Cuba

You may as well ask if Poland wouldn't be more successful without Germany and the USSR completely liquidating their intellectual/professional class.

The US sanctions keeping other countries from trading with Cuba as well as the US government keeping Cuba on the list of "state sponsors of terrorism" are why the quality of life is so low.

100 years ago Teddy Roosevelt said in a speech that Puerto Rico must eventually join the US but Cuba was strong enough to stand on it's own.

It has a high potential and was destroyed by the American right wing as with many other countries.

>>75885829
>>>/leftypol/

I saw on /his/ that the USSR funded up to 20-30% of Cuba's GDP so the answer is no.

>>75885892
Just means the economic damage from communism was even greater than Cuba's present output and standard of living indicate

no. cuban people are highly irresponsible, unable to plan for the future, profoundly interested in sex and showing off to their friends and strangers rather than responsibly working a job, etc.

>>75886100
Maybe the people who came to Miami on a raft.
My girlfriend's grandpa was from a wealthy family, came here on a plane, became an architect, and even refused to speak Spanish at home

Cuba is shit today, less because of it's economic system but the embargo we've had up until the last 2 years

Cuba was doing fairly okay when trading with the Soviet Union was a thing.
It would have been interesting what would have happened to them if they were allowed to trade with the rest of the world like any other country.

Cuba threads are shit because of gusanos from /pol/. Unless it's an actual cuban posting in castellano, this threads should be fucking banned

Also it would depend on how Fulgencio Batista's reign came to an end and what replaced it.

>>75885764
Well Cuba is succesful for a communist country, so probably yes

>>75885892
if they where not commies, the US would've done the same

>>75885829
>The US sanctions keeping other countries from trading with Cuba as well as the US government keeping Cuba on the list of "state sponsors of terrorism" are why the quality of life is so low.


Cuba's GDP per capita was twice that of the Dominican Republic's in 1950; now they're on par. This is despite the fact that Cuba got MASSIVE aid from the USSR to the point where it shouldn't even be considered an independent economy. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/03/16/world/soviet-said-to-reduce-support-for-cuban-economy.html

Soviet stipends to Cuba averaged $4-5 billion during the 1980s, and were probably larger before that when the USSR had more money to throw around. Cuban GDP in the 80s in 2005 dollars was between $25-$40 billion. In 1988 dollars that deflates to $14-24 billion. In other words, about 25% and possibly as much as 35% of Cuba's entire GDP was Soviet donations and nothing else. This was massive aid they got.

http://stat.kushnir.mk.ua/en/gdp/cu.html

Now how does that compare to what the USA did to hurt them? For that we can compare the basket-case of South Africa, which was embargoed by half the world including both the USSR and USA. The cost of trade sanctions against South Africa overall were estimated at an annual 1.3% of their GDP. Even if, against all logic, being embargoed by the USA alone hurt Cuba over twice as much as being embargoed by the USA plus a bunch of other countries hurt South Africa, all it would have actually done (being extremely generous) is reduced the net value of USSR aid by about a tenth.

http://www.snf.ch/sitecollectiondocuments/nfp/nfp42p/nfp42p_staehelin-e.pdf

>>75886532
>if they where not commies, the US would've done the same

Name one country where American stipends accounted for a quarter of the entire GDP for several decades. Definitely not South Korea or Taiwan, which were Sub-Saharan African levels of poor from 1950 to 1980, and now are multi-folds better off than Cuba. Not Chile or the Dominican Republic, which each had less than half of Cuba's wealth per person in 1950 but are both higher today. Not any of the post-CW ex-Warsaw Pact countries like Poland and Czechoslovakia.

The sanctions are pretty heavy which fucked Cuba.

Iran would be much better off without sanctions currently. That's why sanctions are used nowadays because it's war under economic means.

>>75886587
South Korea and Taiwan got baby sat by America for decades.

>>75886501
Regardless of your stance Cuban diapsora ruin any discussion on Cuba. Fuck, majority of them are Cuban only in name but once it pops up the Cubano pride and chestbeating emerges.

>>75886672
South Korea and Taiwan got more economic help from Japan compared to the U.S. Only thing that the U.S. did to really help them is achieve peace and consumer their manufactured goods.

