Question on understanding Norsk

>>68584543
bump

fuck off we're full

>>68585184
no you are not
thanks for the gf btw

>>68585184
here already mate, and I'm Australian

>>68585225
thanks for the strippers

>>68584543
I don't understand your issue.

>>68585379
>Gutten som ropte ulv

how can the verb be in the third place?

>>68585184
hello, friend

>>68584543
>>68584543
Okay so I think I've figured this out.

The subject is actually "gutten som" = the boy who

So it's "gutten som" [1] ropte [2] ulv [3].

So the verb actually is in the 2nd place then, right?

>>68585423
I'm not great at grammar, but I assume it's the same reasoning as in English. It's the exact same structure.

I assume "som ropte ulv" is a relative clause, where "som" functions as the relative pronoun and is the subject.

>>68585674
But what about 'gutten' at the start of the sentence? Is that lumped together with 'som' to create the subject?

>>68584543
You can say:

Jeg vil ikke drikke kaffe her i dag
or
I dag vil ikke jeg drikke kaffe her

>>68585798
It's lumped together with the relative clause to create the subject, maybe. Or you just ignore the relative clause and go on like nothing happened.
Either way, it's exactly like in English:
"The boy who cried wolf raped the shepherd's daughter."
"Gutten som ropte ulv, voldtok jeterens datter."

>>68585956
Right, and the verb is always in the second place.

Is the verb in the second place or in the third place in

>Gutten som ropte ulv

>>68586091
>jeterens
*gjeterens

>>68586091
Ah okay! Got it

So in this example

Gutten som ropte ulv is the subject
voldtok is the verb
and gjeterens datter is the object?

>>68586142
Yes, what did you think?

>>68586142
Yes. That's what I assume, at least. I haven't had to think about grammar since high school, though. So I'm not 100% certain about any of this.

>>68586218
I think I'm a little confused because the subject has a verb in it, is all.

"Ropte" is a verb
but "gutten som ropte ulv "can be a subject of a sentence

>>68586311
Isn't that the same as in most languages? Subclauses?

>>68586418
>Subclause

I guess they don't really teach us these things when you learn English, but subclauses actually seem to be the reason I was confused. Thanks for giving me the name for it anon.That wraps up my question then!

Takk for alt.

BRA TRÅD

>>68586998
Serios?

>>68587384
>Using the international board to discuss language learning
Ja, jeg er seriǿs. Det er hva dette brettet er for - å diskutere språk. Det er Ikke bare den australske (hvem skriver under den norsk flagg) hvem som prǿver å lære seg norsk. Jeg bare har ingen spǿrsmåler å spǿrre.

I think I got that partially incorrect, though. The use of som and hvem is still not crystal clear to me.
For reference, increase I REALLY butchered it, I tried to say: Yes, I'm serious. That is what this board (did I misuse brett here?) is for: to discuss languages. It is not just the Australian (who is posting under the Norwegian flag) learning norwegian. I just have no questions to ask.

>>68589750
This.

Why the fuck not.

Also, I don't get why a lot of Norwegians (mostly old people) think our language is so fucking hard to learn for foreigners. It is probably one of the easiest in europe.

>>68593014
it is hard as hell to pronounce and some words take on like 10 different meanings

>>68593129
Yes Indeed, but the basic bokmål grammar is easy as fuck.

But I agree that the dialects are difficult. Also we got like 50 different dialect words for one thing.

>>68589750
>Det er Ikke bare den australske (hvem skriver under den norsk flagg) hvem som prǿver å lære seg norsk.

Correct me if I am wrong, friendo, but I think this should be written as

Det er ikke bare den australaske (hvem skriver under den norsk flagg) som prover å lære seg norsk


Basically I dont think hvem som is correct, as som already means who in this context

I can't be bothered reading all this. Here's how it works.

"Gutten som ropte ulv" is not a full sentence.
It's just the subject, with a special type of sentence that is a part of the subject.
So you still have the
position 1 - verb
word order, where position 1 is filled by a subject consisting of many different parts.
If you don't get it, you can replace it with an adjective.
"den store gutten"
works in a similar way, you have many words, but only one main part, the "gutt", boy.
You COULD replace what you wrote with an adjective too, but it would be unusual and strange, but gramatically accurate:
"den ulveropende gutten"
maybe a bit wrong, thinking about it.
You can also replace it with a compound word, where the sentence is built into the morphology:
"rope-ulv-gutten"
also gramamtically correct, but very childish, in adult language these contsuctons are rare.
But this probably has nothing to do with that.
Just wanted to share.

