tell me why

>>30930622
Having a little balistic protection wouldn't hurt but yeah there's nothing wrong with that set up desu

>>30930622
Until the guy you tried to shoot gets his group of buddies to circle around you because you can't zero for shit. Them with "all their fancy pc's and radios" while you and your dinky canteen are huddling against a boulder hoping they pass by you.

If you're some slo mo guy with a bolt action hoping to pick off survivors to loot their stuff then you better be good at follow up shots or getting the fuck out. When they follow you with their ak's and ar's and whathaveyou after your first shot attempt you're in a world of shit.

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The only realistic SHTF scenario in today's world is a Race War, or extraordinary natural disaster.

Katrina was as close as a real SHTF could get, and you didn't have snipers picking people off like >>30930819 and OP think. It'll be more like niggers/mexicans coming to raid your house/camp at night

Gear queers with their faggot equipment are just LARPers, nothing more

>>30930622
depends on what you're doing and what's happening around you.

DESU I'll just leave my kit behind and go out and help my friends family and neighbors.
People are people guy. Your Granny isn't going to try strangling you if a tornado hits.

>>30930622
it's true

in an asymmetric warfare scenario, it's better to take one accurate shot at >300m at an enemy soldier and then fuck off as fast as you can before they figure out where you are

wearing tons of heavy gear queer shit will slow you down and you will die to their more numerous, better-equipped force

>>30930819
yeah, but what if youre rifle is zero'd and you can actually shoot. you can move much faster without tons of shit strapped to you. plus the fact its extremely hard to see somebody who doesnt want to be seen especially if somebody beside just took a bullet in the pelvis.

>>30930962
>in an asymmetric warfare scenario, it's better to take one accurate shot at >300m at an enemy soldier and then fuck off as fast as you can before they figure out where you are

but that doesn't actually accomplish anything. snipers are useful when they're delaying forces from accomplishing something or augmenting the firepower of other forces, not when they're just randomly murdering some guys.

>>30930903
Not why Criss Kyle would have you belive

>>30930996
I'm thinking of in terms of civilians trying to damage an occupying force

snipers can be extremely demoralizing

>>30930952
you don't know my grandmother

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>>30930903
>The only realistic SHTF scenario in today's world is a Race War, or extraordinary natural disaster.

Ecological collapse is much more likely and much more existentially threatening.

>>30931174
Global warming is a myth. Make America Great Again. It Has What Plants Crave. 9/11

>>30930996
This anon >>30931046 is right. Imagine how terrifying it would be to go out, scavenging for supplies with your buds, and suddenly one of them falls down, spurting blood from his pelvis and shrieking at the top of his lungs that he's dying. Then, another one of your friends falls down, his head with a fresh new hole in it, liquified brain matter seeping out like water through a hose. You're in a scene of utter chaos, unaware if the next round is for you, on the verge of throwing up from seeing two men die in a matter of minutes. Chances are, snipers are more scary than you think.

>>30931193
Ironically global warming does in fact have what plants crave....

>>30931873
Electrolytes?

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>>30930903

you're right, no need to wear protective gear, this is why the military sends it's guys out wearing garbage bags and flip flops

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so what happens they have a $1000 thermal drone and see you?

>>30930622

He could use some more ammo for that rifle....maybe a knife, ifak, few other odds and ends. Other than that, he can go for it.

Oh, he does need some good shoes, gloves and eye pro...safety first.

>>30931873

Small Nordic children?

>>30931174
Fucking get out hippie

>>30931928
Tools (if any) needed for rifle maintenance?

>>30930622
Depends on your environment.

>>30930996
>The enemy advances, we retreat. The enemy camps, we harass. The enemy tires, we attack. The enemy retreats, we pursue.

>>30930819
>>30930903

You guys need to read that survivor account written by a guy who went through the bosnian civil war in the 90s

Somebody post it

>>30930622
Buy an AK or AR and you're fine.

