Götland / Scandinavia general

>>31383981
IDK about the threat, but russia has had their eye on gotland for a long time.
Russian companies have been making deepwater harbours on the island, and ruskies are constantly trolling the airspace

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Åland is demilitarized. Should it be occupied?

>>31384009
Åland is part of Finland but has autonomy. It actually wants to belong to Sweden rather than Funland.

>Should it be occupied?
Yes by scandi forces to prevent ruskies from entering that. Ruskies have already trained to occupy that section of land. Funland navy is also aware of this shit.

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>From Estonian information source:

-Ruski tactis to occupy scandi areas are most likely same that they pulled in Ukraine.
-Russian Artillery commanders are sent after they go thru their training to Ukraine. They need to actually direct fire to pass their last exam. This information was revealed after some of these guys were captured. They had their paper from military school wiht them.
- Ruski sniper tactis consist from following maneuvers: Artillery at hand, 4-12 snipers, Quick reaction unit close by. Rilfes: 7.62x54R, 9x39, 12.7x55, 12.7x109 and their 14mm KSVK rilfe. They use large caliber rifle to stop BMR-tank or other armored personell carrier. Order arty after that and run after this.

>>31383981
Muh evul ruskis

>>31383981
Daily reminder that every time Russia issues one of their baseless threats (they've been doing this for decades), the best thing to do is ignore them so you don't feed their ridiculous insecurities about being recognised as a GLOBAL POWA N' SHIEETTT (wuz)

If all the countries of the world were represented as Kilebook accounts, Russia would be considered the most attention-seeking one

>>31383981
Keep swallowing blind propaganda, the military is just fishing for increased budget spending so they can buy new toys, they do the exatc same shit here in norway.
Trying to convince People that russia reopening old military bases in Karelia and the North sea that they couldn't afford to keep running in the ninties is the second coming of the USSR and the start of the end of the world.
No respect for fearmongers.

>>31384087
>>31384111
>>31384108
Considering this. Thanks for the reminder.

>>31384063
14mm KSVK... Oops that is incorrect. My bad

>>31384108
Daily reminder that every time Russia issues one of their baseless threats (they've been doing this for decades)
This. They test us to see how we react, respond and what's our readiness. It's all planned and coordinated.

>>31384111
>Keep swallowing blind propaganda, the military is just fishing for increased budget spending

The Swedish military is one of the most impotent forces in Europe considering the territory they have to protect and that they have no strong security guarantees via treaties.

https://www.stratfor.com/the-hub/sweden-and-stability-baltic-sea-region-0

>>31384138
Yes. This is true and needs to be understood.

>>31384154
Could not agree with you more.

>>31384087
>>31384108
>implying that Russia should not be considered as threat.
You just what?
>>31384111
Oil. North pole. Ring any bell?

I highly doubt Russia will actually do anything. There'd be too much at risk if Russia were to actually attempt to occupy the Baltic islands, especially considering Sweden cooperates with NATO far more than Ukraine did in 2013.
Although increasing the Swedish military's budget and manpower is still a good thing, despite the fear propaganda used to attempt to justify it to the cuck population.

>>31384167
Not saying they aren't a threat. They absolutely are (esp. if you're a post-Soviet state trying to break out of their shitty dominion), but a lot of their BS comes from the immense post-Cold War butthurt and need to make other countries think dey relevant n' shieet because they have very few deterrents left (aside from their nuclear arsenal). Contrast this with the U.S., an actual global superpower, that has economic deterrents, conventional deterrents as well as their nuclear deterrent. So you get this insane aggression posturing, it's almost like Russia would be in a psych ward if it were a single person.

>>31384063
>From Estonian information source:
In most cases russian soldiers use lvl-4 torso armor and lvl-2-4 helmet. Further back russian soldiers have most likely barely helmet. Ruskies are having trouble with their NVG-tools. Tanks and such are well eguipped but soldiers have only gen2. Special forces buys their own shit. Most likely thru Mongolia or White-Russia. Even large caliber rifles like Sako TRG and thermal goggles. This indicates that west is prepared better with night ops and shit.
Ruskies wearing thick n' hard armor means that infantry needs to be shot with magnum cartiges or good AP-rounds. 7.62 rounds are growing out of facion. 8.6x70(.338LM) is needed to even infict some damage from sniping distances. Such ammo causes enough blunt trauma to target to prevent him continuing fighting. AP-round not needed and money saved just a little.
>Finland is still lacking in basic troop equipment. NVG tools are old or troops have barely even seen them.
West is consentrating in thermal nowdays since it does not need IR-light source to work.

>>31384087
Russia is a global threat. They are the most dangerous, evil country known to mankind.

