Operation: Ragheads BTF0

>>27908675
[Citation Needed]

It sounds interesting and all but do you have any links?

>>27908675
Russian Mediterranean Fleet doesn't exist. And this is unlikely to happen without NATO approval. And I am sure that NATO will not approve it.

>>27910085
NATO isn't the UN, there doesn't have to be unanimous agreement for an action. NATO has no veto power.

>>27908675
Is there a reason why Russia mounts their (presumably cruise missiles) in that way? It seems like a much less efficient use of space when compared to US's vertically mounted silo-systems. Does each contain multiple missiles? Are they a particular type that couldn't be easily fixed vertically?

>>27910095
What do Poland, Baltic States and other NATO members threatened by Russia will think about alliance, when major member like France cooperating with Russia? For them Russia is a greater threat than ISIS.

>>27910106
I believe those are the fuck huge, long range, supersonic anti ship missiles.

>>27910106
They were created as "aircraft carrier killer" without ground strike capability.

>>27910106
Russian anti-ship missiles are absolute monsters. Five ton monsters that hit ships at twice the speed of sound.

russia is going to get their helicopter ships from france for this. the french fleet is rendevousing with the russian cruise missle ship now. putin has ordered the ship to co-operate with the french navy.

>>27910143

who cares what they think? they're only value is their location. And they're providing space for bases for free already.

>>27910196

Egypt already agreed to buy Mistral ships built for russia. And russians were eager to take money.

>>27910106
>>27910167
Looks like P500 Basalt or P1000Vulkan

>>27910106
Historically Soviet cruise missiles have been big, like small jet fighter size big in the early variants.
Those missiles are twice as big and more than twice as heavy as a tomahawk.

>>27910202
Fuck you. Poland has more tanks than Germany.

>>27910227
>Fuck you. Poland has more tanks than Germany.

>Counting T-72s

Symbolic? Or can't they increase sorties in Syria. Using cruise missiles seems like a waste of money unless you really need to replace the stock.

>>27910143
Compartimentalisation of threats. Dealing with IS is finaly deemed urgent enough that cooperating with Russia on this specific matter is acceptable, without ignoring that Eastern Europe might be another point of fraction. Everyone so fartries to behave like reasonable people on this and nobody want to make the first move and be the whiny little asshole who will say that he is more scared of a potential threat from Russia than from a recognized one from IS.

>>27910251
Do you mean PT-91 Twardy? It has nothing in common with T-72. It's modernized to NATO standards.

>>27910227

Poland is just another buffer state in the European plain. Know your place.

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>>27910106

There's a considerable size difference:

BGM-109 TOMAHAWK CRUISE MISSILE
-------------------------------------------------
Weight:
2,900 lb (1,300 kg),
3,500 lb (1,600 kg) with booster.

Length:
Without booster: 18 ft 3 in (5.56 m)
With booster: 20 ft 6 in (6.25 m)


P-500 BAZALT CRUISE MISSILE
---------------------------------------------------
Weight 4,800 kg (10,600 lb)
Length 11.7 meter

>>27910288
It would be a mistake. Russia wants NATO divided. Without a common opinion on Russian action. Other opinions should not be tolerated.

>>27910362

An opinion that just happens to come from Poland and their fellows Easterns. You won't trick us so easily.

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>>27910321
>PT-91 Twardy
>It has nothing in common with T-72

go home poland, you're drunk

>>27910333
Buffer state, huh? If Europe tried to defend Poland in 1939 there would be no WWII and Cold War. Up to the Russian border would be a free democratic Europe. But well, fuck Poland. Work so well last time.

>>27910321

>125mm
>Russian ERA
>T-72 parts

its a fine tank, but it has nothing to do with "NATO standards"

>>27910167 >>27910171 >>27910179
>>27910218 >>27910219 >>27910349
Thanks for the info. I guess the anti-ship emphasis plays well with the apparent Russian area denial philosophy.

>>27910397
>>27910414
It's 100% Polish build. Including Polish ERAWA-1\2 ERA.

>>27910398

WWII was inevitable. Hitler's Germany had to invade other countries to sustains its economy or collapse. There was no satisfactory conclusion to that particular strategic position.

>>27910459

well I'm not surprised, poland being legitimate russian clay

>>27910210
did they say no takebacks?

>>27910490
They also circled circled and dot dotted.
They got the cootie shot.

America's blundering in the middle east and general EU globalist jew fuckery is going to hand all of Europe over to Russia.

