Americans, how do you view Europe? Europeans, how do you view America?

I can tell this thread will be a disaster.

>>72039479
I used to be quite pro-American. And then they elected Tr*mp.

Bunch of fags

I dislike them all except Russia and Trump

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>>72039479

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>>72039479

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I love America.

fuck america

>>72039660
this, fuck off with your Europe obsession Kraut

>>72039660
>tfw EU shills fucked your Reputation

we are not all pro EU /pol/tards you know

interesting

>>72039829
/pol/tards are against EU though?

>>72039922
yes

>>72039922
Not the Germans. They even shill on /pol/.
It´s even worse there.

Europeans do not have enough self-worth or dignity to fight for their rights or even their country, and decide to let the nanny-state run their life for them. It's absolutely pathetic.

Not even trolling. I respect most European countries, but not their lack of individualism.

>>72040002
There must be deep brainwashing of your people from a young age from what I'm seeing. Your people are willingly selling themselves out to a supra-national government that's not beholden to any voter base, and is actively curtailing their rights and replacing with foreign ethnic groups.

relatively comfy

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>>72039479
When I was younger, I saw it as a far more developed and a very rich land that was superior to my country in every way.

Now that I actually know something about it, I wouldn't want to live there, but I'm glad it exists, because we would be fucked without it.

Also all the American cultures are kind of fascinating and when you think about it, it's very different from Europe. The fact that the people who live in that alien land (alien as in different, like Australia) speak English makes it seem even more distant.

>>72040093
The European parliament is elected by the people and the EU commission is made up of ministers from member countries who are also democratically elected. What is up with this "unelected bureaucrats" meme?

>>72040093
EU comes early in politcs class. The forced guilt plays a big part in the whole thing. Media is a big part of it too, obviously. What Angers me more are People like >>72039660
who won´t stop generalizing us.

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>>72040232
Excellent answer

We'd nuke ourselves, than being a part of eu

>>72040299

What he means is that smaller countries like ours don't have any influence at all. It's our 13 seats against Germany's 99 and France's 74 = not democratic

What do you guys think about Asia??

>>72040351
nice

>>72040299
Yeah and all those politicians were elected fairly and squarely, no deep state machinations or corporatist fuckery at work at all.

>>72040351
well thats harsh

>>72040351

We would borrow you a nuke and do the same in this situation.

>>72039479
Europe as a whole? No problems, I wouldn't live in most of it but it's quite nice overall.

The EU? Broken, it needs major reform if it wants to survive, either by becoming a federation or sinking back into trade union status

>>72040354
US states literally have more of an equal share in their parliament/congress than European countries do. In one of their legislative bodies (the Senate) every state is guaranteed two representatives regardless of population size, meaning California has the same say as nowheresville. The fact that the culturally homogenous bland squares that make up the US have this and independent European nation-states with thousands of years of history don't shows exactly how fucking retarded the people who designed this "union" were.

>>72040413
That's up to the individual states to sort out. At this point you're talking about elections on a state level.

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>>72040384

Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong & South Korea = Very nice
Rest = shitholes

>>72040455
And those individual states have to obey what the EU tells them. The people have a flawed and tampered with control of their own directly elected politicians at best. And now you sheep are blindly clapping as they are setting up an EU army.

>>72040232
This, we should be thankful for NATO protection.
Hopefully my government will learn to pay their fair price for it.

>>72040384
I like you, you're the only people on earth capable of being civilised besides us.

>>72040449
>shows exactly how fucking retarded the people who designed this "union" were.
They weren't retarded they knew what they were doing

See>>72039722

>>72040420
UNCOMMON

>>72040542
Considering that my country doesn't even have tanks and Trump is calling NATO obsolete, I don't see it as a problem.

Although I don't think it's that necessary, either when NATO hasn't broken down yet.

>>72040649
Those EU tanks won't be defending you. They are there to make sure you don't rebel against their globalist agenda.

Leave and build your own tanks.

>>72040351
please dont nuke yourself

>>72040703
t. Ivan Ivanovich Rusakov

>>72040384
I like you, but I think its sad that you all hate each other

>>72039479
>Americans, how do you view Europe?

I used to hear a lot of people talking about wanting to go to Europe about 20 years ago.
Now nobody really talks about going there.
So I guess the opinion has changed.

>>72040649
It's obsolete in that bridges should be being built with Russia instead of continuing with Cold War-style posturing, which is correct, whatever your history may be with them. As an organisation we should be directed towards the Middle East and China, not them. Sick of people interpreting this as him saying America won't meet their commitments or that he wants to do away with it. All he wants is everybody to spend 2% on defense as was agreed by all members in return for American protection, which is completely fair.

