Elona General

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So I got a living weapon but it's made of a low tier material and doesn't seem to have many stats. What should I do with it? I started the game only recently so I have no idea what things are like endgame.

In the last thread another anon with a living weapon said he would bank it until Lost Irva and use artifact fusion on it before leveling the thing, but I'm not sure if it's worth doing that since my weapon is bronze and also only Miracle instead of Godly. I'd love some advice on this matter - for reference I haven't started main quest (gone into Lesimas) yet since I don't want to fuck up and die.

>>15219066
>Literally autism the game

>>15219114
Whips are actually decent weapons in my book. Mainly because of that remote blow. Whereas a common problem of melee is to well...get in melee range bringing you into contact with all sorts of nasty stuff, a whip allows said person to engage either in melee or at range.

The material might not be anything to write home about but that's ok. You should be able to use a material kit on it in the future to up its damage. Preferably ether or adamantium. That's what I did for my living light sabers to up their damage.

Godly will allow you to put more stuff on it for artifact fusion but...heh, that could be a double edged sword from what I'm finding. I'll probably post more about this soon. I'm finding it to be insanely expensive to fill my living weapons with what I want through artifact fusion so you might be able to get by with miracle.

For now, I'd just store it away until you're much farther in the game. You won't be able to access artifact fusion for quite awhile anyhow. It's still worthwhile to keep imo. Even if you do find something stronger later, If you won't use it give it to your pet or if you're not going to use it for damage it still can be used as a "resist stick" where you fill your living weapon with resists when you level it.

>>15219185
Only if you let it be.

No one's forcing you to do the same thing over and over again. Most people do whatever they feel like at the time.

>>15219203
just report and move on anon.

>>15219114
I thought you could reroll the material on a miracle weapon with material scrolls? Or does it being a living weapon make that impossible?

>>15219257
I never report anyone for anything. Moderation is already too strict here.

>>15219257
Not him but I found that I could change the material with scrolls for miracle lightsabers. When I tried to do so with living lightsabers it didn't work so I had to go with a material kit. I'm guessing living weapons might be a bit different.

>>15219114
>I haven't started main quest (gone into Lesimas)
Do it now. The first floors will be a walk in the park with level 37 and you get some nice goodies out of it.

>>15219198
That's an interesting take on the weapon - I haven't had any real chance to use melee since my pets got swole without me and tend to kill mobs before I can get in melee range.

I haven't thought about the "resist stick" stacking - that's a brilliant idea. I'm guessing resists matter a lot more later on.

>>15219257
That's the first thing I tried after taking the screenshot and it just said "Nothing happens..."

>>15219304
I'll definitely give it a go, though my squishy pets do 10x my damage so I'm still fairly wary with going into dungeons.

>>15219400
You can literally clear the vanilla storyline as a level 37 anon, you're worrying way too much.

>>15219198
Artifact fusion isn't feasible if you aren't willing to put in exorbitant amounts of time in order to gather all the necessary materials - which is made worse if the component you're looking for is the monthly quest one.

Is the end product worth it? It's debatable. Some could argue that there's no real need for a maximum artifact fusioned set, especially if you're not looking to go far past the general act 3. Without making assumptions about anyone's playstyles, artifact fusion should be seen not as a necessity, but rather as an eventuality. Something you designate as a pet project when you feel like it.

In that sense, it's not a "double edged sword" at all. The materials used for assembling components doesn't come at a cost of other things, and if you're looking to minmax, you're never going to surpass the potential that a godly living weapon can provide, especially now that living weapons have a hard cap and you can't abuse the mat kit revamp ad infinitum.

Generally by the time you get to fusing Godly equips, you're pretty much at the end of the line, item wise.

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Never ever will we get ELIN. What did we do to forever get cuck'd by NoA?

My shopkeeper is stuck at full/bloated status and hasn't eaten in months: even if I throw cursed potions at it to cause vomiting, she still is registered by the game as "full" and refuses to eat.

>>15220105
I suspect that she might be a golem or a robot. Nothing wrong with having a golem or a robot shopkeeper.

>>15220105
Other anon is way too optimistic. Have you checked her pulse? You might have an undead problem on your hands. She might be a vampire and in that case you know what needs to be done.

>>15220149
Take her to the local well and get her impregnated while looking for the legendary wish fairy?

my lv 58 wizard savefile just got corrupted for the 2nd time

hold me /jp/

>>15220367
Make backups, nerd.

>>15220372
i do, but it was from back when i was lv 30 with shit stats and spells, i think i will take a break from elona and play again someday

>>15220379
Elosnack it back

>>15219828
The guy who drew this one dun goofed some time ago. Since Noa wasn't the only one working on the game, this may be the reason. Or not, who knows.

>>15220367
>>15220379
You should make a backup every time you update the game

>>15220367
Make sure you save in town before you update. A lot of people get corrupted saves from trying to update while their save is in a dungeon.

>>15219185
All the touhou threads on /jp/ are okay but we can't have one fairly slow general of Elona?

>>15219185
>uuu noone likes my shit music((9
Literally kek.
>>15222282
Shouldn't you save in outdoor random maps or in other non-permanent maps for updating?

What's a good pet to use an Another Heart on?

>>15223047
The whole saving in town before an update as a precaution could be found in various changelogs. Whether or not this is still needed I don't know but it's better to be safe than sorry. Examples noting that you should do your save in town can be found in the version_en text file that comes with the game. Should find it in the Elona folder.

As for saving in a dungeon then updating corrupting saves. I speak from experience and also from others who did the same thing.

>>15220134
She's just a regular Juere Swordsman, sadly.

I think I narrowed the cause down: Going through my weekly backups it looks like the perma-bloat started happening after I put a cursed cloak with bloodsucking and random teleport on her.

I uncursed the item and unequipped it from her but the perma-bloat is still stuck. Killing her didn't fix it either.

>>15223158
Have you tried looking at her fullness (offset 88) in cdata.s1 with elosnack? Is it negative, or is it a large value >15000? Try running the game, then saving, then pressing the reload button and see if her fullness changes.

To find her, go to the one with mob id 235 at offset 108.

>>15223081
Littler girl has cheer and is extra cute. The traditional choice would be to make a snail into a slug, then when you get a machine heart upgrade it to a metalslug.

>>15223158
I don't think NPCs that stay home eat ever, since I remember ausculating a younger sister that I left there for the sake of having some NPCs wandering around and her hp bar was always pink. Probably the same for shopkeepers?

>>15223047
>uuu noone likes my shit music((9

That wasn't me. I was going to bitch about the janitors in the next OP, though.

Maybe I'm just being super lazy but man, trying to use allies is a massive chore.

I've got a set of bells that wreck shit, but I tried to limit myself so I could have fun by getting some more varied allies, a smash ogre, demon, and a zombie girl. Not only are they all slower than me, but their skill potentials were almost 0 when I got them. Trained them at the dojou but they still suck hard at staying alive.

I probably should've seen this coming and am just being lazy. Is there a better way to do this? Maybe I choose the wrong monsters too. I might just keep going solo.

>>15227425
how far in the game are you ?
early on, everything is in short supply so training pets can be a burden

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>>15227456
I'm at South Tyris, done a little bit of the quest there but not much.

>>15227459
>28 years old
>only 5'2 feet tall
>86 pounds

>>15227469
I know, right? I've played this guy since he was like, 18 so I dunno what happened.

>>15227425
For allies with low potential you need to fill up a kitty bank with a few hundred k then throw it at them. Alternatively, pot of fusion some gems and hand it to them.

>>15227511
So money is the best way to train potentials then?

>>15227519
That's the way to go, yes. Money is a lot easier to get than herbs and since you can't train your own potential with money, I never use herbs on my pets. All of them still have superb potentials in everything just from me occasionally feeding them fusioned ores.

>>15227528
Alright, I'll go for that then. What about training speed? They're all really slow too, atleast compared to me.

>>15227543
My pets all train way faster than me. Your pets most likely appear to have slow training speed because you never raised their low potentials.

>>15227519
Gene engineer Pickpocket into your pets and they'll get gold for defeating enemies.

Mining/Fishing and some other skills let pets collect materials after defeating an enemy.

>>15227548
Ah, no, I meant like getting their speed up. I've got potions of speed upper but those aren't easy to come by.

>>15227564
ap then herbs and pots

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Alright, finally finished the artifact fusion part of my living lightsabers. Moving on to leveling them now. My lightsabers are miracle level so 2500 artifact power limit. Was able to fit darkness bot, magic damage, and element scar. Suits me fine that it's miracle instead of godly. Was struggling with what else I could attach to it that would give me the most bang for the time investment/cost. While I would imagine one might be glad to have a godly level item it's a double edge sword in the way that a person now gets to look forward to spending even more time farming mats. This may or may not bother you. For me, I intend to supply at least two pets(one dual wielding, and another with tons of hands) and the farming for mats will actually be a matter of concern.

Let's talk about cost. To get all of that on my blades took 120 sox, 12 gain attribute scrolls, and 8 months to pass. Both the attribute scrolls cost and the sox cost were the most painful for me but the sox cost surprised me the most and I'm a bit bitter about. Here I thought that all the sox I had been saving since the change of no longer being able to exchange them for growth scrolls would take me further. Unfortunately, that Urcaguary has a fiendish addiction to sox. Blew out my entire stash of sox. I'm all ears if anyone has a suggestion of a good way to farm sox. I currently just find them off of dungeon floors and every now and then off monsters I kill. No map resetting or snacking suggestions please.

If there is no real effective way to farm sox then I'll probably forego the sox related enchants all together in the future. I find the enchants where you just need to wait a month much easier. Instead of magic damage for future living lightsabers, I'll probably will fill it with resists, darkness bolt, and element scar. The element scar will be helpful for the lightning, fire, and ice damage I'll add through leveling the thing. Weapons will be for my pets but element scar should help me out as well since I cast elemental spells on my character.

>>15227894
Add two ether material kits to the cost as well.

>>15227894
Wait, are sox important? I NPC'd all the sox and panties I found.

>>15227894
Have you tried stuffing your house with blacksmithes for socks ? Takes 3 days to restock

>>15228164
Haven't seen sox before on a blacksmith but then again, since sox is a weapon in this game, it would make sense for them to be sold by them. My house is stuffed with magic vendors so I'll have to to invest in the blacksmiths I find in towns. Thanks for the suggestion. I'll get started in investing in blacksmiths or investing more into the ones I may have already invested in.

>>15228152
They're important for certain fusions. Like the magic damage fusion is gotten by using a jewel tear of god. Can only get said jewel tear by doing a repeatable quest for Urcaguary that deals with bringing her 30 sox. More information can be found here:

http://elona.wikia.com/wiki/Artifact_fusion

>>15228152
30 sox per jewel tear of god. Get collecting!

http://elona.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_from_knight_level_150

>>15227894
In general, thief-type enemies at the right level (ninjas, red ninjas, and best of all diabolic clowns) hold stealable sox maybe 1/3 of the time. The trouble is finding those enemies reliably. Wiki'ers also allege you can find them off summoned pudding spirits.

>>15228264
Neat. I'll definitely keep my eyes open for those enemies now to steal from. Definitely will look into seeing if those sox are on those puddings too. Thanks.

Note for Anna
Using young lady as a pet, if you tag her with someone or yourself the custom AI breaks for some reason.. not sure why. The broken AI persists afterwards until it randomly fixes itself at some later time

Specifically it looks like its throw major potion itself that bugs up and wont work, everything else seems to work. This is somehow triggered by something when tagging

>>15227894
I've had my blacksmith invested in for years and I've only seen a few socks. They feel about half as rare as flying scrolls (in otherwords they barely ever show up.) You'll get lots more by rolling through dungeons... I think certain undead have a fair chance to drop them but I can't for the life of me remember which ones they are. I considered setting up a bunch of ranches and breading them but never quite got round to it.

