Make /ic/ Great Again

[cont.]

2. Spreading of Misinformation/ Deliberate Disencouragement
Be it due to a lack of knowledge or the overestimation of oneselves abilities, there is a lot of half-baked advice on this board; Critiques that try to impress with academic language and the mentioning of names, but ultimately lack in content. I am unsure if these persons just indulge in showing off, or if they genuinely want to help others, but in the end their advice is not constructive and in rare cases even harmful for the artist.
While a critique can be written in an attempt to mock the artist, the critic, as they bear no grudge against the artist, has no motive to disencourage them from drawing. This, however changes, when the critique is disregarded by the artist - be it for legit reasons or not. In this case, the artist will ask to see the critic's work, which will either result in a spiteful bashing of said work (regardless of their quality), or the critic claiming they do not need to show off technical expertise to help out with their observation and theoretical knowledge on the field of illustration.
A way to prevent the "show your work" dilemma and spread of misinformation would be the introduction of identification tags for this board. This way it's up to the artist wether to accept a critique or not, without explicitly asking for ones work. It will also prevent the spreading of misinformation to a certain degree. Furthermore ID tags will most likely regulate spiteful posts in general, thus we will have less gossip threads and less anons posing as other artists for /ic/ to bash them.

What are your thoughts on the introduction of identification tags for this board?

https://strawpoll.com/x5wbsz7

>>2945901
1. Could you have made this thread without the /pol/ influence? With this alone you have just singled out you're part of the problem.

2. It's just one person. Half the board is aware of this person and their style of trolling.

3.
>Furthermore ID tags will most likely regulate spiteful posts in general

This has been discussed already. A poll wont change this. If it gets enough negatives you'll just claim someone stuffed the ballots like last time. The people all for IDs are secretly the shitposters themselves.

The stickies already provide valuable resource. Nobody is misinforming anyone.

>>2945905
>The stickies already provide valuable resource. Nobody is misinforming anyone.
There's a ton of misinformation on /ic/ though. But I think a huge amount of this is not actual trolling but just ignorance and blind leading the blind, so you can't really fix that too easily.

>>2945905
> It's just one person.
I would love to believe that, but it's very unlikely. If it was the truth, I'd suggest to ban said person.

>his has been discussed already. A poll wont change this. If it gets enough negatives you'll just claim someone stuffed the ballots like last time.
I wasn't around last time. As I lack some key information, would you care to elaborate on this? Also I don't plan to claim anything, I just want to get a discussion about this board's possible future going.

> Nobody is misinforming anyone.
I doubt that a lot of people misinform on purpose but more transparency would provide beginner artists with a better way of estimating the legitimacy of a critique.

>>2945910
>As I lack some key information, would you care to elaborate on this?

If you weren't around back then you aren't qualified to police the board or suggest to make drastic changes. Someone who knows board culture from inside out and its problems is qualified, just my opinion.

In short it was a /q/ suggestion thread. On the sidelines it was an individual from discord who stayed up all night making several polls in hopes he got his way. It's also the same individual who made fun of my sick dog in the /q/ thread after I posted pics (which I shouldn't have) when he called me a liar. This individual is quite famous for his Trump VS Clinton comic and I suspect he is you just by going off of the choice of OP pic you used.

Now that I have you here just in case you are him: you think it's funny to make fun of sick animals? Fuck you dude.

Undoubtedly threads like these have upped post quality posting style (grammar usage) to appeal to mods. But I'm sure you're on discord high-5ing your pals on how much you owed this anonymous person while pretending you are not him.

That's all I have to say on this matter. Again, you're sick.

I think mods should be more involved in the community than not at all, some direction and community events would be nice.

also too many god damn political threads, it's an art board I don't come here to be yelled at by a bunch of far-right/left fuckwits about muh pc culture.

We should have a hard ban on any political discussion whatsoever.

The mods are absolutely useless and let the dumb trolling threads multiply. Fucking obnoxious.

They are not in favour of changing the system. Go elsewhere. /ic/ is a cesspit of shit and you won't find much of value here other than the books thread. Who in their right mind would go to a discord channel for this shithole?

That sticky is beyond useless.

Also OP. Post your work.

>>2945901
>>2945903
I do not agree with your opinion, but I am not willing to go out of my way to have a long winded argument about it. Here it is in short

Mods are never here and it is too slow to justify more than a small handful. They rarely remove threads, but, luckily for you, you can hide them easily if you wish to not see them

Meme threads can often bring on good conversations so removing them is a shame. Often time ngmi threads turn into inspiration threads or help people understand they are not alone in their feeling

ridicule threads can lead to an examination of an artist's flaws, thus sharing knowledge and assisting others to not fall into the same pitfalls

Misinformation will always be spread. It is on the person receiving the critique to analyze the crit for accuracy and act upon it. The few times I have seen an inaccurate critique it usually gets shot down by other anons so I think your talking out of your ass

Having IDs will ruin anonymity and give crybabies more reasons to shitfling when they receive a crit that hurts their feeling. It dissuades brutal honesty and makes this place a watered down version of how it is now

You know what should be done? make "show your work" change into another fraise or word. Like how f a m becomes senpai. Because "show your work" is the real cancer of this board

>>2945901
>getting the mods to do fucking anything
kek, they won't even update the fucking sticky

>>2945972
>Having IDs will ruin anonymity and give crybabies more reasons to shitfling when they receive a crit that hurts their feeling.