>>27908675

I don't care if those giant diagonal launch tubes are old/inefficient tech (don't know if they are or not)

but from an aesthetics point of view they make me completely erect

they display a certain sense of FUCK YOU that VLS blocks will never have

>>27910459
>It's 100% Polish build.
Weren't a lot of the T-72s exported to Iraq and Syria 100% Polish built?

>>27910251
A tank is a tank. Having an ok tank is better than none at all.

>>27908675

Could those missile be re configured to target land based targets?

would be hillarious to see them hit a ISIS Toyata parade or dune packed with ISIS grunts

>>27910459
what part of the 125 mm 2A46M is NATO standart?

>>27910574
Nah, Poland exported some T-72M part kits to Saddam back in the day- They weren't even complete and the Iraqis had to build the remaining parts themselves.

>>27910106
Look at the size of the Tubes, particularly length
Now consider the draft of the ship
Do you see the problem?

>>27910511
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miammotPHP4
dont wet yourself

>>27910085
>And this is unlikely to happen without NATO approval
A NATO member, Turkey, is supplying sarin gas and equipment to make more to al-Qaeda in Syria

>>27910085
France is only provisionally part of NATO
>>27910106
Older design
That's from the 80s
Older American ships similarly had their anti ship and tomahawks in external boxes

>>27910881
What kind of ship is it? I've never seen it before.

>>27910196
Was.
That order got cancelled because Crimea
EGYPT is now buying them
>Egypt will have LHD wtf

>>27910288
And with turkey aiding them and supplying sarin and being on Russia's border that's also something they want to contain

>>27910362
Russia does not want NATO on its border
Would you want a hostile military force on your border?
Would you like Russians based in Mexico or Canada?

Back when the Soviet Union broke up they allowed a reunified Germany to join NATO on the condition that NATO not extend to the east

Murika immediately broke that promise

Why does NATO even exist anymore? Cold War is long gone.
Now its an intervention force for energy resources.
And murika is using it to encircle Russia to cut off its gas and oil pipelines

>>27910940
Kebab is gonna kebab.

>>27911002
>Would you want a hostile military force on your border?
The only reason NATO is "hostile" towards Russia is that Russia keeps invading nations around them...

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>>27911002
Why should Russia care if other nations want to join NATO? They have the choice to decided what they want. Cold war thinking is over, they are not buffert states.

>And murika is using it to encircle Russia to cut off its gas and oil pipelines
>mfw readimg that

>>27911002
Well maybe Russia wouldn't have all these problems with their neighbors shifting over to NATO if they hadn't kept all of Eastern Europe as a massive open-air prison for almost half a century.

>>27911023
>behave belligerently and hostile for years trying to provoke a reaction
>finally push things too far
>you see everyone! He's a threat! A menace! I have to behave this way or you're all doomed!

>>27911042
>why should russia care if other nations want to join NATO
They've been invaded and almost wiped out by Western Europe several times now
Oil and gas pipelines
Sphere of influence

>>27911042
>They have the choice to decided what they want. Cold war thinking is over, they are not buffert states.
You think if the governments chose not to join NATO they'd be in power for much longer after that decision?

>>27911042
>he doesn't know about the pipelines

>>27911053
Which nations? Iraq?

>>27911069
>You think if the governments chose not to join NATO they'd be in power for much longer after that decision?
Yes.

>>27911082
Post it.

vids time I guess
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqdH3mPqhKI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eezq7ZVIeVA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iACmlYV_C5E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUgHSHMDwX8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jen03xMnsq0
some sound porn at 2:50:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oipmvdJEMLc
some hits:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7QHlFrBrH_Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pu9ZjC4EdDc

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>>27910288
>Compartimentalisation of threats.
Fucking this

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>>27911044
>provocation

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>>27911088
>what nations? Iraq?
I that supposed to be some sort of ruseman?
>Yes
Soros.jpg
>post it
You could fucking google russian oil and gas pipelines yourself

>>27911002
Why does NATO exist.
Cause it's mutually beneficial for every member?
Why would you not want to be part of the most powerful organization on earth

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>>27910961

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bora-class_guided_missile_hovercraft

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>>27911128
>I that supposed to be some sort of ruseman?
Oh were you talking about the Nazis? Well they are dead.

>>27911160
>guided missile hovercraft
>guided missile
>hovercraft
What are you doing Ivan!?

