Communism

t. Soviet spy that got abandoned

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>he isn't nazbol

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>>74316787
It's true.

Help me get home.

Communism is just the shitty religion of atheist liberal arts majors with a god complex.

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>>74316754
The ultimate red pill is anarcho-syndicalism.

not communism, that's so last year, it's marxism
and neo-marxism

what we have isn't just dialectic of the material but the dialectic of the non-dialectic, or rather the synthetic religion of post 1848

marxian mechanics of capital accumulation can explain our social discontent better than the freudian complexes, such as the desire-production and so on

by being communistic in the modern term isn't come political proposal but a psychological one where you try to de-fascify your own desire and so on

>>74319867
>come
some*

N A Z B O L
A
Z
B
O
L

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqZMwTSgNqw

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>>74319694
Based Wobblies have it right.
>>74319903
>Nazbol
>The Russian Nationalist meme

EL PUEBLO
UNIDO
JAMAS SERA VENCIDO

All ideology, political or otherwise, are simply promises made by a couple of idealistic bourgeoisie to push an agenda that ultimately only serves themselves.

We're all doomed to suffer and die on this shithole of a planet and nothing that is ever said or done will change that.

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>>74316754
>modern men face economic hardship
>they turn to fascism instead of communism
is the red terror over lads?

>>74319949
>nothing that is ever said or done will change that
ideology does
it gives you the impetus, of course you can have it and then do nothing, everyone have that freedom

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>>74319949
VR will do.

>>74319961
Facism is capitalism in crisis >>74319694
This

>>74320022
>what is history

>>74319949
>communism
>bourgeoisie
um no sweetie x

>>74319992
>it gives you the impetus

To fail, and ultimately make things only marginally better for people who are just going to live shit lives anyway.

>>74316754

a few simple questions

-how does a society with no State (the goal of communism) work? does a rapist go to jail? who decides how many years? who is the judge? who builds the jail? who feeds him?
how do you build a hydroelectric dam? who decides what gets built? how does someone get a universally recognized engineering degree?

-also, if Marx was wrong about communist revolutions happening in first world developed countries (they happened in poor places), and also about the importance of workers (fewer people work in factories every year and robots will only make things worse, think of the future of truck and taxi drivers with self driving cars) couldnt he be completely wrong?

is the working wage cuck class nowadays more important than self employed people like odontologists, vets, plumbers or hairdressers?

>>74320047
Yeah as I said fascism is capitalism in crisis. An example of this is germoney

>>74320048
>Marx
>Not bourgeoisie

>>74320051
then you don't know the power ideology have over people

so you have campaigns and volunteers and so forth, they can only get them if they feel something positive in that direction, and that is why they believe their worst enemy is not the opposing party but the people who don't vote and so on

a totalitarian freedom

>>74320074
>Communism
>Bourgeoisie even though it wants to get rid of classes.

>>74320074
marx did not own any labor even his own
he is more proletariat than the poorest proletariat

Marxism is good at ruining things. Haven't seen much good come of it.

>>74320130
you would live in a very perverse world without the ideological battles they had
nothing short of biological machines

>>74320130
All third world revolutions have becone state capitalist
You need capitalism before socialism

>>74320095
>then you don't know the power ideology have over people
I do know how powerful it is, and also how destructive it is. Ideology is used to justify atrocities far more than it's used to make the world better for others.

>they can only get them if they feel something positive in that direction

That's the thing, they 'feel' positive, they rarely actually commit to performing positive acts. Humans are mentally fragile, we would breakdown if we choose to understand just how futile our efforts to better society are on a macro level. That's why we absorb ourselves into petty, everyday things. To distract our thoughts from thinking about the death and suffering that goes on all around us.