>>15227894
Unless you're willing to save scum, generally assembling a full Godly equipment set takes time in the order of years. Getting a full set of Godly equipment without save scumming to begin with is moderately time consuming. Possibly more if you happen to be relatively low speed and have terrible RNG luck.

Blacksmith save scumming is pretty much the easiest way to get socks, but if you consider save scumming out of the question, then you're in for the long grind. Very specific monsters will show up with sox, but in your level range, you're going to have trouble farming them reliably to begin with, since presumably you're grinding in the Void. There are no "high range" monsters that have a guaranteed sox drop.

Artifact fusion was intended to be the end game time waster while Act 3's story continued to be developed, so if anything, your observations just confirm that the system is working. Personally I'd argue that Rainbow Living Weapons (Scattered elements) aren't as good as Resist Living Weapons but that's something that needs source code numbers to confirm.

At your point in the game, everything is essentially a long grind. From capping stats out at 2k to hitting caps on all skills, pretty much there's nothing that's going to not be painful if you dislike grinding. For people who love grinding it's arguably the best part of the game once the story is out of the way...and far too easy.

I don't really see it as a double edged sword considering there's no real drawback - but I can understand that the grind can wear down on people.

>>15229004
The Diabolic Joker and Assassin Lizard enemies tend to have sox on them. I think the Pudding Spirit thing was because the Spirit is a Thief class NPC, and it seems based on limited sample testing that Thief classes seem to show up with sox slightly more often.

Blacksmith sox farming essentially needs save scumming to get results. Otherwise they're about as rare as pot of potentials on magic merchants. I don't know, maybe eventually they'll put sox in a crafting recipe as well, but for now sox is basically end game farming.

>>15229257
I wish they were as rare as pots of potential. I get pots of potential roughly 1/5 of the time. Sox on the other hand aren't even close to that1/200 maybe?

I've notice I vomit and lose weight when I eat bad food but what food make me gain weight? Is weight a purely cosmentic stat?

>>15231025
Personally I've never had that much of an issue savescumming out sox, but if you're really facing that much of an issue then going up and down between some of the lower level Voids is probably a better idea. Pretty easy to just hop between a couple floors up and down repeatedly when the enemies can't hurt you anyways.

>>15231838
Don't think there's any specific food that pushes weight up, so just keep eating and don't eat rotten/cursed stuff...or drink too many pots. If you let it fall too low you get anorexia, which in early game can be pretty disastrous if you try to ignore it.

>>15231853
How low are we talking here? I'm not early game and I am eating a lot, I'm just a Juere so I don't need to that much so pushing my weight up is kinda hard.

>>15231859
I was just testing alchemy training with snow.
Got anorexia around 30 vomit or so.

Is snow the best way to train alchemy btw ? I feel like i'll be stuck anorexic for a full year if i do that

>>15231859
I don't think weight has to do with anorexia, only how frequently you vomit. I got anorexia after vomiting like 20 times in a row and it was quite irritating to only be able to drink juice for a while. If you don't have a juice mixer, being anorexic could be disastrous.

>>15231937
I just trained alchemy gradually by throwing all the potions I got and keeping potential up. I also throw potions at myself every couple of turns if possible so I'm constantly wet for swimming to train/give me speed boost.

>>15231947
each time you vomit, your vomit count goes +1
each time you sleep, it goes -1
if you go too high you get anorexia and to get rid of it you need to get to 0

>>15229004
>>15229207
Thanks for the information.

>>15231937
I dunno. I just gradually upped alchemy by dungeon trawling for mats, then crafting, and upping potential when it was low.

Do Dominion's make good pets? They've got that elemental shield spell for those resitances and decent speed too.

>>15234104
Depends. That speed means their INI is going to be moderately high, so it could make early AP grinding an issue. While elemental shield is useful, it's not necessarily the most important thing - it really depends on the rest of your squad/equipment. It also depends on how you're going to get them, whether you're going to monster ball them down or burn an astral light pen on them.

There are better options speed wise, though the Attribution is pretty neat, it's not going to be great unless you keep the Dominion on custom AI. For a level 100 the rest of its stats are pretty normal, nothing too great to speak of.

Having a quick evo is pretty nice though.

Since the changes made in e+ it's been a lot easier to make "good pets" than before and a lot more pets became viable. It's really now about how much investment you're willing to make, as well as what kind of team you're looking to assemble.

>>15234176
I've got a squad of bells, but they're never very fun to travel with so I usually keep them on standby.

What I'm looking to build is a pet that can function as my only pet, I wanna roam around with one companion and team up with them to lay down beatings.

I was looking at stuff like Vishnu and pets with good speed to match mine, but it's a real process. I've been traveling solo for a while so my level has grown quite a bit since I last used pets, so with all the new enemies I've been fighting I'm pretty out of the loop about their specifics. I'll have to spend some time on the wiki.

Is there any sort of guide about custom AI though? I've seen it and tried fiddling around with it but when it comes to the details I'm totally lost.

>>15234219
Bells get outclassed quite a bit by the time you hit the 80 - 100 dungeons because of higher tier bells as well as Sat-units. Not relying on them is generally for the best unless you're playing a specialist character that doesn't fight or something. The main issue then is a matter of AP.

Even in Act 2 you get already get speed up to 500 just by grinding AP, so honestly that starting 270 might be nice, but it's not a massive game changer.

In the event that you're looking at a single pet, having Attribution is nice, but it definitely isn't the end all be all, especially if you're not using custom AI - since the Dominion has several other abilities that can take priority over it using Attribution. In terms of a solo partner, you'd want somebody who can ideally heal you - a res would be nice, but only one partner can technically res you (Defender) so hopefully you never get to the point where you need that anyways. The Dominion is "moderate" in terms of support, but really lacks a strong healing option - and the default AI tends to leave them just sitting up in the front lines, which may/may not be what you want. The healing part you can technically remedy with custom AI learning, but it will require a bit of investment on your part.

I personally think that if you're looking to invest a substantial amount into a single partner, then a lower AP partner is actually better than a higher one - the stat difference can be made up for with herbed food and potential kept high. (Again, you can actually use custom AI to teach Attribution Shield)

Anna's explanation page on the wiki for custom AI is pretty straightforward, have you read through it, and was there something you didn't understand?

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I'll put these scissors to good use. Next on the hit list: Urcaguary.

>>15234425
Do these scissors mean I can replace the entire farm with grass tiles and not have to deal with plants not regrowing when off farmland?

>>15234512
All the scissors do is ensure replant. While the plant is growing there is still the chance it will rot and wither away. Converting all the titles to grass sounds like a bad idea. Your plants will be subject to a greater chance of withering if you do that.

>>15234557
I thought the way the math works out means that if your Gardening is high enough, the wither% is a flat 5.

It looks like planting off field tiles means scissors do not guarantee regrowth for seeds that aren't vegetable/fruit, however.

>>15234512
Looking at the wiki it seems that if you plant your seeds off the field/farm tiles your chance of replant lowers considerably. The scissors pretty much make replant guaranteed on a farm tile but not so much on one that isn't.

Going by the wiki assigning a difficulty number of 40 to herb seeds to replant, the number is multiplied by 4 if you don't plant on a farm tile. So you're up to a difficulty of 160 now. If you go to harvest with your scissors a check is made to see if you fail to replant. The check is random number between 0-199 is less than the difficulty value - 100(The -100 comes from the scissors). So subtract 100 from the difficulty above and you're at 60. If that random number turns out to be less than 60 causing that check to become a true statement, then you won't replant.

Since planting on a farm tile actually halves the difficulty and then subtracting 100 to it puts it in the negatives, you are guaranteed replant on farm tiles as the number you roll will always be higher than the difficulty number.

Alright, with that out of the way I think another thing useful to keep in mind is this off of the wiki:

> Assuming you plant on field tiles, maximum regrowth and lowest wither chance can be reached at 41 Gardening. If you do not plant on field tiles, maximum regrowth and lowest wither chance can be reached at 214 Gardening, but will still be worse than planting on field tiles.

How does performer, preach, alchemical rain and such take their targets ? Is it those in a certain range ? What if they are behind a wall ?

>>15219066
I couldn't follow the last threads and I'm stuck at 1.57. Custom 1.8 is not out yet right?

>>15236146
Yep

>>15235884
This is anecdotal, but range appears to be "the NPCs that are visible for the PC". Breaking down a wall with Create Door during Party Time significantly improves reception if lots of NPCs are behind it.

anyone tried the ore hack version of elona ?

http://wikiwiki.jp/elonaval/?orehack

I can only google translate, so i have only a vague idea of what changes but it looks interesting

>>15240742
Be careful if you try it out, since the autosave disabling part can sometimes throw people off if they forget about it. The increase in save slots is pretty nice though. The meat of it is mostly in the skill and item changes, if you're just starting off, you won't really notice the other stuff right away, especially if you can't read Japanese for the NPC dialogues/extra quests. The part with Adventurers looks pretty neat though, a good deal of extra tracking helps give it a different feel compared to normal E+ where Adventurers are really just a sideshow in the background.

I do like the extra pet scaling that the author put in though. 2x effect from Hermes blood is amusing. Some of the changes are evidently done with an older version of Elona in mind, such as (ペットと一緒に演奏できる。) which is already possible now - as well as (ペットは速度も訓練の対象になる。). Without actually playing it myself I can't really comment too much on orehack's custom pet AI. Could just be rather rudimentary, or could be more sophisticated than the combat flag directives.

It looks pretty neat to try out if you're getting bored of vanilla E+, but if you can't read Japanese, it might present a challenge.

Why is it named Elona?

You play it alone.

How many times have you heard that one already?
On topic, deleted my two-weeks character out of boredom and I want to start right again. Bugger.

>>15242189
>How many times have you heard that one already?

Once. From you.

>>15242189
At least make a geneseed?

[Changes and additions]
* When a spell levels up, its potential will decrease by a greater amount now. (Makes it harder to level spells by spamming them in a short window of time.)
* Spells can now be trained at wizards (the identifier) in towns. Each course will give a lot of experience to a different set of spells. (Wish and Harvest cannot be trained.) This does not consume any spell stock, so this makes it possible to train spells that are hard to obtain.
* Changed how an Act II sub quest increased Luck. If potential is below 300%, it increases potential by 80-100% at random. If it's 300% or above, then it gives Luck attribute experience.
* Added a new special action.
* Converge Breath damage now depends on Magic and not Magic Control skill.
* Added 2 red books.
* There will now be a coffin of necromancy and some other things in Lumiest graveyard.
* Prevented overflow when selling items.

[Fixes]
* Fixed some special actions being unable to target enemies who are barely in range.

>>15243508
>Spells can now be trained at wizards
Woah

>>15243508
>Make a character
>Melee and ranged seems to work well
>200+ hours later
>clear act 3, time for lategame content
>" oh anon, it's clear that magic will outdamage all other attacks given training, weapons just aren't as viable in postgame ;) "
>th-thanks Ano
>start pumping up magic dart, ball spells, and all this stuff like some kind of grinding zombie
>almost at parity between physical and magic damage
>see >>15243508

you bet I mad

>>15243903
My guess is that spells will level just as fast, except that you don't need to spam them now.

>>15243754
wondering what you'll have to pay
i dont see myself farming even more plat for the spells

>>15243964
The big question is the "currency" to train spells. Plats, or gold? Because training spells the same way you upgrade weapons could get pretty wild.

>>15243508
>>15243754
>>15243903
It's too soon to really form an opinion on the changes to magic imo. I'll be waiting for more information.

1) >When a spell levels up, its potential will decrease by a greater amount now. (Makes it harder to level spells by spamming them in a short window of time.)

This is definitely a nerf. This is going to make leveling up my lv 980 or so magic dart so much more painful on my character Kai.

2) >Spells can now be trained at wizards (the identifier) in towns. Each course will give a lot of experience to a different set of spells. (Wish and Harvest cannot be trained.) This does not consume any spell stock, so this makes it possible to train spells that are hard to obtain.

This can either be a buff or another nerf. What you should be asking is, "How much will the training cost? If it's gold how much gold are we talking about? Does it scale out to an obscene number based on spell level?." Keep in mind that the cost might not even be gold. It could be something harder to farm. Depending on what that cost is it could be a buff or a horrible nerf.

Also, when they say a lot of experience how much is that exactly? Perspectives can vary on how people view an amount. However, lets assume a lot really is a lot. Your spells level up quick if you can afford the training but as you level up your spells your potential tanks harder now because of 1. You will be sleeping a lot more if you want to keep your potentials up for leveling spells on your own without a trainer.

Will the changes make it take longer to level up spells or shorter? I'm not sure. I wouldn't mind if the training cost scales with gold as I personally think there needs to be a good gold sink for players late game aside from giving it to your pets. Even now I can probably imagine you people getting ready to type, "but gold is so easy to get." but if the gold amount truly grows to be an outrageous amount, is the total amount of time spent in dungeons collecting that gold leading to an increase in time in leveling spells or is it shortening it? One would have to compare the time it takes after the changes to prior the changes I imagine.

The point of the new system is to remove the need for people to needlessly spam spells like buffs in order to grind their levels. There were a lot of suggestions raised in the thread, ranging from coupling spell power to casting skill just like for pets and other NPCs, to eating spellbooks for spell exp (?!), to making NPCs drop better stuff when defeated with spells (wat).

Ano himself listed the following candidates: (>>827)
Charge spells for exp - waiting for them to charge is no less tedious than holding down the key
Limiting usage of charged spells to combat would be terrible, so it would take the form of needlessly spamming spells out of combat
Coupling it to stock usage - would mean assigning spellbooks to a shortcut key and spamming those instead
Would also make mages more expensive play because of the large amount of spellbooks that need to be bought
Coupling it to spellbook usage - would mean assigning spellbooks to shortcut key, rest is the same as above
Choose which spells you want to give more exp to - more like choosing which spells you want to spam needlessly
undead - would force people to delve into necromancy
sandbag - more work all the same
make spell power increase with attributes - no different from spell spamming
increase exp for spell usage and increase potential reduction - makes it possible to level spells quickly, and prevents spamming of spells, reduces grind. But that just forces the user to have to go use the spells otherwise potential goes to waste, so it's not much of an improvement. Doesn't solve root of problem.

The new system's going to be interesting for sure, because "a lot of experience" sounds like it will allow spells to continue leveling even after you hit the soft cap where you need 200-300% in potential in order to gain any experience.

On an unrelated note, some people complained about metal pets being too powerful, and Ano said something about nerfing them hard in the future. I'm not sure if he's kidding, but that may be something to consider if you're thinking of getting a metal pet at the moment.

>>15244903
I don't know, to some extent metal pets are a beginners trap. It used to be that with a bell or two you could easily cruise through Act 1 and even part of Act 2, but people never really considered AP that much back in the day.

Nowadays with AP being as important as it is late game, you end up in situations where once you're past a threshold range, somewhere into Act 3, those bells become utterly useless because their speed doesn't mean they kill fast enough. In the old days the logical conclusion was "well upgrade to Xeren Satellite Units", this unfortunately compounds the problem - the problem being that with the focus being so much on the metal pet, when they become obsolete, you're left with nobody else viable. Now that the focus isn't on them, they'll definitely become obsolete sooner rather than later.

Unfortunately metal pets tend to not fare so well against God tier opponents once their speed advantage is lost, and their stats haven't been properly built up. And for a beginner, the whole benefit of having bells and such is that you don't need to invest anything into them and they can still sweep by virtue of their speed. So speedrunning through Act 1 that way just leads them to hit a major wall by Act 2.

Any change to the way the metal bit works right now will be interesting, but it only skirts away from the real problem with pets - there are only certain pet classes which hold a niche worthy for consideration. You could argue that Defender holds a niche because of the revive, metal pets hold a niche because of damage reduction and generally speed, but most other pet options don't have anything too "special" about them. So really there's no reason to use them in particular. If it wasn't for the god recruitment penalty, people would have made the jump from Xeren to Gods as soon as they were able.

I'd rather see more evolutions and unique bitflags added in rather than nerfing the metal bitflag entirely so that they become as mundane as other pets. The improvements to the AP pet system have only gone so far.

>>15245027
>most other pet options don't have anything too "special" about them

That's a good and bad thing. If you want to RP bob and his dog you don't feel too left out.

AI and special actions used to be important but Leold and custom happened.

Maybe making special actions more powerful (for npc) and less accessible could be the solution. And by less accessible I mean restricted to class/race/whatever not higher price/farm time.

>>15249496
I see it this way. Leold and the AP system is like giving pets options to learn basic spells, not unlike you reading spellbooks yourself, except in their case spellbooks are ridiculously expensive relative to the options at your disposal. But seeing as you're the MC, fine, the cost is acceptable. In this sense, custom's mechanism makes sense as well - you're teaching your followers spells that you've mastered yourself, and it still takes an ungodly long amount of time to get there.

For the most part right now, what is unique is restricted to bitflags as well as a small amount of special actions. Unless Ano decides he wants to overhaul the system entirely and give himself a ton of work, I don't see that aspect changing. I'd agree with you that a lot of the races need work to give them each something "unique" to them. There's just no incentive to using a large amount of races right now.

Is there a way to disable pet casting?

>>15251330
Elona Custom AI settings. Otherwise, use Seal Magic from Leold (with AP) Depends on what extent of spellcast locking you're looking for. Custom has the added benefit of being accessible in early game. Your only other alternative is Directive, and that disables them from doing anything at all for the most part.

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Haven't played since 1.36; What should I expect?

>>15251330
if you are doing it for the reason i think you are doing it, try gene engineering control magic into them instead.

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>>15251415
I'll look into that, thanks
>>15251774
I did, but I'm afraid I'll replace Juere with god pet by the time he'll get it to relevant point. I mean, he doesn't cast that bolt often, but it's annoying that he somehow learned it without asking.

>>15251927
have you tried giving it gems so it will train its own potential?

>>15251932
don't have any

>>15251927
At least it's just a bolt spell and not a storm spell. That said, unless you're going for sentimental factor and sticking with the Juere, they really don't have anything that stands out, even their evolution doesn't make them very noteworthy, so only dedicate resources to them if you really want to have them around for a while.

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>>15252004
aye, I'm planning to get goose and fairy, and then get something through ally scroll/dominance

>>15252017
Ooof the Goose can be a pain in the ass in an actual fight. Might want the Defender just in case unless you plan on keeping them at home for a large part of the time.

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wait wait wait why'd that orc captain suddenly want to be friends?! Is it a random chance when they're low on health?
>>15252338
I plan to get Kumi's fairy, not sure about goose. Defender does seem tempting for overall durability and heals, haven't found any potions of descent to breed goose yet anyway.

>>15245027
You can inherit a metal pet by soul spindle and it'll knock their speed INI down to 50.
Granted you lose the ridiculous speed, but if you want to build a tank of a pet, that's one way to approach it.

>>15252351
He's a unique, you get them as pets when they die.

>>15252351
Potions of Descent? Good luck with that, those things are basically the rarest item outside of several fixed spawns locked behind ridiculous quests.

>>15252393
I guess at that point it depends on how much investment you want to put into it. If the Piece NPCs still have their old metal bitflag they'd probably be the best candidate for soul spindling, given that their Life isn't a measly 1, and speed won't matter anyways. Grandmasters aren't too hard to catch by early Act 2, even if finding them can be a pain sometimes, and at least they come with more combat options than the standard Gold/Platina Bell.

The only advantage I can see to using the two bells is the relative ease of getting them early, but with their speed taken away from them and their otherwise crap stats, I'm not sure they'll be too effective. Considering that 50 speed puts them even lower than standard kobolds, you'd probably have to pump some hero cheese into them to raise their odds of surviving, especially against poison. I'd hate to imagine what a speed nerfed bell would do in the face of a pack of poison hounds. Having all of their skills nerfed to 25 on top of that hurts a fair bit too, especially if you don't put enough gold sources/potions of potential in the inheritance package.

I don't remember any monster that actually has the cmetal/carmour combo actually...though I suppose there are probably custom ones floating around with that.

>>15253111
I'd imagine if you're at a point where you wanna soul spindle a bell, you can get potions of potential pretty easily, along with herbs and other stuff so that can help.

>>15253265
Probably. With people setting up magic castles and gold being the easiest resource to collect, potential potions will basically accumulate naturally if you grind up into late game, even without taking crafting into account.

Then again if grinding into late game is the option taken instead of soul spindling a bell as soon as you can, then we're probably talking about Satellite Units as the target rather than the bell. Unfortunately that life 1 stat issue is still there. Grinding for hero cheese to bring them up to par shouldn't be much of a problem if you're already willing to grind for a fair stack of potential pots and hermes pots (couple hundred of each presumably if you're going the distance anyways).

I don't remember if you could inherit banks or not, I suppose if you could, you could just store a couple trillion gold and pass that down as well for potential recovery.

But really if the only benefit from that process is that the metal pet gets AP a bit easier, then honestly it seems like an excessive amount of effort for a rather dubious return. I guess it's a nice thought experiment? With a Xeren Satellite Unit at 2000 Life/2000 speed in Act 1, it's probably going to be another episode of "Xeren Genocide Order". I suppose that in itself can be moderately amusing.

>>15251752

Would using a cursed rod of heal on a boss and leaving for a few months lower his stats ?

>>15253631
I think the room would regenerate by that time.

>>15253494
A lot of changes. See here:
http://elona.wikia.com/wiki/Changelog_(Elona%2B)

>>15253662
I was thinking zeome and chaos fort bosses, aren't those area static ?

>>15253631
Will take a substantial amount of savescumming to work, considering most bosses are significantly resistant against all status effects, which would include sickness as well. Depending on what equipment they spawn with, they might just ignore sickness entirely, so you'd probably want to steal as much as you can before hand.

The waiting for months part probably won't have any effect at all (in terms of stats decreasing over time), testing it shouldn't be too difficult with elosnack and savescumming to see if you can land the sick on the first go, but it really depends on whether boss npc state updates even when you aren't on the map. It doesn't seem that likely in my opinion.

You might be able to just test it out with a high quality pet to simulate a level of resistance, or maybe one of the earlier bosses. Trying to do it on the Chaos Fort bosses without sufficient stats already will probably just get you killed.

Sorry if this is a really general question, but what properties should I be looking for in end game weapons/armor? Aside from high damage and DV+PV values of course.

>>15253870
Depends on how far you want to go and how much time you're willing to invest. If you don't want to invest any time really, go for items that have innate effects like tripping off extra attacks and such. Living weapons are generally good, but they're really not something you "look" for (with certain exceptions). Things like plus stats generally reduce in effectiveness the further you go in the game. Material kits can resolve problems of items with good effects coming at bad materials - which also affects damage/DV/PV values as well.

If you're willing to put in time, then Artifact Fusion is essentially the end game. The whole system is basically a black hole as far as time sinks go, and you'll spend the majority of endgame farming the items necessary for them. The best items for Artifact Fusion are generally those which have a minimal amount of existing effects so to maximize the room that you have to work with. You'd be looking for effects that you can't normally get that easily from fusion.

Just be wary that Artifact Fusion will take up all your time, and even savescumming only reduces this by a minor degree if that's your thing. Between making resist suits to damage suits, you're honestly more likely to hit a stat cap on something before you complete full weapon/armor sets.

>>15253931
Well I mean, what kind of properties would I be crafting on my gear with artifact fusion?

>>15254087
Depends on what you want to build for. Magic spec can work. Melee based weapon enchants are generally seen as less efficient compared to the magic options, since the quest is disproportionately harder in comparison and melee hits a bit of a nasty choke when you're at end game due to a general lack of options.

Full elemental resist is an alright fallback if you can't think of any specialty you want to push towards. With a full set, getting to rank 20 in all elements is entirely feasible. (but the time investment and resources needed is beyond ridiculous considering how rare some of the harvest items can get due to RNG) This includes resistance to raw magic.

