Would you rather?

stupid at first glance, but actually a very good question.

I honestly don't care about imagination or drawing. combining references is a lot nicer that drawing kjg scenes with people in it imo.

If i could fucking paint like a chinamen it's no different than having a pet succubus or a billion dollars.

Without a solid foundation your just putting lipstick on a pig.

drawing from imagination and having as little references as possible is what I aim to do, feels more freeing in a way. I just love how loose the image on the right feels.

>>3078051
I want to make comics so I'd take 0033's skill set immediately.

>>3078051
Ruan Jin. You can model everything in a 3D application, meaning that being able to sketch the human body from any angle is worthless.

RJ's a good draftsman himself, isn't he? If you mean maxing out either your rendering or draftsman skill, definitely the latter. Sequential art and animating are definitely more my endgame.

i'd rather have the ability to suck my dick or cock

>>3078067
remove a couple of ribs and presto

>>3078071
what the fuck does presto mean you goddamn wop

>>3078072
what the fuck does wop mean you goddamn goober

>>3078076
i see you've played this game before.

>>3078058
Drawing from imagination is overrated. You think people care if you drew the image from imagination? What matters is whether it looks good or not...

>>3078051
0033 obviously

>>3078051
0033
0033
0033
Anything to be 0033

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>>3078051
What's going to happen if you have both? do your rip the fabric of time and space?

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>>3078051
wtf rotating poses with minimal references is way harder to do than it looks

>>3078166
That's what a lot of you faggots think. Oh his style is simple, it must be easy as fuck to rotate simple styles like that. Nope, in actuality, drawing like 0033 is much harder to achieve than rendering a turd.

>>3078104
What drawing skills from imagination allow you to do is to open up your creativity to actually draw the things you want to draw and then look for reference to get that extra level of believability and correct mistakes etc. Without that skill, your work will always be stunted because your creativity directly depends on what references you managed to gather before starting your piece.

>>3078193
And if you draw from imagination you're gonna be limited by whatever visual information you memorized, and since most of you guys aren't KJG, it's not gonna be much. You'll have a much wider selection of things to reference from on google images then you do in that little feeble brain of yours.

>>3078192
Alternately he could be rotating a 3D model he made in something like zbrush

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>>3078200
I highly doubt that. 0033 is an animator not a 3d modeler. Plus if that was the case, he wouldn't be able to make redlines like this

>>3078197
>And if you draw from imagination you're gonna be limited by whatever visual information you memorized

No you aren't because at any time when you feel you're stuck, you can start looking up references. It doesn't work the other way around when you are completely stunted in your ability to draw from imagination and always have to rely on references from the get-go.

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>>3078197
>tfw use reference intelligently while drawing from imagination

>>3078051
That painting by Ruan Jia WAS by imagination. and I think it's impossible to be at that level of rendering and have zero ability to do it without reference. it requires too much mileage to get there for you to not have anything in your head to work with. Plus, that image you chose for the "sketching human body at all angles" doesn't match him in skill by far. so this is a stupid question every way you look at it.

>>3078316
1.)what's your evidence that its purely from imagination? Realist artists hardly ever draw from pure imagination. I've also seen a couple of his process videos where he was using reference 2.) You can't read. I didn't say zero ability to draw without reference, I said limited in your ability to draw from imagination 3.) how does it not match him in skill? 0033 is at the top of his game as far as animation goes and ruan Gia is at the top of his game as far as rendering goes and 4.) it's not a stupid question, its a question of would you prefer having high level rendering ability or a high level of imaginative ability being able to draw a Simplified human figure from almost any angle without reference

>>3078071
I guess that does it, but why not just train for back flexibility instead of doing something that stupid?

>>3078072
In that context it's like saying "voila"

>Ruan Jia can't draw from imagination because I said so

>>3078329
>0033 is at the top of his game as far as animation
lol

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>>3078051
I wouldn't take either, I just want to be able to draw freely and joyfully like I used to

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>>3078329
fuck off already

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>>3078391

>>3078382
He can, just not nearly as well as 0033. I remember an anon posted a recent video interview of Ruanjia where he was flipping through his sketchbook and later on he drew a figure from imagination and you could really tell that this just wasn't his forte at all. I'm sure Ruanjia is not as bad as that video made it seem and he can probably draw fairly decently from imagination, but most beginners have no clue just how good someone like 0033 really is at what he does.

