/lang/ - Language Learning

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>Language learning resources:
http://4chanint.wikia.com/wiki/The_Official_/int/_How_to_Learn_A_Foreign_Language_Guide_Wiki

http://www.duolingo.com/
>Duolingo is a free language-learning platform that includes a language-learning website and app, as well as a digital language proficiency assessment exam. Duolingo offers all its language courses free of charge.

>>>/t/746368
>Torrents with more resources than you'll ever need for 30+ languages.

https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B9QDHej9UGAdcDhWVEllMzJBSEk#
>Google Drive folder with books for all kinds of languages.

https://fsi-languages.yojik.eu/languages/oldfsi/index.html
>Drill based courses with text and audio.The Foreign Service Institute (FSI) is the United States federal government's primary training institution for employees of the U.S. foreign affairs community.These courses are all in public domain and free to download.Site may go down sometimes but you can search for fsi on google and easily find a mirror.

https://www.memrise.com/
>Free resource to learn vocabulary, nice flash cards.

https://lingvist.com/
>It's kinda like Clozemaster in the sense that you get a sentence and have to fill in the missing word, also has nice statistics about your progress, grammar tips and more information about a word (noun gender, verb aspects for Russian, etc.)

ankisrs.net/
>A flash card program

https://www.clozemaster.com/languages
>Clozemaster is language learning gamification through mass exposure to vocabulary in context.Can be a great supplementary tool, not recommended for absolute beginners.

https://tatoeba.org/eng/
>Tatoeba is a collection of sentences and translations with over 300 hundred languages to chose from.

radio.garden/
>Listen to radio all around the world through an interactive globe

https://forvo.com
>Has pronunciation for lots of words in lots of languages

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http://www.effectivelanguagelearning.com/language-guide/language-difficulty
>Check out information about languages and their difficulties

http://lexicity.com/
>An invaluable resource for comparative language study as well as those interested in ancient languages

http://cosmogyros.tumblr.com/post/108962232110/huge-new-language-learning-collection
>A very extensive language learning collection for 90+ languages.

http://www.dliflc.edu/resources/products/
>Similar to FSI, drill-based courses with text and audio issued by the US government.These courses were made for millitary personel in mind unlike FSI.

http://en.childrenslibrary.org
>Lots of childrens books in various languages, categories 3-5yo, 6-9yo, 10-13yo.

https://www.hellotalk.com/#en
>The app is basically whatsapp, but only connects you with people who are native in the language you are trying to learn. It also has a facebook type section where you can share pics and stuff too.

https://www.italki.com/
https://www.mylanguageexchange.com/
https://www.interpals.net/
http://www.gospeaky.net/
https://www.speaky.com/
https://polyglotclub.com/
http://lang-8.com/
>Few more language exchange communities like Hellotalk:

http://www.goethe-verlag.com/
>A mostly free site which offers audio and drill like exercises for 40+ languages.

http://www.languagetransfer.org/
>A free resource with recordings to learn a language.

https://babadum.com
>Flash card game with a focus on vocabulary.

http://context.reverso.net/translation/
>A website like Tatoeba (also has a Firefox extension!)


Previous thread: http://boards.4chan.org/int/thread/78024312#top

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>waiting a minute and clicking cars and traffic signs just to post a picture

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I updated my chart:
removed the mega links and posted them on a pastebin. I hope it should be more user friendly now.

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Do you guys curse in your target language? For example when you hurt your toe.

>What languages are you learning?
Polish. Just because i'm interested in Poland and the language not because "Muh race"

Serbo-croatian. I'm tired of hearing "Why don't you speak Bosnian" whenever i see family.

>>78117523
How hard is Serbo-Croatian for a Dutch speaker?

>>78117540
It's not THAT difficult, there are a fair amount of German loanwords and pronunciation is fairly similar although a bit tricky. Do keep in mind that i grew up around family speaking the language and i had some polish prior knowledge

Anyone have any doubt about specifics of Spanish or european spanish pronunciation hmu
>>78117093
Nice guide

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feel free to improve this or suggest improvements

>>78117030
I'm Learning French and after that will be Spanish

What is your opinion of anki? I like it.

>>78117368

Saved.

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>>78121354
>tfw too stupid for anki

>>78121354

I like it until a few weeks in an you have several hundred reviews to do.

>>78121505
Even with decks?

>>78121354
Had to shell out like £20 for the app since I'm an IOS goy and only really like doing flashcards on the go, but it's a helpful tool. Seems really good at drilling in those hard to remember words.

>Check out /lang/
>Water kraut is the only person making contributions to the thread

Fuck what happened? This used to be lively.

>>78121673

In pc is free.

>>78121505

Dude, you only need put The things you want to remember and every day review, then anki will organize everything. What is the hard thing?

>>78121811
I'd love to make more contributions, but I'm still a relative newbie, so anything I say would be dubious at best.

What about Tinycards, is it a waste of time? I've never used any of the flashcards apps, is this same as Anki?

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>>78122074
forgot pic.

>>78121948
This, not sure if I really should be giving advice to anyone yet.

>>78122074
>is this same as Anki?

Anki is a custom card program, I use it to remember everything I want to remember in the long run, from a phone number to language stuff and I honestly work very well.

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>>78121505
Same. I couldn't get accents to work on OSX. I use Quizlet because it's easier for me.

Learning Russian right now.
Highly recommend Alexander Lipson's books and tapes, they make it very fun to learn.

>>78121948
>>78122124
Newbies are just as valuable as people with multiple languages already because while you might not know the answer to specific questions, you have an idea what is working for you learning now. Yes you might only be seeing the tree and not yet the forest, but it is all helpful.

Are there any good resources for russian where structure is taught? Duolingo just throws words and phrases at you while expecting you to know why anything was structurally different.

>>78124418
Are you using the mobile version or on your computer? The web version should have grammar tips at the bottom of some lessons that will help with that.

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>>78117030
I asked in the last thread where would be a good place to learn afrikaans, but would anyone here care give me some resources? dankie

>>78124418
The web version does have more grammar tips, but Duolingo really takes the stance that you can pick it up with context and finding patterns over time. So at first you might not get it, but after you see that structure in a bunch of lessons you start to pick it up.

I think this theory makes works better with Spanish, Italian or French than it would something like Russia but I don't know.

How/where do I learn Latvian?

Can someone sell me on Italian?

My mums side is Italian but whenever i try learning it i drift away after a couple of weeks. I just don't find the language or the country that interesting.

>>78124848
If you feel like you're learning the language for anything but yourself, I don't think you're going to have much luck. Don't let your heritage tie you to a language.

>>78124215
do you have any link ? im interest

>>78117198
Id say to use RTK - Traditional Characters Edition.

It's probably a lot faster than that book and works rather well for learning the meaning.

>>78124446
Mobile
>>78124671
Guess I'll just plug on then

>>78125289
Are you using other tools? I'm learning a much simpler language and using multiple methods to reinforce my learning. I find I only really internalize something after it's been covered by a few tools, if that makes sense. Like I learn it in Pimsleur, see it in Duolingo...

