Why so great?

>>2787922
I don't know shit about dip pens, but this nigga has all the tutorials you'll need.
>https://www.youtube.com/user/LighterNoteProd/playlists

>>2787922
>Can anyone tell me why these are so special and know of a good reasonably in depth tutorial?
Versatility. You can produce an extremely wide variety of lines with a G-Pen, from very thin to very thick, and it's not as hard as a crow quill so it's very easy to do so. Once you get used to it there's very little you can't do with it, outside of extremely thick lines.

The Zebra is the least scratchy of the Japanese brands, IMO. Use it for a while and it'll become noticeably smoother. If you want something that draws smoothly right away, Leonardt's General Handwriting Pen is the same nib with a slightly less sharp point, but draws extremely smoothly.

It's really just a very good medium flex workhorse. What problems are you having, exactly?

Yes, thanks, Alphonso is skilled and very generous with his info.
He works mostly with Sakura fine liners.

A couple of weebs have made vids about manga pens but there is surprisingly little. And none that I have found that speak to these nibs' peculiarities and helpful techniques.
Anyhow. I thought there would be a huge number of trad-mangakas on here. (I mostly hang out on /pol/)

>>2788027
Sorry, you posted that when I was still typing my last one.

Mainly my problems are with thin lines and and consistency of flow and while drawing tones or values with light/rapid hatching. I find that despite the scratch noise, it sometimes leaves fragmented lines that I have to redraw. It also seems to favor the downstroke, which unless you're inking comics and spinning the page around is pretty unusual. I've tried it on smooth bristol and standard sketchbook "cartridge"-type paper (which could be my problem). Not vellum.

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>>2788038
Not sure where you got the idea that spinning the page around is pretty unusual. Most dips pens and fountains pens(excluding those that don't have a sharp point, and even some of those) favor the downstroke. Pic related. Upstrokes are in almost all cases not recommended, causing sputtering and even possibly misalignment of the tines.

Smooth bristol is a good choice, vellum not so much.

Your flow problems sounds like an ink problem. I've had it happen before, and it almost always comes down to the ink rather than the pen. You should be able to get a line going nearly straight left or right without too much effort, and if the line is broken your ink may be too viscous.

Here's a video of Yusuke Murata drawing. If your ink isn't flowing off the pen as smoothly as his, you might have an ink problem.
https://youtu.be/75mYCmGX_R0?t=5671

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>>2787922
Dip pens (and waterclor) is why I can't switch to digital. They make such expressive lines that only a brush can rival.

I use mostly Japanese nibs. I really love the Kabura type nibs, pic related. I use G pens for foreground elements but for everything else I use a kabura. It's basically a stiffer version of the G-pen that makes a slightly thinner, more consistent line.

Marus are great for fine hatching but I don't recommend drawing with them.

I've used the 3 main brands of Japanese nibs a lot (Zebra, Tachikawa, Nikko) and overall they're the same except for the Nikko G which I disliked. Tachikawa is just as good as Zebra in my book. Heck I think their Marus and Kaburas might be even better.

Other great nibs are the Brause 66ef, Brause 511, and Hunt 102. The problem with them is that it's impossible (afaik) to find them in bulk, while you can buy boxes of Japanese nibs for much cheaper.

I think the traditional process in manga has more to do with the possibility of multiple people working on the same page at the same than the medium itself. If you watch the documentary Manben you'll see that these studios work like an assembly line.

>>2788038
>Mainly my problems are with thin lines and and consistency of flow
What nibs and ink are you using? Do you burn the nibs before using them?

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>>2787978

Dunn's stuff always looks bad to me. He always over bakes his ink drawings, ignoring the precision the medium demands. When I watch him it feels like hes forgetting hes using a pen.

OP, if you're not afraid of books, look into Rendering pen and ink by Arthur L. Guptill.

Be forewarned though, it is an older text, but I haven't come across anything better or more comprehensive than Rendering Pen & Ink when it come to dip pens; Mostly because felt tip and other advances weren't around when it was written.

Sure, check out Dunn, but don't stop there. There are much, much greener pastures.

I know traditional cartoons have the Blackwing 602, which is pretty good (though I'm finding myself more of a Pearl man).

Manga never went digital?

>>2788032
Check this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXee9PA1BZ4

Ignore the cringey presentation, the actual content is good and I haven't seen it explained anywhere else in English.

