build up and attack the USSR from the east. Because the USSR has no Navy, if Japan suffers territorial losses it would only be in mainland Asia. Tell Benito to wait to fuck around in the Balkans, he'll only bog us down anyway. Tell the Turks you'll let them finish what they started in Armenia if they are willing to help.

>>31452117

instead of invading Poland as they did, instigate race riots in Danzig, and enter the Free City as a peace keeping force. After that, stage a plebiscite in the Free City to join Germany. Obviously, Germany wins. If Poland wants to start a war, they can start a war, but I'd stop at Danzig.

The sad thing is that the agricultural revolution made Lebensraum obsolete 10 years after the war ended.

File: hitler_thug.jpg (38KB, 500x327px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 500x327px

>>31452117
This thread should be on /his/ or /pol/ but I'll bite
>StG's and Panzerfausts for everyone
>adopt a battle tank, ~40t with a gun ~90mm
>muh nukes
>improve wartime production, every company making what is necessary for the war effort, not just what they've designed

>agree to Molotov-Ribbentrop pact
>mobilize against Poland
>call off the invasion at the last minute
>watch the Soviet Union invade little ol Poland by themselves
>rush to the Poles aid against Bolshevik aggression

The West now has quite a conundrum to deal with. Will they support you, and go against their interests on the continent? Will they go against the Soviets and admit that they're a bunch of evil scheming bastards? Or will they do nothing and make it seem like the only ones with enough balls to stand up against Communism is Deutschland?

>>31456232
>Basically don't be Nazi Germany.

But this thread is for people who think that was the white mans last hope.

>>31461699

The technology that made the "Green revolution" already happened, the problem is that it was across the pond in the US. The US spent a ton of money increasing agricultural yields after the 1930's dust bowl, and achieved higher crop yields than anyone else in the world.

Germany had the tech base to do the same, but they didn't, and all the nitrates and chemical labs that could have made better fertilizers went into making explosives.

The thing about Danzig riots is that Hitler already played that card with the annexation of Czechoslovakia. If rioting happens, Poland is going to impose martial law, and they have the mobilized units to do it.

Your idea is actually counter productive, since it gives the poles additional time to mobilize early. The invasion of Poland only went as well as it did due to the fact that over half the Polish army was still on trains moving to their assembly areas, and those areas got overrun before they could even get there and form something resembling an organized unit.

>>31461769

your scenario is interesting but it's not going to work, because that's exactly what the Soviets did. If you're both waiting for the other one to invade, nothing is going to happen (nothing is better than world war 2, though)

Thread always brings people who know nothing of history out. Germany was doomed from the beginning because this: >>31452310

They lost as soon as they started and Japan made a desperate gambled that failed. There is nothing in a million years that could've made Germany win.

File: bundesarchiv_bild_183-p1013-316_westfront_deutscher_panzer_in_roye.jpg (252KB, 800x552px) Image search: [Google]

252KB, 800x552px

>>31461788

good point. In that case, going full soviet, but I'd skip the race riots and have Danzig hold the plebecite without race riots, while 150,000 "Tourists" happen to be in the city. There again, if the poles invade to disrupt the plebiscite then they started the war.

If we can wind it all the way back to the Munich agreement, I'd take just the Sudetenland and Pilzen/Skoda plus Danzig instead of all of Czecha. I'd set up an agreement to allow the Poles to use the Port of Danzig duty-free (and build them a railway corridor and even supply the trains, if that helped) while Danzig itself is united with Germany. Thus we have a contiguous Germany and a Poland that isn't cut off from the sea. If it was feasable, I'd fund a second port in Lithuania for the Poles (Polish-Lithuanian commonwealth appeal) so they wouldn't be dependent on just Danzig for their link to the sea.

The problem with Czecha is Hitler had a personal vendetta against the Czechs from his time in Vienna that made him overplay his hand during the Munich Agreement.

I know that Hitler actively sought rapprochement with Poland and failed to achieve it, so I'm not sure how well this plan would work.

As long as we're in the realm of wild fantasy, I'd go back in time with a bomber wing of B-2 spirits and neutron bomb London, Paris, Warsaw, New York, Washington DC, Moscow and Leningrad and then blame the destruction on Jewish Blood Libel and Kabbalistic rituals while fervently denying any German involvement.