Shitposter spotted. Do you remember META thread? IDs will ruin your shitposting

>>2945972
>You know what should be done? make "show your work" change into another fraise or word. Like how f a m becomes senpai. Because "show your work" is the real cancer of this board
It's "Post your work"
>thinking wordfilters will stop the meme

>>2945972
>Because "show your work" is the real cancer of this board
>/ic/ - Artwork/Critique
Better just to delete this cancerous board. You don't draw anyway.

>>2945903
>This way it's up to the artist wether to accept a critique or not, without explicitly asking for ones work.
the people who give mean critiques dont give insightful critiques, as for the legitimate critiques where the artist is in denial, seeing even gods work doesnt change anything.

Im for ID tags so that people feel at least a bit ashamed when they post no strings attached insults.

>>2945927
>This individual is quite famous for his Trump VS Clinton
manlyspirit is the guy shitposting?

I'm one of the dicks for IDs and linking work to IDs as proof.

Unfortunately this is a terrible fucking idea for 4chan because most of us don't want to be identified. We have jobs and our work can be traced back to us don't need the idiots from here stalking us.

I appreciate the fact that it's not a hug box but in sincerity most of the content is shit. The anecdotes from people are great and the sharing of tuts and books is fantastic. Anything more than this, fucking forget it.

>>2946002
You are for IDs yet acknowledge it is a terrible fucking idea?

>>2946006
You can't have it both ways.

>>2945997

Why yes, yes he is. I think you see it is quite obvious given the length of time he did not reply back to my post. All signs it is him is clearly night and day. I wish I can go back to the posts he made in discord but I'm not doing that shit nor logging in to that cesspit.

>>2945901
>>2945903
Wow, what a nice wall of text by someone desperately trying to sound smart while they wank about things they have no control over.

Hey, maybe next time instead of making a shitty meta thread you could try CONTRIBUTING TO THE FUCKING BOARD.

I like how most of the replies to OP bring up how it's written in plain legible English style.

Are you 12? Some of you are downright fucking retarded otherwise

>>2946017
As someone who actually has contributed to the board, I think this is a justified thread. What have you done yourself?

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>>2945901

If you hate garbage threads, don't reply to them. It's that simple.

>>2946024
You mean if you've been on any board ever. This has been the case since before The Web was a thing.

I think the OP was trying to elaborate his/her points to make them clear and unambiguous.

Pretending to be a bunch of illiterate retards with MUH SUPREME COURT LANGUAGE doesn't fucking do you any favours.

Back to your regularly scheduled bullshit

>>2946022
I post in threads. I generally try to be helpful.

Whiny shit like this doesn't contribute to the board, it's just wanking about shit we as users have no control over. I've seen it on other boards and it's always the same shit.

Wanna make the board better?

A. Make better fucking posts

2. Get in touch with the admins/mods and tell them your concerns, not whinge about it on the fucking board where it will get deleted

For someone bitching about board quality there sure is a lot of rule-breaking going on.

And that's what this is, it's bitching, whining, moaning bullshit.

To say nothing of the flaws of the idea, i.e. ID is counter to the idea of anonymous board, won't really stop anyone because the problem is board culture and not shame because no one gives a fuck about that, no one wants it, ect.

If you really care about moderation apply for a janitor position next time it opens up.
>>2946022
What is "tone." OP is deliberately typing in way to try and sound smart.

>>2945901

Alternatively, force a system where you have to draw in an oekaki whenever you post.

Disable image uploading and force users to draw the exact image.

>>2946031
Except you don't know. OP was on discord bragging about it and how he "won over the mods".

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Because I start rarely visit this trashole and even 4chan now I should tell you some secret technique - "Preemptive strike "

>1) When you corner another retard/shitposter/actually good poster in discussion reply him with "post your work fag".
>2) Prepare battle pictures. I mentioned them in "how to pretending as artist" guide (search for drunk Emilia and Rem pick).
>3) Reply with battle picture at your own "post your work fag" post. Be fast but not so fast. Look at your target posting speed.
>4) Wait a little. Now it's better to change IP if you can.
>5) Post original source of your battle picture. Destroy "him". "NOT YOUR WORK" "NICE TRY FAGLORD" etc
>6) You won. Excuses will not help your opponent to save face. Other anons will attack him too.

Good luck! Never tell the truth and never post your art here.

>>2945979
Not a shitposter, I can take a critique saying I'm shit without crying though. I believe the only shitposting is when /beg/ like me try to defend their shit work by calling out an accurate critique because they broke their bubble. If Id's destroy the directness and harshness of this board then it will become a hugbox

>>2945980
true, but what if it just turns it into a period or something similar? something that does not stand out

>>2945981
I do draw, and I value feedback on my work, even if it is negative. It's embarrassing when someone tries to start a fight because they got their feelings hurt, and it devalues the person giving the critique by making it a waste of time. Why even post your own work if your going to act irrationally and shitpost whenever you hear you're not perfect?