A bolt action offers literally no real world advantage, but is slower to fire and reload. A slightly higher potential for accuracy is far outweighed by the ability to make fast follow up shots, and you're literally never going to be "picking off muh enemies at 500 yards." You're more likely to walk around the corner and have Jose and his buddies pull out a Hi Point and start shooting at you.

There's a reason bolt actions died out after WW2.

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>>30932615
Here.

depends on how far you realistically think you'll be shooting
within 400m and you're better off with a AR, few mags of quality .223 ammo and an appropriate optic
accurate and lightweight enough if done right and still semiauto for your cqb fantasies & followup shots
suppressor is a bonus obv

>>30932759
Thats been shown to be complete bullshit

>SHTF/civil war means everything will be in the woods
>People don't live in suburbs or cities
>Room to room fighting with a hunting rifle

No thank you senpai. Look at Syria if you want a good idea what the fighting would be like today.

>>30934422
wat u dont own several properties with odd huge mediuval fortified metal doors and a private ranch out in the sticks? shit man economic collapse happens how can you not afford this stuff all the survivors got teh good loot get gud

>>30932739
>A bolt action offers literally no real world advantage

I don't know, considering high power hunting rounds can routinely sail through Level IV armor, it would be handy as a support element against a heavily armored force. But you need an additional fire team or two to keep them back, distract them with harassing fire, and counter any flanking.

>>30930903
Sick of this ancap strawman.

>>30931921
Bust out my homemade, ridiculously expensive EMP devices.

Or
>Birdshot

>>30934527
Found the AnCap.

>>30934504
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paf3VtmLZuc
Heres a IV plate stopping .338 Lapua. So tell me what high power hunting rounds are you talking about? Do you hunt with .50 bmg?

>>30934527

you act like fibertarians wouldn't really do that

>>30930622
fudds would always win in a fantasy situation

All they do is mask themselves in an environment and take shots from 2-500 yards away

Would drive an enemy fucking insane

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>>30930622
>has not seen bullet removal videos.
>that all it takes to want body armor
Thank your pizza delivery boy next time you see one!

>>30930819
>hoping to pick off survivors to loot their stuff

OP didn't mention that at all in his post. He was speculating on the relative merits of a minimal load out v pretending like you have a logistics chain behind you.

Also, you assumed that OP was referring to a lone operator scenario. What if it's 4 guys with bolt guns? Now you have multiple casualties, and the rest of your AR/AK buddies are getting picked off while they try to maneuver because their suppressive fire is ineffective since they can't zero for shit.

>>30935517
>fudds would always win in a fantasy situation
They would win engagements, but not wars. Fudds and mallninjas both have a weird preoccupation with enemy casualties, so instead of actually achieving any sort of objective, they'd just murder bunches of people and think that they've "won" something while the actual invading government/national guard/fbi/whoever is busy setting up radio stations and assisting farmers and generally trying to set up a legitimized state.

see also: the vietnam war and both gulf wars

>>30931920
Protective gear is all good and everything, but have you considered the logistics chain that makes it feasible? In a shtf scenario, the only time that armor would make sense is when you're defending your supply source.

In the field, you'll have to decide on protection or carrying more consumables. Resupply ain't coming in on a Blackhawk, you carry it on your back. The weight/bulk of a PC and helmet could add up to 2 fewer days on patrol and less distance covered. Or possibly running out of ammo when you least need for that to happen.

Armor serves a purpose, but you need to be aware of the limitations it brings.

>>30931174
The environment won't suddenly and catastrophically shift to kill everything. Dat global warming is a fairly slow process.

Anything that'd be "SHTF" would be strictly temporary and distinctly localized. Natural disasters and that kind of thing.