It's very informative and the part about speed lines is excellent.

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>>2788067
>Manga never went digital?
Some do, but traditional seems to be the standard for the time being. Jin and Kanemaki Thomas use digital, as do others, but it's still by far a minority.

For that matter, film cameras still have a foothold over there.

>>2788071
Ah apparently that's a shortened version, there used to be full videos of each lesson. Try to look it up, it's worth watching the full thing.

>>2787978
Cool

>>2788054
Yeah that wasn't clear at all. Sorry.
Spinning the page is unusual within my own background in more Western traditional fine art drawing styles. Hell I could even be entirely wrong about old-timey European/American pen & ink drawing (I like the turn of the century illustrators etc).
I have a couple of nibs that seem to move in most directions using a light touch (Hunt 101 and School I think, and a couple others). Plus I use lamy fountain pens for sketching freehand without penciling first.
I think the main reason I have been researching manga and comics processes is that my normal drawing approach, developed largely with lead pencil, seems to look like graphic novel stuff when I use pen, so I thought I would amplify that rather than try to tone it down by incorporating it.

Thanks for the help. I appreciate and will follow up on the reccommendations and try to track down the doc.

>>2788058
Great post, thanks! Have t heard of kabura. Will try.

>>2788061
I just received a copy of the Guptil book :-).
Will inhale it.
Also there are some great ones on Archive.org - the most well known one is by Maginness. Was the standard bearer before the Guptill one.

I hear you about Dunn. He's pretty good at capturing reflected light in his shadows in some of his portraits. Besides that I assumed his drawing background was more design/freehand sketching kind of thing. Overall not my fav but he's a skilled draftsman generally, a nice guy and helps many.

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If nibs feel scratchy as fuck, there's an alternative. Zebra brush pen. The lines it makes are VERY similar to a G pen nib with the same applied pressure.

>>2788223
I have pentel brush pen
I find consistent lines hard to draw

>>2788072
>film cameras still have a foothold over there.
and faxes
japan is stuck in the 90's

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>>2788282
Im assuming you mean this pen.
And yes because the strands of synthetic bristles act like hair. Where the zebra brush pen has a rubber-like tip that allows you to make consistent lines depending on how much pressure you apply, just like a dip pen.

>http://www.dailymotion.com/HabaneroScans
if anyone is interested with manga documentary stuff here, pretty interesting watch i say.

>>2788059
Sorry missed this.
I use a bunch of different nibs but the one in question is the zebra G.
I have tried burning the tip (although I'm not sure I did it with the G pen).
No special ink. Just whatever india ink.

>>2787978
>>2788061
>>2788195

I bought Dunn's book and I think it works really well in getting things started, but I also agree that he shouldn't be the only person you look up stuff for. Mainly working with technical pens but do plan on getting into pen nibs next.

Bumping quality thread , will contribute when home

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>>2788364
Those brush pens are the real MVP.
Superb performance and refillable, plus they are cheap as dirt.

>>2788061
>Rendering pen and ink by Arthur L. Guptill.
Can anyone dig up a PDF of this?

>>2788364
love this more than their pocket brush, it has longer bristle, better ink flow, it's cartridge holds tons more ink and doesn't get ink all over your hands if you tend to hold near the nib because the pocket brush has air holes situated in it.

>>2788957
Indeed. I still love my pocket brush pen for inking on the go. But the pentel brush pen is the closest thing to inking with an actual brush

>>2788355
You forgot they still sell and produce VHS tapes. Dammit. I want to play Soul Reaver on my PSX.

>>2788364
I love these things so much, the only problem is when you squeeze too hard and the ink leaks into the threads a the tip. You can get so many effects with this brush too, it gives a really nice rough and loose texture when sketching as well.

>>2788364
what's a good ink brand to refill this one with? preferably water proof.

What is some good ink for these nibs? I have tried Speedballs india ink but it just doesnt flow half the time (maybe i got a bad batch). PH Maryins Bombay ink isngood but cakes on the nib crazy fast and i dont know if thats normal.