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>>3078393

>>3078391
>he likes Planescape: Torment
wtf I love Ruan Jia now

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ruan jia - 0033
>>3078056
1-0
>>3078057
1-1
>>3078058
1-2
>>3078059
1-3
>>3078063
2-3
>>3078064
2-4
>>3078067
2-4-1
>>3078104
3-4 (I hope you are another voter and not somebody who already stated his vote and now discussing your opinion because that would screw up the ratio)
>>3078107
3-5
>>3078111
3-6
>>3078161
see >>3078067

I give my vote for 003 too so that makes 3-7 so far

>>3078397
>nearly as well as 0033
What's your evidence that its purely from imagination? I watched japanese animators youtube videos. They draw from references and "pose books". And your 0033 is no name animator

>>3078332
>why not just train for back flexibility

>he fell for the training meme

>>3078397
>he can probably draw fairly decently from imagination
all of the keks. do you even know who you're talking about? "fairly decently", lul

>>3078415
Why do you guys have such a boner over these things? It doesn't matter. There are those guys who make the "hyperrealistic 3D art" videos on YouTube who have more subscribers than Kim Jung Gi, and a normie would probably agree they're the superior artists because they don't know how anamorphic illusions are set up via photoshop and probably don't even care to ask. These people can build an entire career on straight up fraud, why do you care so much if someone uses reference, copies or traces? Who fucking cares. You like the end product and you put any kidn of money towards the artist, and the artist has done a good job.

Ruan Jia is trash lul
>>3078420
Do you have schizophrenia or something?

>>3078197
Hey look, a non-artist who thinks drawing from imagination is memorization.

>>3078051

0033.

Rendering is easier to learn than anatomy and construction. And it's funnier to do. So if I could shit correct human figures, I'd focus my time in learning how to render.

I don't want to polish my fuckin turds, m8.

Rendering is not art.

>>3078404
Explain

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>>3078104
woah check out this faggot

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>>3078316
>>3078329
>>3078382
Ruan said in a talk, I think it was at THU, that he uses references all the time, and joked that without them his stuff looks caveman tier.
Realistically he will have started from imagination, finished with imagination, but opened up tabs for reference in the middle, got some help with the nose here, the mouth there, etc. There's videos of him painting on youtube where you can see this process, which is much like most pros do, link related.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFO0LRB-yGg

>>3078051
I'd choose Ruan. I could make a living off the paintings, and learn more imagination and sketching stuff in my own time, like he's doing now. It's also not just being a slave to reference, his knowledge of lighting, texture, colour and composition is top tier, regardless of if you like the style, subject and the rest of that.

>>3078104
it's only overrated to you because you can't do it.

>>3078051
In all honesty, I'd rather be Ruan Jia. I LOVE lighting and atmosphere. If I could draw/paint any kind of texture, lighting condition, fabric blaah blaaaaahhh, but be limited in my ability to draw from imagination, I wouldn't care.

If I could, for example, take a photo of a boring tennis ball, but give it beautiful textures or lighting, that'd be amazing.

>>3078391
You really can't read can you? He asked what was your evidence that it was PURELY from imagination?

This sequence of posts doesn't defend your argument. He struggled to get it right, and had to do a bunch of skull studies to perfect the face. You fucking liar

>>3078554
>He struggled to get it right, and had to do studies and actually train like every artist
Every artist struggles. If they don't, they've become complacent.

0033

My inspirations are animator-like drawings with strong gesture, drawings that tell a story, I almost don't care about color although I know good rendering brings more audience.

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I don't see anything inspiring about 0033. A lot artist can draw like him. And "le no references" is just a meme. Even people like Yoshinari use references

>>3078554
the irony is that it's you who can't read. It literally says the following:
>"Since I wasn't able to find an appropriate model to refer to, most of the details and colors were conjured from my imagination."
>"I made repeated attempts to depict the face the way I imagined, but each time it proved unsuccessful. So I made a number of studies starting from the fundamentals such as skull structure and then working on towards completing the face.

>>3078104
why do you care about what others think?

>>3078076
im a wop frog. wop is an italian american slur, the assumption is that they are a notch below whites.

>>3078670
He did studies on the side in preparation for the main piece. What's your point?

>>3078663
Post your work

>>3078705
what? the anon i quoted asked for proof it was from imagination, so i gave him the Ruan Jia quotes that say so. what about that do you do not understand?

>>3078727
Sorry, I must have misread your post, I thought you were saying something roughly along the lines of
>he did studies, so his work wasn't a work from imagination

My bad, man.

>>3078051
>0033
I want to be able to draw bodies so badly. Every day I get a little better.

I'd prefer drawing. Anyway I like flatcolored pictures more, than with realistic render.

>>3078051
Not a fair comparison since both artists have probably strived to be at least competent in both rendering and sketching from imagination.

