Should mentally ill people be allowed weapons?

>>29307732
SHALL

DESIGNATED

If by mentally ill you mean homosexuals, bisexuals, transsexuals, or fetishists, then no. They are non-humans and therefore not entitled to human rights.

>>29307732
That question is incredibly difficult to answer as we do not have a uniform manner by which to classify what symptoms or behaviors constitute mental illness to the point where owning weapons would be dangerous, be it to themselves or others. As you can see, this guy's notion of mental illness >>29307808 may not be the same as others.

The power to determine who is mentally ill and who should be stripped of their Constitutionally Protected rights is something we need to be very careful about.

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>>29307808
>>29307808
good job

>>29307732
Sure, as long as they aren't the type that would do unjustified harm to others.

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>>29307834
Haha what happens if we take that Constitutional right?

>>29307891
Then nobody has guns, and we turn into Europe v2.0. We'll have to figure out some expensive and humiliating way to bring in millions of Islamic rapefugees, so we can get that authentic Yuro vibe going.

My instinct says why not, but I don't think with the current level of mental health evaluation we can differentiate who would and would not, be fit to own a weapon.

Being autistic or even delusional doesn't necessarily make you prone to violence nor does it make shooting someone any easier, deep down even crazy people know it's wrong to take a life. And if they were such a threat to themselves or others, why do we let them drive where they could potentially run people off roads or intentionally crash?

>>29307891
Texas conquers the rest of the continent and renames it Faggots.

>>29307841

>Sure, as long as they aren't the type that would do unjustified harm to others.

Like liberals?

Only sharpened sticks

>>29307808
Fuck off back to /pol/

If they have hurt other or themselves in the past, are violent in nature, make rash decisions, etc then no.

My buddy living in Taxachusetts was at a low point in his life a few years back and checked voluntarily checked himself into a mental health facility. Right before he was discharged one of the therapists was like "Oh btw, I let your local police know you were in here. They're gonna stop by and take your guns off your hands". Massachusetts is a faggy state for gun owners - for the next 5 years he wont be able to have any guns. Once the 5 years is up he'll have to reapply for his FFL (long gun permit) which will take an upwards of a year to be reinstated and he will probably never be able to get a permit to own a pistol ever again (may issue state - police departments can deny you for any reason they see fit and there's nothing you can do about it).

>>29308100
Bullshit, unless he was involuntarily committed

>>29307732
Anything could be a weapon. That being said, shooting sprees are lame as fuck. Not as personal as chopping people up with an ax. If someone did that I think the liberal media would void their bowels live.

>>29308100
Does that only apply for MA? What if someone went in voluntarily WITHOUT police ever being notified or involved prior, during, or after when the patient was a minor? Surely there has to be patient confidentiality.

>>29307732
>Mentally ill

Too vague, try again.

I think the criteria of having to have been involuntarily committed is a good one. Restricting people who are simply being treated for things like depression, bi-polar, or autism spectrum disorders would be draconian and counter-productive.

>Be hasguns
>Feeling slighty depressed
>Want to go to doctor
>Know that will get your guns confiscated
>Can't tell anyone
>Can't get any help
>Depression gets worse
>Turn to alcohol and drugs because you can't go get actual antidepressants
>Depression gets worse
>Eventually blow brains out because you couldn't get the help you needed for fear of losing your freedoms

>>29308136
It sounds like bullshit to me, but in general you aren't disqualified from owning guns unless you have been institutionalized /without/ your consent, I.E if they have to drag you in screaming in a straight jacket, you can't have guns. Even this can be appealed though, given time.

>>29308190
This is my argument exactly. Taking privileges away after someone voluntarily seeks treatment is only going to deter people from getting professional help.

>>29308112
No, I promise you he wasn't. I think you severely underestimate the faggotry propagated by Massachusetts when it comes to gun ownership. Legit in the top 3 worst states to own guns.

>>29308136
I'm not entirely sure but I'd think so. Like I said above MA is a horribly restrictive gun state. About as bad as it gets.

>>29307732
Yes except people like antman for example

>>29307808

Since theres always at least one retard like this guy, yes. They should.

>>29308208
I promise you it's not. This was 100% voluntary. He had admitted that he had felt suicidal at points. The shrink then took it upon himself to declare him to be unfit to own guns.

>>29308221
Ding, ding, ding. You hit the nail on the head.

>>29308235
Whats wrong with people like antman?

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>>29308241

I know it's bait, but I'll take it, if you are new here don't, go away, if you don't like what you see, you're welcome to leave, 4chan is not for everyone, and that means for you, think of it as that dark place in your basement you don't want to enter because you don't want to find what's inside, the same way you don't like what you see, the same way we don't want you here.

