"The big difference between America and Europe is that when

Yeah it shows Americans are delusional as fuck and still think the American Dream is a thing. Europeans are at least aware that they're being in a worse position than the guy in the limousine.

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>>68492321
Here's your chauffeurs cap. Have fun driving him around.

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>>68492454
Can't all be king.

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>WE IZ GUNNA BE DRIVING IN LIMOZEENS N SHIET NIGGA

>>68492454
No, it shows that the pretentious Irish prick who first said that quote has no clue about America.

>>68492454
Except that in america there are people that do start from the bottom and work their way up. Ofcourse not everyone will succed but it worth it to try. If everyone thought like you there would be no entrepenuers and hardworking people that eventually become a success.

86% of millionaires are first generation desu.

>>68492680
Your missing the point.

The point is, somebodies got to drive that limousine. And there are a lot more people driving limousines than there are with names on the registration.

>>68492759
In fact, you might even say, that the only way for that guy to be sitting in the back of that limo is for somebody else to be sitting up front, driving it.

>>68492738
I'm a first generation hundredaire

>>68492795
Instead of asking yourself, "Does that guy deserve to be sitting in the back of the limo?" You might instead ask yourself, "Does the guy driving the limo want to be there?"

>>68492680
This CA fucker knows more about America than most of the supposed "Americans" posting ITT. Its a shame how badly 4chan has been infested with r*ddit subhuman filth...

Is U2 the worst band of all time?

>>68492795
You are a literal subhuman. Its time for you to return to Africa, you filth.

>>68492830
You might further ask yourself, "If me being in the back of the limo means somebody is stuck driving it who doesn't really want to be there, then does anybody really need a limo?"

>>68492321
in america, everyone thinks they are going to become a millionaire one day

>>68492738
How many of them come from rich families or went to top universities?
>>68492680
It's not worth it, especially not in America where you're completely ruined if you take a credit and your business fails.

>>68492868
A typical primate response.

>>68492877
You might further ask yourself, "what the fuck were my defective-gened parents thinking when they decided to have a child?"

>>68492923
Back in your cage, mongrel

>>68492923
Don't tempt me, gene-trash.
Lest I have your trailor park sectioned off.

>>68492738
For example, most of our presidents weren't born in a mansion. Crap, Obama was born to a white trash single mom from Kansas.

>>68492904
your illiterate

In america, you can't say, "I want slaves."

So the acceptable substitute is to say, "I want services."

>>68493008
Fight me you little bitch

>>68493008
*you're

>>68493013
Slavery implies nobody is getting paid for their services and they're forced to work against their will.

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>>68492454
>yuropoors think riding in a limousine is an impossible dream

>>68493033
And if they don't pay their rent, what then? You move them off their own land and lay claim to their possessions.

But only after stripping the land of all its resources and taking the best for yourselves.

>>68493064
In Europe, traditionally there was the landed gentry which you had to be born into. You could not become a king if you were born a peasant, try though you might. Socialism originated as a notion of destroying the nobility and ensuring equality of outcome.

But since the US never had hereditary gentry, Americans didn't find socialism appealing; it was just seen as a way for leeches to steal from the hard labor of others.

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>>68492454

Gee, it's almost like aspiring to be better and climb higher made America what it is today.

>>68493033
If payment is only a deferment of the threat of force, then money is worthless. You are not measuring the value of someones services, you are merely assigning them an allotment of resources. You are still the ultimate arbiter on how those resources are used and divided.

>>68493169
a 3rd world shithole?

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>>68492904
If your household income is less than $65,000 (or some number near that), ivy leagues and other top universities will cover pretty much the entire cost for you. If you get scholarships on top of that, you're looking at getting the best education in the world for free. If you're paying thousands to go to some state school you need to rethink things.

>>68493169
People in capitalist countries see their servitude as a privilege.

>>68493273
put the crackpipe down.
we are here to help.

>>68493133
Except that socialism isn't widespread in the US because the people don't want it but because the big companies that highly profit from your almost non-regulated capitalism run the government. Socialism isn't about lazy people stealing from the rich, it's about crazy rich companies not being allowed to fuck over the entire population.

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>People in capitalist countries see their servitude as a privilege.

Capitalism condemns the majority of the populace into a position of servitude. Somehow we convince ourselves that only the most noble and morally superior people become masters, while our servitude is a sign of our own moral inferiority.

>>68492680
Why start "from the bottom" when everyone can be at the middle and robots do the work lol.

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>>68493229
>>68493297

Is this some kind of thinly veiled attempt at getting a talk about socialism going?

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>>68493337
>US
>almost non-regulated capitalism
I wish that were true

>>68493351
Because there was such freedom under Soviet communism where the party constituted a feudal ruling class?

>>68493351
We build mansions for our masters while condemning ourselves to sharing apartments. We build them jet aircraft while driving sub-compacts. We work holidays so they can have their summers off.

>>68493415
Assuming there are only ever two choices.

>>68493405
It is compared to the rest of the world. Look at the absurd amount of money that universities or pharmaceutical companies charge. They can't do that in Europe because the government s won't let them.

>>68493449
Name a non-shitty communist country.

>>68493415
When some taiwanese worker goes home after a 50 hour work week getting paid less than half of minimum wage assembling salad shooters, how do you think that makes him feel?

When his livelyhood depends entirely on the careless whim of an american who makes more in a day than he makes in a week, do you think he goes home and dreams about making it big in America?