This board is just a tool. Nothing more, nothing less A TOOL.

It's useful because of its resources but it's obvious that a lot of people here are unhappy with many aspects of it.

Don't think of this board as some sort of home for you. I suggest going to sites like Crimson Daggers. /ic/ can point you in the right direction but once you have a generally good idea of what you need to do, search for critiques elsewhere.

I get the feeling that a lot of anons here think /ic/ is Gods gift to mankind, it isn't, and the shoddy results of most artists here prove that beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I also suggest finding Facebook groups. Most other art communities are useless. Put in the effort cultivating a productive atmosphere. Just because you can endure ta toxic atmosphere doesn't mean you should.

Leave this site the way it has. chan culture is ultimately toxic but think of it like colonialism, it's awful and inhumane but there's no denying it brought some benefits to the local people.

/ic/ will encourage you to look seriously at your work and see any major flaws but it will not help in raising your self-esteem, motivation, or overall mental state.Come here sparingly, hide stupid threads, hide useless comments, get in, get what you're looking for, and get out.

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>>2946034
honestly it didn't feel as if the guy was overboard on language, didn't notice on original pass. I think these threads help to advance culture and sentiment where mods can eventually take action. When it comes down to it there are no mods for this board, if only one of us can reach that level we can delete all the threads in pic related

>>2946044
obviously the artbook and questions thread is a mistake but the rest is accurate.

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>>2946040
>I do draw
And I am not

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>>2946038

>>2946044
Mods don't give a fuck, mate.

And so another thread devolved into nonsense.

>>2946045
Artbook threads are actually pure cancer. Because /ic/ retards spoonfeed facebook/tumblr/reddit retards who can't use google. Hell, I seen posters who don't know how to use torrents and don't know where is /ic/ archive. Same for torrent request threads. "I don't know how to register on cgpeers help" fuck you.

>>2945901
Just leave /ic/ there's a very good reason why many of those who used to post here packed up and left after gathering resources and using them to improve.

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>>2945910
we have a lot of spilloff from /pol/ because of two things
1. we're a relatively slow board that doesn't have dedicated mods or even janitors iirc
2. people actually posting works they've made aren't able to fully post anonymously, you can identify most returning artists by their style almost instantly

ID tags work both ways and since it's not that hard to circumvent should a troll feel like it, it would most likely result in making it easier for trolls to harass specific posters

kyle survives because he's a shit stirrer himself and enjoys the attention (see beach body ready).
keppok made the idiotically fatal mistake of thinking it was a good idea to make a tumblr dedicated to /pol/ tier rants (along with the rest of her private life) and link to it from her art blog.
that one sorry soul from the draw thread gets an instant paragraph long response reminding him about how he fucked up with some girl whenever he posts
bbc was dumb enough to accept commissions from literally anybody without screening people to make sure they had some form of establishment online and got doxxed by someone with a burner paypal.
gabenewell keeps getting banned because he draws gay furries, violating the only global rule that is ever enforced on this board.
firez is... well, firez is firez

now imagine every single post of any nameable user on this board getting treated the same way them posting their work gets treated. even if it's only one troll, they're already using a proxy to duck bans then. they'll just reroll for new IDs

/ic/ is broken by design, with the current site culture there is nothing that can be done to "fix" it besides increased moderation which is honestly not worth it for how small this board is. as long as you don't give people a way to track you outside of the site the worst you have to deal with is being mildly annoyed

>>2945934
much of art is inherently political, reactionary authoritarian centrism is still reactionary authoritarianism.

>>2946051
they deleted ONE of my hate threads (left the kyle hate thread open) so they do care a bit. I also once got banned for a week because i posted illastrats okcupid screenshot ( it was really pretentious " if smarts scare you don't holla" and he explicitly used his artist name so it wasnt private). So I know they do come by once every so often.
>>2946053
says the guy who uses my name to shitpost

>>2946058
It's not your name. Use trip

>>2946058
Yeah but that's the same kind of shit they do on other boards. They don't care about /ic/ related problems.
> I also once got banned for a week because i posted illastrats okcupid screenshot ( it was really pretentious " if smarts scare you don't holla" and he explicitly used his artist name so it wasnt private).
kek, that sounds like something that egomanic would do

>>2946061
you use trip if you think thats how it works and that it's your name.

>>2946056
it wouldn't multiply shitposting, it would spread it out evenly in a fair way imo.

>>2946056
>that is ever enforced on this board.
Justified victim. Furryshitters from tumblr start invading /ic/. Too bad lolis were banned too. I like lolis.
>>2946063
You're part of problem.
>attention whore
>underage

>>2946056

You didn't get any new users from /pol/, they were always there. They just decided to be vocal when you guys were vocal about your politics.

Additionally, art was always traditionalist in nature because it's encouraged that you learn from old European masters.