>>2788944
I haven't been able to track down a downloadable one but you can read it online here:
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015014524337;view=1up;seq=9;skin=mobile

The Hathi Trust site has some lovely historical book scans in pdfs which unfortunately they seem to have the corner on and which they dont allow downloads of. Which is weird because many were scanned by Google and arent the best quality scans.
At least with Archive you can download zips of hi res files.
The book is certainly worth the $ though

OP here,
I've been following up as best I can with individual posts but Christmas is starting to take hold.
Just wanted to thank all the anons who posted. It's been really helpful.
The difference ink can make has been a revelation. I kind of turned my nose up at the idea that garden variety india wouldnt do the trick but so far the ones I have tried witg the Zebra nibs haven't worked. It WAS the ink. I just tried some Platinum Carbon which I use in my fountain pens and while still the "wrong" kind of ink the flow was waaaay different.
As well, the feedback, links and docu mention were all great.

Merry Christmas pen bros.

>>2788998
Im very interested as well. Will check back for suggestions and possible consensus on standards.
Im curious about deleter ink since they brand one specifically for use with zebra/nikko etc manga pens.

>>2788996
The pigment one it comes with is already waterproof. And refilling these are a little tricky, but doable.

https://youtu.be/R4Sx5bmtO6Y

My personal choice of ink is the Platinum carbon ink.

http://www.jetpens.com/Platinum-Carbon-Ink-Black-60-ml-Bottle/pd/3461

A bottle can be a little pricey, but I've had my bottle for more than 2 years and I've barely reached the half point after multiple refills of both my brush pen and fountain pen. I say it's well worth the money.

>>2788998
Of your speedball ink isn't flowing as well as before, it may need some water. Add a couple of drops into your inkwell and give it a shake to stir the pigment. It should work fine with dip pens after that.

/ic/ can you recommend me a solid non-disposable technical pen?
Im fine with the maintenance, but buying and waiting for pens to ship is silly.

>>2789036
Rotring pens if you're truly up for maintaining that motherfucker.

Also copic multiliners are cool too.

Depending on the brand, fountain pens are nice as well. Along with Hi-tec pens.

Other than that, your other options are disposable kind.

>>2789036
Theres also koh-i-nor. Competitor to the Rotrings. More or less depends on whether you want brown plastic bodies or white. Koh-i-nor also make the "rapidosketch" line, which has fewer line weight options but which I'm curious about. Apparently slightly rounded and more forgiving with sketching, though I've heard everything from "meh" to "amazing" to "same as regular".

>>2789039
Any recommended disposables? Since im working with tech pens first, im wondering if i should dive into the Copic Multiliner SP line as well.

>>2789102
My personal preference are microns. There are also the Faber Castell pens.

the copic miltuliner sp pens are a great choice. You can buy rechargeable ink cartridges and replacement nibs for them.

>>2789102
>>2789036
>>2789039
This is my 2c:

Rapidographs aren't great for drawing because you need to keep them upright or they'll have ink flow problems. It doesn't seem like a big deal but it's really fucking uncomfortable. I use a 0.5 and a 0.7 Faber-Castell TG-1 for lettering comics, I've tried Rotrings, Staedtlers and Kohinoor and they all have this fundamental flaw. Also maintenance on smaller sizes (0.2, 0.1) makes them a pain in the ass. Sizes from 0.3 upwards are free from clogging issues if you use them regularly.

You're much better off with a dip pen or disposables.

>>2788998
If you're in Europe, you can get the Rohrer & Klingner Zeichentusche from Gerstaecker (and its affiliates) or the Pelikan black india ink (Tusche A). I get 250ml+ bottles and they last a long time.

>>2788470
There's a coating on top of the nibs to prevent them from rusting. You should hold the nib with pliers and pass it over an open flame for a couple seconds. You don't need to get it red-hot or anything, just a couple seconds.

This solves 90% of ink flow problems, generally Japanese nibs flow really well with whatever ink. If you still have flow problems you could try leaving your ink open (with a tissue on top or something) so it dries and thickens a bit.

>>2788944
There is one floating around somewhere, I've seen it. I don't have it though, since I own the book.
>>2788998
I use Speedball Super Black all the time(It's like $12 a quart on DickBlick and I'm a cheapskate).

Japanese inks tend to be more viscous but flow really well, dry really fast, and cakes on nibs quite aggressively. One of the things I like about Speedball's super black is how easy it is to clean off of nibs.