>>31461792
This is assuming that the invasions would be negotiated to be synchronized, unlike in actual history where the Soviets waited two weeks.

It also wasn't a ruse by the Soviet Union to raise the West against Germany. The allies didn't call the Soviets out on invading a neutral country because neither France or Britain had anything to gain from fighting the Soviets too, and the Germans had already caught all of the outrage from the invasion.

>>31462011

If you really wanted to work out a diplomatic solution, there has to be a land exchange.

What you could do is propose a land swap, trade the Danzig corridor for Memel, which Germany recently demanded from Lithuania and Poland had also tried to acquire. Perhaps even go farther, appeal to the Polish sense of lost glory and propose Poland annex Lithuania with German support.

>>31462230

letting Poland annex Lithuania could work, desu. especially if you rig up a nice plebiscite.

File: 1458083037848.jpg (540KB, 1325x1000px) Image search: [Google]

540KB, 1325x1000px

>>31456211
>when the officer steals your zeltbahns so they can have custom-tailored camisuits

>>31461769
I assume you plan to use magic to aquire these STGs, Panzerfausts, new tanks and nukes.

>>31452117
Figure out how to suck stalin's dick hard enough that he not only sides with you over the allies, but russia actually joins the axis.

Bonus points if you keep the stupid fucking japs from bombing america and getting them involved.

That's it, really.

>>31461122
I don't think you understand the logistical impossibility of that for germany. How many soldiers you have does not matter in an amphibious invasion, its how many you can put ashore in time before a counterattack comes and flattens you.

To do that you need vast amounts of landing equipment, shipping capacity, shore bombardment capability, total naval and air supremacy.

The Germans had none of that, the allies needed all that, plus help from resistance, plus strategic deception to pull it off even with a massive disparity in resources. The germans wouldn't even be able to stop the RN surface fleet from steaming down and blocking the channel as soon as they landed.

File: 91613e6cbeb48b76b7d64b891f329ff8.jpg (114KB, 736x930px) Image search: [Google]

114KB, 736x930px

>>31452117
Pray Rudolf Hess makes a peace deal with England. Don't declare war on America after Pearl.

>>31461771
No one thinks that.

Even if that Nazis had won, western culture would still be reaching senescence by now.

>>31461771
So retarded people?

Get rid of the king SJW, avoid mess altogether, instead structure country for effective capitalism.

Offer manpower and manufacturing to Europe for cheap, though you're currently in debt and have no money, this small income will help.
Basically rent out German workers to either do work and manufacturing in Germany for cheap, and a small cut of the profits, or outright send them abroad to do labor, such as being farmhands, factory workers, or sailors. An important step here is to, at least to a degree, undercut at job markets, give people an incentive to hire your cheap labor.
Also just do agriculture in general, undercut neighbor markets with cheap grain.

Also make use of your Jews to make sound financial investments and help bolster industry, they have a long history with money, don't waste this, instead of taxing them high and making them flee or move their wealth, tax then low to give them an incentive to stick around and still pay their tax, give them a reason to invest in your agriculture and labor export, a cut of the profits.

Eventually, after a few years of rebuilding your economy, try to open negotiations and see if you can get at least part of all the unfair debt off your back, as it's so crippling for you as a nation to deal with.

>>31465101
This is the dumbest post in this thread. And that's pretty impressive in a way.

>>31459415
>they were 3rd out of 3!
Wew
>They had been fighting the second sino Japanese war for over 10 years on mainland China
>This matters to Japan's complete lack of support for the European theater
>Literally late to the party and not even part of the pact of steel

The Japs being tacked on to the german-Italian alliance made zero fucking sense. Even less so after they decided to attack the one country that was cool to endebt europe but not open up a second European front through direct military support.

>>31465115
But why

>>31465580
I don't even know where to begin. I've never seen that much stupidity in one post.

>>31452322
War between Russia and Germany was inevitable. Russia was in the process of invading Europe, so Germany engaged in a preemptive war. It may not have been the best strategy, but war with Russia couldn't have been avoided.

The USA government was itching the join the fight since the start, but the people needed to be convinced it was worthwhile. Japan gave them a reason. However, even if the USA was kept out of direct war with Germany they were acting as a supply base for the enemies of Germany. It's a tricky situation.