>>78124848
Does any of your family speak the language? Talking to them would be great practice.

>>78125289
I like the Assimil book for Russian, however I'm using the French version, since it is my mothertongue, and can't comment on the English one. I imagine it to be very similar.

Each lesson is a conversation in which new vocab and grammar are introduced, with tips in the footnotes, and every 7 lesson is a revision one. You can also consult the index if you want to check specific information about grammar.

Other than that, you can buy/download "A Comprehensive Russian Grammar" if you need something more detailed and comprehensive.

>>78124848
I'm learning it (I'm a tourist here), don't really know what to tell you, better learn something you're interested in

>>78124848
Then learn something else. The only way for learning language to be pleasant is if you are interested in the language and culture.

>>78117368
>Do you guys curse in your target language?
No, I don't think anything will ever be able to replace the power of Québec French swearing, for me at least. There's just such a wide array of possibilities for every nuance you can imagine.

learning russian
how to not be discouraged by long time frames to get good?

I study maybe an hour a day and have native speaker friends (online)

will it really take forever to get to even B1?

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>>78125289
Check the desktop/web version for some grammar tips then

>>78125078
this is the book:
http://newstar.rinet.ru/~goga/biblio/lipson/lipson.html (first link there is for downloading it in djvu format).

>>78121354
I really like it but there are no good premade decks for Farsi. It made learning the alphabet really easy though.

>>78125849
thank you, i've found the book in pdf in other link but i didn't found any link for audio. Can you upload if it not too big ?

>>78117368
I don't really feel comfortable swearing in Spanish, it feels kind of disrespectful to swear without having full cultural knowledge. I wouldn't call my Mexican friends "cabrón" even though I hear people saying it to their friends all the time.

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>>78124418
>>78124446
>>78125289
>>78125348
>>78125827
>>78126018
Fuck off, we're full.

>>78121811
Everyone is too busy learning desu.

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>>78119400
How long would it take for a Dutchman to learn Deutsch who basically knows the language just by spending multiple weeks a year there? I can read and listen German but when it comes to throwing a sentence back I'm fucked

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>>78125887
>Quebec French swearing
>une calisse de feuille
Kek.Yeah, have to say it's something else.
The European variation is similar to Portuguese in that regard, reason why I try to use it. Regardless, cursing in s foreign language isn't always satisfying. Doesn't feel "right " if you know what I mean

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>>78124818
Just start! Teach yourself latvian and colloquial latvian are both great if you want to start there, otherwise check out the grammar book in the pack at the OP, also great.

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>>78126288

>>78126201
I'm not even learning Russian, was just helping him out. I'd like to go to St Petersburg once though.

>>78126201
pyд пocт

>>78124818
>>78126288
>someone asks how/where to learn Latvian
>someone ITT actually has learned (or is learning) Latvian and thus is able to help
kek, what are the odds?

Also, how mutually intelligible are Latvian and Lithuanian?

>>78125531

Unfortunately not. My Gran is the only relative who could speak it but she's getting old and it has sort of become a pidgin Italian with a lot english, Greek and Arabic randomly blended in.

>>78124978
>>78125835
>>78125851

It's the only language i have any real world connection to and i have the classic anglophone problem of wanting to learn a bunch but not being able to stick to any language.

>>78117540
If you know what Russian language is like, that's kind of what grammar is. It's really similar to Russian grammar. Grammar is worse than German, there are 7 instead of 4 cases. Pronunciation is really easy though, that's the only pro I would list. No genders, too (technically there is gender, but once you learn the endings (sunce, dijete - if it ends in an E, it's neuter) it's easy to remember.

My question is, why in the fuck would anyone learn this language in the first place?

>>78126890
I was the anon who got asked the question. I'm basically learning it because my parents are from former yugoslavia and they didn't teach me the language when i was young because they wanted to make sure i speak proper dutch first.

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>>78126576
You mean Petrograd.

>>78117070
>nasal sounds
You forgot nasal œ̃. It's merged with with ɛ̃ in northern France but elsewhere it's kept, so in some areas brin /brɛ̃/ and brun /brœ̃/ are not homophones . My group and I were taught to pronounce only ɛ̃ though, so it maybe doesn't even matter.

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>>78128030
>mfw in many parts of France, they pronounce "deux" and "de" the same
I'll never forgive the French for butchering my language

>>78127794
>Where were you born
St. Petersburg
>Where did you grow up
Petrograd
>Where do you live now
Leningrad
>Where would you like to live
St. Petersburg

h-historical jokes, amirite

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Do you guys know any good resources for Serbo-Croatian and Slovenian?

>>78126113
my upload speed is really shitty, sorry.
However they aren't really important, it's the text that's important. The tape is mostly used to hear the correct pronunciation of the words.

>>78128454
ok no prblem, i have tons of materials anyway plus youtube links, thanks for the book though

>>78128234
Did you come up with that yourself?

>>78128234
Where do I go to find a sad model-tier qt that wants to leave Russia and become my sex slave?

>>78128073
The French really are a bunch of savages. My pet peeve is how they turn every "è" into "é". "Je l'ai pas fé, je le ferai apré".

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>When the language you're learning uses retarded concepts like "Up week" to mean "Last week" and "Down week" to mean next week.
>When the language you're learning can't even keep it's retarded concepts in check when it says "up work" to go to work and "down work" to finish work even though you don't go to work in the past.

>>78129186
That's what you get for falling for the Chinese meme

I have some french links from youtube, but feel lazy af rn lmao bruh

>>78124625
Sorry I can't help you with any resources but just out of curiosity, what made you interested in learning that language?

Is french worth learning im concerned the country will just be a wasteland in next decade

>>78129186
>when the language you're trying to learn uses the same word for "morning" as it does "tomorrow"
I have no idea how to tell the difference.

>>78131077
If you like literature, then absolutely.
I don't think it will become a wasteland. That's too paranoid.

>>78131077
by that logic bongistan will turn into a caliphate but it's only london and like one other city that got enriched and that's because it's an internation trade hub
paris is much the same except that it's a slightly smaller trade center
the rest of the country is still the same france

>>78131077
Stop using memes as a escape goat

>>78131077
France has existed in some shape or another since 481 (even if you don't want to count the Frankish Kingdom as being France's predessor, then it still goes back all the way to 843). I just can't imagine it suddenly becoming a wasteland, at least not in the near future. It seems downright impossible.

>>78121354
I think it is one of the tools that helped me the most recently. Pretty easy to use since it has just what's needed. I began using before this year started and I have almost 500 words in my English deck.

>>78131337
la mañana - the morning (femenine)
el mañana - "the" tomorrow (masculine)

>>78131856
Wew, I was actually talking about German.

>>78131543
Eh, the countryside will remain nice. It's always the cities that end up really affected, and even then paris is exceptional.

>>78131896
What, how?
Next week in German is literally just next week, and last week just last week

>>78131928
Reread my original post.