>kids in Western countries think they know anything about communism

>>74320230
>USSR and puppet states
>Communist
No

>>74320118
Marx had a PHD and was friends with Engels, who was undoubtedly bourgeoisie. Your average laborer who suffers day in and day out and is mentally and physically exhausted did not have the luxury to think up things like Class struggle or labor theory of value.
>>74320121
>marx did not own any labor even his own
Marx had many, many advantages in life just by being born in the place he had been and to the parents he had.

>>74320244
>it wasn't real communism

Here we go

>>74320250
But he didn't exploit others labour..

>>74320192
fine then think about death
but it will reel you in one way or the other
even consumption is ideology
there is no way to take yourself out of it, only recognize it for what it does

because our "default" value into the lives we are born to is not neutral, expectation and demands are placed unto us yet our history supposes that we are rational individuals with choices, these ideas conflict with each other and you get a conflict of the self and so on

>>74320073
that is a ridiculous oversimplification and I find it unbelievable that communists are still repeating it to this day
marx gets away with it because he didn't live through the 20th century, but you people?

>>>/pol/
>>>/leftypol/
Nazis and commies should be shot on spot, no exceptions.

>>74320230
schools and universities like to teach communism like its some magical system where everyone gets free shit depending on how hard they work
if you actually meet one of these marxists its very quickly evident they have zero idea how communism works in reality

>>74319694
THIS THIS

>>74320269
Secondhand, he did, whether he liked it or not. He even admits this in Das Kapital.

>>74320266
>wage labour and a profit based society
>communist
SCREECHING
>>74320290
Are you retarded? No one does that

>>74320305
lets not forget the workers didn't own the MoP.

>>74316754
>realized
FOY

>>74320250
The ultimate redpill isn't Communism or Capitalism; it's Pluralism, as suggested by Isaiah Berlin.

>>74320250
>>74320269
he actively pursued anarchism in the countries he lived, if he was advantageous he threw them away to get in trouble to spite those advantages

>>74320305
its how I've seen it taught, why would anyone unironically support communism if they taught how it actually works?
>most people will starve
>you will live in a slum
>no freedom
woo sounds like the political ideology for me!

>>74320271

>these ideas conflict with each other and you get a conflict of the self and so on
Exactly, how can we expect to resolve conflicts in society when we can't even resolve conflicts in ourselves is my question.
>>74320341
Enlighten me. My interest is peaked.

>>74320352
>most people will starve
But no one did after collectivizatio in the USSR
>you will live in a slum
The opposite in fact
>No freedom
>What is libertarian leftism e.g. communalism, anarchist, libertarisn marxism etc

>>74320334
>>74320305
>wage labour

Yeah, we pretended to work and the state pretended to pay us

>profit based society

But there was no profit possible

>workers didn't own the MoP.

Who did then?

>>74320369
we keep pushing
or give up

that's why modern physics personality hate philosophy

>>74320381
go ahead and give an example of this marvelous communism working in real life

>>74320390
>no profit possible
Oh no...
>Who did then
The state
>We pretended to work and the state pretended to pay us
Ah so you don't even know what wage labour means yet you criticize communism...

>>74320369
Pluralism is the political concept, that allows for more political concepts.

It means there is no one right way (Communism, Fascism, Capitalism), but instead allows for argument and debate. Otherwise, the political concept will ultimately fail.

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>>74320416
Ok

what is this thread doing on /int/? get the fuck off to /pol/.

>>74320416
i'm not a commie but the paris commune was ok, yugoslavia was pretty alright too until the later days.

>>74320471
/pol/ is the politically incorrect board

communism is politically correct

>>74320477
>until the later days
Think you mean when the US peacefully funded nationalist rebels :^) because the bourgeoise fear communism

The ultimate redpill is Royalism, tho. Absolute Monarchy, to be more precise.

>>74320488
>communism politically correct
Are you retarded? Although it's more accepted than nazism
>>74320516
cuck

>>74320428
>The state

The state was the party and the party was the people. Of course, in practise NOBODY owned those factories and MoP, that's why they were in such shit conditions.

>criticize communism

Because I live in a country previously run by communists.