>>68593304
Nynorsk has more regular grammar in many cases

>>68593455
Also as a follow up, the way I think it works is that som can be used as who as an object, but hvem is used for who as a question.

So,

Hvem er det means who is that?
Det er som jeg snakket om means That is who I was talking about.

File: 1452319435361.png (440KB, 633x758px) Image search: [Google]

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How do I learn Norwegian prepositions? I've been studying Norwegian on and off for a few years now, and while most of the grammar and vocabulary is easy enough, the prepositions are impossible. It's like there's literally almost no correlation between them in Norwegian and English, or from one Norweigan sentence to the next. What am I supposed to do? Memorize a literally infinite number of situations and which preposition to use in each one? If there is anything that is going to stop me from becoming fluent, it is this.

>>68593485
cheers anon, the original question has been answered but what you wrote was still an interesting read

>>68586091
wtf norway

>>68593663

Use på where you’d say “on” or “at” in English: «Jeg er på fjellet.» «Hun er på skolen.»

Use på for rooms, whereas in English you’d say “in”: «Jeg er på badet.»

Use på for islands, just as you’d say “I live on the Faroe Islands”: «Jeg bor på Færoyene.» Iceland is an island, so på is used, even though in English we’d use “in”.

In general use i wherever else you’d use “in”, with some exceptions like «Jeg er på landet.»

>>68593805
Some rooms take "i"
"jeg er i stua"
"jeg er i gangen"

It's probably differences like this that's confusing. Using "på" is no rule.

The island rule is pretty accurate, but has some exceptions.
"japan" requires "i", not "på", despite being islands.

>>68593966
I read somewhere that if the function of the room is more important than the room itself, you take på.

So like with a kitchen for example, which has a very specific function.

Jeg er på kjokken

>>68593966
>>68593805
Rethinking a bit, and a quick google, I think "på stua" and probably "på gangen" are accepted, but "i badet" is not, so use "på" if you aren't sure. It's not unusual for that to be the standard, even for these rooms.

>>68594077
That sounds like it could be right, but I don't know

>>68593600
takk for forklaringen

>>68584543
"The girl" is a noun
"Who cried wolf" is an adverb/adverbium (but cry is a verb, they just constitute an adverb together)

>>68594230
The boy*
I almost failed my swedish courses in HS but I think that's correct. Word order is pretty liberal.

>>68593663
Am I wrong in saying prepositions are the absolute hardest part of the language??

Anyone have any thoughts on this

Need 2 learn kebabnorsk

>>68594803
this is a serious thread. literally no one else was shitposting before you arrived.

please leave if you cannot behave like an adult.

On the subject of dialects, this video could be useful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHmUo3bD9CU

Not perfect, but the best on youtube that I could find.

>>68595098
I just skipped through it without watching because it'd cause me to cringe so much.
Saami isn't one language.
Oslo dialect and bokmål are not as close as people think
Dialects are not altered versions of bokmål and nynorsk (except eastern norwegian)
And that's what I am willing to see.

>>68584543
Where can I learn the basics? I know nothing about the language but seems interesting. Is it available in duolingo?

>>68595285
dont people in oslo basically speak bokmål though

>>68595351
sure is!

>>68595366
Yes they do, because they got shamed so much for speaking oslo dialect so they switched to speaking bokmål instead

Bergenstesten in 30 days, any tips?

>>68595458
I haven't done it, so can't help much, but don't underestimate its difficulty, I knew someone who spoke Norwegian well but they still failed.

>>68596120
been learning for 2 months senpai

>>68596546
but im studying about 6 hours a day

>>68595404
Thanks. Already on it.

>>68596591
What resources have you used to learn norwegian so fast?

How confident are you in in regards to passing the test?

>>68596791
Good luck, it's a fun language.

Regarding dialects, a bit of a blogpost:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wARB2COiwZc

It wasn't until the near end of that video, did I think for that I might have understood what that guy was saying. I had to rewatch the video a second time and recognize the country of origin of the uploader's surname that he is Norwegian.

I then felt embarrassed that I didn't understand the speech the first time around, or even immediately recognize it to be norwegian. However, I felt slightly relieved when someone pointed out that he was speaking with a dialect (Stavanger). Which, I recognize that most norwegians speak with a dialect, even those in Oslo; as I understand it, almost no one in Norway speaks a perfect standardized bokmål norwegian.)