>>72040703
>globalist
STOP. WATCHING. ALEX. JONES.

>>72040786
yes let's ignore people's arguments because you think terms they use are from places they didn't originate

>>72040814
>DA GUBBERMANT GONNA KILL YEW
Great argument filthy little runt

>>72040775
Russia literally annexed a chunk of their closest neighbour, breaking a protection treaty and is now supporting separatist rebels there. It's easy for you to talk when your country wasn't wrecked by the reds and have a moat separating you from everyone else.

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>>72040420
Yeah, going to need a time stamp. If not, get out proxyfag.

>>72040786
What the fuck do you think all these trade deals giving more power to multinational corporations than governments is about? What do you think of rich corporatists lobbying in government and funding activist groups that promote open borders and forced "diversity".

>>72040831
the government has killed a lot of people, particularly the American one

>>72040351
Belka is that you?

>>72039616
Why the fuck do you like Russia?

>>72040856
I'm a capitalist.

I support free trade.

If you can't compete that's your problem.
>>72040860
Stop acting like a yank.

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They have the coolest wars

>>72040907
>I'm a capitalist.
t. Porky

>>72040907
hahaha yes "free" trade. People like you were the ones who sat by and let the Nazis and Bolsheviks roll over everyone and seize power.

>>72040836
he and his defense secretary have reaffirmed that the US will meet its commitments countless times, all I'm saying is that him being elected isn't a reason to support something insane as a German-led EU army and potentially throw away your independence again.

>>72040765
That's cause the only places really worth living in are in Scandinavia/Netherlands and some of Germany, from an American perspective.

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>>72040907

>>72040955
>Free trade is a policy followed by some international markets in which countries' governments do not restrict imports from, or exports to, other countries. Free trade is exemplified by the European Economic Area and the Mercosur, which have established open markets. Most nations are today members of the World Trade Organization (WTO) multilateral trade agreements. However, most governments still impose some protectionist policies that are intended to support local employment, such as applying tariffs to imports or subsidies to exports. Governments may also restrict free trade to limit exports of natural resources. Other barriers that may hinder trade include import quotas, taxes, and non-tariff barriers, such as regulatory legislation.
What do you mean by "free"?

Americans are so ignorant

>>72040991
Wrong

>>72040973
I see why some people might want the EU army, but I don't think it's necessary myself.So I agree with you there.

But what makes you think it would be German led? Germany might be the strongest economy in the EU, but it's not like it dwarfs the rest of us. And it's not like they have the strongest army in the EU, either. Even Poland has more tanks than them.

>>72041036
Yes so free, those trade deals have things like Corporations allowed to sue governments if they even claim that some regulation prevented them from profiting and forcing that government to pay what they say they would have earned.

Or how about self sufficient individual Mexican farmers forced to sell their land and than work it for slave wages to the same company because they can't compete with giant American agricultural corporations loaded with US government subsidies.

Useful idiot

>>72041174
>Or how about self sufficient individual Mexican farmers forced to sell their land and than work it for slave wages to the same company because they can't compete with giant American agricultural corporations loaded with US government subsidies.
Good

Throw away your computer if you don't like it you larping faggot

>>72040836
but dont you think, that generally speaking, having good relationship with Russia would be better than a bad one?

>>72041118
Because in the end, the EU follows their lead, not our's or France's or Poland's. Countries like France and Hungary are just as complicit in supporting it, but we know who'll be pulling the strings.

>/pol/fags detected

Judging from what has happened in EU(Eurozone crisis, immigrants problem, etc), stereotype of /pol/ being always right is always confirmed.

>>72041293
do you have a single actual argument you idiot teenager?

>>72041360
How can we have good relationships with Russia if we stay in NATO?

America only wants their oil

>>72041293
My computer has nothing to do with what is happening. The ability to make them wouldn't suddenly disappear without your multinational globalist bullshit.

Walk straight off that cliff if you want I on the other hand want to live in a free society.

>>72041372
Did EU follow Germanys lead in refugee crisis?

>>72041410
so you are a protectionist, is it fair to say?

>>72041360
Yeah, I agree, pre-2014 relations with Russia were alright.

But this isn't on us, it's on them. Letting them go on like this would be like a beta kid taking shit from a bully because he "wants to get along with everyone".

>>72041432
I don't know, do you think it's a coincidence that it's the EU who is telling off Eastern Europe for not taking them and not telling off Germany FOR taking them instead?

