Do you support independent Catalonia? Why or why not?

No, Spain is perfect as it is

yes

spain is shit

>>68009492
Germany was perfect as it was when it had Poland.

>>68009537
ok

>>68009479
No, dont want my own regionalists to spaz out if it happens.

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It's French, so is Navarre

>>68009597
>my own regionalists
Is there anyone left?

>>68009536
It's like Spain got so mad that they had to let Gibralter happen so they made Ceuta to cuck Morocco to vent their rage.

>>68009775
Well some Catalan still live in Roussillon, but Corsica and Brittany are the main ones left, although they are losing more and more influence.

>>68010007
What about your prime minister? He is Catalan.

>>68009479
Yes Spain should be balkanized

>>68010136
FUCK QUEBEC

Yes because i like Catalonia and i dont like Spen

>>68010086
France integrates everything.

>>68010086
Yeah, his family is, I doubt he even speaks Catalan

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More states are always good.

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>>68010230
Do you know this guy? This guy is a French singer but he said in an interview that he speaks Catalan with his family. He sings in Spanish well. Valls could be the same case I think.
>>68010176
Spain couldn't and there will be a massive ass-pain next year south of your border. I don't know which is better. I wonder how Spain couldn't suppress and integrate Catalonia when it had decades of Francoist regime and even hundreds of years of time since the Crown of Aragon went into Spain.

>>68009479
yes

now i want to see them burn and cry in a marxist leninist poor state

>>68010136
Quand sera le prochain référendum au Québec ?

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Yes, Scatalans are bro tier and deserve independence.

>>68010661
>now i want to see them burn and cry in a marxist leninist poor state
Catalonia is the richest region in Spain.
Catalunya és la regió la més rica d'Espanya.
Cataluña es la region la más rica de España.
La Catalogne est la region la plus riche d'Espagne.
カタルーニャはスペインで一番豊かな地域だよ。

Deal with it you fascist PP ass-sucker.

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>>68010665
Jamais ;-;

Catalonia will be independent.

Basque Country and Navarre will be unified then independent.

Galicia will join Portugal.

Spain will be balkanized and all those sore PP supporters and falagists will die in economic crisis and pain in their Madrid homes built with Catalan taxpayer money. And EU will never bail them out.

Spain wasn't meant to exist.

>>68010951
Ne perds pas l'espoir. Quand la Corée était une partie du Japon, personne ne croyait qu'un jour elle sera indépendante.
Le monde ne cesse de se changer et tout est possible avec le temps. Vive le Québec libre.

>>68011068
>Un Coréen parlant un bon français
On aura tout vu.

Thread Music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHXDMJRcDF0


>>68011205
Je ne suis pas coréen mais il y a des centaines de français qui parlent coréen parfaitement dans cette ville où je suis. C'est rien de rare ou étonnant.

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>>68011068
Merci, meilleure Corée

No

Their flag looks ugly as sin, they need to change that first.

>>68009479
I'm ambiguous tbqh, on the one side I have great simpathy fro their cause and would like to see it succeed but another part of me doesn't want to see Spain torned and diminished.

It's a complex issue.

No. hala madrid

Yes.

Fuck spen

>>68009479
Yes.
It just makes sense.

>>68009479
No

Because we share with the Spaniards, the same disdain for the independantists

>>68009479
No, they need Spaniard dominance.

Last time I went there, they made fun of me because I knew how to speak English (???), I tried to reply to them but they said:
No parlo espanyol

>>68015236
>catalan logic

>>68009479
I do support independent Catalonia.
City states and Balkanization are better than having huge nation states. Smaller governments are better as it means less centralized power.

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>>68015182
>This monarshit post
> disdain for the independantists

>>68010242
No wonder everyone jumped at the chance to fuck up some Germans in the 30 years war.
How the hell do you let that happen?

>>68015997
>Implying the republic wasn't the one the one who culturally genocided the various regional cultures.

The monarchy was decentralized and didn't oppose the various regional cultures, it merely ruled other them.

>>68016070
>the republic wasn't the one the one who culturally genocided the various regional cultures.
Nationalism has been detrimental on many regional cultures as nationalists wanted to 'unify' various people as 'one people'. Kinda silly tbqh.

>>68015236
I've always been well treated in Barcelona, they don't mind you speaking Spanish (especially not Mexican accented one) as long as you make an effort to be respectful and try to speak a few phrases in Catalan. They've got some great used books libraries (in Spanish) and partying in the ramblas is fucking awesome, just stay away from the Moorish area.

>>68016070
Literally moving the goalpost because i triggered your autism.

>>68016070
You must be fucking kidding, people weren't even allowed to choose names for their children.

Seriously try sources other than whatever is the Spanish stormfront for your info

>>68009479
Yes, but only for the memes.

Otherwise I don't give a shit.

>>68016098
>nationalists wanted to 'unify

Civic Nationalists* wanted to unify them, but Civic Nationalism happened thanks to the Republic, under the Monarchy everyone was linked by blood and Catholicism, even if sometimes like in Alsace it was an invented French origin, it didn't matter what language you spoke or what culture you had, as long you had French blood and was Catholic you were fine, while Civic Nationalism is like a religion and require the people to believe in a definite set of ideas and speak the same language(Francien in the case of France)

>>68010990
>>68011068
Why don't you show yourself you proxy faggot?
>>68014453
>>68015236

But why? Do you have a bit of sympathy because you speak the same language?

>>68016016
At least they made a country out of it capable to fight two world wars in succsession and are not some kind of "unated states of Europe" and are now the laughingstock of the world

>>68009479
Yes. I don't like Spen.

>>68016163
He's talking about the french 3rd Republic, the ultimate monarshit trigger.

Catalans are a people without honour. They won't be independent because they lack the balls to fight.

Almost all the peoples we oppressed found their way to freedom. Netherlands, Colombia, etc. Even fucking Bolivia (Bolivia!) managed to wrestle freedom from us. But Catalans, who are merchants and not soldiers, won't.

They are cowards and deserve to stay in the most African part of Europe. At least Basques fought for a long time and Galicians cucked us with Franco and Rajoy. Catalans are a joke.
> 21st century Europe
> even the biggest cowards of Europe, Latvia and Slovakia, have their own countries
> Catalans don't
My sides, they are Rusyn or Sorb tier lmao

No one gives a fuck who a board full of autist chimps supports desu.

>>68017205
please be nice to slovakia and latvia

>>68009479
Catalan is the purest form of Spanish

>>68017377
Catalan is iberian Occitan, it's not even in the same family as Spanish;

>>68017550
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpxyUtmlYhM

The literal perfect mix of french and spanish is catalan since it's part of the occitan family.

obviously because i want to kill them like my family did in 1937

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yes

>>68009479
Yes, I do. However, the Basques need their own land before anybody else does in Spain.

>>68016893
>Be independentist
>Get genocided by the Cuckpublic
>Worship the Cuckpublic

Nice cognotive disonance m8

>>68022088
>Nice cognotive disonance m8

Nice cognitive dissonance m8*

>>68009479
No, spain is one.

>>68009479
Sure

>>68022991
I support indepebdant cornwall east kent yorkshire and northumbia filthy anglo faaggot fuck with us get fucked.

>>68009479
No, Catalan independence is a meme.

>>68023375
this and catalan is a meme lenguage

someone conquer us already, we are suffering. PLEASE

>>68023439
I'm Catalan myself, I honestly don't understand why everyone here wants to seperate. 40 years and still butthurt from Franco

>>68009479
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

>>68023491
>I honestly don't understand why everyone here wants to seperate.
It's because PP is Franco in disguise.
They are prosecuting Carme Forcadell and Artur Mas because they "talked" about independence in the parliament.
Spanish central government just wants to keep Catalonia because it gives them money. leeching off Catalonia.

>>68023591
He didnt just "talked" he made an illegal referendum regarding the independence of Catalonia

I don't really care.

I really hope they get their independence so we stop gearing their butthurt SJW bullshit all the time

>>68023591
Spain wants to keep us because we are part of their country. Catalan independence is a joke that has been going on for far to long. It's time to stop.

>>68023625
This also, the Catalan goverment are like elementary school children, don't want to listen to anyone but throw a tantrum when they don't get their way

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I don't care. As i see it they're part of Spain i guess. Also Prussia is rightful clay of the reich.

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>>68023591
>They are prosecuting Carme Forcadell and Artur Mas because they "talked" about independence in the parliament.

you really fell for this meme lmao

>>68023683
Only if they take Buenafuente and Jordi Evole with them

>>68023683
Please don't let us go, if we get independent we will turn into a communist shithole

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>>68009479
I support worst korea being a part of best korea again.

I would say they would make a fine country and the union with the other countries has pure drawbacks and no real benefits other the military protection which is in this day and world not really needed,Catalunya wouldn't find it too hard to get accepted into NATO as a independent country.

>>68023815
France wouldnt let that happen
They wont get into EU either

>>68023815
>military protection which is in this day and world not really needed


>nigger mountain ""ingteligencja"" folks

>>68023779
>Please don't let us go, if we get independent we will turn into a communist shithole
no, i wish you get independence soon, Spain will be better without shit.

>>68023843
I would assume they would make fuss about it but in the end the pressure from the international organizations would win them membership in most things.We are talking about oppressing a small catholic western state.We both know that is highly unlikely to happen in 2020.

>>68023693
You are not Catalan. I doubt you even speak Catalan at home.

>>68017205
/thread

>>68024003
Lmao whatever floots your goat man

i've heard Catalans are Pro-Palestine

so no

>>68023625
Why does the referendum need to be illegal? Just because Rajoy wants it so?

>>68023973
Europe would never allow that because It would send a messangeto the rest of the indepedentists regions of europe. Even the Uk would be aganist.
If catalonia gets their independence they would turn into a Belarus isolated from the rest of Europe

>>68024042
Why do you care so much about Catalan independence though? I'm sure you have better things to be concerned about

>>68024042
>Why does the referendum need to be illegal? Just because Rajoy wants it so?
because of the constitution, "popular soverignity comes from the people of Spain" not only the people from Catalonia, to declare the independence of a region of Spain It would be necesary to change the constitution

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>>68024041
not like you have anything to say about it, yid

>>68023751
How about all anti spaniards get deported to peoples republic catalonia?

>>68024088
I just want all fascists in the world to suffer. Now that Trump happened, I want it all so bad even more. I want Catalonia to be let out and Rajoy to lose government. That old goat needs to go just like all the obnoxious old goats all over the world.

>>68024099
You don't need to abide to evil laws. There is a thing called civil disobedience for this. When there was Franco it was illegal to question his authority. You did.

>>68024140
Israel's slingshot is a tad stronger

>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David's_Sling

>>68024174
Rajoy is not facist He is just a cuckservative selling Spain to the EU

>>68024143
Anti-spaniardists are not tolerated, anti-spaniardists led to napoleon genocide as well as usa genocide.

>>68009479
I don't care. Why not?

>>68024216
Anti-spaniardism is not tolerated in 2016.

>>68024174
>evil laws
Thats you opinion mate. I can also think that the laws involving robbery and murder are evil and disobey them

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>>68024197
yes those missiles will be put to good use once pissrael is given a nice democratic islamic regime reform.

>>68024249
Independant south when?

>>68024099
>>68024256
Laws are opinions codified by politicians.
Constitutions change all the time. It can happen.

>>68024249
California and Pacific Northwest need to be let out too now that Trump happened.

>>68024319
This man lost it.

>>68024213
no le hagas mucho caso es un subnormal indepe fuera de España,esperemos que s mantenga fuera y no vuelva

>>68024213
A little fascist is still a fascist. He just lacks power. Needs to be sent to the guillotine all the same.

>>68024319
Jerusalem needs to be independant.

>>68024279
>>68024319
That will never happen.
Never.

What do these issues have to do with Spain? Spain and the USA are different countries.

>>68024384
>A little fascist is still a fascist. He just lacks power.
>PP
>fascist
kill youself jordi

>>68024384
He isnt even a little bit fascist, being facist involves some socialist economy measures. A fascist wouldnt allow Spainiards to be as poor as we are now

>>68024402
They said the USA will never be independent when it was under UK rule.

>>68024410
They are fascists at heart. The people and the era just don't permit it so they pretend to "behave" now, but they will act up at the earliest possible moment. They are prosecuting Catalan politicians without talking with them for a bit. This shows much.

>>68024402
There are fascists in every country and suppressed people too.
Trump can happen in France too in the name of Le Pen. This problem is universal.

>>68024490
Fascist means spaniard is spaniard no classes, the nation is one arm one flesh one body one soul.

>>68024490
what are you doing in south korea, Jordi?

>>68024490
I dont know where you get that information from butthey are lying to you, nobody gets prosecuted in Spain for speacking about catalonian independence

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>>68024384
just stop it already you're making me cringe

>>68024410
>kill youself jordi
You need to be a bit more polite and not insult Catalans when Catalan taxpayer money helped bail out Madrid and is supporting the failed wasteland that is called Andalusia just like it did for hundreds of years. Wherever you are.

>>68024597
Lol where are you getting all that info from? all lies

>>68024597
Support deporting andalusians from spain then.

>>68024547
http://www.elmundo.es/cataluna/2016/11/22/5834392d46163f66348b4700.html
>La magistrada del Tribunal Superior de Justícia de Catalunya (TSJC), Maria Eugenia Alegret, ha citado como investigada por los delitos de desobediencia y prevaricación a la presidenta del Parlament Carme Forcadell para el próximo 16 de diciembre. El TSJC inició una investigación a partir de la querella de la Fiscalía para determinar si Forcadell desobedeció al Tribunal Constitucional (TC) al permitir que el Parlament votara la hoja de ruta independentista el pasado julio.
>Tras la votación el Constitucional consideró que "la actuación de la Presidenta del Parlament permitiendo que se votase en el Pleno la alteración del orden del día solicitada por dos grupos parlamentario", la CUP y Junts pel Sí, para que se votasen las conclusiones de la comisión sobre el proceso constituyente es "un incumplimiento objetivo de su deber de impedir o paralizar cualquier iniciativa que suponga ignorar o eludir los mandatos" del tribunal.
>En su resolución, el TSJC también ha citado como testigos al secretario general de la Mesa del Parlament, al letrado mayor de la cámara catalana y a tres de sus miembros José María Espejo Saavedra (C's), David Pérez (PSC) y Joan Josep Nuet (Catalunya Sí Que Es Pot), que mostraron su disconformidad con la decisión de Forcadell de alterar el orden del día del pleno para incorporar la votación de las conclusiones de la comisión del proceso constituyente.

>>68024597
FUCKING LIAR, what are you talking about? you don´t know nothing so shut up your big mouth

>>68024678
>al permitir que el Parlament votara la hoja de ruta independentista el pasado julio.

>>68024625
It is called fiscal facts. They are available on the websites of the Spanish and Catalan governments. Catalonia pays more tax to Madrid than it receives. Where the difference goes? To Rajoy and lazy Andalusians.

>>68024678
el coreANO

>>68024597
ok fucking Jordi , stay in South Korea a dont come back to Spain, nobody wants you ass here

>>68023473
were buys with the Brits right now, but we tamed the Greeks already so we should be able to help you

>>68024732
your*

>>68024752
Hope you get killed fuck germ fuck eu spain is one.

>>68009479
Yes but with Valencia. Independent Basques, too

>>68009641
Illyrian provinces are smaller here than they actually were desu

>>68024732
I have no interest in the bland wasteland and an economic failure that is Spain minus Catalonia. So we are in agreement here.

>>68024490
>>68024526
We will bathe the world in nuclear fire before any state is allowed to leave.

>>68024830
>Yes but with Valencia.
It will happen eventually. But we need to take steps to make it happen. First things first. Priorities.
>Independent Basques, too
That is their problem to resolve but that will eventually happen too. Both governments of Basque and Navarre are regionalists. When Catalonia gets independent, it will give them strength and hope.

Israel and Kosovo happened. Catalonia can happen too.

>>68024839
This economic wasteland has the same GDP as your country and a minimun wage almost similar

>>68024897
Independant state of jerusalem and tel aviv when?

>>68024839
>economic failure that is Spain minus Catalonia.
because Spain moved spanish industry there in 1800 because north Spain is rich in resources, unlike south.
Again Franco invested in Catalunya too, (it was a big mistake)

>>68024918
Korea was in ruins and basically poorer than most states in AFRICA. If you think Spain is doing good because it is on a par with Korea, you are seriously retarded.

>>68024918
Also without Catalonia I think Spain will be poorer than Korea. Catalans are 16% of population but produce 20% of GDP.

>>68024969
South are moors largely and tge whole populace is around 50% moor totalled up while every other region is pure white.

>>68024997
never said that we are doing good quite the opossite

>>68024997
Spain was third world in 1950.

>>68025023
4% grwater efficiency wow, the rest of the states will bo longer subsidize caras and they become polanf

>>68025033
>spqin was thirf world in 1950
Lies.

>>68024597
We don't need to be polite, we have the army, the police and the government on our side. If catalans start chimping out we'll send death squads like we did with the basques. There's nothing you can do about it.

>>68025201
Based

Traitors deserve death.

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>>68023591
>PP is Franco is disguise

I hope that was true.

Not in the issue of Catalonia tho. I'm a foralist.

>>68025242
They want to be but they can't and they won't and they never will.

>>68025711
Yes, and Andalucia is rich and high IQ.

>>68017205
Top kek underrated af, you Manolo are my hero.

gib independicia por favor

i fucking hope kimmy nukes the fuck out of worst korea desu

>>68025959
pep bitte

>>68026112
Yes, but I want a korean gf

>>68026363
Korean girls like European men, given that they are open-minded and progressive, not misogynistic and backwards like disgusting PP supporters.

>>68026419
women like money

>>68026463
that's what ugly men say to convince themselves. funny thing is most of them don't even have money.

>>68026419
I want that divorce and adultery was illegal again.

Where is Franco when we need him?

>>68026419
I thought korean girls were only after fags with degrees and money.

>>68026535
Oh yeah. Fascists are too incompetent to keep women to their sides so they need LAWS to shackle them. What a surprise.

>>68026607
why are you so salty about fascism?

>>68026627
People are inclined to hate disgusting things.

>>68026607
Even Pitt and Deep are cucked this days...

Civilized societies regulate sex. Sexual liberation is for savages like negroes.

>>68026607
mate, why do you think that? PP is not a fascist party,wtf only corrupt shit

>>68026712
>Civilized societies regulate sex. Sexual liberation is for savages like negroes.
t. virgin
no wonder fascists tend to be ugly. it all fits.

>>68009479
no, its the spanish equivalent of scotland e.g we don't actually want independence we want to leave and the join the EU

>>68009479
Catalonia is rightful Andorran clay!

but seriously, even if it was independent, it'd be at the mercy of the EU like Switzerland (though in a batter location for international trade)

Como un yanquis viviendo en barcelona diría que es una idea interesante sino probablemente mal.

>>68026910
"You are just frustrated and bitter, no matter that 60% of marriges end in divorce, that cucking has skyrocketed is not an issue anon. All social norms were just prejucides, they weren't justified. No matter that women have +20 sexual partners when they reach 30 or even less, now they are empowered and free even though they have become a semen deposit for a minority of men. No matter that women throw to a dustbin their fertility for working in the office, we don't need children we just have to import low IQ third worlders that will replace us!"

t. non-virgin

>>68027163
>No matter that women have +20 sexual partners when they reach 30 or even less
Why does it matter to you if she has 1000+ sexual partners or whatnot?
Mind your own business.

>>68027461
Are you really korean or a proxyfag/foreigner I thought korea was cool.And I met koreans and they were cool as fuck

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>>68027461
>Anon: "Correlation is not causation."

>>68027516
>I thought korea was cool.And I met koreans and they were cool as fuck
You mean backwards like you? To a fascist backwards people must look cool.

how does Catalan even sound like? i've never heard it spoken.

>>68027538
I mean that they arent bitter cry babies, They were all friendly

>>68027516
Es catalufo.

>>68027537

Same question. Why does it matter to you?

Dont act like you care about their well being.

>>68027549
Here you go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHXDMJRcDF0
>>68027537
So what if she has STDs? Doctors are there for a reason.
Are you gonna not drive your car because it will wear it out? Car mecanics are there for a reason.
>marriage
It is an overrated, an outdated system. It is a slavery. It needs out. Good riddance.

>>68027613
o un troll

>>68026910
Unregulated sex can only be find in tribal little societies.
All higher civilization have concepts of restrictive procreation.

Disolving norms of a civilization is the disolvement of the civilization itself.

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>>68027538
Western democracies came to think that "human beings desire nothing beyond ease, security and avoidance of pain."
Fascism was "psychologically far sounder than any hedonistic conception of life."
"Whereas socialism, and even capitalism... have said to people 'I offer you a good time,' Hitler said to them, 'I offer you struggle, danger and death,' and as a result a whole nation flings itself at his feet."

Fascism has now no meaning except in so far as it signifies "something not desirable." - Orwell, Politics and the English Language

>>68027538
You are a troll
"everything I dislike is fascist :( "
You dont even know what fascism means

>>68017205
this

LOOK AT ME I HAVE BEEN COLONIZED FOR 300 YEARS I'M MORE PROGRESSIVE AND MORE EUROPEAN EVERYONE ELSE IN SPAIN IS REGRESSIVE AND DOES NOT LIKE DEMOCRACY

>>68027537

And this survey is old as shit. Another time, another mindset.

el catalANO señores

>>68027749
Israelis remade their country that wasn't for 1000 years. They even remade their language that has been dead for centuries. Compared to that a Catalonia independent is nothing.

>>68027662
>Fascism was "psychologically far sounder than any hedonistic conception of life."
So it kills tens of thousands of political opponents. You fascists are mentally ill. Girls may have sexually diseased but they are freer in spirit.
>>68027741
Fascism is everything that is not liberty.

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>>68027865
>Fascism is everything that is not liberty.

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>Come with me anon! Let's celebrate the joy of being a single, united nation!

>>68027764
Not an argument. There's no reason to suspect these trends have reversed.

>>68027626
Well, that's what you imply. I don't think sexual liberation is good for women.

>>68027637
Herpes can't be healed for example.
Yes, marriage is outdated. It this "sexual revolution system" that has worked, the first generation that embrace it already had a fertility rate lower than the replacement rate.

>>68009479
Yes, because i am libertarian; the state cant impose itself over them, they have their rights

>>68027865
t. prefers overused pussy that went on 1000 men rather than a girl that will give him a real family

Did you know that singe motherhood damages most children mentaly?

>>68024174
lol waht a fagot

stfu

>>68027955
>the state cant impose itself over them
Oh but it definitely can.

>>68027955
Te amo.
>>68027948
It will one day be healed. Your argument is invalid.
>low fertility
That is because the shit economy and bad social security makes it impossible to raise kids without sacrificing personal life.
France has replacement rate (2.1 if i remember correctly) of fertility rate and it is THE country where sexual liberation started (May '68). Your argument is invalid fascist scum.

>>68028055
But that is wrong and disrespect their individuality... John Locke would be sad D:

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>>68027865
I was quoting George Orwell, one of the greatest intellectual enemies of fascism.

He is saying that fascism understands the human condition much better than do the other systems - hence why it is so appealing. He was not advocating for it, nor am I; this would be plain to you spent your time developing critical thinking rather than training your brain to reflexively jump at any contrary view

>Girls may have sexually diseased but they are freer in spirit.
Yes, "free" but slaves to their own whims and appetites.

"For indeed none can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." Milton

Im against any small European state that wants independence
those greedy fuckers would try move onto our tax haven turf

>>68027948

Are you woman. Is that why you think that?

And do you think its bad for men aswell?

What is the solution? Dont let people make their own choices?

>>68028089
How many languages do you speak m8? I know portuguese(mother language), a little bit of spanish(badly spoken disgusting version of portuguese), english, and am trying to learn norwegian(because vikings) now

>>68028111
Individuality is not important, collectivity is all that matters.

>>68028089
외국인이냐?

>>68028041
>he shut me up so i'll give him personal attacks
callate
eres un joto
>>68027971
Source?
No matter how much they are mentally damaged, they will be more sane than you neckbears.
>>68028121
>but slaves to their own whims and appetites.
It will never cease to make me laugh how you fascists describe freedom to undermine it. Better to be slave to self than others.
>>68028126
Jokes on you Patrick. At least Catalans kept their own language. They have more reasons to be independent than you. Your being independent (and Belgium) is the very reason Catalonia should be independent too.

>>68009479
Yes, it's a pleasure to annoy spaniards.

>>68028153
The solution is simply to encourage a return to traditional ways of thinking.

>>68028191
French Catalan English Korean Japanese
oh and i also speak a dialect of Catalan that is called Castellano.
>>68028221
무슨 상관?

>>68028251
heres our reason for being independent: we fought a guerilla war against the UK and won
There is no other "reason" for being independent that actually matters

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>>68028251
Willing self-sacrifice is not slavery, its rejecting the will of others while at the same time willing that you sacrifice for them. The two other alternativas, unwilling self-sacrifice and wilful self-indulgence / stupefaction, are certainly forms of slavery.

Until you can accept such basic concepts and principles as these, I would not try your hand at high level argument.

"How singular is the thing called pleasure, and how curiously related to pain, which might be thought to be the opposite of it; for they never come to a man together, and yet he who pursues either of them is generally compelled to take the other." Socrates, The Apology

>>68009479
If a good majority of them want to then sure

>>68028274
>encourage a return to traditional ways of thinking.

This does not work. If you try to enforce traditionalism, you will fail. It does not matter how you try to do it.

The material structures of the society determine the social organization. Sexual liberation is a consequence of changes in the way the West organizes the economic production. Only changes in the economic organization (which may be under way already) will make the current sexual "degeneracy" evolve into something else.

>>68028089
Herpes cure? Are you kidding me?

Who the fuck knows how many of those new births in France are moors and how many are native French.

You don't say anything about when women entered the labour market practically the raised x2 the labour force lowering wages (immigration has worsen this even more, 6 mill immigrants only in Spain), inflation, globalization and the destruction of industry in the West, how taxes have skyrocketed everywhere in the West...

Sexual libertaion started in the mid 60's more or less at the same rate in most Western countries, maybe in Spain and Portugal started 5-10 years later.

Social security is good enough in every Western country. You are just a demagogue.

>>68028490
Muh materialistic determinism

Sexual liberation is a made up word to imply a state of oppression having existed. Its true that liberalism has led to an increasingly expanding marketplace, causing our appetites to grow and our patience for traditional morality to decline, but this is not simply the reason why. The Sufragettes were originally very morally conservative despite capitalism having pushed them into having the opportunity to attain more rights.

I agree that telling people to be better does not often work, but it can, and its better than waiting for the broader cultural architecture to shift

>>68028251
you shut me up?

lol you dont have anything worth saying. i know that youre a french weeb that learned catalan and like that region of hipsters now support le independence because of muh unique identity. you actually believe fascism oppresses catalonia and whatever liberal fagotry you dont like. all this proves how big of an imbecile you are. in the real world, politicans dont care about your idealism, catalan elites want to get out for money, and spanish authorities should fusilate sessesionists. if youre not willing to fight, tough look being a fagot

>>68028872
>whatever liberal fagotry you like.
you like*

>>68028872
>you actually believe fascism oppresses catalonia
>>68024678
Fascists only see what they want to see. That's why I want you removed.

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>>68029001
Replying to your own post

>>68029163
i quoted it to show him the article. are you really this dumb? it is a tragedy the country is ruled by people like you

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>>68029001
lol youre probably ugly as fuck too

fuck off

>>68029217
If I ruled the country 99% of the people tat have ruled this country for the last 40 years will be in exile.

>>68029258
Source?
Your little sore ass-hole?
You pulled it out of that? lmao.

>>68029380
yes my asshole is little, im sure you had it wide opened :) everytime you had an anti fascist gay orgy as protest

being sore of catalan is gonna last all your life m8, because theyre not going free

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>>68029380
Unironically Barcelona fell before to the fascists than Madrid.
Madrid será la tumba del fascismo

The shape of an independent Catalonia in the whole of Europe is ugly af, just like that disgusting flag.

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>>68030161
They don't have a disgusting flag, it's just that the flag that the independent movement uses is a commie flag which is very ugly

>>68010788
No es ni la tercera, puto subnormal

>>68030623
PIB per cápita

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ITT:

Psychotic poster who sees evil fascists everywhere.

Newsflash, that meme died long ago and i doubt anything in modern day europe even remotely resembles fascism.

>>68030161
Germany is ugly as fuck too currently.

>>68030768
PP. Le Pen. That ugly dutch guy. Those east German fascists. Have you been in a cave?

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>>68030857
>Fascist

I think you're just sperging out words out of your mouth though you don't even know what they mean. Let me guess you're some gluesniffing anarchist who thinks everyone who disagrees is da evil nazziefascist. Literally the word you use has no meaning because you use it so fervently and much it has practicallly inflated to nothing.

>>68009479

Yes, I support it
So we can finally annex it and exterminate the local "language" and """culture""" and expand French universalism.

>>68031033
only way id support their idnependence, good thinking

>>68009479
I support a subhuman zoo?

No, I hate spics of all kind

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>>68031360
>That flag
>That post

It's time to start killing some catalans

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>>68028089
>France has replacement rate (2.1 if i remember correctly) of fertility rate and it is THE country where sexual liberation started

I wonder why..
Are you a western english teacher living in korea?

>>68031464
Can I join ?

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>>68009479
>Korean cares about Catalonia
>ok

>>68030467
I meant the flag of the independent movement.

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>>68031852
Why is this disgusting?

>>68031834
He is not Korean. A Korean could not be this biased. He is a Catalan.

>>68031985
Anyone who loves freedom will support free Catalonia.

>>68031919
It feels artificial in all sense. The one of the Autonomous Region is much more aesthetic.

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>>68032063
yeah sure...

>>68032116
Autonomous community*. thx for the (you) btw

>>68024041

They won't be if they become independent and need to look good among their peers.

>>68027461
>Mind your own business.
I like you.

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>>68009479
No, there's already too many meaningless countrylets on this "continent". We should go back to the pre-WWI borders.

>>68009479
Anything that may lead to the demise of the perfidious spaniard has my approval.

never, an balkanized spain would mean more various calls for independance here and various other european countries

>>68009479
Yes, because the rest of spain Is too good for cat*shit! And fuck quebec too

Yes.

Catalonia should finally free itself from the Moorish invasion while they still have a chance.

>>68017205
Excellent post

>>68017550
Also Piedmontéis, Genoese and Lombard are in the same family of Occitan, lol.

>>68010242
>VIANDEN
Shit shaped country and brown on the map. Looks like shit

¿Qué coño hace un catalán independentista en Corea?

>>68035274
>un catalán independentista
El adjetivo no es necesario. Todos los catalanes son independentistas. Los que dicen "no" no son catalanes. No hablan catalán en casa. No saben escribir catalán.

>>68035677
Real Catalans don't speak Spanish.
Gott strafe Katalonien

>>68025201
The international community will not allow it.

>>68036874
parlar o no el catala

>>68036964
They can't do shit, like in the 80's. They won't do anything against a EU and NATO member just because it is defending against rebels.

Serious question. How do you feel about CiU? It was affiliated with the European People's Party, just like PP. Don't they have/had a similar ideology, except for the secession?
>>68036964

>>68037389
every country needs the right and the left. they difference between CiU and PP is that the first cares about Catalonia and the latter cares about exploiting it.
>>68037192
>this is seriously what falangists believe in AD 100+1916

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>>68038777
>CiU cares about Catalonia

Let me laugh you delusional faggot. I'm from Castilla y León and I'm more catalanist than them.

Be careful, I will don't repeat that normies against independence.

>>68040637
won't*

>>68017205
Quality post

>>68017205
so you don´t even see them as one of you?

>>68009479

Yes, fuck spain.

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I fuckin hate those gentusones, I would like all catalans (my prime minister first) to burn in hell forever.

tell me about them, why are they so hated?