>>27911209
...Of going fast, is all. You have problem?

>>27911175
Only one of the several times

Well, with any luck the Jihadists of the twenties are gonna be too busy in Moscow and Yekaterinburg to bother "the west".

>>27910143
It's not much of an alliance, it's just that they both want the same guys bombed at the moment. And those guys are hardly anyone Ukraine, Poland, etc are very fond of. If anything they should be happy about the Russian shift in focus form eastern Europe to the middle east. And if they get really lucky Putin makes himself a new Afghan-style quagmire to drown his domestic popularity and political authority in.

>>27911002
>Back when the Soviet Union broke up they allowed a reunified Germany to join NATO

Russia has no business deciding the foreign policy of other countries. Germany joining NATO was between Germany and NATO. And so on for the other countries that joined, or are considering joining, NATO.

And let's not forget that the Russia thinking it can dictate things like NATO membership for its neighbours is exactly why those neighbours want to be part of NATO. They have been under the sway of the guy in the east, and as a result they're buying guns and looking for friends in the west. Especially as Putin restores the good old USSR tyranny.

It isn't the USA that drives NATO expansion, but the newcomers who where banging on the door wanting to get in.

>Why does NATO even exist anymore? Cold War is long gone.

As Georgia and Ukraine have noticed, there is no longer any reason to worry about Moscow deciding to invade you.

There's also no need to hit the Russian pipelines, just phrack down the oil and gas prices instead and hit Russia, Iran and Venezuela with a single blow. And if you really want to hurt them, sell some new guns to the Saudis in return for them opening the valves even more.

>>27911002
>russians based in Mexico

Tfw an entire country turns into an alcohol with a gun problem.

>>27911214
Its in the Caspian Sea! There's nowhere to go!

>>27911253

...so basically nothing changes at all?

>>27911254

Black sea. It still can weeeeeeee past the t*rks.

>>27911142

Because it allows leeches to downsize their military budgets confident that the Americans won't.

>>27911263
Its only at halfway alcohol atm

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>>27911226
Jesus fucking christ, how far back into history are you going to go to justify russian actions in a post cold war era?

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>>27911209

Btw norway has crafts of similar design - a sea/river minesweeper and patrol boats.

Skjold-class look like they belong ON TRACKS. My autism demands it. Imagine the awesomeness of this thing crawling through a marsh or shallow river ON TRACKS.

>>27911278
And those leeches increases your power projection tenfolds and increases your influence massively, quite the symbiotic relation.

More important question:
Why does the US have a defence budget that is 9 times larger than Russias?

>dat ship
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lVDyz8Ij1JE
Go to 1 min and 7 sec.

>>27911247
>Russia has no business deciding the foreign policy of other countries.
And what business does the USA have deciding the domestic policy of foreign nations?
Overthrowing governments to ensure "a more favourable investment climate"?
"I don't see why we should allow Chile to go communist just because of the irresponsibility of its people"
Etc

>Its between them and NATO
>Russia has no say on the matter of NATO bases and American military deployments in its region and right on its border
So you wouldn't mind someone in the Americas inviting Russian troops in then?

They want to be part of NATO because of bribes and kickbacks

>it isn't the use that drives NATO expansion
Lel

>As Georgia and Ukraine have noticed, there is no longer any reason to worry about Moscow deciding to invade you.
You're still using the same circular reasoning here.
"we had to expand NATO because one day Russia would not be comfortable to NATO bases right on their border and react strongly"
Georgia was murika fucking around for pipelines
>prices
Is not about that
Its about control
You control it you decide where it goes
>phracking
Oh good even more environmental destruction, who needs a water table anyway amirite
>sell more guns to the financier and supplier of al-Qaeda
You really are brazenly retarded

>>27911285

well at least they wont cut heads as eagerly as they do now, being full gun problem while only half alcohol.

For Poland, the existence of a powerful Germany and Russia poses an existential problem. The ideal solution is to become a buffer state respected by both Berlin and Moscow. A less desirable solution is an alliance with one of the two for protection. This is difficult because the high chance of being defacto absorbed or occupied. The third solution, pursued in actuality, is finding an outside power (US) that guarantee its interests.

>>27911278
>hurr durr murika pays for yuropoors defence
People really believe this shit

>>27911308
>it's the current year

>>27911308
You lose 28 million dead and see how long it takes to forget
That's the psychology they're operating under

>>27911320
Why is its defence budget 50 of the worlds total spending?