Or does he smile a little at the thought of a plane smashing into the statue of liberty? Does he look forward to a day when he won't be forced to make worthless crap for a person halfway around the world to feed his family?

>>68493503
>If its not 1, it must be 0
>What if its not 1 or 0?
>name a single 0 that is not a 0

>>68493460
>Look at the absurd amount of money that universities or pharmaceutical companies charge
And all thanks to government overregulation that jacks up the price of everything.

>>68493581
I think I hear the kuku bird calling..

>>68493581
What? That doesn't even make sense. Why would the government makes prices higher than the company that sells those things originally intended?

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>>68493460
>universities
Because the government uses its own money to give a teen tens of thousands in an unsecured loan. No company would do that with their own money.
>pharmaceutical companies
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/2545691

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>>68492454
>parents came from poor caribbean shithole
>saved up their money to immigrate to America
>became legal citizens and now make a combined $180k a year
>have to listen to europoors talk shit about a country they have no clue about

>>68493337
You think the U.S and most capitalist countries have no regulation? Have you heard about subsidies?! No? They are everywhere. The U.S. government protects the oil industry it is not fucking unregulated. Here in Guatemala they protect the chicken industry.
Socialism is cancer aswell as mercantilism. The government should fuck off and let the market flow but idiots like you vote for the people that prevent that.

>>68493682
So let me get this straight.

You are saying the ability of a consumer to manipulate the price of a drug is him exercising his right not to buy it?

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>>68493672
Externalities

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>>68493337
The time where something vaguely like that (Runaway Capitalism) occurred is called the Gilded Age, and it was resolved in the Progressive movement of the early 20th century.

Socialism didn't appeal to most Americans for a variety of reasons, its more than just
>Americans are stupid
and
>Americans can't see they're being cheated

>>68493351
>>68493449
Capitalism condemns nothing but the lazy to poverty and the diligent to wealth

There are flaws, as everything does have, of course

But your actions will shape your outcomes, and that's fair.

>>68493520
He, the worker, will think of how wonderful his bed will feel

His livelyhood depends on his employers, which is a factory run by Taiwanese, and who assemble American goods
If they Americans won't buy, someone else will

And he'd most likely be jumping for joy at the thought of living in America, where he could earn so much more and live so much better
Unless, of course, America has somehow slighted him in some way, in which case he obviously wouldn't be

From your rhetoric I can see you've never actually worked strenuously in your life

>>68492893
how do you know that?

>>68493713
And I'm sure we all enjoyed your parents tacos before the health inspector shut them down.

>>68493642
For example, college tuition. Once upon a time, they had to compete in a free market and offer affordable prices if they wanted to get students enrolling. Now since the gumbint got the idea that everyone must go to college and become neurosurgeons because we don't need to manufacture anything anymore and that should all be done by Xiang, they began subsidizing universities so that they no longer had to compete in a free market setting, they could charge whatever ripoff tuitions they felt like because the government would prop them up regardless.

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>>68493870
>tacos
>caribbean

>>68492680

Statistics say otherwise, America is among the Western countries with the worst social mobility.

Look at this fag still buying into propaganda.

>>68493417
>we
Speak for yourself. You came here when?

>>68493373
But that is not possible now though. Maybe in the future.

>>68493852
>The time where something vaguely like that (Runaway Capitalism) occurred is called the Gilded Age, and it was resolved in the Progressive movement of the early 20th century

But even then, most people didn't want socialism, they just wanted better wages and pensions and working conditions. Communists later denounced the organized labor movement as "a wage bargaining lobby, not a vehicle of revolution".

>>68493870
You sound like a real loser. Things not working out for you? You can do it!

>>68493852
I think he'd be more interested in figuring out how many salad shooters he could shove up your ass before pissing on your grave.

>>68493892
>being forced to pay for education

Fucking revolting. Nothing permits a person more to rise on the social ladder than access to education.

>>68493813
They do but not nearly as much as European countries. Our economy is capitalistic but with more regulations that protect our consumers. The Nordic countries have almost pure socialism and they're without a doubt the best working countries in the world, they barely have any problems socially and economically. Socialism is the best system in the world and the only reason it didn't work in South America is because you are lazy pieces of shit and any system would fail in your hands.

>>68493948
>people didn't want socialism, they wanted socialist policies
Lad

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>if i work hard enough and study stem i will be wealthy
You guys are precious

>>68493820
Call me crazy
>>68493982
>forcing people to work for free

>>68494007
This is really stretching any defition and nuance of the term 'socialism' there,buddy.

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>>68493912
Wait I was wrong. It's actually the worst.

>>68492321
>>68492454
muh temporarily embarrassed millionaires

>>68494026
Socialism is public ownership of the means of production. Most people didn't want that aside from a few times like the Populists in the 1890s, but they quickly became irrelevant.

>>68493912
You are the gullible fag here. Maybe in Germany, an european country that has always been rich and now gets their cuck sucked by the european union can have money to spare for your social programs but socialism is a stupid idiology that has affected many. I have talked to venezuelans that fled and hate socialism more than anyone else.
Tell me when has a poor country become better under socialism?

>>68493948
America's "Golden Age" occurred during the 50's and 60's, in the post war boom, after implementing the progressive policies of the Democratic leadership that won World War 2. Taxes during that period were the highest they have ever been in US history.