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>>29308241
I don't know the whole story since I automatically filter any tripfag I see but from what I understand he's some guy who lives in a trailer and screams at his television and tries to pray his homosexuality away. Also he posts here about guns and people get angry when he does, but then things get crazy and his manic depression comes out and he threatens to kill his cats or something like that.

You should find out from some /k/ommando who actually does see his posts and doesn't just see the replies.

>>29308278
>a long trainwreck of a post that is just a sentence with a bunch of commas

What are you even trying to say anon?

>>29307808
pretty much this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_abuse_of_psychiatry_in_the_Soviet_Union

>>29307834
Exactly this. It's why Obama wants everyone to have mandatory health checks.

>>29308190

>become a statistic for antis arguing against mentally ill people owning guns

They're doing it on purpose.

>>29308452

This.

Even in America countless people were lobotomized without consent and women were given vibrators to cure hysteria.

Psychiatric health has always been too obscure to cite as a valid reason.

>>29307808

Didn't like, EVERY Yankee General dress up in drag during one of their drunken balls?

There are also tons of posters that upload dragon dildos next to their guns. Even if they bought it for ironic reasons it's just a matter of time before they try sticking it up their ass because they are bored or drunk.

>>29308190

This, basically. Everything from homosexuality to heterosexuality has been thought of as mental illness.

Everything is a disease, everything is illegal, everything is poisonous, etc etc.

All your opinions are invalid because there are opinions others have that cancel yours out.

>>29308074
>>>/reddit/

>>29307808
People like this guy are why they shouldn't.
This stormfag is gonna go up to some gay parade and gun down a ton of people who get boners from looking at women with penises because his schizophrenia tells him that they are gonna throw some gay revolution and let homosexuality take over.

>>29307808
I vote stormfags shouldn't have guns because they're all a bunch of tools.

>>29307732

Anyone of adult age deemed unfit to bear arms should be killed as bearing arms is a natural right same as life itself. By taking away someone's right to bear arms you are saying they have no right to preserve their life and therefore their life has no worth, logically they can only put those deserving to live at risk with or without a gun hence they should be summarily executed.

At a minimum they should be institutionalized if they do not have a caretaker whom will assume the burden.

If you want 'common sense' regulation this is it. The logic is flawless.

The people who try to ban guns don't want this alleged common sense control. What they want is obviously to take away just the guns of those they considered to be slaves. Creatures to be used for their will. An implement to further their goals and support their lifestyle. They care not if you die any more than a farmer cares if his shovel breaks. Sure it is unfortunate and he may take care to avoid it but there are many more shovels in the world just like it, as the farmer is concerned there is only one of him.

>>29308444
He's a fictional persona written by someone who wrote the most trite, banal "psycho" they possibly could, only to kill off the character and keep mentioning it at every possible instance, a la >>29308235 to try and force it into memetic status.

>>29307732
If this is a roundabout way of asking whether you should buy a gun... sure, go for it.

>>29307808
SHALL
NOT
BE
INFRINGED

>>29307732
How mentally ill?
Depressed people are a gray area, some are a danger to themselves or others, but most aren't.
People with gender dysphoria, sexual deviancy, anorexia, parental issues, etc, don't see why they shouldn't have the right to bear arms. I mean, if we barred autists and sperg, almost all of 4chan would be blocked.

Potatos and others who simply can't take care of themselves should probably not be armed, rather, their wranglers would be armed and take responsibility for their safety.

I should point out that the mentally sick actually don't commit a lot of crime compared to the rest of the population, most aren't more violent than the rest of us, and those who are, typically live in institutions.

>>29307808
You sound like a sound and well balanced person without any hatred or issues.

>>29308112
Federal laws are usually more lenient, but some particular states can be very fascist.

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s l i p p e r y s l o p e

>>29308136
Unless you live in a particularly fascist state, if it was a voluntary commitment, there was no police involved, and you didn't say to staff "I just REALLY want to hurt people and I'm planning to" or something similar, you're PROBABLY fine.

However, if you want to own NFA items, I figure this is something that COULD MAYBE come up and your tax stamp could bounce, but it wouldn't block you from regular firearms.

I don't know how it is with carry licenses, but I know a girl in New Mexico who tried to hang herself the other Xmas, she was committed for about a year, and she recently went and got a CC license after almost being grabbed in a Walmart parking lot at night (I had advised her about it a while back, the thought apparently jumped into her head after the parking lot incident and the first thing she did in the morning was scheduling a class). She carries a .45 Glock and recently got a Saiga .308 for a bargain.

Really, check your local laws.

>>29307732
you mean like the sperg a couple days ago that pointed his rifle at his brother over some dumb little argument?
no
some people just aren't responsible/can't control themselves

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>>29309287
not even the stormfag but

>women with penises

>>29310149
Trannies are boner poison to me but I don't go around dictating their rights because of it.

>>29307834
Sorry, if you're diagnosed with schizo or biopolar, no guns for you, ever. Same with violent felons.

>>29310178
Schizos and bipolars aren't actually that dangerous though. They're actually far more likely to victims than the general population is.

>>29307732
Unless they are prone to aggressiveness/hallucinations/depression, there are so many mental ilnesses every second person has one. I think everyone should be allowed to defend themselves and treated like "undiagnosed" gun buyers, as long as they are not a hazard.

>>29307732
No, mental illness is not/very poorly linked to violent crime. What should be done is if we have a reason to believe someone (anyone) is likely to do something violent, to themselves or others, then we do something. What that is can change, and how we determine if they're a threat is hard. But really, mentally ill people are very typically fine.

(Retards of course shouldn't be allowed weapons, or any dangerous object really, in the first place, but they're not exactly mentally ill)

I'm too afraid to get treatment because if I do I'll have a permanent record saying I am unfit to have certain jobs or own firearms.

Nice work fucktards.

>>29310241
Yeah, exactly. I believe that if we restrict people who have minor stuff they don't seek treatment for because they might have their guns confiscated, they might actually develop something serious long term. The only shooting here in Czech Republic was a result of this.

>>29309506
This, antman is /k/'s edgy milhouse

The only people that shouldn't have them are people that are going to use them against other people without reasonable and proper justification, [sp]or annoying arseholes who use them irresponsibly in a manner that would result in video footage being uploaded to liveleak or worldstarblipblop.[/sp]

>>29307808
so you believe you shouldn't own any weapons?

>>29308705
>>29308452

Psychfag here:

Hysteria was largely a case of "doctors didn't really know what they were doing" and a side effect of victorian prudishness (the idea of women being sexual on their own volition rather than just passive baby-makers is pretty new). Hence doctors had to vibrate horny housewives, and those who were legitimately sick (because eww what kinda doctor wants to actually work with women parts, what is this the modern age???)

Psychiatric abuse in the US reached a fever pitch during the eugenics and sterilization programs, research California's coerced sterilization program. I'll sum it up:
>Be poor, minority (usually mexican who can't read)
>go to hospital and be in childbirth
>forced to sign a bunch of consent forms, but you are illiterate. The hospital says its just routine stuff.
>SURPRISE one of them allows them to sterilize you after the operation.

Another one:
>Office of Economic Opportunity runs a bunch of housing and poverty programs.
>Be poor woman living in gov't slums
>White guy shows up, "those are some nice benefits you have here... Be a shame if anything happened to them". Basically be threatened to lose benefits if you don't have the procedure done.

As for homosexuallity you need to understand that
1: in terms of "norms" in a population homosexuality is still a small minority despite what Tumblr tells people. The truth is trans, lesbians, gays, and bisexuals combined represent somewhere around 5% of the population.

What this means is that homosexuality is "deviant" in the sense that it differs from the norm, noticeably so.

The reason it was taken off the DSM (guidebook for psychfags) is that being gay doesn't seem to hurt people inherently, nor disrupt their life. Being gay doesn't harm or damage your life, being discriminated against does however. But there's nothing inherent to homosexuality that ruins your life or prevents you from having a typical day.

This is obviously in contrast to say Schizophrenia.
1/2

>>29310388
>>29307834
>>29307923
>>29308100

If you hurt yourself, then we get into mixed bag territory.

First if everyone who had major depression couldn't have guns then a LOT of people would be disarmed. A huge chunk of Americans will have depression at some point in their lives- it is treatable and can pass for most people. It is the flu or pneumonia of the psych world- can be dangerous, takes time to treat, but ultimately can pass.

And that's really the issue at hand when people bring up mental illness- there are those who 100% get better and those who can't. If you have borderline personality disorder (this is your garden variety batshit crazy attention whores where if it isn't going there way at every opportunity then obviously life is unfair and they should try to sudoku for attention) then that's pretty much ingrained in your life. That's not going away. Depression? Dysthymia? Yeah that can go away. Hell certain members of the schizo-family tree can be suppressed IF you keep up on medication and treatment.


There's a bewildering number of conditions that cause people to be dysfunctional, but that is very different from those that cause people to flip their shit and go violent. Your hoarder isn't exactly a threat to anything other than the pile of dead rats that got lost.

Then we get to PTSD, a condition that hits home for a lot of /k/ommandos I'm sure. Should THEY have their guns taken away? Because PTSD is co morbid (occuring with) a fuckton of other disorders. mental disorders btw often come with guests, and it's just a party in your head.


I think ethically it would be EXTREMELY difficult and hazardous and just plain wrong to strip people of a constitutional right unless I was presented with evidence that they had been violent before. This isn't minority report, I can't judge people before they do or plan something.

>>29307732
Personally, no. But my personal opinions should not infringe one anyone's right to enjoy their fucking life, so it's really their choice.

Depending on the illness, no I don't think so.