>>27911308
Russian media went past Karl XII quite a while ago, they're be at least back in the middle ages by now, and don't expect them to slow down before 3000BC.

Strangely enough though, they haven't shown nearly as much enthusiasm about returning Petsamo, Salla and Karelia to Finland as they did about grabbing Crimea.

>>27911337

If the US pulled out of NATO today and shut down all it's bases in Europe, EU military expenditure would double by the end of the week,

checkmate
m8

8

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>>27911320
>Why does the US have a defence budget that is 9 times larger than Russias?
Because they did not become poor.

>>27911346
But that's world war 2... How important is when a french frog went crazy and invaded everyone and russia?

>>27911355
Cold war 2.0 is real

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>>27911310
Better off giving them tracks and give them to the army, the båtforsvar is useless

>>27911002
NATO aren't hostile to Russia. They are a defensive alliance, not offensive.

>>27911356
Problem is, nobody wants to be the guy who tells the public that their tax money will be spend on a military that wouldn't be able to stop Russia no matter how big the budget is. Wars and such are really things that are far away from the average voter's mind at least in this country.

>>27911353
This isn't the case. Chinese defense spending alone, including all their hidden spending, is 50% of U.S. spending.

>>27911263

There's going to be a massive change.

Imagine how 100 million Mexicans are going to react to drinking Vodka instead of Tequila

>>27911002
>ignoring the fact that the reason why all the former pact countries wanted to join NATO was because Russia kept threatening them and trying to openly interfere with domestic politics

I always loved this about vatniks.

>>27911320
>Why does the US have a defence budget that is 9 times larger than Russias?

Because they are a LOT richer. Russia blew 4.5% of its GDP on the defence budget last year, the USA spent 3.5%.

>>27911376
>wouldn't be able to stop Russia no matter how big the budget is.

Just stop overestimating Russias power. They'd get stomped in a conventional war now and up collapsing from the inside.

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>>27911375

o shit

>>27911417
What are you implying?

>>27911397

they don't have to give up agava completely. Just alternate, day by day. Vodka will balance out their violent mirth, make them sadder and more placid.

Either they'll go full shizo or just become normal well-mannered and intelligent christian people.

>>27911331
True dat holmes

>>27911356
Except it wouldn't
You've just got the murika military spending fixation that you need more and more until so much is being devoted to it that the rest of society is falling apart to feed it

All the major European players have 2+ divisions, advanced navies, airforces, and two of them have nukes
Who is Russia going to threaten? And how? And why?

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Conventional forces are terribly expensive. Much cheaper to just press a button.

>>27911375
Lel

>>27911440

I imply that NATO framework is routinely used to bandwagon its members into whatever US fancies bombing at the moment.

Dont wave your articles at me - they were never enacted.

>>27911456

*snort*

There's nothing more expensive than a nuclear war.

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>>27911310

Had a work mission in the drydocks where they make em

well did make em since they are at hold now

in the breaks i tried to balance ontop of the turret barrel was tricky but i managed it

the dock chief just lauged at it since the boat had been a landwhale for the past 4 years

we stuck a brooom in the barrel before we left the dock

>>27911382
>including all their hidden spending
You mean like how murika engages in all kinds of creative accounting to hide its true budget?
Like getting the department of energy to pay for its nuclear weapons stockpile?
Like the airforce getting NASA to do advanced aerospace R&D?

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>>27911456
Are you sure that'll be cheaper if we add in the costs for rebuilding after the enemy dumps it's MAD-arsenal on us in retaliation? Because that seems like it could get expensive.

>>27911441
>Either they'll go full shizo or just become normal well-mannered and intelligent people that worship "La Santa Muerte"

Ftfy.

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>>27911353

>>27911516
China's is much more than that.

But then again, so is America's.

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>>27911489

such is life in norway shipyard, I guess

http://www.tomdispatch.com/blog/175361/tomgram%3A_chris_hellman,_$1.2_trillion_for_national_security/
A better look at the defence budget

>>27911531
I would agree with you on murika
Any source on china?

>>27911414
We're a tiny fucking country, we send 750ish guys to Helmand and became the largest manpower contributer Per capita to ISAF.

At Best our military spending helps fight for the interests of our larger allies at worst we'll be a speed bump for NATO. That's really not an easy prospect to sell when people would rather have money spend on the country. Most people can't appreciate the national pride swelling in one's heart when four F-16s outperform the RAF and Royal Navy in Libya.