That's why it is extra imperative that Trump loses in November, because the last thing we need is a US that is not hostile to Russia.

>>31384270
Thank you for correcting the record
here is a penny

>>31384270
>RUssIA!!!!
>Murican'z
Yet no one knows what China is doing.

>>31384258
>From Estonian information source:
In Ukraine confilct these small or extra small UAV:s hase been a HUGE problem. They are hard to spot and hard to destroy. These also have been used to direct artillery fire via sniper team.

>How do you shoot down small UAV?
Just HOW?!? With small arms fire it's nearly impossible to destroy.

>>31384270
There will be mosins on mars and there is nothing you can do about it

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>>31384270
t. Someone who knows NOTHING about Russia

Care to enlighten us on how Russia can be non-hostile?

>>31384087
They are not evil. They will just exploit any opening you give them to the fullest. So don't give them one.

>>31384111
Well they dont even have any budget so ofcourse they would be happy if they got more money.

They badly need it.

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You don't see the swedish foreign minister giving reporters pizza and vodka during press conferences...

That aside, if Russia were to invade, what resistance would a couple of hundred soldiers on gotland offer?

If a serious invasion were to be staged, the whole island would be overun within hours.

>>31384309
Russia will never be non-hostile, that is the point.

Russia will continue to subvert Western democracy until they get their next opening, at which point they will strike.

>>31384258
>>31384063
More this: In Ukraine: Soldiers have found out that wearing eye protection it can decrease damage taken from lazer things like AN/PEQ (numberx) or russian equivalent and laser guide thing-a-magicka's that burns your eyes to carchoal. Even non-colored polycarbonate eye-pro's can prevent some damage.

>???
Use eye-protection when training and figthing. Do whatever you can in war. Just don't get caucht!

>>31384331
>That aside, if Russia were to invade, what resistance would a couple of hundred soldiers on gotland offer?

What resistance would 0 soldiers offer?

Maybe Russia can do something good to Sweden.

>>31384339
>Russia needing to actively subvert western Democracy

Western politicians do such a good job at that already, Russia doesn't even need to lift a finger. The biggest threats to western democracy lie within, especially in western Europe.
>>31384442
Russia would probably make Sweden a better, less cucked place, tbqhwyf.

>>31384339
Maybe that's a good thing since western democracy is shit.

>>31384331
Tripwire force.

Its hard to cry to the international community with no blood spilled.

>>31384331
>That aside, if Russia were to invade, what resistance would a couple of hundred soldiers on gotland offer?

Do you know about "doorbell" tactics in military? They are disposable force. They serve as warning doorbell during invasion. 0 soldiers = 0 countermeasures.

Also this >>31384448


>>31384442
Like what? Roughen up those sissymacaronis?

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>>31384444
>Russia doesn't even need to lift a finger

You do realize we're in this boat because of Soviet subversion right?

>>31384454
>Like what? Roughen up those sissymacaronis?
And rape some swedes bitches to they give birth to white, not black or sandnigger.

>>31384456
Soviet subversion that has transplanted to the West.

>>31384458
>slavs
>white

>>31384466
Sure is whiter than nigger and muslim.

>>31384468
Debatable.

>>31384442
We don't need that marxist hellhole. Sweden is a basket case beyond any hope for salvation. Fact that they have to invent a red scare to distract people from Somali colonization should tell you how bad it is.

>>31384466
Alright big guy, let's see that criteria for being white.

>>31384446
Western democracy was doing fine, at least in the US, until globalism, diversity and multiculturalism became the norm.

>>31384479
Western democracy has almost no defense against that shit.

At least Stalin just purged the fags.

Hoi Norskies! I like yer style by the way:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjcwCsp6gBA

GUYS THIS IS NOT POL. More gun stuff guys!

Hey Norskies! What is it like to shoot in those mountains with sniper rifles? What do you use?

Still the same guestion going on: How do you downsyndrome a small UAV? size is less than 20kg...

>>31384466
Hey Schlomo! How are you doing?

>>31384488
Sorry guy, threads like these are inevitably going to go full /pol/ after just a few replies.

>>31384541
mmhm... Kinda noticed. Nigger this, Muslim that, Stalindidlidyy and western dingus fucking libaralistimistimyy.

I was hoping... But then internet. Kinda feels wasted to give you guys these chips of information that this Estonian intelligence gathered. I can't even discuss about these things public board. I need to announce these here.