Generally people like to go for living weapons in terms of artifact fusion on the weapon side, and considering the two of the three craftable living weapons can be dual wielded it does offer a good level of flexibility. Again though, from starting the process of artifact fusion to getting a full set is likely to take you months real time. Some of the materials are just ridiculously tedious to get.

>>15254130
I should probably add on that getting "specialty" suits that up a certain skill is basically a quest towards insanity. With the magic spec weapon, the quest is set and drops are controllable. With elemental resists, you just have to gather a ridiculous amount and preferably run with a full team of gatherers.

With Nefia cores, it's all random. All bloody random.

>>15254087
for melee on weapon probably all "deals magic damage"
maybe pierce attack but i heard it work only on the base dice of the weapon (or is it the weapon based pierce ? aka 30% for polearm etc)

on the armor pieces just make sure you have protection against status then stack resists

outside of artifact fusion, most attributes are good http://elona.wikia.com/wiki/Equipment_attributes

Hound corpses doesn't give resistances right ?

>>15253734
Wait, so using a material kit on precious items literally does nothing now?

>>15254087
This is what I have so far on two living lightsabers for my dual wield pet. >>15227894. Darkness bolt, magic damage, and element scar was all the artifact fusions I could fit on it. Haven't had much time to play these past few days but today I did some leveling of the blades. Got ice, fire, and lightning on them now. Still leveling them to get them to #####+ level.

Speaking prior to leveling the lightsabers, I'm surprised yet not surprised that darkness bolt is doing more damage than magic damage. On one hand, the enemies in the void have lots of resistance with darkness being at at least superb level and magic at normal but darkness bolt does 10k damage while my magic damage is doing like 5k. Despite resistances I suppose the fact that it's a bolt means its damage is going to be higher. Guessing magic damage is just a dart? I used two tears for darkness bolt and two tears for magic damage so they should be equally rated in that respect.

The thought had occurred to me of stacking just one element as opposed to go "rainbow"(as many elements as you can fit on a weapon) but I think I read somewhere that after a while there is diminishing returns on stacking. Also, by going rainbow you can get around some enemies that might have a very strong resistance against one thing but not another. Whether or not the above two things are truly the case I'm now committed to building this rainbow weapon.

Taking what I learn from this experience or insights from other people on this matter I may or may not change up how I design my future living weapons. After these two living weapons I'm taking a break from it though. Need to recoup all the materials expended so far and I have other avenues of power I still need to explore or finish up on.

>>15255490
"it deals ***** damage" scale with the dices
hammer 4d30 with # magic damage will do more magic damage than dagger 2d4 #####

invoke probably work differently

>>15253734
>A lot of changes.
Anything big, like spells being trainable at the wizard?

>>15255635
Oh is that what's going on? Hmm, so two hand weapon users might benefit from those enchants more since their weapons usually have better dice on them. Good to know if I choose to make a living weapon for my two hand weapon user. Thanks for the info.

>>15255730
the only thing that makes a weapon 1H/2H is its weight which you can change with scroll of flying

>>15255779
Good call. So what would be the ideal kind of sword to dual wield after using flying scrolls? Two living claymores?

>>15254957
Nope.

>>15255681
Peep the 1.56 changelog. Scroll down that page. You're going to see a lot of things.

>>15256274
so 1.56 was the only one that really chhanged things?

>>15256305
No it's just the first one that came to mind that also really affected my gameplay decisions. You might want to go read from the 1.3x to find out what really changed for you as a player.

>>15256316
I was hoping for a quick summery of the important stuff rather than reading the entire changelog
was i being too lazy?

Where can I download 1.57 for Custom 1.57.2? The Dropbox link is for 1.58, and the other one is 404 now.

>>15256337
A bit of that but also because a lot has changed. A quick summary of where you are now to where 'we' are now is...not quick. That's all I can really say. It would be longer than most changelogs and heavily biased towards what I found most important and what I knew of.

>>15256376
so ill just go to it as a completly new game based on elona. thankss for the info.

>>15256357
Try the official site

>>15256423
Tried it. Only 1.58 links. The 1.57 ones are the same as I mentioned.

>>15256357
You should be able to use 1.58 with 1.57 Custom with no problem.

>>15256477
Ah the wiki said otherwise so I didn't try. Thanks.

>>15255849
Doesn't matter. Realistically unless you have a specific reason to go swords, swords don't offer anything that spears can't do as well. It only depends on your weapon proficiencies. Spears have a "drawback" of having one additional innate modifier, but have an extended range. The easiest sword to roll a living weapon for is always the lightsaber, and well that speed is basically the hallmark of the lightsaber.

Living spears, living panties, and living lightsabers are some of the easiest living weapons to find. Though admittedly, going rainbow is just as bad as going dedicated. The scaling from rainbow spread isn't that high, and since you can't go past level 15 anymore there isn't an infinite amount of perks you can get. Darkness Bolt/Gravitation Sphere are generally better depending on what you focus into skills wise.

Rainbow can be problematic in terms of the weak scaling, which doesn't improve too much given that rainbow means you'll always be at rank 2 - 3 for every element you choose. Diminishing returns does kick in for a focused weapon, but it's nothing significant until you're trying to push through rank 10 or something. With some specific weapons you can hit around rank 13 - 15 magic/mind damage if I remember correctly. It works for a very niche build.

The amount of elements people pick is generally dependent on what effects they're going for. The Primary Triad of elements can be troublesome because the side effects must be mitigated using items (fire and ice destroying things accidentally), but honestly the further you go, the less you notice it.

Probably the only thing to note is that getting the flying scrolls to get a pair of 10s+ weapons down to 1-2s can be a rather frustrating experience in itself. Much more so than farming living weapons anyways.

does age matter/

>>15256587
Nope.

>>15256610
ty

So I've gotten my living weapon (A bow) up to level 10 and now it's threatening to start sucking my blood. Should I level it up anyways or is it not worth the constant damage?

>>15257385
It's an annoyance, but it won't kill you outright. Stack it too many times and it might become an issue, depends on whether you feel the need to push the weapon beyond level 10.

>>15257427
I forgot, will it also interrupt you if you're busy doing something? Because that sounds annoying as shit.

Is <Vesda> the only unique to drop a special resist corpse ?

>haven't touched the game in about 2 years
>forgot how to play
>mountains of new stuff
Fucking shoot me.

>>15257628
This is a good problem to be having... just look at all those steam games with abandoned development after the devs made quick money from their game trending on social media.

>>15257628
Just tret it as a completly new game.

>>15257443
I don't remember if it causes the bleed effect but I'm pretty sure it should since people used to use counterbleed equipment to offset the issue, which means that interrupts can be a pain.

>>15257443
>>15257715
Yes, you will be bleeding, but you will learn to swap weapons in one point five seconds flat.

>>15257628
I wish I forgot how to play.

Is it worth the effort raising base resistance from food or I should let equipment cover that ?

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>>15256550
Fair enough. Was just using long swords as an example since that's where all of my pet's points are tied up in. Think I'm using the term rainbow wrong now that I look at your post. Sorry about that. When I initially heard the term rainbow weapon I thought of a person that tried to fit as elements onto a weapon as he/she could under the assumption that they're trying to get each element to #####+. That's what I did and it seems that's what you recommend? Well too late to make changes at any rate.

The pictures provided show my finished living lightsabers and the damage my pet is doing with them. Akeno has around 1080 tactics, 600 dual wield, and 800 long sword. The time frame I wanted to do a snapshot of damage is when you simply hit the spacebar once. Pretty much showing all of the attacks Akeno does in one action sequence. The majority of enemies where I'm at have superb resists against elements and normal resist against magic. Level 364 of the void.

In picture 4 the green textbox is an example of one action sequence. She didn't get as many attacks in in this example however I wanted to showcase proximity assist and how awesome it is. Total damage is 121,390. Out of that damage 43,405 of it is element damage from the living weapons. Picture 5 has less clutter and just shows her normal attacks with the element damage from her weapons. Total damage is 176,016. 104,676 of that is elemental damage. The last picture is for comparison. It's of my character casting a lv 1148 magic storm.

Overall, I'm pleased with the damage I'm seeing for Akeno. I can feel a bit better about my expenses in creating these weapons as it seems you get what you pay for. Leveling the lightsabers was the easy part. Only took about an hour to go from lv 1 to 15 when leveling it down here in the void.

>>15258858
Unless you're savescumming the corpses there's really no reason to go out of your way to farm those - just eat them as they drop and your resists will grow.

>>15258957
The main problem I had while testing the system was that there's no way to properly determine whether the monster's inherent resistance ranks go up or not. Past Rank 10, everything looks like #####+, so even though I know obnoxiously high ranks like 40+ are possible, I can't really determine whether monsters will grow to those ranks naturally or not.

Getting three/four elements on an offensively minded living weapon isn't much of an issue, I generally run chaos/nether/mind combinations myself. I've seen more of an effect on side effect procs rather than damage scaling from raising ranks.

But yeah all in all, leveling the living weapon is definitely the most expedient part. The system's been nerfed extremely since conception, but it's still a nice bit of flexibility available in it nowadays. Artifact fusion remains to be the real time eater.

>>15258963
Ranch breeding, but there's really no point in it. In practice I've found that rank 10 resistances (which you'll get a lot easier from equipment rather than corpses) seems to cover most of the side effects rather well for at least the story portion of the game. The effect from corpses seems to cap off after a threshold - with some specific corpses like Vesda's not having any effect after one round of consumption.

Newish player here, what's the best way to get my stat potentials up from "Bad"?

>>15261133
Check the OP, it has some guides, otherwise Potions of potential are the best way, but sleeping and breakfast helps too.

>>15261163
Thanks, that was really bothering me.

>>15261133
You have two options. Potions of potential or having a pet cook you breakfast and eating what they make. If you invest gold into the various magic shops you find in town you will start to see them sell potions of potential. Try getting their shop level to 150 or more. Another way of obtaining potions of potential is through creating the potions yourself though alchemy. You'll need an alchemy skill of 45, an alchemy kit, and three materials you get from material tiles you find in dungeons. If you use the alchemy kit it will tell you what materials exactly. If you use potions of potential make sure to bless the stack before consuming. Blessed potions of potential restore a fair amount of stat potential to all stats.

You can also restore your stat potentials though breakfast. What you need is to either find a pet with the cooking skill or gene engineer the skill into your pet. You will also need to get their relationship with you to fellow. After that, just go to bed around 8 or 9 and when you wake up there is a chance your pet will cook breakfast for you.

All of this will probably take some time to set up. Hopefully by the time your stats tank all the way to hopeless you'll have the methods above finally online.

>>15261238
there is also picnic basket that boost potential of you and your pets

you need a ranch to have a supply of eggs tho

best i did was +12, so 12%. potions are 20% when blessed i believe

>>15261467
Yeah the amount of effort that the picnic basket needs makes it less appealing, especially if your party size is small. Even for max parties trying to keep your party's potential up with picnic baskets is tougher than just distributing gold all around.

I got five putit farms and there doesn't really seem to be too much use for five of them. So what should I replace the putits with? I also have one with a hunger demon, which also seems a bit pointless.

>>15261761
Look for monsters that drop corpses with the stats you want to train. If you're talking about putits and hunger demons you're still at a pretty early stage, and honestly charisma is helpful, but only up to a point (and it depends on what your build is after). Buying a horse is possible early on for constitution gain if you're into that, but horses breed slower than putits do.

stupid question: do cow farm give more milk, chicken farm more eggs ?

sometimes i find animal bones in my ranch, does that mean one of my mobs died ?

>>15261779
I have three herb farms, and 121 charisma already, so I really don't need the corpses, besides just for food but like two ranches is enough for that already. I wanted to try ranches out since I haven't yet, but I think I got into it a bit late, so I guess I'll replace four of them with horses, constitution is way more useful than charisma.

>>15261794
In mid/late game ranches are made somewhat redundant since herbed food by itself already improves every single parameter by a fair bit. Other food sources, like vegetables (for learning boosts) are rather easy to come by with farms. It's definitely better to have more farms than more ranches the further you go.

>>15261793
Animal bones pop up randomly. Eggs/milk/bones/shit all just seem to show up pretty randomly.

>>15261820
Are rabbits worth using on ranches? If the stats are covered already, it's probably better to use them for that.

>>15261830
Probably one of the better uses? Though honestly I've tested running a high luck character and besides easier blackjack, the loot hasn't actually been that much better. Luck is a pretty nebulous stat. (Pretty easy to elosnack test luck to ridiculous values with the happy apples.)

What am I supposed to do with unknown seeds, is it worth planting them? I have a ton, but they don't seem to be too useful.

>>15261871
Plant them. They're basically the farming roulette machine.

Okay, so I'm a tad bit confused on the concept of pets early game and how you're suppoused to get levels of things like melee with them around, considering they just brutalize everything before you can even reach them, I never had this kind of problem as a ranged character but now that I've actually decided to try the good old melee, I'm seeing a lot of issues with my progress in my selected melee skills.

>>15261884
Either use controlled leveling, or be prepared to spam shadow step a lot. If you're using custom AI it's possible to tweak the AI so they lay off after a certain target HP threshold, but it's more trouble than it is worth.

Generally, don't amass a hoard in early game. Going for an early full party build requires a very specific progression path, or else you end up with a lot of weak teammates and a substantial amount of dead weight.

Does Statue of Ehekatal override a lucky day?

>>15261884
Go back to ranged.
Use custom AI to turn them into cheerleaders that heal, buff and debuff instead of whamming.
Don't use pets.

>>15261871
You can get potions of corruption and artifacts from them

>>15261871
I make everything except magic/herb seeds into unknown seeds and farm them religiously. Here are some of the observed common loots:

- Food of any type including random fish, may be anything from a generic corpse to a cyber snack, is never enchanted (~1/3)
- Random spellbooks, including spellbooks of Wish and Domination and ancient books of any level (~1/5)
- Junk (~1/5)
- Ores, including "junk stone" and the various crystals (~1/5)

The uncommon loot (can usually expect 1-3 every field, sometimes you don't get one though):
- Artifact ring
- Artifact necklace
- Potion of Cure Corruption
- Herb (any)
- Magatama/Magaqua

The extremely rare loot (I'd be lucky to see these once after harvesting 10 full farms):
- Mandrake Salad
- Small Medal

There are likely more, but this is what I remember off the top of my head.

>>15262539

I've managed to get rare recipes from unknown seeds once or twice, like for soma or nektar. So I mean if you're still early game and can't afford to buy them from Larna it's an option.

Albeit a very unreliable one.

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>>15262539
Harvested 500 unknown seeds and result is as follows. This definitely needs a huge sample size (possibly 10k+) for us to draw any definitive conclusions.

Is it better to sell cooked fish at the player shop, or the normal one?

>>15257599
No, I think the anubis gives resist too

>>15263117
Higher gardening skill should increase % of rare drops too.

>>15263117
Good work with that. It's a shame they don't appear to spawn potions else I'd consider farming them en mass however unfortunately at the later stages of the game they really don't seem worth the effort.

>>15264273
I have maxed gardening and the drops are basically the same.

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I'm confused about just how severe the God recruiting penalty is - if it just cuts their stats to 1/6, aren't the inner Gods still miles better than the Xeren Satellite unit? Its highest stat is 373 Per which still isn't that much more than 2000/6, and its other stats suck. Plus it only has 153 speed and the gods presumably have 2000.

>>15265781
(I don't know how you got the speed cut off that bad but Xeren Sat's speed is 1536.)

But beyond that, you're also looking at this from a single angle, which doesn't include the bigger picture. Standalone, the god recruiting penalty isn't too much of a setback for certain Gods. If we were to consider Mani for example...

At level 350, Mani gets recruited with every stat at about 200 after the penalty, including his speed. Keep in mind that the only way to get Mani is with Astral Light Pen, which means you need to be at a base level of 175 before you can even try. This means you get a level 350 pet with stats at about 200 average, not even breaking a 1.0 stat ratio. Most pets that can gather AP can easily get 800 speed before hitting level 150. (Under optimal conditions, pets at the early level 100s can still attain a stat/level ratio of 2.0 or higher on all stats. Skill/level ratios usually depends on whether travelling is involved and how many skills are used.)

Now let's look at the Inner Gods. Deus Ex Manina is a level 1200, which means you need to be at least level 600 yourself to have a chance at using the ALP on him. We'll ignore the additional cost of the magic ink since that's largely irrelevant by the time you get there. In return, you get a level 1200 pet with stat averages of 300 all around - including a speed INI of 300~400. By the time you hit level 600, you're definitely going to be hitting stat averages of 300~400.

Even Nyarlathotep, at level 180, has stat averages that are comparable to that (But since he's 180, his stat and skill per level ratios are much higher), and he gets no penalty upon recruitment. (I won't mention Cthuga since she's there for people who want to suicide)

So, where do I cure these dream mutations? -lightning -speed are crippling, wiki says something about potions of cure mutation that I've never found

>>15265994
drink at wells
potion of cure mutation / mutation (common in lvl 50 shop)
potion of evolution (rarest need shop lvl 100 or so)

>>15265994
Potion of evolution are the best way, you start to get them at magic vendors at rank 100, probably less too. They're still pretty uncommon though.

>>15266005
don't wells give random mutations as well? I'm lvl 10, don't have money to invest.

>>15266026
They can also be detrimental mutations unless you are going to pussy out and savescum it like a bitch.

>>15266026
Be wary that wells are very likely to compound your problems rather than help them. You're better off just toughing it out until you can get a cure mutation drop. You can try well drinking, but you're literally looking for a jackpot roll. (either a wish - which you don't want to burn on cure mutation, or the opposite mutation to cancel out the one you have).

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>>15266034
>>15266103
Guess I'll just ignore dungeons until I find cure, thanks.

>>15266245
>I'll just ignore dungeons
>until I find cure

This is the exact opposite of what you want to do desu. You need to farm low-level dungeons for gold and loot, then you sell off that gold to invest in the shops. Rinse and repeat until you land on a cure mutation either in the dungeon or the shop.

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>>15266499
Doesn't matter anymore, but thanks. I think this game is just not for me, I appreciate the amount of content but the grind kills any joy I'd possibly have. I'll check news about development time to time, maybe it'll suit me some more later.

>>15266509
You can grind other ways, like gardening and doing harvest time, then using the seeds on your farm. I prefer doing that to dungeons, not as efficient probably, but just doing dungeons gets boring.

>>15266509
Honestly this is the sort of game where if you're looking for a narrative, elosnack shit in and play however you want. People might rag on you for not playing the game the way they think it should be played, but it's a single player game, do what you want with it. That being said, roguelikes in general have always been grindtastic

>>15266541
Depending on what seeds you get and such gardening is actually more effective than dungeoning. Dungeoning is good for getting hard exp, but dungeoning too heavily too early on usually shafts your stat/level and skill/level ratios.

Of course a lot of this seems counterproductive for any player that sees elona as a dungeon crawl, since ironically dungeon delving too much can actually have detrimental side effects.

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>>15266581

indeed

>>15266805
At least you have a 2.0 ratio at least. I remember one of the first characters I built back in the day never even broke 1.0 ratio for most of his stats when he beat Zeome. Leveling has really gotten a lot easier since the early days.

>>15267097
What do you mean by 2.0 ratio? Attributes to level?

>>15267109
Yeah. It's something that has a fair bit of significance early on in the game, when you don't have as many options available at hand. But as you get further along, keeping up a high ratio doesn't matter as much.

Dear god, 4k fame adventurer with gain attribute scroll. Almost didn't check him out.

So what kind of stats are you supposed to have to be able to kill <Meshera Alpha>? I'm using magic, and I cannot kill it with 186 magic and lvl 105 crystal spear.

>>15268240
I have a rod of wish, if I summon a god can that kill it? Is it worth it?

>>15268240
That's way higher than what I had. I think I used a bunch of buffs, especially charge special action. I'm not sure how I got it though. You just got to be able to do 10% or so in one hit.

>>15268240
Meshera is a damage check, or failing that, a speed check. Whether you can take her out or not generally depends on whether your combined dps is high enough between you and all of your party members.

If your speed is too low and your damage is too low, then you need to find ways to either buff, or get more people into the fray. It generally doesn't help to use a god to beat a story boss, given that each of the story bosses are really just damage checks for later content. On top of that, while there's merit in killing Meshera for access to Act 3, there's nothing too useful for the long game in Act 3 besides Artifact Fusion.

If you don't have a specific goal you're aiming for to give a reason as to why you need Meshera dead, optimizing a bit more might be a better option.

>>15268258
Absolutely not!
Do not waste a wish on killing a boss.

I think she was easy, but I had a bunch of high-level pets with me. They're good for dealing with her super regeneration. Also, have a weapon with decapitation or have a pet with one. Or have a full gauge when she's low health.

I was like level 70-80 when I defeated her, but I beat her effortlessly and even saved all the infected soldiers.

>>15268263
>>15268306
>>15268310
I guess I'll just get stronger first then, I want to kill it solo. Thanks.

what resist affects sulfuric potions and acid ground ?

>>15269332
Float + Acidproof, it's not element regulated unlike fire and ice. Poison reduces a different type of damage, like the difference between poison hounds and slimes. The former doesn't damage your equipment, the latter doesn't kill you in a toxic cloud.

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Finally brought myself up to the latest Elona+, what's the item for changing height/weight?

Where can you get it?

>>15271160
Don't know what the item is you're talking about but you could do all of that the old fashion way. Blessed milk makes you grow taller and cursed milk shrinks. Milk can be gotten from ranches. You can increase and maintain a certain weight by just eating food or you can decrease weight by constantly vomiting up what you eat.

>>15271160

It's called Soup of Wonderland, and it drops from Little Girls when killed.

So it's possible to farm karma by killing bards then reviving them, leaving the area and doing it again. I guess that's an option, since I don't know any other guaranteed way to get karma, I guess just doing quests works too.

>>15219185
Who are you quoting?

>>15272122
Quests are good enough for the most part I feel, it isn't too hard to keep Karma maxed out nowadays, and dropping it has always been easy.

Shoud I clear all the static dungeons (minotaur's nest, pyramid, etc) before killing Zeome or is it the same if i do it after ?

>>15272122
After I got Sacred Treasure of the Wicked my karma has always been near-max. Not only does this let you turn in wallets ad infinitum (You lose 3 karma but gain 5) but successful pickpocketing or prostitution never loses karma, and getting caught is far less devastating.

>>15273392
No difference. Generally done for leveling up and some uniques. Whether you need them or not is generally build dependent.

Elona Custom 1.58.1 is out.

Old Elona Custom thread hit the comment limit. New thread is here:

http://elona.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:22264

Installed a music mod for Elona Plus, does anyone else hear this high pitched noise when switching areas?

I assume it has to do with the mp3 format or something, but I'm clueless as to how to remedy it.

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Back to training

Does anyone else play overdose mode instead of normal? When I played normal, I spend ~half a year to be strong enough to kill zeome.

>>15277223
Half a year of in game time is nothing. Half a year in real life to kill Zeome though...I think you need to ask for help on your character then.

>>15277359
Irl of course. Lots of grind.

>>15277386
It really shouldn't be taking you nearly that long to kill Zeome. Even on advancing or other difficulties. What exactly are you having problems with? Maybe we can help.

>>15277399
Mostly potential. Potions of potential drops really really rare in lowlvl dungeon. Plus you need water potions, which are pretty rare too. Alchemy skill needed pretty high, as lvl of dungeons you can find required ingredients.
Scrolls of growth are just impossible to get early. It is difficult to get them even now, with my 80 lvl character.
It took me so long mostly because every my stat potential were hopeless, and skill potential was low too. But slowly I grind and grind and grind, and finally managed to kill zeome and clean some named dungeons.
Oh, and I played with mounted archer, one of the most effecient combo in elona.

>>15277446
I don't know how you didn't give up playing like that, I know I would, I mean there are better ways to level.
This isn't related to the reply, but is herbed food the best way to gain attributes? I usually gain about 8 points per attribute every 40 herbed curarias, with potential at superb.
And is there way to see attribute potential?

Just got 1.58.1 custom and 1.58 added and I'm noticing that my shop which used to sell vast quantities of goods rapidly for millions is now barely able to sell 1-2 items a night. Cha is a bit over 100 and nego is 250 on a rank 1 shop. Any ideas on whats up?

>>15277580
Failure to sell was aligned with normal shops ( though still in favour of specialised ones ).

>>15277560
Herbs used with skill grind is the only way I know. To see attribute potential numbers you'll need the Glasses of Yacatect which is dropped on kill by Karavika.

http://elona.wikia.com/wiki/Karavika

>>15277446
Like I said before, the main issue is that you weren't focused on developing a base infrastructure (getting a stable income feed, getting all the base merchants you need invested, farms and such) and concentrated on pushing through dungeons. Dungeons will give you plenty of hard experience, but generally won't do anything for you in terms of setting up a good level of infrastructure unless you're map reloading to farm treasure chests or something, or just farming puppy cave over and over for early gold.

Just plowing through dungeons hoping for loot usually ends up forcing your level up, but your stat ratios tanks. Especially if you're going at it with a small party, so all the experience is eaten up by you.

Technically if you were farming dungeons, it shouldn't have been too difficult to get some scrolls of growth since presumably you'd at least get a small stack of small medals, though whether you'd want to waste them on scrolls of growth is another thing altogether. You should never be in a position where you need scrolls of growth if you control your skills properly and sleep well. You'll have one or two skills that will always tank if you use them constantly, but their ratios should also be pretty high. You never farm potential pots from dungeons, you farm them from merchants. Water potions are relatively easy to come by. Trying to craft potential pots with alchemy is something reserved for once you hit Act 3's end game state, since it's doubtful you'll amass enough angel's tear and yggdrasil saps before then to create a meaningful stack.

And really the only thing Zeome has going for him is that his spellcasting is moderately strong for his rank. He's basically a resistance check...or a speed check if you ran bells.

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>>15219066
I hope one day we can see the personal dungeon having features for advanced farming.
Like pic related could be used for better herbs or you could grow other monsters and keep them in a semi captive but still ostile status to farm materials or something. Of course everything balanced so farms and ranches don't become useless.

>>15278200
Wheeww that'll be difficult. As great as the idea sounds, to a large extent farms already made ranches obsolete. You'd have to find a really special niche for the dungeon to fill. I mean it'd be nice to actually have it be a dungeon and play like a mini dungeon overlord in elona (where you throw poor adventurers in to get impregnated by Cthugha) but then there are a lot of inherent issues in that too. (As Cthugha releases her celebratory burst of METEOR and unfortunately destroys everything around her, including her poor adventurer friend.)

I guess I like using it as a loot cave right now and spell containment field.

>>15278185
>you weren't focused on developing a base infrastructure
Well, not exactly. I had a farm, and I performed, and invested in traders. Actually variety of activities in elona is what kept me for ~5 years (or so, I don't really remember, I started playing before elona was 1.16), it makes this game unique.
But herbs were rare, mostly fruits. They developed some stats, but not really much. By the way, is there a way to storage fruits from the farm, so I could eat them all before they spoiled? Freezer takes small amount of stuff, and 4-th dimensional pocket is kinda, uhm, unreliable cause it needs high spell lvl and charges could end unexpectedly. It is especially a problem if you are not caster at all.
>You never farm potential pots from dungeons, you farm them from merchants.
Yeah, I know. The problem is - they are expensive as hell, especially with low negotiation skill. And merchants can be dicks, and have everything except this damn potion even if they have >500 shop rank.
Whatever. I think I can start a new game in normal mode. Could you give me some advice about what class should I start?
There are not many unique crossbows and bows(and guns too?I don't remember), so, I guess, I don't want to be archer or gunner again. Playing with melee character means you need to use Shadow Step almost constantly, what makes Kumiromi the only choice (cause of quick stamina regen). But I would rather worship Ehekatl or Lulwy.
Wizards are ok, I guess, but spamming Magic Missle is kinda boring and other spells are not reliable cause high resistances of bosses.
Martial arts are ok, but I don't want to savescumming to make a mutant with 10 hands, I don't like that.
Don't know what I really want, lol. Any options?

>>15278309
As with most things it's a matter of scale. For a single person generally a single herb farm is effective. You spend early game hoarding herb seeds however you can for the purposes of setting up the farms later. Later on in act 2 you can actually get a more reliable source of herb seeds to speed things up. But generally the first leg of the game (Act 1/2) is for the initial investment dump.

4D pocket is the best option for preservation purposes. If you can't afford potential pots, you're not going to be getting any preservatives anyways, and preservatives are generally a waste. Finding a 4d pocket book isn't too much of an issue, and going magic guild is good enough to get charges.

All styles are "viable" by end game, just that some are more efficient than others, and depending on what you like to do, some are more infuriating than others. The investment that you need to make them viable is usually the critical factor, and it sounds like you don't want to put in much investment. Melee is technically the class with lowest entry cost since you get a relatively early time stop weapon. Magic requires spell grinding, Ranged requires finding a good weapon set, without the opt out option that melee has since there aren't many early game ranged uniques you can fall back on. The Winchester is probably the easiest one to find early on.

There's actually a fair number of unique guns, around 8 of them. Finding them is the main problem. Artifact Fusion has generally made it easier to use uniques, but it has also closed the gap between normal Miracle/Godly items and uniques. But you're far too early to even consider Artifact Fusion.

The reason why melee usually wants shadow step is out of convenience. If you're running solo, a vast majority of enemies will get into 1-1 range with you anyways. You'll find some that like to shortport or stay at range, but then it's a matter of speed differential. Which is crucial for every single class. If you have enough speed, shadow step only serves to make things quicker. The equation changes dramatically if you use pets, especially if said pets are ranged or faster than you. More often than not you see people talking about their pets killing before they can get in range. But in any case, you're not literally using shadow step every other action. At your level range (1-50 early game) the only issues are generally bells and lich/wizard series casters as far as melee goes.

Sounds to me like your real problem is not being able to get gold reliably and use that to gateway to other resources. You don't need 500 shop rank to get potential pots. Don't even need 200, you just need enough merchants, and you run rounds between them to hoard up a fair stack of pots. Either that, or you savescum the merchant, whatever you see fit. But either way, gold is always the first step. If you can't get enough gold to even afford stacks of potential pots, you're not going to get anywhere with it.

>>15278399
Get veggie and fruit farm, cook everything with barbecue and +cooking equipment. (+gardening helps getting higher enchantment)
I make 80k / farm that way (can be more if lucky with muskemelons).
You can do the same with fishing & corpses.
If stuff rots you can put them in your shop but it sells slower.

Training negociation is done with traders. You gain xp for (negociation+10)². So with 10 neg you need to buy/sell for 400.
If the trader has 10 cargo for 800g each, buy them one by one. Same when you sell them in the next town.

Just above 100 is enough to see potions of potential. What you need isn't more investment, it's more magic vendors in your house (and its less expensive). 4 of them is enough to get me a steady supply

In your herb farm, if stuff wither, leave them until you kumiromi stone isn't on cd anymore. When you run out of room make another farm and stop making more when you reach 5 or 6 of them (later on you will want that many).


Finally if your skills potentials are shit, your attributes wont grow up.

Lets say you have Longsword 10 (100%)
You hit some dude and gain 50xp Longsword
Longsword is strength skill so you'll get 50 * set factor * strength potential

Now with 50% Longsword potential you only get 25xp so your strength grow slower.



>>15278552
I don't know. What I know is that they still count for the limit when they are in the dojo. Also the game check your base faith (+faith items are useless).

>>15278761
I think. you meant to reply to >>15278309
anon.

>>15278761
I mostly did as you say. Btw, what is the difference between grand parfait +1 and gf +10? Does it give more potential? Is there any sense in mixing herbs in +10 food?

>>15278870
The higher the rating, the more improved the values. Higher cooking yields higher + ranks.

>>15278870
+1 or +10 change the XP you get.
You don't get potential from food (except herb). "Herb in" gives more XP and make the attribute grow (gain potential)

XP = ( nutrition * ( 50 + quality*20 ) ) / 100

quality = grand parfait (8), refuse (1)
nutrition = fruit has 30 PER / 50 MAG / 20 CHA

Now if you cook a +10 fruit nutrition will be 40 PER / 60 MAG / 20 CHA (CHA doesnt raise for reasons)
So difference in PER xp between +0 and +10 for grand parfait is 84 - 63 = 21

Herb in gives 800xp for every attribute including speed.
And for comparison curaria gives 100xp for all including speed.

On the other hand muskmelon curry +10 sells for 40k


>>15278761
Forgot to say until you get kumi statue most of herb seeds come from the fairy (feed her bread and noodles you buy in towns)

Does the Studio Ghibli music pack not work with the latest version?

>>15279844
I've got it on and besides the problem I mentioned here >>15274481 it works fine.

The problem I listed isn't even a problem after a while, you stop noticing it.

>>15279883
For some reason when I put it in the music folder, there isn't any music at all.

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>>15278996

Pets get bigger boost then the PC though makes me die in side any time i eat herb food

Is there ever a good reason to eat the random strange feast you come across? It just made me bloated and unable to eat any herbed food for a long time.

>>15280245
Is it bad to just eat all the herbed food at once? I just go to the puppy cave, and find a hunger demon, and eat like 40 at once.

>>15280245

when your new yes.

Later on better off skipping it for herb or +5 etc farm/ranche food

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There is nothing worse than this.

>>15279844
>>15279932
Actually, it looks like none of the music mods work. Does anyone know how I can fix this?

[Changes and additions]
* Added an unique NPC for Act III.
* Added 4 high-level quicklings. They are all unique in their own way.
* Changed the sprite for quicklings so that they face to the front because it was hard to tell whether it was a face or a hand on the old sprite. You can now tell that they are a type of dwarf.
* Changed the cMetal bit flag so that it only reduces regular physical attacks now. They usually get killed before they kill the player, so this should be reasonable.
* To be honest, I've always wondered if 4 times Constitution and having armor that resists magic was too much, so cArmor bit flag has also been changed to reduce only regular physical attacks.
* Increased the attributes for armor race.
* Gave metalslug cMetal bit flag for real. Existing metalslugs will have their cArmor swapped for this when their stats are recalculated.
* Buffed starting magic resistance of metal race.
* Capped the enhances your spells equipment attribute effect at 2x. Equipment attribute strength will is also proportionally harder to increase (i.e. if you've already reached the cap now, then you'll still be at the cap after the update.)
* As Casting skill of NPCs increases, spell power will increase more now.

>>15280568
Ohoho these cMetal changes are going to be rather amusing. I suppose the changes to enhance spell attribute means some changes in terms of living weapons now though...

>>15280568
>NPCs increases, spell power will increase more now.

Will need numbers but I've been curious about a dedicated spell caster.

>>15280568
so cArmor used to reduce 75% of all dmg

and now its 75% physical ? whats the deal with constitution ?

>>15280568
And suddenly my Pro-Jet gets oneshotted even if she already had more cons than pros

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>>15280568
>cArmor bit flag has also been changed to reduce only regular physical attacks
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>15280568

Well pro jet is now useless

>>15280209
>herbing your rare herbs

No anon what have you done?!

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>>15280969

It was a test to see what would happen with herb herbs

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>>15280787
90% physical damage resist is useless? I'd take it in a heart beat if it was offered to my character.

>>15280568
>Changed the cMetal bit flag so that it only reduces regular physical attacks now. They usually get killed before they kill the player, so this should be reasonable.

Doesn't seem Ano realizes there's players like me that can farm hero cheese reliably. At any rate, is this the major nerf to cMetal talked about earlier? Don't know about you guys but this feels like a mere slap on the wrist considering it could of and possibly should of been much worse. Seriously, 90% resistance to everything was a bit much and it really should of been nerfed hard.

You hear that Akeno/pro-jet? They nerfed you. Now you'll actually have to wear something instead of just going around naked, and never dying, attacking things with your two lightsabers. You'll need some resist gear like everyone else. I suppose our dear friend Atlas is still going to keep crying that his punches do nothing to you though. I mean, what other pet can boast such damage resistance. If we build you a resist suit, we still might be able to get you back to where you were before the nerf at being practically resistant to everything again.

"It's ok master, even if they get past me being metal they still have 3 million HP to chew through. Also master, I can still run around naked if I want to! Just load me up on magic fruit now and give me the trait barrier. I don't use spells so I'll have a 3 million point strong bubble shield they'll have to chew through to get to my actual HP."

No, your lewdness ends today metal pet!

>>15281185
>Doesn't seem Ano realizes there's players like me that can farm hero cheese reliably

I don't think it's a matter of not realizing as much as it's a matter of not caring. By the time you're at the point where everything is 2k, the vast majority of the game as far as "storyline" goes is trivial. Your perception of endgame and his probably just aren't the same. I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't expect people to grind to the same degree.

Who knows, maybe people will ask for more nerfs until cMetal bits come with an automatic stat penalty that can't be mitigated or something if that's what it takes to satisfy their concepts of balance.

>>15281512
When I first heard that they were going to nerf metal pets I completely understood why it needed to happen and started thinking how I would nerf them. I actually thought of nerfing them so hard that their resists would be similar to the resists offered by Opatos worship. So 20% damage resist(both magic and physical) for metal and only 10% for armor pets. It partially makes sense to me since I imagine a player with Opatos's shell becoming somewhat metal himself as his/her skin starts becoming mineral like, like their god, through intense worship.

Don't get me wrong though, I'm not angry that he didn't go far enough. I still feel very much challenged by the game and can use all the help I can get down in the void. I'm just saying I would understand the application of a violent nerf hammer though.

>>15281672
Should make mention though that if the nerf was hard, like mine, I would of at least made the appropriate pet INI score adjustments as compensation.

So I made a stupid mistake when I was newer on this character and gene fused a God Pet into another pet, is there any way to get that pet again or am I fucked?

>>15281975
Think I heard in a prior thread that if you go back to the god that had your god pet and earn enough favor you should be able to get them again.

>>15282073
I just tried that and praying didn't do anything. Maybe I could try and get more faith than I had, I dunno. I'll give it another shot but if anyone knows anything I'd really appreciate it.

>>15281672
Well Ano can keep phasing in more and more balance checks as the community demands. If he feels that metals are still imbalanced, then there's plenty of opportunity to strip their abilities from them further. If not, just start introducing stronger enemies that can bypass abilities altogether, rendering the metal advantage completely pointless. Brainwashing is already a thing, could just buff that for enemies strong enough that your companions will all start to kill you, or have you start to kill yourself. Reckon before long people will feel satisfied with the difficulty.

Always plenty of room to make things more difficult...
But I'd say that INI scores shouldn't get adjusted regardless of the nerf. There's no reason for compensation if they were seen as unfairly advantaged to begin with. It'd only make sense if every metal loss 90% of their speed stats or something.

>>15280667
Oops, misread it. Thought it said 耐久 (con) when it actually said 耐久力 (health). Thanks.

>* To be honest, I've always wondered if having the equivalent of 4 times the health and having armor that resists magic was too much, so cArmor bit flag has also been changed to reduce only regular physical attacks.

>>15282080
You can get the god pet again. Switch to another god, then switch back.

Also mark the pets you want as "important" in the conversation window. Pets marked as important cannot be sold to slave masters, abandoned, or sacrificed in gene engineering.

Can I somehow change default player skin to something custom? It is kinda frustrating, when you look the same way whether you are golem or fairy.

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>>15282948
http://www.elonaup.x0.com/

>>15282121

odd to nerf it when Ano put in Panzerfaust X does X10/X4 damage to things with cMetal/CArmor bit flags

>>15280568

Spells can now be trained at wizards (the identifier) in towns. Each course will give a lot of experience to a different set of spells. (Wish and Harvest cannot be trained.) This does not consume any spell stock, so this makes it possible to train spells that are hard to obtain.

>>15283861
Aside from the obvious "spending gold instead of stocks" benefit, this will make grinding spell levels so much cozier.
Seeing a wizard once every two days is going to be much quicker and easier for my sanity than the current "spam spamm spammm spells one day and a half every two days with barely time to do a dungeons or do quests".

>>15283954
We shall see. Watch it take 500 million gold just to level up a high level spell. (That's 500 dungeons at a minimum you have to do.) Watch the overall time it actually takes to level up spells actually skyrocket the higher your spells get. Everyone's smile...will be gone. Lets hope this dark future doesn't come to pass.

>>15284039
The "different set of spells" part seem to imply that it's going to e a fixed cost for a fixed raw experience, modified as per normal by the experience formula.
I assume the option isn't just for end-game characters, so...

Well, as you said, we shall see. Getting hyped for nothing would be a shame, after all.

>>15284099
To me it implies that you will be able to take different courses which will train a group of spells
Like offensive spells class, buff class, lightning class, etc

>>15281185
>>15281672
You should think about early, midgame and pseudo late game too. I understand cMetal can be absolutely good where you are, but for someone who wanted a metal pet and can't upgrade life at all it becomes even less worth to invest on metal pets since it's already hard enough to maintain one in the first place.

How does dungeon level raise?
I get from 70 to 100, and if I switch continents it generally stays around that, but if I use a statue of Opatos then it goes to 40 and below. I don't really wanna do the higher level stuff, because I'm afraid that that wouldn't allow me to do the lower level dungeons anymore, which are much to find big daddies in. I'm just curious if anyone knows how this works more precisely.

>>15284603
It goes off your highest level cleared.

>>15284305
Not the guy you're responding to but that's an incorrect assumption. Just because one is not at the point where they can maintain a metal pet does not make the investment less worthy. From the looks of it, his investment in his pet paid off well. I'm not using pro-jet myself but have a bell of termination that's been a real pain in the ass to train but my investment is paying off now. I think in one of the earlier threads he or someone else said that pro-jet was not a newbie pet so I don't think early game even crossed his mind.

I guess it's a person's prerogative if they want to go against the grain and train a pet that is probably going to be too tough for them to handle though. In all honesty, I agree with the anon who said metal pets are a newbie trap and probably should be left to veterans to deal with.

>>15283210
The Panzerfaust X is a player option, not something that was given to monsters. If monsters start carrying Panzerfausts and can use them freely, then it would address the current issue that people seem to perceive - namely, that metal/armor was too favored when you had pets with them.

>>15284039
Too much gloom and doom over something that hasn't even been properly clarified. If it takes excessive amounts of time, people will swap away, and sooner or later it'll get patched again.

>>15284305
The problem is that if you consider cMetal options in early/mid game you'll come to realize that 90% of your options are anomalies. Extreme speed for their level, extremely low health - with the possible exception of the Piece race (which for the life of me I should really test but I never get around to it). They were specifically designed to be dodge tanks at the early/mid game level. For that purpose realistically, they still do their job. Give them a proper AI tweak, and enemies will never reach them save for casters.

Does this mean that you can no longer just toss your bell/pro-jet willy nilly into the fray? Yes, it does. It means that you now have to look at planning how to make the most out of that massive speed advantage while you have it - because the fact of the matter is, speed is a relatively easy stat to raise nowadays in comparison to life.

This change deters people who weren't going to consider dumping a massive amount of resources into stabilizing a Metal pet from getting one in the first place. You'll still find that Metal can be absolutely good in early/mid game. A Xeren Satellite Unit will still wreck face with its 1536 speed. A Bell Pair will still be able to destroy Zeome if you give them sufficient equipment.

Anomalies like the Metal race in roguelikes are typically meant for very niche/specialist builds. This change doesn't deter from that, it only emphasizes the niche that the Metal race holds by making them slightly more fragile and increasing the risk factor. For the large majority of early/mid game that physical resist will be absolutely fine. The only thing you have to worry about are casters and hounds burning them down quicker than before.

So I have ten statues of Kumiromi, should I get more or is that enough? It takes so many fucking little girls, took 55 to get this many.

>>15285182
Enough is determined by whether you can sustain you and your team entirely on herbed food or not. Easier for you to decide than for others to tell you. If you're satisfied with how many rare herbs you're getting then that's that.

There's really not much else you use little girls for in any case. Easier to farm hero cheese with music tickets as another anon proved.

>>15285193
Considering I only spend herbs on myself for the time being, I guess it's enough.

Starting a new game, this time I want to play Normal because everything moves too fast in Overdose. Is herbed food the best way to increase stats? Would farmer be the best starting class?

Also, how do I keep potentials up? I try to always sleep in the king's bed but it only increases potentials by a small amount.

>>15285249
Herbed food is the best way to increase stats, just don't expect to get any of it early, farmer or not. Being a farmer helps, but it isn't the end all be all, considering gardening is an easy pick up skill.

Potions of potential for potential. Sleeping only helps slow down the loss, it won't keep your potentials up at max if you're actively gaining stats. Should probably just accept that at early game you're going to have a bunch of attributes at potential depending on how hard you grind. I suppose you could try and meticulously plan every action so to min max your gains and keep potential up, but the effort is ultimately wasted. It isn't like the attributes have no cap, so sooner or later, you'll get to max. Better to worry about making it through Act 1/2 with a good foundation to springboard into the long grind game.

>>15285249
Just play normally.
No point trying to power and plan your way through every aspect of the game. It'll naturally come to you with time.

>>15285313
I think all the talk we do about the endgame grind tends to make people lose perspective in terms of experiencing the early/mid game for what it is, and instead focus exclusively on munchkin grinding.

Which is a pity considering you don't even need a 1.0 ratio to beat Act 1 or Act 2.

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>>15285299
>>15285313
Oh, okay. I'll try not to worry about it too much.

I just got a wish from Vernis's well. What should I wish for?

>>15285388
I dunno. Happy Bed? A Statue of Kumiromi? I mean I usually use them for Astrals, but you're nowhere near where you need to be to use an Astral so yeah depends on what you think you need at the moment.

>>15285436
Statue is a precious item, so you can't wish for it.

>>15285438
I guess 7 leaguers could be useful early? I dunno, considering I use wishes exclusively for Astrals.

>>15285466
Seven league and evolution are nice, I think, since evolution can give you some nice stat boosts that don't require gear, and early on that makes a bigger difference, and seven league means getting around faster which is always useful.

>>15285476
>>15285466
>>15285438
>>15285436
So it's either evolution or boots? I feel like getting boots but they might not be as useful as I think they might be. Is cargo the best way to make money?

>>15285542
Cargo is a nice way, gardening with a farm and cooking is a nice too, but needs some investment first, about 30 in each skill.

Do you gain less AP as you raise your attributes and speed?

>>15285836
You gain AP depending on the power of the enemy you kill, so the stronger the monster, the more AP you earn. The threshold to gain AP increases as you gain more AP - this is the only thing that affects AP gains, is your current total gained AP. This incentivizes you to fight stronger and stronger enemies to keep gaining AP.

Current speed and stats have no effect on AP gains. If you have 0 AP, you can gain AP from a high-level monster whether you're at 2 speed or 2000 speed.

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>>15285836

The following three factors determine if AP is gained, and the amount gained:

The enemy killed must have an Attribute INI above 1000. Most enemies that fulfill this requirement will be above level 50 and appear in South Tyris. Some enemies below level 50 that fulfill this requirement are the Green dragon (level 32), Titan (49), Shub-Niggurath (45), Kesalanpatharan (47), and Black gryffon (48).