>>72041467
Personally, I am not so sure about that.
After all, it is not really our responsibility to protect the souvergnty of Ukraine.
And I think it is fair to say that most Crimean people would be rather part of Russia than Ukraine

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>>72041400
>how do you feel about x
>i think x is good
>NOT EN ARGUMENT DATS A BAD ARGUMENT
Are you retarded?
>>72041410
>My computer has nothing to do with what is happening.
Yeah tell that to the miners in Africa or whatever sweatshop cunt in Ching chong land assembled it
>The ability to make them wouldn't suddenly disappear without your multinational globalist bullshit.
Yeah but most people wont be able to afford them because of tariffs

Western consumers>Third worlders

>free society
>without free trade
pick one

>>72041487
Whome exactly do you mean by "the EU"?

>>72041521
the European Union

>>72041519
>uses the word "larping"
>calls others retarded
ah yes saying your opponent in a debate is just pretending to hold the views that they hold isn't fallacious at all

ironic since you're posting somebody who literally does "LARP" as a Libertarian politician.

>>72041519
>Yeah tell that to the miners in Africa or whatever sweatshop cunt in Ching chong land assembled it
The circumstances of which it was built now aren't inherently necessary to build it you idiot.

Unironically it reminds me of America, just worse.

>>72041499
>Crimean people would be rather part of Russia than Ukraine
This sends a very unpleasant message to any post-commie country with a Russian minority, that it can be manipulated for Russia's gain.

While it's not our responsibility to defend Ukraine (well, it was Russia, UK and America's), who knows who will be next. We know from history that appeasement doesn't work.

>>72041596
European Union is an union of its member states. It tells whatever the member states tell

>>72041620
how was it our responsibility to defend them? Maybe on humanitarian grounds but as far as I know we have know treatal obligations regarding their defense.

>>72041461
Anyone who isn't is deeply misled or is a corporatist who would profit from not having it. All those laws do is make sure deals are made fairly to benefit people, trade with other nations still happens.

>>72041620
So, what do you think, how should we solve the Ukraine crisis?
I simply dont think its realistic that Crimea will return to Ukraine

>>72040351
Don't speak for everyone faggot

>>72041647
>European Union is an union of its member states. It tells whatever the member states tell
and it's probably very easy to be under that impression whilst being a German

>>72041598
Who is going to make it for "slave wages" then?
>>72041596
>DON'T CALL SOMEONE A LARPER!
>fallacious
Autism

I posted him as a joke https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_PrNotOGkE

How is he not a libertarian anyway?

>>72041687
A kinda unrelated question. Have you heard about the Opium wars? If yes, what do you think about them?

>>72041707
As a German, I am pretty pissed about the lack of solidarity in the refugee crisis

>>72041620
>UK and America's
How the fuck is it their responsibility?
It's literally none of their business.
Ukraine fucked itself when it let a CIA staged coup happen.

>>72041694
There's no way it will return to Ukraine, unless another major conflict arises, at which point it won't matter anymore (it's like the Vilnius/Wilno situation Lithuania had in the interwar period).

But they can't just get away with it just like that. The sanctions are working and I thinks that's all we can really do.

>>72041675
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum_on_Security_Assurances

Sorry, it appears the UK didn't promise to directly protect it. But this is what I was referring to.

>>72041822
>solidarity
nobody's required to clean up after your government's mistakes, fuck off

>>72041732
>Who is going to make it for "slave wages" then?
Such a stupid question. They wouldn't. I and everyone else would be making more money from more protectionist deals that help the common people with which we will be able to pay the higher price of said product to accommodate that other workers now livable wage.

>>72041755
Yes, but I'm not very knowledgeable about them. From what I gather Europeans particularly brits hooked all these asian countries people on drugs to gauge money out of them and keep them dependent on them for as long as they remained addicted.

An example to people of today that conspiracies like that can and do happen.

>>72041827
But we cant keep up the frosty relationships and sanctions forever, can we?
Because I think that the east europe would benefit the most from better relations with russia, both through trade and security aspect

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>>72041825
>CIA staged coup

>>72041822
We don't want them in our country and neither should you.

>>72041822
Yes, we're all very happy to receive EU funding, but when we're called to accept a 1000 refugees to ease the burden of Greece and Italy, it's a different story.

>>72041906
I just see the Opium War as a case were a country (China) stayed protectionist for a long period of time, thus falling behind in research, until the technologically superior Brits were able to invade them and force them into free trade.
This is the reason why I am so sceptical about protectionism. If you keep your boderds close, you will fall behind sooner or later

>>72041915
Yeah, it's a very complicated matter.