Como devo pronunciar a "s" e o "r" para eu ter o sotaque (ou pronúncia?) mais "neutro" possivel.
(estou estudando o português do Brasil)

>>78131928
>>78131950
Hur durr, I fucked up with the week thing. Either way, it's the same in Dutch with morning v tomorrow. Easiest way to know the difference is that morning is noun, so will always be capitalized in German, whereas tomorrow generally is an adverb. (Though it can be used as noun, that is more rare)

>>78131896
Hehe, I thought it was just a thing in Spanish.

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>>78130666
I am moving to south africa in 1.5 years. I figured it would be best to learn afrikaans so i don't stick out too much there as a white man

Whats your routine /lit/? I wanna know. Give me a rundown

>>78132218

*/int/

>>78115601
Didn't see anyone else reply to this. "Mы c дpyгoм" is actually the only natural way of saying it. Russians poorly acquainted with foreign languages use the same wording and then they end up sounding odd. I am told this phrasing comes from Finno-Ugric grammar? I don't know.

>>78121354
how am I supposed to maintain reviewing so many cards? Especially when they're cards for kanji which have so much more to them than your standard flash card

why did lang-8 suspend making new accounts?

In Spanish when is it "mi" and when is it "mí" (with accent mark)?

>>78126378
Very helpful thanks! Do you know any entertainment or other things I could use to improve fluidity?

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>When Japanese learners complain about having to learn a few Kanji

Us Chinese learners literally cannot communicate without learning the Hanzi. It's not advanced level shit we have to learn it from day one.

>>78132546
>I am told this phrasing comes from Finno-Ugric grammar? I don't know.
"Mы c дpyгoм" literally translates to "we with friend", right?

I can't speak for other Finno-Ugric languages, but if that is indeed the literal translation, then Mari almost has the same thing, just with a slight difference.

That example specifically would be "we with my friend" (if I'm not mistaken, "мe йoлтaшeм дeнe", which is in fact "we friend-my with").

>>78133148
>mi
"my"

>mí
this is used when the 1st person singular is the object of a preposition, therefore it translates in English as "me" (one very common example would be "para mí", which translates to "for me")

>>78133507
Thanks!

>>78132011
Depende muito. Nosso "s" pode variar em s, z ou sh dependendo da palavra. Literalmente não há regras.Por exemplo,a palavra despesas é lida "deshpezas".
E nem vou começar com o nosso "r", há regiões que usam o r forçando a garganta, no RJ se diz como se fosse o 'h' do inglês...
>eu ter o sotaque (ou pronúncia?) mais "neutro" possivel
Isso não existe, melhor escolher um dos nossos sotaques e começar a imitá-lo. O mais próximo do que seria um "Received Pronunciation" é o sotaque do sudeste dito no Jornal Nacional. Sugiro tentar imitar o âncora
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3CAfl88rE0
O boa notícia é que tem todo o dia, então fonte não vai faltar. Basta digitar "Jornal Nacional" no Youtube.

>>78132814
That's what happens when you download a whole deck. Suspend all the cards except for the some of them (20-30?) and once you master them a little (when they have like a month until next review), unsuspend some other bunch of cards and keep on this way.

>>78132942

From /r/languagelearning

>In my opinion, this is terrible marketing to get people to sign up for their sister-site: HiNative. The problem with this is that HiNative doesn't even begin to replace what Lang-8 does, nor is it even made for the same reasons. Lang-8 is grammar based, and HiNative is... Well, people use it to ask how to say something in another language, which isn't that useful at all. I've never met so many serious learners as there are on Lang-8.

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>When the language you're learning makes you say "I grasped the phone and put it in the location of the bag's interior". Instead of just "I put the phone in the bag".

>>78133692
Obrigado.
Já tinha pesquisado um pouco sobre todas a formas que há de pronunciá-los e os diferentes sotaques, mas a minha mais grande dúvida é se eu deveria pronunciar a "s" como /ʃ/ ou como /s/.
(e mais uma coisa, há uma regra para quando a "s" soa como a z, e é quando esta está entre dois vocais)

>>78132218
Assimil, Duolingo, Anki. Repeat.

qts when I'm tired:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz_kg5DzRgo

>>78132218
Spanish. Pimsleur, Quizlet, Duolingo, qts, repeat. Similar to >>78134461

>>78134577
Oh and also Michel Thomas at night inbetween Duolingo and qts

>High Valerian, Klingon, and Welsh are all on duolingo
>Farsi isn't

>>78133194
I haven't found anything good, but check the usual sites as there is some latvian stuff, word courses on memrise for example. Search for latviešu valoda on youtube for movies and clips. There is not a lot of easy reading stuff, but I'm currently going through Riga Detektivs (on the state run site) which is really good but not for the complete beginner. My suggestion is to start with one of the books to get the basics down good first. Also I borrowed a dictionary from the library since the ones online are not that good imo, cooljugator is the best for lookng up verbs.

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Someone wants to talk in spanish with the latin american neutral accent? Im super bored

>>78134227
Why are you learning Mandarin if you hate it so much?

>>78134695
Yo

https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/6sleaj/hello_im_malachi_ray_rempen_creator_of_the_travel/

>>78117030
Can anybody here make any sense of this?
>>3219362

>>78128355
For slovenian there is a "slovene pack" on TPB
Otherwise the Strokes Easy Learning Slovene is not bad, but only available in Italian or German as teaching language.

K'r neki

>>78134732
Have whatsapp?

>>78132546
Thank you!

>>78134602
How long do you end up studying a day? I think I average to ~4h a day.

>>78135026
Sí, pásame tu número

>>78134025
so the parent company is trying to 首になる lang-8 because reasons, probably financial/because fuck you?

>>78133255
don't flatter yourself, I'm not complaining about the kanji, I'm complaining about how anki works

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Why do we call English a Subject-Verb-Object language when that's not how we order all sentences?
As soon as you get more complicated than "I love you" SVO breaks down.

We say "Why did you place that dish on the table". We don't say "You did why place that dish on the table".

>>78135221
>brainlets trying to speak linguistics
the subject "you" still precedes the verb "place", which is then superseded by the object "that dish"

>>78135435
But there's two words before the subject.

In Chinese they'd say "You why" instead of "Why you". So it seems chinese is much more SVO than English.

>>78135117
>How long do you end up studying a day? I think I average to ~4h a day.
It's hard to say exactly, but I'd say around that. I hope it pays off for us. I'm basically just working, studying spanish, and sleeping.

>>78135478
you're not serious are you

>>78135478
Chinese has a very analytical grammar, and English grammar is a lot less strict and has many exceptions.

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>>78135478

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Man, constantly switching between Latin and Cyrillic input methods is really mindfucking me. I'm happy that I've become quite comfortable typing in Cyrillic, but when I'm constantly switching between the two I start forgetting how to type in Latin (only briefly, of course, but it's still a weird thing to experience when you've been comfortably typing in Latin for as long as you can remember).