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>>31384185
An invasion would be very difficult actually. A Ukraine-type invasion would be impossible for a few reasons, the main ones being that Sweden has a very good intelligence service (as well as cooperation with other western intelligence), and also, Gotland is an island. You would need actual shipping to get soldiers there, which means that it would be detected right away, even if we're only talking small numbers. Gotland subs and mobile ASM batteries further complicates the shipping of soldiers. An attack would thus be impossible unless it's part of an attack on the baltic states a decade or so in the future.

>post more images

>>31383981
Putin is planning to attack you any second now, please join NATO plox

>>31383981
>So... Russia is threatening somehow Sweden. No news source tells nothing about this "TOP SECRET threat"
So, they do not bother with nonexistent submarines now.

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>>31384258
> 8.6x70(.338LM) is needed to even infict some damage from sniping distances.

cool story broskie

>>31386167
The so called "threat" coincides with the visit of Biden.

Coinkydink?

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>>31386172
>nonexistant

>>31384468
Slavs are just pale niggers.

Swede here. Read that the military moved units to Gotland permanently a couple of days ago. They actually rushed it ahead of schedule.

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>>31386388
This is true

>>31386172
The submarines were confirmed without a doubt. It's just not possible to prove who sent them, but the Russians are the only ones with a motive.

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>>31386243
Yeah, nonexistent.

>>31386388

All modern Europeans descend from Slav steppe people. In fact Slav ancient invasions spread Indo Aryan languages that you all speak today.

kek

>>31386426
Bullshit, but we're all descended from niggers anyway, so what's your point?

>>31386407
With a motive of doing what? Its like that time when a couple of Tu-22Ms maneuvered in the middle of the Baltic and whole Scandinavia screamed that they are being carpet bombed? Ffs, try using your fucking brain sometimes.

>>31386426
WE

>>31386399
Oh wait I just read the thread

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>>31386456
Yeah, 2 backfires and 4 flankers making simulated (most likely nuclear) bombings against vital intelligence and air force installation just barely outside your airspace is completely innocent.

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>>31386417
yeah, all i see is water

>>31386525
So how did you find out if they were practicing simulated nuclear bombings, not non-simulated jerking off at supersonic speeds? Ffs, Tu-22M does not even need to leave gulf of finland to practice nuclear strikes on Stockholm. It is not ww2, retard.

>>31386602
Actually they do not even need to leave russian airspace to practice nuclear bombing of Stockholm.

>>31386627
But what good is an aggressive display and thinly veiled threat if no one can see it?

>>31386407
Yeah, when they weren't old fishermen or goddamn fishfarts. Sweden's submarine-scare is a fucking joke.

>>31386602
Yes, Russia sends these planes as well as a a few SIGINT/ELINT ships and an A-50 mainstay a few kilometers outside of swedish airspace to "jerk off".

It's an obvious provocative attempt to make headlines in Sweden and get some juicy SIGINT at the same time.

>>31386673
>a couple of extremely fast strategic bombers maneuver in a sea that is less than 300km across and has fucking Gotland right in the middle of it
>agressive display! HOLY SHIT THEY ARE BOMBING US!!!
Fucking retards.

>>31386243
>>31386677
>>31386565
oh look, a fish

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>>31386714
Oh, look, absolutely anything approaching russian airspace must be american!

>>31386243
And? Russian submarine is not the only thing that can leave a trail like that, far more plausible explanations include things like Swedens own sub, one of the passing cargo ships dragging its anchor (it's a quite busy shipping lane), or that one Dutch submarine that was there that week taking part in joint excersice in the exact same waters were the sightings of that """phantom Russian sub""" were made.

What possible reason would Russians even have sailing their sub there anyway? They could do all the nerfous spy novel-tier shit I read that week from the media just by renting a cabin and/or boat from the archipelago with far less risk, or the exfil/infil super sicrit agents stuff by simply buying a plane ticket.

>>31386728
that is not what you said. You said that submarine hunts in the baltics were fish or fishermen. There are several pieces of evidence that contradicts your statement (although >>31386243 is almost certainly NATO).

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>>31384442
>Maybe Russia can do something good

>>31386677
Not every incident investigated by the military is an actual submarine, but when they say it's a submarine, it's a submarine. They have to almost be able to reach out and knock on the hull before they consider it confirmed. If it's just something like 50 independent witnesses seeing the submarine, it's considered a "probable" submarine at best.

>>31386745
1. i did not say anything about fish
2. there is absolutely no evidence
3. there are exactly two russian subs in the baltic, both 877, and none of them can lurk near the baltic shores

>>31386705
Stockholm is not on the way to anything. The Russians were shadow boxing right in front of the Swedes' faces and you expect me to believe that it was anything but a threat? Get real.

>>31386776
>there is absolutely no evidence
There is a fuck-ton of evidence.

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>>31384270
>correcting the record on /k/

You sad, sad, desperate fucker lel...

>>31386801
Did you even read the article? They were going past Gotland, 30-40 km from Swedish territorial waters. Considering there is 150km between Gotland shoreline to Latvia shoreline we give you an answer: they were maneuvering in Baltic sea, no more, no less. They could be practicing nuclear bombing of anything within 600km, including Copenhagen, Oslo, parts of Finland, parts of Poland and whole Baltic states.

>>31386811
There is no evidence. Except of Tzar-era submarine that they managed to find.

>>31386871
If you're just going to make a fool out of yourself, it would have been better if you had stayed quiet.

>>31386891
>hurpadurp
Continue, please.

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>>31386776
1.
>Yeah, when they weren't old fishermen or goddamn fishfarts.

2. I have now presented you with three different pieces of evidence, and even i have been able to find this as just a regular guy with an interest for submarines.

3. Would be a fair point, except that submarines can actually move. And again, i have never implied that all submarine chased were of russian origin. I've simply told, as well as shown, you that the submarines were not "nonexistent".

>>31386903
>Yeah, when they weren't old fishermen or goddamn fishfarts.
There are other people except us two here, you know.
> I have now presented you with three different pieces of evidence
You presented none.
>Would be a fair point, except that submarines can actually move.
Yeah, they just slipped through danish straits unnoticed.
>And again, i have never implied that all submarine chased were of russian origin. I've simply told, as well as shown, you that the submarines were not "nonexistent".
No you did not. Swede ASW have mistaken otters for soviet submarines on multiple occasions in 80's. Considering their military really needs money the whole story with nonexistent submarine smells really funny.

>>31386861
They were not going past Gotland. They were going north of Gotland, towards Stockholm. The Swedish military says they were doing some form of simulated bombing run and NATO says it was some form of simulated nuclear strike. I don't care what the Russians say, because the Russians lie as easily as they breathe.

>>31386765
I am aware. Just sick and tired of this subject. I am from finland and our media gets rabid ober this. Issue just resurfaced recently. It was all over the news for like a month, and people have a tendency to panic and exaggerate to the point where every fisherman is a russian partizan

>>31386982
>The Swedish military says they were doing some form of simulated bombing run and NATO says it was some form of simulated nuclear strike
Seriously? What the fuck, how did they do a simulated nuclear strike less than 100km from the target? They do not even have nuclear bombs anymore, just missiles!

>>31383981
Russia runs naval and airborne invasion scenarios in the Baltic almost evey other tuesday, usually on or very fucking close to the borders of the scandi's and esti
There's no threat, just Swedes pretending they won't just surrender if Russia for some gay reason wants to invade them by putting up a pseudo defensive posture
It's also worth noting that pf all the baltic nations, Sweden is actually the best target for an invasion
Tiny population, shit tier soldats, and pathetic government officials

>>31386969
You do realise that Denmark has 0 ASW capacity, right? And what possible reasons could you have for believing that they were chasing otters?

>>31387000
Ask the Secretary General of NATO. He signed off on the statement.

>>31387060
>You do realise that Denmark has 0 ASW capacity, right?
You do realize what danish straits are? Besides, outsides of Baltic sea Russians still do not have small submarines.
>And what possible reasons could you have for believing that they were chasing otters?
Cant find the article, sorry.

>>31387090
So, secretary general of nato signed off some obvious bullshit.

>>31387037
>Swedes pretending they won't just surrender
It's not all that easy for Sweden to surrender. Swedish soldiers have been instructed that any order to surrender is false and not to be obeyed.

>>31387060
>And what possible reasons could you have for believing that they were chasing otters?
In 1995 their prime minister admitted they were chasing otters, not russian submarines, in a similar situation.

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>>31387119
>Russians still do not have small submarines
Yes, they do.

>>31387175
First: this is not a submarine. Second: it cant even go that far. Third: only one of those exist, and its shit.

>>31387139
Prime minister Bildt was trying to improve relations with Russia and was offering a convenient explanation to allow Yeltsin to save face.

>>31387189
And fourth: russians never ordered one, the one that exists is in TsKB Lazurit storage since 2008.

>>31387214
Yeah, also zionist occupation government. Protip: you do not improve relations with anyone by making yourself look like complete idiot.

>>31387232
>Protip: you do not improve relations with anyone by making yourself look like complete idiot.
Clearly you know nothing of human interaction. Making it look like you were the one being an idiot so someone else can save face is perfectly good way to improve relations with said someone.

>>31387247
Oh no, looking like an idiot enables you to spend money and massively improve your ASW capabilities. Because, you know, looking like an idiot is bad.