You should shake or stir your ink. There's a tendency for ink that sits for a while to have things sink to the bottom, which will fuck with the flow. You can tell it's sat too long if you can dip something into the bottom and it comes back up with sludge on it. Also, >>2789019
This. If your inkwell is left open, or hell, your inkwell just has a shitty seal(very likely if you use it for a long time/shake rather than stir), you'll get some evaporation and the ink will thicken, which can affect ink flow. A few drops of water and a good stir should do the trick.
>>2789013
Fountain pen inks like Platinum's are generally too thin for dip pen use, but it's not like you can't use them(you do court a higher risk of blots, especially when crossing wet lines). You could always leave it open to reduce a bit, but I don't know how well that would work since dip pens inks usually have a different binder.
>>2789199
>There's a coating on top of the nibs to prevent them from rusting. You should hold the nib with pliers and pass it over an open flame for a couple seconds. You don't need to get it red-hot or anything, just a couple seconds.
Elaborating on this, if the color of you nib changes at all, you've left it over the flame for too long. You should really only need to pass it over, since it's just an oil coating and should burn off pretty much immediately. Personally, I don't have lighters around so I just use dish soap.

>>2789036
>>2789039
don't go with the rostring meme, it breaks easily.
use faber castell technical pens or those blue staedtler technical pens.

for disposables Sakura Microns are better and cheaper the staedtler and copic brands

>>2789292
>There is one floating around somewhere
AMAZING! And incredibly helpful too! I never would have /guessed/ that it could actually be on the Internet of all things! Floating around all this time, it just blows the mind!

/s

>>2789299
I've tried them all and Faber-Castell seem to be the best. They also have that little water reservoir in the cap to keep the tip moist which is a godsend

I'm pretty new to everything and I've been using micron pens for a little bit an I would like to try out fountain pens or something any good recommendations for newcomers?

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>>2789304
It's 650mb. I'd compress and upload my copy but I know absolute fuck and nothing about doing that.

>>2790573
Fountain pens and dip pens are quite different, but the pilot metropolitan in fine makes for some fun figure drawing and takes most fountain inks.

>>2790592
Just make a torrent or use Mega

>>2791050
I've already linked to an un-downloadable scan of it above for anyone that wants to at least see it until a pdf turns up.
It's from an earlier version than the current "60th anniversary" printed book and its actually slightly clearer in the blacks than the cheap reprint.

I bought the Deleter Trial pen set (includes Nikko G, Maru and Saji nibs) and I’m trying it with Kuretake Black Ink 60 (Jake Parker’s recommended one). I’m loving the richness of the black strokes, but I’m finding difficulties with the ink flow. Once I dip, it’s too much and I can’t make a hair-thin line, then it’s great, and after 3-5 minutes it’s clogged on the nib! I dip it in water to dillute, then again in the ink but after 2-3 times it’s unusable and I have to clean the nib thoroughly to be able to use it again. Is this normal? How long can you use the nib before you dip it or clean it? I’m new to this.

>>2789292
I tried this, just a few drops of water and shaking, but the ink clogs on the nib. Maybe I didn’t put enough water? I love the feel and strokes of the pen nib, but I’d like to be able to use it without maintenance every 5 minutes.

>>2794501
I also tried burning the nib.
Should I just get another ink? If so, I'd appreciate suggestions, preferably inks that are sold in Japan.

>>2794502
are you having problems with all the nibs? if that's the case just change.the nibs. thinner isn't necessarily better, I leave my ink open to dry for days and it flows great

>>2794522
I meant change the ink not the nibs

also always use diluted

>>2794525
water when you add it

>>2794522
I've practiced mostly with the G nib, but the others also get like that.

>>2794525
Thanks! Ok, I guess I'll try different ink. The one I'm using explicitly says "very quick drying", which at first I thought is good. I think I'll also try to find a droplet to transfer some ink to dillute and see how it goes first.

>>2789017
This. Despite the ink not being dip pen friendly, it is pretty nice in other applications.

Platinum also makes a water soluble black ink, which at some vendors will be confused for being the Carbon black. Haven't purchased from Jetpens, but had success with 17-20 usd bottles on Amazon of Carbon Black. Unfortunately one of the sellers I bought from years ago somehow got their shit fucked up, so they'll sometimes sell water soluble black, causing a mix up. Be careful about this shit.

I've only been recently using the carbon black (& a tiny bit of distilled water) in a Pentel Aquash medium since a lot of those waterbrushes were on sale two months ago (4 usd). I popped the tiny filter out of the brush mechanism due to just having shitty luck with the particles, but other than that, it has been working really nicely.

>>2788998
Personally a fan of Deleter #4 when I'm able to get some, and Dick Blick Black Cat India Ink as a budget choice. Ph. Martin's Bombay India Inks are nice to use - all that good shit on top of being coloured inks despite the black from that line being "so what". Another Ph. Martin ink I really love is their Copperplate Gold from their iridescent ink line. The black ink from that brand to get is their Black Star. Forgot where I read it from (probably on ParkaBlogs), but the differences with the hi-carb & matte variations ain't that drastic as they make it out to be.


>>2794501
>>2794527
kek
Despite you needing to get used to the general maintenance every few minutes, using a quick dry ink while trying to get a hang of dip pens probably is not so great to do.

>>2794526
>>2794522
Still, how often is normal to dip/clean the nib?

>>2794537
It depends on how thick your lines are, but consider you should be able to lay down about a drop's worth of ink before having to dip again.

are you sure you're not simply waiting for too long between strokes? once you dip you're expected to lay down lines

>>2794537
I clean the nib with a damp paper towel once I'm done. I gently pinch the hollow of the nib to get the ink between the tines. Never gave me a problem.
A nib should last you a relatively long time, most mangaka change their G-pens every dozen pages or so I think? You'll know when they don't perform that well anymore.

Marus wear down much faster, Sajis tend to last a long long time.

>>2787922

I like drawing with gel pens and fine liners. Are dip pens really worth it? I think I might be too lazy plus it's not really practical on the go.

>>2794607
I've drawn with those and with brush-pen, and I just recently tried the dip pens - the result is oh so satisfying! Though I'm using a very pretty ink, which the liners don't have.

>>2794583
I had a big drop staying near or at the hollow after a few minutes of drawing. It's like it didn't want to flow once the ink near the top of the nib was finished. I'll try it with a more diluted ink (Kuretake Black 60), and I ordered the Deleter Black 4, which I hope to not clog so much.

>>2794536
>>Despite you needing to get used to the general maintenance every few minutes, using a quick dry ink while trying to get a hang of dip pens probably is not so great to do.

Dipping is common sense, but you mean it's normal to have cleaning involved every few minutes? I expected to clean the nib after I'm finished drawing. Oh well.

>>2794587
Every dozen pages?? That's why they sell those nibs in bulk. I thought the nib being metal would last for a long time.

>>2787922
Nibs are more for consistency than they are for quality,

if you need thin lines and are not adept to using a brush, use a nib otherwise brishes beat the fuck out of nibs so hard that its not funny.

Most american comic artists have forgone nibs in place of brushes for everything but very fine and detailed work that would take a gods steady hand to do with brush work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyGZhERTDyg

oh, and lets also not forget the ease of use that felt tips give,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYpROCxL59s

from a personal standpoint, I don't like dip pens at the same time that I love them. I love working in fine lines and building up layers.

I have recently gotten some jinho pens, 450's and replaced one with a g nib... there are some issues with feeding an entire page long fully depressed line, as in 1mm thickness, its able to go paper long with a .75 mm line, but were I believe it excels is really thin lines with a bit of flourish as a normal line thickness of about .1mm that can blow out to .8mm

I should also mention the normal nib, I believe a fine, is around .6mm to around 1.1 mm,

also, there are 3-4 notable nibs in japan,

1 is made for writing, and its fine/extra fine, writes easy but is almost unused in drawing,

1 is the g nib, wide use and can get almost any line you could want out of it with skill

1 is used in shoujo and has an s name, its scoop shaped, its stiffer and gets a finer line over all then a g nub,

and one is the crow quill equivalent and i can not remember its name. its stiff and for the finest line.

paper is also important but i cant help at all here.

>>2794607
better in every regard, worth it... not sure,

my cro quill can get 2 A4 full depressed lines before needing to re dip, that's a fairly large amount of ink.

I just got some fountain pens and put a g nib in it, so I should be able to go 1-4 full pages of ink before needing to refill the pen

personally, I don't like rollerball pens for art, and I love thin lines, but fine liners tend to fray and the thinner ones make me hesitant to press hard,

at least that's the way that I see it.

go get a jinho 450, they are 2-5$ full aluminium with converter
get some zebra nibs, got a 10 pack for 7$ and get some water insoluble fountain pen ink, personally I have some higgans fountain pen india ink shit from when I first got dip pens, its 73ml and was sub 10$ this MIGHT work in fountain pens, this ink is weird in the way it was sold to me as fountain pen ink but supposedly isnt fountain pen ink... I dont fucking know, but piss with the cock you got not the one you want, so I used it... shit works, and is better then needing to redip all the time, especially considering im clumsy and would knock the ink over... really happy that its a non issue now.

>>2794607
Oh, almost forgot, get a copic brush pen, the thing is like 10$ and has 2 cartridges, this, if you learn it, will be better than any nib or pen you could get and would only be surpassed by dip brushes

>>2788067
For the most part, no. I have a feeling it has something to do with the quality of the end product, as the ones that use digital or even just digital techniques tend to look worse than their counterparts.

Alot of amature mangaka are now using digital at least to mimic screentones because that's really the only aspect of manga that is a complete motherfucker to do traditionally both because of cost and time consuming nature.

>>2788355
Faxes are very useful, as its basicly an email that makes a noise when you get something and forces you to see it. I have alot of friends I would fax if I could because fuck knows they only check their emails once every other fucking month.

>>2788998
Stupid question, did you burn/wash off the oil/wax layer that prevents rust?

What kind of paper should i use for this nibs, i have access to tracing paper newsprint vellum and book paper (80gsm). Theyre all to rough, tracing is too smooth

>>2794707
Most decent quality paper should hold ink fairly well. I'd recommend paper that is at least 120g/sqm though, lighter paper might warp.

>>2794641
>use a nib otherwise brishes beat the fuck out of nibs so hard that its not funny.
That's really simplistic, brushes give you a completely different type of line. I used brushes for years before switching to dip pens and I would never go back

>>2794634
>I thought the nib being metal would last for a long time.
As opposed to fountain pens these nibs have a much sharper point and they're not iridium tipped, so the point will wear down with use. Also since they're made to be so much more flexible than fountain pen nibs, they'lll get to a point where the tines will stay bent, or will go out of alignment. It's just part of the natural life of the nibs.

>>2794634
>but you mean it's normal to have cleaning involved every few minutes? I expected to clean the nib after I'm finished drawing. Oh well.
No, you shouldn't have to clean the nib every few minutes.

watch this, maybe it'll clear your ideas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_hHTfFeRsM

>>2794537
Depends on the ink. I used to use a Japanese ink labeled "Comic Super Black" and it stuck to the nib like no one's business, so frequently cleaning was required. I use Speedball these days and it's not nearly so aggressive, so I can draw for much longer before cleaning.
>>2794634
>I had a big drop staying near or at the hollow after a few minutes of drawing.
How much ink did you have on the nib? Generally, there's kind of a less is more approach when dipping, at least that I've observed in mangaka. If you look at >>2794766 this video, you can see Murata doesn't actually dip the nib all that deeply. If you've got a large drop on the back of the nib, you risk it all running down when you cross wet lines or the like, and creating a blot.

>Every dozen pages?? That's why they sell those nibs in bulk. I thought the nib being metal would last for a long time.
I've heard some change them every page.

>>2794833
>>2794766
Yeah, I dipped the hollow part too, thanks! Really had no idea.
Aside from that, in the video I can also see he has extreme control over his pen, but not much else. I have no idea what he does off camera, he might as well be cleaning the tip, I don't know.

>>2794761
Wow. Now I'll know.

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>>2794860
>Aside from that, in the video I can also see he has extreme control over his pen,
That's pretty common. A lot of mangaka grip the pen very close to the nib - Hagio Moto goes so far as to have her finger on the nib itself.

Not a lot of videos show it, but you can see the paper towel here that Urusawa uses the clean his nib.

>>2794758
not really, they give you a wider range of potential lines, not different lines.

>>2794993
That's in theory. In practice, you get a substantially different line with a dip pen.

>>2794998
watch the watts video I posted, the first one.

>>2795050
let me guess, he's demonstrating that by doing straight strokes on paper
if you actually work with the tools they're very different, it's retaded to think that a brush can substitue a dip pen entirely or vice versa

>>2794634
>you mean it's normal to have cleaning involved every few minutes? I expected to clean the nib after I'm finished drawing.