>>78135528
how did you get into the habit of it? Over years gradually doing it for longer daily? I've a couple of years of German in school under my belt and I've wanted to get into a daily habit but I keep going a couple of days and then not touching it again for months. I know it's as simple as just doing it and keep doing it until it sticks but do you have any practical tips?

>>78134253
>mas a minha maior* dúvida é se eu deveria pronunciar a "s" como /ʃ/ ou como /s/.
Depende como eu disse. Mas um dígrafo é sempre /s/, por exemplo passatempo, impressão, dissimulado etc
O /ʃ/ é o sh que se escuta muito em portugal e em alguns dos nossos sotaques. Não creio que se você misturá-los vá causar problemas de compreensão para ser sincero.
>(e mais uma coisa, há uma regra para quando a "s" soa como a z, e é quando esta está entre dois vocais)
lol nunca percebi mas tem razão. É a típica coisa que um nativo nunca se preocupa em pesquisar eu acho

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>>78135143
Mmm there is a million americans on int I think and just a few guatemalans It will be better if you give me your number

>>78135143
>>78136140
May I suggest you guys to talk on telegram? It will keep each other anonimity and no ones has to post personal phonenumber in this site. Alternatively create a fake email and then change numbers

>>78135435
the verb is did

>>78135880
Diving into a subject is just business as usual for me. I love picking something and spending all my energy on it, even if it takes a really long time. I think it would be extremely difficult to do this much per day unless you really were enjoying the process. You have to enjoy the journey as much as the result. The process of learning is fun for me.

It also helps I have no friends or family.

I'm not a believer of gradual. When I decided I wanted to be thin, I just stopped drinking that day and eat the right amount of calories until I got thin. When I quit drugs I decided I wanted to quit and I had to taper or I'd die (benzos), but the day I decided I stuck with it until I was clean. So I'd say just start today.

If you struggle to find time, I suggest making time early in the day. Maybe wake up an hour earlier and go to bed an hour earlier, then you know nothing will run late and cause you to miss that study hour.

Hope that helps.

tl;dr have autism

>>78135757
Post your routine Mari dude. I'm curious.

>>78135880
The hardest step is the first, so just do some practice in the morning asap, don't push it to later.
Have a calendar taped to your door/wall and cross the days you've reached your goal.

>>78136256
>>78136140
Good idea, I do have the app installed. My username is @americanon
If anyone knows the Telegram of that Iranian guy that left his username a few threads ago please post it. Alternatively if you're reading this, send me a message Iranian dude

>>78136330
It's my own struggle with consistency, not necessarily languages in particular. I do like the early idea, I think I'll trying this.
>>78136498
Do you know of anyway an American can get a good immersion experience in 90 days (how long an American can be in the Schengen zone without a visa) in Germany that wouldn't be too expensive and not goofy? I've done WWOOF stuff before and I think that anyone on that anyone hosting for that sort of thing is a lunatic. Anything similar, but a bit more official?

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>>78136587
I send you a message
>>78136256
Thanks dude

>>78136667
I have no idea, I'm a shut-in and IRL immersion isn't something I know a lot about. Hopefully another germanon can be more helpful.

>>78136498
It sorta depends (for example, initially I would obviously spend more time on things like practicing my handwritten cyrillic, basic pronounciation, etc.), but these days, in no specific order, it's typically something like:

>trying to decipher/translate some written stuff (usually from a children's newspaper which is available online)
>handwriting practice
>listening practice on the radio (especially when they're listing numbers, for example giving weather reports, giving times and dates, etc.)
>trying to translate and/or transcribe a couple of lines of lyrics from a song (which of course involves listening to said music)
>reviewing and learning vocab on memrise (though I probably should switch to anki, the only reason I haven't yet is that the memrise course is already created and I'm a bit lazy with creating new cards, downloading audio from forvo, etc.)
>continuing through the textbook (pretty much in a purely linear fashion)

Overall, maybe something like 2 hours per day, sometimes more, and obviously some days I might do quite a bit less and only do vocab+textbook when time is more limited. Also, the textbook is divided in "themes", which is 5 lessons, and at the end of each theme I like to take a "break" for a couple of days to focus solely on making sure I've properly assimilated all the contents from that theme and making sure that I don't have too large a list of words to review.

>>78135221
don't think there's any other time in english where you don't do SVO other than in questions and poetic expressions

>>78135221
Ignore the people calling you an idiot; I think it's a good question.

And the answer is because in linguistics there's this concept of the "unmarked" word order, which is the semantically-neutral statistically more common word order. This is typically that of statements, not questions. So English is consistently SVO: "I made the salad", "I made it".

For me the real question is why Spanish/Portuguese/Italian are considered "SVO" when they're actually SOV if O is a pronoun: "yo hice la ensalada", "yo la hice" (<- "I it made"). I don't really see any reason for giving more priority to nouns (over pronouns).

>>78135478
"why" is normally some sort of adverbial, not a verb

>>78136310
it's only partly a verb in that context, it's a auxiliary, or "helper" verb that really only acts to modify the wh- word behind it
place is still the verb of the sentence

>>78137298
>For me the real question is why Spanish/Portuguese/Italian
French too ("j'ai fait la salade", "je l'ai fait")

>>78137366
helping verb and main verb aren't really parts of speech. there can only be 1 real verb in a clause, which is 'did', and 'place' is an infinitive. infinitives are not verbs and can't be conjugated which is why you can't say things like "did he does?"
for this reason most questions in english are considered VSO

I think I asked something a little similar earlier but Turkish doesn't have articles, right? That means no word to say 'the' or 'a/an'. Why do I keep seeing examples saying 'bir xxx' to mean 'a xxx' instead of just seeing 'xxx'? Is it another example of duolingo just trying to make it easier for English speakers to get started?

>>78139592
it doesn't have articles but bir means 'one' and can be used like a/an but it's not needed

>>78134605
But Welsh isn't a constructed language?

>>78139752
So basically just use it to clarify if an object was singular instead of plural then? As far as I know right now Turkish doesn't really have a plural suffix, so 'elma yer' could be 'he eats an apple' or 'he eats apples'

>>78134605
I know that feel

>>78140238
yeah you can use bir like that. the plural suffix is ler/lar. this plural suffix is not always used when plural would be used in english

>>78140238
Err shit, I messed up something awful there. Of course there is the plural 'lar/ler' but you wouldn't use it in my example, would you?

>>78140663
Thanks. Do you happen to know when you would use the suffix and when you wouldn't? Is it based on if the word is the subject or object in the sentence?

>>78140728
in the subject you always use it. if it's the direct object you can only use the plural suffix if you would also use the accusative suffix e.g. "elmaları yer" is "he eats the apples"
so if it's a non-specific direct object as in "he eats apples" then you don't use it

>>78141023
Thank you! That's helpful

I really want to learn frencj but i dont really know where to start

Is this a good routine?

Duolingo, textbook grammar and reading french news/listening to french radio?