The character's INI sum (Attribute INI + Speed INI) + (total AP / 5) < enemy's INI sum (Attribute INI + Speed INI) - (enemy's 2 * Life + 0.5 * Mana). The more AP a character gains, the stronger the enemy that has to be defeated in order to gain AP. Characters will eventually stop gaining AP due to the total AP accrued. The maximum AP that a character can obtain is 80000 - Attribute INI - Speed INI.

The enemy must have equal or greater Speed INI than the character. AP gained is as follows:

I'm still on my first character and it's a really interesting feeling when you start them when they're about 17 or 18 and by the start of Act 3 they've aged to 32.

I don't know how far I'll go before I make a gene but who knows how old my character will be by then.

>>15286332
Drink blessed potions of slow
They'll make you younger

>>15286350
I'm not interested in becoming younger, it's a cool measure of time to see how old your character gets as you play more. I've never played anything that made me feel this attached to a custom created character.

>>15286332

blessed potions of slow make you younger by a bit and slow down rate you age by

>>15286332
Yeah there's a certain sense of attachment that you get from just pushing through and surviving the entire experience, without considering any meta aspect of it. When it eventually comes time to make a gene and pass on to the next generation, the narrative that's built up is kind of amusing. Especially when you start to consider what kind of inheritance your character would leave for their children.

Makes for good writing material.

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>>15286540
The whole story you build for yourself as you play is for sure one of my favorite parts.

I noticed the actual main story wasn't involving me much so I'd try to build in my head occasionally what it'd be life when my character did stuff. I don't have a real narrative or anything built, but you do start to kinda feel it out when anything important happens.

It also starts to feel pretty special when the story does acknowledge you. Maybe they did it in act 1 and I just forgot, but when this happened at the end of act 2 it felt pretty magical.

Is it possible to change race through gene engineering? (Ex. God)

>>15286716
>>15286716
The charm of the game lies to some extent in the freedom that it possesses. Whether you see it as your character being a destined hero, or just poor schmuck who happens to show up at all the wrong places at all the right times, it's what makes it somewhat unique in contrast to most RPGs where the hero is infallible.

Well I guess here the hero is just "pretty fucking lucky"...moreso if he survives a couple pregnancies. I can only imagine the reactions of the party after Act 2 ended and MC ended up adopting Meshera-chan as his adoptive daughteru.

How exactly does early-game progression work? No matter what I do, I never feel like I'm getting any stronger. None of the loot I find seems better than what I had before. Public performers and kobolds are always very dangerous to fight when they probably shouldn't be.

>>15287235
Depends on how you go about it...which is what I say a lot. Very early game (puppy cave stages) is always slow. You might get one or two lucky breaks (like a Wish and such), but for the most part you spend very early game getting yourself settled in to a "style". Whether that ends up being a more combat oriented or a more quest/crafting oriented style tends to differ based on person.

The majority of the "strong" gear in the beginning is found from storyline quests. This includes weapons and accessories. You might find one or two material kits from quests, but it's a common newbie mistake to use them too early on a piece of equipment that you might end up junking later.

Kobolds/Performers are Extremely Dangerous in the very early stages, and warrants flee on sight protocols if you don't have a countermeasure (a pet usually in the very early stages) in place. You will be able to kill them relatively soon, but you need to decide what kind of method you want to go about it.

Trying to take a pacifist route for instance normally means you need to rely on your pets to do the job. The first pet you get in town actually does a very good job at handling threats provided you stay close to them. If you instead choose to run solo...then typically the burden falls on you to find a ranged option, be it magic or a good gun/throwing item, since your speed is generally not too hot early on.

Generally if you're stuck in very early game, go trawling in puppy cave if you have to. Gardening quests aren't bad at all if you can get pets to cover your back, and some other quests are doable. Cargo runs aren't as effective in very early stages since running from Bandits can be a hassle. The same goes for escort quests. But trawling in puppy cave can be great, especially if you can land a couple oracle scrolls quickly...which is plausible since they're only an uncommon spawn rather than a rare spawn. Getting a god pet early is a good go to option too.

>>15287235
Also don't forget the early game has just as much cheese as late game if you're willing spoil yourself. Getting the small medals necessary for the early-game-ending Shield Tonfa (and then Sage's Helm) is just a matter of visiting the wiki.

Also understand that "loot" is roguelike in nature, not JRPG-like in nature. Low-quality weapons and armor are practically worthless from a selling point of view, as are most basic potions and scrolls. Dragging a 20s steel hammer to town to sell is a waste of your time. Don't pick up everything you see.

I disagree about trawling the puppy cave. There's some neat stuff there, but there's just as much neat stuff to be found visiting towns completing board quests, and you'll certainly make some cash if you can complete just a few "bring this item" or escort quests. Gobs and gobs of cash if you complete a "before it's too late" quest. This is why so many people advocate seven league boots as a first wish, because it trivializes travel time and associated issues like wilderness starvation and taxation.

>>15287235

First thing enchant your gear at the blacksmith. If the best you have if a paper cloak enchant it anyway to +2.
9*+2 items is already 36 PV and DV. Don't go around without PV, dodge is nice but crits and certain attacks (shield bash) can't be dodged without greater evasion skill or at all.


New players tend to underestimate investing in shops. Look out for ## investing gear it will save you tens of thousands gold.


Early on your attributes will grow very slowly. You mostly grow by getting the static artifacts, and cheesing adventurers (trade them "it weakens your resistance #####+" and duel them).
Once you can buy potions of potential regularly you'll really feel you are getting somewhere. And with herb farms it get kinda crazy.

>>15287461
Most of the aversion towards the puppy cave is because some people see it as an exploit, not unlike the delete reload scumming on the graveyard or the herb seed delete reload. Granted, scumming puppy cave isn't anywhere near as gamebreaking as the graveyard run, but it's still pretty scummy.

The only advantage to puppy is that oracles generally can net the first 100 grand pretty easy, and done properly, results in minimal exp gain on all fronts, except negotiation from selling. For experiencing a "normal" game that kind of scumming should generally be avoided altogether.

>>15287706
>aversion towards the puppy cave is because some people see it as an exploit
...what?

I noticed that potentials are fading really slowly for new character. Even if it is not Superb, but only Good.
But when I drink 10 blessed potions of potential with my 70 lvl char, it takes me 2 in-game month to make every stat hopeless again. I wonder why? Is it just my illusion?

>>15288129
floor scumming puppy cave by hopping back and forth or just reloading until you get the drops you want. It's like the most extreme version of dungeon scumming short of delete reloading on the boss floor to exploit chests.

Some people pretty much hate any sort of savescumming whatsoever and consider the act of savescumming as an exploit. There've been some pretty outspoken people in the past.

>>15288169
Because your growth slows down substantially as you get up into higher levels? If you're not gaining 10 - 20 points in an attribute every couple levels, then naturally your potential won't plummet as quickly either.

I mean at your level your stat ratio hasn't broken 2.5/3.0 yet has it?

>>15288252
My main issue with savescumming is that the act quite literally eliminates RNG from this game. You can savescum crops until you get an artifact out of every unknown seed or a rare herb out of every herb seed, have 100% cast success for every skill, never miss an opponent, never take damage in duels, and never get negative effects from wells. You could savescum every single duplicate artifact into a godly piece with obscene bonuses or a living weapon. There's no real challenge in the game if you are willing to savescum.

>>15288252
>puppy cave by hopping back and forth
That's not save scumming. That's part of the game. You can do it at the void too. How can you even begin to compare that to backspace+enter map reload?

It's like equating town board quests to editing in 10,000pp with cheat engine.

Saving, going down the stairs, then using oracle, then reloading IS save scumming though.

>>15288252
Calling puppy cave broken is retarded. It's there as the new player's crutch very early game. Most of the desirable items have low spawn rates and will take hours to grind. To make more gold quicker fishing + cooking would be much more time efficient.

Honestly I enjoy the very early game part of bumbling around bumbling around puppy cave gradually identifying things and grabbing a set of shit gear. I'll quite happily defend puppy cave to the death.

>>15288284
Do static artifacts generate in the puppy cave? I only went through it once for the cooler box quest.

>>15288296
I was actually thinking of the crimson plate, which might generate on blades on the bottom floor. Not that I've seen that happen before though.

>>15288294
I don't care what methods people use if they enjoy the game. I was just replying based on opinions I had seen in the past. Similarly I don't claim to hold any opinion against people who would savescum. I don't have the right, nor do I really care. A game isn't something serious enough to make me hold a grudge against somebody because of their choices while playing it, and them save scumming doesn't affect my experience.

If elosnacking in things or save scumming makes their experience more enjoyable, I think even Ano would agree that they might as well go ahead and do it.

I will however, point things like this out when asked, precisely because other people tend to have very strong opinions related to this. I'd rather people be fully aware of whatever exploits or mechanics there are, and make the choice for themselves whether they use it or not - while understanding that if they want to talk about it, they'll probably garner very specific and very polar reactions.

I've spent more time testing the game and looking for bugs than I have actually playing it for fun, so I certainly won't claim to hold any authority in terms of how people "should" be playing the game - I'll leave that to other people.

>>15288296
>>15288344
I've had the Unknown Shell drop from there, so go through it enough and you can get the Crimson Plate from there.

What is the point of grinding puppy cave, when you can grind random dungeons and get small medals for that?

>>15288753
That's midgame, when you have more to work with and can afford to visit whatever dungeons you please. Puppy Cave is for early game.

>>15288809
There are plenty lvl 1 dungeons in early game. Mostly they are easier than last floors of puppy cave.

>>15288872
Puppy cave grinding never goes down to the last floors until MC can actually take care of it. Furthermore, if you're in it for item trawling (early tools, spell books, oracle scrolls), all you need to do is jump back and forth between floor 1 and 2. There's no reason to go further unless you're looking for a specific item, like the Crimson Plate.

>>15288395
There's nothing wrong with grinding on a game balanced around grinding m8, save scumming is an exploit but grinding isn't, it's made available to you purposefully!

What's the supposed natural elemental and magical resistances metal enemies are supposed to come with now? Will my pets get updated on that?

>>15289058
There were no changes to their standard resistance tables. It was just the bitflag that was adjusted. Don't think that there will be any adjustments immediately either. Right now it still seems like a test the waters phase as far as the Metal/Armor changes go.

Does the time stop from Shena's Panties also trigger on ranged attacks?

>>15289152
I don't know what you mean by that, since it's a throwing weapon. Do you mean whether it will time stop your bow/gun if you wield it in a hand, or whether it will stop time if thrown?

Either way, it only triggers if the panty is the weapon used to attack.

>>15289171
I meant if it triggers when you throw it, or if it only triggers if you use it in melee.

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My computer suddenly rebooted, and save file looks like this. It doesn't load. That's it? I can't restore save?

>>15289178
Fuck, fuck, fuck. That's so disappointing. Lost all fucking progress.

>>15289172
Both work.

>>15289208
Your daily reminder to back up saves, guys.

What effects meteor damage? I checked the wiki, but it didn't say anything.

>>15289407
Spell lvl?

>>15289410
Just that? Magic or will don't effect it?

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>>15289351

Is a golem a good choice for the race? I heard it lvl ups slowly, but I can't find any proofs of that in wiki. What are the downsides of golem except low speed?

>>15289448
Race doesn't really matter outside of role-play, the extremely early game if you're a fairy or mutant, or if you play an EX race like catgod. Even then it doesn't really matter.

I don't believe Golems get EXP penalties tho. Where'd you read that?

Have to admit, I've never heard of Elona before I accidentally stumbled on this thread. The game does seem super interesting so I'll give it a try.

>>15289448
I don't think there are any exp penalties. It's just that they're ultra slow with 50 speed.

What decreases pet training costs, Charisma?

>>15289485
Before you ask, yes the UI is terrible and the very beginning is quite the pain.

>>15289690
>UI is terrible
MUCH better than in any other rogue-like.