>>29310388
oh my god woooooooooooooooooooooow
that's some nazi germany shit right there
guess it's unsurprising as it's cali

>>29307834
Spoken like a presidential candidate.

>>29307732
Diagnosed schizoaffective guy here on 4 medications who owns an AR and a handgun. How does this make you feel guys? I have passed background checks for every firearm and have a conceal carry license.

>>29310521
The first sterilization law got passed in Indiana in 1907. The nazis were strongly influenced by the US euthanize tion program, as were the sterilization programs going on in most of the developed world.


A lawsuit was filed at the Supreme Court level, madrigal v. Someone 1976 I think. They plaintiffs (the sterilized) lost but the sterilizations dropped down drastically afterwards.

>>29310521
Another fun thing they did was deprive rich white people of birth control by saying that contraceptives would threaten fertility permanently, etc.

At the same time they would promise that sterilization was temporary and encourage poor people to abort, etc.


In North Carolina a social worker could recommend ANYONE for compulsory sterilization. Bear in mind this is Jim Crow era. The ethics board that oversaw and reviewed the social workers rarely ever said no, regardless of how trivial the reason was.


People say that America is becoming a police state, that have no idea how much of the worst has already happened

Shall not be infringed, UNLESS...

>>29310759
>>29310719
interesting

no idea who Jim Crow is, I'm an ausfag

>>29310541
Exercise your rights, but also be vigilant.

I trust you have a good grasp on your condition, but do you have a contingency in case you felt you'd somehow worsen?

Personally, I used to cut myself, have some on and off depression, it happens.

>>29310881
"Jim Crow" is a name used to describe laws written in the wake of the 13th Amendment (when slavery got b&), where Democrats tried to pass as many laws as they could to make it difficult for blacks to live their lives.

A LOT of the gun control laws on the books in the US are Jim Crow laws, the idea was that it would be harder for blacks to get guns, and exercise other God given rights.

>>29308190
I can go with the involuntary commited threshold. I'd really like to see some definitive criteria for what would constitute mental illness on a level worth stripping one's rights away, though. As much as I (& everyone on this board) hate to admit it, we ALL know someone who probably shouldn't be allowed around anything that they could hurt themselves with. I worked in a psychiatric facility, so I'd probably give more ground on this than most of you guys, though. I guess if you've been deemed unable to make decisions for yourself to the point where they're made for you, even against your will, then sorry...no guns for you. Outside of that, no one should be restricted.

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>>29310978
cool story bro
thanks for that fantastic and easy to read summary.

>>29307742
NOT

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>>29310759
Nigga I know someone who cannot get an abortion Right Now. They live in central florida and say that they got tricked by a pregnancy centre that told her they could "discuss abortion at the clinic". That discussion ended up being a pro-life seminar and she was told they do not do abortions in her whole county, something no health providers told her over the phone.

She's been beside herself last few days, says she doesn't know what to do because information is purposely obfuscated there. The pregnency is from an ex that beat her regularly and may or may not have forced her to have sex. She is so against screaming rape about it though, she won't even talk about the potential it was rape. She is at least separate from the guy, he got himself arrested in some shitty caribbean country for a few years.

And they're all white. I wonder if it'd be easier to get the abortion if she was black?

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>>29309287
>women with penises

>>29310987
>anon you're a ______!
>but I'm fine
>why are you so resistent to be treated!
>because fuck you
>hi my buddy/son/coworker/random person who is my friends brothers ex roommate is fucked in the head and wants to kill himself!
>some commie shit like the baker or marshmont act.jpg
>forcibly committed.jpg
>well anon after being forcibly dragged from your home and held against your will we've found that you're mostly fine but have exhibited aggression and some other macguffin benign mental illness, sorry for wasting your time for 3 days no you don't have any recourse against the fucker who reported on you, the gestapo shit you experience, or against those that held you for "treatment"
>go to buy a gun later
>fail NICS check
>because you were forcibly committed
>literally no recourse to get your rights restored
>the future you chose.jpg
>"Brazil".jpg

It really depends on how mentally ill. A schizophrenic should really not be around guns ever

>>29311073

You missed the part where you failed 2 psych evaluations, one of which had to be appointed by a court and also testified against you in a court of law. No system will be foolproof, but that's a large damn hurdle for the state to overcome.

Also, as metal illness actually begins to look more like getting temporarily sick and less like a moral failing, that non-voluntary committal bar will go even higher.

>>29311054
Man fuck this shit. We absolutely cannot go backwards

>>29308190
this is currently me. I can't get the help I want because of my state's laws on the matter.

>>29311073
They evaluate you /before/ you're actually committed, so if someone tries to get you committed and then the doctor goes "but wait this guy isn't actually nuts," it doesn't go on your record.