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>>27911612
Estonia? Is that you?

>>27911612
>pride in other people's acomolishments that you contributed to to in no way

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>>27911628
props Denmark considering he mentioned Helmand

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>>27911346
They lost 28 million because they were fucking retards on the tactical, strategical and political level.
Slavs gonna slav.

>>27911571
http://www.defense.gov/Portals/1/Documents/pubs/2015_China_Military_Power_Report.pdf

This estimate put them at !$160 billion for 2014. An estimate from the Stockholm institute put them potentially above $200 billion dollars however.

It's fairly difficult to estimate for a variety of reasons. For one thing China tends to omit a bunch of spending that other nations would include in their defense budget. There's also the fact of it's "internal security" spending, which there's basically no information on but is estimated to possibly rival it's public defense budget in size.

>>27911612
Denmark, not too far off.

>>27911630
I had to say something Nice about the military, i'm using their wifi and they log everything.

#conscriptlife

Still, it was a bit like beating the in sports or something, especially since Lord West had just been talking shit in the median and got BTFO.

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>>27911655
>>27911670
http://www.rs.nato.int/images/media/PDFs/141103estoniab.pdf
>nah it's Estonia

Also they are pretty much danger close to the Russians.

>>27911327
>They want to be part of NATO because of bribes and kickbacks
Are you serious? We from baltics had to be very persistent asking to join NATO. The first time we asked to join was like in 1994. No big nations wanted us here. Only counters like Denmark supported us. It took us 10 years for us to join. I still remember that day, when air police jets landed on our soil. Nothing feels better than knowing that Abrams and Bradleys are here on our soil. There aren't many of them, but it still feels good.

>Its about control
>You control it you decide where it goes
And that's none of Russian business. Georgia should be free to do what it wants

>>27911783
To be fair..I Don't really want to die for Georgia so, let's not get them into NATO

>>27911837
yeah, Russia is quite successful in frozen conflicts. Neither Ukraine nor Georgia are in position to join NATO. Also the problem is, that Ukrainians are hot-blooded and Georgians are even more hot-blooded (those Caucasians are often crazy). They could make some mess for NATO. But they still should have a chance to join.

>>27910349


>Weight 4,800 kg (10,600 lb)
>Length 11.7 meter

those are big missiles

>>27911914
>They could make some mess for NATO

Not particularly. One can only invoke Article V when you have been attacked first.

This is all fine but when does WW3 finally start

>"We're going to look for them everywhere wherever they are hiding. We will find them in any place on Earth and punish them."

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>>27912134
some also have titanium armor. against shrapnel AA rockets

>>27911660
That's not the issue, the issue is a ton of people dead

>>27911663
160 billion is still peanuts compared to Americas stated and unofficial budget
>For one thing China tends to omit a bunch of spending that other nations would include in their defense budget
Same thing murika does see the tomdispaitch

>>27911783
>other countries should be free to carry out murikas imperial grand strategy
>Russia can have no objection to this
>you cannot object to being surrounded by hostile military bases and your resources isolated
Muh imperialism

>>27908675
>Russian Medteranian Fleet

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>>27911320
Cause were defending a bunch of free loading Asians and Europeans.

Fuck em all. Let china and Russia play king shit for the next fifty years.
Then maybe all those whiny ass do nothing's will appreciate American protection.

>>27911044
>behave belligerently and hostile for years trying to provoke a reaction

Name one.

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>>27911042
>Why should Russia care if other nations want to join NATO?

In Russia mind any of the "buffer states" that do not want Russia's boot on their neck is secretly plotting Russia's downfall.

See what happened to Ukraine.

>>27911451
>Who is Russia going to threaten? And how? And why?

Have you not been paying attention to world events of the last 2 years?

>>27911451

Except it would

>>27915170
For real, fuck this noise.

>"Amyeriyaka, why don't you do anything to stop the terrorists?! Have you no heart!?"
>America proceeds to bomb insurgent targets, but because the insurgents hide behind innocents and unarmed, innocent people die
>"AMYERIKA! YOU AMS KILLING INNOCNETS! YOU ARE MONSTER!"

Fuck 'em.

>>27909986
Submarines 30mins out

>>27915423
>Be delusional amerifat unaware that his military hits random targets just for fun, killing tens of thousands of people
>hurr why could anyone dislike me for being a fat, ignorant, piece of shit? Or for murdering their friends & family members?