>>2946070

They actually came from twitter when you guys dissed Darkgem once. That place is filled with unironic furfag antifa types.

>>2946070
>I like lolis.
Who are your favorite loli artists?

>>2946078

j7w

>>2946080
oh interesting

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>>2946078
+Senke Kagero

>>2946072
> Additionally, art was always traditionalist in nature because it's encouraged that you learn from old European masters.

Not necessarily. Some actually encourage looking into more modern techniques especially when it comes to technical drawing.

> in b4 technical drawing is not art!
go fuck yourself

>>2946085
If this is real NoseBro, good taste.

>>2946085
Die.

>>2946087

I hate to be all "we wuz greeks and gay romanz and shit, whitieez!", but a lot of art fundamentals were discovered by European folks.

What do you mean by technical drawings by the way? Like CG?

>>2946036
Underrated post

OP here. Sorry for the late reply; I didn't expect this thread to gain so much momentum. Let me briefly answer those who adressed me.

>>2945927
Thank you for the insight. Sorry for the /pol/ reference, it was a joke, I don't even brose that board (also at >>2945934)
I've been browsing /ic/ for 2 years now, so that thread was either older or went past me for some reason. I think I'm familar enough with board culture by this point.

>>2945929
Underrated post, I wholeheartedly agree.

>>2945972
You adressed some valid points. I agree that we need a stronger moderator presence. Hiding threads is not fixing the problem, it's just shoving it away.

>Having IDs will ruin anonymity
You're still able to be as anonymous as you want to be. If you don't want to be associated with this site, well, don't post your work here.

>It dissuades brutal honesty and makes this place a watered down version of how it is now
In itself I'm all for open and honest critiques, but I feel like they most often lack the "constructive" part. The part where they should actually provide insight and point out significant flaws, instead of being nitpicky. And no, I'm against watering stuff down, or having to provide a solution. All I'm saying is that you can be "brutally honest" without being a dick and I don't think helpful advice will vanish with the introduction of ID posts.

>"show your work" is the real cancer of this board
It's a mentality that would crumble under everyone actually showing their work, as /ic/ would soon notice we're all closer to one another in ambition and skill than we would like to admit.

>>2946002
>most of us don't want to be identified
You identify yourself if you post your work anyway. If you only post here you will only be identified as your /ic/ personality. I don't think this will influence anyones life.

>>2946017
>a shitty meta thread
I wish I wouldn't have needed to discuss this, but /ic/ got worse and worse lately. I do engage myself helpfully in other threads.

>>2946107

drop the lawyer act you shitbag, you've been caught.

>>2946107
>I've been browsing /ic/ for 2 years
I've been here for 5.

>>2946116
Yeah you shitbag you've been caught.

This board is moronic as all fuck I wonder how some you manage to breathe.

>>2946090
I'm not real one tho

>>2946029
Sadly it's not, see my reply to >>2945972

>>2946037
I'm not on discord and I don't know /ic/'s mods. If I did I would have had a talk with them. Like >>2946031 I was simply trying to make a point. Sorry if I went overboard, English is not my primary language.

>>2946043
>This board is just a tool.
It is and it's working, somewhat. I just wish it would be oiled and sharpened now and then. It's rusty and hard to use, but I see that /ic/ likes to ignore those problems as long as it still functions on a basic level.

>chan culture is ultimately toxic
I frequent quite a few boards and /ic/ is easily the most toxic of them.

>/ic/ will encourage you to look seriously at your work and see any major flaws
That is true and that's the use many anons, me included, got out of /ic/. Now that we passed that entry stage to draftsmanship, why do we leave it there instead of building up a somewhat functional community?

>>2946044
Thanks Nosebro. To be blunt, I don't particularily like you, but you seem reasonable.

I'm sorry, gotta leave. Will check in again tomorrow. Thanks for all of you guys' input, I appreciate it.

>>2946122
You only need to be here for a few months to know everything there is to know about /ic/ anyways.

>>2946107
Fuck off

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>>2946090
>loli
>good taste

>>2946107
It's still a shitty meta thread shitting up the board. You fucking hypocrite, breaking the rules so you can whine about rule breakers.

Go shitpost elsewhere.

>>2945901
This is easily the worst thread on /ic/ at the moment, good job anon!

>>2945901
Delete /pol/

>>2946271
Actually starting to think this is a good idea. Moot made /pol/ to be a containment board but that is fucking not working.

>>2945997
>>2946014
I'm ManlySpirit, what's going on?

>>2946343
apologize

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>>2946344
For what exactly?

Also, trip to confirm it's me.

>>2946356
You know what, you are OP. You read the post already; you called me a liar and was mean to my sick dog in the /q/ thread months ago. Apologize.

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>>2946364
I was linked here by the discord chat dude, pic related. I glanced over the OP, and see myself get accused by people. I honestly don't quite grasp what people are complaining about, or how it's linked to me specifically.

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>>2946374

>>2946374
Well now that you have that pulled up why don't you go back in time a bit and pull up what you said. Not many people @manlyspirit so I'm sure you'll find your posts.