>>78141261
Take a look here: >>78117070

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>>78141261
Here is what I did
>Duolingo (at least 50xp per day)
>Memrise (all official French courses 1-7)
>Read internet articles and listen to music and look up a lot of stuff the above doesn't teach
>shitpost in /fr/

I started about 9 months ago, and today I did my first lesson in Assimil Using French. I think if I did it again I would use Assimil French with Ease from the beginning, as I never used Assimil before today and there seems to be a pretty good system. Another thing I did was hang out in /cp/ and chat up cute French girls but that was kind of pointless because I ended up talking to Russian girls in English.

>>78142045

What abbout grammar? Or is that in memrise/assimil? I think i should buy a text book

>>78135880
You just lack the will to do it. Don't think of it like something extra you have to do, but something that is part of your daily routine. I mean, do you skip brushing your teeth just because you don't feel like doing it? Surely not.

>>78142244
I looked up the basic conjugations for -ER, -IR, and -RE verbs before starting duolingo and memrise and picked up most of it organically through the comment sections on duolingo. I never did anything specific grammar work outside reading a few webpages on conjugation and never felt the need to. However, I had previous background in Italian and Spanish so romance grammar comes pretty intuitively to me.
Maybe Assimil French with Ease has grammar but I never used the book so I couldn't tell you.

fuck off. I cannot use either english or french. To be honest, languages became an important part of my life and the feelinf of losing or forgetting all trhe things I know it's just shite

>>78143242
>fuck off.
Why did you feel the need to include this?

I'm not even sure who or what that's supposed to be directed to.

>>78125827
Do you have a link for the english assimil?

>>78143854
fuck off

Why is "syyskuu" written that way in Finnish? What happened to the vowel harmony?

>>78143208
and how well do you speak french

Anyone learning Spanish? Is there anything like a Tae-Kim's guide to Japanese Grammar for Spanish?

When learning Japanese, I never did any type of official Japanese textbook. Is there anything like that for Spanish? Like a Core2k/6k deck and/or grammar guide?

Drumpf

>>78124150
hold down the key. For è you just hold e

>>78145762
I just had a look at Tae-Kim's "Guide to Japanese Grammar", and if you mean a grammar textbook that comes with (short) vocab lists in every unit and is written in a fairly informal, casual way...
I don't think there's anything like it for Spanish, but I might consider writing such a thing myself.

There is such a book for Standard Arabic though: Haywood and Nahmad's "A New Arabic Grammar for the Written Language".

>>78145356
Pretty well; I write and read better than speak obviously.

>>78140694
Correct.

>>78144131
It's on TPB.

>>78143242
You seem to be using English fine.

>>78132218
Procrastinate x10

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Is the Mari station up yet?

>>78119400
Add that literally every fucking game, movie, cartoon and TV show is dubbed in German so you never run out of media

>>78147824
I forgot there's 2 different things on the site.

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar

I meant this one, a concise guide to the grammar that uses some vocab sprinkled in to teach you (it's all base-level stuff you learn with a pre-made deck).

More importantly though, it's optional to pay for it. It even has a nice android app that's pretty well done.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.alexisblaze.japanese_grammar

I think the people of /djt/ have probably put more time and effort into making Japanese learnable than most people do with the languages they're learning so I'm not surprised if something like Spanish, which already has tons of material, doesn't have something like that. But it'd be nice.

>>78151186

Does Germany make any decent TV/Films?

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Well, I am officially half-way through my Russian textbook lads. The qts are only a few lessons away now.

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>>78125887
>I don't think anything will ever be able to replace the power of Québec French swearing
Step aside.

>>78133309
Gotta love Finno-Ugric grammar.

>>78135117
You're absolutely welcome.

>>78135757
All Russians do this. It becomes second nature to switch between layouts. I actually haven't heard of your problem before; it's probably -because- you've only typed in Latin all your life.

anyone know a book/etc for esperanto? duolingo is fine and all and I can accept that failing is a part of learning languages but it's infuriating having duolingo just throw words at you that you don't know or haven't learned yet

>>78125887
>No, I don't think anything will ever be able to replace the power of Québec French swearing
that's because it's bloody glorious
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvR6-SQzqO8

>>78152758
https://www.fluentin3months.com/german-language-movies/

If "ничeгo" means "nothing" and "ceбe" means "yourself", how is it that "ничeгo ceбe" means "very impressive"?

I'm becoming frustrated with Duolingo. I'm up to the "expressions" module for chapter 1 but there's a lot that doesn't make sense to me. I think I need to go and properly learn grammar from a reputable source before these language apps will be of any use for me.

>>78153981
Er, memrise rather, not duolingo. I gave up on duolingo long before memrise.

>>78153981
"Hичeгo" has the colloquial meaning of "okay", "not bad". "Ceбe" sometimes modifies the preceding word to express something like a sense of individuality on that word, a comparison to something else. I'm not good at explaining this.

In essence thus, "ничeгo ceбe" has a range of meaning from "kinda bad" to "very impressive", which you can tell from context. Related is "тaк ceбe", which only means "not that great".

"Hичeгo тaкoe ceбe выpaжeниe" - "it's quite an interesting expression" (crudely translated).

>>78152758
german war films are pretty gut

>>78154323
Example exchange

Кaк тeбe тyт? ("How do you like it here?")
Дa ничeгo ceбe тaк. ("Well, it's okay") (pronounced "дa ничё ce тaк")

>>78153981
This phrase expresses immediate astonishment not your relation to the event and could be translated as "I couldnt imagine what Im seeing/hearing".

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What's the fastest you've learned a language, /lang/?

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I'm creating my own language.

>>78156084
I was close to fluent in Icelandic within a year, not sure if that's really "fast" though considering I already spoke a north germanic language.

>>78156147
When I was a kid my friend and I made our own language and we'd sit on the train and try to talk in it. He got killed by a drunk driver shortly after we started though.

>>78156249
Man, that's sad. I'm sorry for your loss. I'll dedicate my endeavors to your long lost friend.

Get a Ouija board and tell him I said sup.

>>78156279
Thanks senpai. Good luck with your language.

>>78144690
That's a compound with two words, syys (autumnal) and kuu (moon, month). You can put together two or more words that way regardless of what sort of vowels they have. Like for example
>tehdastyöläinen (tehdas=factory, työläinen=worker)
>harmaapäätikka (harmaa=grey, pää=head, tikka=woodpecker)

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I wonder how long it will take me to get through all these. I'm trying to do 200 cards per day.

Próbálok magyarul tanulni

>tfw not at least C1 in German

>>78117093
Is there a guide for Spanish not written by a beginner?

>>78158622
I don't know.
I just posted the guides made by others and my one.

>>78158622
Don't think so and I'm here basically every day. I'm the author of that guide. I plan on updating it as I progress.

I'm not sure how old /lang/ is but we seem to have more effort being put into OC recently so you might see one pop up eventually.

>>78158622
I'm not a beginner (I estimate my written Spanish at B2 and my spoken Spanish at B1), maybe mine will help: >>78117295

I apologize if it looks like shit, obviously the aesthetics weren't what I was focused on.

>>78153579
damn, versatile as fuck

>>78150837
Nope, but incidentally yesterday I found out that someone had already asked them about their website on their VK page (several days ago) and he never got a response either, so I'm guessing that whoever was responsible for their website, their VK page and other such things is probably ded or on vacation or something.

>>78160104
I know you just kinda glossed over it in your guide, but would Michel Thomas' method work to get you to A2? Or would you need a textbook to supplement?

Man, who was learning Russian and wanted to talk to me to help learn English, where are you disappeared?

At the moment my German study mostly consists of working through a grammar book (+ exercises) and Anki flashcards. I try to translate the odd song and watch a German film every so often, but nothing structured.
I'd like to diversify a bit more, but I'm not exactly sure what'd be best. Any suggestions?

>>78160796
Talk to people.

>>78160822
I'm still at a very basic level, but I do have a Hello Talk and Tandem accounts I could use.
How do you think they'd feel about accommodating someone who's not yet at a conversational level?

>>78160862
Annoyed

>>78160878
Thought as much. I'll help some Kraut with English, then when my German improves, come back to them.

>>78160635
Since you said the other day that you wanted people to correct your English, here's an improved version of your post:

>Whoever was learning Russian and wanted to talk to me to help me learn English, where have you gone?

>>78161010
Thanks a lot.
>Where have you gone
This is right because he has gone by now?
>to help me
Because you can't understend to help whom?
And can you explain difference between "who" and "whoever" in this case?

>>78161302
>This is right because he has gone by now?
I think technically "Where have you disappeared" is also correct, it just doesn't feel like a natural thing to say, unlike "Where have you gone".

>Because you can't understend to help whom?
pretty much

>And can you explain difference between "who" and "whoever" in this case?
"Who" is used if it's a question, "whoever" is just a generic word which means the same as what you were trying to say with "Man, who". It's the same idea as "whatever", but with a person instead.

>Who was learning Russian?
>Whoever was learning Russian is ...

Alternatively, you also could have said something like "To the person who was learning Russian: where have you gone?". This is less "correct" technically, but it's a very common way of saying it in everyday speech.

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>When your online course tells you it's time to learn a bunch of irrelevant vocab you will NEVER use

>>78156848
what's this?

>>78162245
Quizlet Long Term Learning

>>78162081
Now I understand, thanks again.

>>78161302
By the way, how would you say it in Russian?

My attempt:

Ктo yчyлcя pyccкoмy языкy, и хoтeл мнe пoмoчь yчyтьcя aнглиccкoмy языкy, кyдa ты yхoдил?

Everything is wrong, I imagine.

>>78162422
fuck, ignore that, I meant to copy paste this:

Ктo yчилcя pyccкoмy языкy, и хoтeл мнe пoмoчь yчитьcя aнглийcкoмy языкy, кyдa ты yхoдил?

Although these books don't have vocabulary lists, there's Routledge's "Basic Spanish: A Grammar and Workbook", "Intermediate Spanish: A Grammar and Workbook" and "Spanish: An Essential Grammar", all of which use fairly easy vocabulary. They're not as informal as Tae-Kim's Guide though. They're also not legally free of cost, although you can find pirated PDFs easily.

How do I glottal stop? I can do it between vowels but at the start of a word I can't

>>78162781
Who are you talking to? Did you forget to reply to someone?

Thanks for these though, I'm also a spanish learner and always interested in resources.

>>78162472
I think the dative construction here is a bit weird. I think of a craft, not a language.

[Toт?], ктo yчил pyccкий язык и хoтeл мнe пoмoчь yчить aнглийcкий, кyдa ты yшeл? (yхoдил -> yшeл)

There are various stylistic problems with the above sentence.

You can't just begin your sentence with an interrogative pronoun. Note that the Russian anon did the awkward "Man, who..." with the singular purpose of avoiding an initial "who" that he thought was incorrect in English. That should be telling.

It's more typical to say "disappeared" rather than "gone" (yшёл means went/walked away, nothing more). Actually, the Russian anon did just that. So you should have said "пpoпaл" or more colloquially "дeлcя".

Finally, participles (yчивший, хoтeвший) are preferred in Russian speech.

I'll use "aнoн" for a subject.

Aнoн, yчивший pyccкий язык и хoтeвший oбщaтьcя co мнoй для тoгo, чтoбы пoмoчь мнe yчить aнглийcкий, кyдa ты пpoпaл?

This is probably what he had in mind. I tried to translate close to his own words.

>>78162472
Almost everything right. You don't need first comma and instead of "yхoдил" you should say "yшeл".

>>78163121
Oh, wow. Now i'm embarrassed of my Russian as well.

>>78162081
I think with "Where have you disappeared" you would have to say "Where have you disappeared to" to make it proper. But in this case you're still right in saying 'Where have you gone" instead.

>>78117030
any of these flowcharts for china language

>>78163072
Yes. Somehow I forgot to include the >> thing to reply to >>78151826

>>78163121
when to use partitive (used by genitive) in russian?
in estonian you use it as a direct object too with uncountable or rather undefined amounts and ongoing or incomplete actions

for example:
I drink water - ma joon vett (vett is water and is partitive)
in russian it is - я пью вoдy but it is not in genitive for the partitive form?
when to use russian partitive?

I hope that makes sense lol..

French guy in Barcelona, any local who knows a good place to learn Spanish?

>>78163350
Still, thanks for the vote of confidence, it means I might sound less stupid to some Russians when I decide to use italki/hellotalk/etc

>>78163121
I still have so, so much to learn. Thanks a lot!

>>78163072
He wrote the reply to me, but he forgot his handle. So he deleted the post and reposted it, forgetting to site my post.

>>78162781
Informal doesn't matter so much as free of cost. I can download illegally but I prefer not to. I was just wondering if anyone put something like that together.

In fact, it'd be great if the learners of /lang/ could put something like that together. Instead of leeching from society they could contribute to it. An effective open-source language resource is always welcome in our community.

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>>78163614
>вoдy
isn't that simply the accusative case?

I can't speak for Russian, but the other two languages which I know at least a little about and which use declension (Mari and German) don't have any concept of partitive to my knowledge, they simply use the accusative regardless of how "countable" the object is.

>>78163614
>>78164420
Ah nevermind, I just checked the Wiki page on the Partitive case (which I should have done initially), I see what you mean now

>>78163959
Barcelona

>>78164189
>In fact, it'd be great if the learners of /lang/ could put something like that together. Instead of leeching from society they could contribute to it. An effective open-source language resource is always welcome in our community.
Great idea, you should start :^)

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>>78164573
I honestly would, but I know like 3 words in Spanish.

>>78163959
Why not Catalan? It's even more related to French and you're in the speaking area already.

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>>78164655
Well make content as you go, that's what I've been doing (when not "leeching from society"). Doesn't have to be something big. I made this when I was learning mis adjectivos demonstrativos.

>>78164787
I wish I had a choice but I need it for work, I'll probably learn Catalan after.

>>78164958
http://fr.assimil.com/ + duolingo + anki/quizlet/cards + lingvist + qts

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why am i so shit at memorising anything but verbs and nouns

>>78164498
yeah its a concept not many languages has and it seems russian uses it in a strange way and through the genitive case

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Here's an interesting fact: the vitality of the Chuvash language is roughly equal to that of the Mari language. For example, the proportion of ethnic Mari in Russia who speak Mari is roughly 71%, just a little less than Chuvash at 73%. Furthermore, both UNESCO and Ethnologue give the exact same language vitality "score" to both languages.

And yet, Chuvash has every reason to be much healthier than Mari:
>number of speakers in Russia is over a million (2.7 times higher than the number of Mari speakers in Russia)
>the proportion of ethnic Chuvash in Chuvashia (which is right beside Mari El) is 68%, which is MUCH higher than the proportion of ethnic Mari in Mari El, at 44%
>the proportion of all ethnic Chuvash in Russia who live in Chuvashia is 57%, which is a bit higher than the proportion of all ethnic Mari in Russia who live in Mari El, at 53%

In fact, the demographics of Chuvashia aren't so different from those of a country like Estonia, and yet their language is faring much worse than Estonian. I really wonder why that is.

>>78165699
because administrative language is russian

>>78165791
>because administrative language is russian
Obviously, but wasn't it also the same in the Estonian SSR?

Or did they receive special treatment because of being their own SSR rather than being being of the Russian SSR?

>>78165940
>being being
being part*

Could someone translate this song for me, as I feel stupid for always singing along but not knowing what I'm singing, I get what are they saying the chorus, but the rest is too much for my 1 year of jerking off in spanish class, I would post lyrics, but can't find them anywhere.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66ZxEeyjFKk

>>78165101
Thanks anon

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>>78166060
Good luck. I've been learning spanish and I'm absolutely floored with the Periscope qts. You're lucky as fuck to be living there.

Their time schedule is weird though, dinner at 10pm and all that, mid afternoon shutdown, I guess start later?

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>whizz through first 50 anki cards
>last 20 take me almost double the time

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>>78166239
>nearly 1000 cards in the pool
>adding faster than I can learn
Do I stop Duolingo and Pimsleur progression until I catch up? Every other day I'm adding 30 cards from Pimsleur, and Duolingo is probably another 15 per day.

>>78164189
>>78164573

I think I'm actually going to start writing something. Right now.

I'll put it up on the Internet and make it legally free of cost to read (probably just some simple HTML and CSS on neocities.org) too. However I don't see much of a point in making it open source on Github, as I don't think anybody else is going to contribute.

>>78166028
It's too much effort to transcribe and translate a song. It'll take me more than an hour, and there's bits I can't even understand because the instruments are too loud. It's an ode to the guitar. Here's a fragment of the lyrics in English:
>"...O guitar... you're a friend of the throat... new upon the light of dawn, singing to lovers in squares and serenades, you're the master and lady of the Cuban country-side. Midnight guitar, midday guitar, guitar of sadness, guitar of happiness. You were born when love was made song and poetry in order to moan in your own voice or follow the melody..."
Etc. etc.

>>78164829
I'd like to make content like that but I don't have an inkling of photoshop wizardry.

teach me desu

>>78166210
Yeah the girls here a crazy, totally different from France, and the life schedule is comfy as fuck.

>>78163614
Partitive is standard in phrases like "выпeй вoды" (stress on "ы") - "drink (some) water", as opposed to "выпeй вoдy" which is more like "drink the water" (an instruction for a finite amount of water). It cannot be used with an imperfective verb.

Essentially, it translates to "some [of]", or in negative sentences "no..." "not any...", kind of a blanket denial. With the accusative case the meaning is precise.

>>78164085
So long as you keep believing! Russian grammar is just German +1. (I sometimes post under Serbia because of proxy shenanigans)

>>78165529
It was originally (somewhat) distinct but it fell together with the genitive. It's still observed in phrases like "чaшкa чaю" (genitive would be "чaя"). Some people actually say чaя but it sounds too correct, too bland.

Can we talk about learning discipline?
What do you do when you're not motivated or something?

>>78167909
Waste my time on 4chan sadly enough.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZQRHMf_bPE

>tfw will never speak an occitan dialect because resources are basically non-existent

>>78167615
>>78167789
so "я пью вoдy" would mean "i drink water" in general? or like you said "i drink the water"?
but thank you!

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>Polish for whale(Wieloryb) literally translates to multi-fish

>>78166210
Taking an hour to hour and a half long nap during the mid-afternoon shutdown is what propels the Spaniards to do things later. Taking a midday nap like that also means you needn't sleep as much at night. With the siesta sleep schedule five and a half hours of sleep a day is actually healthy. This is off-topic for lang thread, but I hope I've answered a curiosity.

>>78167187
Just make a wiki. You might be surprised at contributions over time.

>>78167187
>>78169092
I agree. I don't know about github but I'm sure there are other options. Go to /djt/ and take a look at their guide. It's almost entirely a bunch of hodge-podge contributions.

Also, the project will undoubtedly take a long ass time. If you're planning on working on this for several years, you should open it up in case you disappear for whatever reason as that would allow the work to continue.

As I progress through Spanish, I'd certainly like to make contributions to it myself. Even if its just something like editing existing content or helping design a webpage or something.

>>78168680
Would Dutch naturally be a triviality for a Franco-English speaker?

>>78169092
The problem with Wikis is that the content itself tends to be poorly written, poorly organized, and often has problems with inconsistencies (in terms of actual content, writing style, standards, etc.). These problems would also apply to an open source project on github.

If the Salvadorian Anon actually has the motivation, time and ability to write an actual online book, it'd probably be best that way, seeing as having one author do everything will inevitably result it in being much better organized. However, what would be good would be if he could get other people to help him, proofread, and make suggests. This would especially be relevant for people who've learned some Spanish, since their (or rather, our) perspective would likely be highly relevant for such a book.

>>78170119
>and make suggests
suggestions*

Speaking of proofreading, I really ought to proofread my own posts.

>>78169596
If you mean as in Mutual intelligibilty- then no because Dutch is too different from French and English
If you mean as in general relevance- yes unless you work at a camping or something

>>78169092
I don't know. The book for learning Spanish on Wikibooks has been around for 15 years and it only has 9 units.

>>78169347
LOL, the /djt/ guide is literally a neocities.org website.

There's not much original content beyond the intro article though. It mostly contains exactly the kind of content that's more easily crowdsourced (read: links, including links to pirated materials... they also made a digitized edition of a (pirated?) grammar book, used as their "grammar reference"!).

Using a Google form for feedback should be trivial. And you could easily get an archived form of the whole website from Github anyway, as a .zip file.