Perhaps if they had avoided war for longer and had successfully developed nuclear weapons in secret things would have been different, but avoiding war was an impossibility. Most of Europe was immediately hostile to them once they threw out the bankers.

>>31458783
Germany threatened US shipping to Britain, because the US was supplying lend-lease munitions and aid to Britain and not Germany.

File: original-mauser-waffen.jpg (302KB, 1689x2362px) Image search: [Google]

302KB, 1689x2362px

>>31452117
>how do i survive Nazi Germany.
arm every citizen with....

>>31465790
Please

>>31452117
Get rid of Hitler and get someone competent for the job.

>>31456903
>The terms of the Versailles treaty were harsh but could be managed.
Anon the country was in shambles. There will always be an extremist party rising to power when people are taking a wheelbarrow of money out with them to buy groceries.

Had the French and British just let Germany keep their empire intact there probably would not have been enough popular motivation for another war, given the intensely bitter feelings from the soldiers and citizens that went through the Great War. I'd wager the growing threat of communism in the east may have even strengthened relations between the old Central Powers and the Entente.

File: M1A1 Turret Side Armor.jpg (459KB, 2456x1808px) Image search: [Google]

459KB, 2456x1808px

>>31452117
>Go to bed after watching the Trump~Clinton debate, giggling myself to sleep
>Wake up feeling hung over as shit, walk to the bathroom to get some water to clear out this cotton mouth.
>turn light on, look in mirror, scream obscenities in German
>holy fuck I know German
>holy fuck I'm literally Hitler
>its 1933, the day after the election victory party
>and all your knowledge of 2016 is intact

Lets
Get
Down
To
Business
To
Defeat
The
_______
>call the secretary to contact all the big industry CEO's, my top 3 generals in each the branches, and get me Albert Speer
>tell them to pack their shit and meet me in the banquet hall, bring lunches
>have an aid bring in a lot of paper and pencils
>no I don't want to see Himmler, postpone that meeting, I have shit to do.
>Also, call Rudy, I have to smack him upside the head for something.

>>31467350
what is going on in this pic friend

>>31457960
>italy please help
made me literally lol

>>31461470
>ground campaign against Russia literally has no sense
Finally you get it.

>>31467384
Armor components in a M1A1 turret, you have steel/rubber/steel NERA sandwiches with spacers, all fitted onto spring shock dampeners to recoil and absorb impacts and just fuck around with incoming rounds.

>>31467384
Looks like someone's trying to figure out how to make tank armour.

File: Tank Armor Merkerva Turret.png (1MB, 1024x982px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1024x982px

>>31467384
>>31467827
>>31467350

File: 1397832060790.png (2MB, 689x800px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 689x800px

>>31467350
>>31467384
>>31467827
>>31467892
It's how tank armor is these days..

>and 1933 Future Hitler is about to bring it to the past.

>>31466981
ok I'll try

m8, you don't have time to make Germoney into the Mexico of the West
the commies (both in Germoney and Russia) are literally breathing down your neck
the economy is in shambles
people are starving NOW, today, and they want things to get better, like, yesterday
they will not take "oh we'll starve and toil for ten more years and maybe the Allies will take pity on our plight"
in fact, if you propose this plan, you will be fucking sent to an asylum, at best, by your Partei friends, or lynched, at worst
so yeah

>>31468070
Aw fuck, I forgot about the gommunists!

What about trying to band together with the French and Brits to stand up against the red menace?

>>31456754
>They produced less of everything else too, you know.
Germany outproduced the USSR by about 10 fold on fundamental industrial products like steel, pig iron, aluminum, and coke.
Germany outproduced the USSR in many munitions categories, such as artillery shells.
Germany also produced 2000 Uboats, which cost more than all the small arms, machine guns, and artillery tubes combined.
USSR being an industrial giant is a myth.

>>31469106
What

>>31469961
That guy is dumb cuz the soviets did make a lot of shit. However, the USSR economy was nearly entirely supported by free shit from the us. Tanks, steel, rail cars, trucks, rail line, clothes food boots. So much free shit boosted their production and eliminates the need to produce as much or any certain things.

>>31457115
>Canaris, head of some German intelligence agency was a traitor

How about shooting Canaris in the head?

>>31456833
>They even had tank crews on that factories doing part of job, so they learn their tank while assembling it.
>Let me divert vital tank operators to go and work in a factory!
That sounds fucking retarded.