But we're getting by even with the sanctions and some might argue that they're reducing our reliance on Russia for a lot of imports.

What might happen is that the morale boost of expanded borders in Russia will wear off and the suffering economy will hit Putin's ratings.

>>72041956
I think that this sort of one-sided relationship simply cant continue forever.
Maybe a multi-speed EU would be a better solution

>>72042022
Not really the same. There is a bit of a misnomer. Wanting international trade to be properly regulated to benefit regular people isn't the same from wanting to completely isolate yourself and have little contact with the outside economy or world like North Korea.

>>72041956
a burden created by Germany giving the whole third world the impression that their country is their playground. Germany and Sweden should be taking all of them, fuck them for giving these inbred savages a reason for hopping on plywood rafts across the meditereanean in the first place with their champagne socialist multicultural open borders horseshit. Then they continue and continue to accomadate them instead of drawing a line in the sand and sending them back, therefore encouraging more and more to come because they all know they won't be sent home, and then they act like everybody needs to fucking help "ease their burden". No, fuck them.

>>72041906
>They wouldn't.
and that will hurt consumers
>protectionist deals that help the common people
How will protectionist policies help poor people/people who can't compete when the prices will go up?

Petty idealism.

>>72042124
Did you not read the whole thing? If I can now make more money because my job and industry aren't being shipped off to southeast asia I will in turn have more money to pay for higher priced products.

>>72041956
Except they're not interested in coming to Europe, they're interested in free money in Germany and Scandinavia, that's why none of them stop when they land in Greece and Italy and travel through sometimes half a dozen countries in order to get there. Germany told them that refugees are welcome. That was their choice and it's not your responsibility to damage your own country for them.

>>72042097
To me, it seems that the sanctions are rather symbolic. We are still buying gas from Russia, after all.
And I see our current policy risky on a geopolitical level. We need Russia not only for the natural resources, but also for the trade with China. Also, through global warming, the ice in the artic will continue to melt, and the north passage will be free for ship travel eventually, through russian waters

>>72042236
>WAH WAH I CAN'T COMPETE WAH WAH GOVERNMENT HELP ME WAH
Go to university and get a worthwhile degree

>>72042121
but isn't that what trade agreements like TTP or TTIP are about? TO regulate trade between countries?

>>72042309
Easy for you to say, you aren't in your 40s trying to provide for your kids.

Probably some upper middle class teenage faggot.

>>72042366
By allowing companies to sue said countries for "lost profits"? Not really no.

>>72042123
AFAIK a lot are being sent back right now and the influx of refugees has greatly decreased since 2015. I don't know if European (and Western politics in general) will recover from 2015 soon, though.

>>72042110
Just today I read something about that being agreed on.

desu, the EU would have had it all a lot smoother had it not expanded the way it did in 2004, but I guess they did it to make sure that Eastern Europe doesn't fall back into the Russian sphere of influence. But I'm glad that we managed to get in. I hope we make it through these unstable times.

>>72042285
You're not wrong, but as I said, they can't just get away like that.

I don't know how effective exactly the sanctions are, but the Russian economy isn't doing well. then again, that might be because of the lowered oil prices.

>>72042366
They regulate in a way that benefits corporations at the expense of regular people.

>>72042403
but dont you agree that companies are entitled to some security.
For example, lets say you are a startup, you borrow money for an investment to start a trade in Europe. But then, due to unforseen changes of regulations, you cant sell your producint in EU anymore. Who should pay for your losses?

>>72042435
Nothing they do at this point will make a difference. The objectively correct thing to do was to take a stand early in the crisis and send out the Navy to turn these boats around, and to pile anybody that made it through into shipping containers and drop them off on the North African coast. Anybody with half a brain could tell back in 2015 that what Germany was doing would only result in more and more of them coming from a increasingly long list of countries that aren't actually at war or anywhere near Syria.

>>72042435
I think the problem is that EU expansion was driven by ideological reasons, more than by realism. Our leaders at that time grew up during the cold war, when Europe was divided, so they wanted to unite Europe as soon as possible, not paying attention the the nitty gritty details

>that might be because of the lowered oil prices.
thats also what i believe

>>72040351
Good man

Never German ruled

>>72042395
>you aren't in your 40s trying to provide for your kids.
I support the welfare state

upper middle class teenage faggot>fat american peasant

I'm posting from my indoor cinema rn http://imgur.com/a/4dYcx

u jelly?