>>78170119
I certainly have the time, but my ability to do it is kind of a question mark, and I don't know if I can maintain the motivation to do it for a long time (I have never written a book). We'll see...

>>78167187
Thank you

>>78171200
>I certainly have the time, but my ability to do it is kind of a question mark, and I don't know if I can maintain the motivation to do it for a long time (I have never written a book). We'll see...
I think I know how you feel. I myself love helping others learn French, and I can't count how many times over the years I've helped answer some questions people on /int/ had about French, and every time I've done so I've always been very happy and enthousiastic about it. As a result, I've often wondered if I should perhaps consider writing a book of some sort, especially since I have the advantage of also being a native English speaker. But when I start thinking about the dedication required to actually follow through with such a project, I start doubting myself.

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>>78171200
>LOL
Like I said, it's hodge-podge. The point is, there is no such guide for Spanish. You can laugh all you want but your only advice so far has been some shit about an Arabic book and some condescension about the "casual" method used in Tae-Kim.

Your holier-than-thou attitude makes me think it's a good thing you're a lazy shit and won't do anything.

The quest continues for a true guide to learning Spanish. And certainly one written by someone more enlightened than a Canadian obsessed with El Salvador (for some reason).

>>78172318
>a Canadian obsessed with El Salvador
he's Salvadorian, m8

>>78172318
Uh, I was laughing at the fact that it was hosted for free on neocities.org, the same place where I was thinking of hosting this grammar book I'm planning to write.

The /djt/ guide, legally dubious and all, looks legitimately VERY useful for somebody learning Japanese.

You've also got it backwards: I WANT to write a legally free, online casual grammar book like Tae Kim's. I think it's very good for such things to exist.

>The quest continues for a true guide to learning Spanish.
Yeah, note that I don't plan to make such a website for Spanish, just a free-of-charge informal book to learn grammar, like Tae Kim's.

So I posted about this earlier, but at the moment my German study mainly consists of a grammar book (+ exercises), Anki cards, and translating German music along with watching the odd film with subtitles
I'm still at a pretty basic level, but I'd like to diversify a bit. There are so many apps for learning it seems a bit overwhelming (Lingvist, Clozemaster, Quizlet, Duolingo, etc.). What'd be recommended? Or to better phrase it, what worked/is working for you?

>>78172812
If so, why is he learning Spanish? Do they not speak Spanish in El Salvador now?

>>78172872
>Yeah, note that I don't plan to make such a website for Spanish, just a free-of-charge informal book to learn grammar, like Tae Kim's.

Based on your attitude, I doubt you'll be able to.

>>78173439
>If so, why is he learning Spanish?
I don't recall him ever saying he was

>>78173439
Out of curiosity, you the same guy who was calling some languages ugly the other day?

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I just got here today, bb. Nice try though #FakeNews

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>finally summoned the courage to create a VK account (which was annoying because you need to provide a phone number which is probably collected by the FSB, but whatever)
>ask a language-related question about Mari
>got a reply
>mfw this is the first time I've actually had some sort of dialogue in Mari
Though unfortunately the reply wasn't excessively clear (and probably my question wasn't clear in the slightest), but I think I still understand the reply.

>>78175017
>tfw Sento will never be your grillfriend

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>>78175127
ok, scratch that, I just reread the reply and it's not clear at all, actually it only creates more questions

>>78175364
For how long have you been learning this meme language

>>78175460
a bit less than a month

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>tfw to autistic to skip ahead to the chapter on verb conjugation even though the book specifically tells me that it's not intended to be worked through in order

>>78175559
What did you ask? Maybe you can say you didn't understand and if they can write their answer in English, or Russian if they don't speak English.

>>78175772
It was concerning an exercise I did a while ago in the textbook I'm using, involving translating an English sentence into Mari. When I first did it I used a certain word order, but the exercise key used a different word order. Unfortunately, the book really doesn't elaborate much on word order, except for the most important things. I was curious if what I did was correct, or if it was wrong and I simply had to remember a specific word order for that type of sentence.

But when the guy replied, he gave a third word order. He didn't write anything else at all, he simply rewrote the sentence with a new word order (when I first read it I thought he had written it with the same word order as I did, which I had interpreted as meaning that it was ok). So now I'm wondering if he misinterpreted my question to ask if there are other word orders, or if somehow both word orders are wrong (which would imply that the textbook is wrong). So yeah, now I'm quite confused.

>>78175364
Your despair is amusing. Thank you mari-anon!

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>>78177362

>>78177446
Do you know Russian, or are you finding ways to learn Mari via English?

I'm interested in learning a particular smaller African language but the few resources that exist are in Swahili

>>78177602
>or are you finding ways to learn Mari via English?
This

Of course, if I'm to be perfectly objective about it, it would be a better idea to learn Russian first, as learning Mari without speaking Russian is a bit like learning Irish without speaking English (not impossible by any means, but definitely more of a challenge, and much less useful). However, in my case, I don't really care, seeing as I'm not learning it for any sort of practical reason, not to mention that for the time being there are more than enough ressources in English thanks to scholars from various European countries taking an interest in the language.

>I'm interested in learning a particular smaller African language but the few resources that exist are in Swahili
what language?

>>78177740
Interesting

>what language?
Lomwe, plus I have some resources from the cloesly related Makua.

There's a few resources in Portuguese, but they're all very old and tend to mix and match portions of different languages and present things how they're not really used.

Aside form that the best I've got is some childrens books and portions of the Bible translated by the Jehova's Witnesses.

>>78177945
>Lomwe
that's a peculiar choice of a language to learn (though I realize I'm not really in a position to talk)

Why do you want to learn it?

>>78173210

Lingvist > Duolingo

>>78178220
I lived in a village that spoke it as a volunteer once upon a time. Now I'm kicking myself for not gathering as many resources as I could.

So mostly nostalgia, plus it's a pretty neutral jumping point for the rest of the languages in Mozambique/southern bantu area

>>78176065
As far as Finnish grammar goes, word order is pretty flexible and you can change it around depending on what you want to emphasize in the sentence. I'd guess Mari is similar in that regard though i am no expert

>>78164829
** adjetivos demostrativos

>>78178370
Lingvist looks better, but Duolingo feels more organized to me. Also, there aren't any clubs in Lingvist afaik, and thanks to clubs I've been studying twice as much just because I'm in competition with some American named "Paul".

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>>78178912
The only source I've been able to find online which seems to elaborate further on the topic is in Hungarian, unfortunately.

I THINK that Mari is also relatively free in terms of word order (except that finite verbs pretty much always go to at the end of a sentence), but I can't know for sure for the time being. Maybe tomorrow I'll ask some Magyars briefly translate pic related in case it has the answer I'm looking for.

>>78179504
Out of curiosity, are you more or less following this chart here >>78117111, or are you using a different method?

Either way, how are you finding it?

>>78129186
>in japanese 前 means "in front of" or "forward" and 後 means "backward"
>but in terms of time, 前 refers to the past and 後 refers to the future