Dialects in norwegian can REALLY change how things sound, to the point where the language is not instantly recognizable to me. Almost all learning material for students is standardized it seems (and for good reason, I'm well aware) so unexpectedly hearing 'real' Norwegian spoken - with a dialect - is a bit of a surprise.

Lastly, it seems to me that Norwegian is much more impacted by dialects than most other languages (so I read, anyways), so it will take some time to get used to. I don't think I'm going to bother until I have a very good handle on 'standard' norwegian bokmål, though.

A bit of thinking and perspective from a student, for anyone who is interested (native, learner, or otherwise) I suppose.

File: ivar aasen.jpg (55KB, 500x446px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 500x446px

Kva er det som går fǿre seg i denne tråden?

>>68597108
10 per cent think I'll pass it.

I'm just reading, using the NoW exercises and translating episodes of Norwegian TV shows by hand

>>68597815
>Kva

>>68597693
Yea, we have a lot of dialects. It has something to do with all those years of isolation in small, unaccessible villages all over the country. People were poor and rarely visited other places than their home village. Also the upper class spoke danish.
Some of the rural dialects not only sounds gutteral and strange, but uses a lot of unique words.

For example the word "sludd" in bokmål (Sleet? rainy snow) Have different words in some dialects:

Blåt, kless, skletta, sklætt, slata, slatter, smaladrepa/smaladaue (in certain context) and vadlasletta.

>>68584543
"som" introduces a relative clause, which means that "som" is the new first place.

>>68598448
Why not?
You are not much better, anyway. Arguably worse, with your removal of the first consonant.

The problem was that people had the bad habit of not pronouncing the "h", so it had to be changed to "k" to get people to pronounce it properly.
Ideally, we'd do like Iceland and Faroe Islands, write "h" but say "k", but when we were in the bad position, at least it's better to show the correct pronunciation than use the written language to ruin the correct pronunciation in spoken language as well.

As for the lack of "t", that's also a bit of a problem, that's true. There should have been a "t" there that would be silent in many dialects, rather than enforcing the lack of "t" on other dialects that have it.

>>68598448
?

>>68598591
I remember reading, years ago, well before I started learning Norwegian, that you guys have over fifty words to describe snow. Whether that's true or not, I thought this to be ridiculous.

However, if you look at English, we have over a dozen words to describe snow ourselves. Add in a ton of local dialects, and with snow being a bigger part of scandinavian language speaking countries' history compared to english speaking countries' history, it becomes believable that a language could have 50+ words for snow.

>>68599346
the real snow connoisseur are people like eskimos and sami people

they have more words for it than we do

>>68597693
>Dialects in norwegian can REALLY change how things sound, to the point where the language is not instantly recognizable to me.
That sounds scary to be quite honest. I don't know anyone from Norway so I'm ready to give a try for the lulz anyway

>>68599522
The eskimo thing is a bit inaccurate/it's a bit impossible to count.
From what I've heard about Greenlandic, they only have two basic words for snow. However, their language has a lot of endings that can be added to change the meanings of the words. So you can't really compare them.

If we only go by base words, however, I think saami people have more than 50, maybe it was 100, words. The problem here is that it's actually more than one language, so that great number of words may not be present in one language. But still, I do believe they would have a great number of words for snow regardless.
I actually read an article about saami words for snow online once, but I don't remember exactly.

They also have 50 or was it 100 words for reindeer, which is also a bit cool.
And I believe Southern Saami has its own grammatical forms for counting reindeer.

>>68599873
>>68599522
I did a quick google, and found a list:
https://lektorsalen.wordpress.com/2009/11/23/200-samiske-ord-for-sno-i-signatur-pa-norsk-yrkesfag/
Go to the comments section.

Someone there made a list of 205 words for snow in Saami, and they excluded words based on other words, all unique words

>>68593663
norwegians wont touch this cause they know its true

>>68599346
>before I started learning Norwegian, that you guys have over fifty words to describe snow
I can only think of like three in bokmål

This is a good thread, I'm glad it went on well without shitposting. I want it to continue but Norwegians are probably sleeping and I have no questions right now.

So I guess one last post, bumping for someone else learning who might have a question.

>>68593663
>How do I learn Norwegian prepositions?


you don't

:DD:D:D:Dd

your only choice is living here, really