>>31387189
First, it's a vessel that travels underwater. Most would consider that a submarine. Second, it doesn't need to go that far considering the Russians had vessels waiting outside Sweden's territorial waters. Third, the project is shrouded in secrecy and there is no way for us to know that there is only one or that it is shit.

>>31387259
You are an idiot.

>>31387275
>>31387284
http://www.svd.se/forsvaret-misstankt-ubat-var-arbetsbat
Badum-tss.

>>31387259
You do realise that Carl Bildt was PM in 1994, and the crisis happened in 1982, when Olof Palme was PM? When you're trying to convince a raging alcoholic to demilitarise the baltic states, losing a bit of face isn't that big of a deal. Spending on ASW 1980-1992 was 3 billion SEK, which is chump change.

Also, https://janmilld.wordpress.com/2011/12/05/bildt-och-sanningen/

>>31387315
And that is regarding to the submarine observed 2015. Not the one 2014 (which actually was hunted) and certainly not the one in 1982, which the guy you responded to was talking about.

>>31387316
>When you're trying to convince a raging alcoholic to demilitarise the baltic state
Holy shit, Yeltsin scrapped Kh-80 just for fun, he did what he was told to do by west, and you tell me bildt had something to do with demilitarization of the baltic? Topkek.

>>31387336
So first otters, then nonexistent submaines, now it is actually top secret. Makes you think, you know.

>>31387275
>First, it's a vessel that travels underwater.
Kind of.
>Second, it doesn't need to go that far considering the Russians had vessels waiting outside Sweden's territorial waters.
Were there any?
>Third, the project is shrouded in secrecy
Sure, except there are plenty of photos and there is absolutely no point for russians to make secrets about such shit, they will just all hurr look everyone we desingned a submarine. Besides, they manage to steal money even on non-secret projects, a secret one is 1488% completely stolen.

>>31387336
Also, what submarine did they hunt?

>>31387412
>Were there any?
Yes. A Russian oil tanker was loitering in international waters outside Stockholm for the duration of the incident.

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>>31387491
And a Russian research vessel with a submarine holding bay that for some reason turned off its transponders towards the end of the incident.

>>31387491
>>31387552
>professor logachev
Ffs, its a marine geology/hydrology vessel, i wonder what it was doing in the Baltic sea.

>>31387189
>>31387215

First: A mini-sub is still a sub.

Second: It's well known that Russia uses modified "commercial" cargo ships owned by the government to act as motherships to tow mini-subs.

Third: It's one of the few models the public knows about

Fourth: In all likelihood Russia has better mini-subs that we don't know about.

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>>31387605
>its a marine geology/hydrology vessel

Yes, and these guys are just local rebels with gear purchased from local surplus stores.

>>31387631
>First: A mini-sub is still a sub.
No, its not. Unlike subs it cant dive deep.
>Second: It's well known that Russia uses modified "commercial" cargo ships owned by the government to act as motherships to tow mini-subs.
That were still nowhere near the range of this boat. Yes, its a fucking boat, nigger.
>Third: It's one of the few models the public knows about
Yes, all others are scrapped.
>Fourth: In all likelihood Russia has better mini-subs that we don't know about.
As i said - it is not something that can be kept secret. Especially in Russia.

>>31384022
>It actually wants to belong to Sweden rather than Funland.

Complete and utter lies.

The island Jews don't want to be part of Sweden because they would just get a shittier deal than they currently have.

I sincerely wish they would just fuck off back to Sweden so the Swedes could pump their islands full of mudshits and rapefugees.

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>>31387605
Haha, you realise how silly you sound now? A submarine search and rescue vessel leaves St. Petersburg during a submarine hunt in Sweden, loiters outside Swedish waters for a while, then puts Las Palmas as its destination in AIS and steams for Kaliningrad?

Gee, that's completely normal behavior. I mean, as a captain on a 104 meter vessel, i frequently turn my transponders off at my own disgression and knowingly give out wrong destinations to VTS

well vatniked, vatnik

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>>31383981

>Its Russia again. Scandifags here.

http://www.infowars.com/theres-no-turning-back-swedish-tv-ad-says-swedes-must-accept-multiculturalism/

>>31387700
Its not a submarine search and rescue vessel, its a marine geology vessel. And even if it was submarine search and rescue vessel why the fuck it was searching and rescuing something almost 100km from the place swedes were hunting the sub?

>>31387722
>implying the Swedish media and politicians represent the Swedish people

The politicians are all retarded and the media has openly admitted to being biased as fuck.
The supposedly "impartial" state owned SVT news and television agency was surveyed a few years ago, and roughly 80% of them voted for various communist parties that get less than 5% of the votes in national elections.