>>29311246
>>29311277
you missed the part where all you need to be is put in a 3 day hold under the marshmont act to be fucked for the rest of your life when it comes to things were "forcibly committed" are a DQ, like guns "legally", because some nosy cocksucker thought you were too depressed and your "fuck off" was a cry for help.

adjudicated mentally defective is what you are describing and is different than "forcibly committed". Forcibly committed is not voluntarily going into treatment, not being found by a psychologist that you're a nutter. the normal way of a psychologist deeming you _______ isn't what these laws do. It's a guilt until proven innocent situation operating off the same logic as "if you have nothing to hide you wouldn't mind the police searching your home!"

>>29307732
it depends on the type of mental disorder I guess
schizophrenics probably shouldn't
but mild depression isn't a problem
just as long as they get regular checkups from doctors to make sure they're on their meds there shouldn't be a limiting factor to gun rights

>>29307732
What classifies as mentally ill?

That one slightly autistic guy?
The depressed guy after his mother died?
The person who has a politically incorrect opinion?

>>29307732

In America, yes. Just let them all kill each other, nobody else cares, right?

>>29310969

Would you honestly still be ok with that if he shot your family?

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>>29311054
>She is so against screaming rape about it though, she won't even talk about the potential it was rape.
jesus christ that's so sad

>>29311328
*baker act
the marchmont is the commie bullshit about drug rehab.

Florida is a fucking shithole btw, enjoy getting forcibly taken from your home because an acquaintance says you want to kill yourself.
>anon do you want to harm yourself
>no what the fuck is wrong with you
>why are you so angry
>fuck you
>anon you need help with this maguffin
>fuck off
>I think you should go get help
>fuck off
>beep boop beep hi I know a guy who refuses to seek help regarding _____ and is violent and angry!
>black bagged by the police.jpg
>3 days later released
>medical facility diagnoses you with _____ benign thing tat doesn't need real treatment to cover thier ass over the whole "taking some random assholes word that someone needs to be held against their will"
>blackmarked forever, no gun 4 u

>>29307732
They already do. Go check out /arg/

>>29311328

Unless Google is lying, that's Florida only. Also, it has yet to be tested in an appellate court.

What were your representative's thinking on that one?

>>29311418
use it as proof that you can't give one goddamn inch. The potential for abuse of psychology regarding civil liberties is the modern Jim Crow.

>>29311398

> Hi, I'm the head psychiatrist at the ______ clinic. No, I will not be taking this "patient" because he does not have any indicators of mental illness outside of being grumpy. Now excuse me, I have limited time and budget to use on my actual patients.

>>29311446
>Hi I am literally forced by the state to hold and evaluate this person because you told me they are a threat to themselves or others
>more proof, no we don't need that we'll figure it out during the evaluation
ftfy

keep thinking that denying people "forcibly committed" civil rights isn't fucking retarded anon. Keep thinking that it's taking schizos out of gun shops and not a tool to keep YOU from guns, voting, etc. because you were sad for a while around the wrong people.

>>29311031
BE

>>29311446
>Hi I'm a central dispatcher for your PD, we'll be right there and dump him off at a clinic that will hold him for 3 days for a psych eval
ftfy

florida laws are shit buddy. Your state will follow suit if you don't fight tooth and nail against psychology abuse. Forcibly committed and adjudicated mentally defective are two different things. One requires multiple psychologists testifying in a court, the other requires your ex girlfriend to be angry at you and a phone.

>TFW live in California
>TFW law states that all they need is a "gut feeling" from someone who knows me to take my guns away
>TFW all my family is anti-gun and thinks that owning a gun is clear intent to commit mass murder
>MFW I become the test case for this law when they come to shoot my dog.

>>29311473

So because I said that medical professionals aren't the mustache twirling villains you implied, now I also support the Baker Act? Come on...

The Baker Act may be a step too far, but am I reading correctly that are you are claiming there is NO case where the state should restrict someone's civil liberties?

>tfw live in Bong
>want to move to America for work
>still won't be able to own guns because severe mental health issues

I can still buy pepper spray r-right?

>>29311495

> No due process

Then Florida state law is in direct opposition to "O'Conner vs Donaldson" and "Rogers vs Okin", and the state attorney is going to get their shit pushed in the minute they step in an appellate court room.

>>29311689

Elucidate on "severe".

>>29307732
If we're talking about somewhere that doesn't have the 2nd amendment, I don't see why having mild depression or autism should be a reason to be barred from owning a weapon.

>>29311689
>Severe
Do you really blame us though lol i mean

>>29307808
People took this bait hard.
But there are people that actually believe this so saying mentally ill people cant own guns is opening the door for the gov't to say "X group can't own guns cause they're mentally ill."

>>29311699

Three suicide attempts this year
Bad depression
Anxiety
Paranoia
Insomnia

If I owned a gun I'd probably be dead by now.

>>29307742
Do the mentally ill not have a right to self-defense? To what degree of illness? Which illness?