You won't do it, though. Probably delete the evidence in the process. Whatever, just apologize. You know what I'm talking about.

>>2946379
Dude, I don't know what the hell you're talking about.

>>2946383


You don't remember when I posted pics of my dog after you said you didn't think I was in /ic/ discord chat? Then you asked for my name which then I replied "so you can publicly shame me?"? The thread where you stayed up all night long to monitor your precious poll to see if mods would respond? And in discord you were JUST SO HAPPEN to be online at the time?

But I understand, it's your username on the line here. You don't want to look like an ass, I get it. All I want is an apology as we know your thread won't go anywhere. I mean, it's quite obvious it's you...this boards userbase is very small.

>>2946391
also It seems that particular thread wasn't archived, I can't find it. I'll will eventually (hopefully) pull it up so it can joggin' your noggin' (as you /pol/ people like to say).

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>>2946393
Oh yes, I was confusing /q/ with /qa/.

Does THIS ring a bell, my good old pal old friend?

https://archived.moe/qa/thread/681974/#682693

please scroll in your discord timeline @history to the DATES posted there and it'll ring some bells

Do it now. Or did you delete the history already?

>>2946391
Look man, I think you've got me mixed up with someone else, but if what you want is an apology, sure. If I ever offended you in any way man, I am legitimately sorry.

I've read over most of the thread, and from what I understand, OP wants stronger moderation here. I do recall that being a debacle in this place a few months ago, and making a strawpoll to send to Hiro, but I remember opinions being very mixed on that matter, and I just dropped it all. My experience at that time taught me that anonymity is AWFUL for art critique, and since then, I honestly haven't posted here.

That's the honest answer. I don't see it very fruitful to try and change this board, when I could be spending that time and effort improving my art, than improving the community.

And you're right, my name IS on the line here, and I'm aiming toward gaining a stronger following and reputation, so the less shit I can start with people and the less drama I can be involved with, the better.

As for what my thoughts on this discussion... I personally don't care either way, I've got my own ways to find valuable critique. If people want critique or advice, I'm more than happy to lend a hand, to the limit of my own abilities that is, as I've still got ways to go.

>And in discord you were JUST SO HAPPEN to be online at the time?
I'm online almost all the time dude. I don't work, and haven't worked for a good... 7 months now? I've been focusing on my comic, and commissions to make ends meet. I know that sounds like a lame-ass excuse, but you can just flip through my tumblr and see that I've been crunching out a manga chapter once every 3 weeks, plus commissions.

Only reason I'm even in here is cause someone tagged me in discord, and I find I'm involved in the center of all this drama somehow.

Believe me dude, you've got the wrong dude.

>>2946411
>Look man
>man

The posting style matches you, my dude. Like literally matches. Just read the thread on the archive are you telling me that ISNT you? Come on now. You've been caught again with your pants down.

At least you admitted it. I accept your apology, for now.

this is why discord is cancer for underages

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>>2946415
>>2946409

My postings from September 19th. I worked on a piece of art, and posted it to the wip, there's nothing in the general.

Again, you've got the wrong dude, dude.

I hope that's convincing enough, but if it's not, then oh well man. I've done what I can.

>>2945901
Anyone who is serious about getting gud just migrate to Crimson Daggers and leave this place behind. Ultimately everything everyone says here can only be taken with a grain of salt since you don't know who they are or what their abilities are. Yeah, you can decide for yourself if their advice is bullshit, but this can be difficult for noobs unless they can see that the person giving the advice is clearly farther along.

>>2946428
There's tons of good art communities if you know where to look. My own personal advice would be to make friends with other artists either irl or over the web, especially people better than you, and help each other.

When you've got a reputation to keep up, people aren't gonna troll, and anyone with any decent level of skill is always happy to help those less talented than them.

Likewise, anyone with any decent level needs to learn how to self critique. If you're working digital, literally flip the canvas, that will point out most of your mistakes to you. Plus, you need to learn to develop your eye to catch mistakes, that's part of getting good. If you're always relying on people to tell you what you're doing wrong, you're only doing yourself a disservice. Plus, with how much art-learning content there is online, and on youtube, you really shouldn't be relying on forums all that much, if at all.

>>2946425
>>2946425
I took a look through myself and you're right, it's someone else....for the discord. Still you took part in that thread, that is undeniable by posting style.

Whatever, let bygones be bygones.

>>2946450
Cool man, thanks.

Yeah, just please leave me out of this, I don't want any part of it. I'm working hard to cultivate an image, and the last thing I want is having it marred by nonsense.

Again, if I said something to offend you, I'm legitemately sorry man.

>>2946458
Not that guy but the way you type is annoying.

Cut it out.