The closest I can think to that is how Soviets took factory workers and trained them for tanks. Because this actually happened, while your thing doesn't even make a lick of sense and sounds made-up, autistic bullshit.

>>31457571
>>31457937
>>31458274
>Germany dindu nuffin, dey waz gud boys

You're the same fag from the Pearl Harbor thread, aren't you?

>>31452117
Realize invading poland will start ww2 and build up my military for an extended confrontation beforehand.

>>31476099
They did build up their military beforehand though, they caught europe cold.

>>31466111
And? They still knew exactly where attacking US shipping was going to get them. Fucked.
>>31467066
>Wheelbarrow full of money
Was due to a global recession and retarded German policy, not the treaty of Versailles. A lot countries were in a shambles at that time, you can't keep trying 'Versaille treaty!!!' as if it was the only factor.
>Let them keep their empire
Why? It was tiny, unimportant and unnecessary, they had just lost a four year long bloodbath remember. Some sort of punishment was in order.
Germany was still a manufacturing and industrial powerhouse after the war, they had all they needed, they were just greedy and jealous of everyone else's empire. Just like the First World War.
>>31475502
That's not going to magically make the allies unable to decipher enigma.

Being the good guy?

Or at least pretend to be?

Go full EU/Nato explaining why the commies are bad and you want to help just in case the USSR goes apeshit and invades places (Poland, Finland)

Enhance diplomatic treaties with france&other allied nations, persuade mussolini&franco to do the same, get real tight with the west. Do big business and capitalize, fix economy boost industry unfuck western economy

Introduce autobahns to the world (except the soviets because fuck them)

Make tanks and shit in collaboration with the would-be allies. (Just imagine kraut space magic tanks and stuff, combine with british&US designs Hellcat/Tiger combos etc.)

Basically tell hirohito to go fuck himself, get the european fascists on board and make friends and/or allies of the would be allied western nations

Collaborate industrially

All the while letting the ingenious propaganda machine go all about how soviet is big scary boogeyman

Also go full space race with rockets and shit, build spooky moonbase. Abduct cows and rednecks for anal probing activities.

Tl;dr skip/avoid WW2 best you can and go straight for the cold war.

If WW2 happens side with the west and push for the east.

Also fuck Japan, they want to go full dipshit? Let them, just don't associate with them.

>>31456111
Because Europe put value in architectural and cultural design and expensive materials rather than trying to pump out the maximum number of square feet of living/office space. Also, the physical constraints on cities like New York (ie. manhattan) meant that land was expensive enough to warrant the building of a skyscraper, which is generally not the case in European cities.

>>31476115
No, they were responding to polish aggression with training vehicles and were not prepared for a protracted engagement.

Thats the truth of the matter. Im not a wehraboo, i agree with churchill germans should be eradicated they just keep fucking everything up over and over. But ww2 was started because england and france (probably smartly) took the excuse to try and go to war with germany.

obviously the sensible thing would have been to listen to that french general from ww1 and get rid of germany entirely. I dont know where the cool ladsknechts went but at some point they were replaced by a bunch of autistic robots.

>>31472785
>That guy is dumb cuz the soviets did make a lot of shit.
They made a lot of tanks and aircraft. But that's two categories of munitions in a whole range of things a country at war needs. Soviet industry was understandably outproduced by the far more advanced German one in many categories: metals, chemicals, electronics, etc.
You'd have to be either retarded or a slavaboo to ignore everything other than tanks and aircraft and continue to spout the muh Soviet industry meme.

>>31454075
>And because there was a problem of Leningrad safety which was not possible to solve peacefully. Soviets tried to do that, Finns showed middle finger.
Soviets were demanding land that was not theirs, there was no reason for the Finns to give it. Offering useless land elsewhere was just a feint. They wanted the border fortifications gone so the Finns would have to start rebuilding them, weakening their position in the region considerably. The Finns even made a counteroffer where they doubled the distance to Leningrad but the Soviets were never interested in peace in the first place.
>BTW, Finns already invaded USSR before in 20th
What, you mean the case where nationalists and volunteers organized an uprising since the Soviets were not respecting the promises given to the people of the area? That is not an invasion, and it was not a move of any sort towards Leningrad either.

>>31465101
Fucking mongoloid