>>29308112
Not sure about Massachusetts but can confirm from personal experience this anon is right.

>>29311690
>due process
>psychology and mental health
there is a reason why "not one inch" isn't a meme. The law says the police have to scoop you up and drop you off for a 3 day hold to find out how crazy you are. At the end of 3 days you come out the other end forcibly committed AND not deemed a danger to yourself or others you still were forcibly committed.

>>29311657
being adjudicated mentally defective, which is mainly a thing that happens after you commit a crime where being a _____ is a mitigating factor in, is a normal system with safeguards to keep someone from slipping through the cracks. A schizophrenic shouldn't have to hide thier condition to keep the right to vote, but one who stabs someone being adjudicated mentally defective by a court of law is the system working.

>>29307808
>If by mentally ill you mean Jews, Zionists, Jew supporters, or Kike enablers, then no. They are non-humans and therefore not entitled to human rights.

>>29308136
I "voluntarily"(with police escort) was admitted to a looney house and can still own guns, pass a background check, and have held a concealed weapons permit(moved to different state so past tense).

>>29307808
see
>>29311920
*FTFY

>>29311721
you really suck at suicide. do you not own duct tape and a plastic bag?

sounds like you're just a fucking attention whore, which is within the bipolar spectrum.

>if I owned a gun I'd probably be dead
If you really wanted to kill yourself you'd already be dead.
You subconsciously know that swallowing a bottle of sleeping pills and calling the police to say you're killing yourself that an ER is going to pump your stomach before you die.

>>29311721
A cheap shotgun can be had for around $300 new, stop being a lazy fag and go to the store.

>>29311492
INFRINGED

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>>29311054
Any Central Floridians on who can advise this anon? There must be services available.

>>29311903

> Police MUST scoop you up for 72 hour hold

1. No, the police are not required by law to pick you up if they get a call. They, a psychiatrist, or a judge have the option if they have evidence that you are mentally I'll and a danger to yourself.

2. You can also be arrested without being charged for up to 72 hours as well. They aren't setting precedent there.

The law sucks, but if you want to fight it, get the facts right. You're going to be facing the facts that they basically gave police the same authority over mental health as they did crime. Maybe target that police have insufficient training to make these decisions instead of a civil rights angle.

>>29312039
Central FL here. Why doesn't she take a trip to a public clinic and ask them?

>>29311721
Oh well. i mean, that's too bad anon, but. God shuffled his feet and shit happens.
No fuckign excuse to restrict the entire fuckign population to a pair fucking safety scissors just because a small percentage of people aren't capable of being intelligent and responsible

>>29311388
Considering how fucking rare that is, I don't even think about it.

Paranoid schizophrenics can be shifty, weird and unpleasant, but they're very rarely prone to wanton violence or sporadic aggressive outbursts, that shit you see in movies don't really happen very often in reality.

Also consider that medication and therapy can do a pretty good job of evening this shit out. At most I could see debate on whether or not they should carry, but the typical schizo is clear enough in the head when under treatment that I think they should be able to have weapons in their home for sport/recreation, but also defense, loons are victims of crime too.

I honestly don't think anyone should ever be permanently barred from their 2A rights, in my opinion, if you are barred, you should be able to appeal it. You might not be trusted now, or a year from now, but maybe five years later you've gotten your life together and you're not a risk anymore.

>>29311903

Not a lawyer, so anyone who is can correct me.

'Mentally defective' is the only way you're losing civil rights in the majority of the states in the U.S., mostly due to the cases mentioned in >>29311690.

While used in criminal cases, in my state, it's also the only way your name gets blacklisted on the NICS for mental health reasons.

>>29307808

agreed.

>>29312068
>No, the police are not required by law to pick you up if they get a call.
But they will though, because,
>They, a psychiatrist, or a judge have the option if they have evidence
that "evidence" can be somebody who hates you gets you committed or it's some anti-gun advocate who's "doing the right thing" by making sure you never have guns ever.

>You can also be arrested without being charged for up to 72 hours as well.
Difference being that when you're released after being arrested you aren't going to get flagged through the NICS system for a felony.

>>29307732
If they couldn't be allowed to have weapons then how would the marines fight with flashlights.

>>29307808
so they don't have a right to defend themselves form bigots like you and >>29312134

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>>29311689
You can own blackpowder guns such as muskets and cap & ball revolvers, antiques and replicas (and "replicas") are not considered firearms under Federal law, outside being used in the commission of a crime.

They're not super slick, but you can load them pretty decently, and they're fun to shoot.
Modern substitute blackpowder can burn pretty cleanly, and with a good modern projectile that fits, a fully loaded Ruger Old Army can provide you with near .44 Magnum firepower in one cylinder.