>>68042042
Because they are cunts. Catalans are the literal representation of cunts.
What do you guess when somebody talks about a cunt ? A pussy ?
Then it's because you don't know the Catalans yet.
Once you get to know C*TALANS you will associate them with cunts .

>>68041934
where is this and who are those girls

>>68042719
No idea. Just teenagers.

>>68041934
> putting Spanish politicians in power

It's like you guys WANT a bankruptcy.

Btw he and madame mayor Anne are your problem now, don't give them back.

>>68042818
Anne is Spanish so it's okay.
But this catalan scum omg.

>>68009479
Yeah, they should at least be allowed a referendum. The fact that Spanish politicians are constantly refusing them one just cements their place as the worst politicians in Europe

>>68043211
Our constitution doesn't allow it.

>>68009479
No

Spain = Hispania, not castille

so catalan special snowflakes can get fucked. portugal should be part of spain as well

>>68043684
Kek catalans are niggers they don't give a shit of law.

>>68043963
Actually Portugal has some case, because at least with their language it's drunk spanish, and that involves some effort

as opposed to scatalunyan which is just nigger/3 year old retard spanish

as a castillian i only support a confederation with basques navarreans and asturians
fuck the rest of ethnic groups


KING IN THE NORTH!!!!!!

>>68043963
>>68044154
I agree, but catalan sounds good, portuguese is the real nigger iberian language. It's phonology is a fucking joke.

>>68041934
wtf they are so impressed by him :( they never look at me like this

>>68036964
Sure international community did not allow the Ukraine to be invaded by Russia.

>>68041934
SOURC

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>>68044884
That's because you've lived your whole life speaking with a low-precision language, where all the sounds are a subset of a full complete and non-mongrelised language. You're only using a small amount of the sounds available to you, so you get a clunkier sound.

Pic related is Portuguese on the left, and Spanish on the right.

Portuguese is fluid, soft and poetic when it needs to be, and harsh and manly when necessary.

>>68009479
Sure, but they'd have to fight it out. Crying about meany big Spain instead of manning up deserves you a place in that very country.

>>68009479
1. No

2. It likely wouldn't be a monarchy

>>68045449
Do you know that portuguese doesn't sounds as a romance language? Man it's like they weren't vowels when you guys speak. Castilian and Italian are so superior and how are pronounced and how they sound. Keep it simple.

>>68046084
>Do you know that portuguese doesn't sounds as a romance language?

How can you talking shit about Portuguese when Spanish unironically has a [x] sound?

>>68009479
No, I have learnt than get independece from spain is a bad idea.

>>68046164
I'm not talking shit, it's the true. Portuguese sounds like it wasn't a romance language. I'm totally serious. A phoneme found in Castilian will not change that fact.

>>68046304
truth*

>>68009775
Occitania

>>68009479
No
They're just being tsundere

>>68046084
Vowels are better far apart, as if each one is an event. Would you eat 3 deserts instead of a meal?

Memes aside, it's also a lot less tiresome to speak and hear. For the most part we usually have one open vowel per word. Although to be fair, there is the slightly more open voweled Brazilian.

>>68014307
fuck you its beautiful

>>68046345
Occitania is a meme though.

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>>68046267
noice

>>68046267
Getting independence from Spain is smart, but you forgot step 2: join the USA.

>implying this independence movement isn't just a smokescreen to restore communism in Catalonia

>>68022662
*WHEEZE*

>>68046478
to use colombia as a brothel i suppose; anyways i dont care about spics, they rebelled against their peninsular brothers in times of need.

no mercy for traitors

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>>68046511
>mfw

>>68024384
>Needs to be sent to the guillotine all the same.
Que fais-tu en Corée ?

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>>68032982
Lol my "useless" countrylet has contributed more to the modern world than your 3rd world slavshithole.

>>68048675
Russian contributions to the modern world:
>satellites
>space stations
>LEDs
>nuclear power plants
>etc

Finnish contributions to the modern world:
>a badly drawn cartoon bear

>>68049174
wtf rude lad...finland is my favourite country so fuck off

>>68049246
Don't talk to me ever again.

We is speshul guise totally not spain XD

Fuck these annoying cunts, same goes for you Texas

>>68047492
Je profite de la vie libre.

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>>68049174

>Modernized cellphones ie. Nokia
>Text messaging
>HRM Heart Rate Monitor
>Molotov coctail
>Ice skate
>Sound film
>Suomi KP/31
>Satchel charge
>One of the richest nations in Eu

RUDE. Also, pay debts

>>68049920
>molotov cocktail
That is ours you thieving mongol.

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>>68050116
No yours is Poorly made petrol bomb. We mass produced and perfected our own formula. Thus MOLOTOV coctail.

>>68044154
http://vocaroo.com/i/s1CZKih12yUp