The period you are referring to is known as "The Great Depression", which saw the mass migration of independant farmers from large banking combines from the midwest in large factories that mass produced shoddy goods and drove millions of independant crafts people and small businesses into bankrupcy.

It was the worse economic decline in the history of the United States and most people attribute it to the lack of market regulation and exploitive labor practices of free market industrialists.

>>68494046
There is no help in people that enjoy being cucked to such a degree like people being ready to pay willingly foir education.

>>68493982
Sadly, it doesn't work that way. Instead they end up allowing useless idiots to get into college based on their skin color or people who want to study useless subjects like African Basket Weaving, and then blame the Jews or something for their inability to find employment.

>>68494046
So you are saying the best way for me to avoid paying out the nose for life saving medication is not government regulation, but to simply "take one for the team"?

>>68494007
The Nordic countries are mixed economies like the rest of us. They are definitely not the best working countries. They are probably the best to live comfortably in, but that's only until they run out of the money they gained from liberalizing their economies.
>>68494116
You're paying for it with your taxes, Hans.

>>68494007
Oh sure socialism works better because you are better. Listen to yourself dumbass, maybe their succes is not due to their socialism but because they have always been richer. Also I fucking doubt scandinavian countries are 100% socialist.

>>68494180
You too but you have too pay again

>>68494136

Well, this is what happens when schools are for profit. I mean, the goal of a for-profit prison system isn't to rehabilitation as well, it's to keeps as many prisoners in the system.

>>68494140
No, without the government-created monopolies, there would be more than one company making the drug.

>>68494106
The 50s-60s economic boom happened because Europe and Japan were blown up in WWII and we had no economic competition. That and we made $$$ rebuilding them and selling them goods.

>The period you are referring to is known as "The Great Depression", which saw the mass migration of independant farmers from large banking combines from the midwest in large factories that mass produced shoddy goods and drove millions of independant crafts people and small businesses into bankrupcy

The Depression had ended in most countries by 1935, but FDR dragged it out a decade here with his inane socialistic policies.

>>68494074
>those charts, they love charts
So. is that bad? should i be sad?

>>68494180
only difference between Germany and the US is that you pay twice.

>>68493912
Site your claims

>>68493948
Which was what the Progressive Movement was

>>68493979
If he is dissatisfied with his job then all the luck to him for finding a new one

And I hope you're aware, in your analogy, he'd be just as happy to piss on yours too pinko

>>68493982
Those who fail to put solid effort into the free pre-collage education they receive shouldn't be allowed to get into higher education consequence free

>>68494007
Guatemala is in Central America, you geographic illiterate

Furthermore, regulating the interactions between consumer and producer is only part of the hurtle of Socialism, and having a Capitalist economy disqualifies you from Socialism

>Nordics are pure socialism
And you're pure idiocy

>>68492321
so bono is a commie ''muh equality'' cuck?

>>68494180
Tax-funded education creates more socially mobile and an overall healthies society than education that is funded by private debt.

Big corporations love regulations and socialism because it protects their monopolies and allows them to be lazy and not have to develop the best products and services, since no competitor with a better product can arise.

>>68494092

there is no one definition of socialism

>>68494216
The government didn't create the monopoly, the company did. They filed a patent. Are you saying we should abolish intellectual property laws?

>>68494220
Yeah, because the content of the chart can summed up with this:

The American Dream is dead.

That's something you can be pretty sad about.

>>68494216
How did the government create monopolies? Monopolies form by big companies pushing out all the competition, they're the result of the government not doing anything to stop them.

>>68494193
>>68494225
The US is not unregulated capitalism so I don't see your point.
>>68494260
Yes, if you don't want to pay so much for life-saving drugs

>>68494281
>The American Dream is dead
Thanks, Obama.

>>68492680
This hasn't been true since the 1920s. All the entrepreneurs these days are ivy league educated or have serious connections.

>>68494260
Not all monopolies are natural monopolies.

>>68494227
Where do you get the energy to argue?

The dissatisfaction you must feel with your life must be tremendous.

I'm tired just looking at you.

>>68494282
You understand English. Read the source.

>>68494227
>Those who fail to put solid effort into the free pre-collage education they receive shouldn't be allowed to get into higher education consequence free

What are you on about? A system that discriminates on income doesn't discriminate on performance.

Since college is virtually free here we actually have a more selective secondary education system than yours. You can't pay your way in,here.

>>68494296
>>68494283
Even if they hadn't filed a patent, they may be the only company which knows how to make and manufacture the drug.

What if no one else is able to find a way to make it?

>>68494348
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2016/dec/01/australian-students-recreate-martin-shkreli-price-hike-drug-in-school-lab

>>68493381
You're a fucking moron if you think the USSR represents all socialism.

I hate commies with a passion, but some socialist policies (universal health care, free education, worker's unions) are objectively good and I pity you for being denied that in your corrupt 3rd world shithole.

>>68494348
It would be very profitable to leak those details

>>68494399
And even more profitable to keep them a secret.

>>68492321
When I was a kid I would have thought 'Wow, if I work really hard, I could be in that limousine someday!' now I just think 'lucky bastard' and continue on with my dreary life.

>>68494373
This. Communism means the government owns all production so there is no competition and that means you have shortages and whatnot. Socialism is just capitalism + the government keeping the companies from exploiting the people (more than pure capitalism does).

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Seems to me that the less capitalistic a country is, the shittier it is.

>>68494445
Not for the employees.

>>68494456
>Hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way
>The time has come, the song is over, thought I'd had something more to say

>>68494504
>Socialism is just capitalism + the government keeping the companies from exploiting the people (more than pure capitalism does

This is the modern form of socialism that America simply refuses to believe is real. Their loss tbqh

Ireland here, Bono's a wanker.

>>68494527
They get to keep their heads

>>68494504
>This. Communism means the government owns all production so there is no competition and that means you have shortages and whatnot. Socialism is just capitalism + the government keeping the companies from exploiting the people (more than pure capitalism does).

Holy shit, this is so fucking wrong. Communism with a government? Socialism = government intervention + capitalism?

Please keep your defitions in check you have no fucking clue about what political ideologies are actually about.

>>68494552
That's not socialism (socialism is public ownership of production). That's more like social democracy which all actual socialists/communists denounced.

>>68494281
when did it die? your chart doesn't say that.

>>68494567
?

>>68494512
According to your own graph, New Zealand has a greater level of economic freedom than the USA and even our welfare is fairly socialist (although the current government is a big advocate of trade liberalisation).

There is literally no reason why a country can't promote capitalism while still using certain socialist policies to ensure the welfare of its people and your own graph shows that.

Canada, Australia, New Zealand - all more left-wing than the USA but significantly greater economic freedom than the USA.

Really makes you think huh

>>68494594
Yeah you're right, my bad.

>>68494586
Wrong. I study economics and I'm right.

>>68494616
Nobody's calling the US economically free.

>>68494303
I don't need your patronizing to convince me of your arrogant complexion, bourgeois
And this isn't an argument, at this point the thread has devolved into petty insults and misinformation

>>68494328
And as a consequence you also alienate any individual who is willing to put time, money, and effort into achieving a better life should they choose to do so later on

Pursuit of individual dreams can overcome academic sluggishness, and that's fine, you just need a way to prove you're dedicated to the prospect

It's an investment in life, and whether you do it monetarily or academically is irrelevant

>>68494616
>all more left-wing than the USA but significantly greater economic freedom than the USA

Left-wing and greater economic freedom kind of cancel each other out. Because North Korea and Cuba are havens of free market economics, no?

>>68494373
>objectively good
>commie """""education"""""

Reasons to love the USA

>USA is the only country not based on ethnicity, language or religion but based on freedom
>They landed on the moon
>Best films
>Best games
>Best tv shows
>Best music
>Best science
>Tolerant of all peoples
>Strong rights for the individual
>Invented the Skyscraper
>Big houses for everyone
>Gun rights and right to self defence
>Gives more away in charity than anyone
>Will fight for the little guy
>Big cars

That is why you should love the USA

>>68494284
Obama killed your dream? Sorry to hear that.

>>68494712
still haven't moved yet nigel?

>>68494712
No, that's why you should HATE the USA.
Because jealousy.

>>68494718
Everyone's dream unless your dream is to eat gay wedding cake.

>>68494373
>universal health care, free education, worker's unions

Yeah, let's see where those policies go.

Universal healthcare - creates an environemnt where people keep living longer and longer even though their productive age stays the same or gets even shorter

Free education - produces a lot of useless people with meme degrees who would've been better off working fresh out of highschool.

Unions - killed Detroit

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>>68494712
>mfw the US is objectively the most relevant nation in the world

>>68494770
>Universal healthcare - creates an environemnt where people keep living longer and longer even though their productive age stays the same or gets even shorter

Nah, let's not bring baby boomers into this. I'm more objecting to having to pay for gender reassignment surgery or some slut's birth control or an illegal immigrant gangbanger who got knifed in a fight.

>>68494770
rofl

>>68494768
What was your dream that Obama killed?
I am in college majoring in CS, job market is good. So I am alright.

>>68494770
check life expectancy stats by country. universal healthcare doesn't help anyone live longer.

>Free education - produces a lot of useless people with meme degrees
that is true

>>68494864
>>68494770
The people who lived to 80+ are more often the ones who had an easier life and didn't perform manual labor.

Protip: Almost all life expectancy gains in the last 50 years affect wealthier and white collar people. The average life expectancy of manual laborers is about 69, same as it was in the 1950s.

>>68494864
It's not about the boomers, atleast not american ones. Europe is getting way too old because of all that socialist crap that has been forced upon us by the previous generations. Universal healthcare combined with social security and pensions is a deathtrap.

>>68495039
>Europe is getting way too old because of all that socialist crap that has been forced upon us by the previous generations. Universal healthcare combined with social security and pensions is a deathtrap

Actually it's more because young people won't reproduce; they'd rather spend their time and money suntanning in Majorca.

>>68495072
Because work means paying half your salary to the government to feed the pensioners who already got theirs so you'll rather spend 20 years getting educated for free. Shit goes around.

>>68494649

Must be a pretty shitty school if you don't even learn the basic definitions of the most relevant political ideologies of modern history.

>>68495026
>69
where did you get these numbers from?
if you plot life expectancy from 65 (the only way that makes sense), then the gap is about 1-2 years

>>68495205
Don't you mean paying half your salary to Abdul and his 25 kids? :^)

>>68494328
>Since college is virtually free here we actually have a more selective secondary education system than yours. You can't pay your way in,here.

>>68493982
>Nothing permits a person more to rise on the social ladder than access to education.

This point is important. We don't have private universities and it's impossible to pay your way in no matter how much would you pay. This means that the socialist approach to universities would be exactly what you think capitalism offers, "work hard to get what you want, be better than the next guy", meaning that there is no obstacle if you want to be a doctor except your own performance. It's very hard to get into but your personal wealth is a non-factor.

Also you could think that when the doctor tries to save your life after you've been in a car crash, wouldn't it be best that the doctor is the most skilled person available, rather than one with the largest bank account?

Arguably though because USA uni's have ridiculous amounts of money coming in, they can invest more in research and everything and that way have offer more to their students than their European counterparts. This is why USA uni's top the world's uni ranking lists every year.

So maybe USA's uni's have the best education, but Europe uni's have the best people. While USA's system might produce the best research, Eurosystem is the fairer one.

>>68495288
No Abduls here, only Dežos. But the biggest portion is spent on keeping old fucks alive while they grumble and vote for commies to get more pensions.

The American medical system has a big problem getting young doctors and surgeons unless it's in the big cities, because Millenials all want to be Dr. Drew Pinsky or something and live a glamorous life in LA treating celebrities and driving a Lamborghini. They're having to import buttloads of Nigerian, Indian, and chink doctors to make up for the shortfall.

>>68495338

same is happening here too and is bound to be a serious problem.

>>68495327
Well anyone who actually wants to study can afford it here.

>>68495417

Not that surprising when you are viewed more as a customer than a patient.

>>68495327
You can get a nearly unlimited amount in loans if you get accepted to med school. Doctors get paid $$$$ here so they know they will get their money back

>>68495448
What? Did you even read what he said? He is talking about doctors not patients.

The student loans of doctors are actually another hidden reason why health care costs are so high in the US.

The problem is that american limousine rider has usually big nose and when he drives down the street, he passes a homeless wanna-be-rich every corner

>>68495487
Remove proxy, Putinbot.

>>68495471
Don't bother
Germans on /int/ know the least about the USA but always have the strongest opinions.
They are insufferable cunts

>>68495485
health care costs are high everywhere. nothing is free. or you are implying that patients here are paying cash?

>>68495471
Do you lack basic reading comprehension or do you just don't understand how incentive works in a for-profit system? If you are regarded as a customer, more than a patient than doctors will naturally flock the best paying customers and your whole health care coverage the regional distribution of doctors is imbalanced and completely fucked.

>>68492321
Yeah, it's not really like that at all.
And I come from socialist jante-law land.

Unless, of course he by that meant that we generally won't accept smug people with some selv-righteous sense of entitlement, in which case, he would be right.
But driving around town in a limousine isn't that.

>>68495512
Putin is your new friend, fatso. Most of limousine riders in Russia have big noses too, it is a great basis for a political marriage

>>68495485
No, that would be the strangely non-competetive insurance market in the US.

>>68492321
The actual difference between Europeans and Burgers is that Burgers think 100 years is a long period of time while Europeans think that 100km is a long distance

Socialistic ideologies killed 100 million people.

>>68495617
Obesity killed probably more in the USA

>>68495528
The highest in the US among all developed countries that doesn't even result in a higher life expectancy. A truly tragic joke.

In your country you have cases where people without coverage will avoid going to a hospital for minor things because they can't afford that treatment and somethings these little health conditions balloon into emergencys.

These emergencies have to be finally treated and will be treated but there is not a snowball's chance in hell that these costs will be completely payed off by a person that couldn't even afford the most basic insurance.

In the end everyone has to pay the bill anyway because you guys can't be arsed to implement a system where all people are covered like any other major developed country on this planet from the get-go

It is truly comical.

>>68495597

/thread

>>68495658
People who can't afford even a basic coverage are not worth saving anyway.

>a german flag explains to me how the system i use is fucked
>b-b-ut we are ok
>no, no, i study economy, here it says on page 159: usa is fucked
>/int/ in a nutshell
yawn, good nite everyone

>>68495658
>In the end everyone has to pay the bill anyway because you guys can't be arsed to implement a system where all people are covered like any other major developed country on this planet from the get-go

Any state is welcome to implement government health care. Massachusetts and Hawaii have it.

>>68492904
>how many of them come from rich families or went to top universities
>86% of millionaires are first generation desu
if your family is lower middle class or lower Ivies pretty much cover the difference if that makes sense.

>>68495697
Spoken like a true sociopath.

>>68495741
I know, I know. We should all open the gate for those poor, oppressed ISI...I mean refugees.

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>>68495697
Unless they're you of course.

Also america's "work hard to get what you want, be better than the next guy".

Let's say you get cancer, which has nothing to do with you not working hard enough or whatever.

In USA you are financially fucked, the treatments cost like 100's of thousands or something completely absurd.

In Finland there is zero (0) impact on your personal financial status. The treatments cost nothing.

Yes I do pay that in taxes, but if I'm lucky enough to stay healthy and not getting cancer, will I be mad about paying for other people's healthcare. Of course not, I will be happy that I've stayed healthy.

And also with taxes the healthcare system is so much cheaper, as I don't have to pay huge profits for insurance companies, for-profit hospitals and make doctors millionaires. Doctors here make like 10K€ a month, which is a lot less what they can make in USA but it's a perfectly healthy salary anyway. Also people should be aiming for med studies because they want to help people, not because they want to be rich.

Thinking people's well being and health as a "business" is actually super disgusting.

>>68495697
70% of murrican population cant afford dental care. Lets liquidate this impoverished trash and make america great again.

>>68495617
Capitalism have killed a bunch too.
It doesn't make it inherently good or bad.

Some people tend to think that socialism can only exist without capitalism and vica versa.
(Scandinavian-) Socialism is basicly just regulated capitalism with proportionally large amounts of government funds in circulation. (Higher taxes, broader wellfare system, free education, state intervention in the free marked).
So the state charge high taxes from society, so it has more money to fund it's development.

All in all, socialism have worked pretty well here, regardless of how many people died in China, the USSR and south America.

>>68495741
A sociopath can atleast know what's necessary for a sustainable society.

>>68495841
This idiot confuses socialism with bolshevism and stalinism, probably

>>68495791
I'm not a poor schmuck, Trudeau

>>68495845
You want to let people die, without necessity. You don't care about society.

>>68495875
post proof

>>68495890
Thats probably because he is a kike. Who uses yiddosh words nowadays? >>68495875

>>68495905
Yiddish*

>>68495905
educated people

>>68493870
>Carribean
Beef patties would be a more accurate stereotype. But I don't think you can make 180k from seeling beef patties

>These Europeans raving about free college
there is a significant difference between making 380 colleges free and 4140 colleges free especially when a third of them charge absurd rates.


(using numbers for Germany and USA)

>>68494328
>Since college is virtually free here we actually have a more selective secondary education system than yours
thats because you send the retards to welding school rather than teaching them how to do calculus, not because you have free college

>You can't pay your way in,here.
you can't pay your way in here either. In order to go to a top school you need to fulfill their absurd academic standards to have a chance at getting in, and also extra curriculars etc. once you actually get in if you are poor they (the college) will generally pay for most of your tuition assuming they are a top school. The college debt meme comes from kids whos parents are rich enough to not get financial aid but aren't rich enough to pay for college.

>>68495875
You'll never be poor.
Except when you're poor.

>>68495841
Wait, isn't your welfare state just payed for off of oil and gas?

>>68495817
>Also people should be aiming for med studies because they want to help people, not because they want to be rich.
Doctors don't get into medicine for the money. There are much better choices that involve a lot less debt and studying.

>>68494288
It is true. My net worth is $800k and I'm a typist.

You just have to spend less.

>>68495914

Thats funny because most of yiddish vocabulary in Poland was adopted by polish bydlo. We use such words like siksa, belfer, machlojka or rejwach practically everyday on mass scale. But since there was no jews in czech republic, this czech guy must be a kike if he uses yiddish

>>68494136
I doubt AAs are blaming Jews, and AAs are a very small amount of admits in general. They aren't ruining college

>>68495820
Yet they still manage to eat and you don't see headlines like >America's teeth are falling

>>68495841
Isn't scandi socialism based on having relatively ok taxes for companies and high as fuck taxes for people?

>>68495817
>Thinking people's well being and health as a "business" is actually super disgusting.

Do doctors want to get paid? Apotheracy clerks? Medicine manufacturers? It is a business and it has to be thought about as business.

US attracts already talented people, but if your the average joe, wouldnt put it up there for you to succeed

>>68495933
>thats because you send the retards to welding school rather than teaching them how to do calculus

They go to welding school because they don't meet our selective requirements, mate.

Pupils get separated after the 4th grade and distributed to different school branches based on their performance, regardless of their socio-economic status. Only the top branch gives you the allowance to study at a university.

>there is a significant difference between making 380 colleges free and 4140 colleges free especially when a third of them charge absurd rates.
Same reason as above.

>>68495959
Yes and no.
4% of the annual profit from petrolium production in Norway is sent to the state budget.
The rest is kept in a sovereign state owned investement fund, so it can be used on a rainy day.

However, better examplse of the Scandinavian/Nordic socialism model, would be Denmark, Finland and Sweden.

>>68492321
I think Bono is wrong here. Many Americans, especially millenials, do not think the dream exists anymore

>>68496068
>Many Americans, especially millenials, do not think the dream exists anymore
Thanks, Obama.

>>68495959

Well isn't Norway's way off dividing the "free" money from extracting natural resources to all citizens better than the capitalist way of giving everything to small group of people, like many other oil-producing countries do.

Let's think, is it better to spend oil money for healthcare for thousands of people, or let few princes buy golden yachts and 100 supercars?

Oil profits makes Norway the richest Nordic country, but our system is very similar and we don't have the natural resources Norway has and we are doing just fine too.

>>68495992
Kind of. Business taxes and regulation in Northern Europe are really low, although they have high personal taxes to pay for social services. But they also practice fiscal responsibility and never offer more than what they can afford.

>>68496078
>or let few princes buy golden yachts and 100 supercars?
Then again, thousands of people are employed building and maintaining all those yachts and sports cars.

>>68495954
If you are poor, you're fucked. So?

>>68494712
Thanks, Nige

>>68495982
Am not for the record although I got a bit of an interest in kike culture.

But I watch a lot of American media and schmuck is pretty common word.

>>68496078
It does help having 5 million people and no niggers desu.

>>68496112

Yes, nothing is black and white. But I think the concept of thousands of people working for the enjoyment of few who probably never had to work themselves is bad, and I also think this is the heart of capitalism's failure and why we'd need a better system.

>>68495617
>Believing capitalist propaganda

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>the memerican dream
literal little working bees, inb4 muh personal anecdote

>>68495992
>Isn't scandi socialism based on having relatively ok taxes for companies and high as fuck taxes for people?
Compared to others, yes.
But keep in mind that our high wages more or less makes up for it. We have one of the highest rankings in the Purchase Power Parity index (PPP) in Europe, on par with Switzerland.

Norways corporate taxes are at 26%
While I pay a tax of something like 35% (Exact percentage will depend on my exact annual wage)

There are also alot of other taxes for companies operating in Norway, so the the 26% is somewhat missleading.

>>68496200
>Norways corporate taxes are at 26%
I saw 60+% for big companies like Total

>>68496078
>the capitalist way of giving everything to small group of people

Are you referring to the Gulf-states? Because those are anything but capitalist.

>>68496177

I agree anon. There's a a better alternative to capitalism, we just haven't found it yet.

>>68496177
>and I also think this is the heart of capitalism's failure and why we'd need a better system

It was already tried. It led to gulags and mass famines.

>>68496194
That's simply because our rich are really rich, not because Americans are getting poorer

>>68492454
This. We are just temporally embarrassed millionaires.

>>68496177
>But I think the concept of thousands of people working for the enjoyment of few who probably never had to work themselves is bad

>>68493133
See there is the typical European mindset that they can't overcome the idea of being peasants who have to serve some fat fuck king who lives in a palace strictly because he was born into it.

>>68496283
>I don't understand the term social mobility
Great post

>>68496265

So what should we do? Accept that we're wagecucks and accept that we've got the most unequal society in the developed world? I don't think that gulags and mass executions are a good idea, but there has to be solutions to what's happening in NA and Europe.

>>68496295
You're wrong, in fact this transition is more common in Europe than in the US.
See
>>68496194

>>68496303
Fuck up commie

>>68496265

The common misconception that anything that isn't capitalism is communism. You really are a true American.

>>68496221
The more profit a company makes, the more it will have to pay in tax aswell.
The effective tax rate would depend on what factors you bring in the equation.
Including, but far from limited to:
-Value added tax
-Employers tax
-Property tax
-Various tax deductions
-Real estate tax
-State subsidies
And so on.

>>68496318
>Accept that we're wagecucks and accept that we've got the most unequal society in the developed world?

If we gassed all but about 5 million white people, then yeah, we could be Denmark.

>>68496318
Dont let monopolies develop
Let the smaller businesses have an advantage ganging up on the larger ones

>>68496177
>concept of thousands of people working for the enjoyment of few who probably never had to work themselves

That sounds like feudalism or slavery, not capitalism

>>68496350
If you can think of a socialist country that wasn't a repressive dictatorship nobody would ever want to live in, I'd like to hear it.

>>68496372
Capitalism is urbanised feudalism

>>68496367
Great, in fact monopolies happen precisely because of socialistic policies.

>>68494250

>>68496359

What the fuck is your point? Denmark executed nobody to get to where they are. Were you dropped on your head?

We have a tremendous amount of resources: an educated population, lots of resources and exporting some of our ideas to the rest of the world. There's no reason to accept where we are. We can do better.

>>68496367
>Let bussiness cartels fight monopolies
>Let ut set free a bunch of snakes, so they kan kill all the spiders

>>68496405
>Denmark executed nobody to get to where they are

They don't have 300 million people or any niggers.

>>68496405
He fell for the population meme.

>>68496265

The common misconception that anything that isn't capitalism is communism. You really are a true American. This is the problem why any system which could create better social justice in the USA cannot be even debated about in politics, because the trolls immediately shout COMMUNISM!!!111 and the average american chants with the trolls, as like everywhere the common voter does not understand economy, and politics serve the common voter. Talking about these kind of systems is a political suicide, since only support you get are from educated people, which make up only a small portion of the country, especially in USA.

>>68496395
And a duck is just a minimized T-Rex.

>>68496439

But we still have a fuckton of resources. People come here PRECISELY to make it big. Why shouldn't we make use of that?

>>68496446
Repeat after me: Planned socialist economies do not work and they will never work. Democratic government and free market capitalism is the only system that has ever created a humane, livable society.

>>68496451
Ask this guy. His country is still recovering from that.

>>68496439
Yeah, but also Scandinavians are more collectivist/tribal than Americans, because we're an individualistic culture and also an immigrant-based society, which does not apply to European countries.

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Allow me to zest up the thread with a few charts.

>>68496409
>instead, let's regulate everybody and let the pigs run the whole show

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>>68496539

>>68496446
>create better social justice
>using this term unironically

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>>68496566

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>>68496588

>>68496566
Observe that starting in the 70s, the postwar economic boom ended and we no longer had a monopoly on manufacturing.

>>68496588
Boomers fucked yall over desu

>>68496493
>free market capitalism is the only system that has ever created a humane, livable society.

No , even you do not have a purely free market capitalism. You also have tons of socialistic laws and regulations which makes the capitalism more humane, as in a pure capitalism there would be no regulation to stop the employer from exploiting the worker and environment as much as it can.

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>>68496624

Really. Why are the biggest socialist commies always guys who lived in countries that never actually experienced this system of government?

>>68496566
Out of curiosity, is the "Major sector productivity" graph infation adjusted, and if yes, what the fuck happened in 1975?

>>68496636
>2016
>still confusing social democracy with a planned state economy
I seriously hope...

>>68496649
You are a literal parody. No one is talking about communism here.

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>>68496646

>>68496650
There was a recession in 1974-75 caused by the OPEC embargo.

>>68496636
Except the worker quitting and everyobody around ganging up on him.

>>68496684
Then what the fuck do you think >>68496446 was doing?