>>74320447
>>74320477
>>74320505
go move to north korea or Venezuela if you love communism so much

>>74320516
Until you have a bad king and you end up having to behead him.

>>74320527
commie

>>74320516
that ended in 1793

>>74320546
Yea, this happens, sometimes...

#LouisXVIDidNothingWrong

>>74320538
>USSR puppet
>communist
Have you ever studied how the USSR was economically?
>The party
Not the people as it wasn't democratic
>>74320539
kek Venezula only did badly because chavez was stupid by depending on oil.
>Juche
>Communist
Just stop

>>74320399
The only rational thing in my mind is to give up, especially since society only seems to push back harder when we try to change it remotely, since there are almost just as many individuals who protect the status quo as those who seek to change it.

In this atmosphere of demoralization, it makes little sense to keep fighting for ideology when I haven't even figured out how to make the most of my own life in the current system.

I don't know about you, but it seems utterly insane to me to throw my life away like that.

>>74320551
*blows you a kiss* (Not in a gay way)
Vive la commune

>>74320539
literally said i'm not a commie you twat. i was just answering your question.

>>74320434
See, that makes sense. It doesn't just simplify things down to "Capitalism bad" or "Communism is impossible".

>>74320577
>communism
>democracy

Top kek. How else can you institute communism without totalitarianism.

>>74320608
Are you violating the NAP? Don't blow kisses.

>>74320662
communism is great mate why would you need a totalitarian government

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Fascism is the finalpill

>>74320587
you cannot de-ideology yourself
every desire every want, even biological needs like hunger and thirst has an ideological motive

you can only close your eyes

>>74320756
Those are simplistic ideologies tho no? Ones that all life must fulfill in order to simply stay alive as a biological imperative.

Why do we as humans choose to fight and kill and strive for abstract ideologies that only serve to push an agenda that benefits the sensibilities of a few?

>>74320705
Because smart people will oppose communism.

>>74320810
no, not staying alive, not from us as our choices but the choices we make, say a can of beans versus a can of peas and they are far from simple, to the primitive man it doesn't matter, food is food but for us it does we like one more than the other
something something brown stuff is worse than yellow stuff or what not

we become the desire-machine our whole existence is the production of desire

even if we don't go so far we give esoteric reasons for simple thing, our rationality is psychotic

so with the ideological motives one answer is that it satisfies our desire, something we have learned to accept as "organs" of the desiring-machine-world, or in a non-deleuzian term, it gives us individuality

>>74320934
what about einstein?

>>74320934
smart people will oppose the subjugation of their rights

>>74320947
>didn't even study economics

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>Board has an incredibly high rate of /r9k/ posting, posts about depression, suicide, homosexuality, obsession with "traps"

>Board also happens to have a very high percentage of Communists and other leftists

Gee I wonder if these are related lol

>>74319694
t. commune of france

>>74321060
no, i don't post about /r9k/ stuff and always about leftist stuff

i have good grounds that /r9k/ stuff and alt-right stuff are done by the same people

>>74321060
of course they are

people on the fringes of society are more far more likely to spend their free time searching for alternatives to the status quo

>>74321092
It's called sour grapes

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>>74316754
>Communism is the ultimate redpill
this

for all the so-called "progress", I know prehistoric men could build themselves a home to shelter their children.

though I dream of it, I'll never be able to afford a house (to own) or children.

But TV will rant 365/7 about the wonders of capitalism and liberty.
Crap media was funny though the other day, they interview a woman about Macron,
>I'm 55, I've been fired. In itw they say I'm too old. Most companies in the region have closed. And I ain't no gonna launch a startup (reference to the Macron rants about entrepreneurship) ... I make only 500€ a month, what bank would land me money.

>>74321060
It very much is. Communists are usually extremely cynical in ways that are unpleasant for most outsiders to hear. It's why it doesn't have much appeal for older, career oriented adults, but plenty of appeal for younger college students who have the time to reflect on how shit the world is.

>>74321128
>people want a better life under a more equal system
this is a bad thing?

>>74321214
>people are envious motherfuckers

Want a better life? Go and build one.

>>74321214
Nothing guarantees that it will be more equal, it only promises equality.

It also doesn't guarantee their happiness or emotional stability. You see even nowadays in advanced capitalist countries that people are killing themselves via drugs, obesity, and alcohol even if they aren't starving to death.

>>74321214
Yes. I don't want poor lazy minorities getting any benefits from the money taken from me by the government.

If they want a better life they can fuck off to a different land

>>74321270
i want a better life where i, and everyone i care about, am not being exploited and i am not exploiting anyone myself

pretty much impossible under capitalism

>>74321278
i don't disagree with anything you've said

>>74321280
kek

shit i thought i was on /leftypol/ for a second

how'd this thread end up here

>>74321340
part of the secret /leftypol/ shilling raids mate

>>74321270
selfish prick.
There's no such thing as "self-made man", but I'm sure you're one.
You were born in the gutter, but you belived in the pursuit of happiness, that's how you made it or are making it.

Fucking myth.

>Ten trains of "losers" for one Rockefeller.

>>74321340
they know their time is almost over so they're trying to flail about whilst they can.

pretty sad imo.

>>74321340
time lag.
Middle of the night here.
I start work at 2pm, for the nice wage of 0€/month.

Workers should own the memes of production but I like having borders desu.

the lesson of ussr is that borders doesn't disappear overnight

>>74321337
Well then how would communism be any different for people in capitalist countries like the UK and the US? How would it mitigate deaths by despair and trauma of living in the modern world?

because communists do not feel guilty about propaganda

their propaganda is about the people as an object

so as zizek mentioned the best anti-communist propaganda is not the fascist one which just empowers them but to show that people are not the perfect proletarians the communists make them to be, so technically all this "real life" hollywood portrayal are all anti-proletariat propaganda

>>74321469
lots of people's problems with drugs, obesity and alcohol are started due to issues that arise only under capitalism relating to economic woes and a lack of equality

also obesity would virtually be eliminated. the unequal society we live in now makes it easier for Joe Burger to eat enough calories to feed a small calories cheaply and quickly

>>74321337
>am not being exploited and i am not exploiting anyone myself by my arbitrary standards for exploitation

You are free to live like a bum in some anarcho-syndicalist commune. Just don't force it on others.

>under capitalism

What we have now barely qualifies considering the unholy alliance between big money and big government (made possible by commies like you seeking worker protection for everything)

>>74321401
Life's not fair, more news at ten.

If you come from the gutter, you've got three choices. You can either work on yourself knowing it will take far more work to succeed then for those who were born into it, be bitter and distract yourself with whatever fantasies, alcohol and games you can or try to change the system and make it shit for everyone.

>>74320150
Yeah no, they were a cancer on good honest socialist movements and forever fucked them. Marxists are parasites.

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>>74321468
Did know you know that you can still see the effects of the Berlin wall on a map of Germany. There is also supposed to be socio-economic differences between the populations in the city, then again the wall only fell like 30 years ago or something.

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>communism
a bunch of young, mostly wealthy, unproductive people try to convince the real working class that the best thing for them is famine and strife.

>Why have a career and self-determination would you could have breadlines and gulags, comrade?

>>74321568
socialism is the instrument of capitalist class
just bones thrown to the dog

>>74321550
>(made possible by commies like you seeking worker protection for everything)
yeh life would be so much better if we were working 12 hours day from the age of 8 in unsafe conditions for pennies

those damn leftists ruining productivity!

>>74321536
>lots of people's problems with drugs, obesity and alcohol are started due to issues that arise only under capitalism relating to economic woes and a lack of equality

I disagree, what proof do you have of this besides rhetoric? It that implies too much of rational action on behalf of those who do drugs or get fat. Rich people with all their needs met also partake in these activities, sometimes more than those who are struggling economically. Obesity in particular is something that seems to come from comfort and complacency.

Also, how will Communism alleviate the sorrow related to the death of a loved one, the anger of a divorce, the despair of being alone? All those things are just as, if not more influential in predicating destructive behavior.

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>>74321536
That's because the communist leaders kill their citizens before they can kill thrmselves.

Examples: Joseph Stalin, Mao Zedong, Kmer Rouge.

The estimates of the number of non-combatants killed by these three regimes alone range from a low of 21 million to a high of 70 million, not including Vietnam and other communist countries.

https://www.fas.harvard.edu/~hpcws/asreview.htm

>>74321641
>enact worker protection
>laws written according to the wishes of those big enough to survive the implementation
>small companies can't afford to run in those conditions
>wonder how the rich are getting richer

>>74321679
if you read towards the very end you should know that the warnings wasn't just about communism

>>74321630
There you go again. Next you'll be redefining violence into whatever suits your argument. Then you'll be killing people for not being Commie enough, or being dogs of the dreaded Capitalists, etc. I'm glad Communism and Marxism are all but dead, only kept on life support by the upper class academics really.

>>74321675


>>74321679
>the communist leaders
stopped reading here. why do americans literally not have the slightest understanding of what communism

i guess you are used to red team vs blue team politics and so you just see the words "red" "socialist" "people's" "communist" in the name of the regime and thats all it takes for it to be what it proclaims to be

>>74321804
because communism is about radical destruction of the system

of course it's going to lead towards some kind of destructive end, so can you say the same self-reflection the ultra right have

>>74321831
You didn't answer my question, just quoted me.

>>74316754
The ultimate redpill is radical centrism

I'd rather not be a slave to the state, thank you.

>>74321630
>socialism is the instrument of capitalist class
just bones thrown to the dog

you are semi-awake


anarchy is the solution

Are we living in the dying years of the Great American World Empire?
Like Rome's gradual hundred year descent.

>>74321804
You're an idiot. Listening to too many lolbertarians. Businesses will naturally get big enough to bribe and lobby government for legislation that benefits them. It's not the workers demanding decent living standards or entirely the government's fault like libertarians also think.

>>74321918
Shit meant >>74321706

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>>74321903
could be

>>74321918
I'm saying we need to cleave away the Marxism shit from socialism. Marxism ruined social movements all over the world. Movements which had made great progress towards better worker rights and individual rights.

>>74321965
fine, do it
it is as it should be

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>>74316754
>Jewish inventions to destroy European nations

Fuck off kike

>>74321675
>I disagree, what proof do you have of this besides rhetoric? It that implies too much of rational action on behalf of those who do drugs or get fat.
i cba to look for sources but is it really a stretch to believe events such as economic crisis, loss of employment, pressure to succeed, lack of a fulfilling life and billion dollar ad campaigns targeting the vulnerable are not the reasons for many struggling with addiction?

Rich people with all their needs met also partake in these activities, sometimes more than those who are struggling economically. Obesity in particular is something that seems to come from comfort and complacency
in a communist society you'd have to work for your food; you couldn't just buy it with money you've "earned" as some can now which makes it easy to be complacent.

>Also, how will Communism alleviate the sorrow related to the death of a loved one, the anger of a divorce, the despair of being alone? All those things are just as, if not more influential in predicating destructive behavior.
it won't but freed from monetary constraints humanity could surely make progress on finding ways to cope with and deal with these facts of life.


that isn't much of an answer sorry but its 4am im going to bed

>>74321965

Ironically Marxism is ruining the very things that they claim to champion for. I don't think I've ever seen race relations this bad in America in a very long time and those stupid intersectionality cunts have a made of the whole goddamn thing by feeding their bullshit theories into the disenfranchised. It's fucking saddening.

>>74321965
I quoted you by accident. Marxists are stupid but Czech anon was being a different kind of stupid.

when they get a free helicopter ride

>>74321630
> usamericans are stupid enough that you will see them vote a leftard into office in your lifetime and crumble horribly
i will have a fucking laugh
also nobody cares what you have to say about leftist shit you fagot

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>>74316754
*Nazbol

Also everybody who disagrees with me is literally a kike neo-liberal globalist

>>74322094
no thats pretty much what they want, 'equal outcome' instead of equal opportunity, its not possible without violence and 'overthrowing the bourgeoisie' which in this case is low to middle class white people

>>74320266
And he kept saying it over and over for two whole hours.

>>74322033

>>74322148
you can't "vote" communism into office
nobody cared in the first place and i don't have to resort to name calling

of course i don't espouse communism at all, so anything towards left is good stuff like obama care and regulations on banking but if you want socialism you cannot get it through political compromise because corporations can just move out

you clearly something long and hard up your anus

>>74322286
> im a leftard fagot and im compeltely out of fucking place here
is what i read

>>74322095
We all make mistakes.

>>74322353
socialism is the distribution of the means of production right?
why would corporations willingly give that away, why would they allow themselves to be regulated by the society when they can just move away? what makes them compelled to stay at their own disadvantage?

so the political left is doing nothing more than appeasement to their "humbler nature" by asking corps to extend the life of the society such as green environment and so forth when in reality their compliance is nothing more than them showing their good will towards their public as a master would treat a dog

this is playing the corporation interest as some kind of entity that needs to be appeased to as oppose to nothing more than the organization of capital

corporations are not citizens, they are nothing than the whips of the master a whip out of leather or steel is still a whip regardless how much dollar per hour they give you

>>74322466
u're right, that's why anarchy is the answer

greetings

>>74322496
i think not but hello

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>>74322517
>2069
>he isn't an anarchist

>>74322536
to me it is a lethargic bubble
to be satisfied with an idea but observing the oppressive nature of the system

>>74322555
not if you spread the idea irl, at least, at least to 1 single person

>>74322587
it is morally wrong imo
it is better to be a lefty cuck and politically advocate lefty things than to be the anarchist and wish for a miracle

realistically though to change the oppressive nature of the system you need both, the violent radical and the rational progressive

>>74322555
I'm going to sleep, see you in the next:

"When will people realized the Communism is the ultimate redpill?"

>>74322645
good night

>>74321918
>Businesses will naturally get big enough to bribe and lobby government for legislation that benefits them.

So... should we remove business or the government?

>>74324047
Neither, you brake up companies that are too large, and outlaw lobbying or at least some legislation making it harder for companies and the rich to influence the system.

>>74324129
break

>>74320250
>Your average laborer who suffers day in and day out and is mentally and physically exhausted did not have the luxury to think up things like Class struggle or labor theory of value.
That is the point, he was free from the struggle, so he could look at it from the outside.

>>74320051
If that's the extent of it then that's fine. As long as I do all I can to help other people, it's enough.

>>74321630
sort of
the thing is the meat of communism is rotten, it won't stick around and it won't satisfy you
the sinew of capitalism is better but not by a whole lot
what we need is the bone that is socialism, privatizing what makes sense and collectivizing what makes sense, letting people be grouped up but also individual, letting companies exist and thrive (because it's what people want) but stopping them from fucking people over

How did you guys celebrate May Day?

>>74321869
unironically this.

>>74321550
>You can either work on yourself knowing it will take far more work to succeed then for those who were born into it, be bitter and distract yourself with whatever fantasies, alcohol and games you can or try to change the system and make it shit for everyone.
I wouldn't want it to be shitty, but if has to be shitty, it's better for it to be equally shitty across the board
yes I'm autistic, that doesn't mean I'm wrong

>>74324777
>yes I'm autistic, that doesn't mean I'm wrong
checked.

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>>74324743
may day is a commie holiday I only celebrate loyalty® day

S T R A S S E R I S M