>>2946458

apology accepted my last post in this thread , good bye

Just woke up and seriously, I'm done with this thread. Like holy shit you guys are bigger faggots than I thought. What's up with all that name calling and discord bullshit!? Stop bringing your discord feuds to /ic/

Back to topic: While I understand this is just another thread clogging up the board, I think it's sad so few people in here are interested in improving the current situation. Like Nosebro showed in his cap TONS of threads on /ic/ are garbage. If you want to dismiss a board discussion/ meta thread as shitposting, go ahead. Look, I'm not even disappointed, there where some good counter arguments and at least somewhat of a discussion and I honestly got more out of this than I expected. I guess /ic/s culture and moderation is not to be changed in near future and I'll have to come to terms with it. The only option is to find a website that's closer to what I'm looking for or initiating an art commumity myself.

Thanks for the anon who suggested Crimson Daggers, I will check it out.

I'd be happy to continue this debate if anyone is up for it, else I'll let this thread die l, so you guys can have another quality "rate my meme drawing" thread instead.

>>2946588
go away, pest

>>2946588
the problem is that you step in with a massive holier-than-thou aura emanating from your entire being and tell people that this is what is wrong and this is how you're going to fix it, which is an excellent way to make people disregard you from the first post. a bulleted list of things to change, a strawpoll, a maga anime girl reaction image and a compulsion to mass reply to every single post that is made is just a cherry on top.

you could have simply said "/ic/'s moderation is shit, we need more moderators, what does the rest of /ic/ think?" and have had a productive discussion with no pretentious spiel to sour it from the start

I don't even disagree with most of your points, but I hate you just for the virtue of being another /qa/ faggot who thinks he has all the solutions to this site's problems

>>2946122
>>2946133
>>2946167
>>2946116

exactly why we can't have nice things

>>294605

You don't have to worry about firez anymore.

>>2946588
stop hating fun now fuck off to some hugbox you pile of garbage

>>2946599
>you might be right, but I hate your tone

>>2946724
>circlejerking discord shitstain talking about hugboxes
Good joke

>>2946738
i dont even use discord you subhuman, i was talking about shitposting and meme threads

>all these tumblrfags and redditors whining about /pol/
Why dont you go back to whatever shithole you crawled out from

>>2946599
There are only 11 global mods and they dont give a shit about you or this board.

>>2946036
This

The -chan is just bad for this sort of things, that's all

The anonymity is actually a bad thing, when you receive a fucking critique or ask for an advice you expect the person that responded to you to actually be more knowledgeable in the matter, yet it's painfully clear that majority of /ic/ is made by shitters and the few good artists don't give a shit, it's especially evident in threads like /beg/.

Also the board culture is more cancerous than ever, really except for few threads the majority of them are pure shit: threads where people complain about modern art, sjws, beta males etc., threads where people shit on popular artists, threads where people just complain in self pity, bait threads and shit liket that. And the worst thing is that those are the majority and the fastest threads, so it's clear that a lot of people here are edgy kids and shitters that came here just to complain about their failures.

And as OP said, a lot of times when you ask something you will get the same vague and stupid answers, a lot of times people completely dodge my question and just recommend some meme book.

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>>2946377
> Sorry if I went overboard, English is not my primary language.
>>2946425
>different language in the UI
>tots not OP

riiiiiiiight

i know that i don't add nothing to this conversation but saying this but damn is weird to see /ic/ having a normal/formal and logic conversation without going full rage and actually saying the word "sorry"....

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>>2947025
He's back at it again John get the camera this is some quality shitpostig right here.

>>2947033
I just missed that last night because I didn't get my cup of joe. I'll take -20 pts off my apology. Okay last post.

>>2946588
>I think it's sad so few people in here are interested in improving the current situation.
It's not that no one wants to improve the board, it's that bitching about it it won't do fucking anything.

Again, go to the mods if you want to fucking get something done. This thread does nothing but shit up the board.

>>2946409
>Waah, somebody said something mean to me on the internet
Lol, what a faggot.

>>2947179
lol

>>2947187
lol!

>>2947189
l0l

>>2946044
So you think generals (with the exception of Tower Girls, which I agree is fine) are ruining the board? Can anyone do a quick rundown of why that would be? I don't really see the negatives or the pros, so I'm just curious.

The biggest issue with this board is that everybody assumes discussing art, or "what makes me not like this art" is somehow a valid substitute for practicing. We all want to buy into this but we're all scared to admit it's not right.

>>2947203
This.

All the people actually making progress with their work aren't sitting around, wasting their time posting on /ic/. This place is a cesspool of jealous nobodies that sit around shitting on other people's work, and actively trying to ruin the reputations of people more successful than them (Kr0n being the best example).

Step 1 to gittin gud:
Leave /ic/

>>2947201
>generals are ruining the board

Generals are creating islands of certainty in the sea of shit this board is most of the time. It's far easier to Stick the few General threads and check them everyday than to search for random good threads hidden in page 7.

Even years ago I would find myself with 70 or 80 Hidden threads. Generals make my life easier.

>>2947203
>The biggest issue with this board is that everybody assumes discussing art, or "what makes me not like this art" is somehow a valid substitute for practicing
True, but finding what you dont like can help you decide what you want to do with your art; if youre the type of person that sees something and actively tries to do better

>>2947204
>All the people actually making progress with their work aren't sitting around
this

>This place is a cesspool of jealous nobodies that sit around shitting on other people's work
The best part about this anonymous board is that you can express an opinion without extreme backlash.

>actively trying to ruin the reputations of people more successful than them
Youre not confusing shitposting and opinions with ruining someone's reputation? The posts about Kr0n, from what Ive seen, seem to stem from anons recognizing that he might be "tracing," but even then if you can become successful with tracing, then there shouldnt a problem (hopefully anons, who find it a problem will try to do better in order to outshine Kr0n). Do you have another example that might better explain "actively ruining someone's reputation"

>Step 1 to gittin gud
actually having the desire to improve

>>2946029
this. if more people just FUCKING SAGED there wouldn't be a problem

>>2947230
>>Step 1 to gittin gud
>actually having the desire to improve
90% of /ic/ is nothing BUT desire. people here WANT to draw well, they just don't want to, you know, put in the work it takes.

Thread specific IDs would be a godsend.

ID tags that travel between threads would not, though.

>>2947270
No, saging still gives the OP of shitty threads attention and might evoke a response from other people thus making the sage useless.
The best thing to do is not responding at all, NO MATTER WHAT.

I know it's hard sometimes, sometimes you just have to call that guy on the internet a faggot or tell him to read the sticky but next time you feel that way, ask yourself if it is really necessary.

>>2945979
Only a problem for babies, faggots and conservacucks. Lets get to it.

>>2947272
If you truly: desire, crave, yearn, hunger, and have the enthusiasm to improve, you will improve. If you truly have the desire to raise you grades in school, you'll do it.

Now that you mention it, it kinda just feels like /ic/ is just a casual place to post drawings at get crits. The tools are there if you really, really, have the desire to improve. Maybe theres nothing to change here; just the need for more janitors and a mod?

I couldn't agree more with point 1, if rules aren't being followed or enforced, then why have them?

However with that said, I would honestly have to disagree with point 2. ic's merits only come from the pool of resources readily available here. I will never understand how one can reliably take advice from someone on a site like 4chan where there isn't even a username of some kind to associate with what is said by somebody who for all we know could just be somebody samefagging in the end.

>>2947230
Desire isn't enough, and it especially won't help when you're constantly distracted by shitposting and board drama.

Success comes from working fucking hard to to improve your art AND working hard to self promote, something 99% of this board WILL NOT DO.

If you wanna get exposure, you gotta step into mainstream internet culture, and network, which means actually having some social skills, and being a decent human being.

>Kr0n
You and I both know it's not that simple. I've been to the threads, with the anons BRAGGING about making those image collages, and spreading them about, and how the shitstorm began here, and how they feel it was worth it, as it impacted his patreon, and he had to make a public statement about. Sorry, but that shit is malicious as fuck. All it takes is for some sperg on /ic/ to feel like you don't deserve your success, and they'll rally other idiots with nothing better to do to dismantle all the hard work you've put into self-promotion. Yeah, as an artist, that shit frightens me, because it's not easy to get noticed, to find the right channels and communities, to reach out and network with people, to push out a constant stream of content to keep people intetested. If success was merely "gittin gud" anyone could do this, as there's some seriously talented nobodies on this board.

And if the same idiots who have the audacity to brag about how they were successful in damaging Kr0n's patreon put that same effort into improving their art and self promoting, they'd actually be successful enough to not have to do shit like that in the first place. And that's just one example, you can see that sort of jealousy-fueled bullshit at a micro level in here too. You see it in all the threads, with all the idiots who think they can get by shitting on other people cause they're covered by anonymity.

>>2947310
cont...

I'll say it again, to any artist who is serious about becoming successful in this: get the fuck out of here. I personally don't post in the board that often anymore, and in all honestly, my art and success has made massive strides. This place is literal shithole, and a massive distraction that will hold you back from getting to where you wanna be. Stop rationalizing that shit anon, cause you and I BOTH know it's true.

Call them hugboxes all you want to feel superior, but other art communities allow you to network with people who can help promote your stuff. Anons are generally to selfish for that shit, and instead see your own success as a personal failing due to their own insecurities and personal lack of effort, because rather than actually working to improve, they're spending all that time on here talking shit about other artists, and overthinking shit that honestly doesn't matter.

Name ONE successful artist that /ic/ has produced?

None, anyone who started here, got the fuck out once they started making strides, and that's a very telling sign.


>tracing
You're a fool if you believe that tracing is reason enough to damn someone and ruin their work. Especially when comic book artists regularly trace, and very successful and famous artists were very open about the fact that they traced over photographs, people like Normal Rockwell as an immediate example. Tracing is a tool just like any other, and using it successfully takes a strong understanding of the fundamentals. You and I both know those anons did that shit out of jealousy, because Kr0n has a large income from patreon, and tracing was merely the banner their flew under to attain moral high ground.

tl;dr

/ic/ is easily one of the worst art communities on the web, if you genuinely wanna be successful, you'd do yourself the favor to leave here for good.

If you wanna shitpost and be involved in gossip and drama, feel free to stick around.

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>>2947312
>>2947310
Did this nigga really type all that shit out and expect people to read it all?