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>>68496687

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>>68496399
>monopolies only happen in socialist countries
>while his country is home to the largest monopolies in the world

>>68496688
So it's really mostly caused by increased manufacturing costs?

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>>68496713

The charts show clearly that even when capitalism has worked well for the USA in the past, it doesn't mean that it will work well in the future. Growing income inequality is always bad for a society. Actually the countries with smallest income inequalities rank best in all fields which measure the success of a society.

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>>68496736

>>68496712
He is trying to explain the concept of a social policy to an illiterate retard(you).

>>68496687
>Paid holidays and vacation don't exist unless the government wills it

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>>68496761

>>68496761
Were an admixture of free market and socialist policies desu

>>68496750
What do you mean by other people's money? In your country big multinational corporations are paying less taxes than the average joe working at his shitty manual labor job.

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>>68496782

>>68496768
Actually (and I've waited a while to say this) that Finn is a known troll, leftist, and Russiaboo. I know his shitposts like the back of my hand. You probably shouldn't reply to him in a serious capacity.

>>68496791
Corporate taxes are lower in Europe than the US desu.

>>68496761
>France number one
Well this was in 2000

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>>68496803

>>68496803
>>68496782
Those graphs really don't prove much other than what I already said how small, homogenous countries have less stratification.

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>>68496852

>>68496832
The effective tax rate companies pay is usually very different from the general corporate tax >>68496352

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>>68496866

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>>68496866
Ukraine?

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>>68496876

>>68496750
Socialism is kind of based on the fallacy that equality can exist, which it doesn't. That's just basic Darwinism; some organisms will always have a competitive advantage over others.

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>>68496896

>>68496853

How do you define, homogenous? This graph includes countries that have different and large language communities. Every Afro-American does speak English and has been assimilated to Anglo-American culture.

>>68496906
Darwin always fought this retarded interpretation.

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>>68496921

You scandies misunderstand America and what it stands or more accurately stood for.

It was a new start. A new land where you don't get harassed by government, where you can do what you want to do. The key word in that sentence being YOU. You didn't come to America to make it great, to join their society or to get benefits. It was about YOU. And the other side of that coin is that you are responsible for yourself, you and you alone. The neighbours might help you, you might help them. But you are absolutely in no way entitled to that help.

A lot of people died in America seeking their dreams, a lot of them never had them fulfilled, a lot of them changed them and only a small amount actually succeeded. That's how it works.

Everytime you push for more government involvement, for more equal society, for forcing the rich to give up wealth they don't want to, you undermine the basis on which America was built and which allowed it to become the strongest country in the world.

>>68496906
Normative equity is fucking different from naturalist equality you dunce.

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>>68496939

>>68496807

I don't know who you're referring to, I haven't been to int for months and I never posted much. Attacking on my character is a classy move anyway.

Russia is actually a good example of what happens in a free-for-all capitalism after the collapse of the USSR. The super-wealthy Russian elite controls _everything_ by buying up all of the Russian production and their situation is infinitely worse than yours. But the thing is, you are heading for the same path and cannot even see it, and that's the problem.

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>>68496951

>>68496945
> A new land where you don't get harassed by government

Apart from being drafted to die in its wars.

Alright.

>>68496931
He also never said humans evolved from monkeys but everyone believes it anyway

>>68496925
>How do you define, homogenous?

Say, Denmark has 5.6 million people, all of them one race/language/culture. That does not exactly apply to the US. We have states bigger than some European countries. Just NYC alone has more people than all of Denmark or Finland.

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>>68496970

>>68496977
We don't have the draft for over 40 years, but a bunch of European countries sure do.

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>>68496987

>tfw you realize class consciousness is a false consciousness

>>68496949
It's not though. Just compare world cultures. Europeans became successful and the dominant world culture because of certain inherent advantages they had that Africans or pooinloos didn't.

>>68496738
>smallest income inequalities rank best in all fields

We have one of the least unequal incomes in the world. We aren't a bad country but I wouldn't exactly call us ranking best in all fields.

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>>68497001

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>>68497014
But India had it and that's how the UK was filthy rich dumb burgerclap.

>>68496945
Then explain shit like this.
>>68496987

>>68496949
The former is inefficient if the latter isn't true. Causes more harm than good in the end.

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>>68497028

>>68497030

>>68494218

>>68496977
That actually didn't happen for most of America's history. It actually started happening AFTER America started getting socialized.

>>68497021
I was going to say. Low stratification isn't necessarily a mark of success else Romania and Ukraine would be First World countries. All it means there is that everyone is poor together.

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>>68497044

>>68497057
Not really since the first time we tried the draft was in the Civil War.

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>>68497064

Americans did that while they were the richest country in the world (they still are), but as they decline and their mantra fails to deliver for the average person their values will change.
It was either Bern or Trump, they chose Trump or rather Bernie got pushed out. The question is what new myth will they worship.

>>68496955
Russia is a country where people have no clue how capitalism worked aside from watching Soviet propaganda flicks.

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>>68497082

>>68497083
>The question is what new myth will they worship.
Mass immigration to China to find jobs

>>68497046
This is a summary of 20th century history of which everyone is aware. Does not explain the increasing gap.

>>68497122
Go and ask Bill Clinton why he signed away millions of manufacturing jobs via free trade agreements in the 90s.

>>68496987
Less unions = more profits :^)

>>68497095
Are you saying they don't have 'real capitalism'?