>>75886654
>The sanctions are pretty heavy which fucked Cuba.
>Iran would be much better off without sanctions currently

Oh gee too bad, maybe they shouldn't have been state sponsors of terrorism.

>>75885764
Lets see, the Philipines were liberated at the same time from the same people, I wonder how it went for them.

Also
>banana republics

>>75886918
>cuba
>2000
>terrorists
Lol no

>>75886478
>It would have been interesting what would have happened to them if they were allowed to trade with the rest of the world like any other country
You clearly don't understand how communism operates. Allowing free economic activity would undermine the entire system. Castro never wanted the US embargo to end; it was a useful political weapon for him, besides doing so would mean the swift collapse of the regime.

>>75886993
In recent times, no, they're bankrupt, but back in the 70s-80s they were a major sponsor of terrorism.

>>75887011
They aren't bankrupt. They made some market reforms and are getting as much sweet oil dosh from Venezuela as they used to get from the USSR. They don't sponsor terrorism or anything anymore because not even they still believe in communism

>>75885764
Hi Cuban-American here. Well honestly yeah, first of all if it won the revolution and didn't go Communist then there would be NO embargo as Cuba would not be support Russia and taking in nukes. And also CUBA would be a well off country if they were capitalist, they got an AMAZING and beautiful country with beautiful beaches and churches. They would easily profit off Tourist and vacations.

>inb4 you say " BUT CUBA NEEDED SOVIET RUSSIA "

Yeah but soviet Russia collapse and Cuba needs to learn by itself without support from other countries.

>>75886672
>South Korea and Taiwan got baby sat by America for decades.

South Korea and Taiwan got jack in economic aid from the US. Bring sources.

>>75887586
They aren't exactly well off either. Health care is shit, education is shit. Doctors are paid shit and once you get an education there isnt anything you can do with it. That's what I remember, but I don't think it changed one bit.

>>75887981
Hi Cuban-american poster again, I'd like to follow up that we are not really communist anymore and we're more socalist. But let's be honest, the amazing culture of Cuba came from it's a small island. I don't know if Socalism helped a lot, infact if I remember correctly it did worse. Lots of kids were in the streets fighting and there were robberies and pickpocketing, I believe the reason cubans were so nice is because it was a small island so we all knew each other. We all got to know each other, barely anyone in a town was stranger.

>>75885764
>looked out the window in my apartment in Łódź.
>see all the new cars, repaired roads & sidewalks, clean streets, well dressed people
>remember how it looked 27 years ago, all this shit & filth & poverty

Is this even a serious question, or some poor quality bait?

>>75885764
>Cuba was already a relatively well-advanced country in 1958

stopped reading there

>>75885764
>Would Cuba be more successful today if it weren't communist?
yes but no
just look at Dominican Republic or some more benign example like Costa Rica
they're on subpar with the rest of the world on many things but their growth is stable
not gonna even use the 1st world meme

>>75886502
yeah this too

>>75886973
>the Philipines were liberated at the same time from the same people, I wonder how it went for them
they grew a lot during Aquino era
but alas, now Duterty Harry killed them. let's see if his gamble of focusing on trade with China pays off

>>75888248
The old cars are more culture, but YES Cuba is shit. THERE IS LITERALLY STRAY ANIMALS EVERYWHERE. Walking beside starving dogs and cats is just a natural sight. Elevators doors that don't close and instead a child could easily fall 4 stories down or accidently have his hand crushed off by the elevator in a funny attempt to push fate by putting his arm infront of the elevator( happened before).

>>75886502
Batista's reign would always have to come to a violent end, he was a ruthless guy. Peaceful protest was not an ending. And last time I checked the communist shit came AFTER the revolution.

>>75888299
Richer than Serbia lel

>>75886587
>South Vietnam

File: 96353ab74728debcc56dc9362805d405.jpg (10KB, 236x182px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 236x182px

>>75888740
http://desuarchive.org/int/thread/75246634/#75259879

Neato, it's this guy again.

Cuba is just tropical North Korea.

>>75888771
that was me and not >>75888740 diasporafag

>>75888346
this
cuba would be haiti if it wasnt for fidel