>>3078051
the painting guy, i heard he had a pretty great art education, which would give you a lot of room to move, being a pretty good anime girl drawer doesn't have so many prospects

>>3078051
Both, I'm not some weak ass pleb

>>3078927
0033 can't render

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muh ruan jia

>>3078051
easily the latter

>>3078051
I want to be both

So what steps do you make to be good in wither ruanjia renderin or 0033 drawing?

>>3079305
same.

>>3078051
03, the reason is that his skillset is way harder to attain. I'd like to just have it so I can focus on fun paintings and shit.

>>3078051
Ruan Jia cus it looks most impressive and attractive to normies. With that skillset you could easily pump out dumb animu/disney portraits and get lots of cash

>>3078051
def the latter, rendering is easy to learn, much easier than the drawing
silly question/10

>>3079393
basic rendering is easy to learn, but painting at RJ's level is something achieved by fewer people than have achieved 0033's level of drawing

>>3079397
it really depends what you want to do. if concept design, storyboarding or animation is your focus, then fancy rendering isn't that useful compared to solid drawing skills, but if illustration is your focus then it's great to have a unique and catchy rendering style.

>>3078197
Nigger, you've never drawn shit in your life.

>>3079473
Visual library is based on what you studied you stupid fucking cunt. It doesn't come out of nowhere.

>>3078420
>Why do you guys have such a boner over these things?
Putting an overblown image of someone else on a pedestal gives them an excuse to not work hard because they'll never be that good. It frees time to procastinate and shitpost.

>>3079474
You don't know what drawing from imagination is because you're a fucking loser noob autist who'll never understand anything about art that doesn't have autistic schematics and manuals written about it.
>IB4 what's a good book to learn how to draw from imagination?

There's a lot more to Ruan Jia than rendering. You'll know that if you try to copy his work. It's harder than it looks.

>>3078051
I'd rather be able to put out one manga volume every month and cash in than autistically render a picture for one month and get some social media good boy points.

I don't have either so I'd take 0033.

>>3079479
I don't even draw lmao. Ruan Jia is trash. Even monkey can render like him. Deal with it

0033

I don't even like over rendering, I prefer flat colors. So even if I can render like Ruan I would not do it.

>>3078663
>using reference for 20 mins of your day
>the same as drawing from a reference the whole day

>>3078203

That's clearly by andrae tho.

>>3078051
is that the original version of the ruan jia picture, i remember it being a lot less crappy, maybe it's from compression or something

>>3079495
I don't have to deal with it, because it's like, just your opinion.

>>3078051
>>3078400
You can always combine refs to make things. I guess nothing too fantastical or out of the norm, but that's fine.

Render.

>>3078431
Hey look, a pretend-artist who doesn't know that "drawing from imagination" is referencing your visual library, which is (part of) your memory.

>>3079476
You just angry because you can't read a book to save your life.

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>>3078051
I'd rather have the rendering ability of Monsted

>>3080793
time for you to fuck off

>>3078699
Everything makes sense now.

>>3080855
the visal library is fucking everything you have seen in your life, how the fuck do you think we will reach a limit with that? that shit's the future.

>>3080926
also, as an artist, you start to understand shapes, values, anatomy.

Once you get to that point you can do a lot of stuff without looking at reference, and changing it to whatever you wish. Maybe a phone was hard before, but to the eyes of an artist, its just a shape with rounded edges and a flat surface box. Now what If I make that curved? What if I give it a mout? What if I make it a house?

really? you expect to find that in reference? imagination lets you do whatever shit you want, reference is just what you find.

and that doesnt mean reference is not good, it is, but you shouldnt say that it is the only important thing, while without reference we may forget some details, using totally reference will never let us go further than what we are being shown.

>>3080860
holy christ thats nice

>>3078059
This

>>3078051
0033, because relying on reference for everything you want to draw, especially poses or backgrounds, is more masochistic and restricting than just learning to construct from imagination.

>>3080927
Autists don't have imagination.

>>3078051
that bodys pretty stuffed on the left and your mistaking random lighting in some spots for perfect shading. im alkready better than the right if thats the extent of their skill but id hate too lose too much skill. If its only gaining the expertise then the left because i suck at rendering rn

>>3078051
you know the good thing about ruan jia isn't his 'rendering' it's his design skills, the rendering only looks as good as it does because of the design. if you ever see a wip of his, they're pretty good without any painting at all, sometimes better

>>3082040
LMAO post your work dunning kruger

>>3078104
It's important if you want to be an animator, comic book artist, storyboard artist, or any other job that requires you to dish out a ton of drawings in a relatively short amount of time. If you have to use reference all the time in order to get believable figures, you'll never finish.

>>3082075
the rights not that good. show me better examples by that artist then