>>27915366
By a strange coincidence, all democratic NGOs funded by the West, have a negative attitude to Russia.

>>27911783

Cannon fodder.

>>27912134
for you

>>27910196
inb4 Russia sinks all those ships France stole from them and didn't refund. They've been very quiet about it and it's going to be twice as funny when it happens in a war zone.

>>27915366

Want to know WHY Russia thinks that? When you have your number 1 enemy and counter ops nation setting up AA and anti-missile batteries in those buffer states while going YOU ARE THE BAD GUY YOU SHOULDNT HAVE THOSE, it tends to make you paranoid.

Even with Russia putting boots in Syria and fighting ISIS, the US and EU started crying because their entire campaign crumbled as a result since Russia doesn't give a fuck about moderates. They want Syria to be Assad and the Middle East to be stable. They don't want constant warfare because that means bullshit like the past month happening.

>>27911783
I am from Denmark, we have a permanent airbase in one of those baltic countries. I wish you fuckers would stop trying to hack everything, steal our money, steal our fucking jet fuel, steal our ammo, steal everything in our section of the airbase that isn't nailed to the fucking floor.

Also, i fail to see why russia should be any less jingoistic than us.

>>27917643
bymxxypm )))))

>>27917687
The French repaid the Russians.

>>27917713
This is some devil invocation in Old Estonian?

>>27911142
>most powerful
That would be the international banana company

>>27917925
It means "Please let us be scandinavians"

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>>27910106
Oh yes, yes there is.

>>27911783
Feels good to finally be appreciate. Thanks Baltic bros

>>27917709
They did the same in afghanistan. when the Norwegian QRF had to move out in full force the Estonians in MES stole everything.
Happens when you recruit scum

>>27918400
even more intimidating is the idea that they were designed to be launched in swarms of 8-10 with all missiles controlled independently and flying at different altitudes to various targets, with the highest of them providing recon info to the lowers

itt retards with no concept of geopolitics talk some shit.

>>27917696
>constantly remind everyone you have nukes
>constantly buzz everone with strategic bombers
>have a long history of oppressing your neighbors
>BYLAT WESTERN AGGRESSION! STOP TRYING TO DEFEND YOURSELF!!!

Meanwhile in Ukraine.

>>27919800
>constantly remind everyone you have nukes
>constantly buzz everone with Aircraft carriers
>have a long history of bombing your friends
> FUCKING RUSSIAN AGGRESSION! STOP TRYING TO DEFEND YOURSELF!!!

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154KB, 690x960px

>>27919800
>>27919854
Cold war was one huge 4chan-tier shitposing circlejerkfest. At last I truly see.

>>27909986

Now being reported by mainsteam sources:

>http://www.wsj.com/articles/global-anti-isis-alliance-begins-to-emerge-1447806527
>http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/11/18/world/europe/russia-plane-crash-bomb.html
>http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN0T22IU20151117

>>27919854
"buzz with aircraft carriers"

"long history of bombing your friends"

Ah, I see the slav ministry of truth is up.

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>>27919854
>Bombs & Occupies Germany
Lets be allies America-desu
>Bombs & Occupies Japan
Lets be allies America-desu
>Bombs & Occupies Korea
Lets be allies America-desu
>Bombs & Occupies, Ultimately BTFO of Vietnam
Lets be allies America-desu

And it's been like that decades afterwards. Meanwhile every single place Russia has bombed and occupied kek'd Russia as soon as possible and got all warm and cuddly with the States. We're just better empires builders than slavboos.

>>27919800
>>27911042
Look at the Russian perspective and what's happening, the US is developing an anti ballistic missile shield, and NATO is encroaching on Russia's western and southern flank, couple with they don't trust the west not to attack, and then you have a scenario they don't want to be in.
So when you see what's happening it's not to crazy to see why they're doing this.
Also while Eastern Europe's historical fear can be justified, Russian historical expansion can be as well. Cause Russia doesn't have any natural barriers to anchor on and a lot of their history is about surviving invasion after invasion by out lasting and bleeding their enemy's out, at great costs.
These experiences burn deep, and influence actions. So they expanded into anchors and create buffer zones. This is why histrionically the Russian leadership has been so focused on security, cause in turn it means survival.
What it really comes down to is nothing is black and white, and both sides can look to history for justification.

ITT: Western Europe is being islamized and retards arguing about muh russia and muh nato.