>>2947312
theres angle guy. hes succesful.

>>2946588
People thinking this clearly different personality is actually op

>>2947204
/ic/ is attractive in that you should ideally just hop on, post your shit, get feedback and a finger pointing in the right direction with none of the frivolities that plague other places. Combined with the fact that because /ic/ is pretty obscure out of the 4chan boards it implies a higher standard. Somewhat unsurprisingly, the ease of the platform may breed laziness. There also isn't really a "just post your shit and get feedback" thread (outside of maybe the beginner general), and people might be too scared of the criticism that could come from the attention of making a thread yourself.

>>2947230
>and actively tries to do better
But that's the thing, /ic/ never tries to get better.

>>2947310
>Desire isn't enough, and it especially won't help when you're constantly distracted by shitposting and board drama.
Then it boils down to the individual and their resolve. If you say you desire to improve, and do nothing to actually improve, then youre using desire very loosely.

>Success comes from working fucking hard
agreed, but like I said in a previous post, Im starting to think this board is just for casual artists looking to improve a few drawings. The tools are there if you truly have the desire to improve your overall ability to draw.

>Kr0n
Im unsure if Kr0n told his followers before the incident that he "traced," but enough people were upset thus affecting his patreon. Anons bragging on 4chan should be a red flag, if anything.

>that shit frightens me
It should, sociology talks about the dangers of giving power to a group of people; let alone ignorant people.

>If success was merely "gittin gud" anyone could do this
If you want to be commercially successful, then dont worry about getting good. All the artists I've seen that have "sold out" have not made any improvements what so ever, though I probably need to wait a few more years in case they do improve.

>the idiots who think they can get by shitting on other people cause they're covered by anonymity.
There are instances in which it does get annoying, but people shitting on people has been a thing since forever. Hopefully anons who get shit on in this micro level environment develop a thick skin, or just give up. I hope they dont give up, but the world isnt going to hold your hand and kiss your wounds.


>>2947312
>get the fuck out of here
This has been said again and again, why would you want a slow board to become as slow as /3/?

>>2947312
>Stop rationalizing that shit anon
I try to rationalize everything, because the world isnt black and white

>Call them hugboxes all you want to feel superior, but other art communities allow you to network with people who can help promote your stuff.
Agreed, then go their to promote your stuff, and come here to get shit on.

>Anons are generally to selfish for that shit
Anonymity allows people to take off their mask and show the true autist within. Also people are generally selfish, I think hugboxes prevent selfish people from being selfish. Which is good? But I cant handle people being overly nice. Meeting extremely nice people IRL feels fucking great, but when its through a computer screen it feels too artificial to me.

>rather than actually working to improve, they're spending all that time on here talking shit about other artists
Because they are regular people. Though there might be a small few that actively try to ruin everything for everyone, most of them are just people shitposting. Most probably minors. If someone truly desires improvement they'll go out and work. People who say they want to do things and not work to do it dont have a pinch of resolve, let alone a desire to do things.

>Name ONE successful artist that /ic/ has produced?
I want to say tehmeh, but I cannot speak for him

>You're a fool if you believe that tracing is reason enough to damn someone and ruin their work.
I personally dont mind tracing, but enough people were upset to actually hurt Kr0n's patreon. Probably a lesson on not relying on one medium for your income and being more transparent to your followers.

It was a good read, thank you for actually taking the time to write this. Best of luck with your art adventures anon! God speed you

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>Votes Trump to make Anime great again
>About to go to war with the Norks
>Norks nuke SK and Tokyo

And you thought all that work was going back to Japan, nope.

China will make our Anime now, great job. He was in cahoots the whole time.

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Alright folks, pic related are the current strawpoll results for those who care.

A few of you mentioned I should contact the moderators instead of having a meta thread. The problem is, that we need moderators/ janitors who care about this board. I'm being honest with you - I don't have the spare time to upgrade the sticky or moderate the board and it seems those of you who'd be able to fulfill such tasks are dismissing the board as useless for critique and only a source of references/ artbooks /resources etc.
As much as I hate to admit it, but I am pretentious in that regard. I guess if you want a change you have to initiate it yourself; it was folly of me to think a thread could raise awareness of /ic/s shortcomings.

That said, /ic/ may be cancerous, but it was also a stepping stone to getting good for a lot of us. You just don't get the merits of chan culture on other websites.

>>2947273
Underrated post, this seems like a viable solution to the downsides of board wide IDs. While one can maintain anonymity as an artist if they like to do so, it prevents people samefagging and detects shitposters.

>>2947522
It's me, just growing tired of all that bullshit. Not that it matters anyway, thread's not about me.

>What are your thoughts on the introduction of identification tags for this board?
Find another site to frequent instead of ruining this one further.

>>2947778
>ruining this one further.
Implying that anything can make this site even worse

Stay on /pol/, and please delete this horse-shit.

>>2947924
>>>/r/eddit

plagiarist.

>>2945905
>anything trump in the entire internet or world is pol related
kys

bump, i want tags

bye bye /ic/