>>72042653
>they wanted to unite Europe as soon as possible, not paying attention the the nitty gritty details
this was never a noble goal in the first place, stop acting like it was

>>72042679
we don't particularly see a difference if you're a upper middle class teenage faggot or an upper middle class teenage faggot in a cinema, you're still an annoying upper middle class teenage faggot

>>72042695
I know that most people believe politicians are evil and opportunistic, but i disagree.
I think politicians are just like other people, and some are driven by greed, others by idealism

>>72042679
I can't believe you are a real person. Go walk around a working class neighborhood and tell those guys who keep your precious electricity, plumbing, and air conditioning working how they are lazy and stupid and deserve being fucked over by their own government.

But you won't because you're a spoiled sheltered faggot who hasn't the slightest clue of what a hard day's work is.

>>72042746
you should care if its mine or not though because you'll never be able to afford one http://imgur.com/a/GYDfo
>>72042872
Yeah except the working class always votes right....

They want equality of opportunity not outcome you condensing twat

>>72042947
>Yeah except the working class always votes right....
wait, are you a left and hate the working class?

>>72042679
Look at this stunning example of several generations of weak genetics creating the final stage of runt evolution through stunted growth and complete lack of exercise.

>>72042947
>Yeah except the working class always votes right....
No they aren't, they are voting a recent upsurge that is right wing in style but not part of the established neoliberal conservative politics.

>>72042981
Just like the politicians on the left \xdDDDD

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>>72042981
I'm a social democrat

I hate poor people who didn't work hard enough to become rich then complain about being poor tho
>>72042984
>coming from antifaggot
>>72042995
The white working class always has and always will vote right

sorry antifa

>>72043034
This is true.
Left-wing used to be about protecting the working man.
But it seems to me like they were hijacked by sjw movement, now the only thing they care about is femininsm, gay marriage and minorities

>>72043205
>I hate poor people who didn't work hard enough to become rich then complain about being poor tho
you sound more like libertatrian to me 2bh
beeing social democrat is about helping the working class, you know?

>>72043205
>The white working class always has and always will vote right
>sorry antifa
Are you fucking retarded? I'm not antifa I've been ranting about globalist multiculturalists this whole thread you retard.

>>72043226
>You protect the working man by making him pay more for products
Yeah great idea..
>>72043281
I'm a social democrat
>>72043291
You're a poltard?

>>72043226
Sometimes I wonder if gender politics and such are really that important in the US or if it only looks like it because the media focuses on whatever will get the most attention.

>>72043352
>You're a poltard?
If you take away the neo-nazism and general racism I guess? I barely browse the board.

I consider myself and independent with social democratic beliefs. You are not a social democrat you sound like some edgetard teenage libertarian.

Honestly I feel like I wouldn't mind living somewhere like North Dakota or Montana.

Americans are either really friendly or stright up toxic fuckers, there's no middleground tbqh.

American football is an underrated invention in Europe.

>>72043454
I'm not a social democrat because I support free trade and don't like muslims? LOL

>>72042947
I'm not clicking on a link to an image on an imageboard, go back to plebbit you stupid cunt

>>72043503
Your free trade is selling out your country and people to multinational corporations and the same people supporting and profiting from it are also the ones who want to import all these muslims because they want the cheap slave labor without the travel and shipping cost.

>>72043352
you protect the working man through social security

>>72043630
emotional garbage
>>72043794
I support the welfare state

>>72043399
I have never lived in America, but to me, it seems like both parties are pretty much the same, and use non-issues like gay marriage or abortion to keep the population divided

>>72043830
HOW IS GAY MARRIAGE A NON ISSUE?!

>>72043830
Oh, I think I got it.

These issues are so popular because everyone can have an opinion on them and can discuss them. It's not like tax policy or other things like that where you need to research the subject.

>>72044076
Yes exactly.
Thats not something that would really affect the lobby groups, so they dont care how people decide about it.
basically divide and conquer

I like america.
I dislike americans.
What i mean is the stereotypical muricans that can only see black and white like you're either a "libtard SJW feminist" or a "USA#1 thanks jesus right-wing redneck".
I'd love to live somewhere in the woods hunting deer and driving pick-up's though the nature over there is amazing.

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>>72041620
>This sends a very unpleasant message to any post-commie country with a Russian minority, that it can be manipulated for Russia's gain.
I don't see you object to Kosovo, hypocrites.

>>72041702
Come home, european man

>>72039588
pres tromp is best tromp

OHHHH SAY CAN YOU SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE