308 or 30-06?

.308. If your worried about what you will lose not going to .30-06 you should get a .300wm.

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>>30932569

Either one will work for Bambi or Piglet.

You can get hotter loads in 30-06 in case you want to try your hand at Mickey Moose or Mr. Grizzly.

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>>30932607
I was planning on buying a 783. Anyone have experience with it or is it just cheap shit?

Do you reload? If so, 30-06 is more versatile with different loadouts, plus it's more resistant to being out of stock in panics.
.308 is a great round, too

>whynotboth.jpg

Either-or. 30-06 is more common commercially and more versatile if you handload. With modern powders and boolits that's about the only distinction.

>>30932634

Remington's quality control has gone to shit since 2006 when they were bought out by another company.

My suggestion is the Savage 110/111. You can get one paired with a decent entry level Nikon scope for a little over $600.

http://www.basspro.com/Savage-10/110-Trophy-Hunter-XP-BoltAction-Rifle-with-Scope/product/120829053335623/

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>>30932607
Would a browning short trac .308 fit on there?
>pic related isn't mine, but it looks exactly like the one I have

>>30932672
savages suck just as much as remingtons

They are pretty equal. But I would go with .308 just to simplify things. Even if you aren't planning on it you might eventually pick up a FAL, PTR, AR10 etc

>>30932693
That little slut of a pig.

>>30932569
.30-06

>>30932716
Yep. The old stuff is pretty good (I have a fondness for model 99s) but anything in the last 15 years is suspect.

>>30932716
>>30932672
I'm also not looking to spend an ass ton of money on something I'll use for a few hunting trips a year

>>30932741
If you just want a basic new bolt rifle look at a ruger american. I've never heard anything bad about them, and you can get them in .308 for 350-400 all day

>>30932607
I don't see a Remington 700 model...is there something wrong with them that I'm not aware of?

>>30932779

Its a great gun; but Remington's quality control has gone down hill since it got bought out by Cerberus Capital Management.

If you can get an old one pre 2006, then they're the bees knees.

>>30932779
I was wondering the same man, I bought a used bdl not sure of the year but I'm in love with that gun. I saw a Mossberg on there which I've never been a fan of but that's just me

>>30932607
Ruger American made the list? I can't say I was impressed with the one I shot, but the M77 is a fucking fantastic gun although a little pricey. Also no Weatherby?

>>30932794
So noted, thanks.

Assuming .308, any scope recommendations?

>>30932817
leupold mark 4

>>30932817
Any Nikon or Leupold scope would be king. Think of it as a long term investment because those scopes will last a few lifetimes if you take care of them

>>30932779
Recently it's pretty shit, but the old ones are nice as hell.

Just be sure, man. Prices went up because MUH ARMY SNIPUR and their QC will fuck you nowadays.

>>30932829
>>30932823
Roger fucking that. I was looking at the prices and thinking "my total guns owned barely equal that in value."

>>30932833
It wasn't just the R700. I also was looking for a Springfield 1903 (muh history....but really, I just wanted one) or the ruger American, but the American is all plastic and most of the 1903s are sporterized.

Now, there is a 1903A3 sniper model (numbers match, and scope mated to the rifle, numbers matched), but FUCK the 5k the dude wants for it.

>>30932569

Ballistically they are very similar, although .30-06 will be slightly faster on average and can be loaded to somewhat hotter.

.308 has a shorter overall length, meaning shorter actions.

.30-06 seems more widely available and doesn't seem to go out of stock during panics.

My personal opinion is that they're similar enough that you should pick based on standardizing your rifles on a caliber. I have a Garand (.30-06) so I chose .30-06 over .308.

Good explanation here:

http://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/308-win-vs-30-06/

>>30932881
>.30-06 seems more widely available and doesn't seem to go out of stock during panics.

this, especially in rural areas. a lot of new-generation gun owners (who are the people stockpiling ammo for the most part) shoot 308 because they can stretch one caliber across multiple platforms, such as an ar10, a scout rifle, a long distance precision rifle, a game rifle, etc.

whereas 30-06 remains very popular among the older gen who bought guns in the 60s/70s when 3006 was still king. any gun store i go into there's always 3006 but sometimes they're running pretty low on 308 especially during hunting season.

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>>30932607
>not a single rifle by Mauser on the list
i guess they're not too common in murica

>>30933133

Correct. I don't think Mauser even imports their new rifles to the US.

>>30932878
the mark 4 is crazy expensive. Go for a Nikon Buckmasters or a cheaper Leupold. For me personally unless you shoot long range in competitions or something you don't need a 1k dollar scope

Think I'll go for the aught six then which is what I was leaning towards anyways

.30-'06 can handle heavier bullets than .308 and is better if you want to shoot 800+, or shoot bears or Moose.

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>>30932569
>Never owned a rifle so please help

I actually recommend .270 in your case.

>Can be lighter than .308
>Can perform evenly to .30-06.
>No one currently panic buying .270.

>>30933201
.270 sucks shit. if you think you want a .270 you rely want a 7mm-'06 or a .25-'06

>>30933201
>>30933219
Every panic since 2008 .270, .243, and .40 were always on the shelves in my experiences.

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>>30932662
>30-06 is more common commercially

>>30933201
>>30933219
>>30933228


Yeah, the oddball full power rifle cartridges do tend to always stay on the shelves. Ain't nobody stockpiling .270.

That said, .30-06 seems to stay on the shelves almost as well, and it's a much more common cartridge. And it's easy to just preemptively buy a few hundred rounds, especially because .30-06 can be bought from CMP for $115/196 rounds.

30-06 is a dead round,no one uses that ancient cartridge.

>>30933302
That's just simply not true.

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>>30933302

Only good reason for .30 cal is for heavy and power. Large boolits going fast. So fuck the .308 and for .30-06 or better.

If you want a short action get 6.5 something or a 7mm or basically anything that's better than a ,308.

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>>30933302
try again bby

>>30933302
>.308 babby mad that older rifle cartridges outperform his favorite

>>30932590
>you should get a .300wm.
ANNIHILATE THE SQUEAL.

>>30933133
or the howa 1500.
probably the best budget rifle available at the moment.

how come nobody in america uses moderators when hunting?
and how come nobody seems to stalk?
every video i watch you guys just seem to use hides/high seats.

>>30932672
>says Remington sux
>recommends savage instead
Are you a faggot or just brain damaged?

>>30933842
>how come nobody in america uses moderators when hunting?
$200 tax and six month long government anal probe because HURR ASSASSIN TOOL TO SILENCE GUNFIRE, and there's areas of the USA where they're completely banned for any use.

This doesn't even go into regional Fish and Game laws.

>and how come nobody seems to stalk?
>every video i watch you guys just seem to use hides/high seats.
The people that stalk aren't going to bring a video camera, they'll use that weight for more water or food or rain gear etc.

If they have a camera on their phone, they don't screw around with it and conserve battery life for emergency phone calls.

>>30933860
except thats exactly right. its commonly known that Remingtons qc has gone to shit over the last few years and almost nobody has anything bad to say about new production savage rifles. i bet youre one of those fags that still thinks nugget food is 20 cpr

>>30933862
that's interesting.
ironically, it's easy to get a moderator added to your gun certificate here in the UK.
They are really great for hunting. Pretty much everyone here uses one.

Fair point about the stalking.

>>30933875
Almost nobody has anything bad to day about them because the cunts that buy them are either so inbred they can't string 2 words together or they are too embarrassed to admit they bought this shit tier rifle.

>>30933881
No natural predators of deer in Britain means the instinct and drive of deer in America to flee at the first suspicious sound isn't as sharp with British deer, I'd wager.

Carefully stalking American deer that are constantly on alert for wolves and large cats is a tremendous pain in the ass compared to sitting in a tree stand or blind and passing the time by thinking about a girl you want to fuck.

>>30932569

>>30933934
Well said

>>30933920
they do have natural predators.
humans.
hunting is pretty common here.
we've been culling dear since..forever.
i doubt the dear are any less skittish than american dear.

>tremendous pain in the ass
Indeed, it is. But that's the fun of it.
If i wanted to just sit on my arse all day i'd go fishing.

>>30933905
thats some low tier b8, friend. have you considered not being suck a cockmongling faggot?

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>>30932569
If you are going to buy the ammo over the counter, I would go with the 308. The price of ammo is usually cheaper, and the difference between the two is marginal at best. Now if you plan on getting into reloading, and you have every intention of getting into real long range shooting without going magnum, then the extra case length will allow you to make those super long shots with the 30-06. The difference in kick is marginal at best, so really you need to look at what you plan on doing with the rifle and then go from there. I reload for that beast and I can ring steel at seven hundred yards with little effort.
>>30933934
Woopsy

>>30933951
I've considered it, but I'm not sure if you could ever make the change. you seem pretty devoted to the idea of a life of homosexuality considering your choice of firearms

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>>30933939
I know right. I was going for a less is more thing and I got carried away.

>>30933997
This has got to be the most articulate and well thought out response so far

>>30934012
You hit the nail on the head with that one then

>>30934010
i dont actually own a savage. i just enjoy telling internet retards that theyre wrong.

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>>30934017
Thank you.

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Speed of firing goes to the .308, in a semi-auto you won't notice it but manual actions on a short action cartridge are faster to cycle.

.30-06 is available commercially anywhere from 55 gr. Accelerators to 200+ gr. slugs and can be loaded into lower safari magnum specs with handloading. Surplus is drying up though.

>>30932741
make sure your state allows taking deer with a rifle. the more populous states no longer allow it. here in illinois its deer slugs through a shotgun.

>>30932672
>Remington's quality control has gone to shit
Nice meme. Have you ever even owned one yourself or do your friends at the gun shop tell you that

>>30934152
>Have you ever even owned one yourself
Not one made in the last 25 years, since I actually do research before I buy a rifle.

>>30934030
Well if you ever leave your mother's basement, i think you might find a thing or 2 about the real world, starting with the fact that you are far less educated in matters of practical firearm use than you try to infer.

>>30934189
>believes everything he reads on the Internet.

>>30934203
You'd have to be a retard to infer that from my post, which you clearly are.

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>>30932569
>People are still moving to California

>>30934318
He very clearly said moving out of California you retard. Learn to read

>>30932569
For pigs, something like a 9.3x62 would be better, and 308, while alright for deer, destroys quite a bit of meat in my experience.

Either way, 308 works for them both, but isn't perhaps optimal for either. If you're only getting one though, 308 is a good choice.

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>>30934343
>Learn to read
Make me

>>30934343
>People are still moving out of California
They need to do us all a favor and stay

>>30932569
1.1"/75 caliber, anything lower is a disgrace to /k/

>>30934366
>and 308, while alright for deer, destroys quite a bit of meat in my experience.
That is entirely up to bullet selection and load, besides where it hits.

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>>30933219
In my experience the .270 isn't shit at all. Faster than .308, 7.62x54R and other bigger calibers i've shot, so it doesn't need as much lead to shoot a moose.

Pic related my Sako L61R in .270 win

>>30934506
Old Sakos are very nice.

>>30932833
The 700 is used by the Marines. The m40 series has been used since Vietnam

>>30934190
you can tell all of that based off of an extremely common opinion?

>>30932569
Everyone has their opinion but I'd say the differences are minor. 30-06 is a little louder, a little more kick, a little more downrange fps, but it's no big deal. I used to say the 30-06 was clearly better because it was so much easier to get ammo for it, but that's no longer true.

I'd focus more on finding an accurate weapon you can afford and that fits well in your hand than on which calibre. Deer don't require nearly this much power to kill, and depending on where you hunt them you may or may not be able to use the range.

In a lot of the east you'll never get a shot from far enough away to justify more than a 30-30. We like to hunt with the SKS back there. I've even done it with a lever-action .44 mag, good times.

Pigs are tougher but also usually done at close range. That .44 took down more virginia swine than deer, and I don't even hunt them, I just loaned it out to a cousin that did.

TL/DR either is probably more than adequate, focus on finding a good rifle that's reliable and accurate and doesn't break your budget.

>>30932569

Just a consideration, but I would go with 308.

It's a fine caliber for anything you want to hunt in North America.

The real catch for me is that you are more likely to buy an AR-10, SCAR Heavy, Fal, G3, etc.

I have a ton of guns in different calibers, and I really wish that I planned ahead better and cut down on that.

>>30933831

Bough their 2-in-1 on impulse as nephew was getting older, and might want to learn (2-in-1 comes with youth and standard hogue stock).


Fuck him, I really like the rifle.

>>30932634
I have one in .300WM, and it's a shooter. Killed an elk on the run with it at 200 yards last year. Can ring steel with it consistently out to about 600 yards. You can also get Boyd's laminate drop in stocks for em, and if you glass bedded it into the stock, it has the potential to be a tack driver. Anyone who talks shit in em either doesn't own one or bought it expecting custom target rifle quality for $300.

>>30932607
>tfw your rifle is the first on this list

>>30932817
Big fan of the various 2.5-10x scopes on the market. Current favorite is a Vortex Viper HS 2.5-10x42, which retails for around $400. Nikon has a Monarch thats a 2.5-10 as well but has a retarded BDC reticle.

>>30933949
Alot of vids you are going to see is fudds in the thickass woods where it is hard to spot and stalk.

Look up hunts that take place in western US and you will find stalking. The terrain is totally different from the east.

>>30933949
There are more *deer* hunters just in my state than there are gun owners in the entirety of western europe.

I guarantee they're spookier here.

>>30934711
And the Army. The M24 is a 700 Police with a 20moa base.

>>30934144
Some states also allow poistol cartriges.

I have a .444 marlin for Ohio deer.

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>>30933949
Unless things have changed drastically in the last 7 years, they are far spookier here than in Germany.

I got to hunt Rey while in Germany and this is how the hunts always went:
>show up to wardens cottage
>he gives me a big glass of schnapps and packs his pipe
>we walk into a forest
>he's singing and smoking his pipe
>get to a clearing
>rey everywhere
>"shoot that one"
>lolokay
>shoot rey thats just standing there looking at this older slightly overweight man thats upwind while smoking a pipe and singing at all of 30 yards
>warden pulls out a flask, toasts the deer, and heads back to his cabin to get his 1970s Mercedes to recover the deer
>spend rest of day telling hunting stories and getting drunk

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>>30935108
Welp, wrong pic.
>this shows the rey

Op, I would go with a 30-06. Actually I would go with a 280 Ackley improved. Anyway, my decision is based on staying away from what the military uses and what's popular. You get a buying scare and good luck finding 5.56 or 308. Oh but look at that 270 is never out of stock. I think 30-06 will be on the shelf when 308 isn't, op.

>>30932672
>My suggestion is the Savage 110/111. You can get one paired with a decent entry level Nikon scope for a little over $600.

I got mine at Wal-mart for a LOT less than 600, with scope and accutrigger. I want to say it was 370.

>>30932607
The remington 700 is better than all but one or two of those...

>>30932672
>Remington's quality control has gone to shit
hahahah sure bud.

>>30935160
Lolno.

Ive bought 2 of them and they were both lemons. Unless you're willing to spend $1200+ for a Police model with the heavy barrel thats inappropriate for hunting, their QC is far too spotty to gamble on.
>bough 700 Sendero SFII ($1200 rifle) that was 5moa with FGMM
>bought 700 SPS Varmint that was 2moa with Hornady vmax factory and the bolt handle broke off in the first month

>>30935233
>Ive bought 2 of them and they were both lemons. Unless you're willing to spend $1200+ for a Police model with the heavy barrel thats inappropriate for hunting, their QC is far too spotty to gamble on.
False, as long as you dont buy one of their cheap Cabelas exclusive models, its a great rifle. Get a CDL, VTR, BDL, XCR, or SPS.

If you bought 2 and they were both lemons, that says more about you, than Remington. Also, Remington owns DPMS, so if Remington's quality was really dropping, why is DPMS now the standard for .308 ARs?

>>30935260
>why is DPMS now the standard
>now
Nigga they've always been the standard.

>as long as you don't buy one of their cheap Cabelas exclusive models
>Sendero SFII and SPS Varmint
nigga think before you type.

>>30935277
>Sendero SFII and SPS Varmint
Neither are Cabelas exclusives, try again.

>>30932607
that is short by a lot of guns
stop posting it or fix it

>>30935282
Exactly. Let me refer you to
>>30935233
where I said those were the two I bought and they were both lemons. And neither are Cabelas exclusives, and you outright stated in >>30935260
those are the only ones capable of being lemons.

How fucking retarded are you?

>>30935260
just because a company owns another company does not mean they manage it

>>30935010
Same here. Savage 110 was the first full size rifle I ever owned, and I still hunt with it today. First thing I ever shot with it was a turkey. That was the day I learned not to shoot turkeys with a 30-06.

>>30935317
Remington doesnt own DPMS, but they do manage it. Marlin is also in the same conglomerate but is independent of Remington.

>>30935309
Then I don't believe you. please post pictures or videos demonstrating their quality control issues.
>let me guess, you don't have any

>>30935339
>Remington doesnt own DPMS, but they do manage it.

Proofs?
Because the same people are still working at DPMS and still making the same policies

Remington changed their policies to allow more garbage through the QC line, so their guns are fucking shit now

Daily reminder that .30-06 is only 5% more muzzle energy than .308 but 20% more recoil.

.308 is the superior choice. If you need more than .308 in .30 caliber, then go to .300 Win Mag.

>>30935339
>Then I don't believe you. please post pictures or videos demonstrating their quality control issues.

Holy fuck, it's a real life living newfag

>there are 15 year olds who were born AFTER 9/11
>there are people old enough to have a conversation with who don't remember Hurricane katrina

I can't handle the cancer

>>30935359
Still waiting for pictures. Keep pretending that Remington is more expensive than your collection of fine high quality Mosin Nagants.

>>30935352
Wrong, Remington guns are fantastic, keep pretending you know what you are talking about. And feel free to check DPMS's website, they say the same thing.

>>30935339
I demand counter-proofs that Remington has never as in not once in their entire history put out a bad Sendero, Sendero SFII, CDL, VTR, BDL, XCR, or SPS.

If you can't do that then you're lying.

>>30935394
>oh wait that's right, for 3 years and against court orders they put out guns with non-functioning safeties and non-dropsafe triggers then proceeded to lose a nearly billion dollar class-action lawsuit over it

>>30935391
You are one stupid fuck
You don't remember the picture of the guy pulling his brand new 870 out of the box to a ton of rust on it?
You clearly have never owned one because their new finish rusts like a motherfucker

Keep showing how ignorant you are and how you've been here for maybe 3 months at best

I'm not going to bother giving you proof because you're just a stupid fuck who'll argue against anything I post regardless of WHAT I post

Kill yourself

>>30935391
>doesn't know about the rust problem
>doesn't know about the breaking ejector problem
>doens't know about the bent lifter problem

kys senpai

>>30935260
>If you bought 2 and they were both lemons, that says more about you, than Remington

Shill harder. Remington pump out the cheapest shit they can sell. And as it turns out they can go pretty cheap before people start objecting, they're riding the coat-tails of their reputation from decades ago.

>>30935394
You are now asking me to prove a negative, nice try. Let me guess, you are a Christ fag too. You argue like one.

>brand new 870
A bottom barrel one, Please post that picture so everyone can see. If you buy one of their proper 870s, they are great quality.

>new finish rusts
hahahaha no.

>>30935416
>Shill harder. Remington pump out the cheapest shit they can sell. And as it turns out they can go pretty cheap before people start objecting, they're riding the coat-tails of their reputation from decades ago.
As i've said, they have their shit tier cheapy lines you can find at cabelas. A Remington 700 should cost you $1k+. If you buy one of their $750 dollar models, you shouldnt expect the higher quality.

>>30935410
Literally none of those are common problems.

>>30935434
>iterally none of those are common problems.

>LLLLALALALALALALALAL I"M RETARDED AND YOU CANT TELL ME OTHERWISE

~u

This is a well known problem

Alright you stupid fuck, gunsmith here

I put a new barrel on a 700 a year ago

The old barrel had flats spots where the lands were crushed
BRAND NEW BARREL
I can't find the video anymore but the receiver threads weren't even close to concentric with the centerline
There was 10% contact on 1 lug for the locking lugs
The receiver face wasn't even CLOSE to square
There was huge scrapes in the bore

You might be able to fool someone else with your retardation, but you won't fool me

>>30935357
>>Daily reminder that .30-06 is only 5% more muzzle energy than .308 but 20% more recoil.
Are you some retarded newfaggot that doesn't know anything about guns? Even different loads will vary more than this and there are hundreds if not thousands and that's just what's commercially available. I'm also fairly sure what you just said is physically retarded. Literally retarded physics.

The .30-06 has significantly more case capacity. If you have an action strong enough to make use of that and are an experience, non-retarded reloader capable of developing your own loads beyond what commercial publications list then the larger 07 has a lot more capability.

>>30935357
nigger what

>>30932569
Get a .300winmag if you want a hard hitter. Otherwise you're just being either a faggot or a redneck.

>>30935456
Yet you still cant post a single picture demonstrating your issues with your Remingtons.
>and you call me the shill.

>>30935496
Go fuck yourself, newfag

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>>30935485
Mfw the phrase "literally retarded" is still being used by people miffed with someone else's opinion

>>30935504
S H I L L
H
I
L
L

>>30935496
You can google it if you want.
>everybody else but me is wrong

I'm sorry you have to try and defend your shit tier purchase and make yourself feel better.

>>30935496
Nigger, this is a widely known issue, go buy one if you want to take the risk, their QC has gone to shit (again) and they are coasting on their tarnished brand name.

>>30935519
Are you pretending that the Remington 700 is not one of the post popular rifles in the United States? Try getting out of the echochamber that is 4chan once in a while.

>>30935526
>Nigger, this is a widely known issue, go buy one if you want to take the risk, their QC has gone to shit (again) and they are coasting on their tarnished brand name.
False.

>>30935485
Sorry if you don't want to accept the facts, faggot.

A typical .308 load is about 2700 ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle.
A typical .30-06 load is about 2900 ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle.

2900 = 2700 + 5%

If you want to handload and load some hot .30-06 rounds, guess what? you can load hot .308 rounds, too.

There simply isn't much difference between the too, which is why the American military switch from .30-06 to .308, to take advantage of virtually similar ballistics in a short-action cartridge that is cheaper to produce.

>>30935488
What part didn't you understand, mong?

>>30935066
>20 MOA
HOLY FUCK

>>30935490

Or maybe he just doesn't want a .300 Win Mag. I've hunted from one end of this country to the other, found very little to be shot that I couldn't take with a .308 Win or 12 gauge slug.

>>30935339
http://www.cnbc.com/2014/12/05/remington-to-replace-millions-of-model-700-rifle-triggers.html

>>30935533

Popular =/= good

>>30935328
My first rifle was a .30-06 Savage 111, and I had it just for target shooting because I liked big-caliber rifles and hard kick so I didn't want something like a .223 for target shooting

either, which ever you prefer.

>>30935733
Your right. But the opinion on this Mongolian hand drawn animation image board is obviously much more informed in the finer points of the Remington 700.

>>30933278
It is. .30-06 has been around about 50 years longer (standard service rifle cartridge from 1906 through 1957) and is a lot more common in durr guns. It's ban-proof because if people can't buy durr boolets and Garand food even the fudds will riot.

>>30933302
This is bait.

>>30935576
nigger that doesn't mean MOA of accuracy it means 20 MOA scope mount so you can have a longer range optic on it

>>30932569

.30-06 as said has the best options for reloading. While some physics can be bickered at for the .308 in terms of accuracy, and the more even burn of the powder.


The .30-06 can be pushed faster and harder.

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>>30932672
>Remington's quality control has gone to shit
>My suggestion is the Savage

Confirmed for absolute idiot. Remington's quality is above savage, without question. You basement dwelling swap meet tier loving faggots need to seriously shut the fuck up. This place is the asshole of the internet, and even we are getting tired of your drivel.

308. If you want more oomph, do 7mm Rem Mag

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>>30933875
>>30933905
I can string words together pretty well, but I can string shots together even better. I actually own a Remington 700 SPS Tactical that was purchased just a few years ago. Heavy 20 inch barrel with a mediocre stock and a garbage trigger.

Picture is a 3 shot group of factory accutips. Expensive, but very accurate match grade hunting ammo... can't complain with those groups our of a factory rifle with store bought ammo. (the ammo is actually made by hornady)

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>>30939102
Here's a 5 shot group with hand loads.

BTW... the first faggot to point out I "missed" the bullseye... is a confirmed nongunz faggot. Clearly only concerned with shooting groups here.

>>30938860
i had to look up what "verklempt" meant.

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>>30939126
Pictured is the bone stock Remington rifle that shot those terrible groups....

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>>30939155
Here's me watering the grass at 300 yards.

On the topic of .308, does anyone have experience with the Adams Arms piston-driven AR-10? Is it any good?

>>30933333

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>>30935422

>>30933219
lol please.

>>30934152
My friend bought a 700 new a few years ago. Tightest group either of us could get was 7moa. Started thinking maybe we just suck until I started ringing the 500yd plate with my K31.

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>>30933302
Yeah but no

30-06 is inferior because of far larger recoil impulse

most fatass americans nowadays cant handle high recoil firearms

they are soft pieces of shit, unlike the greatest generation

stick with your .308, you fat pussies

>>30940140
Wow grandpa tell me more about how you didn't see action during ww2