Muskets and other muzzle-loaders aren't subject to NFA regulations regarding barrel lengths or stocks or whatever, so you can have a short rifle, or a double-barrel musket shotgun that has like 14" barrels and it doesn't matter.

So you wouldn't be all gravy, but you also wouldn't be all fucked either.

>>29312095

>>29311054 here

She says did exactly that.

>>29307732
Depends on how stable they are. Of they have mental break downs a lot. Then no.

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>>29307808

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>>29307808
come and take them from my cold dead frilly hands fagget

>>29312850
That wording could be an interesting way of putting somebody into your will. Also, do you still go on omegle?

>>29313087
yeah but ive laid off it in the past months its just been airsoft kids more than anything

>>29312212

In your presented case, your fake crazy call from your girlfriend requires three successive events to occur for you to get NICS flagged: the police think your crazy, the psychologist agrees you are crazy at the end of your observation period, and then a judge signs off on all the presented evidence. That third step should require a trial to pass muster at the appellate level, but this the beuracratic railroad you've implied.

In your second case, you don't get flagged for NICS at the end of your 72 hour observation period either. Not without a psychiatrist and a judge both signing off on it. Again, I admit that's still b.s. without a trial.

>>29313211
What you're not understanding is that the police, the psychologist, everyone just assumes that you're automatically guilty. There is an assumed guilt in our justice system to begin with, but it is doubly so with anything regarding mental illness (even peripherally) which is likely why "innocent until proven guilty" was a concept codified into law. I imagine back then the desire to have the problem, i.e. you, "go away" or "be dealt with" outweighed anyone's rights.

This is not the only aspect where we're moving backward, we're in desperate need of an overhaul of the criminal justice system to clear out the "letter of the law" types who think a law is there to be used whenever possible. We were originally founded on the principles of legal precedence as a guideline, not as an annoyance for a power-hungry DA, we need to go back to those days.

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>>29307732
depends on what you call mental illness.

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>>29313358
so glad i burned that wig after i ruined it

>>29313409
You're really fucking ugly. Sorry.

The mental health system is a joke, especially the VA.

I got diagnosed with schizophrenia when I had alcoholic psychosis, they gave me benzos, max dose Zoloft, multiple max dose antipsychotics, Vicodin, and flexiril, and claimed the fucked up mental state I got from the meds was proof of my "schizophrenia".

>>29307808
>Most people here did not recognize satire using other liberal agendas.

I thought it was brilliant though. Good job.

>>29307732

The problem isn't the gun, it's the term "mentally ill". The gun will always be the gun, but give the democrats a year with it and "mentally ill" will mean owning a cowboy hat or driving a car with low gas mileage.

>>29307732
Most are non-violent, so yes.

>>29308100
>If they have hurt themselves in the past
This is retarded. You're making the assumption that they will never get better. I've tried to kill myself in the past, many years ago. But after the 2nd time I realized how much of my life I was wasting and how much better off I would if I just went through with treatment. A few antipsychotics later and after many years of CBT I am much better than I was back then.
t.bipolarcuck

People with serious mental illnesses such as schizophrenia, borderline personality disorder and severe autism should not be able to purchase a gun. However, a guy in his 30's who took antidepressants for a few months in his teens shouldnt be labeled as being "Mentally ill". The term Mental illness needs to be more well defined before I would be willing to support any such legislature.

>>29310388
Justify psychosurgery.

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>>29313429
thanks fampai y-y-you too

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>>29313792
Come over and lets bang.

If it gets cold I can just throw another body on the fire

>>29313358
Please seek professional mental help. Modren medicine may be able to help, sir. And it might also be wise to remove the bolts from all of your weapons.

>>29307732
Yes.

Mentally ill people are both more likely to be the victims of violent crime, and are less likely to commit violent crime than the average person.

>>29313854
Was meant for sa/k/uya

That would be so cool to have a shemale buddy to hang out and do manly shit then get gay and have gay bucketing in a women package.

>>29313211
11.f "Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective (which includes a determination by a court, board, commission, or other lawful authority that you are a danger to yourself or to others or are incompetent to manage your own affairs) OR have you ever been committed to a mental institution?"
>that you are a danger to yourself or to others
>committed to a mental institution
being forcibly committed covers both bases. It doesn't matter when it happened or the result, if the state does thier job and lets the FBI poke around in state records, on paper for a NICS 4473 you were forcibly committed into a mental institution for observation for _________ mental illness due to being a danger to yourself or others. IE no gunz4U

also the florida baker act has a stipulation that you can't purchase/own firearms (4 ur safety in case you try to kill urself le crocodile tears) after you've been baker acted, even though in a majority of cases it's someone trying to fuck over someone else with the complementary government black bagging and detainment. The rest are nosy cunts who think you're going to kill yourself so use it as a way to "save" you and fuck up your life forever with the black mark of "mentally ill".
>Thanks Florida

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>>29313409
You need to stop masturbating on everything.

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>>29313998
dude by cutting the bangs all fucked up come on

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>>29314031
>dude by cutting the bangs all fucked up come on

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>>29314084
dude its 26 meme come on

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>>29314158
Just control yourself you absolute madman.
You don't want to end up like bowtie.

>>29310456
This anon gets it

>>29314233
Whatever happened to bowtie?

>>29307808
Let's add non whites to this as well. Just to be safe

>>29307732
the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns, wanting to own a gun is a sign of mental illness, the mentally ill should not own guns.

>>29307732
If we had a sensible definition of mental illness, then no. Since we don't, it depends.

>>29313777
There are a few conditions where it is legitimately a useful technique, but other than a few special snowflake conditions where it is useful it isn't necessarily effective for treating mental disorders.

I would NEVER advocate a lobotomy or ablation of any kind unless it was legitimately medically necessary.

Even electro-shock therapy is useful in VERY specific circumstance (for those with extreme depression it used because oddly enough it actually lifts the moods of those people for a day or two, long enough to get them to see a psych, put down the knife, and start a regim one of antidepressants.


I'm very much aware of the abuses my field has performed, and any Psychfag worth his or her salt will be very much aware of the horrors we used to practice out of either ignorance or deliberate manipulation for eugenic or racist purposes. Covering that stuff usually happens at your mid level psych courses when you start going over case studies.

Lobotomies to make people complacent is nazi tier shit that I would never sign off on.

But like any other tool, sometimes it has its uses.

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>>29307732
Yes they should be banned, but only if I am the judge of insanity. And the only way to be sure is to fuck the suspect. It's the only way.

>>29310178
>Sorry, if you're diagnosed with schizo or biopolar

According to the National Alliance on Mental Illness 1 in 4 Americans suffer from mental illness, though only 1 in 17 suffers from a major mental illness such as Schizophrenia or Bipolar disorder.

http://www2.nami.org/factsheets/mentalillness_factsheet.pdf

I'm not saying mental illness shouldn't be a concern especially for the 1 in 17, what I'm saying is the manner in which we determine how to handle those 1 in 4 is something we can't take lightly. Not all mental illness is the same therefore we cannot have a broad sweeping solution that accounts for all mental illness equally. Especially when it encompasses 1/4 of the 300million+ Americans who are ensured the right to gun ownership by the United States Constitution.

>>29310531
>Spoken like a presidential candidate.

I honestly can't tell if that's a compliment, an insult or both.

>>29318471
can i hang wiff ju plees?
homie from murville.

>>29318471
stp
sweet tennessee pussy

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ITT:
>lol who is Thomas Szasz
>lol Rosenhan experiment what's that

>>29308452
YUP

>>29310239
>No, mental illness is not/very poorly linked to violent crime
Correct.

>>29312103
>No fuckign excuse to restrict the entire fuckign population to a pair fucking safety scissors just because a small percentage of people aren't capable of being intelligent and responsible
Also correct

>>29320712
This and >>29317907 this

These anons get it, can't restrict the people to fucking bubblewrap

>>29313744
I am diagnosed with schizophrenia but I have been on medication and haven't had a hallucination for over 3 years. My doctor has actually reduced my prescription and I still don't have any symptoms. I am a safe and responsible gun owner. I don't think my diagnosis should bar me from owning guns if I haven't had symptoms for several years and I am compliant with my medication.

>>29319014
Farragut checking in

>>29311328
>>29311473
>>29311511
>>29313432


I think people need to understand how private versus hospital practices run.

In private practice it's usually a few psychologists (no prescription pad) and a psychiatrist (writes drugs). The psychiatrist mostly acts as a PEZ dispenser while the psychologists do the actual interviews and make recommendations based on that. The psychiatrist may interview someone to double check, but the prescription is basically from the psychologist by proxy.

Hospitals that receive government money however have perverse incentives to keep you on a 3-day hold (pink slip). Most hospitals recieve "need based" grants that are determined by their use. But this need isn't determined by new patients, but rather by hospital beds filled (they tally up patients they have and recieve X number of dollars per patient.)

As a result a pink slip means you can hold someone in a bed for 3 days. That's 3 guaranteed days of sweet government money. Usually they grab drug addicts and homeless people, because inevitably in those 3 days they will have an episode or go through withdrawal (alcohol withdrawal can kill you btw). And people in withdrawal act crazy, so then if you are lucky you can put them on a longer hold.

And since they are homeless or drug addicts, no ones going to notice their absence.

New York is one of the states that has done this.

>>29307808
Its transgender, you fucking shitlord

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>>29311511
You're not alone anon, my sister is trying to file a gun violence restraining order against me

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>mentally ill
>posting Patrick Bateman

Sociopathy is not a mental illness. It is a trait among to the most successful tiers of humanity. Most flag officers are sociopaths.