Maintenance as in "quick dip in water/quick swipe on scrap paper towel". It doesn't mean the full cleaning (which should be done after finishing for a while). Even with most nibs being cheap, you still want to learn how to take care of them too. There are a lot of variables that will have an effect with fucking around with dip pens. Even with all of the information here, some things you will have to experience & get used to on your own.

>>2794966
>>2795277
I see now, I'll have to get used to this. Thanks! I hope the new ink will not dry so quickly on the nib, so it'll be easier.

>>2788355
Yeah, but film cameras are awesome. As are dip pens.

I wouldn't say film has more of a foothold in Japan. Plenty of enthusiasts and hipsters here in the West too, it's just harder to find a good camera store.

>>2795277
I only clean at the end and I never had a problem.

File: 9000.png (754KB, 1004x896px) Image search: [Google]

754KB, 1004x896px

So can someone actually confirm that these panels are drawn with a g-pen, for the love of me, everytime I try to draw delicate and smooth lines, it never comes out right. How do you achieve such smooth lines with a g-pen?

File: fma_.jpg (171KB, 736x1077px) Image search: [Google]

171KB, 736x1077px

>>2796067
can't really tell on that page specifically because that art is kinda shitty desu

For that kind of linework I'd use a maru. That's what mangaka use when they try to make thinner, delicate lines, e.g. in shoujo manga.

Also mangaka tend to build up their lines instead of making 1 definitive stroke.

FMA page for comparison, I know for sure that Arakawa uses a G-pen and a Saji for thinner lines

>>2796131
>>2796067
also be aware that most of the backgrounds in manga are either pasted in (digitally or otherwise), or traced from reference (digitally or otherwise). Just look at the linework on the figures

File: [Kazuo UMEZU] Hyouryuu Kyoushitsu - The Drifting Classroom c001-004 v01 [1974][Digital][LostNerevarine-Empire].zip-The Drifting Classroom v1-046.png (1MB, 1733x2600px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1733x2600px

>>2796134
you do realize that rulers/straight edges exist right? those Full metal alchemist and bakuman were created when graphics tablet was still not the norm in the jap comics industry.

>>2796158
you realize that cutting and pasting shit from xeroxed stock photos is common practice in the manga industry right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfENoePp36o&index=1&list=PL8C198450E3B64C59

>>2796067
It looks digital, but it's hard to tell.

What's the artist?

>>2796394
It's from Bakuman,art is by Takeshi Obata,the guy is also the artist for Death Note
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takeshi_Obata

>>2796401
Youtube reveals that he does use a G-Pen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEdPMJO_Qi0
What kind of paper are you using? I'm wondering if maybe you're having trouble because the tines are catching on the tooth of the paper.

>>2796428
Oh,you're mistaking me for OP,I just wanted to answer the question

>>2796036
Depends on how well one knows the limits of their ink desu. The anon who was just starting out was using "quick dry ink", which again is probably not the best choice when first getting used to dip pens from the start. Maybe when they get the feel of it & can time themselves right, they can get away with dip & go until the end of the inking session if it is possible.

For me, things like certain white opaque inks & Deleter #4 can cake on rather fast. Considerably thinner (or watered down) consistency items don't need to be watched over as much as the above.

>>2796572
I'm more likely to get used to dip in water and swipe with paper towel - it's not so bad when you know that's how it is with Japanese ink. I'll look into other inks when I can, though I'm not sure how to recognize which won't cake. I suppose it'll have to be foreign ink.

Sigh, so many things I want to try out and do. I've recently started enjoying watercolors, found out about the pencil smudging tool (after all my life abhorring smudging with my fingers) and want to try gouache (though having some difficulty finding non-acrylic one)

>>2798050
Always fun to try out new materials & art mediums whenever possible. Gotta do what we wanna do while we can, right?

Some watercolour manufacturers will also make gouache. Worth looking to see if the manufacturer whom you use watercolours from also makes gouache. Off the top of my head, I know Holbein (JP brand) makes both "regular" & acrylic gouache. Even with that though, some formulations in that brand's watercolour line basically feel close to gouache anyway. Actually, go check out eastern paints too - while some are suspect with lightfastness and some being made with more than one pigment, it sounds rather close to what you're looking for.