>>30937227
If shit has indeed hit the fan, you shouldn't be "patrolling", you should be buttoning up at home. It's better to have a rainwater collector and a small garden than a couple of MREs and a Camelbak®

>>30931193
shit i love that movie

>>30931921
shit i didn't even know those were so cheap and readily available

scary

>>30937038
You assume too much from what little he gave us Mr. Projector

>>30931921
shoot it down

>>30934923
i heard somebody killed a moose with .950 jdj

>>30931920
1. That's WWII to now, to future, and then to whatever game that is.
2. I feel that the ratios in the infograph come more from medical technology and improving upon the medevac system (ie helicopter) than anything else.

>>30930903
>It'll be more like niggers/mexicans coming to raid your house/camp at night
even that didnt happen much during katrina because all of everyone's shit was underwater and your average Tyrone isn't a salvage diver

>>30930952
This.

But there are levels of shtf.
Katrina was barely a state wide disaster.
Multiply that by 48 states and now grandma might think her next meal is more important than grandchild #15.

>>30932759

Nobody says tušonka around these parts. This was written by a Westerner who thinks every Slav nation has the same words for shit.

>>30930819
In addition to
>>30937038
You're assuming that anyone you're shooting at would have buddies. If this were the case, you picked a bad target. Fucking no one is going to be able to do shit when they are surrounded by 4-5 guys, regardless of what they are using

>>30931920
Did you not read his post, or did you just not comprehend it's meaning? In the most recent comparable event nothing that body armor would protect you from happened. The military is a completely different situation

OP probably has the right idea if you're going it solo.

Many of the gearfags have shit that supports them and other people for days. I'd like a bit more than what was in OP's picture, but I'm only looking out for myself, so all I'd really require is a small medkit, about a days worth of food, bit of extra ammo and a bit more water. I could also throw in one of those dumb altoids survival tins, so all I need is a small backpack.

>>30937290
>implying if the grid goes down youll just be camped up in your house drinking rain water and eating tomatoes

good chance you may have to hike out to nearby high traffic areas to get intel/do recon on whats going on. defending your home/cache, sure strap on a chest rig with 8 mags. but when you need to move around in a chaotic environment, traveling light, agile and being aware that staying hidden is vital is more important than being prepared to fight off waves of attackers.

The problem that most Gearfags have is that they plan for/think they will have organised and structured combat, like a standard war scenario. It could work if they have a bunch of other Gearfags to team with.

Realistically though, most people will conduct guerrilla warfare. The average civilian won't know enough about combat to use any military strategy, so they go back to primal "I'm going to fuck you up" mode. Those who do know military strategy will choose to utilise guerrilla warfare since its a lot "easier" to maintain and is a lot more flexible in terms of day to day life, plus it can fuck Gearfag standard military conduct.

Nothing happens the same way twice, but if civil war here is anything like syria, id want a bit more than a deer rifle and a fucking canteen. For starters, nalgene please, canteens always taste like someone's dipped their balls in the water.

>>30937290
>you should be buttoning up at home

I was assuming long term shtf scenario. Grid down, or similar. Anything less than 3 months, sure, bugging in is the smart option.

>>30934923
>>30934504
He's probably referring to the crappy steel armor that's been shown to penetrable by full power rifles loaded with AP (and similarly the "level III" that could be punched by XM193). Those companies are either incompetent or lying. If it can't stop AP .30-06 then it isn't level IV by definition.

buuut if SHTF and you're dealing with tactical goobers buying cheap plates they might have bought that bad QC stuff.

>>30938809
> they plan for/think they will have organised and structured combat, like a standard war scenario

Which still wouldn't end well for them because they'll be facing an adverse correlation of forces.

Probably a more realistic scenario would be something like the Middle East. Any number of factions, shifting alliances, blurry supply lines, lots of infighting.

>>30937578
Which is the point I was trying to make with my post, Capt. Oblivious.

>>30940593
Yeah man that's what I said. A good example is the story of some Japanese fighter pilot that crashed on an uninhabited island in WW2. He never knew the war had ended and he carried on killing people that came to the island for years afterwards. Since it was just him, guerrilla warfare was easy to do.